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Red Pill TheoryDon't fall into the trap of binary thinking, there is such a thing as a middle ground (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by _BITCHES_LOVE_ME_

When we discuss men, women, alpha, beta, nice guys and assholes, this sub tends to speak as if these are diametrically opposed, mutually exclusive binary states. But that's not precisely true and this belief will hold you back and make you unhappy.

I'm not gonna turn this into a post about psychology, but there is research that states that depressed individuals tend to speak more in absolute terms such as always, never, all, none etc. I'm sure you recognize this phenomenon here on TRP, it's even in our motto, AWALT. It's no secret that a lot of the guys on here are unhappy because of their experiences and the state of society today. It's understandable, but do you really want to model your view of the world after someone who is absolutely miserable?

Binary thinking limits you, it makes you miss subtle nuances and it also makes the world you inhabit a miserable black and white place where everyone who is not your friend is your enemy. You should avoid this at all costs. There is a nearly unlimited amount of information and you can only process so much. If you look for the signs that all women are out to get you then you can easily find more than enough information to back up this idea.

Just as you are an individual, so are the people around you, and yes, this includes women. I'm not saying that you should go hunt for a magic unicorn, in fact I think you shouldn't. What I am saying is that you should put a little more effort into understand the people around you, men and women, and your relationships. Don't automatically go to the heuristics and maxims of TRP to explain your experiences. Many people will live up to the stereotypes we throw around here, maybe even most. For some it will be a partial fit, but for some, dare I say it, it will not fit at all.

Furthermore, some of these categories are not always mutually exclusive. For example, alpha and beta; it is possible to provide the assertiveness and raw sexual attraction of an alpha while also providing the caring and providing qualities of the beta in one individual. As an upside, this will confuse women because they won't be able to put a finger on your true nature. You defy all stereotypes, which is immensely intriguing to them.

Just like the 'nice guys', who are obviously both betas and assholes (when they don't get what they want, which they don't, because they are weak), it is possible to be an assertive alpha without also being an asshole. Example: I forbid my girlfriend from eating sugary snacks like ice cream. She thinks this is because she is getting fat (she's not, because I make her eat healthy), and gets upset. Instead of amplifying this and invoking some dread, I assure her that it's because I want her to live a long and healthy life with me, and that I also don't eat ice cream despite working out 6 times a week and not running any risk of becoming fat.

Of course, I care more about her physical shape than her health and longevity. But I don't want to be a manipulative asshole and cause her more psychological anguish than necessary, so I frame my subtle manipulations in a more positive light. I'm still assertive and dominant, and I assure you that she's eating out of the palm of my hands and begging for my dick several times a day, but I don't need to be an asshole to do it. Of course, if she's out of line I will set her straight, but I'm never mean about it because I don't have to be, nor do I want to. She likes that I check her when she's acting out and that I sometimes tell her what to do, because she knows I am older and wiser than her. She is attracted to dominance and assertiveness, not cruelty and abuse.

There is a place for the alpha/beta and the nice guy/asshole stereotypes, but they are just that. Stereotypes. They are heuristics to allow us to quickly make snap judgements and communicate an archetype that we all instantly recognize in an efficient manner. It's a tool for communication and fast initial judgements, NOT a complete model for understanding or explaining reality in it's awesome complexity. Don't fall into the trap of binary thinking, or you and those around you will suffer for it.

In closing, I'm not sure what I should flair this. Leaving the decision to the mods or any suggestions in the comments.


[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] 212 points213 points  (21 children)

This is true in general about life. People love binary categorisations for everything, especially causes - but for complex things there are often complex causes. People are attracted to the simplicity of binary (It's nature! No it's nurture!) and often are misled into trying to shoebox things into it.

People prefer not to deal with complexity, and some people are actually incapable of it.

[–]anon35201 38 points39 points  (8 children)

people love binary categorizations.

This phenomenon rears its head in computer programming. There is a multiple choice test that can be given to a student as they begin a pursuit of computer programming. https://blog.codinghorror.com/separating-programming-sheep-from-non-programming-goats

It establishes whether or not the person will be physically able to contribute to the field of computer science after a decade of practice. The test has high information gain, meaning the test captures something of the human mind that separates programmers from non programmers. The questions are of a nature that lure the reader into using the kind of ancient brain binary thinking that humans use by default to stay alive in the jungle 800 thousand years ago. The educational system teaches binary categories in all school classes using pre-industrial assembly-line school system ideologies.

The point is, we're living in a universe that is made of spacial fields, there is no such thing as categories anywhere in this universe. Heck, there's no such thing as "things", there is no object permanence anywhere, only probabilities. Future and past are two gradient fields stretching out in two polar directions from one field. It's all gradients from negative infinity to positive infinity. One exception is the imaginary realm of boolean algebra and numbers, discrete mathematics and set theory, where human brains prefer to operate.

You can see this phenomenon much pronounced in people who have lost most of the real estate inside their minds, the mentally disabled, the very elderly, people who hit their head and are running on 10% to 30% of the cognitive horsepower they had before. You talk to them about something, and you get this distinct feeling that you're talking to a speak and spell.

the... dog.... says.................... woof woof. All Object W has property P. AWALT. The brain that derives an automatic repulsion whenever a category is linked via hashmap to a value pair is the one that has what it takes to drill down and be a programmer.

[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] 18 points19 points  (4 children)

Funnily enough, I'm a computer programmer.

[–]anon35201 25 points26 points  (3 children)

Computer programmers are over represented as the thoughtful and cerebral beta males, so this this sub is a lightning rod for such people. You ask first how you can be of service and use machinery of higher mind to service the larger tribe. Code monkey have big warm fuzzy secret heart: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYodWEKCuGg

We're entering the age of the beta male rebellion to tyrannical alphas, manifest though redpill and Trump's MAGA and Qanon, the DNA based pendulum phenomenon described here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdQpLDm6c0w

I see push back though, type alpha beta redpill stuff on youtube, you get blasted in the face with new dysfunctional family beta male feminine imperative programming. The people who have something to lose are throwing sand into the gears.

[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Yes. There was a fascinating article recently about hypergamy gone wild - Norway,. I think? And they found the bottom x% of males had been rejected by women completely...they were still being used to PAY for females via tax though.

[–]anon35201 6 points7 points  (1 child)

At some point in the last 200 years, the western cultural experiment that said allow women to get educations, take any job they wanted, the right to own property or objects, invest in any hard or liquid asset, choose their husband, and have the right to engage in politics and vote is something brand new under the sun that had unintended consequences. This western secular ideology goes against 3500 years of laid down tradition and cultural technology. Europe is a sign of things to come in America.

Western secular ideologies are manifesting a cultural disease now that is causing birth rate to fall so far below replacement that the political ruling classes fear it's going to threaten their bid at maintaining levels of dominion over their world. So the knee jerk solution is to make up manpower quotas by importing uneducated Muslims from parts of the world where Islamic State still has an indominatable male patriarchy, where each fertile women has between 8 and 15 children. Islamic State has their baby factories at full tilt. Women have nothing to do but twiddle their thumbs if they don't procreate all the time. Give that a few hundred years and Muslims will outnumber Americans 1 million to one. Importing Muslim fighters to America is like a vaccine. A little preview of Islamic Terror wakes up the immune system.

MGTOW is an attempt to remedy the disease. Destroy marriage as an institution, the Christian Church designed marriage under a very different set of ideologies that are no longer in effect. So it's like a car engine with too many parts removed, the engine isn't putting out, and so starving out the input feed to the system forces a redesign: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=9&v=nO6sjWnc1rs

[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Yes, this seems to be exactly what is happening.

TRP is a reaction against women "gaming" the dating/ sexual system.

MGTOW is a reaction against women "gaming" our culture.

[–]Psychocist 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The brain that derives an automatic repulsion whenever a category is linked via hashmap to a value pair is the one that has what it takes to drill down and be a programmer.

Ironically, on the binary nature vs nurture assertion.. Programmers are not born. Any human brain with enough brain-cells has what it takes to drill down and be a programmer. Think of the incredible complexity involved in basic language and communication. We're built to think on these abstract levels.

I've been a self-taught programmer for the last 8 years. Contracted, full-time, building my own software business.. nothing special about any of this. If you can think logically on different levels of abstraction you can be a programmer. Perhaps the focus on logic is what keeps most women away :P

[–]Fyrjefe 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I love your reply. You speak as a person who not only observes reality but is in love with what it is and what it can be. This sort of passion will take someone a long way. This is all paramount to working towards your mission.

[–]Psychocist 5 points6 points  (9 children)

It's strange. I'm used to dealing with complexity in a very conscious way (been programming for almost a decade) and yet I catch myself in binary thinking with regards to many things. I see it as different levels of distinction. If the only terms I know are nature vs nurture, I have no choice but to think in those terms (at least when communicating). Linguistic relativity I think it's called.

Considering humans engage in great deals of complexity when translating images to sounds and deciphering meaning from sounds to then translate back into images to process in the brain as they communicate with each other.. who are these people who are incapable of dealing with complexity? Seems to me even people of below average intelligence are capable of dealing with great amounts of complexity.

[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] 8 points9 points  (8 children)

I've been programming about 40 years (yes, I'm that old)

In fact, I remember programming my first computer - the educ8 - with dip switches. No mouse or keyboard or even a monitor.

The "display" was 8 leds arranged in a line; so you could see the contents of a byte at a time. Ripping stuff...

Memory was 256 bytes. Each location could store an operand OR data; it depended on how you used it.

I remember writing a program that added numbers together, but pretty soon the sinclair programmable calculator came out and I got into that instead... that was the beginning of a long journey....Vic 20, commodor 64, amiga, ti99, the beeb.. I can't actually remember them all. (ummm...an apricot was in there somewhere too. Someone thought that would be a cool name for a computer that was intended to challenge apple. Hilariously enough the monitor was amber coloured (like an apricot). I think there may have been a peach too....)

There are different levels of complexity, plus there are a lot of complex things (Like processing vision) that are done without conscious thought. But conscious thought seems more difficult and requires more control...people who are perfectly capable of kicking a ball or shooting a gun might struggle with vectors or quaternions even though they seem to be using them unconsciously to guide their motions.

So I wonder then what is it about conscious thought that requires more processing power than unconscious thought? I suspect it's because unconscious thought is to some extent "laid down in the hardware' (IE the brain, in structures and subnetworks that have evolved over aeons) whereas conscious thought is all software.

So take for example ray tracing. Do it solely on the cpu (IE conscious thought) and there is a signicifcant performance decrease compared to say using a gpu (Specialised structures or connections in the brain)

So...yes, they can, but they're using algorithms/ hardware that was gifted to them from previous generations / species.

[–]Psychocist 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I remember programming my first computer - the educ8 - with dip switches. No mouse or keyboard or even a monitor.

Kudos! I thought I had it hard in the beginning. I wish I could have watched the industry unravel over the last 40 years.

that was the beginning of a long journey....Vic 20, commodor 64, amiga, ti99, the beeb.. I can't actually remember them all.

A journey is a great way to describe it. I always feel like programming hijacked my attention. Sometimes I wonder how I get paid to have so much fun. Is a hard ride to get off! Always something to learn and improve.

So I wonder then what is it about conscious thought that requires more processing power than unconscious thought? I suspect it's because unconscious thought is to some extent "laid down in the hardware' (IE the brain, in structures and subnetworks that have evolved over aeons) whereas conscious thought is all software.

Good point RE differences in consciously managed complexity and unconscious complexity. I think that's about right, but I would expand and say this "hardware" is not just built up over aeons. For example, I'm sure there are plenty complex things you do in programming without conscious thought simply because of how many times you've done them - they've become habits, have formed grooves in your thinking, etc, same goes for vision and writing and talking and walking and any other ostensibly complex task we've simply come to handle through exposure.

Unconscious thought is simply the brain running on autopilot so it doesn't have to waste energy processing every last piece of information that comes flooding into our senses. We have to be unconscious about most things.

I think we're approaching the nature vs nurture and fixed vs growth mindset debates. I am very much of the strong opinion that nature provides the base materials to almost everyone (perhaps notably differing through gender and intelligence), and that we can largely determine how to use those base materials to achieve many levels of ability. As you say, there are different levels of complexity - so we'd have to specify the kind of programming. But I'll forever stand by research done on brain plasticity that anyone with the base materials can handle many degrees of complexity. In general terms of programming (control flow, logic, data structures, etc) I don't think there is any special kind of impenetrable complexity the average person cannot handle; they just don't want to (most people are lazy-minded). In contrast, there are definite areas of complexity (eg theoretical maths) that some brains simply don't have the intelligence reserves to handle at all.

[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

"I am very much of the strong opinion that nature provides the base materials to almost everyone (perhaps notably differing through gender and intelligence)"

It's a lovely thought that speaks well of your inner desire for fairness, and I would like it to be true, but I don't think it is. Just like our physical size, physical strength etc there's quite a bit of variation between individuals.

Brain plasticity is interesting but these things are really on the frontier of science and what we "think" about them changes - for example I think it was only 10 or 15 years ago that they discovered that the adult brain can grow new neurons; until then the accepted wisdom was that it can't. I expect many more surprises in store but then again so does everyone.

Basically, just as people physically come in a whole range of sizes, speeds and strengths and colours, so too do their mental capacities differ. It's a lovely thought - very egalitarian - to think that we may all start off with a clean and equal slate but it's objectively untrue. For example as well as being physically handicapped some people are mentally handicapped too. These are just gross and obvious variations though; as you said in your earlier post there's a whole range of graduation from those who are far less capable than an average person to those who are far more, intellectually and physically. it's not a comfortable thing to think that not all children are equal (I wish it wasn't true) but I've always preferred truth to comforting fiction.

One of the things i think of sometimes is this:

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal"

The declaration of Independence is flawed because it's based on wishes rather than reality.

I would say that it's self evident that all men are NOT created equally, either physically or mentally or financially or legally.

The problem is, if we admit that not all men are created equally, that brings us to the question of why are we treating them equally...and that's such a can of worms they preferred not to open it.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (5 children)

Unconscious thought is faster, because it requires no deliberation, but sometimes less accurate. If a man is walking towards you with a smile and hands raised he is a friend, but if he is snarling and running he is a foe and you should strike before he does. The price for not acting in time is potentially being killed, while the price for acting in error is less severe. You can't have both speed and accuracy, generally, as with all things, one thing has to be sacrificed for the benefit of the other.

There's a very interesting book about conscious vs unconscious thought called Thinking: Fast and Slow by Daniel Kahneman. If you haven't read it I highly recommend it.

[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] -1 points0 points  (4 children)

I think I've encountered it before (possibly excerpts though) and it was very good.

And yes, in the past speed of thought was more important than depth. These days though the ability to think in depth or creatively can be richly rewarding - both in the personal sense and the financial sense. The more our society evolves the more important depth becomes as opposed to speed.

Thanks for the reminder though I might try rereading it.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

It's interesting to think about whether we'll eventually evolve past our unconscious minds into something that's primarily conscious, analytical and rational, kind of like Spock from Star Trek.

There's actually a very interesting story about a guy who lost the ability to make emotional decisions due to brain trauma. Eventually he stopped functioning, because he analyzed trivial things like "should I pick blue or black ink to sign this contract" for ever and couldn't get anything done. He'd get stuck for hours in the cereal aisle trying to make the optimal breakfast purchase, comparing price, weight, texture, taste, nutritional value etc.

[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

"It's interesting to think about whether we'll eventually evolve past our unconscious minds into something that's primarily conscious, analytical and rational, kind of like Spock from Star Trek."

There's a guy who appears to have the ability to actually program his mind consciously...Daniel Tammet.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Tammet

He undertook a challenge to become fluent in Finnish (a famously difficult language) in a week - and at the end of a week was able to be interviewed in Finnish. He passed the challenge.

Do you know the name of the guy you mentioned? I'd like to look him up.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Wow, that's really cool. Gonna look into that guy more closely.

I think his name was never publicly revealed because it turned out to ruin his life completely. But there's a radio program about it where I believe they interview one of the doctors who treated him IIRC. Very interesting stuff but they don't go into depth about the neuroscience behind it unfortunately, if you're into that stuff.

https://www.wnycstudios.org/story/91642-overcome-by-emotion/

[–]TheDevilsAdvokaat[🍰] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the link, I'm going to read!

And yes, Daniel is a fascinating person and I wish I was as smart as he is.

[–]Senior Contributoradam-l 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Actually, there are two kinds of people. Those who love binary categorisations for everything, and those who don't.

[–]ChrimsonChin988 113 points114 points  (2 children)

Yes ultimately nothing is black and white. The reason why people on this sub tend to “exaggerate” is to make things more clear, especially for newbies.

Understanding the nuances of TRP is the ultimate goal. However as many of us started with BP thinking, which is one “extreme” let’s define it as white for this example. To be able to understand the nuances, which are in the grey area, you first must understand the other side of the spectrum as well; black. Black is TRP.

Only when you’ve experienced both ends of the spectrum you will be able to see the nuances and achieve maximum potential. You can’t go from BP to understanding the nuances, you must go RP first.

Therefore, we tend to exaggerate things on this sub because, remember that, ultimately you have to read between the lines. To put very nuanced points and concepts into words and make it understandable is extremely difficult, that’s why we show the extreme points of the spectrum.

Tldr; You can’t learn and experience the nuances/middle ground unless you’ve seen and experienced the extreme parts of the spectrum (BP/RP).

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 42 points43 points  (1 child)

I agree with this and if we are choosing between extremes then red (black?) is certainly the lesser of evils. You have to learn the rules before you break them.

But nuance is good too, and it's an area where I believe this sub sometimes comes up short.

[–]GoCleanYourRoom 63 points64 points  (1 child)

The absence of nuance has had devastating effects on the political and cultural landscape recently. Dont become one of those morons that views the world as black or white.

[–]3itiswr1tten 54 points55 points  (3 children)

A major underpinning of TRP is that proscriptive advice is much easier to convert to practical application than prescriptive advice, which is largely theoretical or what Plato would call a Form.

To clarify, it is significantly easier for a newbie to digest "don't do this simple objective thing" than "practice and become this nuanced subjective thing".

Let's use the example of "she's not yours, it's just your turn" vs. "frame".

The former statement is jarring and uncomfortable but is a straightforward proscription on oneitis. By following this statement literally, a newb can not only avoid the pitfalls that brought him here, but also develop ancillary traits like abundance mentality. Notably, it's much easier to convince the newb it's NOT his turn (proscription) than it is to get him to internalize the self actualization required to see himself as the prize (prescription).

The latter concept (frame) is so nuanced and varies so greatly from man to man that, again, it's much easier to teach what not to do. Don't DEER shit tests. Stop being afraid of her or her emotions. Don't believe what she says, pay attention to her actions. All are proscriptions that, carefully applied and internalized, can lead to some greater understanding once your beliefs start to align with your actions.

So yes, OP, the binary isn't the endgame. But proscription is binary and a much more effective method to foster an "unplug" - because I can't teach you how to be YOUR type of man anyway, just trade my notes on what worked for me. Forming the grey and nuanced in your brain is always up to you.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 17 points18 points  (2 children)

I agree 100% and I see why things are the way they are here. Still, I think injecting a little nuance here and there is helpful.

[–]3itiswr1tten 3 points4 points  (1 child)

TRP is for unplugging and early stage learners at this point in its population growth. Marriedredpill and the off-site forums are really where most advanced or nuanced discussion is happening.

Thing is, early stage learners SHOULD be binary thinkers. That extreme thinking is necessary for the unplug to happen. You're advocating an immediate move to prescriptive thinking, which isn't appropriate for 95%+ of readers (yes, it's that high). A quick comparison of the volume of asktrp posts to trp posts could confirm that, not to mention that the #1 correct recommendation for most asking is more sidebar

[–]Senior Endorsed Contributormax_peenor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Marriedredpill

Unfortunately, learning a better way to juggle hand-grenades isn't as advanced or nuanced as people may think. Most don't leave here to improve their lives. They leave here to try to try and fix their previous life.

Indeed, if you have grown such that you don't feel like you need to visit here, then cool--go forth and slay, traveller. It's slow suicide if you think you can evolve red pill awareness into a comfortable container of shitty old situations. You either categorically reject old shitty situations or at a bare minimum your position in old shitty situations. I'm not telling you what to do here. Stay married. That's your choice. However there is no way to be who you used to be and be ok in the marriage, no matter how much new, shiny armor you wear.

[–]pabz_is_keww 33 points34 points  (0 children)

Definitely agree. Most sentiments on TRP are 90% directionally accurate but it seems like some dudes on here have been hurt so much by women that they are truly hateful towards them.

[–]1TrenGod37 26 points27 points  (4 children)

Fucking awesome post. Been thinking about this since I came here. Most guys on here come and give advice as if things are black and white.

“All women WILL cheat”

That’s not true. There’s a lot that just won’t. They can. And of course anything is possible but that doesn’t mean your girl is going to fuck the next chad the second you’re not around. This thinking is not only crazy but will literally drive you to misery and fuck up your relationships.

These are principles we lay out. Not law. Pick and choose what works for you. What you see to be true and fit within your own frame. And live accordingly

Another thing I think we forget at times through this journey is HAVE FUCKING FUN. It’s literally the most important thing in all of this shit. We tend to get caught up in life. And making the right choices and strive for perfection. It’s not possible. Whatever your mission is. Make sure you’re always having fun with this shit.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Pick and choose what works for you. What you see to be true and fit within your own frame. And live accordingly

Another thing I think we forget at times through this journey is HAVE FUCKING FUN.

This is the key, really. My value structure leaves me more open to negative outcomes than a safer stance of assuming all women/people are evil, but it also gives me a higher possibility of a greater reward (more fulfilling and deeper relationships with others).

It's not the only or perhaps even the best way, but it's the one most in line with my goals and desires.

[–]zuixihuan 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I think the reason a girl will cheat on you is as nuanced as the whole "nature vs. nature" debate. Everyone understands a huge portion is based off character. But people don't focus on the logistics enough. It's the same thing anyone who is into pick-up focuses on. If you get a girl in a great mood, it is easy to get to a place to do the deed, and no one is around that will judge her for it, you have the lay in the bag 99 times out of a 100.

It's the same thing if there is a possibility your girl will cheat on you. If she has complete shit character, she probably will at the first possible opportunity. Maybe if she is extremely stubborn about her virtues, there is just no way she will. Maybe.

But really it is some mixture of the two. And if you have a high-quality woman, the second one, the circumstances, are the only thing that should worry you.

[–]Veretox 0 points1 point  (1 child)

"HAVE FUCKING FUN" I recently realised that I've been acting like a stiff moron, having little to no fun, while swallowing the pill hard and fast.. and you know what? I found a fb convo with some guy from highschool/long ago, and it reminded me; how fun it and I used to be.. It seems like I reverted back into that laid back state with a snap of a finger like speed. To have fun is to live a fulfilling life. That is all there is too it. Look at Arnold in pumping iron if you want to know what i mean.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Always getting the upper hand isn't worth much if you're miserable all the time because of the joys you sacrificed to get there. Pumping Iron is such a great movie, what a character he is.

[–]thebluesSV 12 points13 points  (3 children)

Thanks for the post I really needed this, I was already starting to feel miserable seeing awalt everywhere to confirm my own bias.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 23 points24 points  (2 children)

No problem. All women are not like that, but you should not assume you can find one of the exceptions. Plan for the worst and don't be surprised if things go south. Then you won't be bitter either. Have fun and realize that most things end.

[–]Koryphae_ 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Plan for the worst i.e. AWALT...

The acronym does not mean every woman WILL cheat.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The meaning behind the acronym is obscure and if you ask 100 RP:ers you will get 100 different responses. The wording, however, is very clear and absolutist. This post isn't really about AWALT, that's just a natural example to use in this sub.

But yeah, I agree and your interpretation is obviously similar to mine.

[–]mark2262 11 points12 points  (2 children)

This is such a great post. if everyone on here can really just process this information, I think it will cause a drastic and positive shift throughout this entire sub

[–]fitzrhapsody 7 points8 points  (1 child)

It's a hard thing to accomplish, because most other communities online don't promote critical thinking whatsoever. Is something vaguely conservative/liberal/independent? Better downvote it and not engage! Does something contradict my beliefs? Insult the person and don't actually think about the argument!

I don't think TRP is any worse than many other subreddits, on any side of the political spectrum. Unfortunately, the more negative/angry posts there are here, the easier it is for those lazy people to dismiss and ridicule TRP. It's really sad, but maybe, over time, we can rise above.

[–]mark2262 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is all true. I still believe that despite it being a hard thing to accomplish, we should still persevere because who knows? We may just become that one subreddit that stands out above all the lazy people that dismiss and ridicule us. Because think about it, those ridiculing people aren’t just coming at us. Their fixed mindsets cause them to do it in every aspect of their lives.

Let’s be the change.

[–]Treanwreck 8 points9 points  (3 children)

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes." - Obi Wan Kenobi

[–]one_eyed_zoro 10 points11 points  (1 child)

The irony of that statement is that it is an absolute. Beyond that, I actually like the Sith Code from the novels.

Peace is a lie, there is only passion. (This line teaches that we are always driven by base passions of needs & wants as well as the emotional responses to life)

Through passion, I gain strength. (This line teaches us that we must understand and harness our passions to preserver through obstacles and challenges we face)

Through strength, I gain power. (This line teaches that once you have the ability to turn your passions into strength, you will have the power to create change in your life)

Through power, I gain victory. (This line teaches that applying your power to your life, you can create lasting change and get what you want from life)

Through victory, my chains are broken. (This line teaches that by taking charge of our lives and changing it to get what we want, we are longer bound by what others want for us or our own internal limitations. This line is probably the most RP as it can be taken to mean breaking free of BP thinking)

The Force shall free me. (This line teaches that our will and our minds are capable of freeing ourselves is we wield it. We must be aware, understand, and apply all that we learn in order to break free)


Jedi are a prime example of BP thinking. They are always trying to please the Republic and being its white knight. They suppress their own desires and needs to serve others.

[–]Treanwreck 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Holy shit. Never thought about that, they even have the light saber colors lol

[–]magx01 9 points10 points  (1 child)

It all starts with parents/parenting.

[–]Fyrjefe 5 points6 points  (0 children)

TRP definitely functions as a surrogate father figure. Because of the collapse of the family, many young men haven't had a masculine role model to teach these dynamics. As another has mentioned in this thread, the delivery here has to be blunt and proscribed so that young men can learn about archetypes again. Only with observation, practice, and time can society change and reorder itself.

[–]Theseus_The_King 7 points8 points  (0 children)

This needed to be said so badly.

[–]lbrownlbandit 8 points9 points  (1 child)

I've recently been thinking a lot in line with this logic and recently even been debating the idea everything we do with women also applies to men. Be it a subsect of men but I have seen it time and time again where trp knowledge that I would use on women would apply to men. Even ideas such as AWALT and such where guys behave the exact same way as people describe women.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Men are becoming increasingly feminized, and testosterone levels are dropping. Women and feminists are encouraging men to adopt female sensibilities, and weak men are falling for it.

Men are ruled by biology just like women. We can't fight our nature. Just as there are patterns among female behavior, so there are with men. Sometimes these patterns overlap, sometimes they do not. Really we humans are pretty simple and dumb creatures.

[–]MotivationCheck 12 points13 points  (6 children)

This is why I hate AWALT. It’s such a nonsensical thought process to categorize any group of people as “like that”. Not smart homies

[–]bad_news_everybody 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I read AWALT the same way I read the expression "Every gun is loaded."

Literally true? No. But you wouldn't point a gun at yourself and pull the trigger, trusting that it is unloaded. Thus you should never point a woman at your wallet and trust that she's fine.

You might be dating someone who isn't "like that" but how can you tell? Short of the most rigorous verification, you should handle with care. A gun in your hands can't hurt you if you don't let it.

[–]dulkemaru51 12 points13 points  (0 children)

AWAW, All Women Are Women.

Women = Like That... they are WOMEN

They all share similar, hardwired characteristics, such as hypergamy.

Their innate programming manifests in various ways. TRP is a set of observed facts that are broken down into universals, like AWALT. With experience, people are able to predict future behaviour that varies greatly from individual to individual and between environments.

AWALT is not supposed to mean, for example, that all women cheat. That is an extension from the core, the core being AWALT, that has no basis in that core.

Take the fundamentals with you, resist the urge to draw imaginary conclusions, go out to operate in the world and observe and you will be able to draw your observations to those fundamentals, guaranteed.

[–]midnightreider 6 points7 points  (3 children)

I agree with you, binary thinkers will take that line to the wrong ends, thinking that all women are filthy cheaters. I’ve seen posts on the exTRP sub explaining TRP made them horribly anxious about their relationships and they couldn’t handle it. This sub also teaches to look for women with good family relationships and upbringings as a way to mitigate your risk of being cheated on, so AWALT is certainly more of an explanation for varying degrees of human nature, not a box to slam all women into. Nuances.

[–]MotivationCheck 5 points6 points  (2 children)

I’m pretty binary in my thinking, until I realize I’m thinking like an idiot. The worst is, AWALT has its truths for the most part, you just have to discern what’s widely applicable to women and what’s not. Not every woman is gonna fuck another man while she’s in a relationship, but just cause we read about it so often here it might seem “normal” to categorize women like that.

[–]midnightreider 12 points13 points  (1 child)

Exactly. This sub can become an echo chamber for a lot of chumps here, and it’s unhealthy. Not because the ideals are wrong, but because it isn’t healthy to be constantly hearing stories of divorce rape and guys scoring with girls in “committed” relationships when you don’t have the context of your own experience. Sure, I have friends who have been cheated on, have fucked married women and girls with boyfriends. I also see girls I know who have boyfriends turn men down because they’re already committed. The common theme? The cheating women aren’t satisfied for whatever reason, and the faithful ones are. If she isn’t satisfied, she’s going to go somewhere else eventually. There’s much more to it than just my brief summation, but that’s AWALT in short. I went to high school with a guy who’s girlfriend was asked by fucking Ronaldo to have some drinks with him wherever he was staying, and she turned him down. Trust me, her boyfriend was absolutely nothing compared to Ronaldo, but she was satisfied with him.

Stick to the sidebar, and use field reports and RP examples as reinforcement for the sidebar material.

[–]zuixihuan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm going to copy a comment I made elsewhere in this post because I think it fits your comment really well too:

"I think the reason a girl will cheat on you is as nuanced as the whole "nature vs. nature" debate. Everyone understands a huge portion is based off character. But people don't focus on the logistics enough. It's the same thing anyone who is into pick-up focuses on. If you get a girl in a great mood, it is easy to get to a place to do the deed, and no one is around that will judge her for it, you have the lay in the bag 99 times out of a 100.

It's the same thing if there is a possibility your girl will cheat on you. If she has complete shit character, she probably will at the first possible opportunity. Maybe if she is extremely stubborn about her virtues, there is just no way she will. Maybe.

But really it is some mixture of the two. And if you have a high-quality woman, the second one, the circumstances, are the only thing that should worry you."

[–]Born2flip 8 points9 points  (1 child)

I don't think a lot of you realize just how far the rabbit hole can go for guys who are naturally assertive and dominant. You do gotta turn it down a notch. I used to smack my chick around, push her around, and manipulate her so much she was real fucked up. I was laughing to myself about one of the guides in here talking about gaslighting. That's shit abusive people like myself would do naturally. I never read a guide, it just comes with being an awful person.

After a couple of years of this she stopped eating and started losing a ton of weight and tried to off herself. I used to have a viewpoint that a man should never show any weakness and my whole life was just violence towards anyone I thought would challenge me including her. I got in fights everywhere I went.

In reality that's just ridiculous and a deep seeded insecurity hiding as masculinity. That was ten years ago, and I grew up. I grew up to be a healthy individual with healthy relationships. Part of it was letting go of some of that control.

You have to have a balance. The world is cold and cruel, and I used to say you have to be colder than the world is to make it. In reality life can be a journey to enjoy or a war you are constantly fighting. It's all on your outlook. If you think the world is against you, or in the case on TRP that women are against you, that's exactly what your world will be like.

I liked this post, because as a rational person coming to this site for the first time last night I was thinking "Wow, this is some ridiculous group think bullshit written as an extreme reaction to the game between men and women changing." This post and the reactions gave me a different outlook on The Red Pill. Being a man is about thinking for yourself, and that is what the OP did here, which is braver than people swallowing any fucking pill. You swallow someone else's pill absolutely, then you are nothing more than a sheep following absolutes set by another man.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Although you took it a lot further than I ever did, I recognize that combative mindset from how I used to be. It doesn't matter how well it works, because it's no way to live. Thanks for sharing, you don't often hear about people who come back from that place.

There is a lot of anger and toxicity in TRP, but also a lot of good, insightful stuff. It's just not always framed in the most palatable manner. Like any community we have all sorts. I'm hoping we can make it into something a little healthier, but I'm not trying to tell anyone what this place should be.

[–]The_Lightskin_Wonder 7 points8 points  (0 children)

This needs to be sidebarres and put into the introductory. You will never grasp TRP if you don't learn the middle ground, and knowing when to differentiate an excuse from an actual circumstance you will stay in the anger phase.

People come here and become more depressed because of how frustrating the truths are and use the "truths" to explain there frustrations. It is what it is, If what women do angers you ; you haven't swallowed the pill.

If you explain a girl rejecting you as being a bad person then you're in the anger phase. We say AWALT because a lot of people in here will make exceptions when they shouldn't, lighten up and embrace TRP.

[–]MasonTaylor22 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Infinite shades of gray, and endless spectrums of color. Try to avoid polarized opinions.

[–]helloseven 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Read in to psychopaty and borderline narcisistic disorder. Seek help. There are ways to cope and deal with this. Remember, you are not alone.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

You're in the wrong sub. Also, no, there are no ways of dealing with psychopathy.

[–]helloseven 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Who are you to tell me if i’m in the wrong place. Oh wait.

[–]modRedForEducation 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Flexibility does not. Mean middle Ground, it. Means being flexible to all points on the bell curve. The. Middle is a placation attitude

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not sure what you're referring to but I'm not advocating for a middle ground. You should be able to move up and down the scale as necessary when it suits your goals.

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil 5 points6 points  (23 children)

The problem is that your conflating delivery methodology and leadership strategy.

Delivery Methodology is how you tell a bitch to do something kind words or baboon grunting. Yea obviously you don't have to hoot from atop a tree like a proto human and yea subtle manipulation works fine if not better in most situations.

However

Leadership is a binary your either leading or following. If you recall the 50/50 marriages of our Gen X parents generation you will remember that leadership ambivalence causes women anxiety and to chimp the fuck out and fight for dominance. A 50/50 will always push women to create a conflict to move out of the 50/50.

A beta male is a person who follows women which for us at Red Pill is a hard no.

Your post is an example of soft delivery not Gen X style 50/50 blend.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 12 points13 points  (21 children)

I'm not speaking about leadership, but I do agree that leading/following is generally a binary relationship in any given moment. With that said, there's still a big difference between using terms like 50-50 and 1-1 or 0-1, because 50-50 implies the possibility of 25-75 and other blends that may be more optimal but are not possible in a binary representation. It's still more nuanced than saying you're either A or B, which is the point I want to get across without making any suggestions on what the optimal mix is.

However, my post is also about how some phenomenon that TRP generally speak of as being linearly correlated are in fact more orthogonal in nature, such as dominant/submissive and mean/nice. I am certainly not advocating some 50/50 yin/yang mix between alpha and beta, I am saying that different mixes are possible and it's not obvious that 0-100 is always the best one.

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil -2 points-1 points  (20 children)

Blends are possible but not optimal. Any ambivalence in leadership leads to a crisis to resolve ambivalence. This is true at the personal organization and national levels. So yes 0-100 is the best one unless you want to have a Gen X style relationship like our parents generation.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 12 points13 points  (19 children)

Still not talking about leadership, the post is about metacognition and how to think.

I also don't think there is evidence to support the fact that 100% leadership is optimal in organizations. In the military and romantic relationships maybe, but certainly not in creative intellectual pursuits. This is a bit of a tangent, but strict leadership hierarchies can lead to worse outcomes when it comes to more cerebral work than factory assembly and the like. I think you are oversimplyfying, ironically in another display of binary thinking.

I see what you're saying but you're talking about something other than what I'm talking about.

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil -2 points-1 points  (18 children)

Leading a woman is just like leading a dog or a child or a restaurant it isn't a creative intellectual persuit. It's 100% like the military. Yes General Mattis has charisma and makes people enjoy following but but everyone has to obey 100% of the time.

On the subject of metacognition which doesn't appear anywhere in ur post and u pulled out of ur ass to deflect:

If your not absolute in your will your gunna have shit execution in action and leadership. If you only sorta want someone to do something they won't. If you only sorta want to squat 400 you won't.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 8 points9 points  (17 children)

I already conceded that strictly leading is preferable in romantic relationships so why are you still arguing the point? You're so dead set on proving me wrong, although you seem confused on what I'm actually saying, that you're just rambling on about inconsequential topics and coming off like a broken record.

You're being needlessly confrontational while not really saying much of anything. My post is still not about leadership. I get that this is probably your favorite topic but at this point I feel like you might wanna go write your own post cause I'm not the guy you should be arguing this with.

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil 4 points5 points  (16 children)

Your post is about how stereotypes aren't 100% absolute. However what you don't understand is that when you have a farm of Mountain Dew X Box Sperg children like we do here at Red Pill you must speak to them in absolutes otherwise they will go full watch a girlfriend slurp jizz beta male.

Head over to askTRP sometime they're still asking if it's okay to get cucked.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 6 points7 points  (15 children)

No, my post is about binary thinking. It's right there in the title. I agree there are a lot of spergs, but I'm not telling TRP to stop speaking in absolutes to spergs, I'm telling people, spergs or no, to stop thinking in absolutes because it's harmful. You can speak however you want as long as you don't try to tell me what I mean by my words or what I understand. And there you go again with the "must". I'm actually a fairly intelligent guy and I can determine for myself how I should speak to people.

The TRP discourse has a place and I see why it's useful, but it also has limitations. So maybe sometimes we could try having some adult discussions too?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (7 children)

He’s saying you’re not writing to the audience and therefore doing everyone a disservice.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 5 points6 points  (6 children)

I know what he's saying, I'm writing to a different audience than what he thinks. I also think he's underestimating the community. Look at the score, it's 90% upvoted with lots of comments in agreement. "Doing everyone a disservice" seems like a misjudgement.

[–]Senior Endorsed Contributormax_peenor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Gen X

Check.

leadership ambivalence causes women anxiety

Uh huh.

fuck out and fight for dominance.

Oh yeah. Lived that shit show. Never again.

There is no nuance. You can delegate tasks, but you cannot delegate leadership, not even the tiniest piece. You ARE always responsible. Or not.

[–]ksmith3244 3 points4 points  (3 children)

I was thinking to myself while reading this “wow, this guy really gets it”. This isn’t a post addressing positive thinking, it’s about the balance of power while considering mental control. And I agreed with everything said until you mentioned you forbid your girlfriend from eating ice cream, and from there it only got worse. To start, your lifestyle choices shouldn’t dictate what your significant other does, or doesn’t do. Forbidding her to do something for her own “well-being” doesn’t make you an alpha in a relationship, it makes you controlling. Even if she thinks it’s not about her physical appearance (when you clearly said it is), it’s manipulative to control someone without honesty. Being an alpha in a relationship means putting your significant others needs before yours, I agree it can mean checking them when they’re out of line, but respecting their decisions as a person ALWAYS. This goes beyond eating habits. It’s always facing the door when eating at a restaurant, or getting up to check a noise in the middle of the night, to name a few examples of “alpha” tendencies. It is NOT telling your girlfriend she can’t eat ice cream and her “begging for your dick” because you’re controlling. I found your post interesting, and while I think you’re on the right track for distinguishing dominant and non-dominant personality traits and the combination of the two, I’m certain your idea of an “alpha” is a bit skewed. Just something to consider.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Look, if she wants to have ice cream I'm not gonna pry it out of her hands. It's more like we're at the store, and she says can we get ice cream, and I say "no we're not eating that shit, it's not good for you", and she says "okay daddy you're right". Sometimes if the sun is out we'll have a popsicle, I'm not a goddamn tyrant. It's not about the ice cream, it's just the first example that came to mind.

I agree that my behavior is manipulative, but manipulation is not good nor evil. Manipulate means to change. When you pick up an object you are manipulating it. I am manipulating her for her good and for mine. Ice cream does not make her life happier or more fulfilling, it deteriorates her health (sugar is INCREDIBLY bad for you) and her body, and she knows she shouldn't have it. I'm being a positive influence without hurting her feelings.

[–]Koryphae_ 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I thought the optimal strategy communicating with women was to convey messages without speaking i.e. attention withrawal, etc. So saying 'You should not eat ice cream, because of X' sounds like speaking to a man, giving orders, talking logically, does it not? In that sense, you seem like a tyrant. Shouldn't the whole mindset of a man be rather like 'Enjoy the trip or get off the ride'?

But I could be off completely here.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, my girl is pretty sensible and she generally respects my opinion and tends to follow my lead, she often says as much. So for trivial things like this I can just speak my mind and say "this is how it is", and she knows I'm right on a rational level. Emotionally, perhaps not so much, you make a good point.

You're probably right that I could frame my message in a way that's more digestible to her. I don't think punishing her with attention withdrawal or similar over something as trivial as ice cream is reasonable, but I might have greater success with a more emotional appeal.

At the end of the day though, it's hard to change someone's mind at the deep level necessary to bring about permanent habitual changes. For now I'm content if she eats healthy around me.

As to your greater point, I don't think non-verbal communication is the key. Rather, it's non-rational, I.e. emotional communication. It can be harder to invoke emotions verbally, which is why actions are sometimes more effective. However, it's not about the delivery system, it's about the recipient system, if that makes sense. Speak to her emotions, not her rational pre-frontal cortex.

[–]Matacks607 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yes, as true as the whole AWALT thing seems through observation it's still an absolute. I prefer to think AWALT really only applies to a women's mating tendency and not necessarily her humanity as a whole. So it's just one aspect of one of her behaviors. Her other behaviors, including how she conducts herself in her personal and professional life are entirely human. She's only animal when it comes to mating. I think of them as day walkers like in the movie blade. They can be both human and vampire.

[–]ToryTosh1922 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Great post.

As someone with Aspergers, I know a weakness of mine is that I tend to take things too literally. I've been working on this throughout the past year by rejecting simplistic black and white thinking unless I absolutely have to use it i.e. identifying a red flag and instead focusing on nuance and depth.

I have to admit it has made my life happier. I perceive everyone as a potential ally rather than the incel mindset that the whole world is out to get me.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I know a weakness of mine is that I tend to take things too literally.

Yeah, that's an even bigger issue with women since you should never listen to their words and always try to perceive the intent or emotion behind it. I used to do it too, but you learn.

Being a bit more forgiving in your interpretation of the world is difficult and sometimes you get stuff wrong, but I think it's ultimately a happier path than the safer, more cynical one.

[–]rapeturd2006 3 points4 points  (3 children)

I'm still assertive and dominant, and I assure you that she's eating out of the palm of my hands and begging for my dick several times a day.

Holy shit. You should get a t-shirt with that on it. It'll be bigger than "do you even lift bro?".

TRP has some (some) good advice, but like all reddits, is filled with retards that say stupid shit like this totally un-ironically.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

It's a bit wordy for a t-shirt, don't you think?

[–]El_Shakiel 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Want ideas for a t-shirt ? Just browse his reddit history.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Wow, that was a weird one. The internet huh, what a ride man.

[–]Zech4riah 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is something I base my comments most of the time. Usually I'm labeled as a beta, bluepilled, purple pilled or cuck but I don't care because I totally agree with this:

I'm sure you recognize this phenomenon here on TRP, it's even in our motto, AWALT. It's no secret that a lot of the guys on here are unhappy because of their experiences and the state of society today.

My own experiences don't support binary version of AWALT. Not especially here where I live because the girls aren't nearly as slutty as in US.

[–]mmerijn 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I needed to read this post today, thank you OP and have a nice day.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Glad you enjoyed it, I hope your day improves buddy.

[–]GarytheGreat123 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Black and white, man and woman, left and right, 0 and 1, positive and negative, yin and yang. It’s the nature of our reality. When you do not rest in one state and continually flow between the two, that’s when you can truly take the world by the balls

[–]MarkGuil 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You're gonna be 50% male 50% female? Lol. You don't have zero dollars you have 30 cents. The middle ground is only a means to emotionally concerve yourself. Or to satisfy something similar

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Oh she certainly does. But when she's with me she's stuffing her mouth with my dick and not ben & jerries, and we're both happy. This post is not about ice cream or controlling people.

[–]Alpha_Jedi 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The world isn't a binary place. Sure is black and white, but there's a lot of grey in between. SJW's love to think in binary.

[–]SemiLoquacious 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Binary combination can be used to your advantage.

Like if a genie was going to give you wishes. If he gave you three, lots of people would probably throw away two wishes with desires of luxury, then hold back on the third wish for a while. If he gave you one, then many people would wish for one thing and still desire another wish.

But a genie that gives two wishes gives the most. To the typical mind, an opportunity of two wishes would tune into a person's natural binary thinking patterns, so they'd make two wishes complimenting each other.

And for a practical example of binary thinking being useful, next time you go to a job interview and the employer says "do you have any questions?", you ask two questions. Ask the first which you had planned out, then ask one which expands. You'll impress the boss, you'll pull it off naturally, and save yourself if the first question came off wimpy.

[–]1redpilldick 0 points1 point  (0 children)

5 year member with inaction, 6 months of effort starting this year, and I find myself in an LTR with a girl who has ZERO red flags. Thanks for this post

[–]fukdembitches 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Exactly.

However, feminism lacks the necessary intellectual depth to comprehend nuance or provide a logical basis. Most feminists cannot even come up with a uniform definition of what is feminism.

Modern feminism is a contradictory nebulous mess. To mask this, feminists define their arguments in nothing binaristic orthodoxy to justify their infantile dismissal all counterarguments as sexist or misogynistic.

Modern feminism lacks the intellectual maturity to deal with any counter argument. This is the main reason why many feminist arguments are shallow, not backed by statistics, and solipsistic.

Their adherents childishlyresort to labels rather than critically engaging opposing views. This is why they are so easily triggered. They are retards in the literal sense.

There exists the prospect of serious harm to the intellectual fabric of western society by allowing this cretinous ideology to gain prominence culturally and politically.

Why do you think most feminists are opposed to free speech?

Because they are too stupid to stupid to sustain any argument against their idiotic beliefs.

[–]DeeplyDisturbed1 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I posted something very similar about a year ago here (different profile) and it got shat upon mightily. Must have been my timing.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah tbh I thought this was gonna be buried at best.

It might be a sign that TRP is becoming more mainstream. As it's becoming less of a fringe community it makes sense to see a kind of watering down of some of the more radical stances people take on here.

If so, I think that's a good thing. Everyone needs TRP, and it's the best antidote for the scourge of feminism.

[–]liizzsar 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Of course, I care more about her physical shape than her health and longevity.

Says a person who's very obviously never truly loved another human being.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If that's true you should probably feel bad for me instead of chastising me.

[–]kylerosa21 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I have been finding this to be true recently.

I view alpha and beta as a spectrum. Being completely alpha is basically Dark Triad, and being completely beta is Blue Pill. Red Pill leans more to the alpha side of the spectrum. The reason i say it is a spectrum is because there is always some sort of beta characteristics in each and every person, and is needed in each and every person.

There are moments in relationships where you need forced beta characteristics to increase the relationship’s longevity. Being always alpha is not conducive to anything long-term, but helps get you there. The most redpilled men do in fact have some beta characteristics and apply them as needed and only when they know that it won’t affect their frame with the woman.

[–]bipedalsentient 0 points1 point  (0 children)

people who fall into binary categories or make themselves out to be in one, are people who don't know themselves yet.

[–]fitzrhapsody 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I point to posts like this as examples when outsiders immediately label everyone in the TRP community as sexist assholes who hate women and only want to get laid. This is self-improvement. TRP is self-improvement. Everything here focuses on self-improvement. "Getting girls" is important, but secondary. Your post is excellent. 1000% this.

To me, TRP is about helping people get into healthy mental and physical shape first and foremost, then understanding how people actually work/think, not just how society lazily tells us they do. It's about taking personal responsibility, being able to adapt to situations and understand why people do what they do, and critically think for yourself, as opposed to the rest of society that seems focused on forcing people to swallow and regurgitate PC rhetoric like a mindless drone.

Oh, and it just so happens that having those skills might also get you laid. Shocking!

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's what I would like TRP to be too, but I find that's often not the case. But I see why people take such an absolutist stance here, they want to distance themselves from their former BP selves and make it easy for newcomers to digest.

Unfortunately though, I think that this rhetoric sometimes turns away some of a more sensible and gentle disposition, who might benefit from TRP:s teachings. It's got a kind of almost radicalizing feedback effect.

[–]VeganBaguette 0 points1 point  (2 children)

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I claimed that it can be the truth, not that it must. You fell victim to absolutist binary thinking, and comitted a logical fallacy of your own in failing to understand what I'm saying.

[–]Pynewacket 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I claimed that it can be the truth, not that it must.

Binary thinking limits you, it makes you miss subtle nuances and it also makes the world you inhabit a miserable black and white place where everyone who is not your friend is your enemy.

Don't fall into the trap of binary thinking, or you and those around you will suffer for it

AWALT is not a motto of the sub, but the concept that women's sexual strategy is underpined by hypergamy.

[–]Schhwing 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Dichotomies serve as good illustrating models. AF/BB, or lover/provider being an invaluable one. However of course you don’t need to shame yourself for straying from a hard line or showing some ‘niceness’ or humanity.

The key here is to make your life the best it can be for you. Everyone is different in ways, which means what will be comfortable for one, won’t be for another. Find the shoe that fits and wear that.

[–]Born2flip 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Very rational and intelligent post.

[–]anabolic92 0 points1 point  (3 children)

One of the clears examples of those binary thinkings, that lead to the extremes, is often seen on asktrp.

OP feeling insecure because, for example, her LTR/plate has done something suspicious (note, just suspicious not disrespectfull).

The answer is "ghost, delete her from all social media, drop stuff in bags" without knowing half of the details that might be worth asking the OP before coming into that conclusion.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Yeah, it's the safest response but it's kind of a chickenshit move in my opinion. You can't really go wrong because there's no risk involved, but of course there's also not much opportunity for reward.

It's hard to form meaningful relationships if you drop everyone at the first sign of trouble. That's fair if you're not interested in one, but relationships with women can be very rewarding and fulfilling as long as you don't expect too much from them.

[–]anabolic92 0 points1 point  (1 child)

As long as there is no boundaries crossed from the other side, that should have been stated at the beginning of the relationship, or a clear disrespect it's better to end on good terms with anyone, men or women.

At the end of the day the world can be such a small place and you don't know when you might need the help from the persons that have been in your life.

[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah I kind of glossed over the ghost part, I agree with that. I don't like burning bridges if I can avoid it, even if someone slighted me. Revenge is petty and doesn't really benefit me in any way. It's an emotional response, not a rational one. It's how women behave. I end all my relationships on good terms if I have the chance.

[–]randarrow 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is one of those places where "Seven Habits of Highly Effective People" is good. The Think Win-Win chapter covers this. Don't just focus on comprise though, look for solutions which makes both people think they won without either compromising.

[–]BaelorsBalls 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I love this post! I’ve been thinking about this but didn’t know how to put it into words and you captured it perfectly

[–]deon10 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sidebar this please!

What an awesome and necessary post

[–]Luckyluke23 0 points1 point  (0 children)

great post man i learnt alot thanks :)

[–][deleted]  (11 children)

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[–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (10 children)

Well look at the balls on this one. Not to rain on your parade but someone made that exact same comment already.

Look, if she wants to have ice cream I'm not gonna pry it out of her hands. It's more like we're at the store, and she says can we get ice cream, and I say "no we're not eating that shit, it's not good for you", and she says "okay daddy you're right". Sometimes if the sun is out we'll have a popsicle, I'm not a goddamn tyrant. It's not about the ice cream, it's just the first example that came to mind.

I agree that my behavior is manipulative, but manipulation is not good nor evil. Manipulate means to change. When you pick up an object you are manipulating it. I am manipulating her for her good and for mine. Ice cream does not make her life happier or more fulfilling, it deteriorates her health (sugar is INCREDIBLY bad for you) and her body, and she knows she shouldn't have it. I'm being a positive influence without hurting her feelings.

[–][deleted]  (9 children)

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    [–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] -1 points0 points  (3 children)

    Listen captain Save-a-hoe, I think you're in the wrong sub. This is TRP and we don't do white knighting or moralizing here. Maybe you should fuck off back to safe-space reddit where you'll find some ideas more in line with your feminine sensibilities.

    [–][deleted]  (2 children)

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      [–]Razkolol 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Yea it's becoming dangerous for icecream companies if op continues his rampage, sales are already dropping fast.

      [–]Razkolol -1 points0 points  (4 children)

      He's an asshole for not letting the girl transform herself into a big sack of unfuckable fat, yea, such a deepshit, he's helping her maintain her fitness level and beauty, he should let her live the way she wants to, eating mcdonalds and icecream, such a manipulative asshole. Irony apart if more guys did this there would be more hot fit chicks around, your beta ways are destroying the smp bro, you're letting your girls get fat ruining them for the rest of us.

      [–][deleted]  (3 children)

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        [–]Razkolol -2 points-1 points  (2 children)

        There are certain rules and boundaries that you need to set, if you don't you'll end up with a fat ugly bitch bossing you around, but hey maybe that's what you want, everyone is different.

        As for the forcing part I didn't see OP mentioning any beating or punishment for non-compliance (which could easily be done if you open the bdsm door xD) so I don't see why you're getting so white knighty, OP's girl won't suck your dick for defending her, sorry.

        [–][deleted]  (1 child)

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          [–]Razkolol 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          You talk about manipulation but 99% of the time women are the ones manipulating, usually for material benefit, "x did y for my friend, you never do y for me" "x bought y for my friend, i could use y you know", this results in material benefit for the girl, what did op do again? Manipulated her into not becoming a fat pig, you lack so much logic that i'm starting to think you're female.

          edit: I'll stop here, your argument is "manipulation is wrong mkay?" mine is "results > means" we're not gonna agree, I think that op is doing good manipulating chicks into becoming fit, i like to see more fit chicks around, fit chicks > fat chicks; you think we should be able to live in a utopia with unicorns dancing around and that people are equal and all the left wing narrative. World has a lot more problems than OP not letting his gf become a fat pig, wanna make the world a better place, volunteer, help starving people in Africa, donate to charity, don't bring bullshit moralizing lectures founded on garbage here.

          [–]SpaceEnthusiast 0 points1 point  (2 children)

          I'm convinced that this kind of binary thinking is a necessary step TOWARDS nuance. Let me explain. When you've been BP all your life, it's hard to have a nuanced view, because any of your views will be near the BP side of the spectrum. When you find out the RP part of the spectrum, you latch on for dear life, because it gives you so much new information about women and life. And now you separate things into BP and RP. But now you have a lot more informational power. You've found out what the extremes can be, or at least the near-extremes. It is NOW that you are capable of proper nuance, because everything is contained in between.

          [–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

          That's a very interesting point. While I wouldn't say it's always necessary, I'm sure that it helps to see both extremes. That way you experience first hand how none of them are perfectly congruent with reality.

          [–]SpaceEnthusiast 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Yea. I went from my first relationship, which was very long term, to having a lot of ONS and plates, both of which are extreme situations. Now I'm settling into a more middle ground of having 1-2 great girls with me and a ONS here and there on the side. By exploring the extremes, you can find what balance works for you best.

          [–]andtoc -1 points0 points  (4 children)

          I'm curious. Do you know any examples of celebrities/historical figures who have both alpha and beta sides? I'm finding it hard to imagine what such an individual might be like.

          [–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

          Not that I can think of right off the bat, but there probably are. When I say beta, I mean beta as in a gentle protector and provider, not a submissive, feminine soyboy. I'm sure there are many people who are decisive and assertive while also having more caring qualities.

          [–]MarkGuil -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

          I really hope you didn't suggest being beta AND alpha. Why would you want to be beta? It's just stupid.

          [–]abudun79 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

          A missing counter-weight to a lot of post that took RedPill truths to unhealthy conclusions! Thank you very much!

          It sometimes reads like some people missed to improve life and hamster their realization of some negative common ground into the improvement. I'm sure not every author had the intend to make it all black-white and sometimes uses that as a style or to make points clear. But I am also sure a lot of people new to the RedPill might not digest every article in a way they benefit from.

          [–]guccigoggle -1 points0 points  (0 children)

          I think over exerting the idea of alpha/beta is a depressing sniveling thing for any grown man to do. Belief in yourself, and moral high ground should guide us, but for some reason external motivation(sexual prowess, money, body type) is what plants the seed. These are actually good things and are necessary to life, not prizes. I think people should apply Red Pill to your roots, where in life do you think you got off track? Is it childhood, teen years, college, career. Apply principle where you lack ability and branch out.

          [–]terryboyyy -1 points0 points  (0 children)

          You kind of solved this shit in my head I’ve had for a while

          [–]MarkGuil -1 points0 points  (3 children)

          I see what this "post" is about...So basically you disagree with AWALT? That's all you had to say. I mean, it depends on what you say ALL WOMEN are like. Obviously if you mean hypergamous you mean ALL. All women have vaginas and XX chromosomes, and have female brains. Most people in TRP don't say ALL all the time. They are just sick of saying "NOT ALL NOT ALL NOT ALL" 24/7 and get tired of it. On the contrary, they almost never bring up the numbers of females or people in general that fit the description unless speaking on statistics and just leave such numbers up for the reader. All in all, if you think you've found a unicorn and she's shifting your brain, or situations that make you want to drive more in between the roads, so be it. But don't try and disguise it. That's not honest.

          [–]_BITCHES_LOVE_ME_[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

          This post is about binary thinking, not AWALT. Calm down there slugger

          [–]MarkGuil -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

          Same to you slow poke. This post is irrelevant.

          [–][deleted] -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

          DING! You just proved AWALT is bullshit but then immediately dismissed it.