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Rant/VentingDo Not Open Up to Women About Your Struggle (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by mackstarmagic

Intro

I recently broke it off with a girl I have had as a long term plate/LTR of sorts. I will be honest it was not easy. The sex was the best I've had and she had an adventurous personalty which matched mine. The past month leading up to this I was in a rut and unsatisfied with my progress. I am currently working as an engineer and have been feeling it is holding back my SMV. I began to obsess about what I can do to satisfy my ambition. It caused me to fall into a low energy state and get bogged down.

Don't Open Up or Express Turmoil

Knowing better but wanting the warm fuzzy feeling of having someone be there for me, I made the mistake of turning to my LTR. I opened up to her about my internal struggle and some of the things I wanted to work on and change. Guess what? Two weeks later she is fucking some hippy bartender. I know the laws, but it was a wakeup call that women will not respect your struggle, even when it is the slightest. Instead they will do the opposite and take advantage of you showing your weaknesses. Don't go to women for support, turn to your male friends instead.

Being Vulnerable

You will hear people say "Be Vulnerable" this does not mean open up and show a women your soft side. Being vulnerable to the RedPill means taking chances and facing rejection and turmoil, not hiding from it. A women will never understand your ambition and drive. They don't need to get better or improve themselves "not until they reach the wall anyways". There is no benefit in confiding in them for advice on the matter.

TD;LR Work through your struggles on your own or with other men. Do not confide in women even if they are close to you.


[–]P4_Brotagonist 133 points134 points  (30 children)

Couldn't agree more. When I was in an LTR about 10 years back, my best friend was killed in a car wreck. At that point I had been exclusive with this girl for about 6 months. I broke down crying about it finally one day out of nowhere. She asked what was wrong and I told her I finally was feeling something(I had never really felt that sense of loss and pain until that moment). A year later we broke up and she actually brought that shit up about how she always knew I was weak because I cried over someone dying.

[–]therhymerr 123 points124 points  (18 children)

God dam this is fucking disgusting. What a fucking no good piece of trash human

[–][deleted] 54 points55 points  (16 children)

All women are like that. Even if she doesn't say it, deep down she's disgusted by your empathy. Empathy is weakness to women. That's why they love guys like me and even more fucked up than me, because we have little to no empathy. Women love fucked up soulless DT men. It is strength in their eyes. I'm not a psychopath, but women love psychopaths. Women are psychopaths so they identify with psychopathic men more. Its a type of projection.

[–]MakeEmSayAyy 6 points7 points  (4 children)

Women are such ridiculous slaves to their impulses it's really sad. This would be like us trying to fuck anything that moves cuz we couldnt refuse sex.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (3 children)

I really don't understand why any man who fully understands female nature can still have any love or care for them.

[–]SatanAscending 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Multiple EC mentioned that they in fact love women. And what's more, we're here because of that.

Example: recent post from /u/TheeRyanGrey "I Love Women, I Do Not Respect Them"
Now, "love" is a very emotionally charged word. Perhaps how you define "love" is different way than the "love" of said EC. I can think of other possibilities, for now that's enough.

[–]Endorsed ContributorTheeRyanGrey 14 points15 points  (1 child)

I love women. They bring great happiness into my world. They balance out my cynicism and pragmatism. I enjoy the way they can care about things, especially me, with such fervor and passion.

If we only look at the worst aspects of each gender it would be impossible to love anything and we might as well turn into a nation of nihilists(which, to be fair, we're already doing)

But that's the pussy way out.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (2 children)

what they want is the tame psychopath. The psychopath on a leash. If you could own a tiger as a pet, that's what they'd want. A huge fuzzy cute warm huggable tiger all their own that can rip heads off of people that piss them off without so much of an eyeblink.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Basically. They want to tame the untameable. They want what they can't have. Typical female (and human in general) nature.

[–]HeadingRed 3 points4 points  (1 child)

It also scares them that you care that deeply about something other than themselves. Narcissism in action.

[–]therhymerr 5 points6 points  (2 children)

Well what I would say is acceptable is if the guy couldn't get it together months later. But this is one time

[–]Robert_Walker 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Yeah, but in her mind, showing that weakness means that you've been faking your strength all this time.

The switch flips from "Strong man" to "Weak man pretending to be strong" and it's fucking all over sooner or later.

Yes it's fucked up.

Males commit suicides at 4 times the rate of women. I fucking wonder why eh.

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (0 children)

One time is all they need. This is why marriage and LTRs are so hard. You're on ALL THE TIME. You have to have amazing game and frame ALL THE TIME. You can never show weakness...or there goes your house, kids, half your income, etc. This is one of the reasons we here at TRP reccomend never gettingmarried. Its stacked against you.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child)

that's when you say you were Bi and you were in love with him, that he filled your soul like she never did, you were torn but stayed with her out of loyalty but you knew you would never have this magical beautiful soulmate feeling with anyone ever again. And the day you cried, was the day you realized that you were stuck in a shit relationship, with a shit person with no soul and no heart. And that you lost your forever love and made the wrong choice. And you're so glad she's left because you were saying out of a sense of duty, that she really needed someone to care for her because you couldn't see how anyone else will ever want such a pitiful excuse of a human being as her. But Bob your friend of the beautiful soul, he taught you true compassion and though you never did find love for her like you did with Bob, you felt compassion. Maybe it was a mistake after all to shelter her for all this time in a loveless relationship and in a way, you're glad that you're both free. That in the end you were just trying to do for her the things that you could never do for Bob because life took his beautiful soul away from you.

So, in conclusion, have a good life. Maybe someone can love you some day, the way Bob loved me and the way I loved Bob.

[–]Caucasian-African 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Did you laugh at her? That is so dumb, I can't believe she said it...

[–]P4_Brotagonist 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Nah she was my first oneitis so I acted like a bitch.

[–]Vajesticles 1 point2 points  (1 child)

This girl must have an mental illness.

[–]yaysmr 139 points140 points  (44 children)

I will echo the advice of NEVER opening up about weakness, trials, or travails to a woman or someone you don't trust. No upside to letting such people in on it at all, tons of downside.

Only 'exception' is if you can immediately talk about how you overcame it/are overcoming it. And make it clear that you are going to deal with it yourself. Even better if you can tell it as a rousing story with your ultimate victory as a climax.

For instance, I sometimes bring up how I used to be afraid of heights... until I went skydiving. And I used to be afraid of public speaking... until I did six years of speech and debate competition. I'm not afraid of heights or public speaking anymore.

Or if you're going through an issue, bring it up in a general sense and then talk in depth about your plan for beating it. Don't whine about that project at work or your shitty boss unless you are already in the midst of beating the issue and can describe your efforts and your plans.

What is VITAL is avoid the appearance that you're in need of help. NEVER ask them their input, and always project the image that the situation is under control.

She won't be interested in your issues, but you may be able to gain some SMV in their eyes if you show that you don't back down from personal challenges and are completely capable of overcoming them.

[–][deleted]  (6 children)

[deleted]

    [–]yaysmr 10 points11 points  (5 children)

    As part of your RP journey you should be scouring for your own weaknesses and eliminating them anyway.

    I would say you should not bring up your weaknesses with a plate or LTR (or anybody) until you've fixed it enough to no longer truly be a 'weakness' but just a 'work in progress,' and you can actually point towards tangible progress to that effect.

    Don't count on others for the plan unless they themselves can empathize with your particular issue and thus know how to escape it.

    [–]blackwolfrain 3 points4 points  (3 children)

    What about the weaknesses that are permanent like a lifelong injury? Something mental like ADD? Genetic like chance of diabetes or heart problems? Never bring it up to an LTR ever?

    [–]yaysmr 9 points10 points  (2 children)

    Never ask her to shoulder the burden. Become awesome at everything else.

    Its part of who you are, and if you can demonstrate that you're dealing with it and not whining about poor ol' you all the time, it can be overcome. Demonstrate that your 'weakness' doesn't hold you back and you won't use her as a crutch.

    Be this guy. He is doing alright, what is your excuse?

    [–]angry-neckbeard 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    I've seen that guy before, he always blows me away.

    [–]NietzscheExplosion 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Fuck that - do what you feel like. If they leave, good fkin riddance!

    [–]wunderwaxel 2 points3 points  (1 child)

    I can agree with this. I suffer from depression and I'm totally open about it. Sometimes it can be tough to handle me so with being open about it, I can sort out all the girls who wouldn't even try. I made good experiences with this. I guess it's because I see my depression more like a nuisance than a weakness and I know well how to fight it. Some of the girls even considered me as strong for not relying on meds and doing sports and fun activities instead.

    [–]Caucasian-African 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    You're battling depression, but your not a pu**y... That's what counts. Sounds like you own it, as you should.

    [–]Expectations1 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    Yep, talk it over with other men if you must. Women dont understand the trials that men have to go through to be on an equal playing field as their pussy.

    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

    I use women as a sound board where I voice my ideas and work through any trouble while I talk to them. I thank them for being a sounding board because that's how I operate in my thinking.

    [–]BuschMaster_J 0 points1 point  (1 child)

    I wouldn't bring them into the sound board unless you are already a couple steps down the road already. In my opinion it looks like you don't know and are asking for their permission or approval.

    [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    No, of course it's not like you have any ideas. You present options, your thoughts, the potential disadvantages, ask if they see something you don't. And decide. You never ask for their input as to what to do.

    Who said you can't use people? Women are still people and usually the ones I hang out with, they are well versed in their field of expertise. So I view things from a different angle as well.

    [–][deleted]  (27 children)

    [removed]

      [–]Endorsed ContributorMentORPHEUS 15 points16 points  (3 children)

      You get help and maybe sympathy from your bros, your Mother, a therapist.

      OP's point, which my own life experience has affirmed, is you don't let women see your weaknesses and problems if their attraction to you is important.

      [–]cryoshon 2 points3 points  (1 child)

      you don't let women see your weaknesses and problems if their attraction to you is important.

      this is a contradiction to the entire trp philosophy, right? how is the attraction of a woman to you important, given all the dogma? shouldn't you be beyond caring about the approval of women?

      [–]AnAbsoluteSith 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      It's not that you swallow the pill and emanate general apathy towards everything with a vagina. It's an understanding that you, no matter what happens should she stay or should she go, you're going to be okay in the end because there is always going to be other opportunities. Your life's value, success, and meaning is not tied to some woman.

      Situations like this topic obviously will only apply for those who are in some form of LTR. These men will, practically speaking, have some vested interest (time energy resources), and thus it will make sense not to muck it up if it is that the LTR still holds some value to them.

      [–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (2 children)

      you're so wrong and that is blue pill bullshit.

      1. He didn't say never ask for help. He said avoid the appearance that you need help. To go to your male friends for help. Or, a doctor is good if it is something a doctor can treat. He's saying don't expose your woman to it. She is not your source of support.

      2. Also it won't drive men to suicide. It will help them. What will drive them to suicide is going to the woman for support, leaning on her, then she runs off and fucks Chad and now you have your "support" yanked out from under you. You need to realize it's not there and it's fragile so don't lean on it and you won't lose it.

      3. Keeping up appearances of strength IS STRENGTH it's not the fucking blue pill opposite. STRONG MEN CRY, STRONG MEN SHOW WOMEN THEIR EMOTIONS, and they do not. Tears when appropriate (lost the game, saw my baby the first time), but you don't break down in tears all the time like they say they want you to. Keeping up appearances is what lead the British to fucking conquer half the planet. Stiff Upper Lip and all that. Being able to function and be in control while you're going through hardships is the definition of strength. This pussy ass breakdown and cry and run to everyone for help when you face hardships is weakness.

      Why are you posting this blue pill fucking nonsense here?

      If your problem is so huge, you go to pros.

      If your toilet is broken and you're trying to fix it and you get shit everywhere, do you go to your wife? No, you hire a fucking plumber. If you have a problem with a contract and you can't handle it? Go to your friend who's a lawyer. Not your wife.

      Yes, go for help in those situations.

      No, don't turn to your wife for "wahh, I'm afraid, waaaah, I'm stressed, waaaah this is too difficult, waaaaah I broke this thing and I can't fix it, waaaaaahhh the guys at the office just don't like me.

      1. it will make her pussy go completely dry for you and wetten it for your replacement
      2. you will get nothing useful because she's going to pat your head and affirm your emotions instead of helping you fix the problem
      3. you won't recover your manhood in her eyes because you will look like just who you are: a useless twat who is not strong enough to deal with his own shit, so how's he going to deal with hers and the kids on top of all this

      All of that gives her the signal to get. the. fuck. out. while she still has a bit of sexual desirability left in her.

      Why RP'ers voted up this blue pill advice is beyond me.

      [–]yaysmr 11 points12 points  (6 children)

      If you have a mental illness, if you have severe issues, go to a therapist or psychologist. They won't judge you, they'll help you resolve it, and they won't use it to undermine you later.

      Are you implying that dumping your issues on a woman (especially one you're trying to have sex with) is the best remedy for that sort of issue?

      There are plenty of outlets for a man to let out his feelings. Women are the worst of them all.

      [–]wunderwaxel 4 points5 points  (0 children)

      If you truly need help, ask for it. Just don't be a crybaby all the time. The ability to see that you can't take a problem on yourself is something I consider a strength. I work in the medical field and the people who are considered the weakest by nurses are the ones that always cry and never do anything to better there situation (like asking for help or taking the advise of a doctor seriously).

      [–]Geckobird 2 points3 points  (2 children)

      That's why it's imperative to have close male friends you can trust and count on in an LTR. Close male friends who will understand your struggle and support you, and not bail on you like your girl will. This can be hard as for the most part, no one cares about your struggle. But true male friends, true, close ones, will be there for you.

      [–]cryoshon 0 points1 point  (1 child)

      But true male friends, true, close ones, will be there for you

      when have you initiated emotional care for one of your close male friends?

      [–]angry-neckbeard 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      when have you initiated emotional care for one of your close male friends?

      Dude that sucks, let's hit on girls until it doesn't.

      Lets play video games and get smashed until our feeling centers are melted to the console!!

      Let shoot things/go fishing/go camping and meditate withe the world until we feel at peace with life.

      DO YOU EVEN LIFT BRO!? MORE!!!*

      You know you are my favorite human right? No homo.

      * hugs crying friend *

      Yeah, /u/cryoshon, I don't give my bros cuddles, kisses, and sing them to sleep. They can tell their woman to do that. Fuck you for saying that I don't help out my friends as best I can. They are my life.

      [–]i_got_the_clearance 2 points3 points  (5 children)

      Women are not naturally built to empathize with you and want to help you. It seems like they are, doesn't it? So it took me 3/4 of my life to figure this out. It is sad, but conducting yourself with this knowledge is what will keep you from killing yourself

      [–]cryoshon 0 points1 point  (4 children)

      spoken like someone who can't emotionally click with a woman

      good will begets good will. that doesn't mean that everything always works out in the end, but it's a better bet than hate.

      [–]angry-neckbeard 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      spoken like someone who can't emotionally click with a woman

      Spoken like someone you can't see that women don't give a fuck about how much you love them.

      Women don't want a little boy they have to care for. They want a man who is strong, and who's weaknesses are actually strengths.

      Why are scars hot? Because you healed and overcame the injury you freaking ripped beast!

      it's a better bet than hate.

      Who says we hate anyone? We hate society and what it's made of the world. I personally think the institution of marriage could use a swift kick in the nuts but... That's another story.

      [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (2 children)

      Get this faggot shit out of here. You do not need help from women.

      [–]Geckobird 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Careful with this. In OP's post, he mentioned how he wanted to fix the problems he was dealing with. He explained that he was working on a plan. Things still went south. Sometimes you should just keep your mouth shut.

      [–]MeiFriend 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      This. Weakness and complaining is not a manly thing to do, and to he honest that girl had very little values or interest in LTR anyways. Lets not forget that AWLT but also there are some better quality ones than others.

      But I'd take this advice with a grain of salt, having a weakness isn't all bad if it's temporary or something you can work on.

      [–][deleted]  (47 children)

      [deleted]

      [–]TryDoingSomethingNew 64 points65 points  (18 children)

      I agree. Women with a more insidious nature will not hesitate to bring up how you once made a single bad mistake, childhood abuse you suffered (and paint you as a possible offender, for no reason!), or whatever thing that was even outside of your control, or ridicule something about you that is very low.

      And yet would scream bloody murder if you do something even remotely similar.

      [–][deleted]  (16 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]TryDoingSomethingNew 15 points16 points  (0 children)

        Thanks for the reminder. AWALT is something I've learned you need to keep having a reminder about in order to keep chipping away at the old mentality and let the new red pill thoughts (in that subject) take it's place.

        [–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (3 children)

        I was online dating with a girl who was being too coy about photos. I felt some were fake that show her body, too easy to find on instagram some random hot or semi-hot girl. Arranged the date. Kept asking for real photos. Sent her a selfie of myself dressed to go out, said I was not going to open the door to my apartment unless I got a selfie from her and I could find her in the crowd (she tried any excuse before to not send this selfie).

        So she sends it and she is heavy. Not fat obese but getting to the point of the arms being puffy and waist is gone and I said fuck it.

        This girl lied to me all along about how she looked. I am not going to be attracted to this shit. She thinks she's going to win me over by her personality. I'm going to deal with listening to her bullshit all night long, paying for shit and then go home pissed I lost a night.

        The Blue Pill tells me: go! Be a gentleman! Give someone a chance you never know! She could be a fun time for you! You may like her! Maybe she's just self conscious! You don't want to be shallow do you?

        The Red Pill tells me: she started with a lie, she will end with a lie. She hides her body because if she shows it she knows I won't be interested. She tried to string it out as long as I made it an issue, if she was confident and honest she'd just show herself and let me decide. I showed me and let her decide. She's trying to play one set of rules for her and one for me. I have to go all the way the fuck out to her and I know I am getting an unattractive liar and manipulator. Fuck it, I'm not going.

        So I texted her and I said this is not going to work, let's just cancel here and not waste our time.

        This girl who had been sweet until now, launched into the vindictive...

        Her: YOU'RE SHALLOW Me: Yes. Looks matter to me. They matter to most people but they lie about it.

        Her: YOU JUST WANT TO FUCK A YOUNGER GIRL Me: Yes.

        Her: YOU'RE NO GEORGE CLOONEY Me: Yes, if I were do you think I'd be on this dating app talking to you?

        I never went back at her with hate. She just tried to keep the insults rolling. I just kept agreeing and explaining. I told her it would be worse if I found her not attractive to go out and make the trip to see her and waste her time and my time. So I'm doing the right thing for both of us.

        She no doubt went off to her friends, didn't tell the part about hiding how she really looked, and would describe me as this shallow asshole who made her get dressed up and ready and bailed on her. And that part was all her fault, using fake bikini model photos when appropriate for her photos.

        So even though this woman was dealt with honestly, with integrity by me, and she was lying and dishonest, when the gloves came off she was on the warpath and I was to the point and didn't get mad.

        It's just part of the ticking bomb you get when dating. Whenever it goes red flag get the fuck out of there. I did. So happy I didn't waste that night and the texts that kept coming in for the next day I eventually just read and didn't respond to. Hamster was talking.

        [–][deleted] 35 points36 points  (10 children)

        They don't give a shit about you even before their egos take a hit. Women are sociopaths, they have no true empathy for others. Especially not men. Primal female nature is twisted.Its Emotionally hungry, masochistic, and sociopathic.

        [–][deleted]  (3 children)

        [deleted]

          [–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children)

          Which is why I don't understand RP men who still care about women besides sex after taking the pill. THEY DONT GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YOU. WHY WASTE EFFORT ON A CREATURE LIKE THAT? Use em, Abuse em, Lose em. They beg to come back for more (more pain that is.)

          [–]MakeEmSayAyy 1 point2 points  (1 child)

          "oh but that's just their nature. I'm an alpha but I'm okay with someone using me for what I can provide without any empathy whatsoever for me who will constantly annoy me to test my fitness (shit tests) with no regard to how that makes me feel or that it might be annoying to me. It's just her nature which she can't possibly be expected to suppress (which we as men have to suppress in every facet of our goddamn lives or get raped in a cage constantly)"

          [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Right? This moralizing make no sense. Women have no morals towards men, they don't give a fuck about us besides our sperm and money. So men shouldn't have any empathy or morals for women, and not give a fuck about them besides their bodies/sex. It's all they have to offer. Besides women love immoral psychotic men.

          [–]TheInevitableHulk 8 points9 points  (1 child)

          They aren't sociopathic that implies that they are behaving abnormal, this behavior is the same species wide with few exceptions

          [–]RedSugarPill 3 points4 points  (0 children)

          Nope. Sociopathy is common. Read the gervais principal.

          [–]1egoisenemy 0 points1 point  (3 children)

          All women are crazy but they're not true sociopaths. Mothers love their children, for the most part. That being said, that's as far as it goes generally.

          [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

          My point still stands: why give a fuck about a creature like that besides sex? Women will never truly give a fuck about you deep down.

          [–][deleted]  (2 children)

          [deleted]

            [–]nevva_Again 14 points15 points  (0 children)

            Never again will I share my problems with women I like.

            Never Again.

            That's where my username comes from.

            Never again will I allow a woman to mess with me in any way.

            [–]Caucasian-African 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            Really? Was it a woman you were dating? I'm lucky that I haven't had this happen. I think I naturally don't trust women enough to be open with them...

            [–]HappyScribe 21 points22 points  (4 children)

            They're just collecting ammo for future use, that's all it is.

            If any of you don't believe this, a few weeks before breaking up with a plate, make an offhand comment about how you don't like your nose and are a bit sensitive about it.

            Just say it once.

            I guarantee she'll bring it up weeks later when you break up. The only reason they want you to open up is to catalogue your weaknesses.

            [–]SoundMake 5 points6 points  (2 children)

            make an offhand comment about how you don't like your nose and are a bit sensitive about it.

            There is one exception that she won't talk about. This only applies to the better endowed men.

            She will never gossip about how big your cock is.

            [–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

            "I'm really self conscious about my 9 inch cock :( its constantly rock hard and throbbing, and it gets stuck in the zipper. Women look at me like a human dildo when I pull my dick out. like I'm not even a person! I'm more than a dick you know, stop objectifying me D': "

            [–]Kalidane 4 points5 points  (0 children)

            She absolutely will during the relationship, and more importantly the details of sexy-times, if the stories are good enough to make her friends jealous.

            This is part of the reason that friends of your FWB 'need you to come over and help fix the whatever'.

            [–]Endorsed ContributorTheeRyanGrey 29 points30 points  (12 children)

            This is correct but a little malicious and one sided.

            Women can be supportive and caring and nurturing, but only once you've established dominance and power and security.

            Men shouldn't open up about their feelings or emotions or vulnerabilities until they are 100% certain the woman they have is a good one.

            Much like women shouldn't fuck until they've found the same.

            See how this works?

            [–]Jani1157 8 points9 points  (7 children)

            I see where you're coming from, but no-one will ever be able to tell 100% with either sex until you open up. It's a gamble for men and women no matter how you dress it.

            If you HAVE to open up to a girl, make it cone from a place of power, where you already know how to handle it before she nags you to hear it.

            [–]Endorsed ContributorTheeRyanGrey 18 points19 points  (6 children)

            Shit test. Shit test. Shit test.

            Do what women do with their crazy and let a little out and check the reaction.

            But NEVER, and I mean EVER count on women for empathy towards your struggle. They live in a bubble.

            [–]Forcetobereckonedwit 2 points3 points  (5 children)

            Hmmm, thinking about this in my own life with women, I guess I've been lucky. I share my shit with my women but in a way that says "Fuck, life can suck, but I got this." I don't look to them for solace, I rant and then thank them for listening. "XYZ is going on. I fucking hate it. It's messing with my head, blah, blah. I need some lovin'. Let's go out to dinner, get drunk, and fuck." That kind of angle. So far so good...but now y'all got me worried..lol.

            [–]Caucasian-African 6 points7 points  (3 children)

            I think the main thing is that women don't want to be burdened by your shit, at all. As long as you own it 100%, and don't lean on her, you are still being strong so she maintains respect...

            [–]Forcetobereckonedwit 2 points3 points  (1 child)

            With my new RP frame of reference, that makes a lot of sense. With evolutionary coding in mind...she needs to be able to rely on the male to handle all the outside shit while she handles the children. Sharing "your shit" with her but not asking her to shoulder any of it shows that ability. It shows her you can take care of business and be emotionally available, but not needy. TRP is truly teaching me some good stuff.

            [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

            you should never tell her in a way that is complaining.

            If she has to find out it's, "I can't make it tonight, I am coughing up blood. Gotta head to the hospital. Let's rain check for tomorrow."

            A road bump in your life and if she wants to freak on the coughing up blood, fine. But it should never be done in anything more than a dry tone.

            "OMG I am fucking coughing up blood! I'm gonna die! What do I do?"

            Well, the thought that enters her mind is: what if she is the one who is coughing up blood one day. She sure as fuck wants you to be the one who knows what to do. So if you can't fucking help yourself, then you cannot fucking help her.

            Don't lean on her for this shit. If she must have access to the information, give it to her dry.

            "Fell off my motorcycle and broke my leg. Going in for a cast. Ready to roll again in two weeks they say. Can't wait to see you then!"

            Pffft. No my pain, no poor me, no I am a victim, none of that shit.

            Facts.

            Facts that do not change the ultimate outcome.

            Because you have this shit in stride. No different to waking up to a flat tire. "Going to be late, flat tire. I'll fix it and just will add an hour to the trip. BRB, getting the tools out."

            Then if you need to call your buddy, call him and get his help.

            [–]Endorsed ContributorTheeRyanGrey 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            Nah that's how I am, too. My girl knows my struggles, even when I don't say anything, because she knows me.

            As long as you come from a position of a man, a position of dominance, and not begging for help or guidance, women can be trusted.

            [–]Nhtmd2 0 points1 point  (1 child)

            And how shold we know this?

            [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

            They're just collecting ammo for future use, that's all it is. They don't really care or have any true empathy for you. It's yet another reason to keep any vulnerability or struggles to yourself.

            Exactly. Everything you say can and will be used to in a court of FUCK YOU YOU ASSHOLE when you do something they don't like.

            And there is no boundary, there is no holy ground. Places a man would never insult another man over, they will go for.

            Watch women street fight. Grab the hair and pull and twist and that is what she's going to do to you mentally and emotionally. Shit that we just don't think about, dirty shit. Going for the eyes. Ripping your ear off. All this will be done by her.

            Because her feelings tell her it is justified.

            So, don't give them the ammo. Let them call you an asshole because you never opened up. Then you can smile and think, "Score."

            [–]TRP VanguardCyralea 31 points32 points  (14 children)

            I always laugh when I hear men, even some RP men, advocate for showing vulnerability in a relationship. It never works out for you. Not in the long run.

            Displaying weakness is always a hit to your SMV. Sometimes you've got the SMV to keep attraction alive, oftentimes you don't. You never benefit long-term from doing so.

            Save your struggles for your close circle of confidants and your immediate family.

            [–]aanarchist 6 points7 points  (10 children)

            it advocates getting her nature out in the open asap so you can next her instead of keeping a viper around waiting for a chance to strike.

            any woman i become interested in for more than a fling i'm going to test her throughout the relationship with vulnerability game. if she shows sociopathic feminist bullshit, she's gonna get dumped. if she passes i'm gonna double down. it's kept me safe from some snakelike women i'd have otherwise housed and fed.

            there's no sense in forever gaming some cunt, use her and throw her away when she fucks up.

            [–]sharp7 1 point2 points  (8 children)

            Interesting. I do the same but it always crashes in my face. Probably cause I have more baggage than most. I started to just only confide in close male friends. But I can only keep that up for a few months until I get tired of the girl and realize she is literally just a walking vagina to me.

            I have not found one instance of a girl sticking around after confiding. But it sounds like you have? Is there really any hope in this or am I better off just going back to my old strategy or even just avoiding LTRs completely.

            [–]aanarchist 6 points7 points  (6 children)

            i'm still searching too. whether you avoid ltrs or not is up to you. i'm always open to the idea of it, as long as she proves herself competent and loyal. in my experience they try to get their claws in so that you're too invested to leave them, whether they stay or not depends on if they think they've found someone more valuable, but they love having that security from someone before they make the decision to jump ship. perpetual dread game is what they prescribe here, but it's a waste of life to spend it gaming some bitch to keep her interested. they make fun of being yourself as a blue pill thing on here, but it's like why would i waste my time and share my life with someone who i have to put myself into a box to keep appeased. that's the most beta simp shit i've ever heard of, that's being a slave under the false belief of being free. you can try to frame it any way you like, tell yourself whatever story makes you feel alpha, that you're better than other people, you're still a pussy sniffing faggot whose life revolves around women validating you.

            it's like you said, the girl gets boring fast when you follow red pill games to a t, it becomes both of you being fake and walking on a tightrope, and a woman's body can only keep you interested for so long.

            hope is the one thing that keeps people going in times of strife, the belief that over the horizon is something better. i look at guys that have gone the nihilistic route of "accepting" women for what they are, they don't seem happy, they seem like empty husks following the feminine imperative more than anything, they just happen to be a few steps ahead of blue pill betas and get laid more for it. you can accept the world you live in, all that does is perpetuate the decline. this whole nonsense has happened before, and it'll happen again and again with every civilization until one breaks the cycle. that starts by holding women accountable to human standards of conduct, not by accepting awalt and playing the game.

            [–]sharp7 4 points5 points  (5 children)

            Thanks. This is literally my exact philosophy. To me I rather fap than have sex as physically its not very different and sex is super time consuming and getting sweaty is a pain. The psychological part of getting a girl to want to sex you I get through very intense flirting. Especially with girls that are taken as its funner then with less risk of pissing them off when I don't actually fuck them. I've been doing that for a few years now after my last LTR. Flirting a ton, but no actual sex. Its been drilling red pill into me so hard. The ideal man really is basically just a cocky jocky caveman to a girls vagina. The best girls I've found are gold diggers. Yes they only want the money but they will behave perfectly for it. Its too bad divorce rape will fuck you though. Honestly if they just removed divorce rape laws I think things would change drastically for the better. Now if a husband divorces you you're fucked and don't get his money you HAVE to behave.

            [–]1mojo_juju 1 point2 points  (1 child)

            Gaming women is not that difficult. It doesn't involve intense flirting.

            In fact, it's no different from going to a bar, hanging out, and talking to a stranger for about an hour. The only difference is a couple of quick kino (physical contacts) interactions to escalate.

            Now, precede this with buying a bottle of red wine on the way to the bar. When you're ready to leave simply say, "So... I have a bottle of red wine in my car. Let's head to your place and have a couple glasses."

            In fact, just have fun with it. Consider it machiavelli-personality practice. Game people. Do it subtly and try to get things out of it if possible, such as get a free beer from the dude at the bar, or get laid by the milf at the bar, etc.

            [–]Senior Endorsed ContributorVasiliyZaitzev 25 points26 points  (1 child)

            I will say again: Don't show weakness. The Skipper always knows.

            [–]PaperTownz 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            The skipper knows what to do whether he does or not. He does what he knows, and it does it well.

            [–]nice_and_friendly 99 points100 points  (13 children)

            yep. there are no limits to this. i lost a great plate last year because one time when she texted me to flirt dirty, i told her i was at the airport flying to detroit because one of my friends had just died. i told her i was a mess and id find her another time. she totally fell off of the radar after that, never heard a word from her again. i am 100% sure that if i had just ignored her in that moment instead of revealing my compromised emotional state, id still have that pussy to this day. they dont want to hear it, guys. ever, period. hearing about your feelings, emotions, and struggles makes them feel physically ill and disgusted by you.

            [–]chadeusmaximus 77 points78 points  (9 children)

            Over the past 20 years, I had two friends that died. Both times, I informed HR that I needed a few days off, and explained the reasons- a friend had died/was dying, and both times, when it came time to renew my contract, contract was not renewed.

            Never thought about it before. But in both jobs, my direct supervisors were women... wonder if there's a trend here.

            [–]XtremePeace 18 points19 points  (5 children)

            Holy fuck. There you go, exactly my intuition about women in management. They are there to exercise their fucked up nature.

            [–]Robert_Walker 11 points12 points  (4 children)

            They may not be there specifically to exercise their fucked up nature, but they will while they're there.

            Protecting women who need protecting with their emotions and difficulties that they know only women go through compared to us men who "have it so easy".

            Rejecting men who are weak and not good for the business.

            After all, the idea that both men and women have emotions and trials and difficulties is an idea that doesn't enter many women's heads.

            They think that men have it easy, women have it hard. Gotta keep the narrative alive, otherwise all their passes and free shit goes out the window. Men showing emotional difficulty threatens that free shit - especially in a corporate environment, "get that fucking weirdo out of here" the hamster says.

            [–]XtremePeace 0 points1 point  (3 children)

            Yes, good points.

            I can't put a finger if it's that, or they just feel threatened by male emotional trials because their reality is attached to how good we operate, or in spite because they have some primal revenge instinct from the original sin, because Adam didn't stop Eve.

            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

            No, it's a primal emotion. There's no need for thought to get involved.

            Disgust.

            The same feeling you get when you see a piece of shit, or someone around you vomits, or a sick person is around you, or you smell rotting food. It's your body's natural reaction to keep you away from harm, because if you get too close and comfortable with this stuff you might get sick and die.

            A woman gets that same feeling of disgust around a weak man, because if she gets too close and comfortable, and mates with him, her genes will get sick and die.

            Simply, women who didn't find weak men disgusting are not around to complain about it, because they went extinct.

            [–]GC0W30 20 points21 points  (1 child)

            Why wouldn't those women have the same evo psych response that women you are screwing do?

            Weak is weak. Once you're weak, you're not good as a beta provider or a sex machine.

            "Og weak. Og no longer protect warrior tribe I run. Og leave village at next performance review, he not worth potatoes any more!"

            [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            and certainly no snoo snoo. Og OK to orbit and donate his resources. But no breeding.

            [–]hores 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            That is insane. That goes way beyond blurring the lines of social interaction and work politics.

            [–]cryoshon 4 points5 points  (1 child)

            sounds like you are confusing "casual fuck" with "relationship"; she was not confused, however.

            [–]nice_and_friendly 9 points10 points  (0 children)

            who said anything about a relationship? both of us saw other people, neither of us cared. great plate. we were friends with benefits for about 18 months leading up to this. she was just one of my dirty little whores, and when she saw me break she disappeared immediately. sounds like you are the one who is confused

            [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 16 points17 points  (0 children)

            Being vulnerable to the RedPill means taking chances and facing rejection and turmoil, not hiding from it.

            Exactly. The vulnerability is "I am so awesome I can afford to take chances and even losing is funny because I have so many surplus time/resources/money/girls".

            I respect Manson, but his "be vulnerable" chapter is too easy to misunderstand.

            Do not ever be vulnerable in the BP sense. Women are hard-wired to disrespect and exploit male weakness, not to support it.

            [–]abdada 45 points46 points  (5 children)

            I wouldn't open up to anyone about any struggles I had. Women, men, family, whatever.

            The only 3 people I ever discussed my struggles with were my mentors: my dad, my doctor and a guy who showed me the business ropes in my teen years.

            [–]TryDoingSomethingNew 22 points23 points  (3 children)

            I open up to men, and I'm pretty friendly/down-to-earth/chill, so they open up to me.

            But not all men. Just those you get a good feeling about, and actually appear to give a damn. Not many men can be bothered these days to lend support.

            Maybe a small circle you can trust. But yeah, I recommend filtering what you want to talk about. Over time once you escape the blue pill you'll see what you used to be open about needs to be bottled up: less beta, more real problems.

            [–]mugatucrazypills 7 points8 points  (0 children)

            You can't really open up to a lot of men either. If they're at all blue pill they'll use any knowledge of weakness or doubt on their part against you at some point. Strong and Successful men don't feel any need to pull other men down, at worst they'll avoid you (because you are a downer), but your typical man in our society, vaguely detached and suffering from a general sense of disappointment with life and the waste of their potential will store your pain up like a battery and crab bucket or try to white knight you on a moment's notice.

            [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            I don't tell much to my dad. The only person I can open up to is my best friend.

            [–]TryDoingSomethingNew 9 points10 points  (0 children)

            Hard lesson learned. It goes against what you should be able to rely on a woman for, or could in decades past, but you're right:

            Even with seemingly "good women", I will no longer take the risk. Once it happens, you're fucked, or at least left wondering what's going to happen down the road.

            And yet I'll listen to other people's problems and withhold judgement pretty well, and always try (within reason) to give good advice and positive encouragement.

            It's a really, really fucked up dynamic with today's women.

            [–][deleted]  (2 children)

            [removed]

            [–]mackstarmagic[S] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

            I agree with this. It actually seems to be a good test to see if their love is unconditional or not.

            [–]Bentov 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            Lol, really? No human will ever love another unconditionally...for any real length of time. Maybe in that moment when you open up to her, but 30 seconds later she will be texting her bestie saying how you can't handle your shit.

            [–]chrisindub 8 points9 points  (2 children)

            I agree 💯.

            Don't ever let a woman see you vulnerable in any way.

            Women will pretend like they are OK with vulnerability, but that's only because women don't even know what they want.

            The second they see genuine vulnerability in you, they lose respect and will use that weakness to control you. Their attraction to you died that very moment.

            I am a general surgeon, so I make decent money, do you know what en ex told me when she broke up with me in residency?

            She saw that I owed a couple grand on a student loan and didn't like that I had outstanding debt.

            I was literally two years away from making a few grand a day and she saw a small debt and it totally killed it for her. Don't ever tell a woman everything.

            You can tell them 80% of what's going on, but never be completely honest.

            [–]Cristoff13 2 points3 points  (1 child)

            Yeah you see on other forums woman who whine for a "true emotional bond" with their boyfriends/husbands. Yet if they got what they wanted, they would lose all respect for him. Woman don't really know what they want.

            [–]chrisindub 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            That's the nature of females, to misunderstand their own motives.

            That's why women find love so mysterious and fascinating.

            Despite playing a fairly complex game where the rules are consistent across continents, they lie to themselves about the game's existence and the rules they play by.

            That's why you start by disregarding most of what they say about what they want. I'm not saying to be a dick. But watch their actions to gauge what they want. And never be completely honest with them. Ever.

            [–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (6 children)

            And never show a woman weakness. Beat the weakness out of your soul, become the best man you can be.

            [–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (5 children)

            Good luck with that dancing monkey performance in a LTR.

            [–]cheeky_throwaway101 17 points18 points  (0 children)

            Aaaaaaannd that's why you plate.

            [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (3 children)

            What are you talking about?

            [–]verify_account 8 points9 points  (1 child)

            He's saying you're going to have a tough time doing that all the time (as in an LTR). I prefer LTRs too, but he's right, it's hard to never show any weakness all the time. Much simpler with plates.

            [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

            I'm not interested in an LTR. Ever. Sluts4life over here.

            [–]RickThacker 7 points8 points  (0 children)

            100% accurate. I had a similar thing happen in January, and this just goes to prove it's the rule. My thoughts? Women can exist in their natural state of femininity only when they can rely on your wisdom. If you doubt your own wisdom, don't share it with your woman because it'll bring her out of the feminine and drive her towards someone else who, by acting on their wisdom, can allow her to feel her natural femininity.

            When you act from a place of wisdom you can live at your edge. If you don't feel the wisdom inside, trust your friends to push you out towards your edge, and let the woman respect you for living there. But the woman.. she's not trying to be your friend and help you find your edge.. she wants to be your woman and trust that you have the wisdom to know how to get there.

            [–][deleted]  (14 children)

            [deleted]

            [–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

            It also helps up the mystery and keeps her guessing. Once she gets too comfortable, that's not good.

            [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (2 children)

            Seriously. War wounds are chick crack. Get those free massages under your belt, warrior.

            [–]The Private ManZamarski 15 points16 points  (1 child)

            I don't tell women I meet about why I wear my eye patch. If they have the audacity to ask, I make up some wild story that is clearly not the truth. I'll let her come up with her own story to believe and I just move on with the conversation.

            I lost two girls when I opened up about my cancer. Never, ever again.

            [–]chadeusmaximus 7 points8 points  (2 children)

            Not just LTRs either. Whenever I talk to my mom about my problems, she alsays chooses that moment to start nagging over some stupid shit. Which of course makes things worse.

            [–]pfffft_comeon 1 point2 points  (1 child)

            what happens if your father dies? you're the man now, the doyen. unless you have an older brother or someone else to take that mantle. she has no idea how to express that to you i guess which is why you get the default nag response.

            somebody's got to be the rock. your mom/gf/ltr is incapable. they have 0 practice and have never had a reason to practice.

            [–]RobertCarraway 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            they have 0 practice

            In today's society they have plenty of practice. They still suck at it and hate it.

            [–]IGoYouStayTwoAutumns 5 points6 points  (0 children)

            THE EASIEST WAY TO TOSS A PLATE: just show a few seconds of vulnerability...

            Had a plate a few months ago, beautiful woman, sex was great and she really had her shit together too (career-wise, unlike a lot of the trashier women out here in LA) but, for whatever reason, I just wasn't feeling it with her (which of course only turned her on even more I'm sure), so I never upgraded her from plate status during the brief time we were together.

            Few weeks in the girl starts getting on my case a bit--why don't we ever go out, do anything together etc (also, little arguments popping up here and there, and drama is something I NEVER tolerate in a plate, not for a second)--and I realize: I'm probably gonna have to cut her off soon. But then I think, well maybe I should just get her to walk away, and then all the work is done for me, no? And the easiest way to do that? Why, SHOW SOME VULNERABILITY OF COURSE (something she'd been on me about for a little while anyway, claiming she was into New Age-y sensitive men etc).

            So I take her up on the challenge (knowing full well this is gonna be the death knell, which I'm totally fine with), and I say "Yeah, well, things have been kind of tough lately... I came out here to be a screenwriter, I spent years writing this big sci fi project, finally put it out there, I was so proud of it, so sure it would take the town by storm and now, turns out, it might not even get sold or optioned, let alone made... Hollywood has changed, no one is buying original material anymore and honestly, given the state of the market, I really don't know what I'm gonna do next..." etc etc. (All of which was true, but typically would be information I'd never share with a woman.) She takes all this in, says "Thank you for being vulnerable with me--I appreciate it." AND THEN VANISHES INTO THE NIGHT, AND I NEVER HEAR FROM HER EVER AGAIN.

            Now granted this worked in my favor (as she was a plate I was gonna drop anyway) but I am SOOO very glad that I had the opportunity to try this little experiment and see the results firsthand. When women say they want vulnerability it's a shit test gentlemen--NEVER, EVER SHOW WEAKNESS. Maybe years ago when women had fewer options you could get away with it every now and then but these days, when a new fuck buddy for them is just a single tap on the iPhone away, forget it, you'll be left behind, forgotten in a heartbeat.

            [–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (3 children)

            If she's fucking a hippy bartender two weeks later, your relationship can't have been in a good place initially

            [–]cakemuncher 12 points13 points  (0 children)

            You'll be surprised how fast they branch hop.

            [–]rot_barth 20 points21 points  (1 child)

            Those of us who have been around awhile will be surprised it took her that long.

            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            There are LTR red flags in his post though, shouldn't be surprised

            [–]PenInACup 10 points11 points  (2 children)

            Law 4: always say less than necessary. It wasn't necessary to lean on her and give her this information.

            Law 11: learn to keep people dependant on you. Not the other way around. She must be dependent on you, when you show her your dependence on her she dries up instantly.

            Law 28: enter action with boldness.

            Somethings I thought of when reading your post. Thank you

            [–]chances_are_ur_a_fag 0 points1 point  (1 child)

            by far not all women want do be dependent on you. not sure who you've been dating.

            [–]chances_are_ur_a_fag 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            she was most likely fucking the hippie bartender before you even opened up to her. correlation doesn't imply causation. unless you know specifically this has happened after your heart to heart. even then, doesn't exactly mean that.

            [–]XtremePeace 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            There are a few high quality women out there who will see your potential and want to rise you up. Seriously. But for the most part you are right.

            [–]cryoshon 12 points13 points  (12 children)

            i have a number of objections:

            Don't go to women for support, turn to your male friends instead.

            you also look weak to males when you open up to them; every child on the playground knows that weakness invites aggression. thus begins the behind-the-back shit talking by your compatriots. the difference is that they can't break your heart, only sting it with rejection. shitty people are going to be shitty. don't try to pin the sins of a shitty person on the coincidental fact that the shitty person was a woman you cared for. do try to remember that there have likely been times when you yourself have rejected your male friends when they showed weakness.

            the fact is, nobody "respects your struggle" when you frame it in such a victimlike way. everyone struggles; struggles are cheap, but heavy enough that nobody wants to take on the struggles of another. begging for respect of your struggle is begging for pity. remember: pity is close to hatred, so don't look for respect but rather cut an example that sensible people will render respect to.

            You will hear people say "Be Vulnerable" this does not mean open up and show a women your soft side.

            this is exactly what that means. the logic: you are so strong that even baring your most vulnerable parts will not endanger you. sure, some women love the stoical types-- i, as one of those stoical types, know this-- but emotionally intelligent women will understand reticence as fear of being emotionally harmed by someone else, and they will infer that such a harming has occurred in the past, raising questions about your worthiness.

            now onto a few more radical bits: men are not islands emotionally or in any other capacity. the lie that a man is an independent ubermenschen is a dangerous one that most men (TRP is a hilariously overwrought example here) unconsciously endorse to some degree. the result of internalizing this perverse dictum is poor mental health, and lo, men are far more likely to kill themselves than women. you bottle the emotions up, then you carry the weight. your male friends are going to help you carry the weight, if they're good people, and good friends-- but they'll never be able to really intuit what's going on in your head any better than you can. besides, it'd be weird if they did. that's where women come in: it's natural to confide in women because they're emotionally adept.

            the solution isn't to emotionally withdraw from women because you're scared of them hurting you, because that ends up hurting you more in the long run. believe it or not, women can tell when you're holding back emotionally, and it usually makes them feel alienated-- men are very poor at concealing emotions from women, especially the women they are in relationships with. go ahead, say it ain't so, but women have been analyzing the minutiae of men's emotions for millenia, and they're several laps ahead of the man in the relationship most of the time. to recapitulate this point in another way: women are going to know your emotions better than you do much of the time. trying to hide emotions from your woman only works if your woman is mostly checked out of the relationship, at which point you have nothing to hide from anyway.

            in conclusion: confide in your woman, because she sees it on your face anyway and hiding makes you look weak. don't pansy around with the "too cool to be emotional" driftwood, it's unbecoming for anyone out of high school.

            [–]Umbrifer 3 points4 points  (6 children)

            I agree with with the essence of your statement. But not that confiding in your woman is the answer. By all means tell her why you are upset. But look not to her for support or help. Control your emotions and let them add passion to your drive.

            [–]cryoshon 2 points3 points  (5 children)

            But look not to her for support or help.

            the reality is that humans perpetually need help from other humans. looking into your own navel for help is quite useless; like i said, this is exactly (and i do mean the very essence) of why men have poor mental health and kill themselves.

            a man isn't a stone, and yet there are so many men taking pride in how stonelike they are-- stones cannot even resist the peaceful bubbling of a brook without being worn down into silt.

            [–]Umbrifer 2 points3 points  (4 children)

            I agree, and that's what friends are for. Not women you want to maintain sexual relationships with.

            [–]cryoshon 0 points1 point  (3 children)

            ... you have missed the point. a man can't provide support as effectively because their emotional skill will rarely approach a woman's.

            [–]Umbrifer 7 points8 points  (2 children)

            When I said friends I was including both male and female friends. Yes I think a man can have female friends who add value and emotional support to his life. Also, while men are emotional creatures, we prefer to solve our problems with logic. Yes talking through your feelings has value in terms of introspection and and capacity to trace emotional triggers to their sources. But men are primarily solution based creatures, and that kind of discussion is usually more organic between men.

            Neither am I saying that a man should wall off his emotions. However, if a man says to his mate "I'm so sad and down and I just need a hug and for you to tell me everything going to be ok" he's looking for a mother figure, and will appear as a child. And rightly so. For a man who cannot reach into himself and create his own strength, through will and knowledge, is still a boy. A man saying to his partner " This is why I have been angry or upset lately, thank you for being with me while I fix these issues" is less likely to appear so.

            I am well aware of the consequences of persistent melancholy. And I agree that isolation in hopes of fixing emotional problems is a losing strategy, having employed it myself and suffered accordingly. I also saw over the course of months, how my negativity was not lessened I when searched for support with my LTR at the time and was met with disdain and infidelity. She did not help me, and her ultimate actions reflect many of the stories written here. Who did help me, were primarily were my male friends. Who despite your disdain, were quite capable of of empathizing with my emotional state and helping me find my confidence and personal power again. A woman's emotional skill rests primarily in recognizing the occurrence of emotions, Understanding them, and empathizing with them, is another matter altogether and not something that many women have been able to do with regards to men, in my experience.

            Edit: Grammar

            [–][deleted]  (1 child)

            [deleted]

              [–]RobertCarraway 1 point2 points  (1 child)

              confide in your woman, because she sees it on your face anyway and hiding makes you look weak.

              She does see it in your face, but hiding it makes you look strong not weak. A woman only respects your weakness when she sees you struggle and knows that you will never speak to her about it. That is the only time. It's manly to suffer and keep it to yourself.

              [–]cryoshon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

              She does see it in your face, but hiding it makes you look strong not weak. A woman only respects your weakness when she sees you struggle and knows that you will never speak to her about it. That is the only time. It's manly to suffer and keep it to yourself.

              does a child (poorly) hiding that it has peed its pants make it look strong, and not weak? hiding is the action of the weak... try to see things from the perspective of other people.

              It's manly to suffer and keep it to yourself.

              ah, taking pride in suffering, the protestant flaw that keeps on giving. you have won this discussion: there is no amount of spite or argumentation that i can render unto you that will hurt you more than you have chosen to hurt yourself.

              [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              Even moreeeeee faggot shit. Anybody who listens to this dudes advice is going to get shat on.

              [–]PissedPajamas 7 points8 points  (3 children)

              My mom's the only woman who's shown sympathy to my problems, she's a special breed of snowflake in that regard thanks to her extremely conservative upbringing in Cuba. My father never cared much for my problems and my sister is the common AWALT, to the point that she'll ruin my chances with another girl just because she's seen me at my worst and lacks respect.

              Any other woman? I'm a perfect man whose never broken a sweat.

              [–]GC0W30 7 points8 points  (2 children)

              I told my therapist what you basically just said one time.

              He told me I was LUCKY to have one person I could trust, and that it was my mom. Some guys not only don't have their mom... but NEVER had a mom they could trust.

              Made my ass think.

              Can you imagine not even having had that? Fuck.

              [–]PissedPajamas 6 points7 points  (0 children)

              I'm thankful everyday for that angel. Never hit me when I'm down and only built me up, even paid $3000 out of her pocket for a genetist when I was fucked in the head. I'm lucky to have a mom like that, but I can't say the same for most guys

              She got that from my grandma, another unicorn. When my dad first came to this country he worked his ass off to build an empire and she gave him $5000 so he can buy his first work truck. He tried to pay her back but she refused to accept it. I guess it's different people from different times, but you don't see that nowadays

              [–]Pastelitomaracucho[🍰] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

              Face struggle, face vulnerability if you will, but be damn sure to show her you have the situation under control, even if controlling the situation entitles getting rid of her.

              [–]GainzdalfTheWhey 3 points4 points  (2 children)

              I don't know, I broke up with my gf, she didn't use any ammo, and said she loves me and will get back together whenever I want.

              [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

              this is why red pill can be fucking annoying at times. There is so so so much confirmation bias going on. Most of the stories in this topic are disgusting and absurd, and while I believe them, I think it says more about the quality of the women being discussed rather than being a pattern that can be applied to all women. I've had women friends that were always there for me, even though a lot of them shouldn't have been. I've fallen out with women and they didn't play upon my insecurities, even though I was slinging mud and playing upon theirs. Humans are way more complex than some posters frame them as. It gets tiresome and I can't tell if it's just the anger phase or if a lot of posters are just that bad at screening potential plates, mates, or what have you

              [–]hbPUA 4 points5 points  (2 children)

              Thanks for the reminder. The girl I'm seeing is rather sweet and I've shared some dreams which probably will come back to bite me. As it takes time to realize them. With the obvious remarks of any small error that might happen.

              Now and them I've been thinking of dating some girls from them gym that show interest but reading the comments I would be fucking stupid to shit where I eat.

              It's summertime and plenty of girls to chat up in the city. Just got a number from a russian student talking with her for five minutes.

              Lesson learned:

              • Rule 1: Be attractive.
              • Rule 2: Don't be unattractive.

              • Lay the five bricks.

              • Don't shit where you eat.

              [–]mackstarmagic[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

              Could you elaborate on what Lay the five bricks is from?

              [–]hbPUA 2 points3 points  (0 children)

              It's from The Beige Phillip Show (http://beigephillip.com/) and the principle of talking with five girls every day. To overcome fear, increase confidence and have abundance of girls that you can meet.

              Great podcast with Dante Nero explaining game as a former pimp and striper.

              [–]StraightGlueWater 4 points5 points  (0 children)

              Women don't see potential in their mates. They see what you are in the moment, not what you are striving to become.

              They don't want to help you build your empire- they want someone who already has theirs.

              [–]Roshambo_USMC 4 points5 points  (2 children)

              This is definitely awalt. I was married to the most patriotic country girl. The moment I sought counseling and depression meds to curb my PTSD/depression and memories from overseas when I finally opened up, it was a game changer that ultimately snowballed the relationship to oblivion. There are no exceptions to this rule.

              After she left and I took the pill and lifted myself up, by myself and close male family members, my life finally improved again. The night she abruptly left, my heavy drinking screeched to a halt, I threw out my several medications and haven't been this happy in a very long time. Not mentioning my past to plates keeps me at a high score that will only plummet if I ever bring it up again.

              Again, there are no exceptions to this rule. It is relationship seppuku to even hint at any vulnerability to a female, regardless of circumstances. And yes, the most hateful shit I ever heard in my life came out of her mouth when things were tanking. It truly is ammo you're handing her that she will pocket to only harm you with. She will use it beforehand while things are okay to curry favor/sympathy with other people in your circle, and act like she is bending over backwards dealing with you/trying to help you through it; the moment she's gotten that favor/sympathy she knows it has run its course and it only has one final purpose.

              [–]NietzscheExplosion 2 points3 points  (0 children)

              Good example of why it's good to not try to keep a bullshit façade up for your whole life. Which improved as soon as she left.

              [–]mustard5 2 points3 points  (2 children)

              Opening up about my struggles at University to my first wife was the death knell of our marriage. She used to nag me all the time about 'no man is an island' and 'I wish you would share your problems with me'. I didn't like to share my problems. I figured I would get them sorted out. So one day I decide I'm going to go with this idea of vulnerability. I share my struggles with certain parts of the course at University. Straight away she turns around to me and says, 'I should have known I couldn't rely on you'.

              Fuck me. I learned my lesson that day.

              [–]1Snivellious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

              My usual feeling is that struggles can only be shown if they're spun as positives. You might have been able to get lots of warm, happy emotions from telling her about how you're "thinking about a startup on the side" and going from there. Similarly, grief plays fine as long as it makes you deep instead of weak. There's nothing wrong with admitting that you want change, but it can't come with the implicit admission that things are bad now. Only with the suggestion that you have even bigger dreams and appetites for the future.

              As an aside: No More Mr. Nice Guy suggests that men in LTRs open up their partners about what they're doing to become more assertive, including specifically discussing the book and the exercises they're doing from it.

              I've never believed that this is good advice for the average man - there are testimonials from men who had it work, but I'd lay money that there are also men who lost relationships that would have worked if they'd changed without discussion. It's just too close to admitting that your assertiveness will be fake.

              [–]sobieski84 2 points3 points  (0 children)

              I lost my lower right leg in a mcycle accident and wear a prosthetic blade. Its only made me a stronger person and i have never bitched about it.

              Women now literally theow themselves at me. And its not because of pity. But because i overcame a major obstacle easily

              [–]TRPtruth 2 points3 points  (0 children)

              Even better than the bros, hire a therapist. They are paid to listen and a good one will help you get to the core of your struggle or problems. Shrinks aren't just for looney tunes and bitches, they can help you sort life out without emotion and without the bullshit.

              [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

              A woman may only fall in love with the image of what she believes you to be. Never with the actual man. There will never be an option for what the mgtow terms male mother need. It's all about what you represent to her and not who you are. Who you are is reserved for you and your few close male friends. No woman would ever care for who you are.

              [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              This is so true. Best coping method is to have something on the side.

              [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

              I have to disagree 100%. It's a sick puppy mentality for women. I'd make up some fake trauma that happened to me when I was young (abusive father or something), talk about how I never got over it. And then I'll seem fixed afterwards. Emotional bonding and all that.

              I'd probably not use an ex girlfriend or emotional emptiness. Preferably something rooted in fact but exaggerated. Also preferably while still in the honeymoon period, not on the first date as well.

              [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

              If this strategy ever actually works its only due to a massive imbalance in SMV that probably serves to drive you closer to her level. It's negging yourself so you don't seem unattainable, which is a valid strategy in itself.

              [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

              I wonder how emotional emptiness work. This is some "I'll tell you about it one day..." Pua routine type shit lol.

              [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

              What I meant was the type of "I was never loved" type of shit. Bad way to explain it I guess

              [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              Nah, that comes off as beta.

              [–]1iluminatiNYC 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              Needed this reminder. I made the mistake of being open about my life issues to women I wasn't fucking, thinking that they wouldn't ruin my situation with the women I was fucking. Nope. They flipped up and pulled a Linda Tripp on me, changed the story around, then ran and told the women I was with about what I said about them. Typical women.

              [–]ElGuapoMiguel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              I wonder if this would be a good way to drop a plate, gf, or ltr gone bad?

              [–]InspireAndAdmire 1 point2 points  (2 children)

              That's where I started fucking up. I've been opening up my flaws and weakness to women. I've been single for the first time in my life now for a year (I'm not counting the relationships I got in that lasted a month or two) after breaking up with my ex of 3 years.

              I'm going wrong with females. I'm not as confident as I once were. Dam. Females are the Devils lol.

              [–]mackstarmagic[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

              Chin Up bro. Don't base your confidence on getting women/sex, I've been there slightly there now. Do you, work towards something you want to accomplish.

              [–]InspireAndAdmire 0 points1 point  (0 children)

              Thanks man. I'm trying. What was stated in OP is very true.

              [–][deleted]  (1 child)

              [deleted]

              [–]1mojo_juju 0 points1 point  (0 children)

              Great point.

              Women are solipsistic by nature, which is similar to being very subjective. Hence, they wont have a logical, objective response.

              [–]Asmodeus04 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              This might possibly be the most pathetic I've ever read.

              It's a perverse, self-fulfilling prophecy. The fact that you can't see outside of the bubble you've built around yourself is... Inane.

              [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

              This also applies for men. Never share your struggle with men. They will use your vulnerabilities against you in an attempt to hurt you.

              [–]pfffft_comeon 0 points1 point  (1 child)

              anger is the only socially acceptable emotion from men when dealing with struggles. maybe because anger sparks action towards resolution. men do things - there's no room for a man who doesn't do things. idk, but i know showing anger judiciously and within reason is fine.

              [–]Boovs4life 0 points1 point  (1 child)

              How is being an engineer holding back your SMV? Is engineering considered a BP career? Actually wondering not trying to sound rude.

              [–]mackstarmagic[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

              Engineering provides me wealth and maybe the value of appearing more intelligent (most people won't even know what you actually do). My past jobs I was out talking with people most of the day. This helped me meet women and stay social. I don't have that opportunity anymore and it has effected my state and happiness. That is just my personal experience though doesn't mean that will happen with everyone.

              [–]Luckyluke23 0 points1 point  (0 children)

              You will hear people say "Be Vulnerable" this does not mean open up and show a women your soft side. Being vulnerable to the RedPill means taking chances and facing rejection and turmoil

              thanks for this, really hit some lightbulbs there...

              [–]ELLEN_POO 0 points1 point  (0 children)

              What if it's a really ugly chick? Or your mom or aunt or something?

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