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It's Time to Admit the Truth about Dating Apps (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by Wolverbeans

Here's what you can look forward if men, by and large, continue feeding the beast of online dating (attention whoring apps)

1) Delaying of marriage

2) Fewer children born

3) Increased maternal age = greater prevalence of autism and other problems in children

4) Greatly educed ability to pair bond for both some men and majority women after spending a decade or more immersed in the hookup culture

5) Enormous stratification in the sexual marketplace (80/20 rule or even 90/10 - 95/5)

6) Massively overpumped egos on women resulting in sky high expectations and ****ty attitudes

7) Skewed sexual marketplace with illusion of massive abundance of alpha males on dating apps

8) Less incentive for females to compete based on appearance = more female fatties

9) More men looksmaxing to compete for mediocre chicks

10) Greater spread of venereal diseases, including strains of gonorrhea & chlamydia that are antibiotic resistant

11) More women replacing sex for the validation they receive online

We are essentially witnessing the complete destruction of the sexual marketplace that has been the norm for most of the past fifty years. This sexual marketplace was typified by a reliance on social circle and night time venues to facilitate hookups. Women's choices were constrained necessarily to the men within their immediate proximity. More importantly, these men had to approach her. If she wanted to meet a man she had to put in the effort to go out to a public venue with friends, or else rely on her social circle to introduce her to a man. This acted as an enormous brake on female hypergamy, and combined with social pressures and norms that encouraged early marriages (which have since decayed), the effect was that most young women did not have a high number of sexual partners and married by their early twenties.

Dating apps turn everything upside down. Women are given the illusion of having unlimited sexual options. They can engage in unimaginable levels of promiscuous behavior with complete impunity and secrecy - on the contrary only a small, and getting smaller, percentage of men can do this. Women now can easily **** a new guy every week for years at a time with their friends and family being none the wiser. And they can do so with essentially no investment of time or energy. It's an unlimited sexual buffet at women's fingertips. Can we really not expect them to gorge themselves until they've had their fill? Of course not, it's just human nature. And so they gorge. They get pumped and dumped by men with SMV's above their own who they have no hope of securing genuine commitment from. But they never forget that good dicking they got and will hold it against every subsequent man who doesn't measure up. Alpha widowhood is becoming the new normal, and all of its attendants follow: bitchy attitudes, enormous entitlement, selfishness, general unpleasantness, inability to love.

There's really no way around it. Dating apps have been a weapon of mass destruction dropped on the sexual marketplace. And most guys were left incinerated in a smoking crater. Of course, some men who have success online laud dating apps, but they're missing the bigger picture: what's good for the goose isn't good for the gander in this case. They're fortunate enough to be riding high on the blast wave of the explosion, but they're oblivious to the scorched earth behind them, and equally oblivious to the hard landing ahead.

Self improvement can't defeat this beast either. In todays marketplace, If you have already maximized your value as much as you possibly can and you are coming across better than 95% of men, this is still often insufficient, because the combined effects of developments in technology are in more cases than not sufficient to nullify your improvements, even if you have improved massively. Even if you do see positive results from self-improvement, all other things being equal, you would have almost certainly received far greater positive results from that very same amount of self-improvement before chicks had access to 1000 thirsty dudes on their phones.

On a brighter note:

Dating apps might be sowing the seeds of their own destruction. I'm seeing a lot of men getting frustrated with the return on investment from said apps all across the internet. Even extremely good looking men getting jaded of pumping 6's (which is the pinnacle of woman on these sites in 2017) only to get ghosted on later. Banning these apps isn't happening, but the conversation is worth starting simply to implant the idea in peoples' heads that these dating apps highly distort the sexual marketplace and result in great damage to individual men and women as well as society as a whole. What we can do about this gaping wound :

1) Delete these apps

2) Start talking to girls in real life

3) Have a low tolerance to the amount of shit you will take from any girl

4) Be quick to next chicks

5) Actively black knight fatties, by not so subtly shaming them publicly

6) Make your mission, not women, your goal

7) Don't give women cheap validation with nothing in return (that means stop liking profile pictures or commenting thirsty shit)


[–]Modredpillschool[M] [score hidden] stickied comment (12 children)

Everything that makes the dating market suck is magnified in dating apps. Women don't just have too many choices, they have unlimited choices. This means you're not competing with a couple dudes she's talked to this week, you're competing with a thousand dudes.

And even if you're top 1% and you can slay, the abundance goes to their heads and you'll never pull them back to earth.

[–]GrabHerByThePEPE 284 points285 points  (135 children)

Met a cute fit girl on tinder and banged her for 1-2 hours. Best sex ever. In the middle she asks me a couple of times "how do you not have a girlfriend?" Make plans for the same later next week, but she ghosted me. Blew my mind. She's probably doing this multiple times a week. But that's ok, I knew she was a tinder slut from just matching. Still...

[–]askmrcia 98 points99 points  (51 children)

Had a similar experience. Cute fit girl that was into bouldering. We met at my place, hooked up. Hung out again and actually went bouldering the second date. Then she ghosted me after that.

[–][deleted] 39 points40 points  (0 children)

You didn't climb hard enough....or too hard!

[–]Alphadestrious 52 points53 points  (6 children)

She moved on to bigger and better cocks bruh

[–]zephyrprime 84 points85 points  (1 child)

Nah she moved on to bigger and better rocks, haha

[–]d0lphinsex 1 point2 points  (0 children)

[–]metallicdrama 12 points13 points  (2 children)

Maybe OP was too big. Maybe he didn't stuff it in her ass in date 2. You never know with these bitches.

[–][deleted] 33 points34 points  (36 children)

Hung out again and actually went bouldering the second date.

Honestly this is my plan. I'm too old for Tinder.....if I fork out $150 to OKC, I can message any women I want, such as women into climbing and under 28. It's cheaper than an hour with a pro, so fuck it.

I'm inspired by Blackdragon's 2% response rate on one blast.....which resulted in a 19 y/o smokeshow in his bed. We're not running for office here.

I'll post by the end of summer if it doesn't work.....or once I get two plates solidly in the air, if it does. I figure that by arranging things around outdoor adventures, I'm giving the hamsters enough room to spin....yeah, I'm older, but I'm both safe and fun, and not looking for any commitments.

[–]brettfromtibet 27 points28 points  (17 children)

women don't use OKC anymore. It's a shame as it was better for men by a long shot. Back in 2009 it was loaded with semi-decent, approachable women you could send a thoughtful message to and set up a date with. Now it's just a few fat chicks with blue hair & noserings... and very little activity. Dating Apps killed dating "sites."

[–]IGoYouStayTwoAutumns 29 points30 points  (7 children)

True. I was big into OKC and Match several years ago, past few years though, the entire market has shifted, women aren't really on dating sites anymore, they're on dating apps, and I doubt they'll ever go back.

The funniest thing about all this: I remember when Tinder first came out, everyone was like "This will never work, it's just a picture, how can you go on a date with someone without at least READING a bit about them first??"

I laughed and was like "Nah, women don't care, for them it's all looks anyway, they never read profile text. They're gonna LOVE this."

Of course my observation was met with oh-so-much scorn from all the women in my life (girls who were like "Noooo, we like to READ, we're READERS, we women need a deep, heartfelt CONNECTION with a guy, and that comes through in what and how he writes on his profile, not just his pics...")--and then, sure enough, about 10 seconds later they all hopped on Tinder, matched themselves with the top 2% of men (going by their pics alone), and never looked back.

[–]kasper138 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I use to think it was a quiz site. I didn't even realize the "OK cupid" part LOL

[–]ayylma088 2 points3 points  (0 children)

and those that are still on OKC seem to be getting waay too much attention as well I have the feeling.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (2 children)

The problem is SITEs aren't as good as APPs for us old dudes. Also, I think it's a geographic thing......there are plenty of women in my area using OKC.

[–]gg_s 1 point2 points  (1 child)

They are using both. Tinder for alpha fucks, OKC for beta bucks.

[–]RP_Scotsman 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Perhaps. In LA it seems OKC has been left to the catladies and fatties.

[–]metallicdrama 1 point2 points  (2 children)

fat chicks that don't even need to ever meet to get an ego boost lol. That site BLOWS. POF has never failed me. I still prefer it to tinder.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[removed]

    [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    What's the name of the article you're referring to from black dragon?

    [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    Try "Blackdragon get laid with 2%" and it should come up.

    [–]nightmancommeth 2 points3 points  (13 children)

    I am older too. Plenty of Fish worked for me. It was more generic dating as send a message. OK Cupid had all these ratings and shit that i didnt want to devote the time to answering. Also one was $15 and the other $20

    [–]askmrcia 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    Honestly when I was on OKcupid I spent more time answering the questions then actually looking at women's profiles and messaging them.

    Answering the questions was the best thing about that app

    [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (6 children)

    Wait, couldn't be younger women at PoF. They are shitty about that, unless you lie about your age.

    [–]metallicdrama 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Lie, and then mention your real age. Sluts love it.

    [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Fair. Although this thread makes me want to just go to a climbing gym and chat up girls......that I actually climb with, of course. Then take them outside. Then home.

    [–]thomasfromSA 7 points8 points  (1 child)

    Girls don't want u they want Alex Hannold

    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Can't blame them, balls of steel.

    [–][deleted] 129 points130 points  (37 children)

    Exactly. I have met tinder sluts who will have sex and then apparently ghost you. The funny thing is that women are the ones who talk about how guys will pump and dump, yet women do it a lot.

    [–]Endorsed Contributorsqerl 47 points48 points  (1 child)

    women are the ones who talk about how guys will pump and dump, yet women do it a lot.

    They're projecting; accuse men of doing what they're doing all the time. It's like the lying kid that accuses the other person of lying first... plausible deniability.

    [–][deleted] 22 points23 points  (0 children)

    Exactly. It's the same as when a woman is cheating and they accuse their man of cheating and questioning everything he does, when they aren't together.

    [–]mrpCamper 88 points89 points  (15 children)

    The funny thing is that women are the ones who talk about how guys will pump and dump, yet women do it a lot.

    Welcome to TRP. This is the real truth my friend. Oh and one thing you got wrong. "Yet women do it a lot" should be "Yet women do it more."

    [–][deleted] 73 points74 points  (12 children)

    that's really not taking it far enough. I would be willing to bet that women to it 20-100 times more than guys do it. Women have zero honor and feel no remorse or obligation to guys they no longer want to date.

    [–]KnowBrainer 64 points65 points  (7 children)

    For hundreds/thousands of years we had societies who's major religious book BEGAN with a story about how a woman knowingly did literally the only evil thing possible, royally screwing over her man.

    Atheism might have it's perks, but there are lessons in that book that, if forgotten, can cause uncountable damage.

    [–]shroomsonpizza 8 points9 points  (0 children)

    They also have a support group to back up their shitty behavior. Other girls and white knights. Dudes don't get shit and get shit on for reaching out.

    [–]mrpCamper 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    agree. We'll never know the real number. but it could certainly be that high. Nor is this a new thing.

    [–]Luckyluke23 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    in women mind, once you are done... YOU ARE DONE.

    [–]Bing400 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Then we're foolish to expect anything, as in accordance to trp philosophy

    [–]SocietalEngineering 33 points34 points  (16 children)

    I genuinely don't get this. I have been online dating for a few years, met probably about 100 women, and almost every single one asks me "what are you looking for" as a sort of screening process. If my answer isn't an immediate "I'm looking to meet people and hopefully find a girlfriend" (or some other commitment-oriented BS) it's an instant ghosting. If I even mention sex or any hint of just wanting to get intimate quickly, again it's an instant ghosting, even if we've been talking for a while.

    As much as the guys on here claim that women are into the pump and dump scene, I just haven't seen it. Unless everyone here is just lying to these girls, then pumping and dumping, then claiming that that's what the girls really wanted the whole time.

    It just really seems to me that girls just want a relationship slave - and if they need to trade sex to do that, they will.

    [–]ven5 25 points26 points  (0 children)

    It's their pride in themselves. Deep down, they just want to have fun, but they would feel like shit if they just go along with a guy that just wants sex. At least if you say you're looking for a girlfriend, they can pat themselves on the back for not being too slutty. Now whatever happens, it's your fault since she already did her due diligence.

    [–]DontTreadOnSnek 45 points46 points  (7 children)

    "I'm looking for a genuine connection with someone" usually does the job.

    You're not committing to anything, and a genuine connection in my case involves being balls deep in their vagina.

    [–]SocietalEngineering 9 points10 points  (3 children)

    This is great, I'm going to try this. It looks both honest and effective.

    [–]youngzari 2 points3 points  (2 children)

    straight forwardness is the key with me. My blurp is "Im looking for a good connection, someone I can potentially build with Im also looking for intimacy too" side-note: someone I can potentially build with is bullocks, its just the worm on the hook tbh

    [–]DigitallyDisrupt 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Blurb is a word, blurp is a sound a stone makes when thrown into a lake.

    [–]majaka1234 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    "genuinely connect my shaft top to your cervix mucus hole"

    [–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (1 child)

    The thing is, that you shouldn't say anything about looking for a girlfriend. Talk about meeting new people and see what happens. On tinder, I have gotten bold and flat out ask if they like making out and escalate from there. The thing is depending on where you are doing it, you have to go through a number of people to find the slutty ones.

    I'm sure there are posts on here about how to find online dating chicks for sex.

    [–]majaka1234 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    You have to be bold on tinder because they already have 30 guys saying "hey what's up?", 15 guys saying "drinks tonight?" etc etc. which means whilst your success rate probably isn't very high your "ey bb wan sum fuk" approach is still cutting through at least 95% of the shit that she gets.

    [–]Slut_Slayer9000 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    The pump and dumb scene is exclusively for top 10% men only. And I mean for the actually hot girls who have shit going on for them in their life. And no not the hoes, single moms, and barely 7's with a face full of caked up make up types, lots of guys can pump and dump those types with little to no hassle. I promise you girls move mountains for guys they REALLY want, they don''t start with instant shit tests like what you described. If they do, then you aren't good enough yet to warrant that kind of desired behavior. Believe me, when you experience girls throwing themselves at you, that whole experience changes. That why you need to dick them hard if you have sex with any girl whom you want to fuck again, I never had a girl ghost me after some really good sex. And by really good I mean me basically using them as my personal slut/fuck toy. Women loved to be used sexually like that, they crave it. If you give them that kind of sex, and don't say or do some other stupid shit to term them off, you'll be like a drug to them.

    [–]kasper138 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    You're just not attractive enough(in whatever way).

    My biggest beef is when I give them my number and then they give me theres instead of just texting. Already starting with the power game.

    [–]Bing400 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Maybe they're contrarians in the sense that if you pump and dump them they'll want a relationship, but if you want a relationship they'll want to be pumped and dumped. Maybe the guy shouldn't make his intentions known in the first place

    [–]DontTreadOnSnek 13 points14 points  (0 children)

    The funny thing is that women are the ones who talk about how guys will pump and dump, yet women do it a lot.

    Ignore what they say, focus on their actions

    [–]Kommanderdude 24 points25 points  (14 children)

    Yeah every tinder girl I met has asked me that. How come you don't have a gf? Why hasn't anyone locked you down yet?

    [–]Senior ContributorSkorchZang 35 points36 points  (6 children)

    Sounds like a wonderful compliment, but really that's their insecurity speaking. There's a lot to be insecure about:

    • Am I giving up the pussy too easily? Am I a typical tinder slut to him?

    • Will he probably be gone if I didn't give it up? Also I kinda want to give it up myself.

    • Guy has what seems like unbreakable frame. What's the catch? Where's the normal blue pill bullshit I am used to manipulating men with?

    • Is he actually married with 6 kids? Spinning me a yarn here, and will just abandon me after we fuck? (she may herself be out for a one nighter, but this fear is primal for women and does not go away even if she rationally knows it's a ONS. Hits them in the girl ego.)

    • If I hinted at this thing about him being in relationship (with me), it will stroke his ego, and he will think I'm a good girl just out looking for the right man, totally not a slut.

    Etc. etc.

    I think the bottom line is that it's not what you'd think, i.e. it's not an expression HER interest in locking you up. Mind boggling but true, she may be completely and utterly uninterested in that and would cringe, backpedal hard if you brought it up in a gracious offer to girlfriend her up. She will say something ambiguous but what she's really thinking is "Omg nooo, I'm too young and too pretty for this!!" I find you can bet on that and win it every time.

    A good response is something like "aw, aren't you the little honey-dripper, nicest thing you said all night. Who knew?". You acknowledge her "compliment" jokingly and proceed to correctly give zero fucks about it.

    [–]GrabHerByThePEPE 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    Overthinking it. If she ghosts after saying that, it's not really insecurity at being with a non-BP male after a dozen of em. And just laugh and shake your head, who cares what you say

    [–]talltexan123456 11 points12 points  (0 children)

    She probably thinks you're too good for her slutty ass. Everyone is insecure about something. I bet their whoring fucks with their minds more often than we think.

    [–]JackGetsIt 1 point2 points  (2 children)

    I get this a lot too. What's you take on where this is coming from?

    [–]Kommanderdude 7 points8 points  (1 child)

    I think it comes from a place of( Wow I really want this guys semen in me he's the kinda guy girls want to produce with, i.e Chad) she may not be saying it in her head but it's there subconsciously. She's probably wondering if she can take you off the market. There's just something about a high smv guy over 30 that hasn't been locked down and doesn't have kids that make bitches want to win you.

    [–]Bing400 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    This reminded me of the saying about old men in professions where men die young being dangerous. Those guys are probably either really exclusive or really shit, but if they were shit the girl probably wouldn't have been talking to him anyway.

    [–]GuitarHero07 30 points31 points  (24 children)

    In addition to Tinder etc. don't forget the paid apps like Seeking Arrangements, What's Your Price etc.

    My main plate is on multiple sugar daddy dating websites. Multiple times per month she gets men paying hundreds just for lunch. They don't even get action out of it. One pays her $2-3k per month to bust a couple nuts (with a condom). Plus he pays for expensive meals and gifts.

    Meanwhile she comes over to my place 3-5 times per week and let's me fuck her any way I please for free. She's also gives it up to chads with good Game at the club.

    This is much more common than a lot of people realize. I've known multiple girls on sugar daddy websites (if you act very non-judgemental, women will reveal everything...especially after sex). I created a fake profile on Seeking Areangements to see what's out there and spotted multiple girls I know.

    [–]textualintercourse 33 points34 points  (6 children)

    (With a condom)

    ...of course it was.

    Keep your junk wrapped at all times.

    [–]clint_bronson 17 points18 points  (3 children)

    Exaclty, why would any sane man, with obvious financial means, fuck a whore without one?

    [–]textualintercourse 10 points11 points  (0 children)

    There are some thirsty thirsty men running around, and very few are self aware, nor very bright.

    [–]GuitarHero07 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    You are right. I usually keep it wrapped. I'm not going to lie though, once or twice when I was drunk I didn't (stupid, I know). She offers it up raw all the time though....."you don't need a condom, I just wanna feel you!"

    [–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (10 children)

    One pays her $2-3k per month to bust a couple nuts

    That's some expensive pussy. He would be better off going with an actual escort or prostitute. That's crazy. I am curious as to if I would actually spot any women I know.

    [–]Rubberlemons 16 points17 points  (0 children)

    She is an actual prostitute though.

    [–]GuitarHero07 8 points9 points  (0 children)

    I've actually created an account on Seeking Arrangements to see what's out there. And based on my impression of the local market, $2-3k sounds about right. The market demand is what it is.

    Her stats:

    • 25, 5'7, fit/toned
    • gets pretty steady work doing modeling for local businesses such as car dealerships
    • won the city beauty pageant 2 years ago (this is a larger city with 2 major pro sports teams)
    • placed at the state pageant to represent the state at Miss USA
    • is actually highly educated and fairly successful; she went to a prestigious university and works as an architect at a major local firm

    A lot of men are willing to pay a premium for a "classy lady." This is especially true in major cities where there are plenty of rich men with more money than time. The idea on these sugar daddy sites is that you are getting more than just a Backpage whore....whether or not that's actually true is up for debate I suppose.

    You probably would find women you know on there. I've certainly seen a few that I know on Seeking Arrangements. Also, you can bet that a lot of the girls you see on Tinder will also be on the sugar daddy sites.

    A lot of good looking women figure that they might as well get paid. Yes, they are ultimately whores but I can't say I completely blame them. If their pussies are in such high demand, they might as well use them while they can.

    [–]JackGetsIt 10 points11 points  (7 children)

    These services probably wouldn't be as big if prostitution was legal. If you had a lot of money it would probably be worth the expense to have a full time trusted whore then to keep running the risks of finding escorts and prostitutes that could be undercover cops.

    [–]majaka1234 1 point2 points  (6 children)

    Legal in Australia and the going rate for a 10/10 is like $300-$450. Any higher than that and you're probably paying more for the brand or fancy website or some shit.

    I've seen that in Europe that pussy is so devalued it's like 50 euros a bang. Not even worth getting married at that point.

    Free market works in some things.

    [–]JackGetsIt 1 point2 points  (5 children)

    Not even worth getting married at that point.

    Maybe this is what we need to get women to swing back to offering other tangible assets besides their pussys; like cooking, cleaning, personality, etc.

    [–]jewishsupremacist88 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    sugar dating is the new "dating"

    those girls will fuck for $$ if you've got game. but lots of old creepy dudes are on there paying for lunch

    [–]twatbutters 38 points39 points  (1 child)

    Online dating apps= good for hookups, that's it. Don't expect anything less than brazen whores from it, and you'll never be let down. Besides, if you're fit and moderately good looking, you should be sleeping with multiple women in a given month. Ghosting girls or getting ghosted shouldn't be a big deal.

    [–]GrabHerByThePEPE 16 points17 points  (0 children)

    I'd prefer making them plates to maximize roi, but it is a big deal because I'm used to getting ghosted when it was clear the sex was just ok for either party. This was kinda unprecedented

    [–]fruguy 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    I had an experience like that. Then we matched again a year later. We chatted a bit but I was turned off by her ghosting.

    [–]metallicdrama 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Lol. I would always ghost but respond if they initiated contact again. They'd still flake after bc its just an ego boost to them. Like yes, he liked me too like every other dick that used me lol. Now I just tell them a fake name, never go to my place, and gtfo after lol.

    [–][deleted] 230 points231 points  (41 children)

    I would take this even further and say we are witnessing the complete destruction of human interaction because of Social Media, period.

    [–]UnKnownSurviving 130 points131 points  (26 children)

    Yep. Not only that, but with men increasingly becoming MGTOWs. Frustrated men are deciding to make their own happiness. Sometime, they can pump and dump a chick, but they're not gonna commit to the bitch. Their happiness is valued more than the happiness of that bitch. And women wondered why they can't find "good" men, or "where are the good men?", once they hit the wall.

    Nah, ain't gonna stick or commit. The system is heavily rigged in women's favor, and they wonder why they can't get good men. Very few women change for the better, and most are just stuck at being a whore, forever.

    [–]czech_man 52 points53 points  (16 children)

    We are facing a shakedown of western society. AWALT - you would be surprised how meny young men are aware of the nature of females these days.

    [–]DontTreadOnSnek 20 points21 points  (9 children)

    Most intelligent guys have innately realized by this point that marriage is sham that gives you a ball and chain on one ankle, and future headaches over divorce, alimony, child support, and joint custody down the road

    [–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (5 children)

    Ding ding ding. Even some of my friends who are in committed relationships and might consider marriage, know how dangerous marriage can be financially. Not just the alimony and child support, but the lawyers alone cost thousands of dollars.

    Even men who aren't or I wouldn't consider as having "alpha" traits, know that divorce can break a man. Look at the suicide rates in divorced men.

    [–]UnKnownSurviving 15 points16 points  (4 children)

    It's fucking crazy. Just look at Tiger Woods. He got fucking destroyed. Not that I care, but there was video of him in pain, just got an extensive back surgery, and they posted it and humiliated him, by showing it publicly, while he was arrested for DUI.

    He should have never married that blonde bitch. Somehow, she was able to make herself a victim, and him, abusive asshole, which in my opinion is false.

    [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (3 children)

    I read somewhere that she got $100 million. That's some expensive pussy. There are countless examples of multi-millionaires like Tiger Woods, who get divorced and the ex-wife gets a boatload of money to "maintain the lifestyle" and then she moves on to some other dude.

    It's ridiculous. Not just millionaires, but men who are going to be earning a good amount of money should never get married. Especially if you don't want kids. Obviously don't marry, but especially don't do it if you have a considerable amount in assets.

    [–]Slut_Slayer9000 2 points3 points  (1 child)

    Go look at Mariah Carey and Janet Jackson. Literally disgusting. Celeb billionaire gold diggers. That's next level crazy psychopath.

    [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    It really is disgusting, but the thing is, I can't completely blame them because men enable this behavior. I don't approve of it though.

    Marriage for men is like giving someone access to all your bank and investments accounts and trusting them to not take half.

    [–]UnKnownSurviving 1 point2 points  (2 children)

    Hell, yeah. Which is why I'm not gonna destroy myself with that. Why should I destroy myself? For her? And she bears no responsibility?

    Yeah, not having this.

    [–]UnKnownSurviving 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    Yeah. It's just not worth it. Too many goddamn dramas. I've heard some men, only in their early twenties, completely drained of their energy, looking 40s and 50s, due to having a relationship with a woman. I wanted to help them out, but I had to care of myself, first. I found this, here, on RedPill, 21 Convention & 21 Studios, and they're pretty good in helping men. The founder is in this sub-reddit. I can't afford to pay to watch lectures, at this point, but I do have books, like "The Way of Men", and the RedPill Handbook, (including the SideBar) to get a basic understanding, to survive as man. I want to get "The Rational Male", next. Right now, I'm busy building my life from scratch.

    [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (4 children)

    Exactly. It's one of the reasons the marriage rate is dropping.

    [–][deleted] 68 points69 points  (6 children)

    Exactly. There are actually "good men" out there, but they have realized that committing to a woman is many times not worth the drama, financial and mental commitment. They would rather focus on things they can control, like their health and career. It's funny how some guys will act like they are happy in a relationship, then talk about how their girlfriend is mad for no reason or they can't do something because their girlfriend wants to spend more time with them.

    Don't get me wrong, I would love to have a girlfriend for feminine "companionship" and sex, but only if she's worth it. Unfortunately, even getting the first date is a hassle, given how many women flake and all that. The system is definitely rigged in women's favor. Maybe I will find a great woman and enter a relationship with her, but for now, I just focus on myself. I don't consider myself MGTOW, but definitely never getting married.

    [–]UnKnownSurviving 9 points10 points  (5 children)

    It's fine you're not MGTOW. I'm fine with it. I just don't like seeing all this assault on men, and I've experience some disturbance with women, and I've always had non-relationship with women, and I saw how they are. How they are really, like. I won't go MGTOW completely, but marriage is definitely off the table.

    [–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

    I don't consider myself MGTOW in the sense that I have completely ruled out a committed relationship, but I definitely understand the reason men are going MGTOW and I'm in no rush to even get a girlfriend. Heck, even getting a woman who doesn't flake these days is a challenge. Women in the US can be freaking crazy. Especially with the feminism bullshit that is infecting our society. Marriage is definitely off the table for me.

    My ideal scenario would be at some point making six figures, living on my own, having a group of friends and having a consistent fuck buddy/buddies that I don't have to do the bullshit dating stuff for. We have consistent fun sex, without the drama.

    [–]pencilcasserole 4 points5 points  (3 children)

    This. Growing up as a bloopie fag hag to your female friends, they pull the claws out and let the bile spew cause you're a sexual non-entity. One of the fastest ways to get red pilled if you're able to break your mental hamstering and actually think about they awful shit they said.

    [–]UnKnownSurviving 4 points5 points  (2 children)

    That's why I got out of the friend-zone status after what, 10-16 years? I'm going monk mode, right now, this year. And going on for while now. Couple of months. At first, it hurt, with all the dead silence. Then couple months later, I got up and running. Jut all alone, though, which I got used to. I realized there's no female distractions, and I actually have the time, to work on myself, plan up the life I want, while earning and saving money for the future. Girls don't even text me on facebook, or even call, and that's when I realized, I'm a low-status male, which to them, they could friend-zone me, for anything they want to use for. A shoulder to cry on or any other shit.

    I plan to delete women off my Facebook's friend list, sometime, when I get SMV high enough, but then again, I could be "friends" with them, only if I have no interest in plating or not attracted to them enough to do it. And I wouldn't invite my plates to facebook, either.

    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    If post wall women understood their value and latched onto a low value man they'd find there are plenty of super caring, romantic, responsible and respectful men who would love to get their dick wet once a week/month.

    But sadly those girls forgo what they could get in a dream of a time past.

    [–]TheYambag 38 points39 points  (4 children)

    I would take this even further and say we are witnessing the complete destruction of human interaction because of Social Media, period.

    Social Media isn't the problem, there have always been whores since the dawn of time. The problem is that we have incentivized the breakdown of the nuclear family. The solution is to end entitlement spending, and yes, I'm 100% serious. The reality is that with welfare programs, and female ability to cuck society into paying for their children, there is now literally no incentive for them to stick with one man. As long as society is willing to fund this degeneracy, we will NEVER fix the root of the problem.

    It may sound cruel to allow a female and a child, the child having no fair say in the matter, live in squalor or possibly even perish due to lack of support and ability to care for themselves, but the cold, hard, harsh reality is that those cases will be very small, as women in dire need of support will change their tune real fast. When they realize that they must choose between literally living on the street and not being able to give their baby girl food for the night, and giving up the cock carousel, the vast, overwhelming majority will give up the cock carousel.

    [–]jontycampbell 9 points10 points  (0 children)

    Ubiquitous in the UK, and can be spotted a mile off by their plumage and markings.

    [–]NietzscheExplosion 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    Vote up. Social media is a vacant vacuole vacuum of ideas.

    [–]MoronicBobbin[🍰] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Sadly have to agree with this. Women are just happy sharing a few "hawt" Chad's on Tinder while ignoring 90% of men. 50% of clubs in the UK have closed down since 2008 and the ones left open are sausage fests where women enjoy ignoring guys as they have their dating apps filled with suitors. PUA died as a result of all this.

    In 2017 for a normal guy his best bets of meeting someone is via hobbies or while going about his daily business. Alternatively he can wait until all these women turn 30 and decide jump off the CC and find a beta to settle down with.

    [–]GrabHerByThePEPE 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I've been thinking this has been changing since the development of language, agriculture, migration to city centers, industrialism, and finally the "death of god". It's all a more corrupt version of what preceded it. We're entering the era of the digital and transforming into something totally different, but once/if we end this cycle of anti-intellectualism (BLM, fake news, Antigua, feminism, tranny culture) we will become the next humans. All at the cost of the past, but it's at our genetic roots forever nonetheless.

    Edit: then again, we would certainly find something excellent about ourselves from a few centuries of a new dark age, as Jack Donovan puts it.

    [–]pabloethcobar 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    it's fucking great. I can witness it with my own eyes! its actually hilarious to see how brainwashed people are.

    [–]TRP VanguardArchwinger 180 points181 points  (16 children)

    Dating applications aren't the source of the problem, per se. They just turn the entire city a girl lives in into one large bar.

    Women live lives of abundance. The same abundance mentality we strive to develop, or at least fake, women are just born into automatically. This is the primary source of the disconnect between the sexes.

    Every single time a woman wants to have sex, she can find someone willing to have sex with her. It doesn't matter whether she's in a bar, a club, a coffee shop, or online. With just a little bit of effort and time, even a below-average-looking woman can find at least one man willing to fuck her.

    This abundance of sexual availability leads women to take sex for granted. Even find it kind of annoying. Because thanks to this abundance, women can afford to be picky. Women only bother saying yes to the top X percent of men. Whether that's 20, 40, 10, or 5 doesn't matter. Whatever it is, or even if it varies from woman to woman, a woman is only going to bother with guys who meet or exceed her standards, and because she has sexual abundance, her standards can be high. It doesn't matter if she doesn't find a guy who's good enough for her at the bar tonight. She can go home alone and shrug, because she knows that if she really wants to have sex, she can find another guy tomorrow, or the next day, or the next, with fairly minimal time and effort. And if she really gets horny or lonely, then fine, she can fudge on her standards for one night and fuck a normal guy, scratch the itch, then go back to being picky.

    In fact, The Red Pill really ought to dedicate some focus toward identifying women who are lonely or horny and willing to drop their normal standards for a night.

    This makes sex nearly completely value-less for women, to the point where they find the abundant opportunities for sex kind of annoying and wish that guys who don't measure up would just weed themselves out and quit wasting her time, so that she only has to comb through the resumes of the upper echelon.

    This situation is exacerbated by the modern sex-positive mentality. Now, being a slut is considered a positive, enriching experience that women are encouraged to embark upon. Drunk on the attention from many men instead of just one husband, women are marrying later, having kids later (which means more birth defects and fewer children overall, as noted in the OP), and so on.

    It's not online dating that's doing this, directly. It's our modern sex-positive society. If women didn't do it online, they'd do it in their nearest bar or club. Online dating apps just turn the entire city into one big bar.

    [–]prodigy2throw 44 points45 points  (0 children)

    This should be its own post

    [–]∞ Mod | RP Vanguardbsutansalt 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Women live lives of abundance.

    They are born rich and die poor, whereas guys are born poor and may die rich... if they follow our tenets and do their due diligence (or hit the financial and/or genetic lottery).

    Point being, women do live lives of abundance... until they don't and for many it seems to be a huge shock to them that guys don't want them like they used to. It's completely out of their realm of understanding that the wall is lurking a few years down the road.

    This makes sex nearly completely value-less for women

    That's the real problem, isn't it? By the time they realize what's what, they're damage goods and not LTR material guys desire.


    The Red Pill really ought to dedicate some focus toward identifying women who are lonely or horny and willing to drop their normal standards for a night.

    1. Look for women showing lots of skin. It's a hint they're ovulating. This is counter to "dropping standards" because they'll be more likely to be down for guys who are dominant and jacked, something guys drawn to this community often lack.
    2. Women go out in groups. When one of them is on the flank looking around the bar/club, she's bored and looking for someone to talk to. Now maybe she's not the one you want to fuck, but in either case she's your "in" for the group as she's likely more open to being approached.

    [–]redpill77 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    "The Red Pill really ought to dedicate some focus toward identifying women who are lonely or horny and willing to drop their normal standards for a night."

    This addresses how to observe when she's horny:

    https://therationalmale.com/2014/12/17/estrus/

    [–]Senior Contributorexit_sandman 21 points22 points  (0 children)

    2) Fewer children born

    3) Increased maternal age = greater prevalence of autism and other problems in children

    I dare to say that (2) is a bigger problem than (3). Or, put differently: those women who postpone having children until a very advanced age are more likely to not succeeding at getting knocked up at all than to have a disabled kid.

    Dating apps turn everything upside down. Women are given the illusion of having unlimited sexual options.

    Not exactly - as you described it yourself further down your post, the sexual options for all intents and purposes are truly unlimited for most women. It's the fact that this abundance of attention a woman enjoys online has the potential to completely obscure her perception regarding her odds on the RMP.

    [–][deleted] 151 points152 points  (22 children)

    Met a girl on tinder, go to her place after a short conversation, get undressed, she is impressed by my fit body and I start making out with her and ripping off her clothes. So I'm finger blasting her sucking on a titty and her hand never even goes for my dick. Confused I ask her to give me head, she begrudgingly says yes and then gives me a lackluster blowie with no motivation. I go soft in her mouth and pull my dick out of it and say this isn't going to work and start getting dressed. She tells me to wait and to at least eat her out first. I tell her to finish herself off and I'm going to the gym. I walk out the door after taking a bottle of liquor from her freezer. Delete her number and unmatch her.

    Moral of the story is, chicks on tinder will not be motivated to make you cum and will only use you as a human dildo unless you build up some emotional connection first.

    [–]officerkondo 113 points114 points  (8 children)

    after taking a bottle of liquor from her freezer.

    This is my favorite part of the FR.

    [–]CrazedHyperion 13 points14 points  (6 children)

    Must have been vodka. What other liquor do you keep in the freezer? Was it Absolut or Grey Goose?

    [–][deleted] 39 points40 points  (0 children)

    Grey Goose? How classy do you think this whore was?

    [–]MelodyMyst 17 points18 points  (0 children)

    Tequila. 1800 Silver to be exact.

    [–]Olga_Schmutzer 26 points27 points  (0 children)

    This. I experienced it firsthand, also with a girl from Tinder. We had a couple of meetups, but everytime I was fingering the girl until she came squirting and she wanted even more. Me suggesting to her she can suck my cock was met with disbelief from her. My dick got unstiff as a result, which she used to shame me, which didn't work because idgaf. I told her I'm not a robot, I need to get something in return before I can function properly. I started putting on my clothes, she tried to shame me even more. I started to roll a joint, and she kept pushing and pushing verbally. In the meantime, I was in a state of complete clarity, thinking about TRP, just shutting the fuck up and listening/processing every stupid thing she said.

    I think your moral of the story is spot on. Until I established some emotional connection with her (it took some dates), she was not willing to do anything to help me sexually. I was there for her, the other way around was not even something she considered.

    [–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

    Agressive dry hand job city

    [–]facelessbastard 21 points22 points  (0 children)

    Topkek. Thanks for making me laugh

    [–]maxytracks 11 points12 points  (5 children)

    I walk out the door after taking a bottle of liquor from her freezer

    Lol you're a horrible person.

    [–]TheRiseAndFall 25 points26 points  (2 children)

    For saving her brain and liver? Dude's a hero!

    [–]redaftrp 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    My favorite kind of person

    [–]blackwater23 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Lmao oh come on now. "Finish yourself off, I'm going to the gym"? You gotta be a troll

    [–][deleted] 17 points18 points  (3 children)

    Definitely skewed young on this one, which is fine. I think that dating apps are one thing, dating sites another....dating sites are often pretty clearly skewed towards Provider Hunters of both genders....think match and eharemony. As a guy in his 40's, I have to fend off Provider Hunters even on OKC....I set specific physical requirements, the ability to climb rocks & backpack. That should keep the fatties down.

    I do feel sorry for men who want children and am at a loss. I don't think about the problem much, as I don't have kids and can't have kids, so my game is avoiding them. Blackdragons current or most recent piece has to do with kids. It can probably be done, but it's not my problem.

    Anyway, to the young dudes here, if you can get laid on tinder, fucking do it and have fun while you can. I'm jealous. I have to work way harder to fuck the same girls. Otherwise, I think the OP's 7 takeaways are solid, if typical advance....outside of point 5 black knighting fat chicks. I love it. My primary way of doing that is extolling the virtues of dietary fat...honestly they could improve themselves if they listened.

    [–]segagaga 14 points15 points  (2 children)

    As someone who wants kids of my own, and fast approaching my 40s, this is why I avoid dating sites, its just a bunch of women looking for a walking ATM for their chadspawn. Why would I want to pay for someone else's kids? I despair at finding a decent sensible woman with an actual future in these places and have more than a few sleepless nights worried about this.

    [–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

    I'm guessing that if you're successful in life and are attractive mate, dating sites might just be your thing. Focus on women under 30 who don't have kids and want kids. You can easily set those filters.

    You'll get daily emails from Provider Hunters. I do, and my profile is all about outdoor adventuring.....we are no more obliged to answer every email as they are.

    If your SMV isn't high enough, you might need to deal with the fact that the mother of your children has others from other men. It all depends on how hard of a bargain you can drive.

    I do recommend at least looking at Blackdragon's stuff on kids. Disney monogamy is terrible on children. As a child of a "broken" marriage, I really wish my folks would have had the emotional maturity to split amicably.

    Humans are poorly wired for monogamy. What's most important is positioning yourself to have lifelong positive influence over your children. Therefore, plan to fail, make sure you're with someone who is at least somewhat amenable to reason, make sure full joint custody would be the only reasonable back up plan, etc.....and of course, execute on it if need be.

    Before anyone excoriates me, make sure she has a god-damned career. The best defense against divorce rape (not that you have to marry to have kids) is to make sure she's not dependent on your income. Paid child care, nannies or legit businesses, are fine. Yes, they are expensive, but as a lover of women they would be better off sticking with their careers, even if they pay all of their income to child care. It pays off in a big way later in life, while reducing the burden on men.

    Alas, many beta's will say "don't work, I want a stay at home mother for my kids" and fuck everyone over in the process.

    [–]jontycampbell 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    its just a bunch of women looking for a walking ATM for their chadspawn. Why would I want to pay for someone else's kids?

    And are often losers with it that don't seem to have a life.

    [–]Endorsed Contributorsadomasochrist 88 points89 points  (2 children)

    Your post is built on a false assumption.

    That online dating is a primary dating mechanism for neurotypical, women worth dating.

    It's not.

    They don't make it past the social circle. Online dating is a market for lemons.

    [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 17 points18 points  (2 children)

    implant the idea in peoples' heads that these dating apps highly distort the sexual marketplace an

    This won't work. The SMP will have moved on again before people figure this out.

    People don't care - people do not modify their private behaviour for the greater good. This level of self sacrifice for others long term benefit is not in the nature of people.

    Agree with most of your points though, including what to do about it.

    [–]JackGetsIt 2 points3 points  (1 child)

    people do not modify their private behaviour for the greater good

    I agree with this unless it's in some type of tribal group setting. People will certainly modify their behavior and sometimes quite drastically if they think they will gain status and feeling of belonging within a group they admire.

    [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Right.

    Private behaviour however - not so much.

    [–]nightmancommeth 8 points9 points  (2 children)

    Lol at the blackknighting fatties. Ive had girls whose photos are 8/10 show up 50 lbs heavier and i straight up tell them that's BS. I can agree with 90% of this post. I havent had a problem on them but the # of fatties who think we are in the same league just blows my mind. I workout 5x a week and follow an extremely disciplined diet to look the way I do. You think some French Fry eating fatty has the right to be with me?

    [–]nonstoplife 7 points8 points  (0 children)

    After my separation from my very long marriage, I went on several dating apps. I got lots of responses and thought, this is great and a lot easier than hooking up in person. But after some time on dating apps, it turned out to be a big waste of time. So much false advertising going on in profiles. Women who said they could dance, and loved to dance, turned out they meant about 20 or 30 years ago. Women who said they were active and liked to hike, turned out they meant years ago. Now, hiking is a walk around a park or a trip to the mall. I became totally disillusioned with dating apps. In economics, they talk about searching cost. Dating apps impose a huge searching cost. I wasted so much time for so little return. A poor investment. I stopped using dating apps after less than a year. I find it better to meet women at places where we share a common interest. For example, at dances, on a local hike, even at a bar. My advice, get out there and do stuff for yourself, that makes you happy. In mixed environments you have the best chance to meet and assess a woman. Forget the dating apps, they are just women embellishing who they want to be, not who they actually are in real life.

    [–][deleted] 55 points56 points  (3 children)

    First of all, great post and I completely agree with everything you said. I will add however that although online dating has absolutely destroyed the sexual marketplace, it has done wonders for TRP dudes and any guy willing to put more than .02 seconds worth of work into himself. Women are almost so sucked into the online world now, when you actually do have the balls to approach them in real life they are easy as hell to get.

    I believe they are actually more receptive and more thirsty than they were say 20-30 years ago. Once you looksmax and get attractive, you can literally just roll out of the house and spam approach and end up with pussy the same night and its not a big deal. As much as online dating is messing it up for guys who are average, it is giving above average guys an advantage actually.

    It's just like being a hunter. Which would you prefer and which would make you more successful? Hunting with a ton of other people also taking shots, or hunting by yourself because everyone is to scared to do it? The number of whatever animal(lets just say deer) doesnt change, but if the amount of people hunting has then it makes it 10x easier for you. Thats the situation we see ourselves in right now. Most guys are so comfortable getting their 1 Tinder date a month(that they get flaked on) and never leaving the house, that anyone who is willing to put in any effort is a prize.

    [–]psychyness 15 points16 points  (0 children)

    I literally had this revelation last night and went on to explain it to my buddy. Not sure if he understood but it's good to see someone else understands

    [–]moonpodrising 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    Sound analysis. Going back to real-life-based meeting doesn't need to be some sort of revolt against technology. It's just, very possibly, a better solution for the individual guy. Dating apps have indeed changed the game. I think it's going to get 'worse' as the technology evolves. Adapt or die.

    Now in the west, in the young adult age group, IRL approaching sets a man apart from the crowd: so it IS adaptive. Without shouldering any burden of 'fixing the system'. A humble, realistic approach.

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

    [–]NeoreactionSafe 7 points8 points  (0 children)

     

    This sexual marketplace was typified by a reliance on social circle and night time venues to facilitate hookups. Women's choices were constrained necessarily to the men within their immediate proximity.

     

    It was "Real"... based in the real world of the body and what was near it locally.

    The online dating creates a "Virtual World" of what "seems" like an abundance of options for females and a shortage of men.

    Objectively there are about 50% male and 50% female.

    But in the imaginary reality the SMV 5 female (who should be able to get up to SMV 5 males) can come to believe she is really SMV 9 if she gives her vagina to a SMV 9 guy for one night.

    Her ability to deceive herself is increased.

    Female minds have the Hamster Wheel logic based on subjective experience so one distortion of her SMV (a 5 fucking a 9) will forever warp her self perception.

    This warped view creates the Alpha Widow or what might be called a "persistent illusion".

    She was never a SMV 9... but she felt like one for that one night with Chad.

     

    [–]Ananonguy88 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    I like this "Alpha widowhood" term, hearing it for the first time and it is striking the center of it's problem. This is the thing I'm afraid the most and It stops me from ever trying any LTR in my life. Past some age where she's after her prime chad hunter mode, you are just another failure in her line of attempts and trials to return to her beloved thunder cock that pumped and dumped.

    Man, It makes you basically sort of cucked by the past, by the time and memory itself. Like one of my co-workers still keeping in her wallet a photo of her hot ex that cheated on her and then dumped her while she remains dissatisfied with her current beta bf.

    This shit carries heavy burn risk.

    [–]Five_Decades 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    Some people don't believe me, but I remember what women were like before all these dating apps. Tinder only came out in 2012 and not long before that online dating was mostly ignored. A decade ago the only validation and options a woman had were men who approached her in real life. Back then women who were 7-8 were humble and respectful.

    Now the market is full of 3-5 women with huge egos and there is no winning move for men. We have no desire to clean up after these women after they've become jaded and bitter by chasing men way out of her smv. For a lot of guys the only real option is mgtow or hope you find a woman who isn't fucked up by modern dating culture.

    [–]justgotalpha 16 points17 points  (2 children)

    dating apps= COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME trust me guys this shit its not for everyone the dating market place is flawed .women have expectations way over the reality line to the point where even fat single moms are demanding tall handsome man who make 100k a year,are you FUCKING KIDDING ME!!!! i tried tinder one time(i knew it was a waste of time but i did anyways ) and i was just shocked of what i saw,fatties ,single moms,straight 4's looking for top 10% males, im like are these bitches for real? women with a market value of near to zero demanding high quality males, thats what feminist america has done to their women

    [–]Five_Decades 8 points9 points  (0 children)

    If it makes you feel better, these women will end up unhappy. The gender ratio in the real world are 1:1, so if women are chasing men out of their league for anything more serious than a ons they will end up empty handed.

    On tinder it feels like there are 100 men for every woman, so the woman chases elite men out of her league. In real life the gender ratio are equal and there are 50 mediocre women after every 1-5 elite men. The math doesn't work.

    [–][deleted] 40 points41 points  (7 children)

    Women on dating apps approach me.

    Rule 1) Be attractive.

    Rule 2) Don't be unattractive.

    [–]jt3611 33 points34 points  (3 children)

    I personally did really well with online dating but it amazed me (at first) at how openly shallow women are. I'm legitimately six foot tall, and it said so in my profile. I'd say at least every 3 out of 5 women I met had me stand next to them because they were "wearing their highest heels, and wanted to make sure I was still taller than them." I was ready to start bringing a scale with me if we're going to verify body stats now.

    [–]jontycampbell 11 points12 points  (0 children)

    Bring a tape measure to 'make sure you are not fatter than me'

    [–]nightmancommeth 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Same I have had the opposite problem of not getting them to go away. Ive actually had girls show up at my house because I wasnt answering there texts. This was after I told them I wasnt interested but they insisted I needed to get to know them better.

    [–]oljoner 4 points5 points  (2 children)

    That's mostly due to your genetics (& of course decent clothes combined with the correctly taken pictures). Truth is, it was kind of effortless for you. Sure, you lift, but don't we all?

    For the Steve Buscemi types among us, your 2 rules don't apply. They need IRL interaction to show off real charisma.

    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    What does that have to do with

    Dating apps have been a weapon of mass destruction dropped on the sexual marketplace.

    ?

    [–]prodigy2throw 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Charisma, confidence and social status will win against a dull Chad more often than not.

    [–]JcHgvr 22 points23 points  (39 children)

    Less children

    People choose not have children because they can't afford them. How can a couple in their 20's think children if the flat they live in is a rental, the car they own is monthly payments. So is your phone, your tv and a lot of other things. Top that off with student loans. You don't own much these days.

    Children are very expensive and require at least one stay at home parent, and with financial situation for young people being what it is having children is simply not viable financially.

    Sure it's also convenient allowing people to enjoy fucking around till 30's. But dating apps didn't exactly have a a lot of competition from stable child producing relationships.

    Same goes for marriage, divorce rape aside, people don't have stable enough lives to commit that much.

    [–][deleted] 27 points28 points  (8 children)

    And yet we witness single mom sluts en masse on slut parades.

    [–]JcHgvr 13 points14 points  (7 children)

    And how many of them planned to have that child ?

    [–]twatbutters 7 points8 points  (2 children)

    And how many of them are still successfully raising that kid (whether it's in the form of government assistance or child support)?

    [–]MrInternetDetective 13 points14 points  (1 child)

    You may be using the term successfully incorrectly here.

    [–]twatbutters 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    I use it to refer to the fact that the kid has a roof over his head, clothes, and food-- I'm well aware of the dangers of single motherhood on a child.

    [–]Phoenixtorment 2 points3 points  (1 child)

    There are women in my country intentionally becoming a single mom early because then they don't have to worry about money because the state supports them.

    I kid you not, let that sink in.

    [–]twatbutters 14 points15 points  (13 children)

    How can a couple in their 20's think children if the flat they live in is a rental, the car they own is monthly payments.

    We need to dial back and shut down some of the common retarded liberal excuses for not having children. Yes, it's harder to buy homes, and cost of living has relatively increased, but the same people who complain about this:

    a. Don't save up money well

    b. Have ludicrious spending habits (e.g. they must have the new iPhone, they must spend thousands on retarded luxuries, they eat out too much)

    c. Use/abuse credit and end up in debt

    It's very viable for any level-headed person making a decent living to have a family if they wanted to. Now when it comes to starting a family with an ex-whore, that's another beast entirely.

    [–]TRP VanguardArchwinger 14 points15 points  (7 children)

    Having children, on its own, isn't expensive.

    But if you want to have children who have their own bedroom in a 3000+ square foot home in a good neighborhood, zoned to good schools with primarily upper middle class white students and good teachers with bonafide college prep and advanced placement programs, and you want your sons to play sports with their friends every season and your daughters to do gymnastics and dance with the other girls, and you want to make sure your kids learn a musical instrument and a martial art and a second language -- that shit costs money.

    If you just want a kid who lives with you, wears clothes, and doesn't starve, that's not too expensive.

    [–]JcHgvr 2 points3 points  (3 children)

    And why exactly wouldn't I want my kids to go to a good school ? What's the point of bringing them into this already very competitive world and having them go into life from disadvantageous position ?

    I'm not saying they need to go to a top private school, get extra classes from good private tutors and so on.

    But yea if I were going to have kid I'd like them to get a head start in life. Doesn't have to be 1% life style, but easier than I had for sure.

    [–]TRP VanguardArchwinger 8 points9 points  (2 children)

    And why exactly wouldn't I want my kids to go to a good school ? What's the point of bringing them into this already very competitive world and having them go into life from disadvantageous position ?

    Don't ask me. I was 30-ish when we had our daughter. We lived in a 2800 square foot home in the burbs at the time and have since moved to an even bigger home in an even better, richer, whiter burb. She's always had her own room, she currently plays sports, does gymnastics and a martial art, and we're getting her into an instrument this year. All the kids in her class are bright, come from successful upper middle class families, went to kick-ass pre-schools, teachers compete heavily for jobs in our school district due to its affluence and the lack of bad elements in the student body, and kids her age who aren't reading at least two grade levels above are the rarity at her elementary school.

    This shit's important. The idea that it doesn't matter what sort of start and what sort of resources you provide your kid -- the good ones will just figure it out and invent Microsoft in their garage and be successful anyway -- that's Disney bullshit. If you want your kid to be rich and successful, you give your kid the rich and successful life from day one. It's still no guarantee, but I'll take the Pepsi challenge over some regular kid from the poorer side of town any day of the week.

    [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    watch this mans words.

    All the people who I deem to be successful given their age, are from families who granted them the opportunity to prosper, given they're not total retards and blew the cash away. Even then they're given multiple opportunities through their family's connections.

    [–]twatbutters 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    the good ones will just figure it out and invent Microsoft in their garage and be successful anyway -- that's Disney bullshit.

    Not every kid will be a multi-millionaire or billionaire, but the idea that you can't raise a successful kid without affluence and all the things you mentioned is ridiculous. Asian immigrants are without a doubt the biggest example to the contrary of your point.

    [–]JcHgvr 7 points8 points  (3 children)

    I'm pretty far from liberal. You have a point but I don't fully agree. Not many people in their 20's make enough money to save. And I'm not talking about eating out every day and having maxed out ccs.

    Flats in big cities already take up a lot of their income. And young people don't want to live in small towns. They are young they want something out of their lives. They are straight out of uni, they started to have their own money so they don't want to settle down and start making babies.

    So yea people choose not to have kids because they would have to give up on fun. Times have changed and people in their 20's don't want to not only to divert funds into kids but also give up on most of their social life.

    Which is why couples in their 30's have kids, they had their fun, and they have more money.

    [–]twatbutters 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Flats in big cities already take up a lot of their income.

    And they're idiots for not finding residence someplace cheaper, where they might have to commute. Another excuse.

    And young people don't want to live in small towns.

    Tough titties-- adjust or don't complain about your financial situation that you're responsible for marring yourself.

    Times have changed and people in their 20's don't want to not only to divert funds into kids but also give up on most of their social life.

    Excuses, and it doesn't even address the harder truths such as the cock carousel playing into older maternity ages.

    [–]badDayAtBerchdsgaden 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    We need to dial back and shut down some of the common retarded liberal excuses for not having children. Yes, it's harder to buy homes, and cost of living has relatively increased, but the same people who complain about this

    I think you underestimate how far out of reach home ownership is for Millenials in the area where I am. I did a quick mental calculation at the factory-type job I took last summer to make ends meet, and it would take my weekly paycheque working 40 hrs a week for about the next 8 years or so to buy a home. And thats before rent, food, and not resorting to wearing a barrel for clothes.

    I can understand the cost of living in North America has to have increased a fair bit since the 50s because of higher standards in things like environmental regulation, workplace safety, & stricter standards for how buildings are built, but this is madness. Theres no way on this Earth Im ever going to spend my prime working years working to keep this shitstorm of a society going.

    [–]askmrcia 4 points5 points  (4 children)

    I agree with this to an extent. The truth is alot of young people spend way to much money on other shit that they don't need. Thousands of dollars on expensive clothes, gym membership they don't use, eating out multiple days during the week, drinking at bars every weekend, living in expensive rentals and so on.

    I guess these can range from different experiences but I'm going off from what I observe from my social circle and people I know in general.

    All of what I said above can be cut down tremendously where it's not killing your wallet.

    I can use my sister and my ex and their friends as examples.

    I'll never forget a time when I was out with the ex and friends at a brunch. I offered for the first time to pickup the check. The check ended up being $60. I looked at her surprised and she said "oh that's nothing, I usually spend more." mind you her and their friends do brunch pretty much every weekend and not to mention the money they spend on Saturday nights and "Sunday Fun Days" at bars.

    People in general can be irresponsible when it comes to their spending habits. So yes it's harder to get homes and college debt can make it hard to plan for children, but it's not that much of an obstacle that you make it sound.

    [–]jontycampbell 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    A I have always said, if you cannot afford to have a child without taxpayer help, don't have one

    [–]Endorsed ContributorMentORPHEUS 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    I've got POF down to a system, when I need prospects I unhide my profile for a few days then it's time to hide it again because my calendar is full. Next month I'm traveling to another state so I set up a new profile in that city and had my first meetup in the bag within 12 hours.

    Study your male competition on your site of choice. The bar is pretty damn low to get your profile into the top 20%. Make a more detailed and polarizing profile than average, you'll get a smaller number of better qualified contacts.

    [–]Kommanderdude 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    Idk. I slayed it on tinder.

    [–]makethemwant 1 point2 points  (2 children)

    The fact that the pinnacle of girls are 6s on that site gives me hope that the real hotties and worthwhile girls are not on those sites.

    I tried online dating for all of 1 week before I figured out that I didn't enjoy such a low response rate from mediocre-looking and high-needs-having females.

    In person, chicks love my vibe, my smile, my obvious show of confidence. Dating apps can't do me, or any wholistically developed RP man, justice. Delete the apps.

    [–]Hitleresque 3 points4 points  (1 child)

    All of what you listed is already happening. The fact that MGTOW, TRP, PUA culture etc. exists was already a clear sign of that. Dont get me wrong, it's going to get much, much worse the further we go.

    The only thing we can do about it is exploit it while the system starts crumbling. And by that I mean you can either use TRP to fuck all the dumb sluts this has created, or you can use it to vet them properly, find one of the few good women left and try to turn society around. Just remember AWALT before tackling an LTR.

    [–]badchad_isglad 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Dating apps do work if you put the time and effort both into yourself and the app. However I believe the more a man's SMV rises, the less he should use dating apps and instead game in person.

    By perusing this strategy, a man will both differentiate himself from the pack and have an easier/more fun time getting higher quality women.

    Don't forget, there are many high quality women out there for the top 20% and many of those women are not on dating apps.

    Get out there and go get a high quality lay.

    [–]stay_anon_stay_safe 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    4) Greatly educed ability to pair bond for both some men and majority women after spending a decade or more immersed in the hookup culture

    shittt this means that hookup culture is self-perpetuating

    boy meets girl

    girl doesnt want anything cuz hookup

    boy heartbroken

    cycle repeats enough times until boy is part of hookup culture and finding someone who isn't part of it will just repeat this process on someone else

    [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    I guess I'm part of the exception then. I travelled a lot in my previous job and didn't have the time or energy to date conventionally. Met a great girl through Eharmony and now have two kids and couldn't be happier.

    But I think that stressed the difference between dating apps and hookup apps. Some stress marriage and kids as what both sides are looking for. Others like Tinder, stress hookups. That's why I never used them.

    [–]Alpha_Jedi 4 points5 points  (1 child)

    I did a write up on each app and the Red Pill implications of each: https://alphajedi.com/2017/06/02/swipe-right-a-red-pill-dating-app-review/

    Long story short, apps psychologically condition men to be Blue Pill by the way they are setup.

    [–]yazen_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Read it. Was a nice summary.

    [–]Juk9876 8 points9 points  (4 children)

    While I agree with your post, I don't think it is realistic to expect men, specially RP men who worked on improving themselves, to drop out of dating apps for these reasons. These apps made ever more ridiculously easy for the top 20% men to get sex, and I don't think people will go back to a more difficult, traditional approach. I think we are witnessing the end of families as we know it in a few decades.

    [–]UnKnownSurviving 6 points7 points  (3 children)

    It's been happening for some time. The decline of western families. Then all of sudden, single, western women, have degrees, and approaching quickly to early 30s, want children and marriage.

    Nah, that's not gonna happen. Most men, aren't gonna give up their freedom, they've had for a long time, to a whoring, late 20s, slut, who recognized their bio clock just now ticking and closing the door to having children. So, sluts will try to quickly force a high status male, to stick his foot in her door, to buy time. When the male doesn't want to and refuse, the only last try will be shaming him to marriage with her. This will only pissed him off, and dump her ass out into the street.

    Any RP or high status male, isn't going to give up his freedom or his love of money over women. Feminism unwittingly give him this option.

    [–]CrazedHyperion 3 points4 points  (2 children)

    I believe that, due to internet availability, a radical and permanent shift in society is taking place. Where feminism made a lot of their gains in the '80 and '90, technology is leveling the playing field once again, in a fundamental and irreversible way. As men can afford to wait for marriage, and do so, women have a limited shelf life, 30 and you're pushing it. The only possible outcome is a decrease in birth rates, since women will have to resign to having fewer children. Sperm banks may fulfill a biological need, but only very wealthy women would benefit of it. Adoption - hell, which single woman would want to burden herself with an adopted child? Even more, the transfer of wealth from men to women will decrease, since fewer marriages.

    [–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

    If people wanna use dating apps let them use dating apps. Obviously it's worthwhile for them or they wouldn't be using it. It's not for me but I don't see the problem with others using it.

    [–]prodigy2throw 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    I'd say if you're getting laid pretty regularly and with ease then keep doing you.

    Truth is 90% of guys use it as a crutch (my former self included) and have to pull teeth to get a date or lay out of the thing.

    With all that effort you're better off learning to interact in the real world with day game.

    [–][deleted]  (2 children)

    [deleted]

    [–]jewishsupremacist88 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    seekingarranagement exists already.

    [–]binarynightmare 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    We are essentially witnessing the complete destruction of the sexual marketplace that has been the norm for most of the past fifty years.

    I think a more appropriate statement would be that we're seeing the norms and regulations of the sexual marketplace being torn down as it reverts to how it was intended in nature.

    Dating apps might be sowing the seeds of their own destruction. I'm seeing a lot of men getting frustrated with the return on investment from said apps all across the internet.

    To be honest all of the alphas and good looking guys I know are having a field day with Tinder. It's not so much that they weren't getting laid before, it's just that they don't have to spend a whole 20 dollars on a door fee and an evening in order to slay a girl (beta eye roll).

    [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    So noble of you.

    Can you pick up off tinder? Then who are you to grieve otherwise? Who should listen?

    [–]bestCallEver 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    Good thing you censored uhm... I'm guessing ..."slutty" and "fuck". Might have offended someone.

    [–][deleted]  (5 children)

    [deleted]

    [–]2awalt_cupcake 9 points10 points  (0 children)

    they're painful to my eyes

    [–]crimsonkodiak 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    This sexual marketplace was typified by a reliance on social circle and night time venues to facilitate hookups. Women's choices were constrained necessarily to the men within their immediate proximity. More importantly, these men had to approach her.

    The last line isn't a true statement and even to the extent it is, it implies it is more a limiter than it is in real life.

    Even before online dating, any good looking woman would have her choice of guys to take her home from the bar, if she was willing. Women can approach guys as well (you've seriously never been hit on by a woman in a bar?), though as a practical matter there's no need to do so.

    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    This post has moved me a bit. I want to focus on climbing, to become a better climber and fuck women 20 years younger than I am with tight bodies. The cost of 6 months of OKC (older guys need to pay to message younger women) is the same as the first month plus the start up fee at a massive indoor climbing gym, $150. After that, it's $75 per month.

    If I did it, I'd have intensive physical shit going on every day. Might be good idea.

    [–]itsawomensworld 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I stopped online dating 5 months ago and this post really could have been written by me. I've been very happy to not be rejected by 7s and waste my time on women who have no interest in a relationship. My record not online dating is excellent even if I don't ask many girls out.

    Online dating has made 7/10 women feel like the hottest girl in highschool.

    Even my fat 18 year old female cousin was giggling tonight about her tinder experience. She said she uses it just to match not go out.

    This is an insane ego boost for 6/10 women. She never got hit on in HS and now she's the creme de la creme , in her mind, online.

    Women crave validation . They spend half their day validating eachother clothes shoes. All of it is for getting a man at the end of the day. If she's validated she has confidence she will get a man.

    But the world's so fucked up today that validation actually makes a woman so confident she'll get a man that she scoffs at seemingly good options for even better ones. She feels so good about herself that her standards are out of control.

    [–]antman333 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    When i apply my standard rules and values towards women on dating apps, i end up deleting / unmatching / ceasing contact with 95% of them. From what i can gather, at best they use these apps as a way to stay distracted / ego validation / escape from their boring existence. Most of the time, i cease interaction because they cannot hold my interest.

    [–]absofaluminum 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    If you're seeing only "fatties" and "6s" or otherwise undesirable women on these apps, it's highly likely you're just not getting a glimpse of the ones who are out of your league because they've already swiped left on you.

    source: intelligent, attractive woman who's had a lot of encounters, both casual and serious, that started on an app and would sniff out your bullshit in a fucking heartbeat. You're all a bunch of pigs.

    [–]1nzgs 8 points9 points  (6 children)

    This is quite a beta thread. You're demanding that men stop using these apps because the playing field isn't in your favour on them, rather than improving your smv to the point that the apps do work in your favour.

    Trying to change the sexual behaviour of millions of people via activism is pointless and beta. May as well call yourself a "MRA".

    [–]prodigy2throw 11 points12 points  (3 children)

    Regardless of the butthurt OP does have a point.

    Truth is lots of guys who have genetic limits to SMV think success with women can only be had through online dating (tinder, bumble, etc) when the truth is those apps are so heavily skewed towards the top % of men that it doesn't reflect how women are in the real world.

    A guy who is 5'7 will always be 5'7 no matter how hard he works out or dresses. Guys like that need to go out and develop charisma and use it on women in the real world.

    [–]Sir_Ganjas_VIII 2 points3 points  (2 children)

    My lifting partner is 5'7 and he gets a solid 20/30 matches a day off tinder. I'm 6'3 and I receive 20/30 matches a month.

    [–]prodigy2throw 8 points9 points  (1 child)

    The height thing was just a place holder for "genetically disadvantaged", but okay.

    Also, matches don't mean anything. Dick in Vagina is what matters.

    [–]Psychocist 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    It all matters, but I'd say facial aesthetics matter more than anything online. I'm 5'9 and going bald (shaved head). I'd be truly fucked without a decent mug.. I do good enough online with some attractive women to not be that motivated to date through other means.

    [–]RedPillWriter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    You're demanding that men stop using these apps because the playing field isn't in your favour

    How do you think modern civilisation developed exactly? At the core of every modern culture was marriage, primarily intended to curb female hypergamy. It is not unreasonable to think that it was alpha men who imposed marriage onto society, limiting their own access to pussy too. Shit you do for not having to live in a jungle, like a monkey, with limited survival. The only reason we can sustain uncurbed hypergamy is because society has some momentum and doesn't collapse in a day, but long-term this isn't good for anyone. Neither women, nor men.

    Yeah, perhaps activism is not at all an effective tool now, but like all problems, the first step is acknowledgement - the more widespread, the better. If you think it's only worth sticking out for yourself, you need to work on your abundance mentality.

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