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Blue Pill ExampleThe proud feminists of AskWomen accidentally validate RedPill truths by talking about how much they love alphas and hate betas. Oops! (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by needsomehelp3211

Summary: OP asks why there are so many frustrated lonely men out there. Commenters admit that it's probably because these guys are weak and low social status. Validates longstanding RedPill theory about dichotomy between alphas and beta.

Thread here.

Ah, AskWomen. I've long suggested they establish a business partnership with PetCo, because that subreddit seems to have an endless supply in hamsters and hamster products. Good money in that.

Anyway... OP asked "I've seen thousands of guys on Reddit say they are above average in every way, yet can't even get a date, because women are too picky. What do you think is the real reason for this?" Knowing RedPill theory, we can empirically offer hypotheses as to why this is: the guys may not be physically superior looking, or rich, or dominant enough. Basically, betas. And surprisingly, AskWomen couldn't help but agree with us in their response to the thread (I guess even female rationalization has its limits).

Let's take a little look-see through the wonderful emotional and confused world that is a woman's mind.

A lot of guys overestimate how good looking they are. I think it is because there are so many shows where the chubby funny guy has a supermodel wife. Girls do this too.

Well... I'll give it a passing grade. You almost got it, honey. Since the 90s, the feminist-influenced Hollywood media has always portrayed the dopey, sweet guy getting the girl in the end. It's a lie, of course, but it's a narrative that they want to push, so they do it. It's resulted in an entire generation of lonely men who are depressed and suicidal because women have fucked their minds so thoroughly that they can't even get a date.

I imagine they're looking solely for women within the league of perfection that they think they're in when they are not in fact actually in that league. Basically, they think they deserve a certain kind of women who is (somehow unbeknownst to them) out of their league. Meanwhile, they ignore the attention they get from women that they aren't interested in and thus delude themselves into thinking they can't get any women. They just can't get the ones they actually want. I've also noticed a lot of those guys list the bare minimum traits as if they're amazing things to have (e.g., "I'm a nice guy", "I have a stable job", etc.), which suggests to me they think women should flock to them just because they're not a total loser. They fail to see that people want more than just the bare minimum. You're not a terribly good prospect if your only redeeming quality is that you're not an asshole.

Ding ding ding. The plight of a beta male described succinctly. The nerd with no fashion sense and weird hygiene isn't even on the cheerleader's radar, and that has nothing to do with his "good personality" or "kindness" as feminists would have you believe. It's because he's not primal enough. He doesn't exude physical strength. He's probably not tall. Probably doesn't get sexually aggressive with girls. If he did, he may have a chance. But all he can do is pine for her in the corner.

I've tried to be a lot more self-aware lately of how I state my experiences with guys in high school. I used to say, "Oh guys didn't like me in high school" or "I never got asked out in high school." But I realized that, while I definitely didn't have many guys interested in me, especially when I compare myself with other (often very pretty, stylish, and popular) girls, that several guys did either ask me out or indicate interest in some way, but that I either wasn't interested or it didn't pan out well. So I'm consciously trying to switch to say "I really didn't date in high school" or "Not many guys were into me in high school." I realized it's kind of shitty and dismissive to act as if "no one" liked me, as if people don't count until I decide I like them back.

I'm glad this one is a little self-aware, but this mentality is shared by millions of women out there. "Ugh, I got asked out by so many low-value men whom I didn't want to be associated with because of social norms, but the captain of the lacrosse team wouldn't even look my direction! That's basically the same as being foreveralone, right? Women can be foreveralone too, see!"

I'll stop here but read the rest of the thread. You can almost SEE the truth trying to claw its way out of the hamster's throat. Betas make women so disgusted that they can't even sugarcoat it. Not even on AskWomen.

TL;DR: Women absolutely despise betas and won't come within 3 feet of them. Despite constantly talking about how much a good personality matters, how much they value guys who are nice and considerate, etc... they will drop their panties in an instant for a muscular confident alpha.


[–]1WidmerBeer 217 points218 points  (76 children)

"I've fucked Chad. You're not Chad. I deserve a Chad, he's texting me any minute now. But your problem is that you think you're in a higher league than you are by just being safe and secure Beta with a good job and all that. You don't give us tingles, so you're better suited dating that Quadrapalegic girl that drools on herself, or Tabitha who rides the carts at Walmart because she's overweight, they're in your league. After all... beauty is only skin deep! OMg, got a text. See, Chad is drunk and wants me to stop by. We're meant to be!"

Yep, it's the guys who are punching above their weight... until the girl hits 27-30 and starts 'settling' for a husband/provider. Being a single Beta is a blessing in disguise. As Bukowski said, there's a lot worse things than being alone.

[–][deleted]  (20 children)

[removed]

    [–]Endorsed Contributornyrp 79 points80 points  (18 children)

    I met a guy today who worked with and was friends with Robin Williams. He told me that at the end of his life, he owed his ex-wife so much money. That for a $3M movie, after paying taxes, lawyers, and his ex-wife, he would take home $70,000.

    Building your career to a point where your closest business partners and life partner take 95% of the 50% the government didn't get must feel pretty lonely.

    Could make a man want to kill himself.

    [–]MarvelousWhale 26 points27 points  (16 children)

    I don't know if it's legit but I have an actor in my family and knows quite a few other actors and have heard exactly the same thing, that he owed his wife (wives?) So much he literally had to keep making movies even if he didn't want to. Just to keep his head above water.

    [–]Endorsed Contributornyrp 33 points34 points  (14 children)

    Yeah, I think it's true. It was mentioned (rumored) here last summer shortly after the suicide. He was basically at the age of retirement and left to be an indentured servant to a woman for life. Really.

    [–]ConfirmedCynic 30 points31 points  (11 children)

    And somehow these women convince themselves that they deserve it.

    [–]MarvelousWhale 13 points14 points  (8 children)

    I'm sadistic enough to say they do deserve it. If they can trick a man into not wearing a condom they can trick a man into giving them his life's resources for as long as he lives.

    Give them an inch and they will take ten miles. It's up to us to keep our own, ours. If some men can't handle it, so be it.

    These are the rules of the jungle, my man.

    [–]ConfirmedCynic 7 points8 points  (7 children)

    Well, we have one foot out of the jungle at the very least. The laws should be changed so that alimony doesn't last forever. Women supposedly are all "strong and independent" after all, capable of earning their own livings, unlike in years past where they were shut out of most careers.

    [–]MarvelousWhale 6 points7 points  (5 children)

    The laws will reflect whatever benefits the established hierarchy. At the moment the state is making bank off of the current feminist culture we are in. They actually rely on Beta Bux, the media is peddling X, Y and Z product to women all day every day but who do you think is the one buying it all? Betas.

    The laws will not change to benefit you. Having conversations about how the laws "should" be, are for idealists.

    [–]ConfirmedCynic 4 points5 points  (2 children)

    I wouldn't count on that. We're starting to move into a society where women often earn more than men. And it just freaks them out when they're the ones faced with paying. Look for change as it becomes increasingly common.

    [–]MarvelousWhale 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    My own father has avoided this exact situation by the skin of his teeth. Made WELL into six figures before biting the bullet of two (almost three) wives. He still hasn't learned his lesson but the crash of the stock market literally saved his life.

    It's disgusting to see first hand.

    Edit - grammar.

    [–]CornyHoosier 36 points37 points  (0 children)

    As Bukowski said, there's a lot worse things than being alone.

    This is when I go work out, head over to Coors Field to watch a Rockies game or find some live music venue here in Denver. It took me longer than I care to admit that too often I would put myself down and make myself depressed. However, being able to see that you're doing that to yourself also allows you to learn how to easily pick yourself up.

    Work on yourself and become the person you want to be. Don't let other people caste you into a certain persona. If you want to be a bad ass, tattooed, motorcyclist ... go fucking do it. You only get one life.

    Me? I always knew I wanted to work on technology. My entire life I was put into the nerd category and completely conformed to that role. I used to weight 400lbs, was always the "nice" guy, never went outside, looked terrible, had no style and never did anything. -- Around my mid-20's I had enough. I hated who I had become. I wanted to be Batman! So slowly but surely I started to train myself (this was well before I heard of TRP). I read up and developed healthy living, I studied fashion, I studied men who were successful with women, I worked on my finances, I forced myself to travel and get outside of my comfort zone.

    Now fast forward to today ... I love my life. I feel like the god damn Batman that I always wanted to be!

    [–]BetterRedThanRed 59 points60 points  (51 children)

    Yeah.

    Imagine all what this guy said is true:

    "I'm 6'0", 170 lb, in great shape, good looking, full head of hair, make $100K a year, am intelligent and fun to be around, but I can't even get a match on Tinder or a date in real life."

    So he is a 10/10 and moderately rich. Which fucking women is good enough for such a guy? Fact is your average HB7 thinks that this guy is just about her league.

    As a man, you literally have to be a 10/10 just to have a higher than 50% chance to get one particular HB7. A 7/10 can get a HB7, too. But it is a numbers game for him. A 7/10 man has to ask out about a dozens of HB7 until one of them considers him as good enough to have sex with.

    [–]PlanB_pedofile 37 points38 points  (8 children)

    Women are not wanting the provider man as much as they used to. They want the chad cock. Only time when the 100k salary and nice guy becomes attractive is when she's exhausted all her chads and had enough of the cock carousel and finally at the age of 30 wants to settle and have a family.

    Sad thing is she won't get that unless some man who is breaching 50 doesn't mind courting her.

    [–]CornyHoosier 39 points40 points  (0 children)

    Sad thing is she won't get that unless some man who is breaching 50 doesn't mind courting her.

    There will always be some pushover-provider to be there when she needs one. Likely even around her age.

    [–]ItIsMyPrivilege 19 points20 points  (4 children)

    The sad thing is she will probably get exactly what she wants in the end. I'm not as optimistic (as much as they will think I'm satan for wanting this) that they will get the shit end of the stick in life. I will bet that for most HB7+s that there is some relatively well off (financially) beta that will be her provider when "she is ready". Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I'm wrong. I'm just trying to dispel this "they will get there's in the end" kind of thinking in myself

    [–]BetterRedThanRed 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Fact it that it is not possible that all women get a guy above her league. This is only possible for sex. But not for marriage were a guy can only marry one woman.

    For every 6/10 woman who did not ride the CC and got into a healthy LTR when she was young and married her 8/10 boyfriend, there is a 8/10 woman who rode the CC and has to marry a 6/10 guy when she hits 35.

    Now I agree that this is not some kind of revenge, but honestly, women who ride the CC are also not some devil. If a HB8 "only" gets a 6/10 husband, I am okay with this already.

    [–]1independentmale 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    I'm just trying to dispel this "they will get there's in the end" kind of thinking in myself

    Good. You should because you're absolutely right. They will not get what they deserve. They will have their cake and eat it, too. I've seen it time and time again.

    There's always another thirsty BB willing to provide for her. Even if she gets fat and ugly, there are countless dumbasses waiting in line to wife that shit up.

    [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    It comes down to women not policing their emotions any more because they will get a guy and a job no matter what. So their primal urges take over. I live in a pretty liberal city and am currently on a trip across the mid west. OMG the wonder that is conservative white culture when it comes to resisting feminism. The women aren't as attractive but you can just tell they all approach their men in a mature respectful manner. I am considering moving south for weather reasons but this trip is making mind up. Conservative culture is great for men and when men are happy they make their women happy.

    I am one of those guys who is suicidal because of all the feminism I was exposed to as a kid, the fact my dad got bitched up by my mom because of predatory divorce laws and domestic violence laws, and finally when my dad broke mentally and he got entrapped into an fbi sting and was sent to jail for 15 years for meeting a minor, it's usually 5 years but he was a community leader and it was an election year so they threw the book at him. I am not condoning what he did, I am just showing how feminism has destroyed my life and I don't really see any other options than getting as far away from it as possible. Feminism is the death of the stoic male and ultimately will end our culture. The Midwest might be vanilla and boring but atleast the fuckin feminist haven't destroyed it yet

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]BetterRedThanRed 4 points5 points  (0 children)

      It is probably because the story is made up.

      I never heard anybody claim on reddit "I am a 10 and nobody wants to have sex with me". But I heard a lot of "I am a solid 5 or a soft 6, but even 3s reject me.".

      [–][deleted]  (2 children)

      [removed]

        [–]BetterRedThanRed 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        Maybe his sense of entitlement turns the entitled ones off?

        This.

        A 9/10 man can not just get a 9/10 woman for a ONS. A 9/10 woman can just get any single 9/10 man for a ONS.

        If a 9/10 man shows entitlement and is picky, she can just go to the next 9/10 or even 10/10 man who is not that picky.

        Ironically, she thinks he has to high standards. But fact is that he just does not take into account that the market is screwed in favor of women. A 10/10 man is the equivalent of a 7/10 woman in the ONS market.

        [–]Moldy_Gecko 1 point2 points  (2 children)

        You sir are the winner! It's the inflated amount of self-worth and hollywood stereotypes perpetuated by feminism that has these low level women (even 5s) thinking they are all deserve Chad Thundercock. Ugly girls need to understand they aren't all 10s. Even if their momma said size don't matter.

        [–]Purecorrupt 2 points3 points  (29 children)

        Unless he has 5% body fat - 170lbs at 6'0" seems pretty thin. I don't think I look very big except compared to other men who obviously do not work out. And I assume I'd be 185-190 if I was 3 inches taller.

        This guy sounds typical where he overvalues himself.

        [–]1WidmerBeer 50 points51 points  (14 children)

        This dude cracks the top 5% on height and salary in the world, two things women value highly, and here were are, TRP, undervaluing him because he's not 6'2, 200k salary... have you seen the women on Tinder?

        Looks like we're being apologetic to the absurd standards of the opposite sex when it comes to Tinder/Online dating. Supply/Demand on the internet is so heavily distorted even we're ragging on him. Truth is he's out of 75% of their league- and that's being generous to the other 25%. Only will the majority of women see that when they're frantically scavenging to find a provider as the wall approaches. This dude is going to be echelons above them all by that point if he continues the road he's on.

        [–]DuncanMonroe 13 points14 points  (4 children)

        Bitches on tinder are ugly and reaching far above their league. I can get 9s IRL almost consistently. I can't even consistently get 7s on tinder. Waste of time.

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (3 children)

        It's not just tinder. If you're dating, don't date online. Online, you're competing with every guy on the site. In person, you're competing with whichever guy is approaching her at that time, which could easily be just you. The risk of course is not knowing whether she finds you attractive, whether she's single, etc.

        [–]detachedbymarriage 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        But at that point, does it really matter? Women are fickle at best when it comes to attraction. If they want to be attracted to you, they will find a reason.

        [–]1KyfhoMyoba 1 point2 points  (1 child)

        Online, you're competing with every guy on the site. In person, you're competing with whichever guy is approaching her at that time

        And the guys online are online because it's 'safer' for their fragile egos than actually going up to a smokin' HB9 and attempting a conversation with her. So much, much fewer actually learn/have game IRL.

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

        The guy in question probably needs to network. Have SIL, cousins, etc do some networking for him. Its hard to convey a lot of status. He is probably winning every column except face

        [–]CornyHoosier 10 points11 points  (1 child)

        I've seen some good looking guys who are awkward as fuck and can't get laid because they make everyone cringe when they open their damn mouths.

        [–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

        I think this is my problem.

        [–]kinklianekoff 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        it's not apologetic, it's being realistic. Tinder is all face and body and making the hamster think your high value by doing interesting shit on pictures. This dude has high relationship value, but that doesn't mean shit during his 20's.

        [–][deleted]  (2 children)

        [deleted]

          [–]rattamahatta 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          The Netherlands average height for males is around 5"11 (180 cm) and you omitted Spain, Italy, France where guys are shorter, but your overall point stands.

          [–]poop_lord_420 4 points5 points  (1 child)

          He said he's in great shape. Not that he's massive and ripped. At that weight and height he probably focus on cardio.

          [–]BetterRedThanRed 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          170lbs at 6'0" seems pretty thin.

          This is America today...

          Were the upper quarter of ideal weight range is "pretty thin". Add 15lbs and this guy would be overweight unless he is serious about lifting.

          [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (4 children)

          I'm 5'11 175 just south of 10% bf, and yes, I feel pretty dyel. This hypothetical guy is over estimating his looks.

          [–]Chicken_Hands 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Nice quote about the old man, Buk

          [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Guys aren't punching over their weight the value of a man has been destroyed in this culture. I

          [–]TRP VanguardCyralea 113 points114 points  (15 children)

          I imagine they're looking solely for women within the league of perfection that they think they're in when they are not in fact actually in that league

          This is my favourite example of female solipsism. Women do this all the time, so they assume it must be true of men as well. In reality it's rarely the case. Women have eyes for the top 20% only, men have a much broader range.

          The best part is that she goes on to validate that, with this:

          I've also noticed a lot of those guys list the bare minimum traits as if they're amazing things to have (e.g., "I'm a nice guy", "I have a stable job", etc.)

          Note what she's doing here. She's reframing all the things she requires as the bare minimum. No doubt if she had continued she'd have added things like "Be fit, tall, wealthy, influential, confident" all as minimums before consideration. The number of men who meet those requirements is actually much smaller than she thinks.

          Men require women to be physically fuckable. She can't process that attraction could be so much simpler for men.

          [–]Modredpillschool 35 points36 points  (10 children)

          Women do this all the time, so they assume it must be true of men as well. In reality it's rarely the case. Women have eyes for the top 20% only, men have a much broader range.

          It's most obvious when you realize that we're talking about guys who don't get any hits on okcupid or tinder.. so they aren't even in a position to reject women because of high standards. They're still at square one.

          [–]ReclusiveHermit 37 points38 points  (6 children)

          [–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (4 children)

          That's a painful statistic - only 9% of men are on the attractive half of the graph at all

          That means for 91% of all men, you may as well not exist. I consider myself to be at roughly the top 20% point, so I got a ways to go before I get proper.

          [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

          nah you can exist, you just can't expect much from tinder/e-dating.

          E-dating or tinder for a girl is like this. Picture you got an e-mail, you're invited to Gordon Ramsay's new restaurant. He makes EVERYTHING there. And since you won, it's free. All free. Go ahead and walk through, just pick up whatever you want and eat it. It's all free, and it's all available for you.

          This is what tinder is like. Guys are on there to fuck. The girls can pick from pretty much any guy, and even a guy way out of her league may plow her if he's bored or lonely. It's the dick buffet. All they're gonna see is your picture and decide in less than a second if they're going to fuck you.

          Now in real life, you have a way better chance. More parts of who you are show, and if you know how to talk to them properly, almost any guy can get laid from someone. She will still pick, but you can influence that choice a lot.

          Then there's the next level. If you're famous or have put in your work and got your $ right, you now choose. Just as you used to walk up to girls and try to get with them, they now do that to you and you have to only pick a few. You're now in the pussy buffet, and it's offered to you all the time. Add in the fact you go to the gym and are fit, and it's a homerun. You'll get girls coming up to you at car shows, the mall, wherever trying to get with you. Because now YOU are the rare commodity, a rich single (or not, they dont care) guy who can offer them so much.

          And then at the end of the day, unlike the 9/10 guy on tinder who has an otherwise shitty low income life, you're doing whatever awesome shit you want in your spare time.

          [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          In college when we had to take turns manning a recruitment booth or something. Suring our shift we had a rolling tally of 1-10 HBs that walked by.

          We tried multiple ways of doing it, even separate groups. The bell curve would ALWAYS appear. We even had a gay guy do his own separate one and after 4 hours, bam. Bell curve.

          [–]RojoEscarlata 18 points19 points  (0 children)

          It's most obvious when you realize that we're talking about guys who don't get any hits on okcupid or tinder

          Those men don't even exist in their eyes, at least not as "men"

          [–]Redasshole 5 points6 points  (0 children)

          She thinks her life experience is the same for everyone because she is the only one that matters.

          [–]Mr_Andry 1 point2 points  (2 children)

          I think we should clarify that those requirements are for LTRs. For the tingles, all she really needs to see is authentic self-confidence, and the rest gets assumed or temporarily overlooked. It's a bit rare in the real world, but you do see fat, broke guys who get attractive women because they can pull off the funny and charming personality.

          Once she looks at that kind of guy as a possible LTR, she'll start trying to "fix" him.

          [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

          Bitches love Mickey avalon. If you've seen him he looks like a jewish bird-woman. They'd fuck a tree if it had swag.

          [–]RPthrowaway123 233 points234 points  (46 children)

          Lol, one of those is pretty ironic:

          I imagine they're looking solely for women within the league of perfection that they think they're in when they are not in fact actually in that league. Basically, they think they deserve a certain kind of women who is (somehow unbeknownst to them) out of their league. Meanwhile, they ignore the attention they get from women that they aren't interested in and thus delude themselves into thinking they can't get any women. They just can't get the ones they actually want. I've also noticed a lot of those guys list the bare minimum traits as if they're amazing things to have (e.g., "I'm a nice guy", "I have a stable job", etc.), which suggests to me they think women should flock to them just because they're not a total loser. They fail to see that people want more than just the bare minimum. You're not a terribly good prospect if your only redeeming quality is that you're not an asshole.

          This is exactly what women do. "I have a job" is the male equivalent of "I showed up and I have a pussy, what else could you want".

          [–]Senior Contributorexit_sandman 92 points93 points  (15 children)

          "They fail to see that people want more than just the bare minimum." This is exactly what women do. "I have a job" is the male equivalent of "I showed up and I have a pussy, what else could you want".

          And it actually works - for enough guys, "passing the boner test" is enough for a woman to be eligible for a relationship; they'll do the pedestalizing and rationalizing why this particular girl is great and loveworthy by themselves. Yet when it comes to guys with options, they suddenly need more qualities and are blindsided why their mojo doesn't work with Chad who is more eager to fuck many chicks than to commit to her.

          [–]Purecorrupt 29 points30 points  (3 children)

          Makes me think of Ronda rousy's "DNB - Do nothing bitch". Where she basically says there are girls who are entitled even though they don't do anything.

          [–]BetterRedThanRed 37 points38 points  (4 children)

          Look! A man has to be nice and needs a stable job just to be not seen as a total loser. A woman needs none of this. With just average looks, she already gets laid easily.

          [–]babybopp 22 points23 points  (3 children)

          They're 5'10 but say that they're 6' (not that there's anything wrong with being 5'10 - I'm 5'10. It's the principle of the thing). They're not in terrible shape, but they're definitely not athletic. They've got a full head of hair but have a shitty haircut. They make $80,000 a year, which is totally close to 100k, right? Except they're in New York and live in a shoebox because 80k won't buy you shit there. They think they're intelligent but aren't actually as smart as they think they are. They're not actually that fun to be around. And most of all, they have this entitled attitude that they deserve companionship and that the world has somehow done them an injustice because they don't have supermodels throwing themselves at them. I think that the latter is the most unattractive. Poor, fat, lazy, shithead dudes get laid and get into relationships all the time. Just ask half the women on AW who have "that ex." The mindset I just mentioned is more unattractive than everything else I just mentioned.

          alpha fucks beta bucks... classic, but what is more amazing is the absolute disgust aimed at betas.. they think of betas less than dog shit..

          [–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (1 child)

          I don't really get how this thread says anything about alpha or beta, it's just random fat reddit bitches bitching, but it's funny how they all keep saying that guys "expect supermodels". You can tell they're really unattractive and fat, and they know it, based on their hate of how guys want much better than her.

          [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Women act based on two things. Feels and how they think they feel. If you look at this thread with the idea that, women hate betas because a beta considering himself in the same league as a girl is considered an insult to the girl. All these girls are actually mad guys think they deserve them. Meanwhile alphas make her tingle, feels, and use their dominate frame to control how the woman thinks she feels, which will almost always work because awalt. Women hate betas because they are not real men, but it's all women's fault men are like this now.

          [–]drinkinouttacups1 67 points68 points  (5 children)

          Its way juicier in irony than just that

          they think they deserve a certain kind of women who is (somehow unbeknownst to them) out of their league. Meanwhile, they ignore the attention they get from women that they aren't interested in

          Simply take 'wo' out of 'women' and read it again.

          Ahhh...not it sounds like im reading something that makes sense

          [–]Fallout99 29 points30 points  (3 children)

          Let's not forget that the AVERAGE women is now 166 pounds. Half the women just by virtue of their weight are undateable, then throw in personality, single mothers, ect and you see why an average all-american guy has a damn tough time.

          http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/06/12/look-at-how-much-weight-weve-gained-since-the-1960s/

          [–]reisli 19 points20 points  (2 children)

          They also equate 166 pound females to 166 pound males. (And upward)

          It's like no, bitch. Even if a 200 pound guy isn't in shape, he can hold it well if he's tall and still pack strength underneath. A 200 pound woman is a blob even if she's 6'0.

          A 200 lb male wanting a 120 lb woman is an entirely different thing from a 200 lb female wanting a 170 lb male. One is actually (pretty) reasonable, one is fucking absurd.

          [–]dxfifa 4 points5 points  (1 child)

          I'm overweight at 6'3" 220 but I never get seen as fat by any people because i'm built big so your point is right by my experience. At my current muscle mass I should be 185-195 ideally but it doesn't matter to women so much

          [–]ConfirmedCynic 8 points9 points  (1 child)

          Well, look at it from the beta male's viewpoint. What does he offer?

          He'll treat her well. Importantly, he'll give her children a stable home and be a good father to them. He'll pay for their college.

          Isn't that what she wants compared to some loser (in his perception) who might spend half his life in jail? The problem is he's being logical. Apparently Cupcake really would rather have Chad's love child, be abandoned by him, and raise the kid fatherless, with the state paying for her upkeep instead.

          [–]theozoph 3 points4 points  (0 children)

          That's because stability, parenting and income are concepts, and concepts live in the cortex, which has no relation to our limbic hindbrain, where emotions reside.

          A woman cannot get excited by what Beta Bill offers, because there's no emotional component to it, while Chad is fun and hot and unpredictable!

          Once, when marriages were arranged and men ruled their household, a decent guy would be his wife's Chad because he would have been the only man to ever fuck her, because his fathers and peers would have instructed him in how to act like a man, and because her dependance on him would have instinctively created the Captain/First mate dynamic.

          Now that women are free to play the field, Chad is the best game in town and every woman wants a piece of him! The rising age of the first child and financial independance also create the perfect storm for the CC nightmare that leaves girls used up by 30, and betas bereft and depressed.

          Obviously, we cannot go back to arranged marriages and teenage mothers, but unless we find a new arrangement to make a majority of men more attractive to women, and the CC less accessible, the continued descent into degeneracy will continue unabated.

          You cannot beat biology with concepts.

          [–]vakerr 5 points6 points  (0 children)

          According to women 80% of males are below average.

          As you can see from the gray line, women rate an incredible 80% of guys as worse-looking than medium.

          chart

          [–]rztzz 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          While the poster of this is not self-aware enough to see that women do this a ton, I'm sure I'm not the only one that has been mildly stalked by girls who I deem significantly below my league. However...

          Simply put, a relationship can be a bad deal for men. It is therefore logical that men would only be eager to jump into one if he feels she is hotter or more charismatic than other girls he could easily get. So there probably is some truth to it.

          [–]deprecated 11 points12 points  (2 children)

          This is (as of this writing) the highest upvoted comment in this thread, and yet I fail to see how the quoted comment is invalid or inaccurate, especially in the context of RP principles. The commenter is basically saying that these men are not getting dates because they are not offering an SMV on par with that which they are seeking from women. It's that simple. If they were, women would be responsive to their offering. She then suggests that these men's true SMV can most accurately be determined by the SMV of the women who entertain their offer (the women they have no interest in, whose SMV are probably pretty close to their own.) She then notes the apparent discrepancy between what these men feel elevate their SMV ("I'm a nice guy" and "I have a stable job"), and what creates real SMV for women (alpha traits, though she doesn't elaborate on the matter other than referring to "more than just the base minimum.") This is core to RP theory

          I don't get it. This commenter perfectly reflects RP principles. This isn't a feminist trying to spew emasculating dogma about why these men aren't getting dates because they're not acting like good little beta bitches, or trying to deceive men on how they can get the women they want. She is basically saying they are not getting dates (or the dates they want) because they haven't elevated their (true) SMV to a point where the women they want will entertain their offer.

          This is fundamental to RP principles. This is fundamental to SMP in practice.

          [–]Endorsed ContributorRedPillDad 18 points19 points  (1 child)

          Women have no qualms in talking RP truth when the critical spotlight is on men. It's when the spotlight turns on women that they get squirrelly. They know women can be evil, but they can't publicly admit it that basic truth.

          [–]deprecated 3 points4 points  (0 children)

          So?

          What is inaccurate about what is being said in this quote?

          edit: and I disagree. There are many comments in that thread where the commenter states "and women do the same."

          [–][deleted]  (5 children)

          [deleted]

            [–]theozoph 3 points4 points  (3 children)

            While I respect Ronda's combativeness and athleticism, she makes the same mistake as feminists in assuming that men are attracted to women's performances.

            Ronda is single, and it is no mistake. UFC's Octagon Girls are the best Game in town, not Ronda, except for manlets fantasizing about being made her bitch.

            Unfortunately for Ronda, she isn't a lesbian, and will probably end up as a single mother like her own. No desirable man would choose a warrior woman over these, and unfortunately for Ronda, that's her competition, not this.

            [–]Purecorrupt 1 point2 points  (2 children)

            I concur for the most part. I just like the term DNB.

            [–]theozoph 2 points3 points  (1 child)

            She'd be a great guy, no denying that. Very RP.

            [–]ferengiprophet 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            Ronda thinks like that because she had to eat punches for a living to get to where she is now. Most spoiled girls go from daddy's house to a fully paid-for college experience and then mooch off of the men in their lives. They don't know the value of a hard-earned dollar.

            [–]nantucketghost 64 points65 points  (33 children)

            deleted REMOVED BY AUTOSCRIPT - GOODBYE CRUEL WORLD

            [–]quelques_heures 40 points41 points  (4 children)

            And what I love is that then PUA philosophy starts to become disseminated on the internet, teaching men that they've basically been socialized into being beta, and that yes, you can work on yourself and meet more women.

            And what do feminists and white-knights start doing, oh PUA is sexist, it's wrong to "trick" women into sleeping with you, etc., etc.

            Meanwhile, women are angry because the football star didn't ask them out in HS.

            [–]evileddy 51 points52 points  (2 children)

            Women saying men trick them? AHAHAHAHAAHA

            They are the masters of trickery! Dyed hair, makeup, push up bras, spanx form fitting clothes, heels, straight up lying about past partners, false rape accusations.. etc.

            They are just mad that some guys are figuring out how to get by their shit tests by not giving a fuck.

            [–]Diarrhea_Van_Frank 31 points32 points  (1 child)

            Women hate PUA because they resent that men can manipulate attraction the same way they can. They feel disgusted that they let a man fuck them who was only pretending to be an alpha instead of a natural. It's the female equivalent of going to bed at 2 with a 10 and waking up at 10 with a 2.

            [–]evileddy 15 points16 points  (0 children)

            Minus we don't charge them for rape for our bad life choices...

            [–]razorwan 15 points16 points  (27 children)

            The good news is that once blue pill faggots taste the bitter rejection/divorce rape that stems from the age of feminism, they'll be more likely to adapt a pseudo or more red-pill sided orientation.

            [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 57 points58 points  (16 children)

            I'd like to save a few of these guys before it happens. It's none of our fault that we are brainwashed from birth.

            [–]nantucketghost 26 points27 points  (1 child)

            deleted REMOVED BY AUTOSCRIPT - GOODBYE CRUEL WORLD

            [–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 5 points6 points  (0 children)

            Nobody saved me, and many of them won't believe it until the bullshit smacks them in the head and utterly destroys their life. Not just slow learners, but willfully ignorant and delusional about not only the way girls are but also what makes them moist.

            Let them learn the hard way, it's highly effective,then they'll be responsive to reality.

            [–]Senior Contributordr_warlock 5 points6 points  (0 children)

            Understandable, but not acceptable.

            [–][deleted]  (5 children)

            [deleted]

              [–]CornyHoosier 3 points4 points  (0 children)

              Accepting that you fucked up and only you have control over your life is the first step to becoming a better person. In the U.S. I feel like we're living in a country that is slowly becoming devoid of personal responsibility.

              [–]evilkenevil 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              Totally agree. I've had some long conversations that go nowhere. Guys come up to "what is wrong with me?...what can I do different?... How did you do it?" Great questions but they argue my answers more times than not. My only thought is that it sinks deep and re-emerges at some point.

              [–]weirdnamedindian 1 point2 points  (3 children)

              You can't save them. You can merely give them the roadmap. They need to do the walking in. As its said, you can lead the horse to the water but you can't make it drink.

              The RedPill is swallowed by most men only when their blue pill lives are shattered.

              There is a reason this is called The Red Pill. Those living within the matrix not only cannot see it, they are either too frightened or too overwhelmed when they see the veneer of truth. It's too much to handle. Better to go back to the safety of the Blue pill.

              [–]CornyHoosier 1 point2 points  (1 child)

              In my opinion, the most peculiar part is that you cannot go back once you've jumped in. As a former fat person and "blue pill", once I lost weight and started living more confidently I found that I hated fat people and blue pillers.

              As I continued to improve myself, I saw that my anger and hatred was another form of weakness about myself that I hadn't yet improved. I realized that I shouldn't hate those other people, if anything, I now feel sadness for them (or even indifference).

              [–]razorwan 0 points1 point  (1 child)

              You're saying something that is, in my view, impractically optimistic for another decade or two. Right now feminism is the dominant form modern social thinking-- it'll take some hard learning to fix this til you can educate bp into rp as a norm of thinking

              [–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (3 children)

              That's not really good news, trp shouldn't even be necessary to live an okay, average life.

              [–]the_drill 4 points5 points  (2 children)

              That reminds me of a funny sign I saw in a science class...

              186,000 MPH. It's not just a good idea, it's the law!

              TRP is a fairly accurate model of how these things work. Unfortunate? Maybe.

              So it goes.

              [–]evilkenevil 3 points4 points  (0 children)

              Yup-I was blue-pill in my 20's and either married and lonely or single and lonely the whole time. In my 30's things changed because I didn't a fuck. The Red Pill doctrine is the very ugly yet perfect truth. My looks faded, some weight gain to boot, hair vanished...

              Job increased, wallet fattened, real estate holdings grew, personal residence(s), vehicle(s) changed, wardrobe changed, zip code changed oh and guess what I'm not lonely EVER for some reason. There are so many people in my life I have to actually schedule alone time.

              These Blue Pillers disgust me but I have to smile when their girl half my age (more?) is staring at my old ass and giving me a smile. All that is available to me is because of them.

              [–]myschadenfreude 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              You would hope so, but most get back in line to do it again. Men are taught to be disposable heros; there when needed, but absolutely expendable.

              [–][deleted]  (3 children)

              [deleted]

                [–]razorwan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                You have to be very, very careful to not feed a woman's ego by texting or calling too much. These days women have a slew of sources for attention-seeking through social media.

                A lot of people are against the whole "don't text back too fast or too much" thing since it's understandably just a retarded shit test done by women. Better thing is to work out and make yourself into a sociable, desirable person, than to wait with baited breaths over the terse, lifeless responses of a woman who can (and does) get attention from 90 other sources than you.

                [–]2popthatpill 109 points110 points  (37 children)

                A lot of guys overestimate how good looking they are.

                I imagine they're looking solely for women within the league of perfection that they think they're in when they are not in fact actually in that league. Basically, they think they deserve a certain kind of women who is (somehow unbeknownst to them) out of their league.

                These answers aren't as insightful as you make them out to be. They amount to little more than blaming the victim.

                Look at this crap, for example:

                Meanwhile, they ignore the attention they get from women that they aren't interested in and thus delude themselves into thinking they can't get any women.

                This is just female hypergamy with the sexes switched. Basically, she's taking the female experience (too much attention from guys she's not interested in, not enough attention from the hawt guys) and just switching the sexes on it.

                [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 97 points98 points  (31 children)

                Basically, she's taking the female experience (too much attention from guys she's not interested in, not enough attention from the hawt guys) and just switching the sexes on it.

                Yeah, I thought this too. Many... (perhaps most) guys will actually receive zero attention from women. Like actually zero. Nil, nada, sqaut. All their lives, women will ignore them where possible, giving nothing beyond polite conflict-avoiding duty-chat.

                Hell even very good looking guys don't get actual female attention, they just find their own attention is better received.

                Most women do not think "I'm a 5, oh look there is a hot 6 over there". Studies have proved that only a top 20% guy is deemed to be "above average" to women. Nope, she's waiting for a tall hot 8 or 9 to "fall in love with her" (her thinking) or "be having a bad day and go dumpster diving" (our thinking).

                If you're a normal, reasonably good looking guy without confidence, you are not even average to women. You think you're an 8, but even the swampbeasts are looking at better men than you. (Actually swampbeasts are probably worse for this because it's all hypothetical to them anyway).

                So the implication from AskWomen is "lower your standards" (typical selfserving female advice).

                TRP advice would be "build yourself up".

                [–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 18 points19 points  (11 children)

                Some of us do get attention from girls, despite not appearing to be top 10%, confidence, game, lack of insecurities, and some muscle goes a long way towards getting girls to notice you. The attention is different than from men, they look at you, do things purposely to get your attention, they very rarely approach, but they'll eye fuck you from across the room.

                I know guys who get zero attention from girls, bottom 50% and zero game. One of them is going on 8 years without pussy, and he couldn't get a girl in war torn Ukraine. 25-30 years ago he was oblivious to the interest he got from girls while riding his liter sport bike, now pushing 50 he can't buy some tail. No confidence, no game, the quintessential nice guy, no muscle, bald and clinging to the hair on the sides, and angry at girls. Fat girls don't even want him, and dude has money. Others are worse, and get turned into beta bucks with zero fucks.

                [–]Smooovies 7 points8 points  (5 children)

                Going off of your first paragraph, there is a truth about women and the SMP that has annoyed me forever, but that I finally understand. I've always been a reasonably attractive guy, but recently after TRP, I've become much more attractive. I barely have to try and girls will talk to me now. BUT, there is something about how women don't approach that will always drive men crazy until they realize that they have to take EVERY step until they get what they want. If you want sex, you have to make it known. If you want to make out, you have grab her and kiss her. If you want a blowjob, you have to put your dick in her mouth, but not in a rapey way haha. As a guy, you have to know what she's explicitly willing to do with you sexually and otherwise, without her saying anything about it, and that's been the hardest thing for me to understand to this point. As guys, we build our relationships on being honest and funny about everything that happens to us in our lives. Women are fundamentally different in that they posses hamsters, which are fail-safes to prevent them from facing the truth. The shit is ridiculous.

                [–]Endorsed ContributorRedPillDad 6 points7 points  (2 children)

                Women hover and give IOI's, but like you said, most won't initiate. Many guys don't read female signals well - spergs to sexual signals.

                Most guys have crap Game so they project low value in the seductive arena. This doesn't stop them from blatantly target-hunting and chasing the HB.

                Women can't relate to starting with zero value and a huge barrier to sexual access. And men have pussy envy for HB's sexual freedom.

                [–]Risky_Clicks_NSFW 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                Women are prey, and desire to be hunted.

                [–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                Very ridiculous, but that's how it works.

                [–]PlanB_pedofile 4 points5 points  (2 children)

                The male wall. It happens and it can be a bitch

                [–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                He was too damn nice and oblivious, he fucked 3 girls in his 49 years, I'm over 100 and he had a kid on the way before I started fucking. She tried to trap him in a BB role because her soon to be ex was broke, useless, and a drunk. Yeah, he picked a winner.

                [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

                No confidence, no game, the quintessential nice guy, no muscle, bald and clinging to the hair on the sides, and angry at girls. Fat girls don't even want him

                Please stop! I cringe reading this crap.

                [–]CSMastermind 7 points8 points  (4 children)

                Many... (perhaps most) guys will actually receive zero attention from women. Like actually zero. Nil, nada, sqaut. All their lives, women will ignore them where possible, giving nothing beyond polite conflict-avoiding duty-chat.

                I'm a software developer. I also felt like a bad one too because I never went through the typical nerd experiences. It's like a badge of honor guys wear about being a helpless virgin who was picked on. When you run with that crowd it's astounding how many never get any attention from women at all. I've never understood how that doesn't make you want to improve yourself. My response to, "Chicks only date assholes", has always been, "So why aren't you an asshole?"

                [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 2 points3 points  (2 children)

                My response to, "Chicks only date assholes", has always been, "So why aren't you an asshole?"

                Most guys who try to be an asshole fail miserably at it, and back down at the slightest shit test. Most are absolutely terrified of hurting a girl's delicate feelz and the inevitable backlash against it.

                "Chicks only date assholes" is meant to sound like "Women don't date me because I'm just too god darned nice for them", but the reality is that it's male-hamstering for being unattractive with weak game. Of course they don't try to be like that, because it's not the real reason.

                [–]CSMastermind 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                I agree with you. My point is that most helpless men have a self defeating mindset. Instead of figuring out what women do respond to and working to achieve that they tell themselves comfortable lies. I don't feel pity for them.

                [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                I don't feel pity for them.

                I kinda do, a bit. They are sold a dream, and they buy into it. Work hard, be nice to women, and everything will work out just fine. Male looks don't matter, don't be an asshole to chicks, you win in the end when you marry her.

                This isn't my story, but I've seen it around me enough times.

                These guys have absolutely no idea about hypergamy, deadbedrooms, female manipulation or the endless AF/BB lie. They're told women will appreciate their sacrifices, and they don't see the cheating and divorcerape coming because they think they married a unicorn.

                Maybe at one point they even tried to do things slightly differently, they took a baby step and women saw right through it and shot them down in flames. Beta has his place, and he's damned well going to be kept there.

                Most men are indoctrinated and brainwashed from birth. I certainly was. Deeply feminist mother, I guess purplepill dad. The flaw in my beta programming was that I believed in the word "equal" and never stood for the unequal treatment I received from women.

                I fucking wish the betas would see reason though. I didn't need much to wake up, they should have the fucking cojones to see it too.

                [–]teiman 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                I like how I am, if thats not something that get me pussy, so be it. Womens are complicated and perhaps I am better alone that with one of these chemical factories around. I mean, how much I am willing to sacrifice for pussy? I think about nothing.

                [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                There is a fine difference between standards and expectations. My goal is to set a standard that only the very best version of myself can achieve. If I fail to ever reach that point, it's my fault. From this perspective a trp man should be building himself up.

                I have expectations too... who couldn't? The reason why I am here is because I expected something better than the current western culture when it comes to the sexual marketplace. My expectations weren't met because they weren't correctly calibrated with reality. Now they are, but that doesn't mean that I like what I see. My new expectations don't include things like true love, commitment or loyalty from a woman. So my version of building myself up does not take into account anything a woman will claim to offer along these lines in the future.

                [–][deleted]  (11 children)

                [deleted]

                  [–]exuals 15 points16 points  (0 children)

                  OKCupid statistics I believe.

                  [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 8 points9 points  (4 children)

                  http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/your-looks-and-online-dating/

                  "As you can see from the gray line, women rate an incredible 80% of guys as worse-looking than medium."

                  Another fascinating fact, looking at the multicoloured graphs towards the bottom of the link, is that top 20% men get a disproportionally low response rate from unattractive women. For men messaging the least attractive women, the most attractive men get the lowest response rate. There is an actual response-rate inversion happening here. (Same happens with women to men, but less pronounced).

                  The peak response rate is very attractive men messaging slightly less than average women.

                  I don't doubt their graphs, but bear in mind there are skewing factors: unknown gender ratio, media "women are wonderful" bias, etc. Especially take their conclusions with a pinch of salt, but it's absolutely fascinating.

                  [–]Mr_Andry 3 points4 points  (3 children)

                  I think there's a good reason for this, and it's not that "women have absurdly high standards".

                  Remember the "attractive person bias". When you are attractive, people tend to assume you are nice, intelligent, self-confident, successful, etc.

                  Yes, women like good looking guys, but they are more driven by men's behavior than their looks. An alpha doesn't have to be handsome, he has to behave like an alpha.

                  Therefor, once a man's appearance hits that "attractive" rating, women start assuming he has the personality traits that she is drawn toward. Slightly better than average is not enough for her to start making assumptions. It requires a certain threshold of attractiveness.

                  As for the response rate, that's probably a bit more complicated. Attractive women have more experience with alphas and are more likely to assume negative things about them, despite the fact that they are good looking. Average women are still yearning for more alpha cock. That sort of thing.

                  [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 1 point2 points  (2 children)

                  I think there's a good reason for this, and it's not that "women have absurdly high standards" ... "attractive" rating, women start assuming he has the personality traits that she is drawn toward.

                  I think the point that you're making is that the halo effect for men makes her believe he has the other behavioural attributes that she is attracted to.

                  I disagree that this is the main factor at play. I think women are just programmed to respond to way-above-average men, that only the top men will do. The others - she'd rather just do without. There is no 0-10 scale for her, there is only the 80% that are "below" her and the 20% above, so that's where she sees the average point to be.

                  I have another theory that whereas men are attracted to nice-face OR big-tits OR nice-ass, women are only atttracted to nice-face AND nice pecs AND good money AND social status AND confidence.

                  Hard to tell though, women lie and hamster about this stuff more than almost anything else.

                  Yes, women like good looking guys, but they are more driven by men's behavior than their looks.

                  They are much more driven by looks than they are prepared to admit or that the world will acknowledge.

                  Attractive women have more experience with alphas and are more likely to assume negative things about them...

                  Yet the most attractive men are more attractive to the most attractive women. It's the less attractive women that have a strong alpha-aversion.

                  [–]Mr_Andry 4 points5 points  (1 child)

                  there is only the 80% that are "below" her and the 20% above, so that's where she sees the average point to be.

                  That's only true online, where women have nothing else to judge by. In person, an average looking guy with great game/self-confidence can bat way above his apparent league.

                  Yet the most attractive men are more attractive to the most attractive women. It's the less attractive women that have a strong alpha-aversion.

                  Ah, I read your original statements incorrectly there. Looks like there is a "this must be a scam" assumption that is taking over more strongly in women than men.

                  [–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                  Mr_Andry... love the nick :)

                  Looks like there is a "this must be a scam" assumption that is taking over more strongly in women than men.

                  Women are more pessimistic. My guess is that these women figure there is zero chance to keep the guy around for long. Still, the effect is there both ways round.

                  [–]Nullberri 17 points18 points  (1 child)

                  http://oktrends.okcupid.com/ one of their blogs covered it pretty well. I'm sure there's more studies out there on this.

                  [–]i_forget_my_userids 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                  I always thought it was interesting that black men rated the same across all races, but black women overwhelmingly preferred black men...even throughout all years with data.

                  [–]PedroIsWatching 5 points6 points  (2 children)

                  The most commonly cited stat is findings that OKcupid have published about their userbase, both informally on their blog and I think in book form.

                  OKC also proved through studying their users' habits that virtually all men on the platform (across all age groups) are interested in the same thing - women aged 18-25.

                  [–]BetterRedThanRed 13 points14 points  (0 children)

                  just switching the sexes on it

                  This is still as good as it can get for someone who is plugged in. At least she did not blame men, but thinks that men are basically just like women.

                  Of course she has no idea that even a 9/10 man gets less attention than a 6/10 woman.

                  [–]TimeHoTraveler 17 points18 points  (0 children)

                  They amount to little more than blaming the victim.

                  We aren't victims. We're men.

                  Victimhood is for women and weaklings.

                  [–]1thiasus 8 points9 points  (2 children)

                  "Victim" of what? Of an evolutionarily successful strategy that made the females of our species prefer mates that were physically superior and socially capable?

                  The only victimhood is that to victim complexes, and it's largely self-inflicted.

                  [–]throwaway1643 3 points4 points  (1 child)

                  Yeah, exactly, there's no victim here and if any it's entirely self-inflicted. There's no point blaming women for acting like this, just like there's no point blaming a spider for spinning silk.

                  [–]Modredpillschool 35 points36 points  (4 children)

                  Female solipsism in this one:

                  I imagine they're looking solely for women within the league of perfection that they think they're in when they are not in fact actually in that league.

                  They would actually blame a guy who can't get a response on tinder for having too high of standards.

                  Think about this one for a second and see if that passes the moron-test.

                  Guy has zero options to pick from, but is apparently rejecting applicants from this invisible pool because he has too high of standards.

                  [–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

                  The amount of mental gymnastics it takes to be able to even conceive something like that would put 15 year old russian olympians to shame.

                  [–]deprecated 6 points7 points  (2 children)

                  This wasn't my take at all. The message (at least from what I read) seems to be: Guys are not presenting a SMV proposition equal to that which they are seeking. If they were, they would be getting responses. That's how the SMP works.

                  They then make very RP observations that account for the low SMV they are seeing: guys are too fat, guys don't groom/keep themselves, guys are boring, guys are assholes (not in the good way.) Most then concede that girls do the same thing.

                  I don't see that thread as feminist hamstering at all, rather a surprisingly valid reflection of RP principles.

                  [–]TRP VanguardCyralea 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                  That's rather disingenuous. Fat, boring, obnoxious women can get responses from men online without any effort. Attractive men too.

                  Men who aren't in the top 20th percentile, and especially those hovering around or below the median, do not get responses at all. How are these men not offering an equal proposition when by all accounts women of significantly lower SMV are doing better than them?

                  [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                  Meh, you don't have to run faster than the bear, you only have to run faster than the guy next to you sometimes.

                  Self improvement aside. If you're not getting matches on tinder, it's because in a brief snapshot, you're perceived SMV is lower than other men in your local area. I was in a middle eastern country recently, I was getting 10 matches a day. Here in the states? At this rate, 1 match a week.

                  Same pictures, same guy, different men I was being compared to.

                  [–]1MajorMid 39 points40 points  (2 children)

                  Love the chicks saying "So what you are 6 feet tall, make 100k, and are good looking? What else do you bring to the table aside from not being a loser?"

                  Umm...what does ANY woman bring to the table aside her pussy? It's scary how blind to what they are saying women can be. Even a 1/10 male almost always will "bring more to the table" than a 9 out of 10 woman. Think about it. Even the weakest and shittiest of males automatically walks down the street physically superior to 99 percent of all women. And when you take into account how fucking boring and uninteresting 99 percent of all women are he probably is more interesting than they are.

                  So that 6 foot guy making 100k? He brings more to the table than 99 percent of the worlds women just by "not being a loser". But 4 out of 10 Sally who REALLY brings nothing "to the table" aside from her mitsubishi with 150k miles of a pussy thinks hes not good enough for her. Definition of hamster.

                  [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                  actually I disagree, respectfully. at least what I've noticed is in the younger age bracket that you have a significant number of girls who are stronger, taller, and more confident than many of the males their same age, due to environmental contaminants and psycho-social factors. Physical superiority is by no means a male dominated area like it once was for this age group, and I don't like making that statement

                  [–]markfeel 17 points18 points  (7 children)

                  I liked this comment

                  Men are single and can't get dates because they don't approach women (like they are expected to do - again, not really fair, but generally assumed that they are the ones to approach) and ask them out.

                  This, this is a big reason why so many (mostly younger, 16-24 I'd say) men never go on dates. I'm nothing special but I got a solid 8 going crazy for me without doing anything. So I'm out with her and she tells me she's never even been on a fucking date before. I'm 80th percentile at best, but apparently that's all it takes to get young chicks when all the guys around her are too intimidated and socially inept to even ask these girls on a date. Even in my beta days, I asked 7s out and they said yes without hesitation.

                  [–]BetterRedThanRed 14 points15 points  (0 children)

                  Yes!

                  Too many guys here can not tell the difference between PUA and redpill. Usually, it is enough to just ask a girl out. Either she is attracted to you or she isn't. You can not negotiate this anyways. No need for PUA tricks. And redpill is not PUA tricks, either.

                  Redpill simply explains the dynamics between the genders.

                  Why doesn't being nice get you laid?

                  Why do even average women think they deserve to marry a 9/10 man?

                  Why is it harder for young men (16-24) than for older men (25-35)?

                  Or even simple things like: Why do girls prefer a 10/10 to a 5/10 like myself?

                  Redpill answers these questions. Redpill is not "pretend that you do not care and then HB10 want your dick".

                  [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                  I tested this in Europe, my wingman, a former body builder with exotic dark looks, and me, an underweight Daniel Radcliffe lookalike, would approach groups of girls and just talk to them.

                  We were with a larger group already so we only occasionally venture out when the party ended early.

                  The first night we walked into this bar that was dead empty, except for 3 HBs (6,7,8). He ended up getting taken back to the 7's apartment and I ended up dancing with the 8, however the 6 came and clam jammed me. Set my sights too high. However, these 3 girls were the first and only girls we approached that night and they ended up taking us to a club.

                  2nd night, approached three 8's and asked them for directions to an ice cream shop. Ended up us inviting ourselves to go with them to a beach party. Things didn't pan out so we went to a nearby bar and then hung out just us 5 drinking on the beach.

                  Either way, we didn't buy these chicks drink or do shit other than talk to, dance with, and be interesting.

                  We were 100% successful in our two measly attempts at approaching girls I consider hotter than I could ever get at home. (there was a third in between but they were butt ugly and we called that a warmup going into the approach).

                  Point is, get yourself out there, talk to girls, talk to HOT ones. Can't win if you don't play.

                  [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (2 children)

                  You should see how much those pussy bitches over at /askmen wail and complain about how "women need to step up and ask out guys more"

                  You've got to be fucking kidding me.

                  [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                  That's such a young guy response. I hear it too, and I just respond "welcome to Earth. Play the rules or get off at the next stop".

                  [–]DildoFire 8 points9 points  (0 children)

                  Why is everyone acting like this is some kind of new knowledge about the inner workings of the female brain? Women are attracted to hot guys and men are attracted to hot girls. Unattractive women have much higher standards than ugly men since they get hit on everyday by all sorts of ugly and boring dudes.

                  If you were getting hit on by all the dogs in the world every freaking day only the best dogs will do.

                  [–]deprecated 51 points52 points  (14 children)

                  I guess I'll be the contrarian here.

                  I think this is a very informative thread, well worth quick read. It shows that girls aren't quite the idiots some here really wish/believe they are. They get it too. From the (very brief) read of the top voted comments (I'm not going to read them all) the chief complaints seem to be 1) these guys are too fat 2) these guys don't take care of themselves and/or don't put an effort in to looking good 3) these guys are boring 4) these guys are assholes (and not in the alpha interesting kind of way.)

                  I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to understand that women want from men similar attributes as those men want from women, in particular: 1) be in shape (lift, or cardio for women) 2) look your best (dress/groom well) 3) be interesting (do cool stuff) 4) don't be a dick/bitch (not the "alpha asshole" but "bitter beta" kind of dick.) These seem all very well in line with RP thinking, if not plain common sense.

                  I don't think this is hamstering at all. They're just laying it out the way it is, just like we do here. Yeah, girls don't like loser betas bitches. Guys don't like fat whale deluded snowflakes. Girls want hot interesting guys. Guys want hot interesting girls. Both can be prone to overestimate their SMV and not put in the required effort to be high value. How is this new or shocking?

                  This post strikes me as an overtly whiney beta bitch shit post. There seems to be a lot of "Da feminists told me the feels are sooooo important but look! They just like to fuck hawt guys! OMFG they're so hamstering! AWALT! Baaah!" around here lately. This is not rocket science folks.

                  [–]magus678 32 points33 points  (0 children)

                  Anyone who doesn't think RP has moments of its own hamster are deluding themselves

                  [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (8 children)

                  Be in shape and look your best ignores the important of the non-changeable physical attributes, like face, height, bone structure.

                  [–]deprecated 5 points6 points  (6 children)

                  Not true. Whatever your physical attributes, you can always get in shape and look your best. You can also be really interesting and do cool, fun things. And you can not be a dick. You can also learn game. There's lots you can do, whatever your physical attributes, to maximize your SMV.

                  [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (5 children)

                  Sure you can maximize, but that may never be enough.

                  I already am at the limits of how good I can look. But I am small, most women have larger hands and feet than me because I was born premature. On top of this my face isn't very good.

                  I do interesting and cool things, but women aren't going to give a fuck if you aren't passing their looks threshold. "Game" is a lie.

                  This redpill optimism is really just bluepillism. You've replaced one bluepill for another.

                  [–]deprecated 6 points7 points  (1 child)

                  Enough for what?

                  If you are an outlier with respect to physical attributes, i.e. you have birth defects or otherwise some kind of physical abnormality or deformity, then yes, you are playing a tough hand. Nothing will change that. No amount of lifting/grooming/attire/game will make you Brad Pitt (or whoever is the consummate "hawt guy" is these days) and RP doesn't promise that.

                  But these principles will maximize your potential to be whoever you can be. Look at Nick Vujicic.

                  The real point of RP is to live life on your terms, not someone else's, and approach the world from an honest and accurate frame of reference. It doesn't promise an absolute endpoint.

                  But I would agree with you, there has been of late an emergent dogmatic socialization of RP "principles" that rivals the bullshit being spewed from their feminist counterparts. That was the purpose of my original post, to call OP out on this kind of crap, before RP turns (as you observe) into just another bluepill hamster cage for men.

                  [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                  If you were a billionaire, do you think more women would want to fuck you? If yes, and you are not a billionaire, then you`re not at your SMV maximum.

                  Are you at a disadvantage? Yes. There is no point denying that. But life is not fair and you have to play with the cards you were dealt.

                  And ask yourself if you would rather be your lazy slob self. He wouldnt have a chance with a 5. You can probably get a 7?

                  Face: Is surgery an option? I know a guy who had his entire chin restructured (but he was in his teen when the operation was done).

                  Redpill isnt about optimism. It is about reality. Try to be at your best.

                  [–]Jordoom 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                  This is pretty accurate. What has happened is this sub and the manosphere in general has overgeneralized, and in doing so, has demonized the Beta.

                  The Beta is not the snivelling cur. He is the Alpha-in-Waiting. The only thing that presents the Beta from being the Alpha is the existence of the Alpha. Think to the Lion King: Scar was the Beta and Mufasa was the Alpha. Then, Simba asserts himself as the new Alpha. Alpha/beta aren't 100% immutable and set in stone, on some level, it is relative, a comparison, not a taxonomy.

                  Anyway, most men on this sub are probably Betas (talking about this stuff even semi-regularly is a little effeminate, guys.) But the Beta has been so misconstrued that many have just subbed Red Pill-ism as their new Blue Pill, rather than accept that they (we) are most likely Betas.

                  [–][deleted]  (2 children)

                  [deleted]

                    [–]deprecated 7 points8 points  (1 child)

                    Exactly. But these do not appear to be feminists, and they do not to be hamstering. These are seemingly normal girls saying straight-up what it is they want.

                    However, everyone here seems to be suggesting that these are feminists who are hamstering, and "accidentally validate" RP principles in the process. This, to me, is a disingenuous characterization of the thread in question, meant only to serve the "victim" mindset that has taken root here on TRP.

                    Why are we admonishing one of the few honest discussions by women of what it is they really want?

                    [–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (1 child)

                    deleted What is this?

                    [–]Sdom1 17 points18 points  (3 children)

                    Universal rule of thumb for women and men:

                    If you aren't interested in any of the people who are interested in you, you either need to lower your standards or raise your game. Period, end of story.

                    A great way to start is to figure out your biggest flaw and see what can be done about it. Fat? Lose weight. Scrawny? Lift. Are people initially interested but seem to fade out? Figure out what you're doing to cause that, because in the end, the only common denominator in your life is you.

                    [–]MazeMouse 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                    the only common denominator in your life is you.

                    Not only in relationships but in EVERYTHING!

                    [–]jvosh1 8 points9 points  (0 children)

                    Same shit, different day.

                    We really know nothing of these women of why they are making demands, but as red pill men we can assume they are pretty average with a few hotties and fatties sprinkled in. Now ask the same women as they approach the wall and see how they change their tune.

                    No woman is worth your dignity. Women are a depreciating asset. Always qualify them, as the saying goes, you are the prize. AWALT but some women are better than others. Know yourself and know your goals, and never forget there are like 3.5 billion women on this earth. Enough to go around!

                    [–]CSMastermind 6 points7 points  (0 children)

                    I think that guys don't realize that being above average doesn't mean shit. You need to be in the top 10-15% of men to get laid regularly. All women think they deserve a top man. And to help their delusion, they get that dude for a night. But they don't get his commitment.

                    [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                    The girl's self aware, high school story really does hammer in how painful it can be to be a sexless man. She's trying to point out that she ignored some options so that must mean guys are too. I get that.

                    But when I was at my lowest point, I had one, maybe two women at most as options to attempt for a relationship in 2 to 3 year period.

                    [–]ScottishIslander 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                    Women want the top 20% of men and they will chase this top 20% until they approach the wall (age 30) and want to have children, at which point those who are unsuccessful will be begin lowering their standards. They'll get that ring on their finger and as long as their man maintains a status they are happy with they will stay loyal. But if that man's status drops below her own she will start to wonder and start to wander.

                    Women don't care about a stable man with an amazing career as much as you'd think.

                    They care about a man who looks good. They care about a man who takes care of his body. They care about the man who is fun and teasing and gives them tingles.

                    Yeah it's not fair. In fact it's fucking bogus. Women are so choosy they think they deserve the best when often times there's nothing special about themselves.

                    What's the solution then if you are not in the top 20% genetically? Work on yourself. Work on talking to women. Work on becoming an interesting person. Work on being an expert in your career no matter what it is. Lift. Be outcome independent. Be confident. Be happy with yourself as a single man. Women come and go. It's really not that important.

                    Also don't chase incredibly hot women. The world has been handed to them and they are never satisfied. Find a woman of average beauty who has a particular characteristic you like, if you want an LTR

                    [–]DreamBoatGuy25 4 points5 points  (1 child)

                    That entire thread is just them projecting their own situation. Everything from them overrating their attractiveness and not even considering guys that indicate interest as potential partners to having high standards for a partner but thinking they only need to bring the bare minimum to the table.

                    It's truly hilarious to me how women project their own worldview onto everyone else. One of their biggest downfalls is that they think that because they are attracted to social status and income that men are also, so they spend their 20's working their way up the college and career ladder thinking that they are improving their attractiveness, but they fail to recognize that the gender's are different and are attracted to different things. So they come out the other end with a masters degree, dump their current bf if he isn't higher status or projected to be higher status than her at that point, and then walk around wondering why no one wants to fuck their shiny new masters degree in useless bullshit.

                    [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                    My plate was like this. A 36 year old doctor. Every day I showed I wouldn't commit, she'd hamster away how she knows she isn't the hot super skinny young she use to be, but she was a great catch! But she'll show me someday how awesome she is and I'm missing out!

                    Truth is, she was terrible at sex. Thought she was being unique by sucking my balls instead of my dick for blowjobs. Also she had that mental block where she wouldn't loosen up until like an hour of foreplay.

                    I tried to tell her guys don't give a shit about how well your professional life is going, becoming better in bed is a easy way to keep a guy. Especially if you're that old and have nothing to show for it other than your career.

                    [–]1kick6 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                    A lot of guys overestimate how good looking they are. I think it is because there are so many shows where the chubby funny guy has a supermodel wife. Girls do this too.

                    Translation: "I take my social queues from trash media, men must to."

                    Oh projection...

                    [–]watersign 3 points4 points  (1 child)

                    TL;DR if you aren't chad..you're fucked

                    [–]Silverbacked 4 points5 points  (1 child)

                    A lot of guys overestimate how good looking they are.

                    In the book Datatclysm, the author shows pretty conclusively that, while men are excellent at judging physical attractiveness in women, women are terrible at judging it in men. They rate nearly 70% of men as "below average" in physical appearance.

                    This is pretty clearly a biological adaptation. Women bear almost the sole biological cost of reproduction and infant care (men can't lactate). As a result a cautious strategy, accepting a higher rate of false negatives (thinking a guy has worse genes than he does); is preferable to absorbing the costs of a false positive (thinking a guy has better genes than he does).

                    [–]Kalepsis 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                    I actually laughed out loud at this gem:

                    "I've also noticed a lot of those guys list the bare minimum traits as if they're amazing things to have (e.g., "I'm a nice guy", "I have a stable job", etc.), which suggests to me they think women should flock to them just because they're not a total loser. They fail to see that people want more than just the bare minimum."

                    I know plenty of alpha-type men who are very rarely turned down, even though they aren't nice guys and don't have stable jobs. The things she describes are not bare minimum for sex, they're bare minimum for marriage... For that BB guy with whom she will eventually settle, after riding the dick of every Chad she can find while young and pretty. Take note, gentlemen, be the opposite of everything they "want" and you will get what you want.

                    [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                    Lol @ anything ask women. Anytime I post there, my posts get downvoted to hell.

                    [–]AmericanHistoryAFBB 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                    I up-voted when you made that PetCo joke. Good post.

                    [–]1Anti-Hubbard 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                    I knew a self-professed 'incel' who whined endlessly about no women wanting him ever, a day after I asked him out. Women below a certain level of attractiveness are completely in their blind spot. Thank god I passed on that.

                    Double take

                    ...I asked him out... Thank god I passed on that.

                    3 sentences and the hamster has spun the wheel all the way around.

                    [–]IronMeltsinmyHands 4 points5 points  (2 children)

                    You're not a terribly good prospect if your only redeeming quality is that you're not an asshole.

                    Why even bother to be nice? It's not a redeeming quality to be well mannered and treat bitches like people.

                    [–]NecroticFury 15 points16 points  (1 child)

                    women don't know what they have because its never been taken from them

                    [–]2 Senior Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 9 points10 points  (0 children)

                    When they hit 40 they find out the hard way, or if they gain weight. Still though, there's always some schmuck out there desperate enough to fuck her and devote his existence to her.

                    [–]jayhovaasmywitness 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                    This reads like a Buzzfeed article. You guys already know this, what's the point of taking some post on the internet and using it to prove a point you "prove" every damn day

                    [–]Eris17 1 point2 points  (2 children)

                    "The common women wants an Alpha". Ipso facto, Alphas are the common people.

                    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                    YOU ARE GOOD ENOUGH.

                    Modern women raised as princesses where their parents spend all their retirement money on them is one reason why the entitlement is off the roof.

                    Think about it. Her parents are broke with no retirement so princess can live as one. Do you think princess will settle for a decent man with a job? HELL NO! She is sponsored by two retards who will curse themselves everyday when they are old and broke and she's not helping them.

                    Back in the 50's parents would never spoil their daughters like that.

                    Times have changed and no job is good enough for princess. That's the takeaway here. Unless you are a millionaire you are broke to her.

                    Save your cash guys, invest it and plate women. The tides will turn but it will take a hard recession and more poverty for them to re-align their expectations.

                    Bottom line: 90% of girls 18-28 need to eat shit (being poor) for at least 5 years before they are LTR worthy. Forget marriage that's a con job and she will take your cash with the help of greedy lawyers.

                    [–]DarrenLB76 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                    These are the same type of women who endlessly obsess about 'equality' yet at the same time will brutally arrange men into a hierarchy.

                    [–]iSnORtcHuNkz69 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                    .

                    TL;DR: Women absolutely despise betas and won't come within 3 feet of them. Despite constantly talking about how much a good personality matters, how much they value guys who are nice and considerate, etc... they will drop their panties in an instant for a muscular confident alpha.

                    "3ft of them is the distance they calculate your dick in their vagina"

                    [–]ConfirmedCynic 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                    It's because he's not primal enough.

                    Succinct and true. But civilization has been built by beta men. If women only want to breed with alphas and just use betas as ATMs and cuckolds, what does it say for the future? Back to swords and serfs.

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