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MGTOWDating girls does not equal happiness (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by Yonski3

A few months ago I decided to try something new in my life: to abstain from dating any girls for a while and to see what will happen.

Like most men - from a very young age - the chase/seducing/meeting new girls and maintaining current ones were the main focus of my life. Sure I had other things going on but also those things - like going to the gym/making money/places I lived - all of those were also close linked to me meeting girls and becoming better at it.

From pure biological view point it makes perfect sense - our genes main purpose during life is to reproduce themselves as much as possible.

This is why when you get a girl and end up having sex/having a good time with her - there Is a small (and very fleeting) pleasure that reward you for your time and trouble.

The nature of that pleasure (the genes are smart) Is to fleet quickly so you will seek it again and again and by that spreading your genes more and more.

And this is how we get stuck in this maze of constantly seeking for the "cheese" at the end of the maze again and again and again.

But if we choose to stop for a second and look at this process - we discover that the amount of actual pleasure and happiness we are getting from this blind process is much smaller then all the suffering/pain/stress that this is causing us.

it's like digging up an endless hole in the ground seeking a treasure we will never find.

With this understanding - I have looked at life and realized that the chase just doesn't make sense if I want to live a life of joy and happiness.

so I deleted my tinder, stoped looking at girls at public seeking their attention, talking to them, chasing them , etc etc, and basically just started doing my own shit and to see what will happen.

results? stress levels went down, anxiety went down - happiness went up, inner core became stronger.

Does that mean I am going to abstain from dating girls for the rest of my life? probably not. but it certainly takes the pressure, importance and sense of urgency out of it.


[–]Modredpillschool[M] [score hidden] stickied comment (67 children)

On the flip side, when your veins are pumping testosterone, it's close to impossible to ignore the call of nature. For many (myself included) this means requiring me to fulfill my evolutionary duty to spread my seed in order to find happiness. And there's nothing wrong with that. If man wasn't built with this drive, our species would have died out long ago.

Don't make up excuses because you're stressed about not getting laid.

[–]BowlOfCandy 78 points79 points  (28 children)

Monk mode is a great phase to engage. You acquire a natural abundance mentality purely by disconnecting & resetting yourself - you channel a patience and discipline that really grounds you. Self improvement is a breeze.

But monk mode only lasts so long - on the order of 6-24 months.

As it subsides make sure to keep an eye on your motivation - be present and aware of your real-time experience. Women, as much of a pain in the ass they are, have a biological influence of keeping us sharp. Their hypergamy drives us to compete in dominance hierarchies - competition with other men to be the best.

When you take women out of the equation you'll need to source your motivation from elsewhere. Chasing/fucking women is like a drug - your hormones keep you hooked to it when you're on it. When you disassociate from it and break free from the addiction, your hormones slow down. You reach a point where you can pride yourself on not giving a shit about women - because literally you don't. It's liberating.

You'll have more time, and you'll have more resources. You'll buy all the toys and gadgets you want, and you'll spend more time on the hobbies you enjoy.

But it's never enough, you'll notice something doesn't feel right. You'll feel a boredom - it confuses you and scares you. You keep filling your life with shit you tell yourself matters, you'll proceed with your routines.

At this point one of two paths will happen:

  1. You continue down the path of your routines and your MGTOW lifestyle. Your motivation continues to bleed, you let yourself go. You continue to search for a purpose. Having more money doesn't satisfy you - you perpetually chase activities in attempts of achieving fulfillment.

  2. One night you go out being social with your friends. Your mindset of abundance will attract a hot girl you weren't even looking for, or maybe you run into an ex. You'll fuck for the first time in a long time - and it will be one of the easiest lays because you genuinely didn't try at all. You'll feel like a king that night.

When 2 happens, you'll notice something strange about yourself. The hormones start raging up - you're hornier and start thinking about sex more often. You notice your motivation climb - something went off in your psyche and it feels good. You'll fantasize about women again - all of a sudden you give a shit. It may anger or confuse you, or you could even feel ashamed of it - you feel like you lost all the "progress".

What happened is you've re-engaged your biology. You're back to competing in the dominance hierarchies. You're face to face with your biological purpose - the evolutionary destiny that is procreation.

What are you gonna do then? Go back to MGTOW? Or are you going to respond to your biology?

I'm trying to figure out the answer to that myself.

[–]grewapair 14 points15 points  (11 children)

What I've found is that the only thing I've gotten out of relationships is the extra effort I put into my life trying to entertain the girl. For example, I might plan and pay for a fantastic vacation for the two of us that she did literally nothing for. Didn't plan, didn't pay for, didn't do shit.

Then I think about how much better my life is when I have a girlfriend. But it was all from me, not one iota from her.

There's a sort of repeating joke on here that women think your money is "our money" and her money is "her money". But they think that about everything. "You exist to make "us" happy, while I exist to make only me happy" is their mindset. It's exactly the same way they think about money, but no one ever figures it's how they think about everything.

If you're a billion percent better looking than the other men they can get, I'm sure they'd work hard to keep you, but if you're an average guy, that means dating down into the uglies. Not worth it any way you slice it for an average guy. If you can make it into the top 20% great. If not, it's hard to justify the time and money.

[–]BowlOfCandy 2 points3 points  (6 children)

Each of your paragraphs is a different topic, loosely strung together under a theme of "women just wait at the finish line, women are solipsitic, women aren't worth the trouble".

You can learn how to play with fire, but there's really no point in complaining about the fact that fire can burn you.

[–]grewapair 8 points9 points  (5 children)

No. My point is women will add very little to your life unless you date down. What you get from a girl is the fact that you push yourself harder to please her, which does make your life better, while she herself will add very little to your life unless you date down.

When I think back about what I've gotten out of my relationships, everything has come from me. Everything.

So you really don't need the girl, other than as a source of motivation. Once you realize that, you just motivate yourself. At that point, they provide almost no benefit at all.

[–]The_Noble_Lie 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Sounds like like you had toxic relationships / partners?

[–]grewapair 6 points7 points  (1 child)

30 years of them? I mean, you can flip a quarter 10,000 times and they can all come up tails, but what are the odds?

[–]The_Noble_Lie -1 points0 points  (0 children)

How many girls we talking? 100? Really? 10,000? Give a number and lets talk real odds accounting for social brainwashing and selection bias

[–]BowlOfCandy 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Try dating women that come from more traditional cultures - Eastern European women for example.

Expect you to be the man, they know their place as the woman. Cook, clean, they scoff at feminism. Still hypergamous and solipsistic (AWALT), but you can be more at ease because they haven't been corrupted by Marxist ideas.

[–]rainbowstalin1234 0 points1 point  (0 children)

soudns like grewapair needs to stop masturbating and travel.

[–][deleted]  (3 children)

[deleted]

    [–]whimsyNena 1 point2 points  (2 children)

    Just remember you train people how to treat you. If this woman is doing these things and you're not speaking up about it, but instead rewarding her behavior by spoiling her you don't have anyone to blame but yourself.

    I don't have any good advice for you on how to rectify this in your relationship and it's not my place to tell you what to do, so you can do what you want with that bit of information.

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]whimsyNena 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      That's another thing to watch out for. Be mad, feel however you need to, but never let her see that she can make you mad. It makes her feel like she's in control of you and if she can't get anything else from you, she'll purposely piss you off. Keep your cool, be apathetic, but also be firm when something isn't acceptable.

      [–]kealh 6 points7 points  (5 children)

      this is the position I am in right now. I've spent 2 months of this year chasing girls to no avail. I feel defeated and unwanted. It's all I've been thinking about. I started to stop engaging women in a sexual manner but in a friendly manner. I don't ask them out. I mainly focus on improving my conversational skills. But it gets so boring very quickly and I can't help but to be in a state of indifferent. I feel something is wrong and I can't help but to face how shitty it feels. Inadequate. Depleted. Empty and Frustrated.

      I do have goals, I do work on myself, and I am nowhere near to being successful with women. Sometimes I feel like giving up. What am I missing?

      Let me know if you find that answer. Because I'd like to know to.

      [–]rainbowstalin1234 7 points8 points  (2 children)

      I know what you are missing. To find it, you need to stop masturbating AND watching porn for AT LEAST 90 days. but, I bet you and 95% of the readers wont do it, or try to rationalise not doing it. its up to you though. I found the answer through it, maybe you can too. . .or not. up to you really.

      [–]kealh 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      I already have tried that and I'm better off than I was before.

      [–]tolerantman 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      I got to day 72, didn't change anything but made me extremely horny.

      I now fap once a week, keep that T rising but won't be a distraction.

      [–]NotMyBestEffort 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      What you and your actions are doing is a lie. Lies this big are obvious. When attraction exists, anything other than acting attracted to her is a lie. Pretending you don't think she's hot is weak. Pretending that she is hotter than she is... weak.

      Be strong enough to find comfort in the awkwardness of sexuality between the sexes.

      [–]tolerantman 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      People here at TRP often forget to mention that if you don't have the looks, no mount of 'game' will ever get you laid, at least not with hot women. There are men out there who can create an online profile and have 10 new girls sending them messages each day, girls who are into them even before they get "gamed". I think the anonymous nature of forums makes people ignore how important looks and status really are since we assume everyone here looks the same and have the same social position.

      [–]Ezaar 4 points5 points  (2 children)

      Thank you for posting this.

      [–]BowlOfCandy 3 points4 points  (1 child)

      It's essentially what /u/redpillschool said in his stickied comment, albeit he did it in a more succinct and direct way. I decided to write a story about it.

      [–]Ezaar 3 points4 points  (0 children)

      Indeed. Your expression gave way to more thought rather than having a face value description.

      Nuance and brevity at its finest.

      [–]evolveto 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Very well described. Ran into ex, was easiest lay and boom, felt all progress was lost.

      [–]indigenoushorizons 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      I really want to start fucking, but fucking is the exact reason why I do not want to start.

      MGTOW or Biology? -- your comment should be archived. You summed it up beautifully.

      [–]rcwhitaker 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Isaac newton prided himself in having spent his life celibate and yet he's inarguably one of the most accomplished men of all time.

      Elon Musk on the other hand says he can't stand to be without a woman at night, but again, pretty majorly accomplished dude.

      My thinking is that the issue is more complicated, as i know Elon had serious childhood trauma and newton was completely antisocial. It is interesting that he didn't bear any children, really a profound sacrifice to pride imo.

      In Newton's case, my guess is that his being antisocial was a necessary prerequisite to spending his life in study. I imagine he found other people's weakness to be infectious.

      Elon seems to need it more because he's deeply scared of being without it, again likely due to something unconsciously born in childhood.

      For us mortals, maybe the thing to do is to come and go as we see needed for our own sanity and survivability. I don't think either route is without its opportunities and pitfalls.

      [–]TheHustlingWizard 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Amen brother. Anyone who says money buys happiness has never had money. I think our biology will always win. We don't want to be filthy rich and die lonely. I'd like to spend my dying years with family and loved ones. Not thinking about my accomplishments while looking at my Rolex.

      [–][deleted] 204 points205 points  (50 children)

      I went 8 months; no dating, no sex. Just goals, purpose, and self-development. Every man needs to go through a period like this. It should be a modern right of passage.

      [–][deleted]  (28 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]ThePewZ 191 points192 points  (14 children)

        I know this is an attempt to be funny, but he has a point. When you aren't successful with women it's all you can think about, when you are successful - you see how overrated it all is and you can properly devote yourself to self-improvement. Just my opinion.

        [–]Yonski3[S] 77 points78 points  (1 child)

        When you aren't successful with women it's all you can think about, when you are successful - you see how overrated it all is and you can properly devote yourself to self-improvement.

        you described it perfectly.

        [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Another way to put it: Pussy is like oxygen. When you have plenty, you don't think about it much. When you have none, finding some becomes very important, very quickly.

        Edit: I don't mean that you should stick with a problem woman. Just that there's nothing wrong with going out and getting laid to clear your head now and then. Then get back to whatever useful thing you were doing.

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (10 children)

        I can see that. But then we have to define what it mean to be "successful with women". Before I went through my journey I wouldn't call myself successful by any stretch of the imagination. The little females I did manage to get dicked me around and took advantage of me. Emotionally I was in a place where I looked to women to validate me. I took this time off primarily to get better with women. I sacrificed 8 months for better years down the line.

        If you are an incel. Then that may be a different story. I can't really speak on that.

        [–]Uncommon_Commoner 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Receiving and enjoying validation from women isn’t a bad thing, it feels great when receiving it from someone and that’s perfectly normal. Everyone desires to be validated to some degree, it’s built into our DNA. It’s the cesspools of neediness that will cause extreme disappointment and despair. No one should require validation from anyone or anything, personal validation is all that matters and that is discovered from within.

        [–]goober_boobz 5 points6 points  (7 children)

        Success with women is a variable term. Women are the gatekeepers of relationship success. A relationship can't be successful unless a woman is happy in it. If a man is unhappy in his relationship, but a woman is happy, the relationship is successful by default. However, women can't have meaningful relationships without men. Many women I know hate dealing with other women. ALOT of women I know are bisexual or full on lesbian, which makes me wonder how a woman who spends half her time chasing the same sex ever has time to understand men at all, let alone develop a meaningful relationship and career. A woman can't be happy with one man (or woman), knowing there is another man (or woman) out there of higher social status or more attractive looks to benefit from, while simultaneously pushing the notion of female independence.

        [–]alphabachelor 7 points8 points  (6 children)

        Women are the gatekeepers of sex, men are the gatekeepers of relationships.

        FTFY.

        [–]goober_boobz 0 points1 point  (5 children)

        Ahh, but are women the gatekeepers of successful sex?

        [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (4 children)

        Nah, when a women allow herself to have sex with you she is yielding to your control. You are penetrating her. Whether the sex is "successful" is up to you. No matter how you cut it. If you judge sex being successful on whether she squirts on not. It would behoove you to learn how to a get a girl to that point.

        [–]goober_boobz 5 points6 points  (3 children)

        I'd much rather stay MGTOW but thanks for the cuckggestions.

        [–]TheHandsomeMF 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        upvote just because of the "cuckggestion" word. lmao

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        Cuckggestion? That's actually funny.

        [–]ThePewZ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        "successful with women" will vary for everyone. It's a feeling rather then something than something that can be quantified. And that's perfectly fine..

        [–]Vanwaq 5 points6 points  (1 child)

        29 years for me. OP has the luxury to not worry about girls which is nice. Try being with only one girl in whole life and "improving" yourself constantly inner, outer , metaphysical only to get no results.

        [–]Jayjk98 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        Same for me man, it will be 20 years in a month 😔

        [–]2virusofthemind 7 points8 points  (0 children)

        Your future self wants to travel back in time and give you a slap.

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (7 children)

        Mine is the first 17 years of my life. I’m not too far behind.

        [–]askmrcia 6 points7 points  (6 children)

        Pffft amateurs. Try 22 being a college athlete (football) then come talk to me.

        [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (3 children)

        22

        college athlete (football)

        How. What are you doing wrong.

        [–]askmrcia 15 points16 points  (2 children)

        Single mother filling my head up with BS. Had girls interested, just never knew how to escalate past ASD.

        And to be fair, a lot of college athletes that I've known had their issues with women. People will be surprised how many of those guys didn't get laid. Way too many of my teammates did nothing but play video games on weekend nights.

        But at age 27 things are far different now. I'm basically the opposite of myself from back then.

        [–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

        I can relate. I was raised by a single mother as well. In retrospect she tried her best to turn me into a beta - she practically raised me as a female. Smh.

        [–]zyqkvx 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        27 is an absolutely great age to turn things around. Remember how when you were 20 all the 20s girls were crawling all over older guys (about 27) and rich fit guys in their 20s? For one, I hear guys about 27 can go to Cancun on spring break and nail a few 20s girls a day if can stomach that kind of audacity. Most of them have boyfriends back home and go there with other women with boyfriends and have fuck holidays.

        [–]leviathan51 6 points7 points  (1 child)

        If you are masturbating, you are not doing this right.

        [–]1jb_trp 9 points10 points  (2 children)

        It's been a couple months for me. I gave up drinking. I stopped smoking weed. I cleaned up my diet. I cut out sugar and other crap. Working on cutting back from jerking off and giving up porn. I cleaned up my room and took a long inventory of my life.

        I've made goals: Goals for my fitness. Goals for my hobbies. Goals for reading. Goals for personal development. Goals for my finances. Goals for my career and my future. You get the point.

        I've centered myself and am learning a lot. I'm learning I can be way more productive than I ever have been before. I realized I don't need women to "make me happy." I'm learning I can and will better my career, make more money and use that money to get out of debt and reach my goals. I've found a gym I love... It's a hole-in-the-wall in an abandoned warehouse with 24 hr access 365 days per year, and there's almost no one there when I go. I can spend as much time as I want without feeling rushed. And I've learned I can kick my ass when I go lift weights and do it right, and I'm learning the right way to lift and how to have a diet to support my goals. This year I'm going to get shredded. I'm learning I have more strength within me that I ever imagined. I've lost almost 20 lbs since my ex and I broke up almost 3 months ago to this day. And I'm happy.

        Any way, without rambling... This season in my life is important to me. The reading, the budgeting, the diet and working out... It's going to develop habits that will help me the rest of my life. I'm going to put things in place that will make my life 1000x better than it was if I don't take the next 6 months or year, or whatever I decide to do so. And if I was still on Tinder, mindlessly swiping right and going out for drinks with chicks, sure I'd be getting laid, but I'd also still be an alcoholic with no direction and not much future. I'm doing this for me.

        So I get your point.

        [–]zyqkvx 6 points7 points  (1 child)

        Careful. Brain scientists say talking (or being told) about future achievements as if they are a given stimulates the same brain centers as if you actually accomplished those achievements, removing your motivation. Knowing this, from about October 2016 to March 2017 I had the best 6 month monk mode so far. Not sharing was one more dicipline like eating clean and working out. People start turning heads. It doesn't need to be discussed in any way. I didn't burn my halo effect into the ground by talking about my efforts. Maybe it deserves a name like 'effort radio silence'. Next time I go in to maintenance monk mode I'm going to do the same thing.

        [–]1jb_trp 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Thanks, anonymous stranger on the internet... I'll consider your words and think about ways to apply them.

        [–]dta9191 19 points20 points  (0 children)

        I went 5 years without dating after losing my first serious girlfriend. It was awesome not having to worry about girls. I mostly focused on my hobbies and hanging out with friends. Got urges, but avoided them when I could. I think every man needs time away from the chase. Totally agree.

        [–]MartinMcFlyy 4 points5 points  (0 children)

        Created a business in only 6 months of monk mode. Though I still masturbated but that’s because my sex drive is high but yeah you will come out a different person or at the least a better mindset

        [–]SonOfSparda304 8 points9 points  (0 children)

        Been about 18 months for me. Unfortunately fell off the wagon for a good bit of it and let alcoholism get the better of me for several months while I was working a shit retail job.

        Now I've gotten my shit together. I have a real job that starts my career in software development at age 23. I drink much less, run and work out more, take MMA classes, and just joined a gym in my new area. On top of that I'm signed up for a half marathon and I'm sure I'll be able to make it through it.

        Struggling with social life though but trying to focus on myself. I might stop wearing earbuds at the gym even though people aren't super social (usually). I find that talking to some of the bigger muscle guys is good cuz they're always happy to give good advice to skinnier guys like me. I have good muscle tone, but being 6'3" and 170-175 lbs makes regular clothes hide everything. I need more and desire to gain at least another 10lbs muscle.

        [–]RandyBumgardner85 3 points4 points  (0 children)

        I've done this a few times before I took the pill. Usually after a oneitis breakup. I agree it's something every man should go through. The main benefit to me was to break free of my ego's reliance on validation seeking. No matter how Alpha you are, there is always an element of validation seeking in chasing women.

        That being said, I do not agree with the OP's assertion that the reward is not worth the work. Banging and connecting with hot chicks is the greatest pleasure most men can experience in life and a man with a good sex life is generally more fun for everyone else to be around than one without.

        [–]Arabian_Wolf 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        It’s called “Monk Mode”, read /u/illimitableman post about it.

        [–]rainbowstalin1234 1 point2 points  (1 child)

        were you masturbating and/or watching porn during this time?

        [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

        I tried to do no fap. But I probably masturbated on average 1-2 times a month. What was really important to me was not using porn and in the 8 months I watched porn 3 times.

        [–]MrSaiyan_333_ 1 point2 points  (5 children)

        Reaching goals and self improvement won't make you happier in the long term either. Meet girls because you genuinely enjoy it and it's a form of self-expression. That's why it's called "game". E.g. you wouldn't build a sandcastle if you don't enjoy its process, would you?

        [–]zyqkvx 2 points3 points  (2 children)

        I disagree. Self improving from a skinny guy to your basic George Clooney build pays dividends forever. If your inner game is compatible to your climate savor every minute of it. I'd make a point to self improve anyway because you can't assume it will be that way forever, and it's easy to delude yourself later citing successes now. Saying self improvement won't make you happy is like saying money won't make you happy. It does to a fair extent, and just importantly eliminates so many disadvantages, and so much sorrow.

        [–]MrSaiyan_333_ -1 points0 points  (1 child)

        I say it won't make you happy because you always want more and more. If you reach a goal you're happy for, like a week mostly, then what? It becomes boring and you'll want more.

        I don't say we shouldn't do anything then, and it can be a big "spiritual" self-sabotaging mindset ("money won't make me happy then why even try not to be a penniless loser and get a job promotion/work on my business?"). But be conscious of the fact that external things (like muscles, fame, money, girls, cars etc.) are never permanent and can't bring permanent joy into our lives.

        But we can play with them and enjoy them as long as they last, because... why not? :D

        [–]zyqkvx 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        I say it won't make you happy because you always want more and more. If you reach a goal you're happy for, like a week mostly, then what? It becomes boring and you'll want more.

        No it doesn't. That's why I named George Clooney specifically. He doesn't look shredded or like he goes to the gym every day. He probably got that build in his 20s and cruised with an occasional maintenance workout ever since. Compare this to skinny guy with his philosophical truths. It's just retarded.

        It's about the least you can do for women. Women put in a lot of effort to look good. It's retarded to think they don't value basic effort from a man, and thats observable to say the least.

        Here's a random pic of Clooney in about 1985. link. Is he shredded? No. He's just not a skinny geek. He doesn't think of himself a homosexual because he has white teeth. Doesn't look like he's afraid of his own shadow or women. Clean shirt. No mustard, or bizarre wrinkles. You are pretty much the top 20% just by doing what I just covered. Women don't look at men that have put in no effort in their body and think, OMG I don't care, it's his mind that's everything to me. Quite the reverse so you can't 'starve that stat'.

        [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        I vehemently agree with self-improvement and goals won't make you happy in the long term. Especially as men. We are mission driven/goal oriented. That's why they say having a woman in your life is "icing on the cake." The actual cake consist of mission/purpose/goals.

        No matter what a man improving himself and attaining goals will be happier and more fulfilled long-term regardless of if he has a woman in his life or not. The only time I can see this not being the case is if he's setting the wrong goals (not his own personal goals) or trying to improve himself for the wrong reasons.

        Yes "game" is a form of masculine expression but gaming women should fall in the the category of a hobby. It contributes to your happiness but doesn't detract from it. And that's the difference a man not living his purpose, reaching his goals, and improving will not be happy long term. Doesn't matter if he's dating a super model or even makes six figures.

        [–]itsjustsimon- 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Yeah, just be yourself. That will sure make you happy, especially if you’re a loser. Sounds like bullshit women gave me for 15 years.

        [–]Non-PC-Guy 82 points83 points  (9 children)

        Dating is something men are brainwashed into believing they’re supposed to do in society and women are brainwashed into believing they are super special, and that the men should wine and dine them and pay for everything. How about sometimes the man pays, sometimes the women pays and sometimes both? How about just hanging out at her place or your place and having a humble night in by watching a movie and chatting or something? Also, society is brainwashed into believing that relationships are all about romance and emotions, never mind integrity, decency, faithfulness, loyalty, unconditional love, etc. Romance is the least important thing in a relationship; it should come after all the hard work is put in on both sides. If a women has nothing to bring to the table in a relationship besides sex she is nothing but a worthless flesh hole.

        [–]Patzer1470 10 points11 points  (0 children)

        precisely this. Some parts of the world (I'm looking at you, Asia), have this general relationship-part down pat.

        That is to say: hard work comes before "romance" and "love", and without effort from both parties in the relationship, it, and social structure will devolve (a la the West).

        [–]cosmicsadist2 -3 points-2 points  (7 children)

        But but i like worthless flesh holes. Knowing a woman is your worthless cumdumpster feels great. Pump her full of semen like the cum hole she is.

        [–]Non-PC-Guy 4 points5 points  (6 children)

        If I did do this it would only be because I couldn’t resist my urges, but I don’t want to become like the whores I despise and would not willingly set out to do this. Why should I compromise my morals and decency for a women who is probably betraying her boyfriend or husband? I wouldn’t want the same done to me if I was in the blue pill phase. I’d rather go to war against the urge and do what’s right. It’s not worth the short term pleasure (a 3 second payoff) in exchange for your soul.

        [–]cosmicsadist2 1 point2 points  (5 children)

        What? Fuck that flesh hole bro. Maybe shes a whore by choice? Nothing wrong with a woman sleeping around. We liberated woman sexually and then complain about it afterwards. Just get your nut man. It will be like your personal cum toy. Doesnt get any better than that.

        [–]Non-PC-Guy 9 points10 points  (4 children)

        BS. MGTOW men complain that women are disloyal and immoral, and many are angry that their wives have abandoned them, and you advocate encouraging their whorish behaviour and behaving like a male whore yourself. MGTOW monk is the way to go to start a revolution that makes it clear to women how far they’ve fallen and to give them aspirations to change once they realise they are being rejected on a massive scale. I know this is hard on your cock, but this is bigger than your cock. The whole system needs to change and marriage needs to be redeemed.

        [–]zyqkvx 3 points4 points  (1 child)

        Nonsense. Having a flesh hole that sees you as her dick pound is not only great, it puts you in great mental state of clarity. It's like bluepill bleach. It doesn't necessarily mean either of you are going to branch swinging whores. Though it probably means she will or is. Just focus on low milage women. Men are raised to see everything the do as sinful. Women are not, they do not relate sex to sin like men have been raised and don't even understand why a man would, or respect a man that does. They do know how to exploit a man that constantly is concerned about sense of sin. This doesn't mean you have to turn in to a shithead, it just means to get over yourself with your bullshit sin upbringing.

        [–]Non-PC-Guy 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Well, that’s where we’ll have to agree to disagree. I know for a fact sin is real and it has nothing to do with upbringing; I wasn’t raised religious. I’d choose what’s right before God over a flesh hole with no morals any day. If I have to go to war against my sinful urges, so be it. Many women do have a sense of sin; they are just not good at resisting it as men are.

        [–]bongohai 1 point2 points  (1 child)

        Marriage may well need to be redeemed. But that will have to be left to future generations to resolve. The women available today are beyond redemption.

        [–]Rommel0502 43 points44 points  (1 child)

        But if we choose to stop for a second and look at this process - we discover that the amount of actual pleasure and happiness we are getting from this blind process is much smaller then all the suffering/pain/stress that this is causing us.

        This is the reward schedule for anything that provides short term reward. Most negative things in life have a short term reward schedule. (Drugs, booze, video games, crap food, porn, spending money, etc). Most positive things in life have a long term reward schedule. (Education, fitness/lifting, healthy food, career focus, saving/investing money, etc).

        The core of discipline is the ability to defer short term reward for long term gain. Focusing your life around getting a ten minute short term reward of pussy is a prescription for disaster. Instead, if you focused on all long term gains, you would find that getting that short term fix would be the least of your worries.

        [–]Yonski3[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

        Yes.mindfulness meditation can be a great aid to change your focus.

        [–]earthmother92 19 points20 points  (0 children)

        Women arent the point of life. Good job dude.

        [–]MrGreySD 22 points23 points  (3 children)

        I can relate to this so much. It was almost like an addiction throughout the last 4 years.

        But the last 2 months have been bliss. I feel truly happy and I am progressing faster than I have ever progressed.

        Furthermore, spending more time making money = more money = more women. So it's win win.

        Women are a short term pleasure. Fun in the moment. When you quit dating, you're left wondering what you gained from ever partaking in it. It feels empty.

        [–]Yonski3[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

        I'm glad to hear you are doing well. it is an addiction indeed, and it's something I have been doing all my life without realizing that the actual reward I am getting from it is absurd.

        [–]grewapair 8 points9 points  (1 child)

        I dated nonstop for 30 years. Within a month of a breakup, I was back into the next one. Then a bad injury sidelined me for two years and I had to stop.

        Once the injury was behind me, I had no motivation to restart. Why, I wondered.

        Because I had literally gotten nothing but validation out of the relationship. The women had put in zero effort while I ran around and made their lives fantastic. What I had gotten out of it resulted from the extra effort I was putting in, literally none of it came from them.

        If you're so good looking that women are jumping on your dick, I'm sure it's really great, but the effort it takes for an average guy to get and keep a girl is simply not worth it. If you can boost yourself into the top 20%, great. If not, well, 30 years of experience is that it's a complete waste of time.

        [–]MrGreySD 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Well said, and it's cool to hear my thoughts backed up by someone who's further on in life.

        I enjoy flirtation with women I meet in public. I might date ones that I bump into in daily life. But going out of my way for them is where things turn sour. Dating apps are the ultimate waste of life.

        [–]mikerate 33 points34 points  (10 children)

        I agree, I just started tinder and it's like a drug. Every swipe or match your brain surges with dopamine fantasizing about the girl.IMO it's no different from porn. I wasted so much time constantly checking it and hamstering when I should be studying.

        [–]Yonski3[S] 16 points17 points  (7 children)

        Tinder is highly addictive. my advice is to remove the notifications from it and only check it once or twice a day.

        [–]SovereignSoul76 9 points10 points  (0 children)

        Yeah. Personally, I only snort heroin. Injecting it would be nuts ;)

        [–]leonxtravis 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        remove the notifications from it

        I removed all notifications to my phone besides texting apps (imessage, whatsapp, etc.) and I swear my anxiety must have decreased by at least 60 percent.

        [–]zyqkvx 0 points1 point  (4 children)

        I don't do tinder, but I'd think you'd only check once every 2-3 days. I know that sounds like pulling teeth, which is why it also you would come off as not thirsty. Much more time efficient and keeps you out of being a sucker addicted to their phone.

        [–]1empatheticapathetic 1 point2 points  (3 children)

        Wouldn't you just disappear in the sea of men she's talking to.

        [–]zyqkvx 0 points1 point  (2 children)

        If my math is right only the ones on the first day, but if she responded the first day she's the type that would pine if ignored.

        [–]1empatheticapathetic 1 point2 points  (1 child)

        Oh i didn't realise you said you didn't use it.

        Unless you sort that shit out quick you're forgotten about. This was when i was using it 3 years ago. Can't imagine what it's like now.

        [–]zyqkvx 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Maybe I shouldn't have suggested it at all since I don't use tinder, but That does look like the winning math to me. Who cares if you lose some anyway. That's part of the point.

        [–]TheAmphibiaRapist 1 point2 points  (1 child)

        You'll get over it in about a week

        [–]abhishek9129 10 points11 points  (0 children)

        Women are just a passenger on the train to your goals and the goals beyond. You put in too much time and got great with Chicks. Now you abstain, get awesome at life and realize and increase your self worth. Next move is to balance the two and enjoy the life. Happiness is subjective and BS, its a state of mind. It changes form time to time. Never static.

        The survive and reproduce theory is BS as its was relevant when the humans were scarce.

        Today it should be - enjoy fuck progress-in-life repeat.

        [–][deleted] 18 points19 points  (0 children)

        Finally a brush of fresh air! There have been so many threads about how to pick up girls lately I almost forgot the most important thing about Redpill philosophy: "self-improvement". keep doing what YOU WANT and dont listen to anyone else

        [–]2chazthundergut 16 points17 points  (0 children)

        Yes and no.

        Happiness should always come from within. And every man must be 100% comfortable being alone.

        But chicks are so fun. Flirting, dating, touching, teasing, fucking. The smell of her hair. The look in her eyes when she surrenders herself to you. The little gasp she makes when you enter her for the first time. The sound of her laughter. The way her lips look when she smiles. The softness of her skin. The warmth of her body as she presses herself against you. Those little dimples on her back. The animal noises she makes into her pillow when you're fucking her from behind.

        Yea, you can be happy without chicks. But God, how boring!

        [–]noleague 37 points38 points  (25 children)

        I gave up dating a while back, the stress just wasn't worth it

        My life is a lot better and happier without that hassle

        [–]Mrbumby 6 points7 points  (10 children)

        If dating is stress, you’re doing it wrong.

        May I ask what was stressing you?

        [–]RandyBumgardner85 10 points11 points  (7 children)

        No idea why this was down voted and the post above up voted. Dating is not stressful if you're game is solid and natural and you have genuine abundance mentality. Rejections, flaking and shit tests cost you nothing once you can master your ego.

        Most of us aren't there yet, but once you are, it's easy.

        [–]Metalcrazyx 8 points9 points  (5 children)

        Find a girl who is HB 7+ and can talk about evolutionary biology, technology, exercise science etc. Basically intelligent topics that involve logic. That is why dating sucks, attractive girls are boring for a thinking man, besides sex

        [–]InfiniteMuscle 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Just lol. Why would you want a woman to be interested in logic and philosophy? Those are masculine interests bro. When I'm with a hot chick, I don't care about how "intellectual" she is. All that matters to me is that she is feminine, loyal, and low-drama.

        [–]360_no_scope_upvote 4 points5 points  (2 children)

        That's not women are for, and you're still thinking women are like men which they are not. Don't be so serious all the time and learn how to let loose and have fun.

        [–]leonxtravis 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        There was a quote /u/woujo said a while back:

        "Women are the dessert to a good life, not the main course, and that's how women should feel when you are talking to them. WOMEN WANT TO BE DESSERT."

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        God damn this is so fucking true. Good point.

        [–]destraht 13 points14 points  (1 child)

        When I'm in California I definitely don't date and I only hook up here and there up in the naked hot springs. Back there women infuriate me and I become quite sexually frustrated, even if I've just hooked up recently. Now I'm currently in Eastern Europe, East of the Carpathians in a tiny city and I'm not frustrated at all even though I haven't been banging lately. I've been focusing on my programming projects and I just released my beta1 rc1 to the folks back home who are depending on me. Feels good and now I'm jamming on my sabbatical projects and that feels really good. I see lots of women around that appeal to me and I know that I'm going to snag one when the time is right and that also feels really good. I'm also busy looking at real estate and studying with my private Russian language tutor and that feels good as well. So I'm not having sex just right this moment and everything is pretty neato actually. I feel good because I'm seeing lots of progress on many fronts and I can imagine that the future continues to be good. Well, back in California I just feel dread. IMO things aren't right at all there. A woman, not a woman, doesn't matter. Sure a good woman is a +1 but if other things aren't good enough for you then a woman or three isn't going to make your life awesome. I'm verifiably miserable back in California and that isn't at all the case over here.

        [–]BrickSandMordor 7 points8 points  (0 children)

        Cuckifornia. (SoCal) Where women are bred to be man-hating, materialistic, aloof, whack-job idiots.

        [–]U-94 6 points7 points  (0 children)

        Dating is pointless, yes. But I still want to go out and bang someone. Alcohol helps dumb down all those higher functioning thoughts. I improve myself the rest of the week. It's not a big deal. None of it is.

        [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

        Let them chase you. It's a whole lot easier. 😉

        [–][deleted] 17 points18 points  (3 children)

        i did the same but at some time i noticed i was looking for prostitutes because i just had the necessity to have sex but didn't want to spend energy with 'dating' and 'keeping the girl in the circle' with messages and whatsoever. just wanted something easy that could me get that feeling for a while.

        [–]vitamann 0 points1 point  (2 children)

        Did it work? I've contemplated this for a while, it seems overall a lot more stress free.

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Dude, seriously. Doing this made me feel like a 'special man'. I mean: right now i'm so busy with work and 'my own things'. By my own things i mean the plans i have for my future, my gym training, my clothes, my time playing videogame at home, chilling. I used to be a guy that gave a lot of effort talking/keeping girls in the circle and dating women. I've been Always successful in this segment, but right now I just don't have enough patience/energy to do this. I feel myself way more into my things than in keeping a girl in the circle just to date some day and hope to have sex. I'm a very cold guy in this sense, so, i just found out that hiring a prostitute sometime and having this ocasional sex was better for me. As I said, it made me feel 'special' - like: i don't have enough time to spend talking to girls or making social relations. Right now I'm way more 'going solo' on life and it feels really good to me. I even left WhatsApp and all social media. It feels good and, as you said, stress free. I don't feel bad because i hire prostitutes sometimes just because i know i can go out and meet women, i'm not doing it just because i have more importante stuff to do.

        [–]unplug9000 3 points4 points  (0 children)

        Whatever the reasons, a bit more of DGAF for the purpose of development is good. Activities can be fun each iteration, but long term they may stress you out. Throw these in the trash temporarily. Instead, go to the gym, go for a walk, meditate, whatever the fuck, as long as it doesn't involve electronics. Grow a new perspective, return with a better approach that doesn't stress you out.

        [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (3 children)

        It's nonnegotiable that everything in life is about sex.

        We're driven by our genes and testosterone to accumulate power in the form of higher status, better car, better house, bigger muscles, etc. This is done predominately to gain more opportunities for reproduction but that's just part of who we are as men.

        We can't just ignore that we're sex driven.

        [–]RedPillMGTOW 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        It's nonnegotiable that everything in life is about sex.

        That is not true. Sex takes 3 minutes of your life. There is way more to life than sex.

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        I think you misunderstood what I meant.

        Everything in life for men aside from basic needs (water, food, sleep) is about creating more opportunities for reproduction.

        [–]FrankieGGG 4 points5 points  (0 children)

        "Directly after copulation the devil's laughter is heard" - schopenhauer

        [–]ISaidThatOnPurpose 3 points4 points  (0 children)

        I didn't read it, just the title, but I can vouch for this.

        I was talking to my recently divorced brother and I had just broken up with my gf at the time.

        We were like, looking around our lives like "where are the problems? What is going wrong without me noticing? Surely there must be something. Our women were always complaining or causing a stir over something!"

        But no. Nothing. Just peace

        [–]Dead_Art 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Isn't this just going monk mode? After a relationship I'll take 8 months to a few years off dating to focus on me, I'll still sleep around but there's no emotions involved on those hookups and I don't go out of my way. If pussy falls on my dick then alright but otherwise I have more important things to worry about

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

        Happiness leads to dating girls, though.

        [–]leonxtravis 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        So a lot of MGTOW men aren't truly happy then...interesting.

        [–]pohlrich 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        And this is how we get stuck in this maze of constantly seeking for the "cheese"

        you need to understand life never designed us to run mazes, we evolved to cut through the maze anyway we want, yet we reinforce the maze instead and then end up here wondering why lifes so difficult.

        dating and jumping through hoops to entertain and provide in so many different ways is just a heap of crap, don't date.

        [–]Senior Endorsed Contributormax_peenor 4 points5 points  (1 child)

        My obligatory response to the word happiness.

        It's chasing a different dragon. Don't do it. Stay on mission and stay strong, and the cookies will just happen.

        [–]zyqkvx 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        When you get older this is much easier to see then when you are young.

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        not trying to be edgy and gay, but dating indirectly led to happiness for me

        obviously it wasn’t the source, but the validation and respect was like a drug as you describe. a drug called happiness

        i don’t think it matters much what we do, so long as we are plugged in and respected at the end of the day

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        But if we choose to stop for a second and look at this process - we discover that the amount of actual pleasure and happiness we are getting from this blind process is much smaller then all the suffering/pain/stress that this is causing us.

        The stress is proportionate to how you loathe (or not loathe) to pretend, hide your mind, and play the female-male mind war game. I'm considering leaving the field too — when you get conscious you have to wear masks all of the time, it becomes hard to both respect yourself and the hens that take nothing aside from being gamed.

        [–]Non-PC-Guy 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        And there is everything wrong with a women sleeping around.

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Exactly. Women won't make you happy. Sexually you can give yourself better orgasms with porn, mentally you are more stable cos women, especially multiple women, can drive you crazy, emotionally you are more stable, physically you crush it more

        I'm starting to believe it's social conditioning. Praying on base instincts of men. I don't believe I get laid anymore, I believe that the girl is getting laid. I just get sore muscles and a bit of mental stimulation, probably enacting some perversion in my head

        [–]JensenMse 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        I remember my last dry spell in 2014. Decided to not chase girls and just focus on my mission only. One of the happiest years in my life.

        Thing is when it comes to following your instincts, you know something's missing when you're ignoring all the girls that are attracted to you. 2014 taught me a lot about how girls show their IOIs (and some were so blatantly obvious a blind man could see them) However I realize that 2015 onwards, I deluded myself into thinking having a girl by my side would make me happier. Big mistake.

        My lesson I learned was: You don't need girls to live a happy life. But if you decide to have one, enjoy your time with her. Don't make her the centre of your life, you will regret it.

        [–]danoranika 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        This mane is trying to say not getting laid is cool and red pill betas are eating it up! There's nothing stressful about being cool and having women gravitate to you. Unless you're trying to negotiate attraction in which case go MGTOW. Spare yourself the futile effort.

        [–]tolerantman 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        I never got as much peace of mind as when I finally decided to tell girls to fuck off and live my own life, I am sure most problems in the western world would be solved if men stopped chasing women and started to do what they want to do, not what they have to.

        [–]solitudeisunderrated 3 points4 points  (9 children)

        When did this sub become such MGTOW?

        [–]Yonski3[S] 13 points14 points  (7 children)

        I persoanly see a very close link between MGTOW and redpill.

        [–]solitudeisunderrated 20 points21 points  (3 children)

        Redpill men are really just one late-period away from becoming mgtows.

        [–]SovereignSoul76 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Haaaaaaa, that's funny....I like that one.

        [–]RandyBumgardner85 -2 points-1 points  (2 children)

        RedPill: Improve yourself to get women. Side effect: You are now twice the man you used to be.

        MGTOW: Don't improve yourself to get women, they're not worth the hassle, just avoid them. Side effect: You are still a loser.

        [–]RedPillMGTOW 5 points6 points  (0 children)

        Lie. MGTOW encourages self-improvement for yourself. Women are not important enough to change something in my life. I improve myself so i can achieve my dreams.

        Side effect: You are still a loser.

        You sound like a women. Throwing shit on reddit is for losers.

        [–]InfiniteMuscle 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Don't know why you're getting downvoted. This is true.

        [–]InfiniteMuscle 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Yeah this subreddit is turning into MGTOW. I can't find one thread that discusses any positives about women. LOL

        [–]fur10us_falcon 1 point2 points  (3 children)

        As someone whose a virgin what does then?

        [–]BrickSandMordor 9 points10 points  (1 child)

        Stay a virgin. It's much easier. Believe me.

        [–]1Ill_Will7 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Your telling a man he should stay a virgin? that's absurd. If you never get to care for or fuck a woman that shit will eat at you. The first time you vibe with a woman who wants to fuck you is a very nice feeling. And when you do have sex with her, it will be life changing for a virgin. The point is to not make this your main goal in life. Rather, have it when you want, clear your mind of it after you bust one on her tits and move on to your mission and continue bettering yourself

        [–]leonxtravis 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        It all depends. Besides being a virgin, what do you have to offer to people?

        Like what are your hobbies, age group, college major (if you even go to college; cliche question---DYEL?. Depending on your answer(s) you should be seeing women every day...ones that are most likely checking for you.

        [–]savagepatchkid 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Since when was dating one of the keys to happiness?

        [–]abramN 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Before I was even aware of trp, I made two choices that drastically improved my dating experience, a. I would not get into a ltr for a full year and b. I would make sure to have a good time on every date. I even had to tell one girl, who was falling in love with me, that I "wasn't falling in love that year." Lol. But it really made a difference on dates, because whether it clicked with the girl or not, I was still having fun doing what I wanted to do. She was along for the ride, and if she dug it, then I really didn't have to do much to move to the next level. It was...gasp...easy...

        [–]af_007 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        We cant make women our first priority in life!

        [–]Vanwaq 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Non religious minority livening in a large city. Toronto the city famous for girls with attitude. Been consistently working on myself gym, meditation, career, social activities, trying "game" all kinds in different environments daytime, nighttime. Keeping positive and trying to increase my social circle. Read and watched all rsd material from now to five years ago when I started. David Angelo, David Paterson, tony Robinson, and whole bunch of positive and motivational people on YouTube. I read a lot, I watch a lot of documentaries. Regardless of my no success I keep pushing forward. Would love a lay some day.

        I have also had long periods on and off where I gave up on chasing women like op to just worry about my self only and forget the whole pussy chasing shit. Well that did no good I got the same results as when I was trying-0

        [–]TheHustlingWizard 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Girls bring stress. I learned that when I was 21. 8 years later. Three businesses, a house, investment property, investments and jewellery that'll make your favourite rapper jealous. And I NEVER worked for anyone but myself. I fucked the same girl since I can remember. She is bi and started getting serious with her girlfriend. I was fortunate enough to have a couple dates with both of them. However, it's not easy. I went over a year with busting a nut. I don't know what's happening in the world, politics or culture. Just stay up to date with my Dolphins. Phins up bwoiiii!!!!! I go do my thing all day and come home to custys. I'm only 29 but the past 8 years have been lonely as fuck. I know I'm gonna look back at these days and laugh. For now I'm gonna keep doing me!

        [–]Poochysnooch 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Bullshit right here:

        A few months ago I decided to try something new in my life: to abstain from dating any girls for a while and to see what will happen.

        Translation:

        "I stopped putting in effort to date and get laid"

        The only fucking way you "abstain" from dating is if:

        A) you have plates B) you go out of your way to ignore their calls for your cock or you tell them off.

        The fact that you mentioned neither means my translation above is likely accurate.

        Let me tell you a (not so) secret that about < 5% of men here have:

        • they have multiple FB's, MLTRs and even ONS so frequently that it as an act of serious will to stop the pussy from flowing

        I myself have 3 steady plates (2 FB's and 1 MLTR) for 2 years now... down from 3 FB's and 2 MLTRs.

        They all know I am non-exclusive and they each see me at most 1 time per week (for sex of course).

        Plus I cancel on 1-3 new first dates per week and pick 1 new "promising" candidate to go out with to ensure my roster has new potential leads.

        Do you think I can simply "abstain" from banging these girls brains out and dropping my loads down their throats?

        Fuck no. I would have to ghost them all as they come around to take their medicine each week and buy me gifts.

        I considered letting a couple go to "abstain" but honestly they look so happy guzzling my load and getting orgasms from me that I would not want to take that happiness away from them. I do it as a community service and spread my wisdom and give them the pleasures of hanging out with me. Why take it away??

        You need to fucking lift more, learn game, and get into the habit of cold approaching every 7 and above as well as sending 100's of online dating openers per week. Effortlessly.

        There is nothing more easy and relaxing than a 1 hour date with a random sexy creature following Blackdragon's first date script.

        Proof that you are a newb where you even think the pain is greater than the pleasure:

        we discover that the amount of actual pleasure and happiness we are getting from this blind process is much smaller then all the suffering/pain/stress that this is causing us.

        it's like digging up an endless hole in the ground seeking a treasure we will never find.

        YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG STILL

        [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

        You would be interested in RSD Julien's Transformation Mastery. He talks about letting go of everything: pick-up, self-help, the gym, everything. Like you said, just drop it and see how you feel. You will probably do something original that you genuinely like and are proud of. And if you really do want to do pick-up, etc., then you will, but it will come from a place of abundance.

        [–]crypto_chan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        tinder never worked for me. LOLs.

        [–]wildwildeastgyal 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        So you acihieved short term happiness basically.

        Same as someone who takes break from work. You're gonna have to go back eventually to achieve long term happiness.

        [–]laidtorest47 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        I mean, we’re conditioned to want to date because of how society views love and romance. Of course we see dating as a reward or else we wouldn’t want to date, couple, whatever. The problem comes when you convince yourself that you NEED to date. Once you get off of that mindset it’s obvious and you ironically start being more appealing because you’re not desperate. Not caring about dating for a long time has helped me date. I know my reality is that I’m not a very outgoing person towards people I don’t know so dating strangers is difficult. Dating strangers is not how romantic relationships happen and that’s what everyone who has dating problems with that need to understand. Tinder is not a natural way to date, but it is an outlet and a chance to date unnaturally. It’s all about understanding what works and what doesn’t, the tactics you need to use. But ultimately to not be using those tactics to turn people into tools for your use.

        [–]PreOrgasmGroanLness 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Well you didn't make up a new physics theory by this post.

        Nothing equals happiness. But a lot of many small things together make happiness.

        [–]joner888 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

        Haven't "seen" a girl for over 2 years

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