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19yo beta male feminist eyeing the red pill. I've got a story and some questions. (self.asktrp)

submitted by laughatthisin20years

While idly spamming r/random in favor of geophysics homework, I landed on /r/PurplePillDebate a few days ago and started reading. This afternoon, I decided to actually give r/theredpill its fair due and I started reading. And reading. Emerging hours later from some of the sidebar content and trm.com, I figured it's time I ask some questions.

But first, context:

I'm a 19yo virgin certified nice guy who's skinny, far nerdier than not, and more than happy to be alone in my free time than otherwise. I was raised in an Extremely Sheltered environment--Christian homeschooled until college, only male role model was a completely disengaged and emasculated father, was everything but the marriage counselor for my extremely dissatisfied mom (I spent so many nights talking her down from divorce or what have you). As the oldest, I was tied to my family and younger siblings, all of whom were girls. I had two good male friends growing up but after several years they ended up being emotionally and physically abusive (I was several years their younger) and I never made male friends after that. Actually, I never really made friends after that at all. Throw the fact that both my parents have diagnosed clinical depression and probably some mixture of paranoia and bipolar (they're just realizing it after my sister's suicidal attempt), and that I struggled with it for a long time, you should probably be getting a picture of where I'm coming from. Oh, also, being Christian homeschoolers, dating is a huge No No so I received zero instruction from even the more alpha males in the community than my dad.

But even in all this homeschooling and depression, there were girls. From 2015(?) for the next two years, I became infatuated with the one non-Christian, actually-in-possession-of-goals-besides-becoming-a-happy-housewise, opinionated and shy girl in the homeschool (hs) community (hsc). She was the one (1) other person I knew in the hsc planning to go to college but we went to different schools and I fell into depression. Did freshman year, blah blah blah, finally fell out of "love" with her and then saw her next summer and she started giving all the same signals. Realized I didn't want in on this so I asked her out with hopes of getting rejected so I could officially get over it and then went abroad so I didn't have to deal with any of it and could focus on myself for a while. (Read my post history, I'm reviving a relevant throwaway so automod doesn't delete my p

Going abroad was the single best decision of my life. I stopped being a straightedge and got smashed on soju countless times, finally stopped giving a fuck about what people thought since I could barely speak Korean anyways, started dressing decently, and went to parties and clubs and actually had girls attracted to me for the first time in my life without caring about it. I'd gone 4 months monk mode without knowing what it was and it changed me for the better.

Came back home, started working out for gains, not just athleticism and gained 15lb (still skinny af, I've got a long ways to go), and buried myself in a double major and a new job. Now that I'm speaking English again, I'm slowly waking up to just how incredibly unsocialized hs left me. (being told "oh you're a genius", "be afraid of worldly people" (read: non-Christians), and "why are your sisters so much better behaved than you" by your narcissistic mother for 18 years does bad shit). I also realized how much incredible power girls have in our dating culture and just how difficult it is for guys. Not that I'm bitching--I'm just going to be/do better, but it is a long road. I was full-on insecure, cringy, beta, white-knight nice guy pathetic for years and I need to shake that and start loving myself more.

Reading trp materials stunned me because of how much it accurately depicted the dynamic between my parents and reinforced my sinking disillusionment with how the world actually works. Peeling back a) the homeschooler bubble b) the Christian bubble and c) the feminism bubble (my personal rebellion against my parents, but my way of reconciling religious values to what I perceived as the "real world" while moving slowly away from the dogma of the faith... no need to go into it yet) has been painful as I learn I learned NOTHING about how people are. There's still a lot of women-hating bullshit in this community and shame on you all for allowing it, but trp is the first thing I've found that actually provides a framework for masculinity in the real world besides read your bible every day, go on mission trips, work out, and "be a leader". You guys seem onto something. That said, I've got some practical questions:

  • I've got no experience with relationships besides that oneist orbiting bullshit earlier in highschool. (I'm still in infrequent touch with her and appreciate her as one of my few friends, but I'm over it for good) I'm afraid I don't have the background knowledge to start working on it in college. Advice?
  • While I wouldn't mind causal sex (remember, still warming up to it after years of christian hs indoctrination, re: sex is evil and bad aka: I regret sleeping around before marrying because your dad sucks and I wouldn't have known that if I hadn't had better sex when I was younger), my long-term goal is to get into a power couple. I did some searching and it seems lots of you disdain that? Endless plate spinning isn't as attractive a proposition to me as getting in a mutually lustful relationship with somebody I respect a lot (obviously, that means they have to respect me as well, so I've got to be worth respecting in the modern western dating framework)
  • Without ever having a network male friends and unsure of how to even start building one, how do I make friends and get invited to social events? I've been to only a handful of parties and such just because of a lack of connections. Please ELI5 because I'm really really stupid at this social stuff.
  • I read the 48rop and was instantly sobered. I am terrible at all of those now that I'm trying to make friends and influence people. I realize now I'm going about it all backwards, but how do you recover respect in relationships/interactions where you've already set a weak first impression?
  • It's easy to feel discouraged and like you have to wait for the next life reset. In HS, I knew college would be where my life turned around, and it hasn't been yet. Now, I'm thinking I'll have to wait until grad school to get off on the right social footing. Make me feel better by telling me I might actually see results in the next two years.

Basically, trp has put to words much of what I've been slowly, stumblingly approaching a nebulous vision of on my own. I still think half of you are manipulative, misogynistic fucks though, and I can't deny that some of the stuff I've been openly reading, while not at all explicitly bad, still leaves a very dirty taste in my mouth. Maybe that'll change, but for the meantime, I'll at least take a large cup of the the solid self-respect coolade you guys are serving. It's refreshing to actually see a very large to how the world does work instead of how it would be nice if it did work.

Hope that doesn't offend anyone. I'm not looking for reprogramming--I really think it's sad that half this stuff works, but it does, so here I am--and I ought to apologize for coming to help from a community I've been passively demonizing for so long. Sorry for not being fairer.


[–][deleted] 82 points83 points  (7 children)

Takes about a year to start putting everything together until it all makes sense and you develop the frame to carry the new worldview.

It'll be longer for you because of your history and rigid brainwashed mindset until now.

So, welcome, shut the fuck up, and keep reading.

[–]laughatthisin20years[S] 19 points20 points  (5 children)

If there's anything not on the sidebar you'd especially recommend, hit me with it

[–][deleted] 51 points52 points  (0 children)

For you, "No More Mr. Nice Guy" is probably the first book you should digest, followed by "When I say no, I feel Guilty". These tend to wake guys up to the fact that you ARE being manipulated to do things that are not your choice of things to do. Then "The Manipulated Man", then The Rational Male books and blog.

Read the top posts, pay special attention to mod posts and the vanguard tags.

There are other subs you can derive wisdom from, but don't focus so much on the "fuck as many women as possible" popular sentiment.

Lift.Read.Go test the knowledge and find out which tools are right for you.

Never call yourself a feminist again.

[–]Endorsed ContributorAuvergnat 6 points7 points  (0 children)

See my post history for "Unplugging. The reading list" and "Must-read redpill content".

Apart from that, do spend time on the rest of the Manosphere. therationalmale in priority, but also Dalrock (especially if you still have faith). Returnofkings and chateauheartiste are also decent but often get too political. In all cases, privilege the older stuff. 2009-2012. Chateauheartiste in those years was insanely good.

Besides that, while I am answering you:

  • We tolerate the actual hate on women on TRP for two reasons: One, it's cathartic for a lot of men digesting the pill. Two, in this society bent on supporting the feminine biological imperative, men are too often silenced. Free speech on the internet is what allowed the Manosphere to come together and figure all of this out. Policing people's opinions would have nipped all of this in the bud. The end game of that policing is what you see out in the world today: if you're a guy discussing how the wage gap is a myth, you'll be silenced for being a "misogynist". Out there, the culture war has been won by feminism thanks to policing speech. Here it's still alive, precisely because we let guys be free to express their un-politically correct opinion (within the sub's rules).

  • The preferred strategy on TRP is spinning plates, but you're free to do whatever you want with TRP knowledge. It's just that given that knowledge, LTRs are a hard game to play. Marriage is even worse. Still you do what you want.

  • How to make friends. Do you understand from TRP how girls will be into you if they find you valuable? Same goes with friends. Except value estimation is different. Become a valuable man to other men, and they will come to you to benefit from your value. Have interesting hobbies and be willing to take people with you. Join a team in anything and make yourself a valuable member. Learn to make cocktails, cook, play team sports... Whatever skills or knowledge that will make guys go "my life can be improved if I let this guy hang out with me". Learn to listen to people and feed them their own opinion back at them, that will make them feel good talking to you. This last one is a bit Machiavellian but hey it's TRP.

[–]El_Serpiente_Roja 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Rollo Tommassi, and a good dose of lifting + sidebar

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Rational Male

probably in the sidebar, but would like to stress it

[–]RedPillRobin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Took me 4 years and a Divorce.

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (1 child)

Welcome. I rarely respond in any degree of depth to newbies because there's a low rate of people who actually stick to it once they find out that it involves some actual work. Some particulars about your story and your phrasing stuck with me, however, so I'll offer you a bit of a start.

I'm not looking for reprogramming

You've already been reprogrammed. What you want is a way to get back to something closer to your natural state. Start with No More Mr. Nice Guy by Robert Glover (NMMNG for short). You'll really understand what I mean after you finish that. PM me if you have trouble finding it, and I'll see what I can do.

As you work through that, you'll start to have a lot of questions about applying some of the things you've learned. That's when it's time for When I Say No, I Feel Guilty by Manuel Smith (WISNIFG for short). Again, PM me if you'd like some help finding either of these.

With that having been said, I'll address some specific points and questions:

There's still a lot of women-hating bullshit in this community and shame on you all for allowing it

I still think half of you are manipulative, misogynistic fucks though

This is some of your sickness coming up from that reprogramming that I mentioned above. You'll have a better idea of what I mean after you finish NMMNG.

Endless plate spinning isn't as attractive a proposition to me

That's fine. The point is to be able to use the tools of the red pill praxeology to figure out what you want and to be able to work towards it while fully informed. You can go bang dudes, go have a long-term relationship, build a harem or whatever it is that you want to do. The point is that you are put in a position to figure out what you actually want instead of what you have been reprogrammed to want (see above) and that you have the means and mindset to go after it.

I'm afraid I don't have the background knowledge to start working on it in college. Advice?

If you put in something like four to six weeks of reading and work on the basics, this will start taking care of itself. Going into why that is would take a few paragraphs, and this is already long as it is, so just take my word for it for now.

Without ever having a network male friends and unsure of how to even start building one, how do I make friends and get invited to social events?

NMMNG addresses this in a fair amount of detail.

I read the 48rop and was instantly sobered. I am terrible at all of those now that I'm trying to make friends and influence people.

Take the 48 Laws of Power with a grain of salt, especially from behind a red pill lens. The idea is to wake you up to what people are like; it's not to make you think that you have to be some super manipulative person. WISNIFG will do a good job for you in seeing the difference.

Make me feel better by telling me I might actually see results in the next two years.

You'll see results slowly but steadily in proportion to the amount of work you put in with this. It'll actually give you a framework for getting results in whatever it is that you decide you want to do, which seems like something you're sorely lacking in and very much want in your life.

I can't deny that some of the stuff I've been openly reading, while not at all explicitly bad, still leaves a very dirty taste in my mouth.

A lot of this will change once you understand the basics, see the context of the types of things that make you feel weird and have an idea of the wide range of different people, perspectives and experiences you're reading about.

For now, work through NMMNG and WISNIFG (and again, PM me if you have trouble finding them), and once you get those down, you'll be in a position to figure out which direction to go in next.

Feel completely free to PM me with any questions you have or generally discussion. I enjoy talking shop with young, motivated guys who are eager to get their shit together.

Edit: Also, delete this post once you're done with it and make another account just for RP discussion and posting. A non-trivial number of people have been doxxed simply for posting about RP topics, and you will get shit on, banned and generally harassed if it's connected to your main. PM me from your new account if you don't ignore this advice.

[–]laughatthisin20years[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

This is amazing! Thank you for the support and the excellent advice. I really appreciate it and I'll start looking into all of this.

[–]Endorsed Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil 41 points42 points  (2 children)

Drop the victimhood narrative and start lifting weights. Everything else is second.

[–]laughatthisin20years[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Happily doing both!

[–]collingiles 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Arguably the best comment in this thread. Lift lift lift, you cannot downplay the importance

[–]M23W0OH7FV2t 7 points8 points  (0 children)

This afternoon, I decided to actually give r/redpill its fair due and I started reading.

It's r/theredpill, but that aside. TRP is only useful if you temper what's on the sidebar with practice in the real world. What I mean is that I could read every post in our considerable archives a hundred times, but it won't make sense until I actually apply them in society.

Basically, trp has put to words much of what I've been slowly, stumblingly approaching a nebulous vision of on my own. I still think half of you are manipulative, misogynistic fucks though, and I can't deny that some of the stuff I've been openly reading, while not at all explicitly bad, still leaves a very dirty taste in my mouth. Maybe that'll change, but for the meantime, I'll at least take a large cup of the the solid self-respect coolade you guys are serving. It's refreshing to actually see a very large to how the world does work instead of how it would be nice if it did work.

Don't paint us all with one brush, though. For me, I'm manipulative insofar as I force betas (and I go back to my oft-stated edict that women are the ultimate beta) to expose themselves as the frauds they are -- saying one thing whilst doing, oftentimes, the diametric opposite. I don't see myself as misogynistic, as I lump beta men and women together.

Hope that doesn't offend anyone

If my words offend people, they should feel free to leave me be.

[–]1RPLawyer 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I won't bother reading this. You won't get sympathy or attention here before you've read and understood the sidebar and some of the litterature offered in it. You should start with something like Sexual Impolitics by Neil Lyndon so you can see how much feminists lied to you. Then read No more Mr. Nice guy by Robert Glover. Then you can start reading proper Redpill litterature.

That being said, welcome. Do your homework and you'll find this is quite a nice place.

[–]Endorsed Contributorleftajar 3 points4 points  (0 children)

You're a beta male feminist? Well at least you're honest.

I'm going to skip your story, because I don't care and it's mostly irrelevant, and answer your questions.

No relationship experience. Advice?

Start socializing with mixed-sex groups. Do NOT go into them thinking you're going to find a GF or get laid. Just start to learn how to have fun and chill out and shoot the shit with people. If you're in college, this is the easiest thing in the damn world -- just go join some clubs.

power couple.

What does that mean to you?

TRP isn't opposed to relationships. We just point out that 99% of men are doing it for bad, destructive reasons.

make friends and get invited to social events?

Join clubs, shoot the shit with guys. This might feel weird at first, but you want to start to act a little bit bro-ey. The destination you want is to be able to hang out with guys, joking around, giving them some good-natured ribbing, while simultaneously helping them to be better versions of themselves. This is the sort of guy other men want to have around. Also, don't engage in stupid virtue-signaling. Real men are turned off by that.

[–]Senior EndorsedVasiliyZaitzev 8 points9 points  (2 children)

You can read Dalrock's blog (should be in the links on the sidebar) for a Christian and Red Pill perspective.

Other than that, lift, sidebar, lift some more, read sidebar again, etc.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–]Senior EndorsedVasiliyZaitzev 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Why don't you READ and find out?

    [–]quicklogaccount 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    So... Have you read "The Five Stages of Red Pill, and how to read r/TRP textposts"? It should shed light on the way you want to go.

    I still think half of you are manipulative, misogynistic fucks though

    Good thing you think this. This way, when you become one of those, and you will become one of those, you'll know you're wrong and doesn't have to dwell in that place.
    It might help you bearing in mind that the same way all women are like that, so are all men. We are all remarkably simple creatures, heavily hardwired, you'll hate women less for pursuing their goals once you stop from repressing and discouraging yourself from pursuing yours.

    I've got no experience with relationships (...) Advice?

    Experience in long term relationships might be hard and painful to gain. DO have casual sex and fuck around for a while to purge your scarcity, so at least you'll root in the knowledge that sex and affection don't come exclusively from them. It'll help you leaving bad ones.

    While I wouldn't mind (...) lots of you disdain that?

    There are two reasons for this disdain. A monogamous relationship and a nuclear family aren't your hardwired goal for life, it's something you've been indoctrinated to see as such, to make you tame and exploitable. You need to break free of that, and since you're obviously inheriting the idea from your upbringing, you obviously haven't.
    The second issue is that this arrangement carries the backdoor to strip men from all the joy in their lives and make them resources producing and emotional soothing machines for their partners, family and/or the society, and women have learned how to hack this backdoor so thoroughly they now believe they're ENTITLED to its existence and its benefits.
    Monogamous nuclear families have been a working solution for centuries though, but the social standards would guard the backdoors for men. These days, they don't, AND they somehow shame men into maintaining them. Because of that, for you to have a monogamous relationship you need to guard the backdoors on your own, not an easy task no matter how you want to do it.
    In this environment, many people here are skeptical that this arrangement is still a feasible one, that it is still a good way for men to live. But lots of guys here still try it. I'm trying it. Once you understand your environment, no one here will make the choice or be preachy for you. We're preachy towards plugged in fellows, because they'll chose wrong.

    Without ever having a network male friends and unsure of how to even start building one, how do I make friends and get invited to social events?

    HIGHLY context specific answer. Frequent places where there are men your age (gym?), invite them to hang. No need to be shy.

    I realize now I'm going about it all backwards, but how do you recover respect in relationships/interactions where you've already set a weak first impression?

    Unless you made a weak first impression and reinforced it for years, time resets it quickly. We don't remember folks that made weak first impressions. Some weeks tops. With either men or women.
    That said, people WILL stereotype you and treat you according to it though. Some people, mostly women, ARE resistant to others trying to change the labels they initially gave them for a more attractive one. As a guy that has robotics and coding as hobbies that are disconnected from his work and reads a lot, that's a proud nerd, believe me: DITCH THE NERDY VIBES. Easy to do, work out, get big, and it'll be solved.

    It's easy to feel discouraged and like you have to wait for the next life reset.

    The changes are quick. Most people don't put effort on that, so once you do you learn fast. Same for "missing out" and the alike.
    Also, the "reset" idea is an illusion. There are a lot of different and mostly disconnected scenes going on around you, you can walk among them.

    [–]RedPillRobin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Brother, I have a very similar background. Grew up fundamental king James bible believing evangelical. The red pill is a philosophy not a religion. Thing about it is once you see it...You can't unsee it.

    Remembering how everyone always tells you take the Bible in context? Well take your life in context of the femcentric reality we live in. Be thankful you got this at your age. Trust me that stuff about your SMV going up is true!!! 30 is so much better than 20.

    If your wise.

    [–]stylesm11 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Well articulated, sucks ass realizing our cultures leads men down a shit path, start lifting and keep gaining knowledge my dude

    [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    If you want the easiest aspect of TRP to swallow then start with self-improvement. Successful, fit, and confident men are valued.

    Without ever having a network male friends and unsure of how to even start building one, how do I make friends and get invited to social events?

    Read or audible "How to Win Friends and Influence People" by Dale Carnegie and "The Like Switch" by Jack Schafer. Social skills are just that - skills.

    [–]11-Eleven-11 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    It might interest you to cross post this to r/rpchristian . I'm in a similar boat as you with the same questions.

    e: sorry its r/rpchristians

    [–]Andgelyo 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    WTF dude can you put a TLDR? Once I see the word virgin I immediately don’t bother reading, but I do want to help you. Bitch ass niggas will probably downvote me for being lazy to read, but fuck them too.

    [–]ShotgunTRP 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    1) learn to compress your communication. Too many words does not make you smarter. Learn to talk to your audience not for yourself. Your story is super standard, no need to harp on like its special.

    2) don’t focus on relationships as the end goal. You need to work on your own goals that are bigger than that. You need to vet women for the one who meets your standards. You will never do this clinging to the first one who shows a couple green flags

    3) good luck with your power couple. Women are bombarded with super high smv dudes all day. Learn to spin plates. This will give you the abundance confidence and mental grit you will need to manage a ltr. What they say is “trp on hard mode”

    4) find dudes with similar interests. Similar skills are involved with gaming girls applies to maintaining male friendships. Learn to banter. Become comfortable with banter

    5) don’t over invest in ROP. It’s good but there’s other more important shit like flogging the sidebar

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

    [–]laughatthisin20years[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Thank you! Yeah, I'll hit you up once things settle down over here

    [–]2comment 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    I still think half of you are manipulative, misogynistic fucks though, and I can't deny that some of the stuff I've been openly reading, while not at all explicitly bad, still leaves a very dirty taste in my mouth.

    It sounds like the other half gotta stop slacking.

    My advice is to stop painting yourself as a victim, a wholly passive outlook on life depending on handouts from some self-acclaimed moral authority, and become a doer. Everyone is a victim somehow (pity we all didn't wake up in heaven) which is why there is so much jockeying for top spots on the victimhood totempole.

    Your autobiography reads of victimhood, your chastisement of us, and even what you revile (most versions of Christianity: top figure is a literal scapegoat and his authority derives from suffering for your sins) is tinged with the same theme.

    Once you let go of that mentality, then you can assume self-responsibility and build yourself up.

    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Following Christ makes you an Alpha male, if you truly abide by the words in the Bible. All of my male friends are leaders of their social groups and attract many. They are all Christian. That is not the sole purpose of becoming Christian though. Anyways, be easy yall.

    [–]AllgBeamtenrecht 7 points8 points  (0 children)

    There's still a lot of women-hating bullshit in this community and shame on you all for allowing it,

    this here is one of the very few places in western society, where men can talk as they please, and vent as they need. you dont shame anyone here you cuck. especially not as a virgin with zero experience in womanese. now get to work. i smell snowflake, why would you write all this detailed shit about your life, ask yourself this. i was like you when i came here and still work through my ego

    [–]anusbleach11111 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    expecting people to read all that

    You’re not special go lift and get a respectable job and be a man for the sake of being a man

    [–]IVIaskerade -3 points-2 points  (6 children)

    TL;DR lol

    TRP doesn't exist to validate pukes like you.

    [–]collingiles 1 point2 points  (5 children)

    No, I think that's exactly why it exists, actually. What, you think it exists to put you up on a goddamn pedestal? Fuck off.

    [–]IVIaskerade -2 points-1 points  (4 children)

    that's exactly why it exists, actually.

    If you think you should receive validation just because you ask for it, you're an idiot.

    [–]collingiles 2 points3 points  (3 children)

    No, you should receive guidance. What do you think the purpose of this post is? I read this and I see "I am beta. I want to be alpha" if that's not what this sub is for, I must have clicked the wrong link

    [–]IVIaskerade -1 points0 points  (2 children)

    What do you think the purpose of this post is?

    It literally says "Make me feel better"

    Yeah, they're asking for help. They're also asking for validation so they don't have to make actual changes.

    [–]laughatthisin20years[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Shit man, if I wasn't here to change I wouldn't be here at all

    [–]collingiles 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Re read the post