Why make plating the goal? Isn't LTR with kids the endgame? (self.asktrp)

submitted by vudewNL

Look i get the benefit of plating to build your skill and confidence level.

But let's be honest live is short and brutal. And tragedy will hit you sooner or later. What good is it to plate until your late 40's. To late to create offspring (who want's to have a kid that is 16 when you are in your 60's..).

Who will be by your side when tragedy strikes, what will you have left?

It seems to me that TRP although it being an sexual strategy of immense value. I always feel kind of sad when i read posts about guys in their 40's talking about how they are plating so many woman.

I don't dismiss of plating, but i just cannot see it as an goal on itself. I get that having the abundance mindset and good frame and lot's of practice makes you high value. But shouldn't plating be seen as an means to an end rather then an goal on it's own?

TD:DR; Should TRP put more emphasis on getting into an LTR with an high value woman where you can have kids with?

[–]mcr00sterdota 81 points82 points  (4 children)

Up to the individual, some people on TRP want kids and a lot don't. If you want kids then go for it, just don't marry a post-wall slut and end up getting divorce raped.

[–]averageredditcuck 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Prenuptial agreement

[–]Ricky469 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Prenups are theoretically great but not foolproof especially if you are wealthy. Add in the fact that no prenup can stipulate child support, that is left to a family court after a divorce.

[–]averageredditcuck 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh yeah, it's not all encompassing, but it's better than being without any defense at all

[–]know_your_path 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yep lol

[–]atlastic1 41 points42 points  (14 children)

The point of TRP is that women are not goals at all, whichever way you choose to consume.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

The goal is to do what you want.

[–]Andorli 17 points18 points  (10 children)

I do not think anybody should be asking this question. The only person who can make that decision is you alone. There are plenty of guys here who have no clue about the depth of redpill, who will just repeat what they hear countless times (oh but divorce rape, oh but AWALT, oh but but...). The truth is, this depends on the country you live, its laws, your social status, family you are in, are you getting arranged marriage(highly recommended), will you be able to spin plates once you are married (do you even want to do that? or perhaps you want be faithful husband (lol)) and etc. etc.

Obviously most men want to have children at some point in their live, since biologically we are programmed to create offspring. And obviously in order to raise a child in healthy environment he/she will need a mother. In Soviet Union family values were strongly promoted and people leaned towards that lifestyle and women wanted to get married early. Today's reality is different, with all the western bullshit liberal values, social media, pop culture etc. is making women more slutty and hypergamous than ever. And if we had social controls in place to mitigate this before (In soviet union being a divorced woman you would be considered trash, i know this might not be fair in all cases but it prevented a lot of women from becoming sluts or divorcing on a whim and instead encouraged them to work on the family), now there are no controls especially in the west where a divorced woman reaps all benefits while virtually paying nothing for her deeds, even if she is the one being unfaithful. So it would be impossible to provide the kind of answer you are expecting since there too many factors in place that determine whether you should or should not get married and what are proper conditions for it.

As a last note, I personally do recommend getting married but then again I don't live in Europe or America and in my country we still have some family values etc.

[–]wanderer779 5 points6 points  (0 children)

One thing you'll find if you come to the states is that socioeconomic class means a helluva lot. It's mostly poor guys getting divorce raped. Upper middle class people who came from two parent families tend to be more stable. And they have enough money to handle divorce.

Once you get to a certain level divorce doesn't hurt as much. Let's say you get divorced after the kids are out and you have say $4m combined net worth. The wife has worked and you get a good lawyer and she's not totally crazy/vindictive, which is of course the big gamble, and you just split it 50/50. Then you got $2m net worth, plus you're probably at a decent place in your career. Kids aren't that affected, they've got their own lives now and have mostly already been molded.

Contrast that with some lower middle class guy making 30k and a wife who works as a waitress. You're both stressed out, it affects the kids, the schools aren't as good, you fight a lot. She probably came from a bad family and has issues with men. She has more of an us vs. them mentality when it comes to men. She isn't happy, she has shitty friends who have divorced their shitty husbands talking in her ear all the time, along with the TV that she spends all her leisure time watching pounding in the feminist message. Cue the divorce playbook - DV allegations, you're out of the house, stress starts to get you, you get fired, can't pay child support, go to jail, now it's in arrears, you lose your head and start drinking, kids are all fucked up now, and on and on. This is what I and I'm suspecting a lot of my fellow TRPers saw growing up and why we are so against marriage.

[–][deleted]  (8 children)


    [–]Andorli 6 points7 points  (5 children)

    No it is not, most people who come to TRP are either ex-incels, people who went through horrible relationships, breakups, nice-guys etc. And to them marriage or commitment seems like the worst deal ever since never in their lives they had a fulfilling relationship that actually contributed value to them, or even if they had it they never could properly maintain it. So plating is the best deal since you do not commit, you get to keep your feelings secured and do not expose yourself to possibility of oneitis which everybody fear so much etc. Plus if you look at top value men who are getting divorce raped you understand that nobody is secure from hypergamy.

    In reality however all you have to do is be a fucking man, it is that simple. Be a man and stand by your decisions and maintain your frame. Live life openly and genuinely. If you want to have LTR with a girl but you do not do it out of FEAR then I have a newsflash for you, at your core you are BETA.

    All actions come from intentions. There is no Alpha action or Beta action. If you protect a woman because you are hoping to get sex out of her later then you are a "nice-guy", white knight beta scum. If you protect a woman because you are genuinely concerned for a strangers well-being and have properly accessed that that person is in danged (lets say being attacked by a thief) then that action does not make you a white knight, it makes you a strong human being, a male role model from way back, before all this bullshit and liberalization has started.

    I know I am bouncing between topics here, but the truth is your simple question has a lot of nuances behind it and everything is connected. All top 1% men I know in my country are married and have a family and all of them promote their offspring, try to get better jobs and titles for their children. Come to think of it all elites of this world hold close together as clans, or family. This should show you that family is not a loser's option, having proper family and being close with your relatives is what enables you to be strong. However inexperienced or newbie TRP readers will just repeat what they read here so much regarding how marriage is bad etc. There was a good post here regarding Marriage 2.0 which showed that marriage today has lost its original value.

    Bottom line do your own research and come to your own conclusions and it will take you a long time to fully internalize and make all the connections but once you start seeing the big picture it will be easier to make those decisions.

    [–]new__vision 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    This is one of the most insightful comments I've seen on TRP.

    Many men have only experienced a LTR as a low-value man with a low-quality girl. They wrongly conclude that all LTRs are hell.

    It's not the action that defines "alpha" or "beta", but the place it's coming from. Do you help the girl because you're a white knight hoping for sex? Or because you're a masculine man and it's your nature? Do you operate from abundance or scarcity? Is your cup of value overflowing or empty? Value is defined as survival/reproductive fitness and good emotions.

    A LTR entered from a place of scarcity and low-value will be hell. But a LTR entered from a place of abundance and value can be excellent for a man's life and mission, assuming he is already a man of status.

    I recommend anyone interested in LTRs read this 8-part series of articles from the sidebar: http://a.trp.red/3r

    [–]BewareTheOldMan 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    If you protect a woman because you are genuinely concerned for a stranger's well-being and have properly accessed that person is in danger...it makes you a strong human being

    Exactly - I explained this concept a while back to some hardcore fatalist from Eastern Europe - providing assistance with at least a phone call or notification to law enforcement/authorities makes sense. There is no danger in making a phone call or activating police response while ensuring your own personal safety.

    I’ve been to places in the world where people do terrible things to each other for the sake of instilling fear, intimidation, and perpetuating general violence. It would bother me on some level as a human if I didn’t intervene in some way.

    Being Red Pill doesn’t mean you lose compassion for others…no need to be a selfish, uncaring, and unfathomable jerk.

    [–][deleted]  (2 children)


      [–]TheRedPillMonkey -1 points0 points  (1 child)

      There are many on this sub who've had their iron clad prenups thrown out the window. I have no experience here, but enough field reports have come in to make me assume a prenup is going to be thrown out 10 seconds after divorce is filed, even if she cheats.

      [–]kemchik 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Nope, it does not work like that. The reason of the divorce is important as well and will be considered. The only thing that is not negotiable is the child support

      [–]No1Buck 3 points4 points  (0 children)

      Found the tradcon.

      [–]mrHappyPotatoe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      they usually also do not give the backstory why they give that advice. if you take time and learn the red pill ideas and some book you start to understand why main advice is to spin plaptes. it actually is very similar to buddha teachings imo if to look big picture.

      [–]epistemic_humility 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Cheers man. Good pointing that out, you're right. On one hand ltr are hard and hazardous but on the other they're exactly what I enjoy about women and home life. If my ltr fails I plate a bunch and settle into another one. Even my current ltr hit a rough spot but I have outcome independence I'll be okay either way and abundance mentality in that I know I can plate more to find another.

      Not many trp folks seems to seriously consider LTR could be due to them not being able to actually get in one with a hot señorita. They could still be crazy but Hey your social studies teacher in fifth grade could have been crazy, your uncle might be. Humans are odd.

      Your perspective is refreshing OP. I feel ya.

      [–]Steve_Chiv 4 points5 points  (0 children)

      LTR is def the endgame. Dudes around here think they're going to be 50 year old billionaires fucking 18 year olds. Don't be fucking stupid. Find a submissive girl and guide her into being a wife.

      [–]wanderer779 2 points3 points  (2 children)

      If that's what you want then go for it. I think TRP overestimates the chance of ending up in a shitty marriage. My guess is a lot of the guys here saw a lot of carnage growing up, or maybe even experienced it for themselves, and decided it wasn't worth it.

      Make no mistake the rules are against you. If the woman wants to fuck you over the rules are definitely set up for it. Your kids get brainwashed into hating masculinity and belittling fathers. All that stuff is definitely true. Marriage and family ain't what it used to be for a lot of guys. But some guys still manage to pull it off. I know some who have. I have to admit they don't really command the respect they use to, but they have happy families and their wives aren't total harpies.

      With that being said I still refuse to get married. I'm too old to start down that road.

      But if you're young and you want to do it I say go for it. You only live once. But know going it that you're wagering a helluva lot. If you do it right it's kind of like betting your whole net worth & then some on a hand of poker. So you better make sure you've got a damn strong hand. No sluts, no girls from broken homes, no gold diggers.

      [–][deleted]  (1 child)


        [–]BewareTheOldMan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Should this not be the emphasis of TRP...finding a girl who is the best partner you can possibly find?

        TRP is focused toward self-improvement and ensuring your life-mission and personal goals. Women are a byproduct of that effort and NEVER the main goal or focus of a man’s life – the point being that if a woman leaves, is disloyal, or disrespectful in any way you simply terminate the relationship and continue your life-mission/goals.

        So many men have made the mistake of investing everything into a woman only to be hugely disappointed, so I understand the overall sentiment to Spin Plates. Fact is, however, establishing a true legacy via wife and kids in a stable and loving two-parent home is the best environment. Children being reared by a happily married couple is not a guarantee of positive childhood outcome, but research and empirical data reflects this produces the best results. That – and now you have children and eventual grandchildren to carry the family name into the future. Think…Kennedy, Carnegie, Trump, and Rockefeller family legacies. Those families don’t happen if no one ever gets married.

        I feel like so many men are going to miss out on their most meaningful journey in life because of this.

        Men are not missing out. There have always been lifelong bachelors in society. The new millennium has brought more bachelors because women are literally the worst candidates for marriage right now than at any point in history. Many don’t want to cook, clean, marry, have babies, or raise a family until much later in life – if they want that at all. By that time, however, many women have been passed around like a Kardashian and those women don’t deserve Good Men…but will whine and complain otherwise about how men refuse to "Man Up."

        Bottom Line – if women were worth the trouble, men would be eager to marry, produce children, and create family legacies.

        You ask a great question…and these guys at TRP talk a mean Plate Game, but quite a few at some point will eventually find a woman who fits their ideal. TRP is a tool that can be used to assist the process to ensure men don’t get taken advantage of...if and when they eventually marry. That’s a better way to use TRP knowledge. It’s not just about Spinning Plates until age 50 and beyond.

        You genuinely seem interested in a serious LTR leading to marriage versus Spinning Plates. As someone who has done all three (marriage/kids, divorce, and Spinning Plates) and currently in a happy and fulfilling LTR, Private Message (PM) me if you want additional advice.

        [–]LeonardoDiDraperBond 3 points4 points  (10 children)

        Who says plating is the endgoal? Everyone has different endgoals, if you want to have a LTR and kids in the end you can use plating as a stepping stone for this.

        Plating is useful for scouting and vetting potential LTR's. It also teaches you the true nature of women's sexuality and hypergamy.

        TRP is about giving you the tools to achieve your goals. Take from it the things that speak to you, leave behind the things that don't.

        [–][deleted]  (9 children)


          [–]LeonardoDiDraperBond 3 points4 points  (0 children)

          Supply and demand. Most guys that find theredpill are not in the phase yet where they want to think about getting married and having kids.

          [–]nummas 0 points1 point  (4 children)

          That because a majority of people on here see no value in marage, myself included. And maybe half see no value in having children, once again, myself included. What value do you see in marage?

          [–][deleted]  (3 children)


            [–]nummas 0 points1 point  (2 children)

            You don't think you have it in you to provide a stable environment without the need to get married? What difference does signing a piece of paper and wasting money on a party to put a woman on the highest pedestal make?

            [–][deleted]  (1 child)


              [–]nummas 0 points1 point  (0 children)

              I'm listening.

              [–]Launch_On_Warning 4 points5 points  (0 children)

              “Isn’t LTR with kids the endgame?”

              Oh yeah, it’s the endgame alright. Very much the end.

              [–]minoc_uo 1 point2 points  (2 children)

              Best medicine goes to people with money.

              [–][deleted]  (1 child)


                [–]minoc_uo 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                You kinda go on about having someone care for you in hard time. Having money gets you the best treatment.

                [–]LateralThinker13 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                TD:DR; Should TRP put more emphasis on getting into an LTR with an high value woman where you can have kids with?

                Honestly, this is why I read the /r/redpillwomen subreddit more than this one - they look at relationship/commitment in an RP relationship in many ways that TRP for men does not. I think TRP does focus on dating/plating sexual strategy almost to the exclusion of long-term relationship (i.e. marriage) sexual strategy, and it does so to its detriment.

                The issue you have has been bad enough that I've considered starting a subreddit with a name like LTR-RP-Male or some such.

                Red pill wisdom is very useful, true, and empowering. But I get that you find this sub... lacking in LTR advice. All I can tell you is that red pill advice works regardless of how many women you have on your plate. It just isn't tailored to the nuances of LTRs.

                [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                TRP is simply a tool. Build with it what you want. Having said that, I agree that there is way too much emphasis on plates and almost no talk about being red pilled and married.

                [–]SocialJusticeWhiner 3 points4 points  (1 child)

                Black Dragon's blog has good info on this. Really you're not ready for an OLTR (open long term relationship) until you're 35. Too immature before then. He doesn't believe in monogamy and it's very likely not the default system in nature either. When you're with a girl and she's your only source of sex and she throws a fit or becomes pissed off over stupid bullshit prepare for no sex for an extended period of time. If you don't check her right away as is common in LTRs when your game isn't super strong the drama and bullshit starts to add up and she will likely need to be soft nexted in order for her to figure out her emotional bullshit. It sounds great to live with a girl and have someone who will always be with you and love you but thays not realistic. She will at best get cold to you if you're going through an extended down period and at worst jump on another cock. Don't count on anyone for your happiness besides yourself.

                It becomes much easier to maintain frame and not let other people's decision hurt you if you have options. Fucking other women (even if it's just purely a sexual relationship and not emotional) makes you aware that you're still desireable which will help you keep a healthy vibe thus keeping your OLTR relationship in better balance.

                Average amount of sex in a US LTR is around sex once a week. Is that enough for you? Very likely what you're going to get.

                [–]RedHoodhandles 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                You should be higher to the top. I was searching for an answer like this in here.

                [–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen 6 points7 points  (8 children)

                Oh. What a unique question. It has never been discussed before, so you better do not search this sub and the main sub...


                [–][deleted]  (7 children)


                  [–]2SirKolbath -2 points-1 points  (4 children)

                  I looked for this question but could not find it.

                  Sounds like you didn't look hard enough.

                  But it seems your response is appropriate to 95% of the questions here. It's all seems pretty redundant.

                  You're pretty damn judgy for somebody who's new here. Who are you to claim that a 40 year old spinning plates is sad? Isn't that up to them? it doesn't seem to be any of your business.

                  To answer your actual question, the endgame is different for every person. I was married for two decades to a woman I realize now wasn't worth two years. I detest abortion and regret that we had one, but I am damn glad I didn't have to explain to a 13 year old girl why her mother felt like we weren't any fun anymore and took off.

                  Because you haven't read the sidebar, you are clearly not aware that the endgame of TRP is not spinning plates. If I had to sum it up in one sentence I would say that the goal of TRP is relentless male personal responsibility and Improvement.

                  So when are you going to start?

                  [–][deleted]  (3 children)


                    [–]2SirKolbath -1 points0 points  (2 children)

                    Pardon me, but I believe absolutely nothing of what you claim. The fact that you are asking basic questions discussed in the subtext of the sidebar shows that you have failed to internalize the material properly.

                    Men who are as successful as you claim to be do not ask questions of this nature. They are too busy living their lives and constantly working to improve themselves.

                    [–][deleted]  (1 child)


                      [–]kemchik 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                      Please remember that you are talking to divorced guy so his view on marriage and LTR will be biased.

                      @SirKolbath What do you do for living?

                      [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                      Well shit doesnt change that much. Its not like you woke up today as the first person to think "hmmm, kids and a wife. Interesting idea."

                      There is a whole married subreddit.

                      To answer your question LTR and kids is one late goal. Not the goal.

                      [–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen -1 points0 points  (0 children)

                      it seems your response is appropriate to 95% of the questions here. It's all seems pretty redundant.

                      ding ding ding

                      [–]McVaghunter 3 points4 points  (10 children)

                      Plating is to get laid, it doesn't have a deep philosophical meaning. It's just you fulfilling your sexual desires, that's it.
                      Monogamy is unrealistic; men weren't designed to stick to one pussy their entire life.
                      Some people want children but nowadays it's not worth it; too expensive and risky.
                      You want someone to take care of you when tragedy strikes or when you get older? Get a retirement plan, it's cheaper than a wife and children, and more secure (Your wife and children may die in an accident when you're older, assuming you weren't devoice raped before that happens).

                      I don't dismiss of plating, but i just cannot see it as an goal on itself.

                      Who the fuck said plating is the goal?! Your mission is the goal. Achieve it and die the same way all decaying matter does.

                      [–]ckmtpm 1 point2 points  (9 children)

                      A retirement plan can drive you to medical appointments, make funeral arrangements when you’re grieving for a loved one, etc.? I don’t see how a retirement plan could substitute for having real human support in times of need. Friends will only do so much because at the end of the day, they have their own families to care for, too.

                      [–]McVaghunter -1 points0 points  (8 children)

                      they have their own families to care for

                      Only if these men were lucky enough to be part of the small minority who dodged divorce and didn't lose their families in tragic accidents. Then what?

                      These men spent most of their life in a sexless marriage, having sex few times every decade with the same old woman, and for what? Just for someone to take care of them when they can't wipe their own asses after they gotten really old?!

                      Let's say one can't take care of himself after he reaches 70 yo, and dies at 80. He sacrificed 40 sexless years of his life (by being with one woman between the ages of 30 and 70) just to have children to take care of him for 10 years (from 70 to 80). Is it worth it?

                      [–]ckmtpm 0 points1 point  (7 children)

                      Small minority? In what world? I’d say the vast majority of middle-aged men are married with families. The divorce rate is not as high as you seem to believe it is.

                      The rumor that this sub is full of ex-incels and men who never witnessed a healthy relationship growing up, rings true.

                      Having a strong, emotional bond with someone is valuable beyond just having someone to “wipe your ass” when you’re older. It’s about having a true partner—there with you through thick and thin, a rock to lean on and trust. And if a relationship is healthy, there will obviously be intimacy more than a few times every decade. What you’re describing is a very sad, deteriorated marriage/relationship but that doesn’t hold true for all marriages or relationships.

                      This viewpoint is very jaded, and makes me feel sorry for people who think this way. When you develop a real bond with someone, it’s a wonderful thing.

                      [–]RedHoodhandles 0 points1 point  (3 children)

                      Will you be his rock when he has hard times and is falling into pieces? I don't think so.

                      [–]ckmtpm 1 point2 points  (2 children)

                      Of course I would be. I'm not sure why you would assume otherwise. At this point, I am actually the more successful one of the two of us, anyhow.

                      You honestly sound bitter because the girl (girls?) you liked didn't care for you back. But that doesn't mean mutually loving relationships don't exist--it just means you haven't had the privilege of experiencing one.

                      [–]RedHoodhandles 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                      I really shouldn't reply because you're not even trying to rationally explain your point and go straight to insults instead.

                      You assume that I am bitter and that I haven't had the privilige of experiencing mutually loving relationships. Now what? Feel good? Even if either one of that would be true my argument still stands.

                      If he goes down you would be there supporting him for a while but if he wouldn't get his shit together, you would be gone rather fast. Your sexual attraction to him would take a hit anyway and your love is dependant on him having his shit together. It doesn't mean that you are not mutually loving each other. It just means that he is the rock you can fall back on and that it doesn't work the other way.

                      [–]ckmtpm 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                      I’m not being rational when you’re the one making bizarre assumptions about an Internet stranger’s relationship dynamics? Alright. We are each other’s rocks at this point—he is no more mine than I am his. It’s frankly quite insulting for you to assume that he’s my rock but I’m not his.

                      And as I’m the more successful one (and by far more financially stable because of my background), I don’t “need” him to “fall back on” — not now, not ever. We are there for each other because we want to be.

                      [–]McVaghunter 0 points1 point  (2 children)

                      Having a strong, emotional bond with someone

                      Fucking hell! You're a woman, aren't you?

                      [–]kemchik 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                      REEEEEEEEE FEMALES!!!!!! BURN THEM !!!!!!!

                      You are incel right?

                      [–]chachaChad 1 point2 points  (3 children)

                      Who will be by your side when tragedy strikes, what will you have left?

                      That's your problem right there. You're looking for something outside yourself that you're not going to find.

                      [–][deleted]  (2 children)


                        [–]chachaChad 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                        What exactly do you think having those children around your death bed is going to do for you?

                        [–]DopeMeme_Deficiency 1 point2 points  (4 children)

                        Only if you want to pay to be used, mistreated, and rarely fucked. Good luck with that

                        [–]Lego_My_Alter_Eggo 2 points3 points  (3 children)

                        Oh, and have your Genes propogate to the next generation successfully.

                        [–]DopeMeme_Deficiency 1 point2 points  (2 children)

                        When I was young, I cared. Now i realize just how inconsequential I am, and if my line of genetics dies off, neither the planet, nor the species are worse for the ware.

                        [–]RedHoodhandles 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                        Very freeing thought, isn't it.

                        [–]DopeMeme_Deficiency 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        It is. I used to feel so much pressure because my family line ends with me. I felt I needed to have kids or it was the end of everything. The rest of my family is gone, and I'm alone, and it doesn't matter. It is incredibly freeing

                        [–]Kommanderdude 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        Everyone has a different end game.

                        [–]king_of_red_alphas 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        IMO the practical value of this is that it will make you certain that you are not ending up with a girl just to “not be alone”.

                        Almost all of my LTR’s when I was younger were entered into for this reason. I didn’t even feel I had the “right” to walk away.

                        That lead to a lot of wasted time obviously.

                        It also serves to really allow you to understand that what your heart / dick wants is not necessarily the same thing that makes for good LTR material.

                        [–]SilkTouchm 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        My end goal is being rich.

                        [–]kemchik 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        I think your question just break asktrp

                        [–]RedHoodhandles 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        You do understand that you don't need to marry to become a father? You do understand that you don't need to live in an exclusive, i.e. monogamous LTR to become a father?

                        If you want to become a father I would focus on finding a woman that would make a good mother. Neiher (ex-)sluts make good mothers (bad impulse control/destructive behaviour/lowered pair bonding ability) nor mothers from broken homes (self-explanatory).

                        Living in a monogamous LTR to foster children or even marrying for it, isn't a deal I am planning to do. And I'd say, with feminism gone nuts worldwide, neither should you. In the end it is up to you. GL.

                        [–]Bear-With-Bit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        For those on the fence about having kids, check out the childfree sub. Also look on YouTube "Doug Stanhope on Overpopulation." I myself don't have kids and considering getting snipped soon.

                        [–]quicklogaccount 0 points1 point  (6 children)

                        Should TRP put more emphasis on getting into an LTR with an high value woman where you can have kids with?

                        A short answer for you bro. No.

                        You are messing up precisely the one shit you shouldn't.
                        You live to eat, fuck and survive. Eating and surviving are granted for you these days, so you the only biological mission you'll struggle with is fucking.
                        Sex wise, because you are a male, you'll inevitably derive the most benefit from it, the biggest fulfillment, by enacting your earnest polygamy and fucking a lot of different women.

                        Now, those are your biological drives. What you are talking about is a reason for existence. This is a big question since existence itself became so pointless when our biological hard wiring, the stuff we actually feel urge to do, became basically granted.
                        You're bugging a lot about the subject because it is driving you to contemplate your own mortality. Now, your solution to it is the very core of the matrix and the blue pill, it is the belief that you'll only be "truly" fulfilled with a woman, and by raising offspring. That simply isn't true, not even under PC lens. A lot of fucking amazing people never had children, a lot of damn amazing ones were and are gay.

                        The only reason to perpetrate this belief you hold is to use it to exploit you man.

                        [–][deleted]  (5 children)


                          [–]quicklogaccount -1 points0 points  (4 children)

                          That's the catch.
                          You can find a lot of stuff to really engage yourself in your line of work, maybe some hobby, some passion. And it doesn't matter how you plan your future, you SHOULD find such a thing.

                          Families and kids kind of cause you to love and find such a fulfillment by standard. It's an "easy way" to find it. By making you believe it is the ONLY way, you also are made prone to believe that your only "real" purpose is to eventually serve a woman's needs, for them bearing kids is a biological urge.

                          That is not the ONLY way and you don't need to find a good woman and prove yourself worthy of her to you can get the privilege to serve her. It should go the other way around: A woman finds you and puts effort into being so amazing that she convinces you that you should spare some of the time you could be spending on far different and bigger things into having a family with her.

                          Having a family is not a need of yours. It is a (good) option. But it is a need for women. By blinding you to your other options they make it easier to believe that your needs are the same as women's and feed you the same formula, but they aren't. You'll be frustrated that way.

                          [–]ckmtpm 3 points4 points  (3 children)

                          Why is it a need for women? Asking as a woman with no such “biological urge” to have children.

                          [–]quicklogaccount 0 points1 point  (2 children)

                          Maybe some people escape their biological overlords, there are genuinely asexual folks. But we've all bumped in women into the baby fever or baby frenzy here and you'll find articles about the biological clock and baby fever.
                          So, as a first, unappealing answer: You can see it, therefore it exists.

                          "Why" is a bit harder. My guess is that evolution had its time to make each gender fulfill "spread your genes" the best way it can. Men evolved incapable of ever being sure that infants were fathered by them so our biological tyrant must be fulfilled by fucking around, by doing so some children must be ours, while chicks evolved to have no doubts or alternatives as to passing on their genes, so they'll anguish about it.
                          This also accounts for why women are so worried about the emotional bond of their partner's affairs and we are so focused on sex. We don't want to be cucks.

                          [–]ckmtpm 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                          Sure but I think it’s a bit silly to pretend as if women are the only ones who want or “need” to procreate/have a family. You can “see” both genders wanting children, thus, it exists both ways, by your logic.

                          [–]quicklogaccount 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          The mechanism varies, that's what lies under the "why".
                          You evolved to be "sure" that your genes have passed on by bearing children. We evolved to raise our chances by fucking around. It's the same need but its met by different mechanics. We need to fuck. At some point you need to bear children.

                          Just look at a guy in a dead bedroom marriage. He suffers like hell, his needs aren't being met. Hers are. Hence why I told OP that feeding both men and women the same formula makes up for frustrated men.

                          [–]Senior EndorsedVasiliyZaitzev 0 points1 point  (2 children)

                          But let's be honest live is short and brutal.

                          Nasty, brutish and short, in Hobbes calculation.

                          To late to create offspring

                          Too late for women.

                          (who want's to have a kid that is 16 when you are in your 60's..).

                          From an economic standpoint, that might be the best time to have them, assuming one has built one's value over time.

                          Who will be by your side when tragedy strikes, what will you have left?

                          This is a version of The Myth of the Lonely Old Man

                          It is designed to get men to think: "Oooh! What if I wind up alone? I'd better go wife up a post-WallSPLAT! slut in a hurry!"

                          But I see the flaw in your plan: what if tragedy strikes and your wife divorce-rapes you, takes all of your assets and your even more fucked than you would have been anyway. Newsflash: women don't like losers, so if you become a quadriplegic you can expect your wife to split.

                          Of course the real answer to your question is: Get really good long term disability insurance.

                          I always feel kind of sad when i read posts about guys in their 40's talking about how they are plating so many woman.

                          I feel kind of sad when I read posts that say: "Young guys! Marry some girl quick so you can have kids!!"

                          First, not everyone wants kids.

                          Second, in the era of Marriage 2.0, getting married is a high-risk activity. More than half of marriages fail. Of those that don't at least half of what remains are medium-shitty. Then you have some ok ones, and then you have what? 1-5% that are high value? Do you like those odds?

                          But shouldn't plating be seen as an means to an end rather then an goal on it's own?

                          I don't think either should be a "goal on its own". I'm here to do what I do in life. If there are women who fit into my life comfortably [spoiler alert: there are] why not enjoy relationships with them, even OLTRs, instead of locking myself down to just one of them?

                          Look, if I'd followed your advice when I was younger, at best I'd be married to a late 40s chick. Maybe I'd have kids, maybe I wouldn't. Maybe I'd have gotten divorced-raped by now, too. Do you want to pay a woman to bang other guys and teach your kids to hate you? None for me, thanks.

                          Meanwhile, under my own plan, I maintain sexual relationships with multiple young women (19-25). No one woman is going to walk out the door with 100% of my pussy supply and no one woman is going to divorce rape me. And nothing prevents me from having kids with any of the women in my harem. Indeed, three of them have voiced a desire to do just that.

                          So tell me again, why is your way "better"?

                          getting into an LTR with an high value woman where you can have kids with?

                          LoL. The djinni wants to know what your other two wishes are. It's not the 1950s anymore.

                          [–]ComradeDurdenTRP -1 points0 points  (1 child)

                          But I see the flaw in your plan: what if tragedy strikes and your wife divorce-rapes you, takes all of your assets and your even more fucked than you would have been anyway.

                          Was about to say this. If/when tragedy strikes is exactly when you'll see who has your back and who's in your life only when things are going smooth. Do you think your special unicorn who's loyal and supportive will remain as such when you tell her that you've just been laid off and the two of you will have to curtail your standard of living by half for the foreseeable future? Or what if you get into a car accident that leaves you paralyzed from the neck down? You think your kids are going to show up at the hospital every single day to wipe your ass and make sure you're not suffering alone?

                          As a man, you're on your own for the majority of your life. If you have loving and supportive parents, consider yourself lucky but do realize that even they are just human and want/expect certain things from you. Be it vicariously living through you because they weren't able to accomplish their dreams or something as banal as you impregnating some chick just so that they can brag to all their friends that they're grandparents now.

                          No, nihilism is not the answer. Yes, you can still have healthy relationships w/ other people (plates, friends, colleagues, etc.) Just don't rely on others to be the panacea to whichever problem you have in life. Loneliness, lack of confidence, blue balls, etc.

                          [–]Chaddeus_Rex 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          Who will be by your side when tragedy strikes, what will you have left?

                          If you know TRP, you know that women won't be at your side when tragedy strikes.

                          You are still plugged in. Go read the sidebar.


                          [–]Disaster532385 -1 points0 points  (6 children)

                          So you can get divorce raped and lose half your stuff?

                          [–][deleted]  (5 children)


                            [–]Disaster532385 0 points1 point  (3 children)

                            And you think a high value woman can't screw you over? AWALT remember.

                            Yes there are marriages out there that work, but are you willing to take the risk?

                            [–]kemchik 2 points3 points  (1 child)

                            And you think random man/woman in street cannot kill you on a whim? AHALT (All human are like that)

                            Yes there are people that could walk safely from A to B, but are you willing to take the risk?

                            [–]Disaster532385 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                            What a shitty analogy lol. The odds of it happening aren't even close to the same.

                            [–]frendo223 -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

                            your “high value women” the “good girls” that are lawyers are twerking in bathroom stalls and writing my name on there ass after two message which is “9.4 inches” and then my dick vid lol. what don’t you understand and there’s millions of chads out there

                            [–]frendo223 -2 points-1 points  (2 children)

                            if giving your time, energy, and attention span to this one special unicorn girl being in an ltr while she bangs chads in ons is your thing, then go for it lol i actually want to encourage more people to do this it’s less competition for me if we didn’t have betas like you ltring these hoes while we slay them itd be more competition

                            none of these comments are redpilled this sub has been overan by low smv betas with oneitus wanting to have an ltr with these hoes

                            if you’re in a ltr, want a ltr, or even have a single thought about wanting an ltr you are not redpilled you aren’t even in the damn game lol. literally

                            some of you crazy blind il say this for 10000 time but some of you just still can’t comprehend this it is insane..

                            if you’re in a ltr you either

                            1. don’t believe in awalt

                            2. you know she’s fucking chads in ons but continue to give your time energy and attention span to this one special unicorn girl anyway(either due to low smv or oneitus)

                            it’s that simple.. literally. those are the two reasons

                            if you were pullin hoes and having 100s of hoes throwing themselves at you/were high smv the thought of an ltr would be laughable/almost disgusting you would say to yourself wtf is this shit lol

                            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                            Well it’s a bit much to assume that ALL females in LTRs are fucking chads. Many will, but clearly not all.

                            [–]mrHappyPotatoe -1 points0 points  (4 children)

                            Red Pill only offers you window through which you can see how sexual strategy actually is played off between sexes. It has nothing to do with what you think is right or wrong in life and what you should pick as your goal in life. you completely missed the red pill idea.

                            [–][deleted]  (3 children)


                              [–]new__vision 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                              There's not much emphasis on LTRs, but there have been some great LTR articles.

                              Check out the 8-part LTR series on the asktrp sidebar: https://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/1tjcbg/ltr_game_maintaining_frame/

                              [–]mrHappyPotatoe -1 points0 points  (1 child)

                              hmm. you are worrying about other people. its not your job. everyone will use red pill how they see it benefiot their life. we have over population anyway. these times governments arent that forgiving to men. especially 5 (18 to be foraml) - 45 year old white men to be more specifit all straight white men. its understanable why focus is taken off from "happy family life".

                              [–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (1 child)

                              I don't want kids, never have.

                              Fucked over 150 women, i'm 47. My youngest sub is 22. Vasectomy at 35.

                              "WHEN TRAGEDY STRIKES," YOU'LL BE ALONE.

                              You can't count on the familial bond, and even if you could, what a shitty reason to have kids.. to take care of me in my old age.

                              You're projecting your malaligned values.

                              Close to moralizing.

                              Your values aren't mine.

                              [–]Rollo_Mayhem3 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

                              For me the issue is not marriage or LTR per se, it is monogamy. I do not think we are a monogamous species and I am sure I will not be monogamous in any relationship. So the question I am asking myself is, why marry if I have no intention of keeping that commitment. I suppose unless you marry an extremely beautiful and young woman with a high sex drive that will remain faithful to you than I think marriage and monogamy is a losing deal for a man. Sure, he gets kids but look at what most men I have to do to maintain an average household/wife. While divorce rates in the US are disputed, I think the current statistic is roughly 20% or 1 in 5 marriages end in divorce. Some statistics put in up to a 50% rate when you control for the millennial co-habitation and waiting much longer to get married (which means the complete data is not in yet on this cohort).

                              Marriage seems like such a gamble now for the average US male. The economic cost of a middle-class life with a house, wife, 2 kids, 2 cars, college education, medical care, summer vacations...not to mention student loan debt and federal income taxes...is staggering. Oh and do not forget day-care if your wife also works a 9 to 5. The amount of financial stress alone is enormous pressure on the marriage. Then you have parenting the kids in a new hybrid social and technological landscape. All of this a tendency to isolate the male and increasingly either 1) keep him beta or 2) turn him into a beta AND then the risk of divorce, dead bedrooms, burnout, weight gain, and all the other ills of beta come creeping up on you...if your wife decides to leave, you are left a fucking emotional mess at BEST and at WORSE, you are left a fucking emotional and broke ass mess with little SMV to start over...

                              I talking about the perspective/prospects of average US middle class college educated male. Of course, I suppose things are worse for the working class and better for the wealthy yuppie lawyer (although he has more to lose, he can likely get back on his feet quicker assuming he does not lose it).

                              [–]blackedoutfast -1 points0 points  (0 children)

                              "well, RP is right about a lot of things, but isn't it better to look for a unicorn and still try achieve the blue pill fantasy"

                              [–]dylanrockz2002 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

                              i come here for a laugh tbh mate. i do very well with girls already (yes technically i am a virgin except for you mum last nigt hahahahah but i have fingered many girls in my day) but I digress. anyway im 15 and i am already swimming in clunge!! so im not too worried about what will happen in my late 40s, if i dont get killed by a mary jane overdose before then if you know what i mean XD SELECTA