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METAThe Direction of RPW. (self.RedPillWomen)

submitted by redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[M]

As many of you may have noticed, some of our mods have quit recently. I wanted to address that here, and discuss a little bit about our direction.

First, I'd like to let everybody know, they left on their own accord, we didn't force anybody out. Second, I'd like to say that the sub will benefit greatly from this move.

There are a lot of rumors going around as to why the mods left, and I wanted to clear that up so there's no confusion.

Ultimately it was a disagreement between them and me.

When I founded this sub, I founded it on one of the main principles that guide every subreddit in the red pill network: Value truth above all else. There was even a small image in the corner that said "It is better to be slapped with the truth than kissed by a lie."

Unfortunately, the old mod team were not living up to this standard. Rather than embrace truth and encourage open discussion that has make the red pill network subs as popular and successful as they are, they decided that a small clique of women had the one and only strategy to happiness, and anybody who disagreed with them should be banned. That includes a lot of very good contributors, and women who had simply come here for help and understanding.

And by clique, I really mean it. Watching behind the scenes, it played out like the movie Mean Girls. The discussions that took place between myself and the mod team were less about facing hard truths, and instead about who was on who's side and who said what to whom. It was a cat fight.

My original intention was not to disrupt the flow of this subreddit. I never disagreed with the clique on their strategy of marriage. It's a great goal to aspire towards for women. That said, there were some questions about the changing sexual landscape that were being censored. When honest discussion from a red pill perspective is being censored, that's when we knew we had trouble on our hands.

I did my best to appeal to the mod team, but at the end it didn't matter. They did not want to work with me towards the very goals this subreddit was founded upon, and it is my responsibility to the subscribers here to ensure that those principles stay in place.

Everything I feared in my introduction post ended up coming true:

The problem I've seen with female-based sexual strategy forums is that they inevitably focus on what's politically correct. They focus on tempering the message so as not to offend. Because ladies, like it or not, our entire culture currently revolves around not offending you. Seriously. That's today's culture. This forum will embarce truth first and foremost, sensitivity be damned. While I encourage people to remain positive towards each other, plain insults are discouraged, I understand that sometimes the truth will seem like an insult.

What's Not Changing

We're not starting up a Red Pill men explain sub here, this is a sub for women and female sexual strategy. The moderation policy will always be focused on positive female sexual strategy.

The accusation that we want to encourage a "plate school" is nonsense. Men who come to push their agendas (to benefit themselves) will still find themselves kicked out.

Per my original announcement:

RedPillWomen is not the place for men to show up and spout nonsense. We have an unofficial rule on /r/theredpill that basically amounts to: don't listen to women about sexual strategy. It's not that we don't like women, it's that women really have a hard time seeing past what they like to understand men have a different palate. The same goes for men, perhaps even worse so. Men, being the less discriminating gender, are more-or-less programmed to find women sexy.. no matter what. And when a woman says, "I like to eat pie with my fingers" you'll have sex-thirsty guys line up out the door willing to say anything for female validation. "I love women who eat with their fingers."

The goals

Our goals will be identical to my announcement post when we started. Finding long-term sexual strategies to maximize one's happiness and success. This hasn't changed.

We had a radical idea- what if men and women learned about their natures and took proactive control of them, came up with a compromise that made both parties happier in the long run?

We're a cooperative species, and great things can be achieved when we do. Women, you have the ability to find happiness when you embrace the reality of your biological urges and impulses. You have the ability and the requirement to become the optimal mate for your optimal mate. Do not believe the hype that you are good enough how you are, and realize that in life, the only things worth having take work. That's for men and women.

RedPillWomen is self-improvement and long-term goal setting to maximize your personal happiness.

I'm saddened that things had to play out the way they did, but my responsibility remains to you, the subscribers. I apologize for letting you down, and we will not allow this same culture to take over again.

For the next week

We will be working on reinstating the sidebar and stylesheets, as the old team saw fit to try to destroy anything they could on their way out, claiming that it was "theirs" rather than the community's.

We have a few RPW members who have stepped up and are committed to maintaining this vision. We are vetting the members now for the mod team.

And discussion will continue, business as usual.

Thank you.


[–]littlecrochetlady 18 points19 points  (1 child)

Honestly, I've been afraid to post many of my questions and responses to others' because I have felt they were not welcome. So I am excited about this change -- thank you so much /u/redpillschool !!!

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Welcome, welcome!

[–]zoebear22 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I'm still mainly a lurker so I don't know much about the internal politics but will be interesting to see where this sub goes now. On first impressions, I found the political correctness a bit stifling. This post seems like a good sign.

[–]lazysnakes 9 points10 points  (4 children)

This fracture is interesting and of course, as others have said, it remains to be seen how things play out. More forums to discuss redpill from different angles is something I welcome, in particular I find it helpful to read the differing advice from men and from women to women's problems (where the men have the improvement of a poster's relationship in mind). I also believe there is great value in having a separate woman-only space.

I think in future it's going to be very important for posters to be clear on their relationship goals when they ask questions, so the most appropriate advice can be given.

Reading through the comments and discussion you have had in this thread it became clear to me that I was holding some assumptions that were not necessarily true.

  • my understanding of RPW was that we were saying - we accept AWALT and we are going to try our hardest to not let those instincts get the better of us in order to be the best possible partners we can.

  • what you seem to be saying is - we accept AWALT and will leverage that understanding to achieve whatever goals we set out for ourselves

The second being much more in line with pure RP theory i.e. sexual strategy is amoral.

Knowing AWALT and having great girl game a woman could decide to get pregnant by (or divorced from) as many rich men as possible, in order to extract maximum resources from them.

That does sound hollow, as TRP's plate-spinning life sounds somewhat hollow. However, that is my value judgement, so arguably completely irrelevant. Nevertheless, implicit in a lot of RP discussions here is the belief that a woman will not be happy alone. There is no equivalent of MGTOW which gets respect in the manosphere (I may be wrong, am relatively new to this). Surely that is a value judgement inherent in redpill thinking? Are we saying now that that is not the case and that crazy cat lady is happy as Larry?

If this sub is going to be arguing back and forth as to whether to give in to hypergamy or not, I am not convinced anything useful will come of it. While rationally I agree it makes sense to discuss theory without value judgements, I am not sure personally whether I will be able to engage much or not, as I am looking to improve my marriage, not be reminded that I could leave with half his money.

Anyway, I'm sure I will hang around for a bit, and won't be missed much either way as I don't contribute a great deal. Just wanted to share my thoughts. Thanks everyone for dealing with this split as diplomatically as possible.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 4 points5 points  (3 children)

If this sub is going to be arguing back and forth as to whether to give in to hypergamy or not, I am not convinced anything useful will come of it. While rationally I agree it makes sense to discuss theory without value judgements, I am not sure personally whether I will be able to engage much or not, as I am looking to improve my marriage, not be reminded that I could leave with half his money.

I agree that giving into hypergamy would a bad long term strategy, in fact, that's what this sub was built on- resisting the natural tendencies for better long term strategies.

Nobody here should be making the claim that spinsterhood is a desired long term outcome...

[–]lazysnakes 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Thanks, that's good to hear. I don't want to be pedantic, but I think that could be spelt out more clearly as this line in your quote above could be interpreted in more than one way

Women, you have the ability to find happiness when you embrace the reality of your biological urges and impulses.

I know I have taken it out of context, but do you see what I mean? Perhaps it just needs to say 'accept' or 'understand' rather than 'embrace'.

Nobody here should be making the claim that spinsterhood is a desired long term outcome...

Well personally I agree, but that's because I've always wanted to be married. Surely the point of an open debate is precisely so people can discuss that. Some old women are actually happy to have never been married or have children as they knew it wasn't for them. Why can't there be a female equivalent of MGTOW, that is something that could be debated. You could say - she won't be happy that way - but I could say, a man who endlessly spins plates will end up sad and lonely. It's not for us to predict that. It is for individuals to be honest with themselves about what will make them happy.

To reference something I read on the main sub once - a woman's happiness depends on her becoming a channel of love. And of course there is more than one route to achieving that. Probably it is not spinsterhood that is to be avoided, but bitterness.

Bitterness comes from reality not living up to your expectations. When you have swallowed the redpill reality is much clearer so you should be less likely to be disappointed.

A woman might accept what she learns from TRP and think, given my circumstances and options I'm not going to be able to lock down a really high quality man, so my best strategy is to provide comfort to several low value men, providing love in exchange for emotional and financial support. She will be a spinster, but she won't necessarily be unhappy, if she is staying true to what is authentic to her.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

A woman might accept what she learns from TRP and think, given my circumstances and options I'm not going to be able to lock down a really high quality man, so my best strategy is to provide comfort to several low value men, providing love in exchange for emotional and financial support. She will be a spinster, but she won't necessarily be unhappy, if she is staying true to what is authentic to her.

Yes, I suppose I should rephrase, nobody should hope to avoid spinsterhood by succumbing to hypergamy. But if a woman wants to do the equivalent of MGTOW on RPW, that is a personal choice and one that can and should be able to be discussed.

I intend on running this sub with a very similar thought process as TRP- MGTOW, Plate spinning, and LTR are all valid goals and strategies, even though they differ. And a discussion on the individual merits should always be welcome.

[–]lazysnakes 1 point2 points  (0 children)

nobody should hope to avoid spinsterhood by succumbing to hypergamy

Yes I think you are spot on. The risks of taking a gamble on hypergamy can be more realistically assessed when viewed through redpill understanding. This means acknowledging the wall rather than pretending it doesn't exist (truth hurts!)

[–]JuniperSunshine 10 points11 points  (3 children)

To be blunt, is this now a space where anti-feminist women can discuss relationship issues freely? It seems like there was a real Mean Girls vibe before. One very nice woman was banned for saying something like, "does this aspect affect women too, or just men?". I thought it was a fair question. I may be a submissive wife, but I don't think I need to be shushed. Honest questions from known users shouldn't be assumed to be trolling. Honestly, the guys at MRP have been much more welcoming to me.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

To be blunt, is this now a space where anti-feminist women can discuss relationship issues freely? It seems like there was a real Mean Girls vibe before.

That is exactly what it means. And I agree there was some mean girls going on. That's over with.

I may be a submissive wife, but I don't think I need to be shushed. Honest questions from known users shouldn't be assumed to be trolling.

Agreed, in fact that's the rule I was trying to enforce when the old mods left. This is our policy now!

Honestly, the guys at MRP have been much more welcoming to me.

And now you're very welcome here too!

[–]JuniperSunshine 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Great, I'm really excited about this sub now. I look forward to spending some time here. Thanks for the quick reply. :-D

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

As someone who was banned from RPW for asking questions about options for women other than getting married in a monogamous relationship with a man, I'm glad to see this split happen. Best of luck to everyone involved.

[–]KittFurlong 23 points24 points  (3 children)

Aside that is a shame it came to this, I'm also glad to hear about these new changes.

In all honesty, I felt I was a victim of this 'shaming' that was happening, rather than finding guidance/encouragement (no, I have no issue of hearing the truth!). One post of mine even led to I got harassed over private messages, this was not why I came here for. After that, I was disappointed and felt discouraged to come here again.

I hope this change can open new doors, not just for me, but so many other RPW's coming in here. So far, you have my deepest appreciation and I look so much forward to spend time here again :)

[–]littlecrochetlady 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Though I didn't get harsh messages, I got similar responses as you, it sounds like! Glad we can move into a more positive place within this community. :)

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

One post of mine even led to I got harassed over private messages, this was not why I came here for.

I'm really sorry to hear that. I wish I had known sooner.

Welcome back.

[–]FleetingWishEndorsed Contributor 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I know not everyone felt censored by RPW, so they don't really understand what all this is about. I am sorry that that happened to you, but thank you for coming forward to share your story. It is people like you that redpillschool is fighting for. I am glad you were not disillusioned enough to leave all together.

I, for one, am looking forward to hearing more voices in this sub.

[–]FleetingWishEndorsed Contributor 21 points22 points  (4 children)

I think that this is great. I think I am not the only one the only one who felt marginalized by the mods. I am glad to see a return to the commitment of "truth over feels".

This sub has always been about female sexual strategy, and obtaining happiness for women. But, with the old mods it often felt like there was only one female sexual strategy, and one path to happiness. If you followed that you were more than welcome in this sub. If not, you were either banned, or learned to keep your mouth shut.

I am looking forward to redpillschool's revival of this sub to be a more welcoming community to women with different voices and ideas.

[–]trapped_in_a_box 5 points6 points  (2 children)

Yes - keeping our mouth shut felt very encouraged unless we fell into line. I have a very non-traditional traditional relationship and it works for us. My SO and I run a business together, and while we've worked out a lot of the kinks over the past few years in regards to separating work-relationship from relationship-relationship, the one time I had asked for some advice I ended up deleting the post because I felt bad for asking. That could have been me being over-sensitive, I'll admit to that, but...I'd really love to get real advice from like-minded women, even if my situation isn't EXACTLY like theirs.

[–]trapped_in_a_box 2 points3 points  (0 children)

In fairness, I do have to say that some of my other input in this sub was mostly well-received, if only ignored. It's not like it was horrid every time I posted, just when I posted about myself.

[–]good_mother_goose 1 point2 points  (0 children)

And not only that, I feel like a lot of people were being judged more on phrasing than on the content of their posts. Their words were being picked apart even when they tried to clarify. It's silly to think that people can express themselves perfectly when wrapping their heads around new ideas, and for a lot of people rpw is a completely different way of thinking.

[–]aanarchist 4 points5 points  (0 children)

the other thing, that people seem to neglect, is understanding when something is presented as truth, when it is not. skepticism is the only safe haven of truth, when questions become taboo, that's when you know that there is dishonesty and manipulation involved.

[–]meowlies 6 points7 points  (1 child)

will this trickle down into the IRC as well?

I enjoy reading, but the haughty "queen bee" attitude and nastiness from some of the members was unbearable. It honestly read like high school. Glad to see things are changing.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes, in fact, we've got a new chatroom now, but we're working on a new server for the future. Check the sidebar for the new chat room.

[–]IsleView 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Thank goodness. I never commented on here with this account but did on my previous one. The cliqueishness was astounding. Once one "cool girl" had something snotty to say, the rest piled on. Very glad to hear that this is being addressed - RPW seemed a bastion of female sensibility on an otherwise BP internet. It kept me coming back even after deciding to no longer participate. Now happily resubscribed.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

We have done away with the mean girls. Welcome back!

[–]delores_rose 16 points17 points  (0 children)

I am fairly new here and did not feel that people were being shamed. That being said, I am glad others are stepping up to keep things going and let the flow of ideas not be censored. To the mods: thanks for all the work you put into RPW, it really is one of the few places I feel at home at on the internet.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (1 child)

I basically never post here (I'm a man), but I do read it from time to time. Overall, I saw a lot of thirsty men giving shitty advice to women. Also, there were a lot of BP trolls trying to spread the feminist religion (the mods tended to be reasonably good about stopping these though). The first problem will probably be ameliorated by disassociating from TRP. The second... well, I've already seen 1 or 2 BP contributors on the new subreddit. Plus it looked like the mods aren't going to be as ban-happy anymore. Unfortunately, I think this will likely degrade the quality of the sub.

The move may be a good thing, though. TRP and RPW have fundamentally incompatible visions of sexual strategy for men and women - this is probably where the "plate school" allegations are arising from.

Now the real question: can a group of women without male leadership or assistance successfully manage a sub without it devolving into a bunch of catfights, squabbles, or feminist bullshit? Honestly I'm not sure - maybe yes, maybe no. We'll have to just watch and see - it could be an interesting real-life test of what TRP says about women.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The move may be a good thing, though. TRP and RPW have fundamentally incompatible visions of sexual strategy for men and women - this is probably where the "plate school" allegations are arising from.

Having different strategies doesn't mean they stem from different realities. The "plate school" allegations are baseless. We're going to be focusing on strategy that benefits women here.

[–]SeasideJune 6 points7 points  (1 child)

I love this sub and the practical and theoretical things I have learned here. I'm sending best wishes for a strong revival!

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'm sending best wishes for a strong revival!

Thanks!

[–]coffeedynamics 8 points9 points  (19 children)

About Whisper's post, was he banned from RPW for criticizing RPW in the askTRP sub, or did he also comment something here?

Also, I would welcome more open discussion. The only way to improve is to continually challenge your beliefs. I don't mean that we have to argue the fundamentals over and over again, but it would productive, for instance, if we could discuss some alternatives to the Captain/First mate dynamic without fear of being banned.

I also hope that we can speak more openly about being selfish. We are selfish creatures. We are here to satisfy our female imperative. I disliked how this was brushed under the rug as "My happiness comes from making my husband happy!". I never believed this, and I'd rather just be honest about it.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 7 points8 points  (10 children)

About Whisper's post, was he banned from RPW for criticizing RPW in the askTRP sub, or did he also comment something here?

My understanding of the timeline of events, is that he started being critical on askTRP after having the dispute with RPW mods and being banned. I suspect he lost his faith in what this sub could achieve. I would love /u/whisper to come comment on this if he can.

Also, I would welcome more open discussion. The only way to improve is to continually challenge your beliefs. I don't mean that we have to argue the fundamentals over and over again, but it would productive, for instance, if we could discuss some alternatives to the Captain/First mate dynamic without fear of being banned.

I agree with this wholeheartedly, feel free to speak freely.

I also hope that we can speak more openly about being selfish. We are selfish creatures. We are here to satisfy our female imperative. I disliked how this was brushed under the rug as "My happiness comes from making my husband happy!". I never believed this, and I'd rather just be honest about it.

I prefer real talk over comfortable lies. I'd love to hear more about what you're saying here.

[–]coffeedynamics 7 points8 points  (8 children)

Thanks for hearing me out.

I prefer real talk over comfortable lies. I'd love to hear more about what you're saying here.

I don't know if you meant now or in the future, but I'll use this opportunity to speak my mind.

I believe the core features of RP philosophy are rational egoism coupled with the aim to prioritize truth over normative values. RPW seemed to be departing from this slightly in two major ways. For one thing, it discouraged women for using self interest to motivate their actions. The focus was the happiness of their husbands, which sounds nice and amazing and wonderful, but it's not really true. We are selfish. We do things because they benefit us. Saying something like, "My happiness comes from making my husband happy" is just virtue signalling.

For my second point, we are hyper aware of feminists and BP pushing their values into the dialogue. I came to RP like many others to freely talk without these constraints. And it's not because I didn't share their values, in some cases I did, but I resented the assumption that these values were indisputabley correct and not open for discussion. Yet I see the same thing happening here on RPW. Certain traditionalist values are pushed, and any dissenters are promptly punished.

Even if a particular perspective is wrong, people learn nothing by being shamed or banned. They learn through rational discussion and being able to ask questions.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 9 points10 points  (7 children)

The focus was the happiness of their husbands, which sounds nice and amazing and wonderful, but it's not really true.

I think it originally started as a way to deprogram. The truth is, we're all selfish beings, yes. But the nature of woman is that if she were to simply follow her selfish interests, she would find it was a poor long term strategy.

Attempting to make a husband happy is a good investment in long term happiness for somebody who has a hard time making goals with delayed gratification.

I agree, though, it did slowly morph away from that and into a just-so story for good behavior.

"My happiness comes from making my husband happy" is just virtue signalling.

That's very well put.

I resented the assumption that these values were indisputabley correct and not open for discussion. Yet I see the same thing happening here on RPW. Certain traditionalist values are pushed, and any dissenters are promptly punished.

I agree, I've seen the push back in this very post. There is a lot of ego tied to the investment some women have in these strategies.

Imagine if I were to punish the MGTOW on TRP for simply not sharing my goals. It wouldn't be effective at all.

[–]coffeedynamics 9 points10 points  (6 children)

I think it originally started as a way to deprogram. The truth is, we're all selfish beings, yes. But the nature of woman is that if she were to simply follow her selfish interests, she would find it was a poor long term strategy.

To give an example, this was the type of response I was hoping for in this sub.

"X are your goals and here are the reasons why following instinct Y would not work to achieve X. May I suggest Z instead."

But instead I saw mostly this, "The fact that you want X shows Y about your character. You need to change your character so that you no longer want X".

In other words, the focus wasn't on what works or rational egoism, but on some (usually traditionalist) ideal.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 7 points8 points  (4 children)

"X are your goals and here are the reasons why following instinct Y would not work to achieve X. May I suggest Z instead." But instead I saw mostly this, "The fact that you want X shows Y about your character. You need to change your character so that you no longer want X". In other words, the focus wasn't on what works or rational egoism, but on some (usually traditionalist) ideal.

Yes, this is precisely what we're now steering away from. I agree, the recommendations need to be in line with your goals, and not everybody has the same goals.

[–]coffeedynamics 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well thank you. I look forward to seeing where this new direction takes us.

[–]aanarchist 1 point2 points  (2 children)

not everyone's goals are healthy or sustainable. we'll take hitler as an extreme example, his goals weren't exactly things that should have been entertained or endorsed or encouraged. i don't see anything wrong with letting others know that their goals are wrong and should be abandoned. of course people won't do things they don't want to do, it's on them to make their own mistakes and learn from them.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Of course, the openness of discussion will be tempered by a red pill lens. Much like on all the red pill network subs, ideas that stem from a false understanding of reality (blue pill) will be addressed or removed.

[–]aanarchist 1 point2 points  (0 children)

you know what would help is some sort of sticky that describes a situation and what makes it red or blue and how it would be the reverse if you tweak it just a bit and why.

it's not about people having a false understanding of reality. it's about people subtly twisting reality for whatever their purpose. I believe trp calls it frame. anything can be the truth, as long as you frame it well, that's something that people need to learn how to protect themselves from.

[–]littlecrochetlady 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I so agree with you!! I feel we'll be able to more openly analyze situations and our hamsters now lol.

[–]WhisperTRP Founder 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I would love /u/whisper to come comment on this if he can.

I'm still mulling over what to say. This has obviously exploded into a gossip bomb, and I do not wish to put out fire with gasoline.

However, if I were to tell the whole story, it would be very unflattering to certain specific people who are trying very hard to make themselves out to be the very image of injured innocence.

[–][deleted]  (5 children)

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    [–][deleted]  (4 children)

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      [–]CrazyHorseInvincibleModerator[M] 15 points16 points  (3 children)

      Yeah as a bi

      Under the previous moderation policy, you would most likely have gotten about that far before being told you weren't welcome here.

      That's the sort of moderation policy we don't want. It stifles discussion, and makes this group fail to serve women who might for example, be bi.

      But we also have to draw a line to make sure that this sub serves women's interests, not men's.

      So, some examples:

      Male poster: "You chicks should totes be bi, because dudes like threesomes!"
      NOT ALLOWED

      Male poster: "Bi girls are sluts doing it for attention. Don't do that shit."
      NOT ALLOWED

      Bi woman: "I feel a need to be with women sometimes, but I want a committed relationship with a man. Is this cheating? Will he see it that way? How do I find a man who will accept that, or persuade him to accept it?"
      ALLOWED

      Traditional woman: "I think it's cheating. This kind of social permissiveness is what gave us the mess our culture is in, in the first place. Should we really be going down this road?"
      ALLOWED

      Traditional woman "You are a horrible slut! Someone ban her!"
      NOT ALLOWED.

      Male poster: "I would have a much easier time not being jealous over my girlfriend being with another woman if I were included in their first encounter. Not only is this a common male turn-on, it would also make me feel I like I wasn't being shut out or replaced."
      ALLOWED

      [–][deleted]  (2 children)

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        [–]CrazyHorseInvincibleModerator[M] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

        Unfortunately, it looks like she was a troll account from someone who just can't let go. (Cue sentimental music.)

        My point still stands, though. I don't give a toss who wins debates, or even what the sides are.

        I just care that the debate is about what's the best strategy for women, and that one side of any debate doesn't have mod tools to prevent the others from talking. Mods should be outside the fray.

        [–][deleted]  (1 child)

        [deleted]

          [–]coffeedynamics 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          They were probably trying to clear out all the men.

          [–][deleted]  (2 children)

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          [–][deleted]  (1 child)

          [removed]

            [–]viciousloop 3 points4 points  (4 children)

            I'm not sure if you'll see this but here goes:

            1.) I was banned on a different account for suggesting marriage may not be the best choice for women due to the high divorce rate in the US and how being divorced is a stigma worse than being never married in my opinion (which people may or may not agree with).

            Would I be banned again for such an opinion under the new mods?

            2.) If you see my post history, you'll see I've been having trouble with my boyfriend who has ED. He is committed to me and I to him, and we do have sex about twice a month, sometimes more, though it is not exciting.

            Still, I don't want to just abandon him over not getting enough sex, especially because he is experiencing a health problem (ED). Everyone on other subs told me to leave him but I have not.

            Would I be banned for not leaving him? Or would I be banned for leaving him? I'm not sure which course fits better with the RPW mindset.

            3.) I have more of an RP or Purple mindset than an RPW mindset. Is that welcome here? I would be able to explain in detail why I am more purple than fully red, and why red instead of RPW, but am not sure whether than is what is wanted here in this sub.

            Edit The reason I want to post here is because PPD has too many guys and no one so far has had the right advice to help me get my bf to overcome his ED. I'm hoping to find the opinion of a woman who experienced something similar with her husband/boyfriend.

            [–]LuckyLittleStarModerator | Lil'Star[M] 3 points4 points  (3 children)

            1.) I was banned on a different account for suggesting marriage may not be the best choice for women due to the high divorce rate in the US and how being divorced is a stigma worse than being never married in my opinion (which people may or may not agree with).

            Would I be banned again for such an opinion under the new mods?

            No, you would not be banned.

            2.) If you see my post history, you'll see I've been having trouble with my boyfriend who has ED. He is committed to me and I to him, and we do have sex about twice a month, sometimes more, though it is not exciting.

            Would I be banned for not leaving him? Or would I be banned for leaving him? I'm not sure which course fits better with the RPW mindset.

            No. RPW users are welcome to submit pro or con arguments. The mod team takes no stance of whether or not you stay with your boyfriend, and either choice you make is certainly not a bannable offense.

            3.) I have more of an RP or Purple mindset than an RPW mindset. Is that welcome here? I would be able to explain in detail why I am more purple than fully red, and why red instead of RPW, but am not sure whether than is what is wanted here in this sub.

            Yes. There will be guidelines that need to be ironed out. Basically there will be a very lose framework. Within the framework, a lot will be allowed. Imagine something like Rule Zero on TRP.

            [–]viciousloop 0 points1 point  (2 children)

            Thank you so much for answering my questions!

            Rule Zero on TRP

            By this do you mean:

            You are a man who wants to improve your own control over your life, mostly your sex life. You want to help men achieve that goal.

            OR

            You are a woman who wants to improve your own control over your life, mostly your sex/commitment life. You want to help women achieve that goal.

            [–]LuckyLittleStarModerator | Lil'Star[M] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

            Opps! I mean the later, haha. We would have to rewrite it in order to support the goals of women. I am purposely being vague right now because we haven't finalized anything. But what you wrote there sounds like a good start.

            [–]viciousloop 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            Thanks for clarifying :)

            [–]blindedbythebrights 1 point2 points  (3 children)

            I'm glad to hear so. I did have the impression that people who asked questions that were too challenging to the red pill philosophy were attacked or kicked out. In an honest debate, there must always be room for questioning and thinking freely. You go!

            [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

            In an honest debate, there must always be room for questioning and thinking freely. You go!

            yeah, but this is not a debate forum. It says all over the side bar that it's for like minded people, not for debate.

            [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            No it's not a debate red-pill-therom sub. But friendly discussion on the merits of ideas and strategies are more than welcome. The word debate has many connotations.

            [–]blindedbythebrights 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            Obviously if you're taking the time to read and write about this topic and you're not trolling but trying to interpret or understand things, there's always room for debate or discussion. Otherwise you wouldn't need a forum, only a blog or book.

            [–]aanarchist 4 points5 points  (1 child)

            the thing about the red pill is it's supposed to be about the open exchange of ideas, freedom. censorship shaming and cliques is feminism's domain. the truth is, feminism has infected trp in general, at least based on my observation.

            [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            the truth is, feminism has infected trp in general, at least based on my observation.

            Not on my watch it doesn't.

            Report anything that doesn't smell right to me.

            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            I'm happy I found RPW. It will be interesting to stick around a learn a truth or two about men and women, and to learn the extent of my own brainwashing by our society. Seems like you're taking this in a solid direction.

            [–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (9 children)

            Ok. So I'm a bit confused here. From what I've read, it seems like it is a good idea. Allow people to post about different aspect of female sexual strategy and then discuss. However, I think where the problem is, is when posting about different aspect become what would outwardly appear to be suggestions about how NOT to be RPW. For instance, I made a post about being on Tinder. While yes that is one way to approach dating, it certainly isn't RPW. The women did a good job of modding this sub in as much as keeping that message pretty clear. You claim that it isn't opening up the flood gates but I believe that that is an optimistic and quite frankly unattainable view of what more than likely will happen. The conversation can quickly devolve and I believe that could be the case here.

            Another point is I frequently saw posts on here that get removed and users who are given multiple chances. What I don't see is people getting banned for frivolities. Now, I wasn't a mod so I don't know exactly how frequently that was or was becoming, but I can't just believe that all of the mods were doing that so much so that it would create such discord. So this whole incident just seems a bit....much.

            I also see a disconnect between what you started here and what it evolved to. So maybe that is where the true issue is. The direction in which the sub was headed probably didn't align with the original intent, but isn't that just human nature....to evolve as more information is presented?

            In sum, I want to remain a contributor here but as time passes and the true nature of the sub revealed I will have to be wary of it. Something about this whole thing just doesn't sit right.

            [–]-Anteros- 3 points4 points  (8 children)

            The direction in which the sub was headed probably didn't align with the original intent, but isn't that just human nature....to evolve as more information is presented?

            The tenet of RP is discussing sexual strategy. This includes the possibility that the idea of becoming a high value man's plate gets recommended by someone for discussion. Its a emotional mis-step to ban a user for such a thing. As it is to quit when the ruling comes down in favor of simply facilitating discussion (see the tenet earlier).

            Now, I wasn't a mod so I don't know exactly how frequently that was or was becoming, but I can't just believe that all of the mods were doing that so much so that it would create such discord. So this whole incident just seems a bit....much.

            "The truth lies exclusively in the details" I'd recommend following up with the moderators that decided to quit, together. They were not thrown out.

            [–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (7 children)

            The tenet of RP is discussing sexual strategy.

            I think it is

            The tenet of RP is discussing sexual strategy as it pertains to your specific gender

            Which would definitely drive what the message would be. TRP's sexual strategy is to obtain many sexual partners and RPW's sexual strategy is to obtain the highest quality partner. That would exclude discussion of becoming a high value man's plate. I think you are right in it being wrong to ban for that but again I wasn't a mod and I didn't see that happening here. The people who I did see get banned did not believe in that fundamental strategy in obtaining the highest quality partner. I've also seen mods and EC's say that it is ok to be a plate, single or whatever, but that that discussion was just not for this /r/. All of the advice was derived from how to obtain a high quality partner knowing about the differences between the genders imperatives. As I said earlier, I can see where the difference is the way the sub was started and what it evolved to, I also now see why there needs to be a separate /r/ for the two different approaches. It seems like ultimately that was the only resolution. I'm just not sure how this particular brand of RPW discussion will work without it becoming a discussion about female sexual strategy that will further the male sexual strategy.

            They were not thrown out.

            I didn't suggest that they were thrown out. I'm just saying that I believe that this whole incident as it is being portrayed is one sided... on both sides. I'll never know what happened. I don't care to know what happened. But to say that what is given in this post would incite the mods to leave makes it seem like they are petulant children which I could never believe.

            [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

            But to say that what is given in this post would incite the mods to leave makes it seem like they are petulant children which I could never believe.

            They didn't work with me, rather they said "we don't like certain people, take it or leave it." And then they walked while I was trying to address it.

            [–]-Anteros- 4 points5 points  (5 children)

            Sexual strategy is not a monolithic entity, for example there are places in the world where marriage is a good idea and a man with one prior sexual partner is considered a catch.

            TRP's sexual strategy is to obtain many sexual partners and RPW's sexual strategy is to obtain the highest quality partner.

            An oversimplification, see above. While there is a middle ground to be had between men and women, the previous RPW moderation team sought to silence a potential insight and then up and leave in response to its support.

            I think you are right in it being wrong to ban for that but again I wasn't a mod and I didn't see that happening here.

            You might not have seen that because the user was banned.

            It seems like ultimately that was the only resolution.

            That was a failure on the RPW moderators part. Picking up ones ball and going home is a bitter, emotional response to running afoul of a core tenet regarding the game.

            I'm just not sure how this particular brand of RPW discussion will work without it becoming a discussion about female sexual strategy that will further the male sexual strategy.

            Consider that a middle ground can exist. Yet for men, marriage is not recommended and from what I can tell, it never will be in the west.

            But to say that what is given in this post would incite the mods to leave makes it seem like they are petulant children which I could never believe.

            They provided good insight and good moderation overall, but their response to disagreement was not to negotiate, not to build with their available tools but to hang up their hats and quit. I expect that there will be an "Our side of things" post but the damage is done and we have to keep building for the future.

            [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (4 children)

            I had this whole thing typed up about blah blah blah. I think really what I have read in this post is that what the mods were calling RPW strategy, was really just one derivative of it and it may work for most but it isn't the ONLY strategy there is and the other stuff should be discussed. I can agree with that. That is why I think... as I said... it is necessary to have the two approaches. They will work on the strategy that is more narrowly focused on the way that they have seen most success in and this will be a broader spectrum and that will be the catchall. It is still my contention that the broader spectrum isn't a beast that can be contained and the idea that it won't just become a hamster fest is pie in the sky. I look forward to seeing how this all works out because generating different content is really exciting. I would also hope that those of us who still believe in the RPWives approach will still be welcomed here to provide insight in that perspective too.

            [–]CrazyHorseInvincibleModerator[M] 7 points8 points  (3 children)

            I would also hope that those of us who still believe in the RPWives approach will still be welcomed here to provide insight in that perspective too.

            Absolutely.

            The only difference is that particular approach will no longer have the privilege of using mod tools to silence any opposition.

            If you want to straight up insist that all women must demand a wedding before kissing occurs, and insist that man be celibate from the moment he meets her until that wedding, you can totally say that.

            The difference is that people will no longer be banned for saying "that's not a workable strategy".

            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

            Cool beanz yo!

            [–]CrazyHorseInvincibleModerator[M] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

            Glad it meets with your approval.

            BTW, I don't think that's your real position. I was simply thinking of the most sexually conservative opinion I could dream up, as an example.

            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            Yeah I got that :D

            [–]prophecycake 3 points4 points  (36 children)

            When you say cliquey actions, what do you mean? I had noticed that there seemed to be a bit of shaming and direction going on in this sub. Could you possibly elaborate on the changes that are being made?

            If those mods are what has essentially killed this page, I'm glad to see them go.

            [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 10 points11 points  (35 children)

            When you say cliquey actions, what do you mean?

            Almost every time the mods here contacted me for problems, it was because of he-said/she-said stuff. It was always about interpersonal drama, rather than actual red pill topics and moderating.

            I didn't originally see the cliques form, but when I did notice, it was already too late. There were groups who were more interested in us v. them than constructive conversation. One of the mods all but hated TRP because she thought they were all "betas." How that helped me or the team? It didn't. She would take cheap shots when she could.

            They took a similar view to anybody on RPW who they thought were too slutty for help, or who didn't see the vision of becoming a red pill wife. The ban list here is much, much larger than on TRP, and the community is a small fraction the size. That should tell you something.

            [–]sugarbabycakes 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            One of the mods all but hated TRP because she thought they were all "betas." How that helped me or the team? It didn't pretty obvious who that is im glad shes out she was such a bitch. thank you!

            [–][deleted]  (32 children)

            [removed]

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 21 points22 points  (31 children)

              I had asked TRP, ASKTRP, and RPW mod teams to work together when an endorsed contributor from any one of the subs was stepping out of line, so that we could deal with them as a network.

              To me, it didn't make sense that somebody I endorsed and stand behind would be worthy of banning unless they had done something seriously egregious to one of my subs. That includes RPW. If they were making trouble here, I would address it directly with them. If it couldn't be resolved, I wanted to address it across all the subreddits. I didn't want ECs banned from just one sub. If they wouldn't work with us, then they didn't deserve EC on any of our subs.

              This began with one member who had always made well reasoned, well articulated posts. /u/whisper. In fact, his contributions won in the best-of of 2013 on redpillwomen.

              Now, he made some remarks that seemed negative towards RPW, on asktrp, and I had wanted to address it directly with him, because his contributions had always been high caliber stuff, and I didn't want infighting. It appears he didn't believe in the RPW sub anymore, having been banned a long time ago from RPW for some of his content that didn't match the RPW mod team's vision of the straight-and-narrow path to happiness.

              I read his content, it was good. It was thought provoking. It wasn't trolling. It wasn't "plate-manufacturing". It was removed and he was banned. That's not a way of resolving the differences. That's how you treat trolls. When a long standing member who has given you consistent high quality contributions has a beef, you reach out to them and figure it out.

              Unfortunately, the RPW mods were unwilling to work towards that goal with me.

              My understanding is that discussion of the changing sexual landscape was removed in favor of only pro-marriage discussion. Don't get me wrong, pro-marriage is on topic and a good goal. But in a culture where men are increasingly avoiding marriage, the question should be able to be asked, what does the future hold for women?

              [–]fhigurethisout 11 points12 points  (25 children)

              Don't get me wrong, pro-marriage is on topic and a good goal. But in a culture where men are increasingly avoiding marriage, the question should be able to be asked, what does the future hold for women?

              Uh...wow this is just ridiculous. I won't be hanging around. Thanks.

              Of course it was a pro-marriage discussion, that's what rpw want.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 10 points11 points  (24 children)

              Right, pro marriage discussion is very much on topic, and an excellent goal for RPW.

              That doesn't contradict what I just said.

              Whisper was banned for starting a discussion on the changing landscape. Not changing the purpose of RPW.

              [–]fhigurethisout 14 points15 points  (23 children)

              RPW already know that the landscape is changing.

              That doesn't change the core sexual strategy for women (be nice, look good, don't sleep around, self-improvement).

              I still have no idea how this changes rpw core tenets and how it is relevant to that. And you never explained how it actually influences this subject, except that "omg whisper was banned"

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 9 points10 points  (22 children)

              I still have no idea how this changes rpw core tenets and how it is relevant to that

              It doesn't change any core tenets. At all. Absolutely nothing has changed since my introduction message two years ago.

              And you never explained how it actually influences this subject, except that "omg whisper was banned"

              My point was that an on-topic discussion from a red pill perspective should not warrant a ban. That's all.

              [–]fhigurethisout 7 points8 points  (21 children)

              My point was that an on-topic discussion from a red pill perspective should not warrant a ban. That's all.

              And my point is that such a discussion does not contribute any value to rpw. It would just cause a hamsterfest and question the validity of pursuing marriage from a female perspective. So, we will agree to disagree.

              There is a lot more to his ban and all of this, given his earlier comments. it's all very two-faced and ridiculous.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 10 points11 points  (20 children)

              And my point is that such a discussion does not contribute any value to rpw.

              And the old mods thought that about so much, that people were getting banned left and right for the smallest of infractions, discussion began to stifle.

              There is a lot more to his ban and all of this, given his earlier comments.

              Unless you were in the modmail, which you were not, then you do not have any perspective on this.

              it's all very two-faced and ridiculous.

              I agree, there certainly was a lot of that going on while I was doing my best to address everybody's concerns. Now it is over. They are gone.

              [–]Duke_LFG 5 points6 points  (4 children)

              Wow, thanks for an actual reply. That gas lighting bullshit I received from those rpwive mods was clearly agenda driven.

              Ah who knows. I feel like this is a perfect example of everything we've been talking about. These girls clearly were on a power trip, so they got nexted (thankfully they nexted themselves).

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 7 points8 points  (3 children)

              Wow, thanks for an actual reply.

              No problem. I'm trying to be as transparent as possible without crossing into gossip territory. I think the community here deserves to know what was going on. I was working very closely with the RPW mod team during the past week to resolve the differences, so it did come as a shock to me when they all left. Apparently they were planning this secretly behind my back the entire time. So they were not working with me in good faith at all. Which is very disappointing to me.

              I had a lot of respect for the amount of work the team put in here, and I'm quite disheartened that they chose this path despite our long histories of working together.

              But they all gave me the freeze-out and left without a word. Just not how you treat somebody you've been working with for years.

              [–]ANGRY_ATHEIST 4 points5 points  (2 children)

              I'm looking forward to the RP AWALT lessons learned from all this. You can tell from their new sub they'd definitely been planning this a while, saving up content to post etc. My guess is this whole /u/whisper fiasco was just the excuse they needed. I mean, they couldn't just go off on their own for no reason, right? They'd lose credibility. They have to make TRP into the "bad guys" if they want to keep their clique.

              And as much as I hate to say it, the BP'ers saying they "divorce raped RP" is kind of funny, you have to admit. Kind of reminds me of how my own divorce went down, fabricating reasons out of nothing to cover for their complete lack of integrity.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 8 points9 points  (1 child)

              . You can tell from their new sub they'd definitely been planning this a while, saving up content to post etc.

              I got the distinct feeling they were one foot out the door when the issue was brought to my attention in the first place.

              I think fundamentally, the mods who left simply didn't know how to disagree with somebody without them being their enemy.

              And as much as I hate to say it, the BP'ers saying they "divorce raped RP" is kind of funny, you have to admit. Kind of reminds me of how my own divorce went down, fabricating reasons out of nothing to cover for their complete lack of integrity.

              I think it's really funny, actually. Just disappointing that they had to do it so.. stereo-typically.

              [–]RojoEscarlata 5 points6 points  (2 children)

              I really want to wish them well over there, but it does sound like a temper tantrum, AND the policing of context/word and how it degrades the discourse is something that we cannot condone.

              100% with you RPS.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

              Thanks Rojo. We will remain steadfast against the encroaching tone policing that erodes the original message.

              [–]lackadaisicalily 5 points6 points  (6 children)

              So are any of the new mods women? Because this place is for women.

              [–]LuckyLittleStarModerator | Lil'Star[M] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

              I am here, and we are definitely planning to get more women. The male mods here are an only temporary measure, until we can find more women appropriate for the task.

              Until we fill the roles we need, men will be holding the positions.

              Thank you for voicing your concerns. It is a problem we are aware of and we are working hard to fix it.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 2 points3 points  (4 children)

              Yup.

              [–]lackadaisicalily 3 points4 points  (3 children)

              Are the women on the list of moderators in the sidebar? Because all the mods in the sidebar are TRP mods, and women can't be TRP moderators.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

              Our newest mod introduction is here: https://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/4dc8kn/an_introduction/ She's been a long time contributor here and somebody I've known for a a few years.

              Further, she and I are putting together a new team of female mods.

              The male mods could be considered bouncers for now. Trolling has gone up 1000% since the news broke.

              [–]lackadaisicalily 4 points5 points  (1 child)

              Alright, I am just being skeptical. I want this place in tip top shape for the women who need it.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

              I want this place in tip top shape for the women who need it.

              I couldn't agree more on that front. The new mod team will be thoroughly vetted with the best interest of the sub at heart.

              [–]Diarrhoea_Shower 2 points3 points  (1 child)

              Why not archive all the posts and keep the links for the good ones? Keep the sidebar intact.

              There's a bot on KotakuinAction that archives everything, perhaps you could implement something here just in case this sub fractures again and we end up with a RedPillMistresses sub.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

              As a coincidence, I had already been archiving the top posts of RPW for our off-site backup (just in case reddit admin go nuts):

              https://www.forums.red/i/RedPillWomen/?timeframe=1&userid=&search=&sort=1

              [–]liftinginthemoment 2 points3 points  (1 child)

              I've been a lurker for a while (was lurking for a few months before actually joining). I didn't really post much so never felt "censored" but one thing I noticed was on the topic of marriage- the views seemed to have changed. One of the first things I searched for was about being in a relationship with no marriage as at the time I thought my SO was against marriage (turns out he's not as against it as I thought but anyway...). There were a few posts from around 11 months to a year ago about having the captain but not the marriage and the replies and views were quite diverse. There were a range of perspectives, not just "if he doesn't want to get married- NEXT" which is the feeling I've been getting from recent posts. The posts back then ultimately came to the conclusion that as long as you were happy with never having that official commitment and you were ok with how things were then there's nothing wrong with that. I thought the conversations back then were more thought provoking- ultimately I came to the decision that marriage is important to me (and I couldn't have the captain without the marriage) but these posts did seem to offer more opinions rather than just one "choice" or viewpoint. I like posts where we can actually have rational discussions without rational opinions being shut down or people being intimidated to express their opinions for fear of being "wrong". It also enables us to think about our own situations as everyone is different- there is no "one size fits all" solution for anything.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

              but these posts did seem to offer more opinions rather than just one "choice" or viewpoint. I like posts where we can actually have rational discussions without rational opinions being shut down or people being intimidated to express their opinions for fear of being "wrong". It also enables us to think about our own situations as everyone is different- there is no "one size fits all" solution for anything.

              Well, you're now in the right place! Welcome!

              [–]DebatePony 2 points3 points  (1 child)

              Long time lurker, very interested in the recent developments and how both subs will be affected.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

              Welcome!

              [–]ANGRY_ATHEIST 12 points13 points  (17 children)

              Let me get this straight...

              RPW mods were censoring discussions, so you censored their discussions?

              What a shit fest. I've got a lot of respect for you RPS, but quite frankly you kind of sunk to their level with this move. I mean, from this very post:

              they decided that a small clique of women had the one and only strategy to happiness, and anybody who disagreed with them should be banned

              Sounds like a good reason for a leadership change. What were the specifics here though? You got any proof of that? Who got banned for saying what?

              Ultimately it was a disagreement between them and me.

              Oh, so you banned them. Got it. Wait... isn't that doing the same thing that you banned them for? Please tell me you don't miss the irony there.

              Look, I get that they were misbehaving as mods in that they were banning people unjustly (as I understand from this post anyway). What you should have done though is revoked all their mod status but left their posts up. I've looked around and dug up some archive posts (you don't have to look far). From a 3rd party's perspective, it looks to me like all this is personal when it shouldn't be. Really the only thing that should be deleted is spam IMHO. As in "click here for penis enlargements", or arguably "buy my t-shirts" (ahem). On the other hand if somebody wants to preach traditional values, or promiscuity, or praise Trump or Hillary or whoever, who gives a shit. Let their own words speak for themselves.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 24 points25 points  (10 children)

              RPW mods were censoring discussions, so you censored their discussions?

              No, they left on their own.

              Sounds like a good reason for a leadership change. What were the specifics here though? You got any proof of that? Who got banned for saying what?

              I will let individuals come forward if they want to speak on their own behalf. The one individual that was brought to my attention that sparked the debate was /u/Whisper.

              Oh, so you banned them. Got it.

              No, they left.

              What you should have done though is revoked all their mod status but left their posts up.

              They removed their own mod status. I haven't deleted any of their histories, they may have done that themselves.

              ally the only thing that should be deleted is spam IMHO. As in "click here for penis enlargements", or arguably "buy my t-shirts" (ahem). On the other hand if somebody wants to preach traditional values, or promiscuity, or praise Trump or Hillary or whoever, who gives a shit. Let their own words speak for themselves.

              I agree wholeheartedly, which can now happen that the old mod team is gone.

              [–]ANGRY_ATHEIST 10 points11 points  (9 children)

              Thanks for the clarification. Keep up the good work.

              edit: Just to explain my seemingly contradictory questions, in my industry whenever someone in leadership is fired they often position it to the rest of the company as though they resigned to keep things professional and keep people from getting nervous and taking drastic measures. This message somewhat read that way to me.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 4 points5 points  (8 children)

              And I'm sure they'll confirm, they simply left. Without warning, by the way.

              [–]ANGRY_ATHEIST 0 points1 point  (7 children)

              Can I ask then, why we're apparently controlling content based on some sort of nebulous "serves women's interests" standard? Isn't that the same type of bullshit standard family law court uses about the "best interests of the children"?

              I mean, I'm not a mod, this isn't my forum, but I'm just curious.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 4 points5 points  (6 children)

              If somebody posts an idea or strategy, they must post their rationale for why it benefits women. Because this is a sub for female strategy.

              If some guy posts "Hey, women should all be slaves to me," I think we can reason pretty quickly who stands to benefit from that strategy.

              [–]ANGRY_ATHEIST 0 points1 point  (5 children)

              So we're leaving that to the moderators to make that determination instead of the readers? I mean I know I'm being the devils advocate here, but that just seems like enforcing a specific opinion rather than facilitating discussion to me.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 0 points1 point  (4 children)

              I expect that most of the members here are levelheaded enough to call out users who do this, and if they don't take heed, moderators will step in and remove the user who can't follow the rules.

              Do click report when somebody appears to have nefarious motives.

              [–]ANGRY_ATHEIST 4 points5 points  (3 children)

              Motives... there's another can of worms. Apparently we can't even determine the motives of the moderators of this forum.

              It seems to me that the former moderators of this forum were doing exactly what you're describing their job to be -- enforcing the content to be in the interests of women. In this case they happened to disagree with a contributing member (or members?) and that's what caused the split. Of course women want marriage 2.0, it's in their best interests when it comes to their own sexual strategy. I'm just saying that if you didn't choose to enforce certain opinions this wouldn't have happened.

              Whatever, it is what it is. This is your forum so you can do with it what you wish. For me though, TRP has lost two main selling points from this: one, the fact that there are women who agree with the theory, and two that this was a place where one can voice their opinions without worrying about being banned over it.

              [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

              Apparently we can't even determine the motives of the moderators of this forum.

              I have no idea what you're going on about. Read my introduction to RPW. It's been on the sidebar for two years.

              It seems to me that the former moderators of this forum were doing exactly what you're describing their job to be

              I have always been a moderator of RPW, I founded this subreddit two years ago on these principles. A lot of the moderating policies of the previous mods were by my design up until things went sour.

              -- enforcing the content to be in the interests of women. In this case they happened to disagree with a contributing member (or members?) and that's what caused the split. Of course women want marriage 2.0, it's in their best interests when it comes to their own sexual strategy. I'm just saying that if you didn't choose to enforce certain opinions this wouldn't have happened.

              Let's be very clear here. They didn't just think marriage 2.0 was a goal, they thought it was the only goal that could be discussed and that any theory discussion that deviated from that discussion was worthy of ban. Let's not mince words here, they were using moderation to rationalize their own life choices, and silencing anybody who was curious or on the fence.

              If we do our jobs right, the discussion of marriage will not change. But now curious onlookers can engage in a conversation that might bring them to the same conclusions rather than have a pissing contest in mod mail after they get banned for asking about it.

              Whatever, it is what it is. This is your forum so you can do with it what you wish. For me though, TRP has lost two main selling points from this: one, the fact that there are women who agree with the theory.

              You haven't lost that.

              and two that this was a place where one can voice their opinions without worrying about being banned over it.

              That's literally what we just gained. We've stopped the censorship and banning, not started it.

              This is the second time you've done this, getting the facts entirely reversed. I recommend you take some time to read what I'm writing before going off on me.

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                    [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                    If old members want to troll, they'll get removed like any other troll.

                    [–]LuckyLittleStarModerator | Lil'Star 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                    They weren't banned, they left by choice.

                    [–]RedPillDoll 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                    I've lurked RedPillWomen for what feels like a year. In that time I posted once and asked questions to better understand why a world view of mine differed from my husbands redpill perspective. I was called a feminist, told my husband would leave me, and other things I can't remember. I have not posted since to avoid being ganged up on and attacked for just wanting to have a discussion with likeminded women.

                    That said, this post is such a relief. I assume most of us come here to find likeminded women, to better ourselves, and to seek truth... Not to pick sides and pick fights. I really appreciate this post and look forward to the blossoming redpill community.

                    [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                    Not to pick sides and pick fights. I really appreciate this post and look forward to the blossoming redpill community.

                    Couldn't agree more. The infighting and drama was a cancer that needed to leave.

                    I'm glad we were able to address this issue and I look forward to seeing your contributions!

                    [–]LaBlondeFille 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                    So excited that this was taken care of. I unsubscribed months ago after a mod cursed me out and insulted me over PM for making a simple suggestion. Resubscribing today!!

                    [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                    Welcome back!

                    [–][deleted]  (2 children)

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                    [–]MissNissa[M] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                    Could you please add a description of what kind of content is on the channel/why it's valuable to RPW?

                    [–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

                    I wasn't aware this post was cleared by the bot. (Otherwise I would've included my sassy signature. ;-D )

                    Could you please add a description of what kind of content is on the channel/why it's valuable to RPW?

                    This is advice from the world's greatest couple's therapist. =) <3

                    [–]good_mother_goose 0 points1 point  (2 children)

                    My only worry with these new policies is that every post may end up being 'defending rpw'. I don't want to be part of a subreddit where there are dozens and dozens of posts by people who disagree with ther theory or who haven't even bothered to read the sidebar. I want to see discussions by people who are trying to live the rp lifestyle, and what works and doesn't, etc.

                    Maybe have weekly threads for dissenting opinions?

                    [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                    We're not going to entertain non-red pill perspectives, so any debate on that front can go to purplepill debate or elsewhere.

                    You shouldn't have to defend theory here, the opening of discussion applies simply to alternative strategies with a red pill understanding.

                    [–]MissNissa[M] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                    This is not going to be PPD. Posts that apply RP information to the (potentially varying) goals of the poster are OK. Posts that disagree with RP information still aren't.

                    [–]sixtysixpixistix 0 points1 point  (5 children)

                    they decided that a small clique of women had the one and only strategy to happiness, and anybody who disagreed with them should be banned.

                    This is also what happened to the mods over at TRP. I've been banned there several times for making perfectly salient points that they happen to disagree with.

                    It only goes to show that no one is so virtuous that they can be trusted with power.

                    [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

                    I watch all the mod actions, I can promise you there's a reason.

                    Can you link me the offending comment?

                    [–]sixtysixpixistix 0 points1 point  (3 children)

                    Sorry I can't. It was ages ago.

                    [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

                    The mods there have a responsibility to enforce my rules. That doesn't make it a clique.

                    [–]sixtysixpixistix 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                    And your rules are so perfect that they can't be exploited?

                    "The mods there have a responsibility to enforce my rules. That doesn't make it a clique."

                    No, the fact that there's a clique makes it a clique. -- I'm speaking partially out of my ass here. Like I said, it was well over 18 months ago.

                    [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                    And your rules are so perfect that they can't be exploited?

                    They are as perfect as they can be when the people complaining don't any have proof of wrong doing.