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INSIGHTFULI'm Laura Doyle, author of The Surrendered Wife. AMA (self.RedPillWomen)

submitted by LauraMDoyleVerified

I'm so pleased to be spending the entire day with the RedPillWomen today! I'll be here from 9am to 6pm PST with occasional breaks to get my wiggles out. Looking forward to your questions.


[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 26 points27 points  (3 children)

I wanted to thank the RPW mods and everyone who participated in this AMA today. I so enjoyed myself and appreciate the warm welcome! Than you for your support an encouragement. Until we talk again, take good care of you.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

thank you , laura, it was a pleasure. dont be a stranger!

[–]StingrayVC 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Thank you so much for doing this with us today!

[–]TempestTcup 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you so much for visiting!

[–]StingrayVC 18 points19 points  (4 children)

Have you encountered women who, initially hated what you had to say, but you were eventually able to sway them?. If so, how did you do this?

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 25 points26 points  (3 children)

Oh, definitely! I have my share of haters. I bet this group can relate, right?

Part of the way I got in trouble with my marriage was by thinking I knew what was best for my husband ALL THE TIME. There was a complete lack of humility for me, and in fact I didn't understand why anyone would want to be humble. I didn't see the value.

These days I'm pretty clear that while I'm the expert on my own life, I know only a little about anybody else. Every woman is the expert on her own life. I'm happy to share my experiences, and it's very gratifying for me that my experiences have helped over 150,000 women worldwide in 16 languages and 27 countries make broken relationships into vibrant, passionate, playful relationships. So I know this is something pretty special.

But I also get that it may not be for everyone. And the more I approach it that way, the more attracted people seem to be to the concept.

I also try to bring deep listening to every conversation. We all have such a deep need to be heard and understood. I really listen to what her situation is and maybe say it back to her to make sure I understand. That can really make her feel seen and gotten, and sometimes that creates an opening.

Sometimes the time is not right for her. One of my senior coaches and dear friends started reading the Surrendered Wife, thought it was complete tripe and stopped half way through. When she opened it again a short time later, the words jumped off the page an into her heart. The rest is history.

If someone is completely misinformed about my work, (i.e., "You tell women to be slaves to their husbands!) I try to just stick to the facts and let them know what A Surrendered Wife just acknowledges that she can't change anyone besides herself so she doesn't try. She won't tell her husband how to drive, what to eat or what to do at work. Instead, she focuses on her own happiness, and that, in turn, improves the intimacy.

[–]ecossecho 20 points21 points  (1 child)

I just wanted to let you know that I first heard about you because one of my very-feminist friends found your stuff and said "Hahaha, ecosse, you should read this! This seems right up your alley!" (He was joking. Majorly. He thought it was crazy.)

I did read it and it's been enormously helpful. It's a slightly smug little secret, because my husband and all our friends are very "bluepill", and would be shocked if they knew I read your books... but strangely, my husband seems very happy with our relationship lately!

So even the haters are serving a purpose for you. :)

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 25 points26 points  (0 children)

Love it ecossecho! I remember Playboy magazine wrote a scathing review and a woman wrote to me and said, "I found out about your book in Playboy and it saved my marriage! Thank you!" So I don't care what people say about me as long as it gets a conversation started.

Congrats on your relationship getting happier lately! I know how much courage that takes. Well done!

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

<3

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 12 points13 points  (9 children)

TryanotherJuan, First of all, you're welcome for writing SW and SS! Glad they were helpful for you. Secondly, Congrats on your engagement! So exciting!

On the decorating issues, I know for me as long as I'm staying in pure desire, I don't have to worry too much about hurting my husband's feelings. In fact, when I worry too much about him, that gets me in trouble because he would really rather be making me happy.

One idea I have about approaching this is to do it with a spirit of playfulness, like being the Goddess of Fun and Light. So you might say, "Let's put the Elk in the bathroom so it's staring at everyone in there."

Also, if you stick with pure (no manipuation, criticism or control) desire, you could say, "I want to combine our styles to reflect what both of us like." If he says "You want to put things in the man cave because you're ashamed of them!" you can authentically say "no! But I would like to have some space for my style too."

Even if you just said this part, "I’ve always dreamed of creating a comfortable home for us and our future family." to him, I think he would find that irresistible.

I so envy you having SW training knowledge prior to the wedding! Much happiness to you both!

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

First of all, thank for your writing the Surrendered Single and the Surrendered Wife. Both books really shaped the relationship that I have today. Your book outlines the same strategies my mother has intuitively used to create a happy and healthy marriage of 35 years. Before reading, I didn’t always understand their dynamic, but now it makes sense and I hope to follow her footsteps. Your writing has also helped me realize that being feminine is okay and traditional gender roles often do work best. As a millennial, so much of what I see and read denies the differences between men and women and promotes an even 50-50 split of chores and household tasks. Your books have helped me realize how important respect is to a relationship and your advice has been invaluable.

Now, a question for you!

I’m getting married in the Fall. We both own houses full of furniture and will need to merge our belongings and décor. My house looks like a Pottery Barn catalog and his house looks like a taxidermy museum. He loves hunting and is very, very proud of his trophies, as he should be. I fully support him in his hunting endeavors.

We both said that we should hang a few of his favorite pieces in our living room and den. I also offered to create a man cave/ office where we could showcase even more of this taxidermy. However, he felt like putting some of the pieces in a backroom meant we were ashamed of them. Really, he wants as many pieces as possible in the front rooms and not just a few of his favorites.

I have two concerns. First, we think we will live in my current house, which is nice but modest, and some of the pieces overwhelm the space. (They are HUGE…and really need 20 ft+ ceilings to really showcase them. His elk, for example, is about 7 feet tall). Second, I’m afraid my style will totally be lost if every wall has an animal head. A bear skin rug isn’t going to look right next to my black and white European photo wall. I really enjoy decorating a home and want it to reflect BOTH of us. If he would trust me to take on this task, I’m confident I can make it work.

The problem is, I feel like I have to tread very lightly when we talk about this because his trophies are so important to him. I do want to show case them, but I want it to be tasteful and a mix of our styles. He sees any attempt to put items in the backrooms as an attempt to hide them. I want his approval and leadership on the décor because I want to create a comfortable home for us, but we fundamentally disagree on what is considered tasteful.

We will not live together before marriage, so all of this is theoretical planning now, but I want get our marriage off on the right foot. What can I say and how can I approach the situation to reach a compromise? If I need to let him take the lead on this I can, but I’m afraid my identity in our home will be lost and I’ve always dreamed of creating a comfortable home for us and our future family.

(Sorry for the novel)

http://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/38dobv/im_laura_doyle_author_of_the_surrendered_wife_ama/cru7s6u

For context

[–]tryanotherJuanEndorsed Contributor 2 points3 points  (7 children)

Great advice! Thank you! Can't wait to read your new book!

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 5 points6 points  (6 children)

Thanks! I think you're going to find it valuable. I've learned so much in the last 14 years about how to be desired, cherished and adored by a man.

[–]CharmingChica 3 points4 points  (5 children)

I love the Surrendered Single :) I think I'm a bit too young for the Surrendered Wife but I'm going to read it anyway lol what has helped you learn so much in these last 14 years? Certain books certain mindsets. Im looking for anything to help me improve.

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 5 points6 points  (4 children)

CharmingChica, I've learned a lot by being in the trenches with women in their relationships and them sharing the insider information of what went on in their marriages. I coach women and I train relationship coaches on The Six Intimacy Skills, and that's been a great spot to learn from. I get to see that from Malaysia to Mexico, women are scared to relinquish finances, and hear about how they did it and what worked to support the intimacy and what didn't. I saw that in Israel and Jordan they care deeply about making sure their marriages are strong and lasting and in The Netherlands and Japan women hate the title "The Surrendered Wife."

[–]No_regrats 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Did the title got translated differently in Netherlands and Japan because they hated it? Or in other countries for that matter? IIRC in French it was translated to 'submissives wives / women'?

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Yes the title did get translated all different ways. I had to surrender about that since I don't speak 15 of the languages. I understand there is no word that means "Surrender" in German for example. Not in the sense that we use it, anyway.

[–]No_regrats 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Interesting. I didn't know that.

[–]CharmingChica 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's a wonderful experience. Your insight about the different countries was interesting. Especially since in the manosphere/red pill community men often talk about how submissive Japanese women are I was a bit surprised they'd be offended at the title.

[–]frozen_strawberryEndorsed Woman 15 points16 points  (10 children)

So I'm 22 and the boyfriend and I are talking about getting married. The one thing I'm nervous about is letting him down. I've never lived with a man before and we won't be moving in together until after we're married. My mom and dad divorced when I was rather young and I can only faintly remember my grandparents relationships so I feel like I dont have anyone in my immediate family as a role model. Aside from what's in your books, is there any advice you can give me?

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 11 points12 points  (9 children)

So exciting! Congratulations to you on the pending marriage plans!

My parents are divorced too, and I did unfortunately start down the path of following that failed recipe by doing what my mother did. You, on the other hand, can (or have!) read the books I wish I had when I was 22 and newly married, like Surrendered Wife and First, Kill All the Marriage Counselors. So I'm jealous! :-)

I hear how important it is to you to have your marriage be successful and I admire that. Since there's no problem yet, I don't want to make any up for you. From my vantage point, I'm very comforted for you to know that you have access to the information that made my marriage amazing.

It's also helpful to have girlfriends. Do you have those? And you have this group. Maybe your married mentor is here somewhere. If you ever do run into a crisis, come visit my company and we'll help you out.

But right now, you're in great, great shape. Better than I was at your age!

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Ugh, you are the mama I wish I had :) thanks for being a strong, feminine role model for us!

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

That compliment brings tears to my eyes! Thank you!

[–]frozen_strawberryEndorsed Woman 5 points6 points  (6 children)

Haha my boyfriend knows my reddit username so I can't tell you whether or not I've read the books ;)

I just moved and I dont know anyone here. I'm not really great at making friends, to be honest. And since I'm in college most people are just interested in hooking up and drinking. I'm not into either. And I'm not overly religious so I'm just not sure where to go and find people. There are a couple of women I talk to in my classes but that's about it.

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (3 children)

Well it is very tough when you're new in town. This too shall pass. But I've found the more I inquire about other people, the more they'll open up and tell me about themselves and the next thing I know we have a lot in common.

[–]frozen_strawberryEndorsed Woman 4 points5 points  (2 children)

i'm pretty introverted so that's something i definitely have to work on. There's a girl in one of my lectures who always sits one seat over from me and I decided I will just introduce myself next week.

And I have another question: my boyfriend is a soldier and there's a deployment coming up in the foreseeable future. Do you have any experience/advice on how to be a good girlfriend (wife if everything goes according to plan) to him while he's away?

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Strawberry, one of my coaches is a long-time military wife, and one of the gems I've learned from her is that when her husband is deployed she's very measured about which headlines she shares with him from the homefront. In other words, if there are challenges that he can't do anything about from Afghanistan, she's likely to be cautious about sharing that with him. She might get support from other wives in that case and just share lighter news, just so he's not fretting about something from so far away. I would have never thought of that, but I can see the wisdom in it.

[–]frozen_strawberryEndorsed Woman 3 points4 points  (0 children)

i'm not sure i would have thought about that. but it does make a lot of sense. they have many important things on their minds over there. and while i dont think he'd let himself get distracted in important moments there's no need to risk anything if there's no way he can do anything about it.

[–]GrowingSlowly 6 points7 points  (1 child)

I'm not sure if I can help, but I do have a little bit of experience being an introvert living in a new place. Do you have any hobbies or activities that you're interested in? I know you've mentioned being in classes, so you might not have loads of free time, but if you have some free time maybe you could find a group tp join.

I moved a while ago and the only person I knew was my SO. One day I saw a sign for a knitting club and I decided to check it out as I enjoy knitting and crocheting. It does take me a good amount of time to open up to people, but eventually I got to know the women in the group and some of them are very good friends now.

I hope that might help a little. Good luck!

[–]frozen_strawberryEndorsed Woman 6 points7 points  (0 children)

that's a good idea :) there's a drama club here that i'd like to join but i was too late this semester so i'm waiting it out and joining them next semester. but maybe i should dig deeper and see if there's one off campus that i could join.

[–]tryanotherJuanEndorsed Contributor 11 points12 points  (0 children)

First of all, thank for your writing the Surrendered Single and the Surrendered Wife. Both books really shaped the relationship that I have today. Your book outlines the same strategies my mother has intuitively used to create a happy and healthy marriage of 35 years. Before reading, I didn’t always understand their dynamic, but now it makes sense and I hope to follow her footsteps. Your writing has also helped me realize that being feminine is okay and traditional gender roles often do work best. As a millennial, so much of what I see and read denies the differences between men and women and promotes an even 50-50 split of chores and household tasks. Your books have helped me realize how important respect is to a relationship and your advice has been invaluable.

Now, a question for you!

I’m getting married in the Fall. We both own houses full of furniture and will need to merge our belongings and décor. My house looks like a Pottery Barn catalog and his house looks like a taxidermy museum. He loves hunting and is very, very proud of his trophies, as he should be. I fully support him in his hunting endeavors.

We both said that we should hang a few of his favorite pieces in our living room and den. I also offered to create a man cave/ office where we could showcase even more of this taxidermy. However, he felt like putting some of the pieces in a backroom meant we were ashamed of them. Really, he wants as many pieces as possible in the front rooms and not just a few of his favorites.

I have two concerns. First, we think we will live in my current house, which is nice but modest, and some of the pieces overwhelm the space. (They are HUGE…and really need 20 ft+ ceilings to really showcase them. His elk, for example, is about 7 feet tall). Second, I’m afraid my style will totally be lost if every wall has an animal head. A bear skin rug isn’t going to look right next to my black and white European photo wall. I really enjoy decorating a home and want it to reflect BOTH of us. If he would trust me to take on this task, I’m confident I can make it work.

The problem is, I feel like I have to tread very lightly when we talk about this because his trophies are so important to him. I do want to show case them, but I want it to be tasteful and a mix of our styles. He sees any attempt to put items in the backrooms as an attempt to hide them. I want his approval and leadership on the décor because I want to create a comfortable home for us, but we fundamentally disagree on what is considered tasteful.

We will not live together before marriage, so all of this is theoretical planning now, but I want get our marriage off on the right foot. What can I say and how can I approach the situation to reach a compromise? If I need to let him take the lead on this I can, but I’m afraid my identity in our home will be lost and I’ve always dreamed of creating a comfortable home for us and our future family.

(Sorry for the novel)

[–]Aine_of_knockaine 8 points9 points  (10 children)

What are some ways and things that you would recommend for keeping a relationship playful? Are there any activities that you find to be particularly partner bonding (besides physical intimacy)?

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 21 points22 points  (9 children)

One of the ways I keep our relationship playful is by showing up to it as the Goddess of Fun and Light (GOFL) myself. That means I'm dancing down the hallway, or taking a flying leap into him for a hug, or sitting on him on the couch, or I was jumping up and down while hugging him when he told me about this group, for example. Then he ends up asking me to dance to the song that just came on in our living room, or making up songs about how cute I am, and smacking me on the butt when he walks by.

I'm also huge on expressing my desires purely (no manipulations, control or criticism) and then we have fun things to do together because I'm getting what I want and he's doing something to make me happy. So we walk to sushi, go to the bookstore, sit out in the backyard in the evening. It's all about the fun over here, and that starts with me. It's a lot of pressure, but somebody has to start the pillow fight!

[–]StingrayVC 8 points9 points  (1 child)

I was jumping up and down while hugging him when he told me about this group

I love this ;) I think most of us felt the exact same way.

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

It's so nice that we're together at last! Finally, right?

[–]tintedlipbalm 10 points11 points  (5 children)

I'm also huge on expressing my desires purely (no manipulations, control or criticism)

I want to emphasize this. I think a lot of women fear to be openly vulnerable, and that's how covert manipulation starts.

1) What are your thoughts on the term "insecurity" and its modern usage? I don't know if you've noticed, but around relationship subreddits it's heavily used to shame the expression of ugly feelings and reactions such as jealousy, dislike for women with a lot of previous partners or a lot of male friends, and extroverted attention-seeking, etc.

2) Do you think male wants are really being deemed pathological in today's society? Or is this mostly an Internet thing? For example, calling a guy "controlling" for expecting modesty in his wife's dress and demeanor. Do you touch this subject in your new book?

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 11 points12 points  (4 children)

I agree that covert manipulation is what happens when you don't feel safe to just say what you want. But a lot of us had that "i want" trained out of us as kids so the only alternative was manipulation, or giving a bunch with the hope that we'd eventually get our turn (that never works). I really value the ability to express my desires purely now. It was so painful when I didn't know how to do that.

  1. As far as insecurity--I find shaming is not super motivating for human beings. And as a mere mortal woman I experience the full range of ugly feelings from time to time.

Speaking of extroverted attention-seeking. I just wrote a book that kills off a whole class of mental-health professionals, for example. Am I insecure? Sometimes! Terrified at other times. Jealous at times too, (though rarely around my husband--more when I see other relationship experts having a big platform and giving out lame advice like, "Marriage is hard work." Yes, Dr. Phil--I mean you.) We're all vulnerable. It's part of what connects us. We've all made mistakes. We all fear being ejected from the tribe, or being unlovable.

I see the word "insecure" and I feel like I should check the box next to it: Yes.

  1. As far as male wants being pathological--that's a heavy word. I stay away from diagnosing (I leave that to the marriage counselors. They keeps them busy) and try to focus on my own feelings and desires--the two magical gifts I have as a woman that lead me to all things fun, wonderful and intimate. I probably wouldn't concern myself with whether he's controlling or whatever because that's off my paper, so to speak. I would focus on how I felt and what I wanted (my paper) and express that. So if my husband wanted me to wear a more modest neckline, for example, I would ask myself how I felt and what I wanted. If I felt disappointed and sad or hurt, I would probably say "ouch!" I might say, "I want to look vavavoom for this event." At the same time, what he thinks really influences me, so if he thought I was too hoochy mama, that would probably influence what I wanted. I might decide to change. I'm always in charge of myself and all things concerning me. But my husband's thinking really influences me. And my desires really influence him.

Surrendering is so personal and individual. There really are no hard and fast rules--just this universal law that the only person I can change is myself. Anytime I hear someone "pathologizing" a certain behavior I tend to run in the other direction.

[–]tintedlipbalm 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Thank you for doing this AMA! I edited to add a second question, I didn't know if you caught it, it's along the same lines.

[–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Yep, got it! For some reason whenever I write numbers they change to 1s. That's one of the mysteries of reddit, I decided. Or you guys are punking me.:-) Either way, I'm not worrying my pretty little head about it.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–]IVIaskerade 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Reddit uses a text formatting called markdown that does things like interpret asterisks to mean italics or bold. If you put a in front of the character, it will make it do *this* instead of this (edit: you have to put one in front of each asterisk). It's called an "escape character" (and yes, I had to put two of them above to get one to show up).

    If you're doing a numbered list, the character has to go between the number and the dot (1.).

    If you don't have one

    1. It does this

    If you put it before the number

    1. You get this odd formatting.

    And if you put it between the number and the dot...

    1. Presto! Normal numbers!

    [–]lisfb 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    It's all about the fun over here, and that starts with me. It's a lot of pressure, but somebody has to start the pillow fight!

    Ah, but I love this, haha. :)

    [–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child)

    THANK YOU for your books :) I look to them quite often. What's your favorite way to please your man, or show gratitude? And maybe some tips on how to spice that up!

    Also, SW talks about showing vulnerability & expressing that with femininity. Can you expand on that, or maybe give some examples from your personal life? I share my burdens with my man, but am always careful to try not to let anything become too much of his burden (ie grieving).

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 22 points23 points  (0 children)

    You're welcome for the books! Glad you like them!

    Since surrendering, I have to admit I spend a lot less time thinking about how to please my man because I know he's so happy when he pleases me. I think I'm receiving about 100 to 1 around here now, and he loves it and I love it. I do express a lot of gratitude. I'm super grateful to be treated like the princess every day, and to hear how I'm beautiful and never have to put gas in my car and on and on. I can't thank him enough, but I definitely try!

    As far as vulnerability, for me it's not just sharing my burdens, although I do rely on him that way (as well as several girlfriends and two sisters since I like to talk A LOT). It's also saying, "I miss you" or "ouch!" if he hurts my feelings, or letting him see me cry at a sappy commercial (which, sadly, I do).

    For me, the essence of femininity is receptivity. I can't be receiving and giving at the same time, and since my husband is most attracted to my feminine spirit, I focus on being a gracious receiver to please him. Sounds counterintuitive, I know, but letting him be my hero and delight me is also giving in a way.

    Speaking of that, my husband John is a big reddit fan, and he's the one that discovered RPW, and suggested an AMA. I couldn't be more thrilled about it getting to meet you, so I want to give him a shout out for introducing us. Thanks, John!

    [–]RPDameendorsed woman 7 points8 points  (9 children)

    Laura, I love your books. I'm reading "The Surrendered Wife" like a bible as I try to make a permanent change in my ways.

    My questions are:

    1. Do you feel like you just want to shake some women and tell them that they could be so much happier if they'd just listen? I'm asking because I'm a recent convert, and I feel this way all the time, so I can't imagine being the author of the instruction manual and seeing so many unhappy women.

    2. Here at /r/redpillwomen, we have a first layer to surrendering, where we first make sure that we are with a man capable of being a good leader. Many men are so scared of their own masculinity and leadership after having feminism drilled down their throat, and, for example, they think that their own anger and frustration must be muted. We surrender to men who are okay with being men. I understand that surrendering brings out a man's natural leadership (and have experienced it myself), but do you consider that there are men out there that are just too far gone? Do you have any "before you surrender" screening processes? Why or why not?

    3. Do you think that there are women incapable of surrendering? My significant other and I talk all the time about how both of us are able to take a humbling look at ourselves and make improvements, and how rare a quality that seems to be these days.

    Thanks a bunch!

    P.S. I told the male counselor that I see (to help keep me on track with making changes in my life) the title of your upcoming book and he thought it was hilarious and agreed with you. He hates marriage counseling and believes in individual accountability.

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 12 points13 points  (8 children)

    Thanks for the high praise, RPDame! Glad to hear SW has been so helpful for you.

    As to your questions: 1. I still remember that when I was learning to surrender and really had no idea what I was doing, I was just a terrified mess and didn't think it would work for me. I didn't know I was controlling, I didn't know there was another way. I remember a woman saying to me, after I asked her for advice, that she tried never to criticize her husband no matter how much it seemed like he deserved it and I said, "Have you got anything else?" Cause in my head I thought, I am NOT going to do that! I didn't think I COULD do that. Didn't seem possible at the time. So I have a lot of compassion for women who are where I was back then.

    That said, to keep it real, there are times when someone who is well indoctrinated with surrendering says she's so anxious because her husband won't do what she wants and I admit that I will sigh. Heavily.

    For me, all the hurting women of the world are what has me get up every day and do what I do--I started an international coaching company to support all the women who reach out to me. I'm on a mission to end world divorce, and it's a huge job. But I get support from all corners. Support I don't even know about, like RedPillWomen!

    But in a way it's a good sign that you're frustrated because you can see something they can't yet see. That tells me you really get it.

    1. On the "before you surrender" screening process, I do have one, but it's completely different than yours. There are three types of men you aren't safe with--physical abusers, men who aren't capable of being faithful, and men who are actively addicted to drugs, alcohol or gambling. You're not safe in those situations, so I call those "a divorce I endorse" which is rare, as you can imagine.

    What I've been fortunate to see from my position as a coach for the last 16 years is that every man has the capacity to come out as a masculine man. There's no such thing as a man who's "too far gone." If he's not one of the three unsafe guys, then he's a good guy--not a perfect man, but one you can have a wonderful relationship with. One were you can feel desired, cherished and adored for life. We women are the keepers of the relationship and we hold the key. As long as we have the skills, he'll step up to go get the car when it's raining, earn money to support the family, to protect you. If he's not appearing manly, chances are high she's being a little hairy herself. Until you have the skills, it's really hard to see this. But once you have them, while you won't be perfect (I'm sure not!) at least you can see what you're doing.

    1. As far as some women being incapable of surrendering, I've been really really really impressed and encouraged to see the clients that come through Laura Doyle Connect making amazing strides in their relationships, in their personal growth. Pain is a fantastic motivator (worked for me!) so sometimes a marital crisis will really bring out her A game. I've never really seen someone fail who has tried to implement these skills. Sometimes it's quick, sometimes it's slow. Some people want it but can't get themselves to read the book. Some people aren't readers. I made video training programs to reach those women. Some people just can't see the possibility that things will ever change, so for those people I recommend "experiments." Try saying, "Whatever you think" and just see what happens. So I'd say I'm having the opposite experience: That there are some amazing, self-aware, courageous women out there working the skills in their relationships and saving those relationships. It's unbelievably inspiring around here every day.

    I admire that you're committed to your self-development and being the best wife or girlfriend that you can be. Surrendering was the best self-impovement program I've ever undertaken for sure. I became my best Laura.

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    I meant to say thanks for the encouragement from your counselor about the new book Title, "First, Kill All the Marriage Counselors: Modern Day Secrets to Being Desired, Cherished and Adored for Life." I thought it might also be controversial (like Surrendered Wife) but so far it's being received with a big, "Yup!" I didn't see that coming!

    [–]RPDameendorsed woman 6 points7 points  (3 children)

    Thanks Laura!

    I really got to experience the power of surrendering in almost a controlled fashion. My previous relationship ended, I took a hard look at myself and how much was my fault, and I made changes and resolved to do better. I'd really loved him and I'd been so destructive. After some months of silence, I was lucky enough to get an unexpected second chance with my ex, and I was able to enter into the relationship with surrendering in mind.

    It's my own little interpersonal clinical trial, almost, and the difference is like night and day. He feels better, we love one another instead of tearing one another down, and I feel so much better too. I noticed that my mind was consistently quiet for the first time. No worries, no "what ifs". I just trust and give him my feminine strengths to enhance his masculine strengths, and life is suddenly joyous. It's the best and I just want to shout it from the rooftops!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 6 points7 points  (2 children)

    Wow, RPDame! CHILLS! This is awesome. I so admire you for what you've accomplished in your relationship. I know how scary it is, and how much focus it takes to make that kind of transformation. Kudos!

    I'm with you on the shouting it from the rooftops. I feel the SAME WAY. I just can't shut up about it because I'm so much happier and my husband is too. And when I look at the ripple effect of all the other women who are happier now too, I feel we have so much power, and such responsibility to learn these skills that make our relationships great.

    Spiderman was right: With great power comes great responsibility. And you're using your power wisely. Rock on!

    [–]RPDameendorsed woman 4 points5 points  (1 child)

    Thank you so much!

    And I give credit to you, since I reread portions of your book to make sure my new habits stick. Your work has made a difference in our lives, and I'm so grateful to you!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Hooray! Good to hear! Thank you.

    [–]tryanotherJuanEndorsed Contributor 4 points5 points  (2 children)

    "There's no such thing as a man who's "too far gone." If he's not one of the three unsafe guys, then he's a good guy--not a perfect man, but one you can have a wonderful relationship with."

    So true! So many of my girlfriends are waiting for Prince Charming to show up on his white horse when a perfectly good, decent guy is standing right in front of them.

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    Exactly! That's my experience too. The right guy for her will be exciting and amazing, but if you want him to be more of a man, it's like the old Cody commercial: Try being more of a woman.

    [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    "If you want him to be more of a man, try being more of a woman." LOVE that!

    [–]PicklesAndPears 9 points10 points  (1 child)

    Thank you so much for your WONDERFUL books! You have truly helped me to be my best possible self, and I am so grateful for your advice and words of wisdom!

    One of the go-to "surrendered wife" things that I see a lot on the internet is not to complain about your husband/SO to other women, but in your books you encourage venting to another female if you feel frustrated. I'm confused as to how the ideas of (1) outward signs of respect for your mate, and (2) letting off steam about your mate to your friend can/should fit together. Can you shed some light on this and give us tips on how to vent while remaining respectful?

    Also, going off of that question, how does one go about finding likeminded women who have more traditional views of marriage (outside of this group, of course)? I have many girl friends, just not many who treat their husbands or boyfriends in the respectful, noncritical way that I aim to treat my boyfriend!

    Thanks so much!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

    You're welcome! Glad you're finding my books wonderful.

    On the venting vs. respecting issue, what I've found is that there are times when you just have to get something off your chest about your guy. This doesn't happen much anymore to me, but it really did a lot in the beginning. So in that case I had two choices--try to stuff it down and hope for the best (that never worked) or share it with a girlfriend so my feelings got their day in the sun. I chose the latter, and I encourage my clients to choose the latter when necessary. Ideally you vent to the women you're looking for in your second question--ones who will hold it in safe hands, in the context that you respect this man and recognize that he has just the usual number of faults and no more. Ideally you don't go off on a male-bashing binge and end up hating him more. You just want to get it out so you can move on, and do it without hurting the intimacy in your relationship.

    I do think girlfriends that share the same values are priceless for helping you keep perspective (this is a good man who loves you and a good dad who accidentally ruined the rug with black shoe polish).

    On the second question. That is the million dollar question about how to create more community with like-minded women. You RPWs are lucky to have this group! I know women end up with lifelong friends out of coming to my retreat or going through the training to be a coach because there's such an important common bond there. And my coaches and I all hang out together to continue to support each other.

    [–]lisfb 8 points9 points  (3 children)

    -What made you decide to write for a more secular audience? (Not that I'm complaining! ;) I find it very difficult to find the sort of things talked about in the book and this sub seriously discussed or written about, outside of heavily based faith circles, so I found myself pleasantly surprised at how minimal the faith element was when I started going through the books).

    -Do you make the final decision on the titles or is that the publisher’s decision? Were there any worries about how the titles, namely SW/SS, would come across to the public? I think the word ‘surrendered’ has a way of making people who aren't familiar with the terms as they're meant here feel apprehensive, myself included (I was a bit wary of reading SS/SW until I actually opened the books and, you know, read).

    -Out of all the books you’ve written, which is your favorite and why?

    -I know you're latest book just released...but do you have any idea on what you'll be working on next?

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (2 children)

    I see what you mean about the Surrendered Wife being a rare secular book on a hot faith topic, but from what I hear, most faiths don't have a practical how-to book about respect anyway. They just say you should and don't explain the very practical, "This is how you do it step-by-step" part that I needed. For me, it's a universal concept for every woman who wants it. Which, when I was writing it, I thought was at least, AT LEAST 2,000 women. At least. Shows you what I know.

    Which brings me to the question about the title. I named all my books all by myself. Simon & Schuster would have liked to change the title of The Surrendered Wife, but by the time they published it, it was already a self-published hit with a lot of media attention. So it just had to be SW.

    You crack me up with your apprehension before you actually, you know, read. And that is the story of my life--people misunderstand before they actually, you know, read. And that goes back to me being in my own little world and thinking Surrendered was such a beautiful word, something everyone would want to be because it's such a trusting, empowering way to go through life. Like if you're stuck in traffic and you can't make it move, but you can decide to enjoy that time by talking on the phone or listening to much or an audiobook. Surrender. Ahhhhh.

    But then when you pair it with the word wife, of course people have a big reaction to it. But I didn't find that out until after I named my book that and the worldwide media had picked up on it. By then it was too late. And maybe if I had named it something less controversial, you would have never heard of it at all. So who knows? I'm just grateful to be able to get the message out.

    You can't ask a mother to pick her favorite child. The SW was my first baby, so it will always have a special place in my heart, but I have to say I'm so dang excited about my new baby, First, Kill All the Marriage Counselors: Modern Day Secrets to Being Desired, Cherished and Adored for Life. The reviews on Amazon.com are coming in with really powerful stories from women who have seen fast, big improvements in terms of feeling desired, cherished and adored, and that's what gets me going in the mornings!

    Not to say that I don't love Surrendered Single. I love getting those wedding announcement thank yous! And people get really inspired from reading Things Will Get as Good as You Can Stand. So I'm a very lucky author that all my books have been well-received.

    I don't have my marching orders for the next book yet. When those are downloaded, I'll get started. Meanwhile I have a retreat coming up in September and some new programs coming out shortly. So there's always lots to do.

    [–]lisfb 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Well, I'm glad you were able to get the word out. :D I'm also glad you've taken (are taking) the time to answer all these questions! Good luck with your new programs and upcoming retreat!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Thanks!

    [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (1 child)

    Hey there!! i'm so excited that you're doing this AMA!! My ex broke up with me 4 months ago and it's been really hard. I feel that I'm going about finding a new relationship the wrong. I've tried online dating and friend referrals and neither seem to work because they are coming at it from a feminist (may I even say femnazi) approach. I have copied their techniques for years now, not knowing there were other ways, and it's just left me feeling really used/raw/unattractive/slutty.

    I have bought your book "The Surrendered Single" and I can't wait until it comes in the mail, but until then, do you have any suggestions on how to move on from your past (not just relationships) when trying to move forward and work towards finding a new relationship?

    Any advice is very welcomed!! Thanks!!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

    Sunhappy, sorry to hear about your recent heartbreak. That's tough! I'm so happy to hear you've ordered Surrendered Single. I think you'll find it's stuffed full of ideas for what you're asking about. In fact, I'd say there's a whole paradigm shift in there that you'll love.

    But just to get you started, I would say that your online dating and friend referrals are actually great--nothing to change about those except your approach. What's going to be different about those situations this time is you will be showing up in a super feminine way, and believe me, you'll have men coming out of the woodwork wanting to date you. It's so attractive to them when we're our authentic feminine selves. You might focus on being receptive (let him treat you) and being quite (he's auditioning for the part of your boyfriend, not the other way around).

    One other suggestion I have for you is to start smiling at everyone you see. Every relationship starts with a smile. It's scarier than it sounds. It sounds easy, but when you actually do it, you're likely to feel vulnerable. That's okay--keep going. A smile is not a promise. It's just a sign that you're open. You can close a minute later if you decide that's what's best.

    I'm excited for the fun you'll have dating surrendered-style!

    [–]FleetingWishEndorsed Contributor 7 points8 points  (1 child)

    Laura,

    You mentioned now you are in the business of mentoring women via the "Laura Doyle Connect". Have you ever encountered a case where "surrendering" or being submissive wasn't a viable solutions to a couple's problems, or didn't work (outside of the three cases where you called "a divorce you'd endorse")? If so can you share couple of stories? Why do you think it didn't work? What ended up happening?

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    Great question. Here's the amazing thing I've learned from watching thousands of women implement the Six Intimacy Skills. If she has a good guy (not one of the three as you mentioned) she is able to use The Six Intimacy Skills to awaken his natural desire to make her ridiculously happy and become the cherished woman she always wanted to be 100% of the time. This is very difficult for women to believe when they first show up for coaching and they're really hurting and have been for a while, but it's absolutely my experience. So my examples are all the opposite of what you were asking about.

    We've helped over 150,000 women (which is more than any marriage counselor on the planet). We have women come in $20K or $30K or $100K into a divorce and we're able to stand for her marriage and get it all the way back to where they feel like newlyweds. We've helped women overcome affairs. A wife with Intimacy Skills trumps a mistress every day of the week and twice on Sundays. One couple had been estranged for 10 years in the same house and now they're grossing out their teenage kids by being so physically affectionate. Those are the examples that I get to witness every day.

    It never gets old!

    [–]gabilromariz 4 points5 points  (2 children)

    Thank you for coming here :)

    I have a question. My boyfriend of 4 years and I are both in school but while he is finishing a very demanding course, I am waiting to change majors so I'm less busy at the moment. I want to help out in taking charge and planning the things he doesn't have the time to do like a vacation for us to the last detail and so on. He also wants a very competitive internship but I know he doesn't have the time or energy to prepare adequately to write a good CV and cover letter and all that stuff. I want him to be successfull and I want to help, but not step on his toes

    When does this taking charge cross into mothering territory? I'm a very controlling person, working on it, and I just don't want to "try to wear the pants in the relationship". I don't want to take over his life or anything, am I going too far?

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 11 points12 points  (1 child)

    Gabilromariz, you remind me of me! Only you know what's best for your life, but I can tell you I wouldn't touch my husband's CV and cover-letter with a 10-foot pole. Been there, done that, don't recommend it! That's all him, and he has a way of making things happen that is very different from the way I make things happen.

    Helping my husband was completely overrated. Mothering is deadly for passion, since men aren't sexually attracted to their mothers --nor mothers to their sons.

    My husband's CV and cover letters have nothing to do with me, but the vacation is a little different since that's something you'd share. But here's a critical question: Would you rather be the cherished recipient of a vacation he plans and takes you on? Or would you rather be the travel agent who makes all the arrangements and takes him? I know you might be thinking it's just practical for me to plan it since he's so busy, but I know for me that was the road to hell. It might mean you wait longer or pay more, but if what you want is intimacy and connection, you might consider receiving that vacation.

    One of my coaches wanted to go on vacation and her husband was also in a demanding program, so she just let it go. Then he took her out to dinner one night and showed her the two tickets to Europe for the romantic vacation he'd secretly planned when she thought he was studying. He passed his course and gave his wife an unforgettable trip. So it's all possible.

    All this trusting requires some faith and patience, but if I can do it, then you can do it too, as you and I are practically twins from what I can tell.

    [–]gabilromariz 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    I completely get what you're saying. I can only know the best for me, he knows the best for him better than I possibly could (not for lack of trying), even if it feels the reverse.

    I'm starting to get better at this but sometimes slip. I want one thing (to be happy with my man) and sometimes can self sabotage thinking I'm doing good stuff. I see other women doing it too, shooting themselves in the foot when they had good intentions to start with.

    Thank you for such a thoughtful response :)

    [–]StingrayVC 3 points4 points  (1 child)

    Welcome!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Thank you! I'm thrilled to be here!

    [–]tryanotherJuanEndorsed Contributor 5 points6 points  (3 children)

    What advice would you give new mothers to help keep their husbands and marriage as the top priority as they start a new family?

    (Not pregnant...just asking for the future. :) )

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (2 children)

    So cute! Were you a girl scout? Because you seem very prepared. :-)

    This is an area where my experience is second-hand, as I don't have kids. But what I've seen with my friends and clients is that there's a lot to be said for pretending (acting as if) you love your husband MORE than your babies. Those little bundles of joy come into the world so vulnerable and unspeakably cute, and they need so so so much of your attention, it's easy to feel that relationship is more rewarding or fulfilling. But the very biggest gift you can give to that child is a playful, passionate relationship with his or her father. I have a chapter about that in the new book you might find helpful.

    I heard about a book called, "I was a great mother until I had kids," and I think of that whenever I share anything about how to surrender in your relationship as a mom. I'm a little unqualified! But I did lots of research for all my books for sure.

    [–]tryanotherJuanEndorsed Contributor 3 points4 points  (1 child)

    Ha ha...actually I was. My mom has always told me that it is easy for a husband's happiness to decrease when a baby is born and that you need to be careful.

    I guess I worry about it because I'm 28 and while I would like to wait 2-5 years to have children and enjoy a honeymoon period, it seems unwise to wait too long. So I think we will wait a year or so then start a family.

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    Sounds like an excellent plan! I'm not worried about you at all. I think you're in great shape--very respectful and wise.

    [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (3 children)

    Hello! I was just curious what type of research you did in preparation for the book? The ideas on this sub and in your book were more accepted in past generations so I was just wondering if you interviewed older couples or anything. Thanks!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 5 points6 points  (2 children)

    Some people take a really academic approach to this stuff. I just wanted to save my own darn marriage at first. So this wasn't done in laboratories--it was done with real women in real marriages. And I did get some valuable tips from women who were married at least 15 years (that seemed like an eternity at the time) when I had only been married for six or seven. But I don't know that I would say that these views were more accepted by the generation before mine. They had the highest divorce rate ever, for example.

    When I was trying to stop controlling my husband I just started controlling all my girlfriends. I made them try surrendering too. I'm not sure why that worked :-) And the results were just astonishing to all of us. They would come to my little living room support group with these amazing stories of their husband's responding to them with such tenderness, and him taking on chores that they used to fight about voluntarily with a smile, and showing up bigger as the dad, for example. So that was the initial research. Me and my friends. Then I started with workshops and then the book and then, ba-boom! Suddenly I was getting emails from all over the world--from Egypt and South Africa and Japan and the UK. And surrendering was working for them too. And Jews wrote asking if I was Jewish, and Muslims asked me to speak to their wives groups and Mormons and Catholics.

    It was really pretty overwhelming. I didn't expect all that. I didn't feel prepared to help everybody and there were waaaaaaaaaaay more women wanting help than I could ever respond to. So I ran away for a while. I said, "I wrote the book, my work here is done." I put my feet up on the desk.

    But that didn't stop people from reaching out, and some of them were pretty persistent. Plus, I couldn't really shut up about it either, so even at a party I was yapping about surrendering. And eventually I came back full bore and and started serving the women who wanted support again as best I could. This time I got support.

    So I had to grow even more--enough to start an international coaching company, and to create some programs and learn how to present those programs, and build a team and have a retreat. (Can you say, "YIKES!!!!") And all along I was learning from the women I was serving. You'll see it in the new book. I had a lot more data points than before (like 150,000 more). I learned some shortcuts to help newbies get out of crisis and back into connection. I saw where some of my explanations weren't super clear and expanded on those. I saw the common mistakes and tried to set up bigger signs saying, "wrong way, do not enter!" I was able to organize the skills more succinctly (there are six of them).

    Wait, what was the question? I think I got carried away.

    I could make my answers shorter, but once I get started it's hard to stop :-)

    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Wow, thanks for explaining your process! That's crazy how it just sort of snowballed. I really enjoyed The Surrendered Wife and I look forward to reading your new book as well!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Thanks, LadyGourmet. So glad you enjoy my work.

    It was a crazy, wonderful snowball and such an amazing gift. It's such a pleasure to have the goods in terms of something that really really works to make your relationship great!

    [–]Amyjoy1 5 points6 points  (6 children)

    I am in a very happy relationship with a very masculine man. He does not want to marry but does everything he can to keep me happy. Besides the obvious Break Up!! advice, is there a way to apply surrendering to this issue?

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 10 points11 points  (4 children)

    Amyjoy! it sounds like it is your desire to be married. Do I have that right? If so, then Break Up!! would not be my first, second or third recommendation. At all. I had a woman come through coach training who was in your situation and by the end of the training (five months) they were married! That was pretty gratifying to watch.

    Here's what you might consider: Since the relationship is wonderful, I'm guessing you're respectful and not having control issues ala the way I was in the bad old days. If that's true, then proceed to the next step. If you feel like you might have some work to do to improve this issue, that would be my highest priority. I wouldn't even BEGIN to talk about my desire to be married if I knew I was still being disrespectful and critical every day.

    But since you say you're very happy, I'm guessing that's not true of you. So in that case, you could just express a desire to be a wife. "I would love to be a wife someday." Just like that. I know you say he doesn't want to marry, but let's just see how that lands. You may think you've already said it, but you may not have said it that way, and it really makes all the difference. I see it work magic. Women are shocked because they swear he's never going to get married and then just those simple words make him decide to marry her. I know that sounds unbelievable but I see it all the time.

    I hate to go any further until we see the results of that. If you need more support after that you can get a free discovery call at my lauradoyle.org website. We'll take it from there.

    [–]vintagegirlgame 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    "I would love to be a wife someday."

    Interesting that these are the magic words. Most woman would say "I want to get married", but "getting married" conjures up images of big expensive bridezilla weddings which is sure to send the man in the opposite direction. Woman want a wedding but most women don't want (or don't know how) to be "a wife." When she expresses desire to actually be "a wife" it naturally shows a softer more surrendered side that appeals to a man. And the "someday" tagged on at the end keeps the pressure off and makes it an open ended expression.

    [–]upsala 2 points3 points  (2 children)

    Does this concept apply to parenthood as well? I was in the same position as Amyjoy1 a few months ago, but my boyfriend proposed after he realized how much I wanted to be his wife. He also knows that I want to be a mom someday, but he's not 100 percent sure that he wants to be a dad. I would rather be married to him than pursue parenthood with another man, but I'm curious as to how often men change their mind when it comes to this issue.

    [–]aTweetingBird 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    You never know! My SIL did not want kids for a long time, while my brother had always wanted them. After getting married, her clock started ticking and they had a baby. My brother said no more after that, while she actually wanted more! It was something they disagreed on for a few years - but now he has decided he wants another one, and they're currently trying for #2!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

    I completely agree--men just want their wives to be happy, and as long as your guy knows that the most important thing is that you're so happy to be married to him, and then also that you would LOVE to be a mom, it's pretty rare that the guy doesn't come through and agree to be a dad. A lot of kids are born because their moms wanted them and their dads wanted to make their woman happy. What you want counts for a whole lot!

    [–]sariaru 4 points5 points  (5 children)

    Hi! I'm really new to RPW, but as you can see, I've heard rave reviews about Surrendered Wife here and elsewhere, and I'm excited to pick it up!

    Now a question: Have you read Captivating by Stasi Eldridge or it's masculine partner book, Wild at Heart (by John Eldridge)? They're written from a Christian perspective, but they touch on points that I think are very salient.

    One point in particular that I liked was her breakdown on beauty: it invites, nourishes, comforts, and only then can it captivate.

    Anyways, I look forward to reading Surrendered Wife in addition! :)

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 8 points9 points  (4 children)

    I'm not familiar with the Eldrige books, but I love the quote about beauty. That certainly echoes my experience that women (the sexier sex, or the more beautiful gender, if you will) are continuous magnets for men, who are a reliable 24X7 noticing service, God bless them! And while beauty does invite, it's our inner beauty--our vulnerability and receptivity--that create the impetus for lasting commitment.

    My single clients will say,"I'm attracting all these weird guys!" and I'm like, "Yeah! We all attract them ALL!" But what makes a man decide to commit to a woman is seeing that he has a place to make a contribution to her life. She needs protection, to be given special treatment and she's willing to receive that from him and is grateful for it. That's what seals the deal. That's why one of the very worst thing you can say to a man is, "I don't need a man!"

    [–]sariaru 5 points6 points  (3 children)

    it's our inner beauty--our vulnerability and receptivity--that create the impetus for lasting commitment.

    I absolutely agree! A woman has to really be at rest in her beauty - I think men as well as other women can tell when it's forced, or when a woman is "trying too hard," to put on a facade of exterior beauty. Or as she puts it:

    “What if you have a genuine and captivating beauty that is marred only by your striving?”

    Thanks for answering!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 8 points9 points  (2 children)

    The striving is typically not feminine, it's masculine. Striving is hairy!

    [–]vintagegirlgame 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    Haha I love how you use "hairy" to describe masculine traits. As soon as it's "hairy" women think "oh no I don't want to be like that!"

    [–]sariaru 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Striving is hairy!

    Thanks for the laughter into my cup of tea this morning.

    [–]agh_missedit 5 points6 points  (4 children)

    How long do I wait for a man to ask me to get married?

    It seems like a silly question as if there is some magical number. (Is there? haha.)

    What do I need to keep in mind when I am in a long-term relationship that seems like is on the slow track to marriage?

    I'm reading Surrendered Single now, but haven't gotten through all of it. Thanks for writing the books and sharing your ideas!

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 5 points6 points  (3 children)

    Agh_missedit, I think six months of dating is long enough to know if you're wanting to get married to that person you're dating. So there you go--that's the magic number! Haha!

    But that doesn't mean if he doesn't propose after six months and one day that you're outta there! After six months, you might express your desire, as in, "I'm really looking forward to being a wife one day." That's strictly speaking for yourself, not telling him he has to propose, but it's letting him know that's something you would love. You'll probably get some information from expressing that desire.

    Another thing that happens in dating relationships is that men will float an idea in a joking way to see how you respond. So I've seen a guy say, "someday when we're married we'll blah, blah, blah..." and then she says, "Oh, you're drunk! Shut up!" and that's the same as saying, "I would never marry you." If it comes up in a light moment, that's probably a pretty good sign that he's thinking about it too.

    Of course, you don't want to do what I did and totally ruin the moment by controlling the stuffing out of it. And once you get an indication that it's on his mind to propose, that's when you really want to be patient and let him surprise you. It can be tough. That's not one of my strengths--that patience thing. But there's no other way to feel so ridiculously desired and honored by that proposal than to just let it happen in it's own time. It's a beautiful thing. You'll see some more about this near the end of Surrendered Single. If you're already in a relationship, I highly recommend you pick up either Surrendered Wife or First, Kill All the Marriage Counselors.

    If you're not in a relationship, then I can see you really like to plan ahead!

    [–]agh_missedit 3 points4 points  (2 children)

    Hi Laura, thanks for your thoughts! I really appreciate it.

    Do you think it should be said "I'm really looking forward to being your wife one day?" or keep it a general statement of a wife? Does it make a difference?

    I'm in a relationship currently and I've asked him whether he wants to get married if he were to find the right woman and he says yes. At the very least, I know he's the marrying type. He hasn't made any suggestions, light hearted or otherwise, about marrying so I think he's not quite "there" yet.

    Sometimes I feel like running away or that maybe I'm wrong in picking this guy or that things aren't happening fast enough. Your book really helped me understand that I'm thinking all these things because I'm afraid it will never happen and that I have to let go of trying to control it all and exercise patience.

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

    I would definitely leave out "your" from the I want to be a wife sentence. That's the difference between control and desire. There's never a "you" in a pure desire. Once you put it in there it's control.

    I think you're doing fine with your guy, so I'm glad you're feeling that it's just a matter of being patient. You can certainly express your desire and see what happens out of that. Also, you want to make sure that all your energy is a yes to him when he does propose. Sometimes a man will get mixed messages and that will slow down a proposal. It doesn't sound like you're wishy-washy about it, but that's something I commonly see. She wants him to propose but she's not sure she'll say yes!

    [–]vintagegirlgame 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    I think saying "a wife" makes him pause and think to himself..."doesn't she want to be my wife?" He may even picture you being somebody else's wife and if that picture doesn't look right to him, he'll think more about how he wants you to be his wife. But it has to be his idea!

    [–][deleted]  (3 children)

    [deleted]

    [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 12 points13 points  (2 children)

    So happy to hear my work has helped you, Kikuhoshi! That's awesome. I'm pretty excited to not have my parents' relationship too. So glad there's another way.

    As far as people who find surrendering abusive, I usually invite them to tell me how it's abusive, so I can hear what the heck they're thinking, as that would indicate that there's a misunderstanding for me. People who think that are making some assumptions that aren't accurate. If we can get those on the table and dispel the myths, that helps a lot, usually. I'll say something like, "I think there may be a misunderstanding. How do you see it being abusive?" Then I just speak for myself and tell them honestly how it really is. That seems to help.

    Sorry to hear you lost a friend over surrendering! That's rough. But I will say I also ended up editing my friends list at the time, choosing not to associate with some friends who seemed pretty committed to male-bashing. Didn't work for me anymore. In your friends case, it actually sounds pretty funny, but I can see where it got old. Poor thing probably just didn't see a possibility for herself to be as courageous as it sounds like you've been in your relationship. Only you know for sure if you miss your friend and she was 51% good to have in your life. I certainly applaud you making decisions that support your marriage first. That's important to me too.

    I DO like Klondike bars, so I would play six games of beach doubles volleyball with Dave, against Mike and Rana, which we would most likely lose most of, for a Klondike bar. Granted, I would do that for no Klondike bar. So maybe I'm failing the question!

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

      I will look for my Klondike bar in the mail! :-)

      [–]Aine_of_knockaine 3 points4 points  (3 children)

      Sometimes small issues occur and you have to rationalize things to yourself so that you talk yourself off a proverbial cliff. Do you find yourself doing this? If so are there any tips and tricks you would mind sharing?

      [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 11 points12 points  (2 children)

      Absolutely! Recently, we had a situation at our house where we miscommunicated badly. My husband deleted a bunch of files I wanted to keep. Of course I had an immediate human reaction that was bubbling up--you know the one--and wanted to say a few things that wouldn't have been good for the intimacy in my marriage. Instead, I chose not to make a big deal about it. He already felt terrible. So I had a problem that I lost some files, but one problem I didn't have was tension in my marriage! Staying focused on that in the moment has been life-changing for me. I hate for the handholding and dancing to go missing now, and now it's a habit. But it wasn't easy in the beginning when I was in the habit of just shooting off my mouth whenever I felt like it.

      [–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (1 child)

      he already felt terrible

      So many women are oblivious to this

      [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

      Like I used to be!

      [–]WhimsicalWonderland 2 points3 points  (10 children)

      What would be the best advice for women out there who follow RedPill, but want to be active in their own careers as well? With the times changing, my SO doesn't even want me to be a SAHM and encourages career for the 2nd income. How can we balance the home life and the career life when it comes to priorities and taking care of your SO?

      [–][deleted]  (7 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]WhimsicalWonderland 4 points5 points  (6 children)

        Yes, but I do see advice where women tell others to not choose their careers over their SOs, whereas I know many Red Pill-like men who would prefer their women to have their own extremely successful careers as well, even if it means a LDR. They want a woman who is just as capable financially so they know that they're not taking care of them and so these women are not after their money. And I'm not talking about just working to work, but also for the women to be extremely successful in the field that they are in.

        [–]TempestTcup 6 points7 points  (5 children)

        You can be extremely successful without choosing your career over your SO. It's easy, you just choose your SO over your career. It's a decision you make, but it is a difficult one.

        [–]WhimsicalWonderland 2 points3 points  (4 children)

        I am not in a situation where I have to choose my career over my SO, and I'm actually not that career-driven, but my SO has voiced to me that he would not want our relationship to ever hold us back from advancing in our careers. I guess if the situation ever comes up, I don't know what I would do since I would want to make my SO happy, but I personally don't know if him telling me to choose career would make us happy.

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

        WhimsicalWonderland, I've found I can't make US happy. I can only make ME happy. But then he's happy too. So then we're both happy. But I can't skip the first indispensable step of making myself happy or the whole thing breaks down. So what would make you happy? That's the million dollar question that I hear for you.

        [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

        It sounds like maybe this is a conversation you should have with your man because you seem to have a big disconnect in this area. Or you just agree to disagree? It almost sounds like he is telling you his job will always come first, even before you. If you're ok with that then there isn't a problem. But if you aren't... Again sounds like a conversation to have with your husband.

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

        I'd favor WhimsicalWonderland having a conversation with herself about it first and figuring out her own desires. What is it you want? Then she has something to say to her SO. The answer is not outside of her. It's inside of her.

        [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

        Too true! See, that's why you're so highly regarded around here, Laura!

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

        For me I don't really see the relationship vs. career as a zero-sum game (if I pick one, the other one loses). I know there are lots of challenges with dual career couples, but for me a guiding principle has been to stay really focused on what I want and express and honor that. I've taken breaks from working, and right now I work like a fiend (new book is out! Hooray! Cue adrenaline!) and he's super supportive of that because I'm so happy. Giddy, really.

        I'm not big on taking care of my husband. He takes much more care of me. I take care of me too. I got my marriage in a big ugly ditch thinking I was his new mother and needed to buy his underwear. Not so. If I take good care of Laura everything else seems to go swimmingly.

        [–]WhimsicalWonderland 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        I'm not big on taking care of my husband. He takes much more care of me. I take care of me too.

        Thank you for pointing that out. Your advice really hit home!

        [–]cookiecutter 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        I (F/20) married my high school sweetheart. We've been together for almost 7 years and I discovered RPW about a year ago. We have a very strong relationship, but everyone tells us that we will change as we grow older. I look forward to changing together, but I'd love any advice you have on preventing growing apart. I'd like to take a proactive approach to keeping us happy, but I'm not sure how. Thank you so much!

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

        You're adorable! You're 20 and you've been together since you were 13?!? Wow! Congratulations on your strong relationship. I'm sorry everyone is scaring the stuffing out of you by implying that you will grow apart in the future. That's not my experience, actually. The only thing you need in common is each other. You can have separate hobbies and activities and reconvene to talk about your experiences.

        The best thing I've ever found to keep my marriage happy is to keep myself happy. So that is job #1 around here. How will I make myself happy today? So I play volleyball, I gab with my friends and my sister, I read blogs I love, I watch shows that make me laugh, I walk around my beautiful hood with my favorite tunes playing in my ear, and perhaps most importantly, I nap. The happier I am, the happier we are. The more patience I have for life's little mishaps. The easier it is to see how fantastic my husband is (he really is, but I can't see that when I'm sleep deprived or overworked).

        So if I could go back and tell myself anything when I was 20 about how to keep my marriage close and connected, it would be to focus on doing things that make me joyful. Not the five-fruits-and-vegetales and 30-minutes of cardio things. More like the swinging on a swingset and painting with watercolors (badly) things. The more frivolous, the better.

        If you're happy, he's happy because he feels successful making his wife happy. Then he piles on more stuff he thinks you'll like. Isn't that a great system?

        [–][deleted]  (1 child)

        [removed]

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 15 points16 points  (0 children)

        I'm a woman of faith for sure, but I keep my specific religious views private (even at an AMA!) so that my beliefs don't cause a roadblock for a woman who wants to have an intimate, passionate, peaceful relationship. My readers, clients and coaches are all different faiths--Muslim, Jewish, Christian, New Age and no faith at all. I felt like an honorary Muslim when I spoke to Muslim women and they had standing-room only and they all had dog-eared, highlighted copies of my books they wanted me to sign. They gave me a hijab, tunic and Koran. Jews write and say that I must have a Jewish aunt because what I wrote echoes their faith so beautifully. And the Mormons and the Catholics invite me to speak, and the Jehovah's witnesses say that I've explained what they're faith teaches them. I was floored to find out what a connection all women have in this regard, whatever faith, creed and color: We all want to be desired, cherished and adored. We all want strong marriages, and to have the fairytale we dreamed of as little girls. It's so moving to me how we really are all sisters!

        [–]dalls18 3 points4 points  (3 children)

        Hello, My boyfriend actually got me your book and I am interested to read it in the near future, I heard it has some great insights :). I was just wondering how you go about bringing up that you view something differently than your partner without making him feel like you are attacking his view or without starting a fight, but also making sure that he understands that yours is important to you.

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

        I agree--my book is full of great insights. Ha ha! I would think that. I'm getting punchy. Must be time for a break. I'll address this question first thing when I come back after some lunch.

        [–]dalls18 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        thank you so much! :) Enjoy your lunch

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

        Thanks, dalls18! On to expressing your opinion. Here's what I've noticed about opinions. I have a lot of them, and I care a lot about them, but other people not so much. Let's say it's a topic that's not directly related to us as a couple--like politics. He can say something and then I can have a different opinion about it or say, "But what about...." and there's that whole conversation, but it doesn't usually result in feeling closer and more connected. And what I've noticed is, who cares anyway? It isn't going to change how the UN responds to Putin, let's say. I'm making that up but you get the idea.

        But let's say it's an opinion about something immediate that really does concern us both. Let's say he thinks we should leave earlier to get somewhere on time, and my opinion is that we don't have to leave so early. I would tend to approach that from a desire standpoint instead of an opinion. So instead of saying, 'I don't think we need to leave THAT early," for example, I would say, 'I would love to be able to sleep until 7:30, which means I wouldn't be ready until 8:30." Then he can reconsider his thinking (or not) based on my desire, which is super important to him, because he wants me to be happy. Then if he still thinks we won't make it on time if we don't leave at 8:00am and he says that, that might color what I want. I might decide to go to bed earlier knowing I have to be up at 7am so we can be on time. So we're both influencing each other without arguing because we're in different realms. I'm in the feeling and desire realm and he's in the thinking realm. I don't want to contradict his thinking because a) he's really smart! That's why I married him and b) it might hurt the intimacy, which I really value. But I know that if he knows my desire, he's going to take that into account and think of something that makes me ridiculously happy if possible. So I can trust his thinking that's informed by my desires.

        So there's not a lot of opinion conversations around here. They aren't all that satisfying for me, honestly. They seem like they will be, but they're like the caramel rice cakes of conversations.

        [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

        Man here. How would you recommend going about introducing your ideas to a new partner?

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

        Deserfox1986, I'd suggest you start with First, Kill All the Marriage Counselors instead of Surrendered Wife, because the latter title seems to rub women really wrong, and 10X if it's from their husband or boyfriend! Really, you could end up having to have SW surgically removed, so I don't recommend that. But the new book is worth a shot.

        [–]aa257315 4 points5 points  (16 children)

        What caused you to become interested in the subject of marriage?

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 16 points17 points  (15 children)

        I completely drove my marriage into the ditch with my control. I did not realize I was being controlling--only that I was being very "Helpful." I was helping him dress better, eat healthier, with his resume, etc. But helpful in wife language is critical in husband language. So I was shooting holes in the bucket of our intimacy every day without even realizing it. I very nearly divorced him, which would have been soooooo tragic. He's the love of my life and we've been married for 25 years. So grateful I learned a few things in time. Phew!

        [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (13 children)

        How would you suggest translating helpful wife language into helpful man language?

        [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 8 points9 points  (8 children)

        I haven't found that translation yet. For me, what's been helpful is showing that I trust him and respect him with my actions. I expect the best outcome when he takes on a project (he recently replaced the cracked screen on my iphone, for instance. And I used to say he couldn't fix ANYTHING!). Turns out, the guy doesn't need my help! Just like he didn't need any help when we first met and fell in love. It was only later that I deemed myself a lot smarter than him and decided to try to improve him.

        Also, here's something kind of amazing: When I stopped being the arm-chair quarterback of my husband's life, what emerged for me was that I was called to write books. Hello New York Times bestseller! And then I went on national TV shows, then international TV shows and give talks in front of hundreds of people. ALL of that was FAR more terrifying than just taking potshots at my husband. But it was also so much more exhilarating and gratifying.

        So it's interesting to ask yourself what's going on in your own life that may need attention when you're wanting to tell your husband what to do. What will emerge for you as you take your eyes off of what he's doing and focus on what you're doing? I've seen other women have some pretty amazing quantum leaps the same way. Another one of my senior coaches quit her 25 year career as a CFO of a prestigious private school to do what moves her and help other women have intimate, passionate, peaceful relationships, for example. We see things like that a lot!

        [–]GrowingSlowly 6 points7 points  (7 children)

        I feel as though this might be one of my problems- I want to help, help, help. In my mind I'm being useful and trying to make sure he's got everything he needs for work, has eaten breakfast and has a prepared lunch, etc. Some mornings though, I realize I'm sort of 'managing' his morning and rather than being a helpful partner, I feel like a bit of a nag, which is definitely not how I want to send him off.

        I do have plenty to do in my own life, so I suppose I need to learn to better focus on my own bits and pieces sometimes.

        [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (6 children)

        I don't do everything right, but I do manage mornings right. I thought maybe I could help here :) I first get up and get ready quickly (10min or less, nothing fancy at all) then go get food ready. I set out breakfast for him and his lunch, and put his keys and such by the door. If he grabs the food and takes it, great, if not I'll ask if he wants it when I kiss him on his way out. If he doesn't want it, I just eat it later. After a while it's kind of unspoken, and theres no need to say "baaaaaabe breakfast. Breakfast. BREAKFAST!!" He just knows it's there and can take it or leave it. After breakfast is ready I continue my personal morning routine (maybe that's put in work out clothes, answer emails, or continue doing my hair and make up etc). Anyway. Hope that helps :)

        [–]GrowingSlowly 3 points4 points  (5 children)

        Thanks for your example. It's exactly what I'm trying to adjust. There are some mornings where he'll skip breakfast or won't take the lunch and then I go into this unneeded panic-type of feeling, as if he'll manage to starve to death while he's gone. I need to work on getting to your level where I can brush it off and realize that he will in fact be fine.

        [–]StingrayVC 7 points8 points  (2 children)

        It's a matter of trust, really. Though trust at a deeper or at least a different level. Sometimes we want to help so much that we start to think that they cannot do without the help. Just try to remind yourself that while your help is tremendous, that he can make do on his own and is making do on his own. Trust that his decision to not eat breakfast or not take his lunch is the best one for him that day and then move on with your own.

        It really goes a loooonnnngg way in helping to get rid of those panic-type feelings you describe. Ask me how I know. :)

        [–]GrowingSlowly 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        I completely get that, and I do trust him. He is an adult after all. I've just got to accept that I've done my part and leave the rest to him. I think I'll practice tomorrow morning. :)

        [–]StingrayVC 5 points6 points  (0 children)

        Learning to accept that I have done my part and trust him have done so much for me in 1) getting rid of those panic-y feelings and 2) actually being able to help him more just by virtue of being a calmer wife.

        Good Luck! You'll love it!

        [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

        I know that feeling all too well. Maybe you could try busying up your morning, so less time to fret? Check off the "prepare food" box then on to the next task. Whether or not he eats it doesn't have to be on your list :)

        [–]GrowingSlowly 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        I think busying myself is a great idea. Get the items ready for him and then start getting my own day started by setting out my workout clothes or even just making myself relax and knit or read just so I'm focused on something else. The rest is up to him then.

        [–][deleted]  (3 children)

        [deleted]

          [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 8 points9 points  (1 child)

          Why do you have to tell your SO? For me it's more about my side of the street, and how I'm choosing to be. Guys adjust to the new program pretty quickly.

          [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          I'm late to the party, I know, but I would recommend doing a SW/SS movie as an opposition to Fireproof. That movie was simply terrible. it puts the life and death of a marriage totally on the man. That woman did absolutely nothing for him.

          [–]IVIaskerade 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          how do people tell their significant others this message?

          You don't tell them. You show them. They'll know.

          [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

          Laura thank you so much for your book The Surrendered Wife. I have been married 10 months and I read it 3 or 4 months ago when I discovered RPW and I am so grateful for the changes it has made in my marriage and I feel so lucky to have discovered all of this at the beginning of my marriage. I truly appreciate all the women on RPW and your books and various efforts to help women and I just wanted the chance to say it to you "in person". Any chance you're doing a book tour? I live near Worcester Mass I would love to meet you in person!

          [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

          Thanks, Vguertin88! That's so sweet of you! I don't have any plans to go to Mass at the moment, unfortunately. Perhaps you will come to my Cherished for Life Retreat one day and we'll meet in person that way! I think it could be a RPW love-fest. I have an early bird special coming up, which you will hear about if you're on my email list. You can sign up at killmarriagecounselors.com. I have a free 5 Day "Get Cherished" challenge going so you can get in on that too.

          [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          I'm heading over to your site right now! Thank you for the response!

          [–][deleted]  (1 child)

          [deleted]

          [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          Ahhhhhhh! Such a great non-question, lengthynewt! I appreciate you too, because that's how I get to be not alone too--I need other like-minded women too. Congratulations on your wedding! You're a newlywed! That's so, so awesome. And yes, I also feel good knowing you're starting out on a positive, mindful foot. That makes my day!

          [–]2Skoned 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          thank you for your work

          [–]No_regrats 1 point2 points  (6 children)

          I understand you speak for women in a relationship with or looking for a man because you are a woman yourself and give advice based on your personal experience but do you think the majority of your advice could be successfully applicable for a man who wants to improve his marriage? Or to people in same-sex relationships? Or do you think they are advice that apply only to the woman in a male-female dynamic? Why / why not?

          I am thinking in terms of the general idea of acknowledging you can't change anyone beside yourself, focusing on your own happiness and being trusting that your spouse is able to make the best decision by themselves. Obviously I am saying most because while I can see being trusting, respectful and grateful being better than being controlling, demeaning and disatisfied for most people, or principles like relinquishing control over other people's lives, respecting your spouse's decisions for their own lives, practising good self care, receiving gifts and compliments gacefully and showing gratitude could apply to anyone, a few advice are obviously more specific to women, like taking the feminine approach, and wouldn't work out well for men.

          Thanks in advance

          [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 9 points10 points  (3 children)

          No_Regrets, I appreciate that you've been paying attention! I hear my own words echoed back to me in your question, so that's flattering. Thank you.

          Of course you are correct that everyone can benefit from the serenity prayer: God, Grant me the serenity to accept the things (other people!) I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can (myself) and the wisdom to know the difference. And gratitude is a great quality for anyone to cultivate.

          But I have discovered that as a woman, I have some special gifts that I bring to my relationship and to the world. I'm not a smaller, less-hairy man, I'm an entirely different gender, and although it took me a long time to see the distinction, now I can't unsee it! So when I'm sharing my experience with wives, I really am sharing partly about how to honor and celebrate our gifts as women, which are very different than men's gifts.

          For example, women are the keepers of the relationship. This is true all over the world, I've learned, and that means that if we learn the skills that contribute to intimate, passionate, peaceful relationships (either by reading a book or by watching our moms or grandmas or some other role model) then the relationship thrives. If not, the relationship suffers. Men don't have that same power. That's why I feel we women have a responsibility to learn the Intimacy Skills and practice them. It's so up to us.

          None of my coaches coach men. We don't coach couples. We only coach women because we are the ones with the power to make our relationships playful and passionate or tense and distant.

          Also, while respect is super important to men (like oxygen) in a relationship, for women we tend to want to be desired and have lots of passion and feel adored and cherished (men not so much). So not only do we bring different gifts to the table, we want different things from the relationship.

          Call me sexist, but I think if we acknowledge the beautiful design of the two genders and the elegant compatibility of the yin and yang, it would blow the whole thing open.

          I sure get lots of emails from men asking for help, and I have not yet found a way to serve them, although I wish I could, unless his wife wants to talk to us. I have an idea to hold a couples retreat where the women spend three days with me and the men go off and...go hiking and build fires. Or something like that. As you can see, this idea is only half-baked and needs some fine-tuning. I'll let you know if I ever get it off the drawing board.

          Here's the point: In terms of relationships, men respond BEAUTIFULLY to a woman who is respectful, grateful and happy. They are so naturally devoted and have such a drive to make their wives happy that they don't really need any special training. It's not really their department. When she is showing up surrendered, he is rising to the occasion and becomes a better man. From my vantage point, I've seen it thousands of times and I'm always moved by just how far he will go for the woman he loves. He may feel some fear that so much is expected of him at that point, but her faith seems to power him to new heights. It's indistinguishable from magic.

          [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

          Oh my god, please make that retreat happen and take all my money!!

          [–]LauraMDoyleVerified[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          HappyRPWOman, I have a retreat coming up in September 18-21, and we'll have an early-bird special coming soon. You may want to subscribe to my email newsletter to get notice of the special pricing. We just don't have the part where the men go off separately yet. But we have an amazing program for women! They're the highlight of the my year.

          [–]No_regrats 5 points6 points  (0 children)

          Thank you very much for having taken the time to write such a detailed answer (to me and each of the person who posted in this thread). It's rare to see people in AMA's do so to the same extent. I don't share your view but it was very insightful and it is always interesting to hear other's people view.

          I sure get lots of emails from men asking for help, and I have not yet found a way to serve them, although I wish I could, unless his wife wants to talk to us.

          It must be frustrating to get asked for help and not be able to do much. Your idea for a couple retreat would be very appealing to lots of couples, provided the wife is open to listening to advice and changing her own behavior.

          Edited to add:

          I also want to re-quote something you said in another answer to someone else:

          I agree that covert manipulation is what happens when you don't feel safe to just say what you want. But a lot of us had that "i want" trained out of us as kids so the only alternative was manipulation, or giving a bunch with the hope that we'd eventually get our turn (that never works). I really value the ability to express my desires purely now. It was so painful when I didn't know how to do that.

          That part really resonates with me. I don't agree with all your ideas but this one and the major theme of trust instead of control really jump out to me and are some areas on which I need to work more and which make me want to read your book.

          [–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (1 child)

          Beta males already act like surrendered wives, that's their problem. Go check /r/deadbedrooms to see how that works out. Let's keep this discussion about WOMEN here today on redpill WOMEN talking about the surrendered WIFE