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DISCUSSIONWhat's the point if women are going to hit the wall anyway? (self.RedPillWomen)

submitted by MissCherryPi

According to TRP, men can always build attraction by being more confident, funny, etc. But if women's physical attractiveness (and fertility) always decreases with time, what hope is there of ever keeping a man interested long term?

The man on TRP say over and over again that the only thing men are attracted to is looks. So isn't this a losing game for all women who will eventually get older and less attractive? How could "Red Pill women" have any legitimate red pill strategies beyond exercise, diet, makeup and fashion tips?

(For the record, I don't think that men are as shallow as that. Obviously physical attraction is important, but I don't think it's the only factor in a man's love for a woman. However this is NOT a red pill idea.)


[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

No, if you are clever and marry early enough, and be a good wife and mother. There is a strong sense of honor on many men not leaving their families. Some do, some cheat, but many will stick it out.

[–]rplady 16 points17 points  (18 children)

Yes, men are attracted to looks.

But that doesn't mean that's what keeps him there, it only means that's how the initial attraction works.

The problem as I see it is that in a culture that glorifies hookups and one-night-stands, there are no emotional bonds happening.

When men are afraid to enter marriage because women followed their feelings instead of their commitments (no-fault divorce leads to a high rate of unhappies getting divorced), I think we really shoot ourselves in the foot because some of us did want long term relationships and now men are afriad to.

The wall is only dangerous if you dont have a committed partner when you reach it.

I read a study (dont have it on me) that said that men and women tend to associate the good feelings they had when they were young with long term partners, which they don't have with new partners they get after they're old.

How could "Red Pill women" have any legitimate red pill strategies beyond exercise, diet, makeup and fashion tips?

Simple... red pill advice for women who aren't yet married: choose if you want a long term relationship, and then learn to stay committed. Learn to stop being fickle.

(For the record, I don't think that men are as shallow as that. Obviously physical attraction is important, but I don't think it's the only factor in a man's love for a woman. However this is NOT a red pill idea.)

You'd be surprised. But that doesn't mean they don't develop an emotional connection to us eventually... you just have to get that relationship going first!

[–]MissCherryPi[S] 29 points30 points  (17 children)

But that doesn't mean they don't develop an emotional connection to us eventually...

How could a Red Pill Man or Woman ever believe that such a connection is possible? It's required reading that women are emotional children.

[–]rplady 5 points6 points  (9 children)

Having an ounce of introspection I can identify many women I've seen who act emotionally immature. I've identified it in myself as well a number of times. That doesn't mean that's who I am, it just means I have to work against it.

[–]CrackheadHamster 24 points25 points  (6 children)

are you so blind that you can't see that men can be just as immature? We are freaking humans why subject yourself to this degrading crap?

[–]jack500 4 points5 points  (4 children)

Heckler vs. Cheerleader.

Just look at the handles: "rplady" vs. "CrackheadHamster."

Surely that says something about the attitudes they are trying to project.

The Blue Piller accuses the Red Pill woman of "treason" against Team Woman.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire 4 points5 points  (3 children)

I've said it time and time again, nobody demonstrates more hatred towards women than feminists by attempting to deny women the right of agency.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (1 child)

"Women can do anything! As long as we agree with it."

[–]margerym 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Feminists will tell you that the Patriarchy has denied women choice and that feminism is in place to give women choice and a voice. Except, of course, that's not true. They've essentially traded one group of people telling women what to do for another group of people telling them what to do. How revolutionary.

[–]jack500 -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

See my article Female Submission and Its Enemies.

I think what you are seeing here is a feminist angry that a woman is considering "submission" to a man, not in a kink way, but in a "wives obey your husbands" way. At least that's the way feminists see it.

A woman that asks herself "what can I do to please my man today?" is a feminist's most dangerous enemy, because a feminist thinks that's "not equal."

Submitting to your husbands sounds so controversial these days, but submitting to your employer or submitting to a police officer is unquestioned.

Feminists claim to want equal relationships, which are incompatible with female hypergamy. In reality, feminists want female domination and male submission, which also seems to work against female hypergamy.

The problem is the feminist; feminists are the outliers. That's why most women do not consider themselves to be "a feminist" even if they might parrot some of the lines.

http://hipsterracist.wordpress.com/2013/06/14/female-submission-and-its-enemies-a-response-to-jungle-jain/

[–]rplady 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I will only say this once, anybody suggesting this again will be banned.

Nothing is more degrading than people like you assuming I can't think for myself and arrive here on my own volition.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Exactly. It's somewhat controllable if you know about it.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children)

I don't know how that has anything to do with men having emotions....?

[–]MissCherryPi[S] 24 points25 points  (3 children)

Do you agree that you stopped maturing emotionally at 11? If so, how could you contribute anything of substance to a relationship with a man who is more complicated than you could possibly understand?

The "red pill" idea of marriage appears to be more like a parent/child relationship than a covenant between equals. Do you see your husband as a father figure?

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

I don't agree with the 11 year old bit... Hell, I'm way more emotionally mature now than I was 5 years ago. I think that's true for a lot of women though, if my old friends are Facebook are any indication...

But I do agree that all women are emotional creatures. I need my husband to keep me grounded at times.

I wouldn't describe my relationship as parent/child, but it definitely is a leader/follower situation. Athol Kay refers to it as Captain/First Officer, that fits nicely. I look to him for leadership, but he considers my opinion before making decisions. The decisions don't always agree with my opinion, but he's the Captain, so he has the final say.

That link is a rather bleak view... I think the PUA/MGTOW types tend to take a darker view of it all, and I don't begrudge them that. They have their reasons. Quality women worth marrying are hard to find.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I'd like to add that anger surrounding the article itself is attributable to the difference in communication styles - whereas men need black and white examples and metaphors, we often use hyperbole to get a point across. Obviously women aren't actually 11 year olds.

But, when a guy sees his girlfriend lash out in an emotional tantrum, he tries to apply logic. If he sees the relationship as two copilots, then it's confusing when he applies the reasoning "but if I did this, you'd be mad."

It's much easier to illustrate it as such: of course if you did that she'd be mad. But you don't have that luxury. That is not going to be part of your relationship.

[–]dropit_sphere 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do you agree that you stopped maturing emotionally at 11?

(Did you mean 18? I couldn't find anything about 11 in the link.)

[–]jack500 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The women men are interested in sexually; young women, tend towards emotional immaturity.

I think older women read TheRedPill stuff and think they are talking about them, or "all women." They are almost certainly not talking about you. Also much of TheRedPill stuff focuses on the beginnings of a relationship.

[–][deleted] 33 points34 points  (60 children)

Men often report having "wife goggles" for their wife... They look past all the flaws and see the younger woman they married. I didn't totally buy into it at first, but I've seen enough red pill married guys mention it that there's gotta be some truth to it.

However, those goggles are dependent on our own disposition, level of fitness, femininity, etc... I posted an example of what happens when you put up the bitch shield consistently: A Cautionary Tale

The number one thing a woman can do to up her sex rank in her husband's eyes is to sex him up frequently and enthusiastically. The Wall really only matters if you're not doing that, or if you're older and unmarried (but even then it's not a lost cause, perhaps subject for another thread).

They'll have a sense of loyalty for you if you have a sense of loyalty for then, generally.

[–]MissCherryPi[S] 31 points32 points  (54 children)

Men often report having "wife goggles" for their wife... They look past all the flaws and see the younger woman they married. I didn't totally buy into it at first, but I've seen enough red pill married guys mention it that there's gotta be some truth to it.

They'll have a sense of loyalty for you if you have a sense of loyalty for then, generally.

So, what's up with "Dread Game?" It's something even married guys are advised to do. How would you respond to your husband doing this? Is it all in good fun? If you have agreed to be monogamous together, why would it be acceptable for a husband to make his wife think he's cheating or in the second link to threaten her with the prospect?

[–]TempestTcup 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I don't think dread has to always be about other women; dread is just the fear of losing your man. Dread could be as simple as seeing him get into a small airplane for a flight lesson, climbing a sheer cliff, or riding a motorcycle fast.

Sometimes dread is from him doing something death-defying yet exciting & tingle-inducing. Sometimes it is knowing that if you behave badly enough he could walk.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I think you missed the point of that post...

If you’re a husband, the dread of relative and absolute Sex Rank can wake her up. Indeed if it does, it’s potentially doing her a favor. She shouldn’t confuse the fiction of older women in the dating market with the reality of it.

Is it necessary? Maybe, depending on your wife... If she's not red pill, and she's refusing sex because she thinks she's hot shit and he can't get any better, then yeah, she needs a wakeup call.

If she's on board and knows the game, there's no need for it.

And the example linked above wasn't to make his wife think he WAS cheating, only that he has the option. "Hard Dread" is something a guy can use, but should generally save it for dire situations, as it can do more harm to trust in a marriage than good.

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points  (48 children)

male here.

its because he isnt getting the sex, affection and intimacy he needs. as rpwifey said herself:

The number one thing a woman can do to up her sex rank in her husband's eyes is to sex him up frequently and enthusiastically.

if he doesnt get sex in his marriage, i think you are not fulfilling your duties. that doesnt mean you have to fuck every single time he wants, but you should WANT to meet his sexual needs, just like it should be important to him to do the same.

and look at the end of that second article you posted:

The truth is, most husbands idly fantasize about hooking up with younger women, I mean I do. But given a choice between a bunch of hook ups, short term relationships an/or a soft harem of younger women… most husbands would still choose their wife provided they had reasonable assurance there would be a good sex life with her. The kids, the history, the aroma of… pie.

so even RP articles written by men who admit to the truth, still say they would love to fuck their wifes instead of some random 20 year old slut.

dread games purpose is to make sure that you dont take him for granted and that you forget to meet his needs. by using dread game you are reminded that he wants sex and he will get it. it will be you, unless you dont care. then...

[–]MissCherryPi[S] 20 points21 points  (40 children)

I think that all people who want a monogamous commitment should make an effort to satisfy their partner sexually.

But in the context of The Red Pill, the dynamic changes. Because instead of being honest about his needs and then following through with a divorce, it becomes about instilling fear.

What I really want to know is if Red Pill Women want to be treated this way? Do they really think manipulation by fear/dread is something that has a place in a marriage? Seems from the responses the answer is "Yes, if she's not putting out."

[–]jack500 4 points5 points  (0 children)

being honest about his needs and then following through with a divorce, it becomes about instilling fear.

To a feminist, the breakup of a relationship is better than a man using emotional leverage to keep his wife interested.

The man must not control the woman, using "dread" is worse because it's emotional manipulation.

It would have been better if he just divorced her.

I should title my next article "Monogamy and Its Enemies."

Also, the female version of "dread game" is called "the divorce threat." "If you don't do this I'll blow the whole marriage up." The feminist wants the man to submit to the woman, and dread game is an effective counter to the "divorce threat."

[–]TempestTcup 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fear/Dread is a last-chance scenario to wake her up. Since it can be drastic & can alter the relationship significantly, it is generally used as a last resort.

Generally red pill women don't need Fear/Dread because we already recognize our behavior & can change it purposefully for the better.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire -3 points-2 points  (7 children)

Why would divorce be honest? Does "till death do us part" mean nothing?

[–]MissCherryPi[S] 24 points25 points  (6 children)

As if there's anything about "dread game" that's compatible with "forsaking all others"

If a man is really so miserable because of wife not wanting to have sex with him that he is considering divorce or cheating I think he should tell her that. Perhaps that's also a form of instilling dread. But it's at least an honest one.

[–]Crackertron 4 points5 points  (1 child)

If a man is really so miserable because of wife not wanting to have sex with him that he is considering divorce or cheating I think he should tell her that.

They often do, and the wife turns it around for a couple weeks or months, then it's back to normal like the discussion never happened.

Also, the shaming language comes in: "all you want me for is sex!"

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Every time a woman says shit like that I cringe. You can't play that game.

[–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Nobody said cheat.

We've entertained you for a while, but if you have no purpose here but to try to nit pick, and not engage in meaningful conversation then I suggest you leave.

Edit: To clarify, dread game might not be pretty, but when you take a vow for marriage, divorce should be the very last option- and trying anything that might rekindle your flame should be worth a try.

MissCherry is here to try make a point that doing what makes you happy is somehow anti-women or evil because it doesn't fit the narrative that feminism has drummed for the past half a century. We already know relationships are hard work, and MissCherry shows her hand by suggesting the first option in a failing marriage should be "being honest about his needs and then following through with a divorce."

Of course we understand that communication in a marriage is not always overt- but instead covert. Being "honest" is a great way to ensure what he wants (a saved marriage) will never take place. Because his wife doesn't want somebody to explain to her why she should be in love- she wants to just be in love. She wants the guy to be somebody worth loving.

Thanks to psychology, sometimes the best way to rekindle those feelings happens to be dread game. Well, it sure ain't divorce. But thanks, misscherry, for being an advocate of increasing our national statistics.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I expect that SRS and other trolls are going to looove this subreddit.

[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points  (29 children)

it has a place in marriage because lots of women have a princess/ entitlement complex and are incapable to think about anything other than themselves. whatever happens, is filtered through "how does it affect me and how do i feel about it?". that not an exclusively female thing though (but since unlike you, that doesnt concern me, since i dont date men. obviously you would have to look out for such men)

simply put: if you fulfill your mans sexual needs, he doesnt have to use dread game. on the other hand, preselection increases your attraction. letting you know that he has options will increase your desire to please him, because you wont take him for granted and you keep working to make him stay.

actually, you women could discuss how dread game works for you. im sure that after you already caught a fish, using dread game on him would motivate him to be more affectionate to you.

the thing that you are forgetting is: attraction isnt logical. you cant talk it out. if you have a "dead bedroom" talking and discussion wont fix that.

so, you have a moral problem with dread game. attraction is amoral. whatever works works. if you do not meet his sexual desire (maybe because you feel less attracted to him) using dread game will possibly increase your attraction towards him.

Seems from the responses the answer is "Yes, if she's not putting out."

exactly.

but i wont to stop the discussion here. this shouldnt be about what men shouldnt do it and whats wrong to do and how immoral it is.

you should be talking about improving yourself. you should be talking about how to get what you want. how to find, hook and keep the man you want.

you shouldnt complain about the methods men use to find you, hook you and keep you. thats for them to do.

you should be concerned what YOU have to do to get the results you want.

our little conversation here remind me of this article:

http://hipsterracist.wordpress.com/2013/06/09/mannerbund-this-is-what-a-feminist-looks-at/

basically it says that men gather to improve themselves, better themselves. to accimplish something and that women then gather to either cheer them on or mock them.

i have the impression thats what is happening here right now. rather than having your own "mission" and goals, it seems that you would prefer to talk about men and what they do.

on the other hand there is lots of criticism and mockery of women in TRP. still, focus on yourself and the improvement of yourself.

if you put out, he wont have to use dread game and i think its in both interests to have a marriage with sex involved, no?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (25 children)

Side question that probably isn't very fair: what does a RP guy do if his wife becomes ill or injured. To the point where sex is not an option for months if not years. And if sex is off the table, likely other nice things like homecooked meals are too. So does that mean insta-divorce? Even if you used the dread game (which would be pretty shitty thing to do in this case) she can't solve the problem so it's hopeless! Any thoughts?

[–]jack500 3 points4 points  (11 children)

Side question that probably isn't very fair: what does a RP guy do if his wife becomes ill or injured. To the point where sex is not an option for months if not years. And if sex is off the table, likely other nice things like homecooked meals are too. So does that mean insta-divorce? Even if you used the dread game (which would be pretty shitty thing to do in this case) she can't solve the problem so it's hopeless! Any thoughts?

That's a very interesting question, but it goes far beyond just a wife and husband issue doesn't it?

What would a RedPillWomen member do if her husband was injured, couldn't have sex, "bring home the bacon" or otherwise not be able to fulfill his duties?

It's a very similar question to what happens to very elderly people, when the husband or the wife can no longer care for themselves.

Great question. I'd love to hear a RedPillWomen's opinions.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (9 children)

Well I always assume I'm going to stay single until I meet a man I love completely, with all the traditional marriage vows. For better or worse, sickness or health; I plan on never getting a divorce, no matter how much work it takes.

Which is why I want to wait to get married. I want to give myself time to grow as a person, learn a bit more about myself and what I truly want in a man and a lifetime partner. And to mature enough to be a suitable partner in return.

This is a problem in TRP philosophy, however. Women should marry in their twenties, lock down a man and be good to him so he will stay with you when you ain't so good lookin. But you don't want who I am now! I certainly wouldn't want to date me. I gotta get somewhere in life, gain some useful experiences, mature as a person. Get better at just being loyal and loving friends with people.

AND THEN hopefully I'll feel capable of forming a relationship with someone that leads to love and lifetime commitment. But rest assured if I have a husband, I plan on staying by his side no matter what, I'll bring home any bacon necessary, do whatever. If he becomes a quadriplegic I'll give him orgasmic head massages or something!

[–][deleted]  (2 children)

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    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

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      [–]SoftHarem 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Keep your sex drive high but your partner count low. You should be a serial monogamist until you feel you have matured to the point you want a husband.

      [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

      I gotta get somewhere in life, gain some useful experiences, mature as a person.

      men dont care about your career or degree. men do not care about your status. you make the mistake to think that men find the same things desirable as women do, which is wrong.

      [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (2 children)

      Yes but that's not the point, I don't care if they don't care because I do. I don't want to live my life constantly wondering if what I'm doing is desirable to men. I want to live it doing what fulfills me and makes me happy and like I'm doing something for the world. And I have to believe there is a man somewhere out there who can respect a woman who wants that.

      [–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

      It's not that we don't WANT to afford women the time to mature, it is just that time takes it's toll during that time period. it's not a philosophy but a fact of life.

      [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      What would a RedPillWomen member do if her husband was injured, couldn't have sex, "bring home the bacon" or otherwise not be able to fulfill his duties?

      Me? I'd take care of him, love him, and buy an extensive toy collection.

      [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

      Realy?

      [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      what does a RP guy do if his wife becomes ill or injured.

      that has nothing to do with RP. that depends on his character/ morals. a good and loyal person would stay.

      To the point where sex is not an option for months if not years.

      in that case, she should allow him to get it somewhere else. if she doesnt, it again depends on the person. nothing to do with RP.

      So does that mean insta-divorce?

      RP isnt a moral code, its not a cult or movement. i would expect a good moral person not to insta divorce.

      its actually fucked up that you even ask something like this and i shouldnt have even answered such a question.

      [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire 3 points4 points  (7 children)

      If sex is off the table because of something out of her control, that's not a reason to run dread. In another world without no fault divorce, the converse would be true, but men are afraid of commitment because that's no longer true for a lot of marriages.

      Dread is only necessary if you've lost her respect. If she still adores you, no problemo.

      [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (6 children)

      Ok so essentially its more of an emotional thing than a sex thing. Which makes sense, seeing as sex is often the first thing to go when troublesome emotions are brewing.

      Another question then. Why stay with a woman like that? I get that human nature means even the most crazy awesome girl is going to fall off the wagon. But if you have to resort to that "dread" behavior , I would say fuck it, I'll find someone who appreciates me.

      But this is coming from someone who has never experienced love, so there are probably some emotions involved that I don't understand.

      [–]jack500 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      Another question then. Why stay with a woman like that?

      Usually, you stay with a woman like that because you love her. You know, even though she's not perfect and sometimes can be a bitch.

      But if you have to resort to that "dread" behavior , I would say fuck it, I'll find someone who appreciates me.

      By the time your man would use "dread" behavior, you would likely already be thinking "fuck it" and that he didn't "appreciate" you.

      So he's "gaming" you to get you to stay.

      Frankly, I agree with you. I'd say "fuck it" to that woman and go get another.

      [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      because divorce doesnt benefit men. you lose the house, car, savings children and you go on to pay child support alimony and you dont see your children everyday.

      [–]margerym -2 points-1 points  (3 children)

      Why stay with a woman like that? I get that human nature means even the most crazy awesome girl is going to fall off the wagon. But if you have to resort to that "dread" behavior , I would say fuck it, I'll find someone who appreciates me.

      If it's continued I could see that reaction to it but as you said- human nature. Relationships have ups and downs and it helps to be faced with the reality that 1) you could lose this person. Like really. And 2) Think of what that would mean for you. Like really. Honestly relationships are given up on far too easily these days. Maybe if more people were willing to actually face the reality of it ending before it actually did we'd have less of it.

      [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

      Ok I can see the benefit in that. And I've been trying to think of a less, well, shitty way to force that reality on someone, and can't come up with much. Other than asking to take a break for a week or something...

      I'm quite young but from what I've seen, this similar tactic is used all the time except no threatening, just doing. Essentially girl/boy initiates break up to get some point across, point is gotten and two days later they are back together. But these same couples seem to always end up breaking up finally and permanently in a huge angry, argumentative splash. I would fear taking a chance with the dread tactic because eventual failure seems imminent.

      [–][deleted]  (2 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]Amissmiss 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        thanks... I do not recommend redditing with infants around.

        [–]Ellista 1 point2 points  (1 child)

        The thing is though, sexual desire decreases as we age. How do you force a woman to have sex who doesn't want to have sex? We all think we know how we'll be in the future, but we really don't. We might say we'll still be sex addicts in our 50s, but you can't know that for sure. I'm sure most women who love their husbands want to fuck the shit out of him in her 50s, but the truth is, many women just completely and utterly lack that desire as they age.

        This is why I feel marriage should be and is way more than just sex. It's about mostly mental. Does sex really determine whether or not you love your wife if you express love and affection through other means? Sex will literally take up the smallest portion of your life as you get older, are you going to sacrifice your best friend and love for something your hand or her hand can accomplish in five minutes?

        Don't get me wrong, I am the type who would want to please my man sexually for as long as I am able, but I have absolutely no idea how my body is going to treat me when I'm older. I've read stories of women with no sex drives and while I've never personally experienced it, I at least try to understand her and where she's coming from. You just can't force someone to do something they just don't have a desire to do.

        That is a risk you take when you marry someone.

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        so you think the man should just be miserable for his womans sake?

        i dont agree with that. and dread games purpose is to make her want to fuck again. because suddenly when she realizes he could just get it elsewhere she is in the mood for it again.

        You just can't force someone to do something they just don't have a desire to do.

        well in that case you can let him fuck somebody else outside the marriage.

        [–]Nutz76 2 points3 points  (4 children)

        I have a common sense rule of thumb for frequency of sex in my relationships:

        If I can get sex easier and/or more frequent outside the relationship then i'm not going to be in the relationship much longer.

        Whenever things get rough of intimacy wanes, this is what I fall back to to decide if things are worth it. Sex is a big deal and means a lot to me, so if the other person isn't a good match I'm not going to sacrifice my needs, simple as that. Chalk it up to not being a good long term match.

        [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

        Ooo that sounds like a recipe for singledom for quite awhile. I mean the most basic example, what if your wife is pregnant and then gives birth to your kid. She probably won't be able to have sex for months after, and perhaps for months before as well. Would you leave her or cheat on her?

        [–]Nutz76 3 points4 points  (2 children)

        You just argued against a rule of thumb by coming up with an example that's in my mind a clear exception to the rule. I'm just saying.

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        Yo I'm not in your head! You sounded pretty absolute in your post deary, excuse me for wondering just how far the philosophy went.

        [–]Nutz76 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        fair enough. I updated my earlier post to clarify it being a rule of thumb.

        [–]margerym -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

        To answer your question outright, MissCherryPi, I do like that Dread Game exists in our relationship (or has the potential for existence). I like that my husband won't take my crap and is man enough and has enough self-worth to not be willing to stick around for such things. Knowing that I can't get away with shirking my own responsibilities as his wife keeps me in line. Knowing that I won't be doing any of that nonsense keeps him confident in me and the marriage. Win win.

        [–]YouDislikeMyOpinion 1 point2 points  (3 children)

        The Wall really only matters if you're not doing that, or if you're older and unmarried (but even then it's not a lost cause, perhaps subject for another thread).

        Wrong, the wall matters even if she's doing that. I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but young women absolutely have an advantage in dating in their 20s. Now the advantage switches. The wall will happen, and it is a disadvantage. There's nothing you can do about the wall. There are other things that you can improve though.

        [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

        Disadvantage does not equal lost cause.

        [–]TempestTcup 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Also, as I noticed after my sister was widowed, older women that have not let themselves go are in high demand in the middle of the country. The young guys want young girls, but the older guys are pretty darn happy with older women.

        [–]YouDislikeMyOpinion 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        I agree with your response

        You're still wrong when you said "The wall really only matters if you're not doing that", which is what I replied to. I did not have, and do not have a problem with "even then it's not a lost cause".

        [–]Nutz76 -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

        That was a good read. Sometimes even those of us who know better need a little refresher training, so to speak. Just from reading that I recognized a few slips I've made with the gf that need correcting.

        [–]AlphaBrony 12 points13 points  (7 children)

        I've always described it thusly:

        When you are young, your attention and beauty is a sort of large inheritance sitting in a checking account that isn't gaining much (or any) interest. You might feel like you're sitting on top of the world with that much in the bank! The world is your oyster - and for some time, it actually is. And yet, you might realize, that eventually, the cruelty of inflation will outpace your gains in interest and eventually whittle your princely sum down to a pittance. You must find some way to invest yourself to provide for yourself in your old age.

        Men, are stocks. You have your flashy, exciting startups that promise you the world. They're certainly superficially attractive and they boast that they can return your investments a thousand times over! Their business plan? What plan? They don't need no stinking plan! They have a killer app that is absolutely going to slay the market and they know it!

        Would you buy that stock? Hell no. It has a small chance of success, a huge risk, and very well could leave you broke with nothing else to invest.

        You have your wealthy, established, high priced stocks - your Google, your Apple, and so on, trading at $500+/share. The price is fantastically high because /everyone/ wants a piece of them. You have enough to buy.. oh, fifty, a hundred shares or so. Could you see a little return? Maybe. But that company when deciding its new direction isn't going to care about your voice. Not when there are others with either superior capital to invest with or greater number of shares from having invested earlier. You might get a little return, and it might feel kind of nice at times, but the company will never value your input like it would others, and it will never return for you what it will give to earlier or wealthier investors.

        Would you buy? You could. No one's stopping you, and it might give you a little in return, but are you really getting the best bang for your buck.

        Lastly, you have the young owner of a small company that is looking to expand and needs capital. They don't wear the finest Italian suits, their offices are a little dingy, but they have undeniable fire in their eyes and a solid business plan built on good fundamentals. They present to you a business plan that details prudent ideas for expansion to move more of their product that is already a hit in some small backwater markets. They're not flashy or wealthy but they have a well-researched plan, that once executed, will return solid dividends that stand a strong chance of growing year after after year.

        Would you choose that company to invest in?

        The older you get, the more your currency depreciates. You can reap far more by investing in a company at 20. 25, sure, there is still time on the table. 30? 35? 40? No matter what age you choose to invest that same amount in, the more time passes, the less you will see a return.

        You must choose.. but choose wisely.

        [–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (6 children)

        Unless you have a lot of capital investing in start-ups is a bad strategy, as a small investor, which apparently the person in your post is (50k), it would be best to invest in a hedge fund or to just track something like the F500 or DJ.

        In the end the most reasonable investment for a small investor is one that spreads the risk around, investing in a bunch of large successful companies.

        Therefore, the best market strategy for women is to have sex with as many sexually valuable men and not dedicate themselves to just one.

        [–]dropit_sphere 1 point2 points  (5 children)

        The problem with this strategy is that it breaks the analogy: in financial investment, investment and return are tightly coupled: investing in GE won't help you if McDonald's does great, but it will help you if McDonald's does well. This is not true for random hookups. If you have sex with a dude and he wins the lottery tomorrow, congratulations, you are entitled to...nothing.

        If you're going to invest in a dude, you should be sure you're protected: marriage is the way to do that.

        [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (4 children)

        The analogy doesn't work either way. Small investors shouldn't take big risks on start ups.

        [–]dropit_sphere 1 point2 points  (3 children)

        Your knowledge of finance is admirable, but you're so eager to show it off that you're missing the point, which has nothing to do with finance. The company analogy is just that: an analogy. Having sex with a bunch of sexually-valuable men with no promise of investment on their part is a bad sexual strategy for women: if an analogy points to it being a good strategy, then the analogy is no longer useful.

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

        Why is it a bad sexual strategy? Women enjoy sex, attractive men are desirable sexual partners, therefore it is a good sexual strategy.

        It can also be an optimal mating strategy too if the cards are played correctly.

        [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        It can be a mating strategy but I'd look for long-term happiness before I called it optimal.

        [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        short term. long term they ask "where did all the good men go?"

        [–]Big_Man_On_Campus 20 points21 points  (37 children)

        I think Cherry asks a good question. So as a man, I'll try to answer in a brutally honest way.

        This is why women should marry young. Men generally have fantastic visual memory/imaginations for the female body. This is probably a scientifically unexplored aspect of humanity that might provide some stunning revelations. As a young man, your husband is going to form significant mental memory of experiences with your young body. Those are going to color his lifelong experiences with you in a good way. The younger (within reason obviously) and more fit you were for his youthful experiences, the greater the impression you'll make for life. Well past the prime of both of you, he's going to be remembering the intimate times when you both were young extremely fondly. He's going to be thinking of all those encounters with your 20-something-body when he's showing you affection as an old man. This is not a betrayal of who/what you are now. He is not fantasizing about being with another woman, he is remembering the gift you gave him.

        This does not mean that you shouldn't maintain an attractive body if you can. Certainly less imagination is required if you still have a shape that closely matched what you had when you're very young, and this is a good thing (for many reasons). So yes, there is a point to maintaining your body as best you can. If you're single, it will help you fix that problem. If you're married, it means you are sparking your husbands imagination much more often whenever he looks at you.

        [–]jack500 11 points12 points  (0 children)

        My parents have been married for 50 years and although my mother is an old lady now, my dad still dotes on her. Everything he says about the looks aspect is true, but what's even more interesting to me is that my mother was submissive, in the sense of a traditional wife. There was never any question that my father was in charge.

        Now that they are old and retired, it's hard to tell which one is in charge. My mom wants to go somewhere, my dad drives her and pays. My mom wants something, my dad gets it for her.

        My father: "Now that I'm retired I see my job as just keeping her happy."

        I think they call that "love."

        [–]sunshinemary 8 points9 points  (0 children)

        Hooray for Wife Goggles! This is one reason I always advocate for women to marry young. My husband definitely sees me through the lens of the 22-year-old he married.

        [–]gretka 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        I'm too young to have experience, but this is what I believe and hope will happen. My gf is smoking hot, but beauty is cheap and plentyful. I'm not with her because of her looks, but because of her personality. And I have little interest in fucking other women, beautiful as they might be, because "the chase" doesn't appeal to me, and I don't care for my number.

        Also, don't get fat. Not only is it ugly, it's also unhealthy and you'll die earlier.

        [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (29 children)

        Ok here is my problem with this.

        I'm not quite ready for that yet. TRP guys say it themselves, I'm at my prime. And I'm still so young and inexperienced. Book smart but life stupid. Nowhere near mature enough to have a healthy long term relationship; I know I am not in a place personally where I could fulfill a man emotionally (although I would do a damn good job sexually). I honestly shouldn't inflict my whims on any guy, from experience I know I only end up hurting them.

        So I just want my 20's to travel the world and not be tied down to one place or man (or maybe woman), however I also want to spend it having sex! I mean who can blame me...But this is apparently lowering my potential worth to a man and come my 30's and 40's I'm poop. Which sucks to think about but I can't say I'm gonna stop living it up while I'm young.

        I guess my only option is to find a man who can be happy with a loving wife and enthusiastic lover but who happens to not be young.

        [–]delta_hedge 5 points6 points  (15 children)

        life offers men and women opportunities in different periods of their life.

        women have all the sexual market value in their twenties, which devalues rapidly in their thirties.

        men have very low value in their twenties, which then increases slowly but steadily and peaks in their late twenties/early thirties and then decreases, but at a slower pace then the female value.

        ask every red pill men in his thirties about the difference between his early twenties and late twenties, and he will be enthusiastic about telling you how great things have become for him, and that he never could have imagined that it would change this much.

        this appreciation is of course due to having experienced a very low market value, something which women will not experience until their value already is is decline.

        just as most men could not believe how great things would become when they grow up, i sincerely believe that most younger women can not believe how different men will treat them when their sexual market value shifts.

        this does not mean that you will not be able find a man in your thirties. but the change of quality in partner you are able to get will be just as dramatic as the quality of women which men are able to get between their early and late twenties.

        [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (14 children)

        But is it really just hottness that matters? I'm hot now but I would be a terrible wife. Is that what men want? wouldn't they rather have a slightly less hot thirty year old who is capable of having a healthy relationship? Else you get stuck with one of the bitches TRP is constantly bitching about!

        [–]Big_Man_On_Campus 10 points11 points  (7 children)

        ...wouldn't they rather have a slightly less hot thirty year old who is capable of having a healthy relationship?

        No.

        Look at it this way. Men have almost zero dating market value in their early 20s, and the women they get turned down by are people like you (hot, young, vibrant). Those average 20 year old men who don't have a career going yet, they want to be as sexually active as you but do not have that option due to market imbalance for them.

        Now, these men spend their early to mid 20s looking and wanting a young hot sexy wife, but they don't get to have it because those women are out exploiting their higher SMV to sleep with alphas. When those men turn 30-35, well now things are different. Now they've got a career, they've got assets, they've gone through the fire of rejections and not put a bullet in their brain due to loneliness, and now those girls who were hot when they were young are looking to settle down.

        Why on earth should they give those girls the time of day? Those girls didn't want them when they were 20, how is it now fair to them to share these girls with all those guys they had when they were being rejected? Why is it acceptable to somehow expect that these now mature guys would be ready to commit to women who rejected them when they were not alphas?

        Worse yet, those men in their 30s with money and careers, the 18 year olds are now throwing themselves at them. Why on earth would they ever pay attention to a 30-year-old woman when they can now go back and have the young hot girl they wanted all along?

        I'm sorry if this sounds horrible, I truly am, but it is truth.

        [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

        Ok I can see how this makes sense. I suppose my only hope is to rely on my other attributes to get a man when I happen to feel ready. Or go abroad again to a culture where men value things differently (if i can find one). Or, you know, I'll stay hot. Which is unlikely but the one I'm holding out for ha.

        [–]dman8000 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Or go abroad again to a culture where men value things differently

        Most cultures put an even higher value on youth than ours.

        The real issue you will hit is that the high value men have already been taken by a high value woman by their 30s. And the moderate value men can find hot, fun women in their 20s.

        Your best bet would probably be a high value man whose 3-5 years older than you who chose poorly and is divorced.

        But that has its own set of downsides.

        [–][deleted]  (4 children)

        [removed]

          [–][deleted]  (3 children)

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            [–]Big_Man_On_Campus 1 point2 points  (1 child)

            Why are so many replies to my posts getting deleted? wth?

            [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            Trolls.

            [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (1 child)

            why do you think travelling and having one night stands will make you a better wife and more mature?

            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            The traveling DEFINITELY would. Do you not realize how many different kinds of people there are in the world? Meeting just a portion of them, learning how they live their lives and handle relatinships, whatever, will provide personal insight to mankind that I couldn't get elsewhere. Each new thing I learn in the world adds to who I am, alters my perspective of life and often makes me way more satisfied with what I have been given in life.

            Sleeping around benefits no one but me, at the moment I'm doing it ha. I mean I only started having sex a year or so ago, so I've gone a bit crazy (how high is too high a number for TRP men? I'm not quite double digits)... but traveling will prevent me from going to crazy, not sure who I could have sex with in the Amazon or wherever the hell the peace core sends me.

            [–]delta_hedge 5 points6 points  (3 children)

            of course it is not sufficient, but rather a necessary condition for men to consider you. thats why you hear so many overweight women complaining about feeling invisible to men.

            a 30 year can be only slightly less hot than a 25 year old, but a 35 is significantly different than a 25 year old.

            i am 28 and i have no problems with women in their thirties. they are experienced and sexually assertive enough to have sex relatively early. but i would be an utter fool to marry someone whose looks fade in 5 years, instead of 10 or 15 years.

            i doubt any woman at thirty is better to handle relationships than she is in her twenties. the sex she has had in this period have produced enough oxytocins to make her brain completely resistant to further pair bonding. nevertheless, she will probably still stay with her partner, but rather due to lack of options than due to an emotional connection.

            [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (2 children)

            the sex she has had in this period have produced enough oxytocins to make her brain completely resistant to further pair bonding. nevertheless, she will probably still stay with her partner, but rather due to lack of options than due to an emotional connection.

            Umm citation? never heard of this. You saying older women can't fall in love? Or are in capable of sustaining it? And this is supposed to be an absolute???

            i doubt any woman at thirty is better to handle relationships than she is in her twenties.

            100% depends on the woman. I actually just read /u/redpillwifey 's intro on her blog, talking about how she got turned onto TRP. So literally from one year to the next she grew as a person immensely and the result was a better functioning marriage.

            [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            I also got married when I was 23... I've matured, but it's within the confines of my marriage. I can't say one way or the other if that'd be true if I were still single.

            [–]delta_hedge 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            if you google oxytocin you will find a lot of descriptions about it. of course it depends on the women, but i was specifically referring to the case you mentioned, i.e. having sex in the twenties before settling down.

            of course after a 10 year period of multiple sex partners, she is still able to "fall in love", however you define that. and even marry someone. but such marriages are much more likely to fall apart, see here

            [–]Big_Man_On_Campus 9 points10 points  (0 children)

            So I just want my 20's to travel the world and not be tied down to one place or man (or maybe woman), however I also want to spend it having sex! I mean who can blame me...But this is apparently lowering my potential worth to a man and come my 30's and 40's I'm poop. Which sucks to think about but I can't say I'm gonna stop living it up while I'm young.

            Basic red pill truth: Men are expendable Women are perishable

            If that truth hurts, it should. However, ignore it at your own peril. Much like ignoring pain in your gut, the pain of truth is telling you something you need to be aware of.

            You are likely making a choice based on the problem you see. There's nothing intrinsically wrong with choosing the fun-loving super-dating-power cock carousel. However, like all choices, it comes with tradeoffs. Men will value you less for a mate when you're done riding the carousel, there's no way around this. The reason this is so is the old male saying, "Those 18 year old girls, they never get any older." For a very scary thought, consider your dating potential as if it is always being compared against what the next batch of 18 year olds is offering.

            Much like milk on the shelf, women are perishable. Your value as a mate decreases with time and mileage quite rapidly. Yes, the life of living high on the hog, exploiting your SMV to its limit for 10-15 years sounds fantastic. To be honest it sounds fantastic to many men as well, but men really do not have that option. Women will always have the greater dating market power and value. Yes, men can improve their SMV, unlike ladies, but they can never achieve the raw power of a young woman.

            To be honest I think you should be thankful you're not expendable. Being expendable and being on the opposite end of the cock carousel is about like being dirt.

            [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

            you chose short term fun, over long time reward. you want to travel and have lots of sex? find a man who wants to travel all the time and wants YOU all the time. how about that?

            [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            You can't follow me to the peace core :/

            [–]new2RP 14 points15 points  (7 children)

            You're essentially following the exact pattern that the red pill describes. You want to have fun now, but then eventually find a good man to settle down with. You can do what you want, but it's like me saying "I want to spend every paycheck traveling and buying fun things in my 20s, but then when I hit 30 I want to be able to afford to buy a nice house" You have to make a choice, have a lot of sex and fun, and not be tied down in your 20s and have your value lowered in the eyes of alpha men, or don't. It's up to you.

            There's nothing wrong with making choices, but there are consequences to these choices, and it just means you might not get everything you want. You can have a problem all you want with it, but that's life.

            [–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (6 children)

            Hmm alright then. I guess I'd rather have the great memories. Abroad I go! I'm sure I'll get this crazy out of my system sooner or later. And I'll try to remain as hot as possible for as long as possible ;)

            Edit: also, does that mean red pill men want an immature, inexperienced, sexual newb?

            [–]redpillschoolModerator Extraordinaire 13 points14 points  (0 children)

            also, does that mean red pill men want an immature, inexperienced, sexual newb?

            You don't like the idea that when you're 30, guys are going to go after younger girls so you try to dismiss them as immature and bad at sex. That's not doing you any favors- you're rationalizing why guys would rather be with you. It won't be true.

            [–]new2RP 4 points5 points  (1 child)

            I imagine it depends on the guy. Some just want any lay, or as many as they can get, others want a woman who can make him come by just looking at him. Some guys are willing to mold a young inexperienced woman into doing exactly what he wants in bed. To each their own.

            You'll probably be able to find a guy down the line anyway, but he'll likely be a beta who won't sexually excite you nearly as much as the guy's you're having sex with now. Thus is life. Have fun traveling!

            [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

            Thanks! To the amazon, I go! (in a year lol)

            [–]mechakingghidorah 4 points5 points  (2 children)

            Yes, This is a common source of feminist butthurt, but it's true. Looks and sexual purity matter much much more to a man then things like fame,money,status, or even your college degree.

            The ideal red pill woman, at least to me is happy,kind,eager-to-please (or maybe devoted is a better word) ,at least an 8/10 and a virgin.

            Any college bonus depends on what you majored in and what the guy likes, for me I'd prefer a girl who majored in Music or Marine Biology; nothing else really matters to me.

            [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

            Oh god that just sounds so boring. Esp the music and marine bio part haha (i kid!) But seriously I just can't limit myself to that...

            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            You don't have to! Why can't you be all those things and MORE?

            [–]gretka 3 points4 points  (1 child)

            Why do you think being inexperienced would make you a bad wife? I'm really confused with this kind of thinking. My gf is very inexperienced (relationship-wise) but it's the best relationship I've been in. Also, you can travel with someone else (man or woman), not alone. The fact that you view relationships as being "tied down" seems to suggest that you simply haven't met a man yet that would really be your match, so that you would want to spend all the time with him and so that you would have absolutely no interest in ever fucking anyone else again. I hope you meet him.

            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            The very few relationships I have been in, I find myself not putting equal amounts of effort into it because I have other things consuming me. It was college and working full time to pay for it for those relationships, now that I'm out maybe its possible...But I have life plans that require traveling (peace core-2 years alone in the "wild") so, again, if I was in a relationship I would be unable to put forth the amount of effort the man would deserve.

            Basically, I want to work on myself so I can be the best possible future wife and mother I can be, without having regrets for having missed out on trying to achieve my personal goals.

            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            Wonderful answer! Much better explanation than mine.

            [–]TempestTcup 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            This is a fantastic answer! I'm benefiting greatly from Wife Goggles & I've got to say that they really work. Thank goodness!

            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            Big Man nails it. A quality man will value the gift you gave him and respond appropriately as you both age.

            [–]The-Self-Post-Guy 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            As a man I believe that attractiveness doesn't 100% come from looks. If I were to break it down it'd be more like one third looks, one third personality/attitude, and one third skill set. The last one being what a lot of women lack. There are a lot of good looking women out there with great attitudes and personalities, but what really sets you apart from the herd is the different skills and talents you possess. Like take for example a women who is excellent at guitar is way more desired than an equal woman that doesn't really strive to better herself. And I'm not just talking guitar. Like singing, playing any instrument, rock climbing, avid sports player, video gamer, programmer 'as a hobby), shoots guns, something other than a woman who just goes to work everyday than goes home. Something other than a woman who is just good looking with a personality because guess what, with 320 million people in the US (well over half being women) a good looking girl who's has a personality is a dime a dozen. Its just like how guys have to have some sort of talent to attract women (ie: guitar, good dancer, good at sports, artist, etc) Im attracted to women with talents and skills as much as I would be to some who is just pretty but boring.

            [–]TempestTcup 17 points18 points  (0 children)

            Maybe a good red pill strategy for a woman, other than just looks, is to figure out how to add value to her relationship. Keep the house nice, keep her man well fed with nutritious food, keep things interesting in bed, etc.

            [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

            Great discussion happening here. :)

            [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

            The man on TRP say over and over again that the only thing men are attracted to is looks.

            Not true, many TRP men say submissive, cute, sweet behavior also matters. Also, bearing the kids of a man and being a good wife and mom is how to keep a man forever.

            [–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (10 children)

            Being in good shape will put you ahead of most other women in the dating market. I didn't know that I was one of the select few that were single in the 20's and not fat. Physically just being not fat makes more of an impression on men than an absolutely gorgeous face. Being in good shape and eating a very healthy diet make me look much younger than I am, I am turning 29 in a couple months and still get carded regularly (it pisses my little sister off that everyone thinks I am the younger sister).

            Also what made an impression on men I dated was that I cook, bake, and do all the domestic shit; but I also read real literature (not romance), have real interests, and support myself fully. Basically don't depend on your looks. If you depend on your looks, your relationship will be very shallow.

            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (9 children)

            I cook, bake, and do all the domestic shit;

            If you like doing these, all power to you. In addition, if a girl has a man supporting her, well if I was the man I would expect these things as well.

            My problem would arise if we both work full time to support ourselves yet he expects me to do all the house work. I guess a good wife would do it, if the hubby is just sitting on his ass, well it would be REALLY hard to keep from becoming bitter.

            Edit: or is the theory "do the housework so he doesn't stop liking you when you are less attractive"? Because that seems pretty shallow actually. Can't a relationship be based in communication and trust? Rather than looks or favors?

            [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

            Oh don't get me wrong, I don't do all the housework. I work full time and it is my house, so I do expect a certain level of cleanliness. Knowing how to do these things is more of a bonus for my SO and it sets me apart from most women. I only point these sort of things out because I have had men wrapped around my little finger based on my baking alone, apparently baking from scratch (multiple recipes) is rare for most people now.

            Skills and interests are more important than people give credit in dating. Would you rather date someone who is pretty and empty or someone who is okay looking and can actually do things for themselves.

            [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            Ok fair enough, I can certainly say the same for men. A man who knows how to cook is awesome and one who knows how to clean (like deep clean clean) is practically unheard, at least in the college scene.

            And I totally agree skills and interests are so important. I know I am attracted to a man who is passionate about something and good at it. Or even just passionate haha.

            [–]margerym 2 points3 points  (6 children)

            Relationships are based in reality and attraction and holding up one's end of the bargain (I certainly wouldn't call that favors) is a part of that as are other things. To say that these things don't matter or aren't even foundational is wishful thinking at best. So to answer your question, probably not (though I'm sure exceptions exist somewhere they don't make for the rule). Not in the real world, at least.

            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (5 children)

            Not in the real world, at least.

            Ok I definitely feel that in the real world, relationships take work. I just feel the work should be split fairly. I probably shouldn't have used the word favors. And if you enter a relationship and certain promises/ assurances are made ("i'll always cook/clean/etc..) and then are not fulfilled that is one thing. But if not, if we both are devoted and loving and want the best for each other, then he should be willing to split the annoying housekeeping duties down the middle. Again this is assuming he ain't bringing home the bacon, you both are.

            So is this silly to want? Personally I was raised in a house wherein my mom made most of the money but also raised 6 children and did all the house work. She is a hero. But for all the manly family leader my dad is (and he is a GREAT one) I still occasionally feel resentful toward him for my mom's sake for his lack of effort around the house. She never seems to mind. She is honestly the ultimate Red Pill woman, that's devout Christianity for you.

            I'm not sure I could do that tho and not feel resentful. I can be submissive and obedient to a man as long as we are still equals. I am choosing to submit to him because I love him, he should choose to share the house work, because he loves me. These are my thoughts, what are yours?

            [–]margerym 5 points6 points  (3 children)

            I think what it boils down to is everyone is different and we can't assign our own feelings to them. Don't feel resentful for your mom, she's happy! And isn't that really what it comes down to in life and in our relationships?

            Personally in my own life housekeeping is my responsibility as I stay home. But my husband does actually clean, too. Though I think expecting it to be a 50-50 thing is unreasonable even if the woman works (because life isn't 50-50 and I'm sure there are areas where she is doing less and him more) I also don't buy for a second that it's 100% one way or the other. A woman being in charge of housework doesn't mean the husband is a lazy slob. My husband carrying his own weight (putting his clothes in the hamper, washing out his coffee cup in the morning, etc) is helping with the housework. Honestly, I think all this need for absolute literal equality is cumbersome. It doesn't play to people's strengths and expects far too much rigidity. It's turned marriage into a political statement instead of a union. It's almost like one has to keep score in marriage to make sure they are still absolute equals and that is the most important thing. I don't buy that.

            [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

            Honestly it's not even me wanting "absolute literal equality" but my internal INSANE desire for fairness. So the "i do more in somethings, he does more in others" is totally cool with my internal fairness meter haha but the setup with my parents wasn't. But you are so right, I try to just shake off the resentful feeling as stupid when it occasionally pops up.

            [–]margerym 5 points6 points  (1 child)

            I bet that there was places your Dad did more and your mom less that you didn't see. It amazes me, as a mother, how much my kids just don't get what is really happening between their father and I.

            [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            I'm sure you are right. I just couldn't see it.

            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

            But for all the manly family leader my dad is (and he is a GREAT one) I still occasionally feel resentful toward him for my mom's sake for his lack of effort around the house. She never seems to mind.

            Why resent your dad for that? Are they still happy and married? If your mom doesn't mind, and might actually like it that way, why take that out on your dad? That doesn't make any sense... No offense meant, just wondering.

            [–]TehGinjaNinja 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            Obviously physical attraction is important, but I don't think it's the only factor in a man's love for a woman. However this is NOT a red pill idea.

            Proponents of the red pill assert the reality that physical attraction is important as part of refuting the blue pill fantasy that your partner should love you as you are for who you are. They also do it to point out that assertions made by feminists and the politically correct about what someone should find attractive are often misleading.

            However, I haven't seen much argument in support of the idea that looks are the only thing which matters. In fact if you look closely at a lot of red Pill writing what you will see are frequent critiques of women's behaviour.

            A woman's behaviour is a huge component of what makes her attractive as relationship material, as opposed to a quick lay. I'd expect this sub to offer advice on how to act and not just "exercise, diet, makeup and fashion tips".

            So isn't this a losing game for all women who will eventually get older and less attractive?

            No, if you haven't gotten older and less attractive then TRP should be a wake up call to use your youth and beauty to get a high quality man hooked while you still can, rather than wasting your appeal on cads who will pump and dump you.

            If you have gotten older and less attractive without landing a high quality man then TRP is a wake-up call to abandon your sense of entitlement to the guy of your dreams and accept more realistic options. There are still decent men looking for companionship who would be willing to settle for you if you're willing to settle for them.

            [–]Tastysalad101 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            You can find desperate beta providers though you'll eventually lose attraction to them.

            [–]troubadour1492 2 points3 points  (2 children)

            If you're worrying about longer term, you're into marrying territory, and you're automatically getting some beta in your man.

            I was a beta my whole life, and as a beta I attracted a wife and kept her totally devoted to me for 20 years.

            I discovered the red pill for one reason. It's not because she's 45 and age is starting to kick her ass, it's because she's FAT. Something happened that gave me a momentary opportunity to be with someone who wasn't fat, and I actually did the "right thing" and resisted. The strain of resisting that temptation turned out to be what broke my chains, and no matter how much I actually do love my wife, I've put myself through a massive personal hell to forgive myself for not being able to be attracted to fat women, and to allow myself to move on and pursue happiness.

            Your best bet for dealing with the wall, girls, is to avoid becoming fat. I've seen women looking good enough to interest my blue pill beta eyes well into their 50s. Not fat. I have a 20 year old chasing my paunchy 40 year old ass like crazy, and she's never getting any of this dick, because she's fat.

            The only woman in the world who gets a pass on being fat is my wife, and I don't know what the expiration date is on that pass. For now, I'm pursuing happiness out in the open, and my wife can have a divorce if she wants one. This has had the ironic result of making her even more attracted to me, and that much more determined to keep whatever part of me she can have in her life.

            If she'd lose enough weight to matter, I'd probably give up the quest, but she's not going to lose weight. If I could take a pill to make me attracted to fat women, I WOULD NOT take that pill.

            Fat. It's the boner killer. So is blue hair, but there is a lot of past the wall before you get to the abyss of being old old old.

            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            I feel this way about men too. If someone I was dating or married got fat due to poor eating, I would actually leave. That's the only thing I can think o that is a relationship deal-breaker.

            Women are visual too, and for those of us who are active and like working out with our SOs, weight gain is a huge turnoff.

            [–]Ellista 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            True.

            I do think good men are extremely rare.

            [–]batfish55 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            That's a lot of comments. I wonder if this'll get read.

            I'm a Red Pill man. I'll let you in on a little secret that I suspect a lot of us guys share...

            When I was young, yea, I wouldn't chase girls more than a year or two older than me, and I sure as hell wasn't interested in any girls lower than a 8. (but I'll be honest, I settled for whoever was nice enough to touch my wang)

            Fast forward a few years, I'm in my 30s. Now, I'll dip down to a 6+...but my tolerance level for bullshit is SUPER low, as opposed to my younger years. I don't care if you're a 21 year old 10, if you're ANY kind of a pain in my ass, you ain't got no chance with me.

            The point is this: personality counts, especially if gravity is taking its toll. When you were young and firm, you could be flaky, dumb, and kind of a bitch, and betas would take it. If you're older, and you want a man, you better learn to be the kind of woman your grandmother was.

            [–][deleted] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

            It's simple, you need to cash in on your looks by marrying a good man before you lose them. Kids will keep him around long term, along with you being a good woman in general. If a woman gave me her best years having my kids and being a good companion, I wouldn't toss her aside once she get's a bit frumpy (due to age, not neglect like getting fat!)

            [–]The_Ringmistress -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

            Attraction= Alpha= Girl Game Retention = Beta = building the Wife Goggles

            The Red Pill for women is the knowledge that long term commitment must be secured early. Learning to build attraction qualities improves the chances of finding a man who is equally attractive to the woman. But just as a woman won't stick around a man forever just because he gives her tingles, it's not enough to be hot/cute/pretty. He notices you because you look good. He keeps you because you're low maintenance, bore his children, cook great meals, understand the rules of his favorite sport, give him back rubs, make his home a haven, etc.

            Yes, men's SMV can rise as they age. But there is an investment factor in an established relationship that can't be overrated. What kills that investment is bad behavior. When a woman is rebellious or indicates by her actions that she just doesn't care about her man, the compound interest goes away. You start burning up relationship capital. So the red pill is about learning to balance alpha attraction factors (staying fit and pretty, keeping the marriage bed interesting) and beta comfort factors (all the little wifely things that make him feel.like a king in his his castle and glad you're his queen consort). Not so different from men as far as married game goes.

            To my mind, the big difference between red pill men and red pill women is that for women married game is the only safe strategy. The risks of promiscuity are too high and bear precious little fruit for women. Not that there aren't happy endings for women who've seem some action, but it's not a wise strategy if the goal is commitment to a man you can desire and respect.

            [–][deleted]  (1 child)

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