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DISCUSSIONHow to Spot Male Losers (self.RedPillWomen)

submitted by Ursula88

I'm new here. TRP is heavy on advice to men about how to detect and either use&discard or stay away from gold-diggers, low value women, etc. But I've not seen any posts for Red Pill Women about how to spot and stay away from the men who use&discard them and the male takers. It's all advice on how to be a good First Mate. Women, particularly the young women of today, seem to be incredibly naive about men who offer them absolutely nothing except for the opportunity to get laid and become a baby mama. Is there any post here along those lines?


[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

[–]Big_Daddy_PDX 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Way to make a great first impression!! Solid advice about concentrating on the positives and adjusting the mentality toward the traits that are desirable.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Welcome to RPW.

As PragmaticRedTruth mentioned, RPW tends to focus more on seeking out and vetting the "target" type of men, and a part of that involves seeing red flags that betray the guy not actually being the type of man who would work for you in a long-term arrangement. In this way, "spotting losers" is built into the vetting part of the process.

In a way, this is actually very similar to the TRP concept of figuring out the amount of commitment that you should give a woman based on different levels of what she has to offer (the typical three levels being plate, friends with benefits and LTR). The only difference is that RPW is not interested in making women into "plates" or "friends with benefits" and jump right into focusing on an LTR instead.

Women, particularly the young women of today, seem to be incredibly naive about men who offer them absolutely nothing except for the opportunity to get laid and become a baby mama.

You are completely right about this, and that's why RPW focuses on the interplay between sex and commitment instead of giving away sex for less commitment than they want. Again, this is similar to the TRP principle of making sure men don't give away their commitment for less sex than they want.

I'm looking over the sidebar, and I really don't see much that specifically addresses vetting, which I'm surprised with since that's such an important part of the process for RPW. I think having some people note any relevant threads or post their own ideas conceptually would be useful.

[–]VigilantRedRoosterModerator 8 points9 points  (0 children)

https://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/2lauc4/a_plate_is_the_equivalent_of_a_female_beta/

Here's a place to start. If you have any specific questions, we'll be glad to help you out. As for the vague complaints about content, we agree but we kind of had a library fire 2 months ago and are busy writing replacement material. The "vetting a partner" group is high priority.

Here's my response to a similar question, hope it helps.


Vetting your potential partners is an important process; it is part science and part fine art. It amazes me how many people put little to no effort into selecting the correct partner; it is everywhere in their vague dating profiles ("Just ask!" That's the entirety of ~3% of profiles!), and in their vapid, inconsequential date conversations. When selecting a LTR partner, you're checking thousands of subtle and overt cues to their character, against a loudly ticking clock due to SMP competition.

For the most part, your vetting is passive and observational. Confrontationally overt tests, specifically shit tests, are unfeminine and RPW specifically recommends against them.

You also definitely want to avoid an interrogation or job interview vibe. Instead of peppering him with questions, use mutual self-disclosure to maintain a balance of knowledge about each other.

Example: Instead of, "Do you want to get married any time soon? Are you the marrying type?" you might say in conversation, "My parents are still together after 35 years; I hope to be happily married like that one day." Then STFU and let him respond. If he changes the subject, that's one whole block of information. If he's interested in marriage and you, TRUST ME, he will lead the discussion in that direction at the appropriate pace and time.

How he treats people "beneath" him such as waitstaff is one good indicator of character; you also need to observe how he interacts with equals and authority figures. How does he speak of his colleagues, his siblings/cousins; his bosses, his elders, the law, etc?

How socially adept is he? Is he good at reading nonverbal cues? Can he guide the interaction to a state of push-pull with you? Can he banter well with people you encounter? If a pretty woman walks by, is he discreet about looking while in front of you, or does he stare like a 5yo when the dessert cart goes by?

How does he deal with delays, frustrations, problems? Is he quick to anger, does he hold a grudge; or does he pivot and accomodate unexpected glitches for the overall good of the day's experience? Example If a table won't be available for another 10 minutes, does he spend that time arguing with the hostess and ranting and fuming over it, or does he spend it sitting with his date chatting and getting to know her?

What is his sense of humor like? Self-aware, LOL at our human foibles type? Blaming or demeaning, where one party is hurt, shamed, or loses face? Philosophical, wry irony or karmic justice ?

How well does he take charge, when minor or major opportunities for leadership arise? What leadership styles does he use in various contexts; authoritarian and demanding, or charismatic and pragmatic? Example: organizing a random queue into an orderly line, or recruiting strangers to help move something heavy like a fallen tree branch across a busy path; versus doing nothing and being stuck in the problem like everyone else.

How is his overall integrity? If he makes a mistake, does he make amends, deny, cover up, or deflect blame? Do inconsistencies or lies come to light when adding up everything he says?

How well does he reciprocate your interest in him overall? Is he vague about his time away from you, his future, your future? How future-oriented is he in general? Example: Talks mainly about parties, conversations, events of the day, what he'd like to do to you later that day and other ephemera; versus career, pertinent news/current events, family history and plans for the future relevant to a long-term partner.

These are a few things that come to mind. Let me know what follow up questions this leaves; we are working on new dating and vetting material.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

What a good idea for a post! I think that age of you and your potential partner have a lot to do with what sort of flags you should be looking for. We encourage women to make a list (very short! Not a laundry list!) of things they need in a man to make a relationship fulfilling and have the proper respect of her man. So for instance one of the things on my list back in the day was "a strong and faithful Christian". That is something I couldn't compromise on. Someone my age may also say "well established in a career" but that isn't necessarily obtainable for a guy who is 21 but at 27 or 28 it's perfectly acceptable to expect that.

incredibly naive about men who offer them absolutely nothing except for the opportunity to get laid and become a baby mama.

Unfortunately this is extremely common place but it does take two to tango. Women are just as able to make the choice to not sleep with someone and to use protection. Not knowing if a man is worth your time and energy is a big reason why RPW stresses commitment from both parties before sex.

[–]JimiJons 10 points11 points  (1 child)

You didn't need to state that you're new here for your post to make it apparent that you're new here. This question is not only answered throughout the subreddit in various ways, but also makes a number of accusatory assumptions.

It's possible you're genuinely curious about why you fall for a man who is able to stoke your desire through a manipulation of your base instincts and urges despite his low societal value, in which case the loser here is you and not the man who fools you, and you simply need to read more.

If not, read more anyway, so that the next time you attempt to criticize the community with rhetorical questions, you'll know what you're talking about first.

[–]VigilantRedRoosterModerator 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Hard truths spoken here.

[–]sierratangovictor 2 points3 points  (2 children)

TL,DR : It's somewhat complex, but doable

Disclaimer : I am a man, so I will speak from a man's perspective .

Long answer: What is a loser? Someone who just wants to be your first mate but not stay long? In that case, your question should read : How to spot an enriching man.

There are different types of enriching men, and not all of them are Alphas.

The Sigma Archetype

Many a Redpiller disagree with the existence of a Sigma, but they exist. To spot this man, You have to imagine this : a lion may be the alpha-est, but a wolf doesn't perform in a circus. You will have to change your hunting grounds.

You won't find him in the usual bars / gyms ... This is the guy who is building a nuclear reactor in his basement. This guy does not give a s*it about any social constraints. Have you already been to an university? Remember a guy stuck inside the library with a mountain of books around him? That is this guy.

He will have the following traits, that you can easily spot:

  1. he doesn't care about the alphas - he simply walks away from parties where alphas abound. He does not look up to an alpha actor or an alpha athlete. He is not in a hurry to make money. A complete disregard of any social norm is the first signal.

  2. He doesn't try to command the respect of other men. This is where he differs from the Alpha. The alpha will always try to ' give a "vibe" ' - This man doesn't he will disregard social norms, he will disregard other people - this is where women often equate him with a disgusting beta. They will keep on talking about him, but they will still find him "not appealing". The Sigma won't try to sell himself to the ladies. Remember he is beyond the norms.

  3. This man has Autistic passion. If he likes something, he likes every single molecule of it. He will talk about laughably simple things with great passion. He will sound like a pokemon addicted neckbeard. This is where many woman will drop the cue, who still didn't drop the cue in point 2.

  4. Now, if you are still reading, then you have enough patience to look for this trait. The Sigma archetype goes beyond the call of duty. You need to observe this with great care. Many women take "Han Solo" to be the example of a sigma. He is not. He is a slacker turned hero. The Sigma archetype, on the other hand, is a lone wolf on a continuous mission. This means, he never radiates the vibe of being content. The Alpha vibe, that he has everything, that he is content, is in direct contradiction to this man. This man is continuously pushing his boundary, often to the point of molesting himself. This is where the rest of the women ran away - with the question :" if he can't take care of himself, how can he take care of me?" . Answer : "he will take care of you by selling his blood". Pretty beta, but to this man, you will become part of his world, and he will defend the the world.

  5. This man does not compulsively go against the legal laws. Ted Bundy or other serial killers have a tendency to actively violate the law. The sigma is a bulldozer who will crush the law when needed but will not orient himself towards simply rebelling against a law. The sigma is a rebel with a meaningful - albeit the meaningfulness itself is arbitrary - cause.

Now in order to find these traits - directly ask him questions : so, how wild are your dreams, and what are you putting in to realize the dream. May be his answers won't be the most earth shaking, but keep on conversing. Ask him : where do you live? If the answer is : "I just move to the town, and i live in a tent", don't drop the cue, ask him : "Why are you here" . See if there is something that gives you the idea that he is up for getting something at any cost.

No, this man won't be an easy ride. This man will however offer the most enriching experience. but just like climbing every single mountain on the earth (regardless of amount of enrichment) is not for everyone, this man is also not for everyone.

This man requires you to invest a lot in him. In return, he will mature into the most well off alphas.

I think this man might not be the man you want. Please read on .


The well off established Alpha archetype

Some are born alpha. Women talk about the guy quad: Inherited money, good looks, intelligence, and loyality.

See, the first two are inherited. Not all have a good luck to inherit these things. So, often they will have to work their way towards these things. Once they reach a point, they will feel (and rightfully so) that they are better than many others. Now, consider the possible thought experiment carefully :

Imagine, for the time being, that you want an alpha man, who can offer you something that your previous relationships didn't give you. However, when this alpha was working his way up, you were not there - so you have no contribution to his success. Now, once he has succeeded, you want him.

He will ask in his mind : "Chick was so far hanging out with someone else, now she wants me. Either I'm better than her previous mates, so what is my reward - what do I get from her that her other mates didn't have. Or, I'm not better than her previous mates, so I don't need to hang around here."

Do you see what is happening? If you are going for an already successful alpha, whom you can spot easily with their success, then the question isn't any more "How do I spot who will actually stay longer with me". The actual question there, "How do I make him a lucrative offer he can't refuse ?"

An alpha that became alpha by hard work, won't want to settle for anything less than lucrative. Random chick popping up once he's got himself established, and asking for his commitment doesn't charm him. Now he is established, all by himself. Now he can also continue without you. Now he doesn't really need an long term relationship. Now he don't have a shortage of s*uts trying to ride him. So he can get all the intimacy and time and "love" for a much lower price.

You see, at my age now, women say that they want me, cause I'm well established in my career. I usually think at the back of my head, "f*ck off chick, I'm much better off than your previous mates whom you were hanging out while I was fighting my shadow - now suddenly I am well established and you want to change your taste. You want me to invest my time in you? That's more valuable than your previous mates' times. But My reward isn't gonna get larger than your previous mates - so I'm not interested". Yes, I begin the interaction being closed. Yes, people may call me out on this, but if i don't get a better reward than your previous mates, then I'm a loser, and I don't like to loose.

But I guess you are not also looking for this case, where you will have to pay an higher price to get an updated mate.


The successful married man

You want to trap an already successful man into marriage? Give clear signals : "I have an N-count of XYZ, I'm tired to riding cocks, now I want to settle down. You have been alone, but now you can have me. Do you want me?"

There are men who will fall for this. That might work out.

Good luck.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–]sierratangovictor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    :D You're Welcome. That's how I am looking at the past self of mine

    [–]bonerdude420 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I'd recommend a couple things

    -Look for evidence of him being either short term orientated or long term orientated. Does he follow through things start to finish, does he have evidence of long term achievements?

    -How does he treat people when he is not obliged to be nice. It's already been mentioned to pay attention how he treats service staff. I think it's a good indication in both men and women their general attitude towards how they feel about people, are they negative or positive people.

    -How do they react when things don't go how they hoped. The reaction to a small inconvenience will give some indication how they will react to a major setback.

    -How is their home and personal presentation. Do they take care and pride of themselves

    -Finally if they talk badly about others (exs, coworkers, the government, whatever) or blame people for things in their life they are not satisfied with, it should be a red flag, you will be added to the list of people that get blamed for things not going well.

    [–]kavihasya 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I think that one of the things that makes it difficult to just make a list on how to find the ideal Captain, is that women respect different things in men. For some women, access to money and power is a really important part of respect. For other women, it doesn't matter as much, and are more moved by integrity. Some women need stereotypically masculine behaviors in order to feel respect; other women don't. The important thing about choosing a mate is that you identify sustaining traits that you respect and will continue to respect and admire throughout your life. You need to figure out how to look past your own fascinations in order to attempt to evaluate a man's captain potential. That can be very hard to do, and there isn't a silver bullet answer to how to do it well. But it all starts with understanding yourself, and building your own self-discipline.

    [–]Ursula88[S] -7 points-6 points  (7 children)

    It seems to me that Red Pill Women need advice about how to spot the very behavior that a significant majority of TRP is devoted to promoting. I suppose it's good to have all these differing views on the sexes in one place, because women need to be aware of the Pick Up Artist crap that is intended to make them low-hanging fruit. As a guy told me once: Find them, Feel them, Finger them, Fuck them, Forget them. Luckily for me, when I hear a line like that, I don't have to hear it twice to know what kind of man he is. And this is the kind of man who would get slapped on the back and encouraged here. smh

    [–]theScarlettWomanModerator | Scarlett 4 points5 points  (3 children)

    Some of your comment is bad mouthing TRP and its practices, something we don't do here. Please be mindful of the posting rules here.

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [removed]

      [–]VigilantRedRoosterModerator[M] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      Please take this question to private modmail, using the "message the moderators" link down the sidebar. We have an open door policy and will be glad to work with you through the appropriate channels.

      Let's keep this thread on-topic, discussing how to spot a quality partner for long-term commitment.

      [–]VigilantRedRoosterModerator[M] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

      And this is the kind of man who would get slapped on the back and encouraged here.

      Slow down, sister; it's obvious you came to us after reading TRP which is written for its community of men. I can understand how you picked up this perception, but you'll discover that RedPillWomen addresses sexual strategy according to women's best interests, which are sometimes complementary and sometimes contradictory to the interests of men.

      Stick around here a little bit, if you think we'd slap that kind of man on the back, you haven't actually learned what we're about yet.

      [–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

      No, not really. You're just still trapped in the negative mindset that men are the enemy or "the other". Red pill men are tired of that mentality, and it robs you of all value except sex. Men are the gatekeepers to committment. We owe you a relationship in the same way you owe us sex (you don't), and it's up to you to decide if a man is worth getting into bed with.

      If you spend a month seeing a guy before fucking him, it'll be much easier to tell his value than if you put out on the second date.

      [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      This reply happened a few hours after your post. I think it answers your overall question perfectly.

      https://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/4r21hm/how_to_spot_male_losers/d4xy1hw?st=iq7h5fic&sh=e7d84436