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I've noticed that men treat me differently. What are these freaky feminine mind tricks? (self.RedPillWomen)

submitted by A-Promise

Tl;Dr: I get treated very differently to the girls who are louder and more standoffish, who make less of a general effort to be respectful to others. (I never raise my voice and never use personal insults, I have a lot of patience: I was raised that way.) The only explanation that I can think of is that I'm more feminine and ...demure isn't the right word but it is the only one I can think of. What is this mind trick wizardry?! Can you tell me more about it?

Hello ladies! A while ago, I discovered the red pill subreddit by accident. I did a bit of reading on the various subreddits and looked at some of the linked websites. It was interesting to see a perspective that advocated femininity as powerful (I have had a traditional upbringing and find myself being shouted down for my own good by feminists for my views a lot).

I recall reading a post by a man who was describing his and his wife's journey into a red pill take on their marriage. (Details might be a bit wrong, this was probably almost a year ago.) He mentioned that he had discovered that while he was trying to assume a role of leadership and taking on the task of self improvement, his wife was making a reciprocal effort, but he one day discovered a forum that she frequented which had 'tips' including one that he recognised that she had employed during an argument. The forum had suggested sitting on the floor at his feet (as he sat on a sofa or something) during an argument to reduce his feelings of hostility and make him feel protective.

I didn't give it much thought, other than that it made sense, from the point of view of the ingrained desire to protect and not attack someone vulnerable. This was until recently, when my mind was blown.

I was holidaying with a group of friends, and one in particular is what I suppose you would call 'alpha'. He is confident, a natural leader, intelligent, and for what it is worth mentioning, very into his fitness. He was (rightly) annoyed about other things that had happened that day, and was having a bit of a heated disagreement with another girl in our group. She was being standoffish for the sake of her pride and he was overreacting because he was already annoyed.

I was quite tired and just wanted to drink my mulled wine by the fire, so I sat down, leaning on his chair and tried to stay out of it, but almost immediately he lowered his tone of voice (he had been shouting at this point), put his hand in my hair (he's quite physically affectionate, and I'm the little one of the group so I get petted and cuddled a lot... it sounds weird to say out loud, but it isn't weird) and just generally calmed down, stopped the argument, and after the other girl had left, apologized to me for shouting and losing his temper. The next morning he apologized again for losing his cool and told me that he had felt bad being so aggressive in front of me. I questioned him a little bit and he said that he felt that he should be 'gentle with me because I'm so sweet and small'.

After that I thought backwards, and this has happened before too.I started to notice that of the men in our group (We're all in our early 20s) people treat me very differently to certain other women, particularly these men. They don't swear in front of me, are generally more 'gentle' and go out of their way for me without me asking, which they also do for the other more traditional girls of our group. They are quite protective over me in particular: I'm petite in stature but by no means incapable or incompetent, as they well know.

What's up with this? The bit that is standing out to me is that this was advice given on a forum somewhere. It sounds in the same grain of the relationship advice that my grandmother gives me: agreeable women use their femininity to the advantage of their relationships. Where can I read more about it? (My mother bought me the book 'The Fascinating Girl' a long time ago but I got bored of it because I was too young to find it relevant. I think I will dig it up...) It's very interesting to me how different types of men treat different types of women completely differently, especially when put in the context of past relationships...

Thank you for reading all of this text and bearing with me!


[–]vintagegirlgame 15 points16 points  (8 children)

Body language is an important part of Girl Game. The way you hold your arms, the way you cross your legs, and the way you touch him all communicate in his preferred language: actions over words. I think men are more sensitive to subtle body cues than we give them credit for. They can always tell we're not "fine" even when we say we are.

[–]A-Promise[S] 8 points9 points  (7 children)

Is there a 'girl game' textbook or something?(!)

I found it quite stunning that there existed a forum in which someone had suggested this as a tip, and wondered if there were more like it. Other than the obvious stuff which I've noticed myself growing up... for example, as a teenager, I thought that I would be met with a grimace of inconvenience when I asked a friend to help me move a heavy box down up from my basement, but his chest visibly puffed out and he was so pleased with himself to have been asked.

[–]persistencepays 3 points4 points  (4 children)

I'm not sure what people here think of The Rules but I think it's a great "girl game textbook". Basically says look your best, be feminine and sweet , be a challenge, be happy and busy with your own life rather than clingy, and don't chase men, allow them to chase you.

I thought that I would be met with a grimace of inconvenience when I asked a friend to help me move a heavy box down up from my basement, but his chest visibly puffed out

Earning a favourable impression from somebody by asking them to do you a favour is called the Ben Franklin effect as he was the first to identify it. Male-female polarity puts it on another level!

[–]A-Promise[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Thank you for the recommendation, who is 'The Rules' written by?

Yes, I've heard of that in a sociology class that I took! People feel valued by you and are more likely to like you. I think a lot of what I've read around the web today, is, as /u/TheLemming said, to do with good manners and being a pleasant person, and it is quite sad that that needs to be pointed out in a culture of selfishness where people think that disrespecting others makes them seem like a bigger person.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There is a Blog http://www.therulesrevisited.com I found the post on hair very helpful, Apparently my husband also has a thing for the half up half down look. Something I wouldn't have tried otherwise. Just a silly small thing really but has lots of great advice of presenting your best self.

[–]DoveGlove 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I absolutely love The Rules. It is amazing -- and I think it reflects major themes that arise in this subreddit. It should be talked about more!

[–]XMATIC_4 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I know im late as fuck,but. The more a female appears feminine the more I love her. I guess its just programmed in our gene to seek more "feminine" things in females

[–]vintagegirlgame 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes www.therulesrevisited.com is a great girl game resource.

You can also follow me at www.pinterest.com/vintagegirlgame for tips and pics!

[–]MuffinPuff 11 points12 points  (5 children)

The effect doubles if you do this in a dress... Hell, just wearing a dress makes men act differently towards you.

[–]A-Promise[S] 4 points5 points  (4 children)

Do you think this makes a difference in general, or only if you wear a dress on certain occasion. I wear dresses and skirts every day because my job allows freedom of wardrobe choice and I feel more feminine in them, but on the rare occasion that I wear jeans, or yoga pants to the gym, I don't notice being treated any differently.

[–]ITRPer 2 points3 points  (3 children)

As for men,one of the most important rules is to be different from the crowd. When only a few girls wear a dress, it has a different effect than if everyone does it.

[–]vintagegirlgame 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Interesting because women always want to fit in with the crowd. I'd say the perfect sexual tension is in that balance between fitting in and standing out

[–]A-Promise[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

How would you propose one could achieve that balance?

[–]vintagegirlgame 0 points1 point  (0 children)

For a RPW, "fitting in" would be the equivalent of not being blatantly loud, obnoxious and attention seeking in your words, clothing and overall appearance. "Fit in" by building social skills and charm that allow you to be friendly with anyone, even BP men and women.

Stand out by showing consistent quality in the form of feminine style, graceful interactions and pleasant attitude. These qualities used to be the norm for women but now simply being femininity will make you stand out.

[–]TheLemming 11 points12 points  (1 child)

I love the RPW philosophy. But it sounds to me like you're pretty much just noticing the effects of being a patient and respectful person. Those are human virtues and are virtuous for a reason. Our culture has kind of deemphasized their importance, but it sounds like we still know enough to appreciate them when we see them :)

[–]A-Promise[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I had never considered RPW philosophy before I accidentally discovered t back then and revisited this week. Everything makes a lot of sense, virtues like kindness and valuing the contributions that others are proud of (overtly appreciating a man's masculinity) are seen as attractive, it makes sense. That's one thing that I noticed about a previous relationship that fits in with RPW ideas (I think). He was a great guy who had his faults but he would dwell on them sometimes and I considered it my job to remind him of all of his good qualities and make an effort to praise him for them. Before long he stopped getting down about himself as often and became really proud of his good qualities, and it sweetened our relationship because he knew that I appreciated him and noticed and celebrated his goodness. He became less insecure as a result of the self fulfilling prophecy that he was much more brilliant than his setbacks could set him back.

I agree with you that modern culture has deemphasized their values, college was a huge shock to me because there were people who made no effort to be pleasant to anyone and I still don't understand how this benefits them or anyone around them.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (5 children)

I didn't read this whole post, but as a man, I love femininity. Love it. Girls who are reserved, stylish, put effort into their appearance, and know how to act feminine are so much more attractive to me than loud, lazy with their attire, attention seeking, men-like women. Even if the latter is more physically attractive, the masculine energy coming from those types of women is a huge turn off.

[–]A-Promise[S] 2 points3 points  (4 children)

Thank you for your reply, and it is interesting that you should say that the latter group that you describe are more physically attractive. What is it about the first group that you find less attractive, or which part of the second archetype would you blend with a feminine persona to create a balanced ideal?

[–]vintagegirlgame 2 points3 points  (3 children)

I think he's saying hypothetically if there were 2 women, one feminine and one masculine in attitude, even if the masculine one was hotter he would prefer the feminine one because she is pleasant. So being feminine gives you an extra point or two on the overall scale.

[–]A-Promise[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I didn't quite grasp the phrasing, thank you for explaining.

[–]siegristrm 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Femininity makes women more attractive. Feminity is like beer goggles. You might be a 5 in a line up, but if you are feminine with the man you want (to include perceived weakness), you turn into a 9 in his eyes.

[–]shapb 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm not sure if what i am writing below can be contributed to femininity or the novelty effect that comes with travelling.

As a man who travelled through europe i noticed this phenomenon. 5/6's there would easily beat 8/9's at home because i felt that they were treating me as a human being. I brought this up with another guy i met on my travels and we both agreed that looks do not seem as important as they were back home. Girls were elegantly dressed, sweet, and classy (when it came to flirting, touching, teasing, etc). North americans were 'crude' and 'unrefined' in comparison.

I wonder if all this can be attributed to femininity alone.

[–][deleted]  (5 children)

[deleted]

[–]A-Promise[S] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Hi, thank you for your reply. That makes a lot of sense. How do I stop that from happening? So far I've grown up in a very bubble wrapped lifestyle where most people are kind and polite. College was a big shock for me. (I think in the past guys have taken advantage of my 'sweet temperament' but I've since stopped being such a doormat and now I require people who get close to me to treat me with respect as I show it to them or I terminate the relationship, but that is easier said than done.)

[–][deleted]  (3 children)

[deleted]

    [–]A-Promise[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

    you are most likely naive and inexperienced

    Absolutely, like you, it seems, I came from a very sheltered and traditional upbringing and the 'real world' was a massive shock. As you said, I had to rely on reading people's actions rather than listening to their words.

    What you say about appeasing other people at your own expense... what about sacrificial love? For example, with family, you go out of your way, to your detriment, to look after your dear ones. Do you think that this transfers in the context of a relationship?

    Thank you for the book recommendation, I have put it on my holiday reading list for this spring.

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]A-Promise[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      >If we're always the ones who put more in, then what happens when you need help from them? Do they step up or fail?

      I think that this might be the most important thing anyone has ever told me about balance in relationships so far. Thank you. Wow.

      [–]Nynx12 4 points5 points  (1 child)

      Sounds like we're looking for the same thing. I desperately want more resources on "girl game" as well. Men have a plethora of information at their fingertips, ranging from general ideas to detailed tips about female psychology, body language, etc. All too often I see girl game reduced to "don't be a bitch, feed him, give him sex" with people citing that men are simple creatures. Well, that's not enough for me! And I think it's a mistake to underestimate how "simple" men are. You could just as easily reduce guy game to "don't be a pushover, display masculinity, demonstrate status" but, as we know, it is far more complex than that.

      I'll continue scouring TRP/RPW/the internet in general for odd tips here and there (thanks for the one you shared in this post) and let you know if I come across something more comprehensive!

      [–]A-Promise[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      It would be nice if there was a playbook, wouldn't it? (I've read 'The Game' and to be honest wasn't that impressed by it, but found it amusing to be able to identify the source of some of the material that men would approach me with.)

      If you find anything interesting, then please do share! Thank you!

      [–]johnnight1 Star 5 points6 points  (6 children)

      Congratulations. When the sabre-toothed tigers attack, that other loudmouthed bitch will get eaten while you will get protected by the alpha males of the group.

      My theory is that male-to-female 'romantic love' is a mixture of parental protective love and sexual attraction.

      That also means that in a world where women have the same strength and body size as men, this love would not exist. Women would be able to defend themselves equally good as men, so there would be no need for a protection instinct. We would still have sexual attraction, but it would lack the emotional part.

      [–]A-Promise[S] 3 points4 points  (5 children)

      Thank you for your insight. Is that to say, that the emotional component of romantic love is based largely, in your theory, upon the instinct to protect, which is why men, who are socialised to be protectors and providers, do not fall in (lasting) love with women who can do it all themselves and 'don't need no man'?

      I would ask, then, what about the men in the world who don't have this instinct? One thing that shocked me when I went to college were the number of men who dated (nice) girls I knew who really couldn't care less about them more deeply than a sexual relationship.

      What, in your opinion, is needed, surplus to evoking a protective instinct, to create love which encompasses commitment?

      [–]johnnight1 Star 1 point2 points  (1 child)

      My speculation is that men in college have zero ability to provide, so they don't. Furthermore, college is a fake temporary environment. Everybody knows that their lives will be reset at the end of this period.

      So the dating is not serious, because everything, including personal relationships, will be upended soon. Women in college behave the same with guys, which is often a topic on TRP.*

      Single serving college friends, single serving dates. They will be gone soon, so why invest emotionally in them?

      .* That one case where the guy had a high school girlfriend and they went to different colleges. She separated from him with the her expectation that they will date other people in college but they are reserving each other to marry after the college. Predictably, they guy found himself a new fiancee, for whom he was providing and they were even buying a house (he either worked through college or didn't go to college.) His ex was outraged that he did not keep the end of the bargain (she did not leave him a choice). One thing that is certain is that men HATE to be the financial backup guy, when the woman goes off to fuck other multiple men. This does more that negate emotional investment. It creates anti-investment, pure hate.

      What I am trying to say is that college being a temporary place suspends commitment on both sides.

      [–]A-Promise[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Men in college have zero ability to provide, so they don't.

      Many people are either working throughout college or already financially set, as well as set in terms of job prospects, so have a stable view of their future. In terms of providing emotionally and in terms of time, students have a large amount of free time, would this not be an ideal time to find a LTR partner, if that is what you're looking for?

      Everybody knows that their lives will be reset at the end of this period

      Do you think that that is an American thing? Most of my married friends met at college.

      With regard to the story you are referencing, it is beyond dumb to expect anyone to wait around for you after you dump them and break your commitment to them. I hope that the gentleman in question did not find himself scarred from his experience.

      [–][deleted]  (2 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]A-Promise[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

        'Don't need no man'? It's colloquial, and doesn't make grammatical or practical sense. Were I a man, I would be pretty upset if the woman I was with said that she didn't need me!

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Men here, passed by to see what RP women actually discuss. Anyways, we all hate loud bitches that has no respect and tries to be bigger and dominant. We hate that. This girl was probably annoying to him and he probably couldn't take her seriously anyways. by staying calm I see in girls that she's 1 : not a total whore that get mads for no reason and two you looks more feminine. Girls aren't loud and dominant. We respect that.

        peace.

        [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)