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One thing I keep having to relearn is to *watch what she does, not what she says*. [FR] about ignoring what she says, give her what she really wants.

This video really hit me, it's funny, but it's actually tragic. I saw into the dark things that AWAL this last weekend. Vid is well worth the two minute watch, even if you don't continue reading.

I've been trying become a better Family Alpha™ and leading my family towards the direction of my vision. Most of this process has been improving, lifting, reading, and doing me. I hate how long it is taking while simealtaneously knowing that I'll never reach the end, so I'm in this state of embracing the suck while attempting to enjoy the ride.

I've been trying to bring the family along to get outdoors more often (embracing the suck that I can't afford an extravagant vacation, while truly enjoying the experience of hiking for free). Last week there was an opportunity with perfect weather, and we had a Sunday free, so I told her a few days before, "Keep Sunday free and we'll go hike the Creek Trail as a family."

She replies that she's not sure if she can, she has stuff to do. translation: "I'm really not attracted enough to hang out with you Sunday, you haven't reminded me today that you are the prize"

I say, "Too bad for you!" smack her butt and walk away.

An hour later she says, "What time on Sunday are we going hiking?" translation: "I'm a little moist from my recent interaction with you, and want to see if you are truly the prepared and determined leader that I may be attracted to."

"I will leave the house by 10am sharp, I'd like the whole family to be in the car by then. I will get the kids and their food ready." At this point I thought I had won, and we would all enjoy a great time.

The night before the hike she tests me with, "I really want to sleep in tomorrow, so I'd like to leave around noon." translation: "I know you think that you are a strong alpha tiger and I'm allowing you to have a little fun, but remember who holds the leash here."

At this point I'm thinking, you bitch, you just have to tweak something to get the final word. Luckily it was just for a secong and I try to return to OI zen. "Not gonna work babe, I want to get to the top and back in time for us to grab some dinner, and then we're gonna go to the movie at 5pm. We can't leave any later. I'm leaving at 10 with the kids. I'd love to have you come." A little 5 second kiss and I'm gone. This is subtle, but 6 months ago I'd change my plans completely if it meant I was getting a shred of what I wanted. For me this is a huge improvement in my OI.

Day of the hike she was in the car by 9:55am (would have never happened 6 months ago, watch her actions), and excited to leave, even helped get kids ready before I knew. translation: "I respect you as leader, and trust your vision so I want to do what you want"

Again, I thought I was done with shit tests. We are driving and she asks why we are going a different way. The trail has many starting points, I had chosen a simpler one since we had kids with us, told her simply that we are starting from the south. Then comfort test: "I don't want to go that way. I like the other way." (use of I). translation: "I am afraid of the world, and I'm not sure you are able to protect me or my offspring." All that improvement is now out the window, I thought I went from Alpha Motherfucker to Asshole who doesn't care about his wife's comfort! The unknown is terrifying to her, and fear seems to dominate a lot of her mental process. I should know better, as a beta pussy, how could I dare push her to be challenged. I admit I almost didn't make it, but I attempted to treat her as the oldest teenage daughter. She doesn't know, and I do, and so I didn't back down.

I said "I know this is the better way, and we are going to go this way, even if you don't want to." Satisfied with this response I forgot to STFU, and let leak, "I hand picked this was for the kids. My decision for the safety of the kids comes before your preference." Big mistake, DEERing. I notice it immediately, tell myself I'm a fucking idiot, and STFU. Still an improvement for me. She is upset, and fidgeting to show it. I would have caved in at this right away, I just want to get along. It's at this point, when she's upset when I start to think there is no way we can have a good time now. That isn't true though, I can still have a good time, and I start to tell myself that. I can enjoy my time, she can choose not to, but it won't affect me. (I'm repeating this in my head, faking it to make it.)

I push hard to STFU, and we pull into the trailhead before I have a chance fuck it up.

The gate is closed. Now I might fuck it up. She says, "Well looks like this place isn't as good as you thought? Didn't you say you researched it?" I didn't say that, although I did research it. translation: "You may have hid it well, but deep down you are a pathetic beta bux faggot, and you are MY beta bux, now say it! Say it in front of me and the kids."

I was bummed, I won't lie, but stayed with STFU, got out to inspect the gate, and realized it just blew closed by the wind, it wasn't locked and there were other cars in there. I opened it, and placed a rock to keep it open. I had to stop myself from doing an "I told you so, see I'm a big boy mommy" routine, but I just got back in the car and parked it, just saying, "Man it's perfect weather today for this."

Her last ditch effort as we started walking was a shit test, "Well, this place you picked looks way shittier that the other one." translation: I'm starting to feel some tingles, are the legit or not?

I told her I didn't notice because she was in front and I like the pants she wore and the way it shows off her ass.

She acts mad "Quiet! There's other people here" translation: "Louder! Let them all hear."

As we almost made it to the top she couldn't stop saying how much she liked this trailhead better, how it a better for the kids but so much more pretty. A couple of times she said she was glad our kids are learning to enjoy outdoors. She had an amazing time, and honestly the kids just seemed to enjoy it because we were enjoying it. Afterwards at dinner she kept grabbing my leg and telling me how it was one of the best family days ever. We never made the movie because the kids were tired, and so we went home and I pounder her into the bed instead.

Still today she keeps bringing up what a great time she had, and how nice it was. The same trip that she doubted every step of the way, the same trip that she could barely be bothered to come on.

I LEARNED A LOT ON SUNDAY

  • This is a sexual strategy, but there are excellent side-effects that come from all of the changes required, and all of life is affected.
  • Wife is relentless at trying to tame me, get me to doubt myself, get me to admit that I am a beta.
  • Maybe AWALT, but she has the right to reserve her pussy and/or company to only the best man, I truly wouldn't want to be with a woman who lowers her standards (but my life would be easier).
  • All the way into the start of the activity she never said anything to reassure me that she was enjoying herself. And I desperately wanted that validation! I almost caved several times.
  • Shit tests and Comfort tests are foreplay, I should look forward to them instead of avoiding them or being upset by them. My wifes panties are soaked with my Shit Test defenses.
  • She will never love me the way I want her to. I want her to be quiet and believe me and never doubt me. She actually is usually quiet or and submissive most of the time, but never when I want. And when she is a sex denying shit testing harpy it is only an indicator to me that I'm failing at Dread Levels 1-5. She is a mirror that I can see how well I'm leading in.
  • Even when she gets all pissy I can still have a good time. And when maintaining frame she will usually become less pissy and have a good time after a while.
  • I'm glad I didn't give up. I still have a way to go as far as getting rid of the dad-bod. I started to get more sex, and almost relaxed a bit on the lifting and dieting. I'm so glad I didn't.
  • I'm glad I didn't give in. My beta training was screaming out that I am fucking up and being a prick and all kinds of stuff. STFU goes for my schizo-beta voices too, just gotta keep telling my self STFU.
  • She's counting on me to translate and appropriately deal with her shit. This is big, SHES COUNTING ON ME, she has no interest or reason for trying to prove that I'm attractive to her! That's my job.
  • This was a small victory, I need to continue to improve a LOT before I can start to acheive a big victory like her begging for my cock in her ass while I eat a pizza on the beach in Hawaii. I've set my sights on that kind of marriage, but it's on me to be as Brad Pitt/Ryan Gosling/Jake McDorman smvwise.
  • My wife doesn't know what she wants as well as I do. I cringe at saying that, but I think it's true. My wife thinks she wants me to be a domesticated tiger, friendly and cuddly, but that's not what she wants even if she doesn't know it.
  • "I told you so" routines are a display of low value.

Deep down she wants to be hunted by a wild tiger, but all she will ever do is try to tame you. Don't let it happen.

Update: Thanks for the encouragement. I have realized through reading it and my own comments that I'm balls deep in her frame, and have learned that I need to reconstruct a strong, personal, masculine frame that doesn't need validation in order to maintain integrity. Thanks /u/redneck001 /u/redpilldad /u/spexer /u/scurvemuch and /u/reddreadwolverine for illuminating that. If I'm going to be honest though, I really found out how important validation is to me with the positive comments on this thread, and how much I eat that shit up. I am on the tit of your guys' approval, and I am getting off it today. Seriously, thanks men.


[–]Blackthorn8 16 points16 points [recovered] | Copy Link

This is a strong FR due to its detailed nature and your internal dialogue. Your humility is serving you well. I learned a lot in your summation. This game doesn't come naturally to most. This FR illustrates why this is such a bitter pill. Most of the strategies go against so many of the natural (bad) beta habits we develop over time. Keep leading your family, the rest is on its way.

[–]TimeNdevotion0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Keep leading your family, the rest is on its way.

AMEN!

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Thanks. To be honest it is the hardest part. Being willing to lead, even if in a corny way, like having a family vision, and "raising" your wife and kids into adults. Sometimes I feel like I deserve a break, but I know I don't.

[–]Boesman12Unplugging5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I would have caved in at this right away, I just want to get along.

Isn't this the beginning of our betadom. We as men are programmed to take the path of least resistance because we know that is the shortest route. Because logic.

But with woman we must resist the urge and show that we will lead her to take our route because its the best for our family.

Well thought out FR. Food for thought.

[–]Griever1141 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Isn't this the beginning of our betadom. We as men are programmed to take the path of least resistance because we know that is the shortest route. Because logic. But with woman we must resist the urge and show that we will lead her to take our route because its the best for our family. Well thought out FR. Food for thought.

Ah logic, its our greatest strength but women know this and helped manipulate it into our greatest flaw.

[–]cj_aubreyMRP APPROVED0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Isn't this the beginning of our betadom.

Agreed. To offer deference in exchange for future social acceptance, I believe this is the essence of betadom.

[–]Riding_Officer_CCI2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Awesome FR chap- the deconstruction of her behaviour and your reactions are really useful, beecauuuuse... AWALT.

The phrase I've been using more and more when tested, rather than DEER, and as development of STFU, is... grin "I got this." Of course for that to work, one has to *show that shit has indeed been got.

Yes, it means I'm still setting out the boys kit for nursery tomorrow, tidying the kitchen or sorting something around the house while she relaxes, after a shorter day than mine in a much easier (but much better paid) job- but I'm the Captain, and I set the example. It's not about 'fair.'

I've noticed that imposing my will I the world and handling shit is a virtuous cycle, which brings a smidgen more inner confidence each day.

tl:dr - favourite FR

[–]rpnow[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Thank you. "I got this" is great, I'll start working that in more!

[–]BluepillProfessorMarried-MRP MODERATOR6 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

you bitch, you just have to tweak something to get the final word.

This stood out. Reminds me of something I read a while ago. Something in Genesis.

Wife is relentless at trying to tame me, get me to doubt myself, get me to admit that I am a beta.

Pisses me off as well. Until all of human history until 1960 the solution was to turn her over your knee.

she never said anything to reassure me that she was enjoying herself.

Again, dancing monkeys, all your fault, you must lead, she gets to give you shit nonstop. Pisses me off.

Deep down she wants to be hunted by a wild tiger, but all she will ever do is try to tame you. Don't let it happen.

It is not very deep.

[–]Chinchilla_the_HunMarried1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You pretty much said everything I was going to as I was getting upset for /u/rpnow just reading this (in the same way you feel terrible for a character in a movie who keeps doing cringe-worthy things). That, and it was a reminder of how persistent women are with their shit-tests...akin to a child's insatiable desire for play and games.

Frustrations aside, my pat-on-the-back to OP along with everyone else for a great FR and for maintaining frame well. The inner voice lines highlight the need for the RP community to crowdsource a "Shit-to-English Translation" dictionary.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Ha yes, Genesis. After finishing your book I realize more and more that man is held responsible for the fall of man, even if the woman grabbed the fruit. No way to escape it. Pisses me off too.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

No matter what naysayers may come, lurve, lurve, lurve ( as the kids say) this FR dude!

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

Maybe I am projecting. Maybe not.

She had a great experience at the cost of your hard work, and you managing her pissy actions and mood.

So are you the prize?

And what did she do to add value to your life?

The other question that stands out for me - What behavior are you rewarding with these types of interactions?

food for thought.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Great point. I am hoping that out there on the horizon somewhere that she will be able to forget about my past beta self, or at least it will be so hazy that her reality is being married to a family alpha, and so then things will happen a little easier and more natural?

I know that I'll never stop dealing with tests and proving myself, but I get the sense that since this is all new to her, and still only makes up 5% or less of our time together that she's just waiting for me to go back to the old beta me. So I think I did an allright job of proving to HER that I'm the prize, but I do agree that in order to do that, being the prize in my own eyes probably did degrade a little bit.

I hope that one day when I can convince her a little more that I am a little I can start to do some of the pavlovian stuff. But point taken, I will focus on believing that I am the prize internally more.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

She.... Her... proving to her....

yea.

create your frame.

its that time of the month

[–]rpnow[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You nailed it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (11 children) | Copy Link

I like your questions... but i guess i'm still a little lost as i've just found the pill more recently... his story above wasn't about her adding value to his life. She had the choice to either get in or get out. Does an alpha look for a women to add value? help me out here.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

forget alpha or beta or omega or whatever for a second.

The idea is you should add value to the relationships in your life, and those people in your life should do the same.

My point is while everyone is congratulating the guy for a good job of not fucking up, I am pointing out the next series of questions he should be asking himself.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

okay okay... soooo.... because i'm learning... and no where in marriedredpill do i see much about this, but how does a wife that you don't seek validation from give value?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

and no where in marriedredpill do i see much about this, but how does a wife that you don't seek validation from give value

Depends on the beholder.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

yeah, i'm kind of having a hard time with this one. I can DO everything and have outlets for all social things where my wife isn't needed. A dog would be a better companion than a wife. Sex and child bearing seem to be their only worth in my life. I am married.... i just found redpillmarried and trying to digest it all. I find myself not seeing any worth, and more my wife being a burden. She is a great person, incredibly honest and loyal, thoughtful and compassionate, empathetic and caring. But..... when it comes to it, she is just not needed though.. anyways just blabbing out some thoughts.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

I'm going to be trying to internalize this I also think WISNIFG and many comments on posts around here deal with seeking validation a lot. I just read one, but can't find it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It was probably my post :) thanks for the link....

[–]RPMavMarried0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Interesting conversation, companionship, child-rearing, cooking, cleaning, sex, perspective... the point is that she shouldn't be dead weight, along for the ride, testing and complaining and challenging the whole way. She, and all the people you invest your time in, should contribute positively to your life.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I love hanging out with my wife. Despite our flaws, she's a trip to hang out with. We enjoy many of the same activities, and I enjoy doing them with her.

If I maintain frame, we have a great time (nearly every time). When I get my panties in a wad over something too-stupid-to-remember or she tests/flips, we both have a crappy time.

She has enormous value, but not for validation.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is it, always improving. The more I know, the more I know I need to know.

[–]rpnow[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Having her along did add value in the end, but was it truly worth all the turmoil? I'm not sure.

But the mistakes I'm still making are that I've built a small weak frame, that is ultimately still inside of hers. Now I have to move from the "fake it to make it" to the genuine natural make it part, the actual unplugging part...

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Does an alpha look for a women to add value?

TRP looks at male behaviour as Alpha, MRP is a combination of Alpha and Beta.

Because we are in LTR's/marriages, we stay with our significant others because they "add value" to our lives.

If there were no value being added to our lives by our SO's, what would be the point in staying in the relationship?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

How did she add value? They did have sex right? Lol. A little cheerfulness in this process will not go amiss.

[–]Redneck001MRP APPROVED1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Ha! I liked your FR.

My only.advice is don't overthink. Sometimes (well, most times) people choose the easiest path. Which means, most people will sleep late vs ... something else.

Don't fall into the trap where you're killing flies with a newfound hammer.

Great leadership, though. I enjoyed reading that.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

I've been struggling to find a balance to be honest. As a recovering Career Beta, I truly don't know what Alpha looks like; my model being Bruce Willis movies leaves me a little ignorant. Thanks though, hoping that eventually I can react naturally without having to analyse so much.

[–]RedPillDadMarried- TRP APPROVED0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

Analyzing her every move puts you into her frame instead of yours. Seems you've been attending to her frame and she has long profited from that. You can inadvertantly foster weakness by doting on her. And like a spoiled child, the cycle can be challenging to break.

Stop focusing on her and lead yourself instead. Your family will be more inclined to align when you're on a winning path.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, realizing that more an more. Late in the game to find out my frame is no good, gonna take some work.

[–]RedPillDadMarried- TRP APPROVED1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Never too late. Attending to the shittier frame squanders leadership. For my wife and I, it was over-attending to the kids, especially our learning disabled one. There's a big difference between minimizing losses and winning. It's the difference of focusing on opportunities instead of endless shitty-ass problems... Be an opportunity guy leading your team to wins. Hope that helps.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It does, thanks.

[–]spexerMRP APPROVED1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Great FR.

She will never love me the way I want her to... ... She is a mirror that I can see how well I'm leading in.

this is so very true. A great indicator.

and you also set up a new goal for us all to strive for:

I need to continue to improve a LOT before I can start to acheive a big victory like her begging for my cock in her ass while I eat a pizza on the beach in Hawaii.

[–]iamrsj1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

good post

[–]FearDearg2015Married- MRP MODERATOR0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Great FR. Upvoted.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Very useful.

Thanks.

Notice that AWALT were not reasons to be a dick, but to show virtue in the face of her pissiness. Leadership if you will.

I was always told men desire domestic tranquility. Bullshit. My grandfather always told me to marry a strong willed woman, because it was a challenge. At the time I never understood, and now I can see what he is saying, I am not sure this is what he meant.

Good report.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes! I am learning this more and more. The things that aggravate me are actually challenging me to become a better man. I hate it, but am at least learning from it.

[–]donerkebabpleaseUnplugging0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Great FR. I learned from it. The translations are an eye-opener, I need to get better at this.

translation: "I know you think that you are a strong alpha tiger and I'm allowing you to have a little fun, but remember who holds the leash here."

Here here!

Thank you for this reminder:

Wife is relentless at trying to tame me, get me to doubt myself, get me to admit that I am a beta.

[–]crazycattime0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

This was awesome, thank you.

[–]maxofreddit0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

1 - I just realized having a translator in my ear like this would make my life a shit-ton easier

2 - One of my biggest challenges is the "I told you so" thing. Even though I think I'm being playful, I see more and more that I'm seeking her validation, just like you said. I (& she, funny enough) want it so I DON'T need her validation/good job/pat on the head.

It's never over. But what fun would that be, right?

[–]RedDreadWolverineRed Christian0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Do you spend a lot of time putting that much focus on her? I pay my wife very little mind unless I'm paying attention to decipher a reoccuring problem or she's doing stuff I like. I try to focus on my own game otherwise.

I'm not criticizing I just find that wife analysis is often fruitless unless it's to troubleshoot something reoccurring.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah /u/scurvemuch pointed out as well that I'm still alot in her frame by trying so hard to ensure she has a good time, which I need to work on. The other part though is that I'm just discovering these things about my wife, and it really is unlearning the blue pill and starting to swallow the red. I think as it starts to dissolve I will be no longer analysing and just doing me.

But it really has been like an expirement, see what works, what doesn't, so these are like an explorers findings in the uncharted new red territory.

[–]RedDreadWolverineRed Christian1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Doxxed, fired, been busy starting my own business and doing damage control professionally. Putting some podcasts in the can as well as videos for a YouTube thing. That's way in the future. I've learned to let my content sit for a while and revise it before publishing. In regard to your wife analysis just remember AWALT and if you want to hunt a deer don't ask the deer but the Hunter. You can analyze but be wary of seeking clarification of her nonsense. And don't study her so closely that you're not in the moment.

[–]pingpongsam0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Best thing I've read on this sub in a couple months. Excellent FR. Superb material and excellent writing of it.

I especially liked how you avoided the I told you so at the gate.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

I really love this story..... thank you. I'm still trying to cure myself of seeking validation and this was a great use case to show how things can go when seeking validation is left to the wind. I'm always asking my wife for permission.... I've been doing better, but damn.. i'm still such a fucking bitch... anyways. keep posting... i like to read these it helps.

[–]rpnow[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

For me I really had to see proof that leading unapolagetically is what she wants. My whole life I've been taught the opposite.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Totally right!!! Been taught to be everything but stoic and confident. To be sheep and afraid.... I have two sons and i'll be damned if i'm going to let anyone squash their confidence and their self respect.

Relearning our perspective that we've been taught our entire lives is turning out to be difficult, lots of stumbling along the way. But progress isn't without falling down! Good luck on the future and keep posting!

[–]JDRoedellMRP APPROVED0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Very nice. I'll take some of your "findings" with me this weekend as my family goes on a road trip to her parents' house. Historically this trip has sometimes brought out shitty behavior from her. Should be a good time for me to put some of this into practice and fight my beta urges to argue and DEER.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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