TheRedArchive

~ archived since 2018 ~

19

On the breakaway thread on r/PurplePillDebate, I saw the complaint that TRP is engaging in 'beta solipsism' regarding what women want. They said that TRP is likely 'building a better Beta' which (among other complaints) was not in line with female sexual strategy.

My question is; why is a beta in this context a bad thing? (Beta Fucks, not Beta Bucks, naturally.) If AF is a man who is likely to plate or pump and dump you, and wild Alphas are just plain psychopathic, then surely either BF or Alpha Bucks are the ideal SOs/husbands? If Hypergamy desires a high value masculine man with many options to commit to her, is not BF better sexual strategy than AF, despite your visceral attraction to AF? Though not as wealthy or high status as ABs, BFs differ from BBs in that they actually are attractive, masculine (typically in a rakish manner,) seductive, and good in bed. In which case, what is the difference between BF and the apparently loathed build-a-better-beta?

Thanks for your time.


[–][deleted] 11 points11 points | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Xemnas81[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Thanks for responding. Again, what is the difference between high beta, beta fucks, and build-a-better -beta?

[–]Camille113255 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

  • High Beta = Greater Beta. Good mix of alpha and beta traits, knows how to lead a relationship and command respect but also gives enough comfort for a woman to feel secure.

  • Beta Fucks = Used when people discuss mating strategies such as AF/BB. To me, Beta Fucks is the same as Greater Beta, however the emphasis here is on his ability to arouse the woman and earn her respect. There is also AB (alpha bucks) which is the other type of man that RPWs either pursue or are currently with. These are alphas who also have some provider traits, but they are nothing like Greater Betas.

  • Build a Better Beta - I don't remember reading that phrase but I do know that a lot of the men on the RP subreddit conflate "alpha" with good, and "beta" with bad. In reality, there are good and bad alpha traits, and good and bad beta traits. The type of guy that a lot of them describe as beta is really an omega. A lot of the advice and tips on how to become an alpha are really about becoming a Greater Beta. They are improving themselves by adopting positive alpha and positive beta traits, while removing their negative beta and omega triats. This is perfectly fine but there is an aversion to the "beta" label. I have no idea if this is what that term is referring to so someone please correct me if I am wrong!

[–]fire-fly30, single1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I do know that a lot of the men on the RP subreddit conflate "alpha" with good, and "beta" with bad. In reality, there are good and bad alpha traits, and good and bad beta traits. The type of guy that a lot of them describe as beta is really an omega. A lot of the advice and tips on how to become an alpha are really about becoming a Greater Beta.

It would clear things up a lot for everyone if that was widely understood..

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

why is a beta in this context a bad thing?

its not, you misunderstood

my objection is intellectual. they ascribe beta thinking to actual alphas. THAT is the beta solipsism

i have no objection to beta fux, beta fux is the best husband on earth, both for himself and for the woman

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

/u/Camille11325 wrote a wonderful post that talks about a man's personality in terms of dominance, a woman's default dominance and her dominance threshold. I think it's a much more useful system to refer to when trying to determine whether a particular type of man and woman are a good match for each other.

I can't find a link to it right now, but hopefully she will be reposting it in the near future.

A beta bucks for example, isn't a bad fit because he sounds like a low dominance man - so if he is with a low dominance woman, that has a low dominance threshold - then he will be able to maintain her interest and attraction and she won't try to rule over him.

Like I said, it's a wonderful post and I believe she intends to re-submit it to this sub.

[–]Camille1132510 points11 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Yes it will be on the wiki under the Essential Guides section! Once all of the guides are up I will make an announcement so that everyone can take a look. Also part 2 of the series is coming as soon as everyone gets settled in our new home :)

[–]PixieDelightsMid 30s | Married 8 years | total 124 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Part one was great. Thank you for writing it up! I can hardly wait until part two.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Great news all around. Sorry if I butchered your terms etc in my drive by explanation haha. :0)

[–]Littleknownfacts1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm looking forward to it!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

yayyy looking forward to part 2!

[–]Xemnas81[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I look forward to reading it! I'll admit I'm mostly going off terminology provided by Rollo and Roissy here

[–]lazysnakes40 | married 3 yrs | tog 115 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Perhaps I'm getting too hung up on terminology here, but my understanding was that AF/BB was a description of the basic female mating strategy i.e. you will grab the alpha for his genetics but lock down the beta for security. As such I didn't think there is such as thing as BF or AB in pure redpill theory. However in reality the alpha/beta thing is a continuum and yes women will ideally look for someone who combines the best of both worlds for her. Your strategy is still the same though. It is your inherent nature to 'betaize' a man once you get him, both to test him and to make him less attractive to other women, however that reduces your attraction to him and hypergamy kicks in. He has to stay in control by demonstrating enough alpha qualities.

what is the difference between BF and the apparently loathed build-a-better-beta?

I didn't read the original thread but I guess this is something to do with people not liking someone who is 'faking it til they make it', especially women, who want men to 'just get it' when it comes to seduction and relationships.

[–]BeautifulSpaceCadet 5 points5 points [recovered] | Copy Link

I think this post will be easier to flesh out once we have Camille's awesome post to refer to in RPW terms as opposed to TRP ones...but I would draw the analogy between the build-a-better-beta and the reformed slut. Warning, I may be all over the place with this post trying to reconcile the differing terminologies.

RP wisdom cautions against the reformed slut because it's likely been constructed inauthentically as she nears the wall. The hands down best definition I've ever heard for 'the wall' is (and ironically I'm likely about to butcher it) "the moment when a woman's looks are no longer a sufficient vehicle to help her acquire what she desires". It's not some moment where you are suddenly hideous, it's a moment when it's no longer accomplishing the same things it used to and now you have to scramble to make do with what you have while you still have it. Therefore "the wall" and its impact on individual women is extremely variable based on the woman's wants and goals. A woman who has used her looks to sweet talk her way into clubs and onto alpha dicks is going to hit the wall at a trillion miles per hour, whereas a loving housewife will likely just bump along with it.

I digress, but using the above example, you can see why a reformed slut is not ideal. It's likely either a thin facade, a total sham, or something she has even deluded herself into believing. In all cases, the positive changes it has brung isn't the rock of a foundation you would want for an LTR. The exception I would pose to this, is if the woman (as many RPW have done) takes a significant period of time to rebuilding her own personal foundation through introspection and self-improvement, and is now offering a completely different product than she previously was. This plan is not foolproof, but it's better for her, and less risk to the prospective LTR.

Getting back to the crux of your inquiry; from a female's sexual strategy perspective (I have no idea why the build-a-better-beta is loathed by males), I would cite the above point I made: the woman may be buying a product that will fall apart at the first sign of trouble, likely in the form of shit tests. Unless he has put in some serious improvements into the foundations of his being, your BaBB may just be a big fat BB anyway. Tingles decimated.

A true BetaFux, which I will now refer to as a Higher Beta as opposed to a Lesser Alpha, is desirable. This will be a man who is naturally dominant but has enough comfort traits to make a quality LTR candidate that would also want to be an LTR candidate (as opposed to a wild stallion AF who would likely resent the situation if he even found himself in it at all). Even a Lesser Alpha may possess enough comfort traits if he finds himself wanting to settle down. So these two men (higher beta/lesser alpha) are pretty solid selections if you are a quality enough woman to secure the commitment of one.

Now my whole response seems to crumble at the part where you say "What are you getting at BSC? A slut should just resign herself to the CC and never strive for self-improvement? A BB should never try to improve himself and become a more desirable partner?" No. I'm not. It's the difference between throwing away a broken smart phone or refurbishing it. Ultimately we would all prefer a brand new phone, but refurbishing is better than trashing, though many of the refurbished phones will ultimately crap out anyway and have you wishing you had just found an undamaged one to begin with.


God, hope I did alright pulling all that together. EC's, please chime in if I egregiously butchered something.

[–]fire-fly30, single0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Very well put! That makes total sense.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

© TheRedArchive 2024. All rights reserved.
created by /u/dream-hunter