Could we say that men’s obsession with “n count” is not based on “studies about promiscuous women” but their own egos.

qwertyuiop111222 · 2019-06-02T17:05:29+00:00

Here's one theory that just came to mind; would be curious to see what others think of it.

Disclaimer: Not saying this is what should happen, as much as this is what might be happening in a majority of cases.

In the dating market, men are weakly assessed on numerous traits; women are harshly assessed on very few traits

So in an equivalent dating market with an equal proportion of available men & women, men are assessed on looks, physical strength/ size, confidence, ability to make money, character, sense of humor, social skills, self-discipline and ability to hold a job, etc etc. But if you're weak in some, you can make up for it with strengths in others. Which is why the articulate but nerdy beanpole, and the stupid but charismatic musician can both do well in the dating market.

On the other hand, women are harshly assessed almost always on youth (or looks) and loyalty. Apart from these two traits, most men will overlook issues in women such as lack of confidence, poor money-making abilities, limited sense of humor, etc etc. You'd be hard-pressed to find a dating market where good looks and low n-count are considered irrelevant.

Looks are easy to assess immediately, but future loyalty cannot be assessed. So n-count becomes a weak proxy for the ability to be loyal. So men fixate on that.

Salty-Bastard · 2019-06-02T17:12:06+00:00

Absolutely, all sex and relationships are based on ego. I've been with women who've had very little experience (no virgins that I know of) to pass around biker sluts and everywhere in between.

Personally its my value and the value of the person I'm with that matters. Would I wife up a slut from a biker gang? Nope, I'm more valuable than that. Would I wife up a 30 year old that slept with 10 guys? I don't see a problem with that.

And men absolutely want the highest value woman they can get for an ltr/marriage. They want to be proud of their woman and they want their woman to be proud of them. They don't want to say "that's my girl" and have his buddies say "that's been everybody's girl".

Shadow_Of_ · 2019-06-02T16:14:00+00:00

I seriously doubt a virgin rape victim would be super eager to have sex again.

geyges · 2019-06-02T16:19:45+00:00

You never addressed u/MercedesBenzoAMG question.

There's a certain symmetry to virginity concept. In that virgin women are put on a pedestal by men, but virgin men are "losers" according to most women.

If virginity doesn't matter to women, and it doesn't exist outside male ego, then why do so many women care about it.

GridReXX · 2019-06-02T16:11:35+00:00

I will readily admit that my "low or no" n-count preference is based on ego.

But aren't all dating preferences based on ego?

Especially in a comfortable western democracy where survival is no longer at stake?

Please, name a dating preference in these comfortable circumstances that is not based on ego.

sadomasochrist · 2019-06-02T16:50:46+00:00

When people talk about solipcism on here, they're talking about a post like this. Of course this is a male issue, just like worrying about being raped is a female issue.

What exactly is your point?

It doesn't mean that it isn't important.

This is some insane mental gymnastics.

concacanca · 2019-06-02T16:14:13+00:00

It’s not “men’s obsession”. Most men have a healthy concern for women that have been with an unusually high amount of men, but otherwise, don’t really worry all too much about n-count.

ColCrin · 2019-06-02T16:13:37+00:00

There are some studies though.

https://ifstudies.org/ifs-admin/resources/table1nick-1-w640.png

[deleted] · 2019-06-02T16:29:56+00:00

I mostly don’t care but I can’t tell how much of an outlier I am, or maybe the pills subs cater mostly to low value, insecure men.

When sex is no holy grail and low quality sex is pretty easy to get, there’s no need to obsess about it. It’s just like ordering fast food, it’s crappy and why would anyone write essays about it?

The cognitive dissonance pisses me off since I was a kid, though. They want women to have more sex, then they want women to have less sex too.

EsauTheRed · 2019-06-02T18:08:01+00:00

Obsession with n count is due to deep rooted fear of paternity fraud

Blonsomio · 2019-06-02T16:17:16+00:00

A virgin rape victim: She’s “ruined.” From what exactly?

Chances are she will be damaged. Her sex life might suffer because of the trauma, she might have some sort of PTSD, she might develop depression, she might have problems dealing with men in general etc

It's sad, but I think men should avoid damaged women.

Daffan · 2019-06-02T16:50:34+00:00

I was reading this thread from a prior OP and it more clearly than ever highlighted that “virginity” is wholly a male conception.

https://i.imgur.com/PbGCVmn.png?1

TheJim66 · 2019-06-02T17:58:10+00:00

We think sluts are disgusting.Like it's a deep rooted visceral disgust towards investing emotionally on a slut.We want to LTR a woman our children wouldn't be embarrassed to call a mother.The fact that the studies and logic seem to support that feeling is a happy coincidence.

The rape victim is "ruined" because such a traumatic experience probably left her with some serious baggage and issues.

Also most men don't require a pure white virgin(but it would be nice).Just try not to fuck a whole army (my personal upper limit is 20 but it may vary from man to man)

FlavFal · 2019-06-02T17:15:46+00:00

Not only a male thing, some (not many) women have this desire for "purity".

87AudreyHorne · 2019-06-02T17:53:23+00:00

For me although Im a girl, of course its about ego. But so what, i want to date people who completely satisfy and inflate my ego because that is enjoyable. what's wrong with that?

Infinite_L · 2019-06-02T17:19:01+00:00

In my opinion, it is because of society's view of male and sexuality.

Having sex with men = dirty and having sex with women = not dirty.

A woman who has sex with many men is gross to some men because having sex with men "stains" her.

A man who has sex with many women is benign (or a positive) to most women because having sex with a woman is neutral (or does not stain them).

But if you flip the scenarios, how many straight women would be okay if their boyfriend told them that they had slept with lots men in the past vs the number of straight men would be okay if their girlfriend admitted to sleeping with lots women in the past.

I am willing to bet that more men wouldn't mind if their girlfriend has a high female n count than women who wouldn't mind if they discovered that their boyfriend has a high male n count.

It boils down to female sexuality is pure and male sexuality is impure.

SerpentCypher · 2019-06-02T16:54:34+00:00

Here's a question, why is N-count the only dating preferance most women seem to have a problem with? Everyone on this planet has standards for who they will/will not enter a relationship with. Looks, job, earnings, religious beliefs, political persuasion.

Why are all of these preferances more okay than a preferance for someone who isn't promiscuous? Even more interesting is that women also vet for N-count, except to weed out virgins instead of sluts. Why is it okay to not want to date someone with a lack of sexual partners, but not someone with a surplus of them?

For all this talk about men being obsessed with it, why is N-count the only dating preferance that is almost universally the one to get women REEEEing and trying to shame this preferance away?

[deleted] · 2019-06-03T09:19:48+00:00

I would say its more to do with projection and lack of awareness from unattractive guys.

The average guy will not have as many options as the average woman, and will happily f**k something, anything without standards coming into play. The ratio of opportunities to lays is probably 1:1.

For attractive High SMV guys, this is probably different as he will have options.

However the low SMV guy will project his own behavior onto a woman. And will possibly believe that she will just fuck anything and anyone. (only a theory as I am not a spokes person for a non existent male hive mind).

Now in my eyes, the reality is probably very different. Sure an average woman will still have more options than a high value male for getting laid. But even if once a month, she is lonely, horny, drunk, etc, that is nothing compared to the amount of offers she will have declines/rejected. But a low SMV male will never be able toi relate to this as he will have never experienced anything like this at all.

High N-Count really means nothing.

abaxeron · 2019-06-02T17:03:05+00:00

"Let's Talk About My Gut Reactions; The Thread".

Virginity doesn’t exist outside of the male ego.

"Cheating on a wife doesn't exist outside of the female ego".

It’s about the male desire for having a bunch of “pure things he can penetrate that no other man has.”

I hate to bring this up again, but 1) the whole "virgin-chasing" thing is mostly a made up fantasy trope; Britain knew an instance of a king marrying a commoner widow with children; if there were cases of brides getting beaten to death or burned alive for absence of blood on the bedsheet in the morning, they were few, and happened in distant, isolated, backwards, and quite unrepresentative areas; "No Hymen No Diamond" was a trolling initiative, mostly made in response to slut walks getting crazier every year; 2) The VAST majority of men understand that there are other N-counts than "zero" and "too much".

You're mixing two different things in plain sight ("taking N-count into account" and "virgin-chasing") and think we would not notice?!

It’s why in countless religions men receive a “harem of virgins in paradise.”

No; in "countless religions", paradise contains things that are desired but scarce in a person's life. Such as tables full of food, or rivers full of drinkable water and booze, or fine clothes, or peace and harmony. Since this is "Let's Talk About My Gut Reactions; The Thread", I'm not surprised that you decided to ignore all of this. And, just to clarify, my surface Googling says that Valkyrjur as "virgins" is a late Christian "reimagining" of Norse myths that has nothing to do with actual pagan beliefs and traditions.

A virgin rape victim: She’s “ruined.” From what exactly?

The comment you're most probably referring to talks about psychological damage, clearly.

The entire thread you linked to is nothing but a bunch of men DISAGREEING WITH EACH OTHER, MOSTLY about definitions and wordings. How the Hell can you, based on this, cherry-pick a couple comments that induced the strongest gut reaction in you, and conclude that all men have some sort of universal natural imperative?! This is the "Early Christians believed that women have no soul"-tier shit.

robertfrostt · 2019-06-02T16:25:47+00:00

If we are viewing N count as the number and not who the number was composed of, you are correct. It's an ego thing.

Now, if we are talking about *who* she has slept with that has very legitimate concerns that are related to the man's safety.

If a woman has knowingly dated or slept with a convict or ex-con, or some type of gang member, that can endanger another man's life because it's not known what affiliations she still has with him or if he watches her or has surveillance, etc. For all he knows a man could walk out of his house and be a drive by shooting victim.

If the woman has slept with a man whom she accused of rape during college that can be a big risk to the man. He might not interpret her signs of consent properly, or she might accuse him of something that he isn't aware of. Or, she might have traumatic issues from her rape experience if it was a brock turner type of thing.

LovingLivingLarge · 2019-06-02T17:03:23+00:00

'Slut' is a feeling or impression a male gets about a woman, which causes him to feel disgust. I can't argue with men about their feelings of disgust and I don't want to argue about what disgusts me.

passepar2t · 2019-06-02T18:32:12+00:00

I've dated rape victims and it wasn't a picnic. I do not want to go through that again.

fuckdr11 · 2019-06-02T18:37:30+00:00

Virginity doesn’t exist outside of the male ego.

Incorrect. Virginity has a clear and unambiguous definition for heterosexual sex. It can even have medical implications, like the breaking of the hymen.

I don't know how anybody could possibly think that the concept of virginity "doesn't exist". The idea is a clear non-starter.

Furthermore, this has nothing to do with the fact that some weirdo RPs and incels think that men should only be attracted to virgins. Those people are wrong too.

[deleted] · 2019-06-02T18:56:34+00:00

cheating and jealousy is based on ego too

flyinghorse1 · 2019-06-02T23:12:31+00:00

We can be weird over it. When I was a virgin I just wanted 1. When i'd been with 1 I wanted to be with 3 then i'd be happy. Then I thought get to 10 and then I will be a stud. When I got to 10 and didn't feel a stud I went for 20. Somewhere between 30 to 40 I began to view myself as weak for needing the numbers to feel like a real man. A year or ago I managed to stop counting as the numbers don't matter.

[deleted] · 2019-06-02T23:39:03+00:00

Virginity in women has a biological purpose, a guarantee the man is the first to mate with her and insures paternity.But virginity was traditionally undesirable in women past a certain age. They were seen as either insane or cursed, given how easy it is for a woman to find a mate.

Virginity in men means nothing until the age of 17. Once a man hits that age the "virgin" jokes and teasing start.In a man in his late 20s and beyond, being a virgin is considered the mark of a defective loser.

We're not all that better than the Sentinelese, we just smell and dress nicer and we've stopped ritualistic killing of people. But, at our core, we're still just apes wanting their bananas.

iLiveInAHologram · 2019-06-03T01:35:44+00:00

I feel like it’s BOTH based on the male ego and the fact that it’s easier to have sex when you want to have it as a woman and that kind of doesn’t show choosiness. Like it could potentially reflect your standards. But I also know that some women have higher sex drives and do what they gotta do. Being in the 50/50 red and blue pill is a weird place to be.

H2orocks3000 · 2019-06-03T17:43:29+00:00

I’m a guy I find that odd. I know it exists but never seen it.

I guess I can see being the first one to “sexually ruin her” as the slang goes would be fun (show her the ropes much faster). Though hmm,

I know I had a girl tell me she had 30 partners and the actual number I didn’t flinch at. It’s like- damn.

Not the number I Dont care about one bit, and the sex in that relationship was prob the best ever.

What I eventually figured out was that she was likely a borderline adaptation. I was so confused why things worked the way they did.

Our Attatchment s kinda imploded together in the end(way before I knew what that was)

So basically, number dosent bother me- have fun.

I basically after realizing I was raised by two narcs recently, I do pay attention to that as it does tell me two things.

The girl has anxiety any time number is like approx double mine. Everyone else I had met was in my ball park and I had just gotten out of a 7 year relationship.
Test her awareness of her self, look for patterns in her personality, mental physical health etc.

I basically figured it out after researching something and finding that 38% of border line people have adhd and also they have major depression too.

It was those two things and the fact that she had pulled a couple weird things on me that where unlike everything else.

So yeah- to people like me - your number dosent matter- your general health and self awareness does. That’s about it.

Learn what your Attatchment style is If you where a personality disorder, which one do you lean towards. Slightly even. Look up what ever mental health issues you have and X, personality.

HarpyMaster · 2019-06-04T18:12:42+00:00

men like to sexualize women but if women sexualize themselves aka are natural with their sexuality, men will call them slurs.

i so happy that many married men who think like this are experiencing DB. they deserved it.

SmurfESmurferson · 2019-06-02T16:14:25+00:00

I don't know if it's ego, or if it's the male obsession with their own penis/the fact that they think it's the center of the world

Vaginas are made to pop out 7 pound babies

The fact that guys think dicks can "ruin" a vagina is just a weird bit of male mental hamstering. If you can push out a watermelon, why would you think a hot dog could do damage?

CosmicBioHazard · 2019-06-02T16:48:48+00:00

I think it’s justified to say that its’ the nature of males, insofar as we responded to high n count disadvantaging us by evolving to not like it, not by reading studies.

virginity itself, though, if the studies ARE to be believed, is of greatest concern to the men themselves insofar as, while womens’ happiness in marriage trends slowly downward as n count goes up, men experience an actual “discard if seal on cap is broken” effect. First time robs them of somewhere around 15% chance of marital satisfaction (extremely significant), then no further damage.

crackrocksteady7 · 2019-06-02T17:43:03+00:00

another angle on the same thing, taking a ride on the village bicycle doesn't feel like an ego feeding accomplishment but banging a discerning low n girl does

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[deleted] · 2019-06-02T16:50:30+00:00

The concept of being a virgin, as it exists in modern Western society, is applied to both men and women so the idea that virginity is "wholly a male conception" makes no sense except perhaps historically.

I don't get the huge obsession with n-count myself, seems driven by a moral crusade than anything else. Like it's okay to not wanna have a relationship with a slut cool that's your preference. But when they start saying "all men find sluts disgusting" I roll my eyes.

TGP posted some decent research here not too long ago showing that men actually rate sluts higher for pure SMV, just lower for RMV. This sounds about right to me.

[deleted] · 2019-06-02T17:28:13+00:00

The obsession with n-count comes from insecurity for sure. But the insecurity stems from taking shit if you haven't gotten laid enough, from both men AND women. If you're a virgin you're literally a laughing stock. If you're hanging out with a girl and she finds out you haven't been with many women, even if you're not a virgin, it can be a strike against you, especially with women who have gotten around (not that that's a bad thing).

GridReXX · 2019-06-02T18:23:15+00:00

I like subordinate women, and the more people they've fucked the more they're unwilling to grow with me in the relationship. Women who are virgins in their 20's because of circumstances are exciting to me because I could get the chance to explore so much with her, rather than be directed to play out all the things other people have shown her how to enjoy. I'm not expecting any virgins anymore in my thirties that I'd deem worth pursuing, but from my experience, promiscuous women are usually validation seekers rather than hedonistic, and this means, unless they've got wit and intelligence, I'll probably will not want to engage with them socially. So it's just a bad match for me, unfortunately. I'm just more likely to respect the social parts of a relationship with a virgin or low n-count girl, or to be content with a newly hedonistic girl that wants to explore her sexuality. This is what leads me to an overall respect for the person and so will lead to a much more contented relationship overall. (Also, I've never had sex with a virgin, neither have a lot of guys, so it's not surprising we might value having the opportunity to take someone's virginity, considering it was a major part of Christian culture since at least 1500-1600's. It's a fetish like white cotton panties at this point....)

Mr_Smoogs · 2019-06-02T18:24:49+00:00

A lot of it is disgust, not necessarily ego

GridReXX · 2019-06-02T18:32:37+00:00

I don't believe any man above the age of 18 who claims he is still a virgin. Unless he is physically disabled/disfigured. Sorry don't believe it.

Talkytalktalk · 2019-06-02T18:36:28+00:00

no. it's men aren't actually pigs and want someone who can pair bond.

AntwanAntoon · 2019-06-02T18:56:43+00:00

virgins are tighter /thread

matrixpush · 2019-06-02T18:57:46+00:00

SMV disparity...like everything else.

DREADC0RSAIR · 2019-06-02T19:22:59+00:00

If she has a high n-count there's a higher chance that she'll

Monkey branch to another dick, cheat, have an STD/STI, running into past guys she's fucked and dealing with those awkward moments, family and friends will consider this dishonorable for both of us, Desensitized to the bonding of sex etc.

Not to mention the fact that I'm spending money and time for dates when she practically would give it up for free for anyone else. Cost to benefit wise its just not efficient.

Here's the honest truth despite all this, if I met a high N count woman who was pleasant to be around and we shared a connection like no other I'd probably take the gamble on her despite her past. But there's way more reason than ego to not preferring a high N count woman. And even if ego was the greater part of that, its the ego that attracts women in the first place and makes a man so it's definetly necessary. But it's more of a red flag that helps in decision making for if you're to pursue romantically or not.

wingbark · 2019-06-02T19:23:55+00:00

I think n count indicates other things about a person. Let’s use the extremes. Virgin man would probably not be attractive or would be very religious and there’s probably a high chance of awkward sex. At a certain age, this will turn women off. Is not specifically the number, but the characteristics that produced the number.

I understand that you’re saying to imagine a man with whom a woman is already involved with and attracted to who she discovers was a virgin before they met. I would agree that in this scenario women would likely not care much. If he’s attractive to her and they have good sex, the virgin past doesn’t matter much. That being said it’s incredibly unlikely to find such a man who is attractive to you, yet is also a virgin.

The opposite isn’t quite so rare. A woman with a very high n count. Maybe sex isn’t as meaningful or emotional for her as it could be for a given man. Maybe she couldn’t get men to commit to her. Maybe she had low self esteem. Maybe she isn’t religious. Maybe she did sex work. Who knows. Could also be that she always practiced safe sex and just had a lot of it because it was easy to get and she enjoyed it.

The point I’m making is that I don’t think it’s so simple as you framed it in the OP.

Also I’m not totally sure that what you described about men wanting to own her sexuality is a necessarily negative thing. For example I know women who would be less bothered by their husbands having sex with another woman than if he emotionally connected with another woman—if he made another woman laugh or smile.

Men and women are different and want different things and want to feel special. I don’t see what the rub is

immaculacy · 2019-06-02T20:01:13+00:00

>Virginity doesn’t exist outside of the male ego.

Even if you don't want to get into a huge debate, this is the most easily disprovable thing simply by finding a woman who thinks virginity exists.

Rape victims are not ruined at all. They didn't do anything wrong.

Saying virginity doesn't exist because there's not an agreed upon line is like saying blue and green don't exist because you don't know where teal turns into blue.

It doesn't matter where the line for virginity is for me because you do it all with the same person. The only people who would worry about where the line is are people who did sexual stuff with different people and are wondering if it counts so they can say they are a virgin or not. For example, imagine you're a woman with your one life partner and one day you sit on his dick with clothes on and move around, and the next day you blow him, and the third day you have regular sex with him. You gave your virginity to him. It doesn't matter WHEN it was, and there's no need to worry about that. You know it's just you two. But if the woman did that with 3 different guys, then there would be anxiety and confusion and everything about who she gave it to. The "line" of virginity doesn't matter to me because I do everything with one person.

I-wanna-GO-FAST · 2019-06-02T20:07:26+00:00

Virginity doesn’t exist outside of the male ego.

Does the patriarchy plant a hymen in women at birth?😂

Men care about virginity because they instinctively know that promiscuity in a woman makes paternity uncertain. Yes, we've solved that problem very recently, but that doesn't change thousands of years of evolution.

If you want to argue that men should stop caring about a woman's sexual history, then you should also argue that women should stop caring about a man's height, how broad his shoulders are, and all sorts of other traits that women no longer have good reason to prefer in men.

I won't be holding my breath.

CRGRO · 2019-06-02T20:12:05+00:00

That link was to a comment on something fairly far from "virginity"

Also when talking about woman's pov (her conception on her own n count) we can't say it's only male egos making virginity

GridReXX · 2019-06-02T20:20:53+00:00

Woman. Can we not have even one standard for which of you we want to sleep with? Like can we not even have ONE thing we judge women on that wasnt preapproved by you?

Compare the average womans giga list of standards for presumptive male mates, which is so immoral in its demandingness that it literally includes the mark of the devil (6 foot, 6 figures, 6 pack and sometimes 6 inch dick) ...

with the male list of 1) not fat 2) low n count..

It not even close. And yet you want to take that one out of two things on the male wishlist away.

Women are stingy as fuck, if we let yall have your way we’ll be relegated to a distant corner of the mancave, subsisting on low fat turkey bacon and feminist approved softcore porn. Not even two cents or two sexual standards to rub together.

TheBookOfSeil · 2019-06-02T20:38:00+00:00

Virginity doesn’t exist outside of the male ego.

???

So a person who's never had sex before is a myth?

The fact that that thread was earnestly discussing n counts based off rapists.

The fact that I’ve read countless OPs where he can’t decide if a woman who dry humped a dude has a new n count.

........ so you're taking the words of some autistic guys on the internet and generalizing them across the entire male population?

N count isn’t about the woman.

Not even sure what you're talking about here. Women don't like virgins just as much as they don't like guys who have had sex with +1000 women. For a man, a virgin woman isn't a big issue, but guys don't like the thought of women having sex with a large group of men before they have sex with that man. Sticking your dick in a hole where dozens of dicks have been before is like wiping it around the entire inside of a toiletbowl. Would you kiss a man who just ate out three other women? Virtually the same thing. It doesn't matter if it happened just then or a few years ago. There might as well be vaginal fluids dripping from his face, just like there might as well be jizz still dripping out of the woman's vagina who just told you that she's slept with 20 other guys before you.

Willow-girl · 2019-06-02T20:49:14+00:00

The reason n-count is important is that women don't fuck for free. They only fuck if they manage to get something out of the man in return.

So a woman who's been fucking dozens of guys is mercenarily aggressively monetizing her vagina. You really want to be next in line to be fleeced same as the rest?

Wallstreet3 · 2019-06-02T21:13:26+00:00

N-Count says certain things about individuals. When that info is then mixed with other info, one gets enough info to start assessing the worthiness of an individual.

TopOccasion29 · 2019-06-02T21:29:51+00:00

Of course ego is involved. That doesn't negate or invalidate the studies though. It's a combination of both.

PM_Happy_Puppy_Pics · 2019-06-02T22:48:44+00:00

A virgin rape victim: She’s “ruined.” From what exactly?

Emotional trauma

quickeddie · 2019-06-02T23:23:49+00:00

In the same way that certain species of birds will discard their eggs if you touch their nest (responding to instinct), men value virginity out of instinct and similarly are disturbed by the idea of committing to promiscuous women out of instinct. The male of our species devotes more time to his young as a percentage of lifespan than the male of any species (the time devoted may actually exceed his own lifetime when one considers bequests and inheritance), so he is evolved to ensure the investment is actually into his progeny. Religious pedestalization of virginity is just the codification of an instinct that was already there - after all, it was men who wrote the Bible and other texts, not the gods.

LeJacquelope · 2019-06-02T23:33:22+00:00

Rape victims shouldn't even count in this kind of discussion. Any guy who refuses to touch a woman because she was raped is IMHO a low-life shitweasel, not a man.

Claiming her as my first would not at all be an issue for me. I wouldn't have been as much into my low n-count wife if she was an inexperienced virgin with no sex skills at all. I like 'em wild. Fucking a virgin is like fucking a child in my mind.

But there's a limit to that n-count.

For high n-count women who weren't raped, it's about the baggage she is carrying, it's about the fact that she passed over you during her youthful and most fertile years and has decided to go with you once she's had all her fun, it's also about the fact that a high N count woman clearly has other options and can suddenly decide to share your bed with a random Chad. Ego has nothing to do with it, there are huge actual risk factors involved.

All of this is also true for a woman dealing with a dude that has a high N-count.

bodevelho · 2019-06-03T01:22:16+00:00

best way to predict the future is to look at the past, what do you think is more egocentric a man that thinks he will be the last one in her N count or a man that knows he will just be another N to the count ?

diffdedbed · 2019-06-03T01:54:54+00:00

Internet arguing 2010+

Have opinion.

Google a study that supports.

If no study an article.

If no article a blog.

If no blog a study that doesn't support but no one will be arsed to read close enough.

If no luck there just pretend it's supported by how obviously right.

No men were like "I really like Stacy but after reading the n count study I fear she won't be loyal."

They were sleeved out really.

Aggressive_Beta · 2019-06-03T03:04:40+00:00

We are wired to ensure that if we provide for a woman we are fucking, that her child is most likely ours and not a bastard. Lower N count woman makes that more likely. It's how men evolved because the ones who were more interested in committing to higher N count women were selected out of the gene pool over millions of years.

No amount of complaining or hamstering will ever change the fact that, all else equal, men are more interested in committing to women with lower N counts than women with higher N counts.

[deleted] · 2019-06-03T03:42:57+00:00

Could we say that men’s obsession with “n count” is not based on “studies about promiscuous women” but their own egos.

It is a possibility that some or most men here have such biases?

Yes. All humans have biases. Most men here may have those, I know I have heavy biases against promiscuous women.

Does this makes the studies cease to exist?

No. They are still there.

Does this mean some or even most men did not get to this conclusion by rational thought?

No. Men are known to have 'systemic' thought processes after all.

Is looking for the best for one self without affecting other's rights is wrong in any way?

No. This is just the normal human behavior.

Are there sound mathematical and quantifiable data showing it helps men?

Yes. STD, divorce and relationship data.

Are there sound mathematical and quantifiable data showing lower n count is 'safer'?

Yes.

All humans have biases, and many of men have heavy bad experiences which increase their biases against promiscuous women...

But there is a good reason, they were, in fact bad experiences, and they did show the correct path according to study.

It is like being irritated against a badly written law because you were screwed over by it... It is a bias... But the fact still stands. Or Like discovering a chemical is dangerous because you lost a lot to its side effects... You got the correct answer...

Life is not a math problem... It doesn't matter you use feelings, or even bad feelings, to get to rational thoughts... what matters is that you got the correct answer, rationally.

The problem is when these feelings cloud rational judgement... Which is kind of hard at this point, as we are talking about relationship market place.

SirNemesis · 2019-06-03T04:01:32+00:00

Yes. It's like a new car vs a used car that has been all maintained.

Though a virgin rape victim doesn't 't really make any difference to me - I'd still be her consensual first. On the other had the hangups and psychological damage would certainly be an issue with a rape victim, virgin or otherwise.

LillthOfBabylon · 2019-06-03T11:41:49+00:00

It's a 2 way thing. Yes, having a madonna-whore complex is stupid. HOWEVER, alot of sexually active women are mentally unstable and haven't gotten proper therapy. The higher her n count, the more unstable she is.

Virginity actually started because we had no paternity tests back then. Also, woman's more likely to be unsatisfied with sex with you if she's had better.

[deleted] · 2019-06-05T19:05:21+00:00

I find the whole "purity" talk repulsive tbh. Guys who are into women for their innocence & who fetishize innocence nearly always are clinical narcissists or have general trust & control issues. I think its not just abt ego for men, its about having an easier time to control someone naive & inexperienced and its easier to impress someone without experience too, which is lazy. Though some guys might not think abt it critically and just were raised religious or picked it up from other influences without ever questioning it.

Bruchibre · 2019-06-12T07:18:22+00:00

I don't think any man's preference has ever changed AFTER reading statistics and “studies about promiscuous women”. But calling it Ego is a different story. If a man is obsessed with n-count what does it have to do with ego? OK I've read about certain guys who say shit like "if she's had many lovers there are more to compare with and more chances that some were much better" (to what I'd respond "so fucking what" but OK) in which case it sounds pretty insecure to me. But that's only one situation. In general it is what it is: a preference.

rasmelo · 2019-06-28T01:27:48+00:00

I don't know. I want a man with a low N count as well. I don't want some dirty man who can't get his life together and lives like a perpetual teenager. I don't mind if the guy expects something from me as well.

GuyWithTheStalker · 2019-06-02T17:20:14+00:00

Related: Howwwww the fuck would guys (or girls) even know the number anyway? It'd be a creepy thing to measure, and I'm sure lies, rumors, and God-knows what else would make it a fucking ridiculous assessment.

Who the fuck asks about this shit? Seriously. Who the fuck does that?

wtffellification · 2019-06-02T16:06:53+00:00

in a sense youre right. in another sense... STD’s

TheReformist94 · 2019-06-02T16:23:55+00:00

What do women on here find so hard about understanding why many dicks going in one hole is a bit icky?

What's more gross, licking my finger and sticking it in 20ears, or having 20wet fingers stuck in my ear?

GridReXX · 2019-06-02T16:43:23+00:00

Men who prefer virgins are suspicious to me. They are the types who probably prefer little girls or "minors". Most adult women are not virgins.

[deleted] · 2019-06-02T18:03:57+00:00

I don't know about obsessions but I'll talk about aversions.

I and many other men are averse to high n counts because our life experience tells us that high n count women are a bad bet for LTRs. The studies are found later to confirm this.

We don't care about n counts for random hos we fuck. We don't respect high n count sluts and we don't want to LTR them.

That's all there is to it really.

Million-Suns · 2019-06-02T18:09:26+00:00

It's not about ego.

It's about ancestral habits wanting to be sure that our offspring are biologically ours.

PaintingOfJoan · 2019-06-02T16:09:55+00:00

It means you haven’t had sex before, this isn’t super hard to understand and yeah men have big egos that pop at a pinprick. Virginity was important because men used to not know if the gal they were getting hitched to would have their children and Mariology. Turns out that only dumbfuck religious fundies and hen men care about it.

sadomasochrist · 2019-06-02T17:53:47+00:00

You're conflating these issues out of ignorance. Few of these men would be in this debate.

The vast majority of these men are looking for ways to have a stable family.

50% of families end in divorce more or less. Of course these guys are looking for ways to soften the blow on this.

rachaellefler · 2019-06-02T23:18:21+00:00

Countless religions? Only Islam. In Christianity the afterlife is specifically stated as free of marriage. Hinduism and Vedic religions tend to believe you keep getting reincarnated until you experience something that releases you from the cycle of karma. I guess you could get a harem of virgins in one of your lives but it's not the point.