TheRedArchive

~ archived since 2018 ~

55

I'm not even going to debate(argue with) anyone in the comment section. I'm just going to read what you type...even the long walls of text.

Before someone claims this isn't a thing and nobody is asking for sympathy/empathy.

The comments in this recent post .....in this older post ..... this entire post(CMV: Women have no sympathy for men.) ....so many posts with this theme of late .

So let's pretend women finally understood how hard dating is for the 'average' man.

Women still won't want to fuck him. Empathy won't make her find him attractive. Sympathy won't make her proud to show him off to her friends.

Women will still look at him and see a loser. A fat/skinnyfat , short ,poorly dressed loser. Or maybe now that she has empathy she doesn't think he's a loser....maybe she thinks he's a lost soul

In a world were women could empathize with the plight of men ...instead of getting a "ewww. no way in hell loser" when he asks her out ...he will now get "you're so brave for putting your heart on the line but unfortunately you're not my type"etc....

In the end it's the same result. No hugs, no kisses, no love , no intimacy and ...most important of all(no matter how much you guys try to pretend it's not what you want) ......no pussy.

The fact is ...no matter how much empathy/sympathy they get. They are still going to have to learn how to dress better. They are still going to have to lift weights 5 days a week for a least a year and a half. They are still going to have to get over their social anxiety and learn to flirt.

How exactly is womens sympathy/empathy going to help these lonely men find love/intimacy/sex?

because i don't see how. i don't see why they keep asking for it ....especially from the women in an online anonymous debate forum ...that's pointless imo

But maybe i'm missing something


[–]NockerJoeKing Hater40 points41 points  (103 children) | Copy Link

The difference is that most of them don't want the easy lay so much as just someone to acknowledge that they have it hard out there.

Even groups that used to be mild and hate the manosphere are now turning kind of radical and scary even in comparison to the worst of the manosphere just because they have it hard and nobody cares. As much as Supreme Gentlemen is a meme a lot of dudes are finding stories of rejected men lashing out violently and hailing them as heroes. Because when you're stuck between a psychological rock and hard place after a while lashing out becomes the only thing you can really do.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!12 points13 points  (85 children) | Copy Link

Most of these guys aren't even smart enough to lash out at the right culprit. Lash away guys. I hate clown world just as much as you do. The only difference is I'm actually trying to change it.

And how about these pathetic losers try using that crazy energy to do shit rather than stew? Cause yeah the world is a laughable nightmare, we all live in hell, it's a fallen world bro, but how about they at least recognize. Shit clown world bro. Find your path to laugh and if you want to laugh your way out? Well no try give up losers were never meant to survive such harsh times. At least take out our enemies bro ffs

[–]NockerJoeKing Hater6 points7 points  (30 children) | Copy Link

They aren't. Don't take my statement for support.

However it is worth noting. After all the default assumption is that these guys are passive and won't do anything. But it's rapidly turning out they're willing to get violent and as you said, they're more concerned with lashing out than finding a good target.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-5 points-4 points  (29 children) | Copy Link

I look forward to the battle. Maybe one of them will finally kill me?

As to what they should do. These worthless worms, these petty nothings, no try give up losers. I despise them. After I spent years and years of my life to help these no try worthless traitors. These no good evil men. Evil bad men who care not for any other man but only for themeselves. No try guys.

We've done the work good for nothing man. We've written it all down. Even more than that we are willing to help, to do our best to help you for nothing but that you are my brother. After everything I've done if some poor character weakling, some give up loser, some disgusting piece of air, a whisper and never anything else, wants to come try to kill me and my children? Come at me bro. My fist already healed from two weeks ago beating the fuck out of some sad goblin. Yes its my fault goblin.

I've done my best and I do want the best for "you" . You want to target me and my kids because you are too dumb to understand who is attacking you and who wants all women to be whores? OK retard. Come on. Come at me. Prove just how retarded you are.

Idiots get mad and just lash out at random. Thereby proving what idiots they are. At least be a martyr.

[–]ThereCanBeOnlyOne_316 points17 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

Holy fuck after reading this and your other comments, I can only come to the conclusion that you are a deranged, sad, man or a troll. Your deranged ramblings are second only to Elliot Rodger's. Get back on your Prozac, dude.

[–]whichbladeNA Paler Shade of Purple10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

He's almost always drunk lol.

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

this

[–]NockerJoeKing Hater6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah I read this and I'm just wondering if he had a stroke or something.

[–]Salty-Bastard3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

He's our resident scrambled eggs wino.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

He’s a harmless drunk other than his encouraging Anorexia

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Lol he's just drunk, which is ironic really because I'm on three, actually no shit five, different drugs right now and still make more sense than him. Remember kids alcohol is more harmful than any illegal drug.

[–]Ascimatorsmirks audibly4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Remember kids, this post should not be taken as an endorsement to get high on 5 drugs at once, either.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Truth I'm now in withdrawal from all the codeine I've been doing over the past few months, do not recommend. Still compared to oxy withdrawal it's a piece of piss. Kratom got my back.

[–]throwinoutex-Red Pill, now Purple Man4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

He has written like this for years. He's just a bumbling old man who thinks he is more intelligent than he is.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

deranged, sad, man or a troll.

could be both

[–]Zippo-Cat1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Holy fuck after reading this and your other comments, I can only come to the conclusion that you are a deranged, sad, man or a troll.

I am pretty sure he is a man, yeah

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh you haven't been around here for very long.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave11 points12 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

Yeah this is true for women too, about trying to help. Attractive women should not waste a moment showing emotional sympathy or time on any guy like that if he’s not a family member. He will just desperately latch on to her and channel all his antisocial bitter rage at her and be batshit crazy. Hot young women do not take the bait of slumming it with some disturbed weirdo out of “compassion.” Boys learn to be men through rites of passage among other men, as any anthropologist will tell you. You as a sexually attractive female cannot bestow manhood on him and you should never ever let someone like that drag you down and get obsessed with you. It’s not your fault he never did a rite of passage and is an unbalanced man child.

Before anyone gets triggered I’m talking about men with incel thinking or with nice guy thinking, not a random down on his luck guy she is friends with.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

if he’s not a family member

I don't think blood ties change anything in this regard.

I am wondering, though, why all this incel culture, school shootings, etc. are mostly American things.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Because mass shootings are America's national sport.

[–]reluctantly_red1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

In America the solution to any problem is always more guns.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

I said family because they wouldn’t be seeking a romantic connection, but if family becomes dangerous or unstable boundaries should be set there too.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Well, maybe guys won't seek connection with a sister, but I guess sex between cousins is not that uncommon as you think.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah honestly when I thought about it incels are still a risk here, I’ve seen the stuff they write.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It's not only incels, many guys can find their cousins attractive.

But also, I think incels seek more than just a "wrap around the dick".

[–]Zippo-Cat0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Japan had an "incel culture" long before the US did. Shit, they made an entire industry out of it.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

What else did you expect from a country where porn is censored?

[–]87AudreyHorne0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

What are you talking about?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Hey, bartender, I need an extra large Prozac smoothie for this one.

[–]crackrocksteady7buying gf0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

These worthless worms, these petty nothings, no try give up losers. I despise them. After I spent years and years of my life to help these no try worthless traitors. These no good evil men. Evil bad men who care not for any other man but only for themeselves. No try guys.

This is great keep goinv

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Try

[–]crackrocksteady7buying gf6 points7 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

At least take out our enemies bro ffs

And who would that be

[–]EminemLovesGrapesSpongebob5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Whoever went to school that particular day i'd bet.

[–]LittleknownfactsAutomod is my husband3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Too soon.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Shhhhh

[–]LillthOfBabylon14 points15 points  (42 children) | Copy Link

And how about these pathetic losers try using that crazy energy to do shit rather than stew?

Because CERTAIN GROUPS (who I wont name) feed these guys a victim narrative. The kind of advice these "losers" are given is hardly different from pretty thin girls bullying the pimply fat girls to the point of suicide.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (38 children) | Copy Link

So what you're saying is women are so horrible, mean and evil they even bully each other into a noose. Got it. Hey, wait a minute, why is it "sexist" when I say it?

[–]LillthOfBabylon7 points8 points  (37 children) | Copy Link

Oh! We're just going to pretend male suicide doesn't happen? Okay. Since you want to pretend not to understand my point, I'm just going to assume you think male suicide is a myth. How very feminist of you.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (35 children) | Copy Link

Of course male suicide happens. It's a literal epidemic.

I care about it. I belong to Project Semicolon. With an alt, I hang out in various suicide prevention forums.

What do women think of it? Well, apart from saying "yes, but women attempt it more, so we have it worse then you" they're doing things like deliberately blocking men from reaching out to each other in ways that are effective to counteract the problem because they don't involve the Wimmyn's Studies (sic) department lecturing men on toxic masculinity and demanding all men become radical feminists a la MensLib. I'm reasonably sure if men ganged up to interfere with women trying to curb women's suicide, women would in no way get on their collective menstrual cycle and try to run over anyone on earth with a dick. Right?

Actually I did read ONE article where a feminist almost showed some human sympathy for a man. Article started out well, it was a chick looking for stats on suicide to go on about how awful women have it and found out to her horror just how prevalent men killing themselves is, and marvelled saying if 86% of suicides were female and if that many women were dying the NFL would be forced to have a month where they dress every player in baby blue and put a knot on their index finger or something. Of course, she immediately fucked it up by saying men are selfish, and other men need to "get in there" and stop being macho and cry just like women do because if these men kill themselves it deprives a girl of a father and a woman of a provider, and these poor poor women (the real victims of male suicide) are the ones who lose out on the money and chores.

[–]LillthOfBabylon6 points7 points  (34 children) | Copy Link

Of course male suicide happens. It's a literal epidemic. I care about it.

Do you honestly think it's helpful to tell guys "No one will ever love you" "You're better off alone fucking a fleshlight" "Society will always hate you" "You can never fix your situtation. You're stuck like this for life."

And worse of all "DONT SHOW YOUR EMOTIONS! People hate it! Just bottle it in!"

Not even other guys think those messages are helpful.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (17 children) | Copy Link

Do you honestly think it's helpful to tell guys "No one will ever love you" "You're better off alone fucking a fleshlight" "Society will always hate you" "You can never fix your situtation. You're stuck like this for life."

Yes. Because men deal better with TRUTH. MGTOW and other initiatives are about telling men not to invest any time and energy into something which will ultimately grind down their self-esteem and soul or worse open them up to criminal prosecution and termination of employment.

"DONT SHOW YOUR EMOTIONS! People hate it! Just bottle it in!"

Nope. Just be indifferent. Women don't want you? Find another hobby brah, no big deal.

If you want men to show emotions, you have to stop discouraging men from doing it. You don't smack a child across the face every single time he opens his mouth, and then wonder why he never says anything.

Not even other guys think those messages are helpful.

Not true.

[–]LillthOfBabylon1 point2 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

Yes. Because men deal better with TRUTH.

  1. Then why do other men hate it?
  2. Clearly not since there's a male suicide epidemic.

If you want men to show emotions, you have to stop discouraging men from doing it.

I'm sorry, those are women? (See links)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTSvLKY7HEk

https://youtu.be/FkD4iU9nxkM

Not true.

https://youtu.be/9xg_Wp76pY4

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

Then why do other men hate it?

Well, who wants to hear that they're basically unwanted? But it's better to know that upfront than deal with decades of lying.

Clearly not since there's a male suicide epidemic.

Much of that has to do with mistreatment by women. The usual trigger is a woman walking out on a man for losing his job, or she just is bored of having had him provide for her for 20 years, she found a better looking man with more money, tee hee.

I'm sorry, those are women? (See links)

Conspiracy theories about soy is not what I'm talking about.

More like this

Or this

Or this

Or this

[–]BilboBagginhole1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I'm just going to throw my anecdotal evidence in with u/Mgtowkapow3

The only time I've been really suicidal was during my divorce.

When I discovered Mgtow and guys telling me that everything I was doing was for validation from women, it was a light bulb moment for me. I have been raised by a single mother and conditioned to work for my woman, only to have her shit on the life I built.

RP was a hard pill to swallow, but it was ultimately freeing.

There are a lot of testimonials like that on the mgtow subs.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

And worse of all "DONT SHOW YOUR EMOTIONS! People hate it! Just bottle it in!"

This is kinda true, though. We're incentivized to not show emotion even by women.

[–]LillthOfBabylon7 points8 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

We're incentivized to not show emotion even by women.

I call bullshit because men are the #1 people telling men "you cant be raped", "I wish a teacher molested me when I was young", "You're a pussy if a girl beats you up", "You're such a soy-boy". I have yet to see women do the kinds of shit men do to each other.

For example: https://youtu.be/9xg_Wp76pY4

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

I call bullshit because men are the #1 people telling men "you cant be raped",

I think this one's more of a generational gap, tbh. Younger people seem to understand better while older people

"I wish a teacher molested me when I was young",

I do wish this, actually. I'd rather have the mental problems from a woman forcing themselves on me when I'm young than the mental problems of women really not wanting me at all.

"You're a pussy if a girl beats you up"

I think that's more schoolyard shit than anything.

"You're such a soy-boy"

I don't find that insult serious in any way? Like if someone called me a soy-boy, it'd be like "Oh no, you used an internet term that only fucking nerds know what it means. How am I ever going to get over this deep shame you've inflicted on me?"

But I also grew up when "gay" was an actual negative insult and I have zero issue saying mean personal shit to people who insult me that would actually get them mad enough to fight me, so it may just be me.

I have yet to see women do the kinds of shit men do to each other.

Women do it more by their choices, and they don't shit-talk in person because even wimpy men still have the physical edge.

And with other men, you can always fight them.

[–]czerdec0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It's almost otiose to point out that your own feminism makes your post a richly ironic read.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I wish I had more hugs. My people, I love you all. Please carry on. It's a harsh world but carry on carry on you can do it. You have power. I saw it. Level up yes you got this

[–]Zippo-Cat2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

The only difference is I'm actually trying to change it.

A person banging their head on a brick wall in hopes of getting through is not impressive; quite the opposite.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Bang away bro while I be the change I want to see

[–]rus9384Misanthrope1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I'm actually trying to change it

By participating on PPD?

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

No in my RL

[–]oneprettycoolcat0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

And how about these pathetic losers try using that crazy energy to do shit rather than stew?

And do what? There isn't any changing the nature of women. So what exactly can be changed?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Change men to realize that everything they've been told is a lie.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Your acceptance of it. Cause yeah there isn't going to be any changing of human nature. Natural law above all. But we can change our acceptance of it.

And I do understand it is bad. I do get that. It is. But their literally isn't any other choice. This is the fallen world. The only real choice is to accept the fallen world for what that it is. Or to deny reality and grow increasing in denial of the truth.

Sorry

[–]LillthOfBabylon4 points5 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

The difference is that most of them don't want the easy lay so much as just someone to acknowledge that they have it hard out there.

You say that, but they dont even try. Nor do they listen to people.

As much as Supreme Gentlemen is a meme a lot of dudes are finding stories of rejected men lashing out violently and hailing them as heroes.

Yeah, that's what happens when you feed depressed guys a victim complex instead of telling them to improve themselves.

[–]Zippo-Cat9 points10 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, that's what happens when you feed depressed guys a victim complex instead of telling them to improve themselves.

Literally everyone is telling "depressed guys" to improve themselves.

So much so that they made it into memes.

[–]LillthOfBabylon8 points9 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Literally everyone is telling "depressed guys" to improve themselves.

Except particular male-groups that tell them to blame society for the guys problems.

[–]SerpentCypher5 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Hmmm, sounds like that one group who's name escapes me. You know, that one that tells women that all of their problems are caused by men. That one that blames patriarchy/male dominated society. Fe.. Fem... Nope, lost it. Was on the tip of my tongue too.

I agree though, we should be telling people that feel like They've been hard done by to improve themselves and their situations.

Women complaining about the glass ceiling? Tell them to work harder. Women complaining about the "wage gap"? Tell them to get a better job and to work more overtime. Let's tell homeless people to get a job and stop being so homeless. Scrap fat acceptance movements, tell obese women that if they want people to find them attractive, they need to stop being fat, disgusting hogs first. As someone else so eloquently put, TRY!

You've convinced me, fuck empathy. All of these ideas are great! The world is fair and just. Amazing people are winning at life while the scum are struggling at the bottom where they deserve to be.

[–]LillthOfBabylon1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You know, that one that tells women that all of their problems are caused by men.

Oh! I hate them too! Shocking isn't it?! I actually judge people by the content of their character!

[–]throwyourboat34 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy Link

Fuck empathy for men who hate women. Why should we care what happens to them? Let em rot.

[–]SerpentCypher0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

What came first, the chicken or the egg?

Do you think lonely men get so embittered for no reason? Or is there a possibility that being relentlessly insulted, mocked, dismissed and creep shamed perhaps lead to these people becoming so jaded?

I've always been of the belief that ostracizing, dismissing and silencing people is what creates extremists. Lonely men have always existed, but the hateful incel community is a relatively recent thing. It seems to me to be related with how (with the help of the internet) we as a society went from mostly ignoring lonely men to demonising them.

[–]throwyourboat34 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy Link

I don't care what came first and I never will. People in the world have real suffering to overcome and everyone has to fight.

I am just starting my life and I am not spending one moment of it comforting raging misogynists or distributing my pussy. The entitlement is disgusting. Men could should to put their energy into movements that help lonely men but instead they spend it on hating women and attacking feminists and now we are required to play mommy despite the endless misogyny?

Let them rot.

The only way I'd be inclined to pitch in in a non sexual way would be if it were for a population of men that did not depend on the "women are worthless" narrative to get through the day.

[–]SerpentCypher1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Cool you do you.

Why do you keep downvoting me? It's against PPD rules and I've been nothing but polite. People that don't like disagreement probably shouldn't seek out debate forums.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Funny how they never tell women who complain about the glass ceiling to work harder.

[–]throwyourboat34 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy Link

I didn't know you were into outright lying.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Men do. Women do not.

[–]czerdec5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

but they dont even try

Evidence?

What proof do you possess of their failure to try?

[–]LillthOfBabylon1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

They don't listen to people. When people try to give honest answers, they push it aside. As for evidence, I could ask the same thing for all the bullshit to talk about women.

[–]LeJacquelopeHaving a son is child abuse1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

tldr: Marginalized people are easily radicalized.

[–]max_peenorCertified TRP Shitlord-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The difference is that most of them don't want the easy lay so much as just someone to acknowledge that they have it hard out there.

Women are nature's way of saying Put On A Helmet.

[–]sparksjoy 1 points [recovered]  (8 children) | Copy Link

It won't. I think on some level they do want that kind of sympathy but they know at least deep down the problem is still there at the end of the day. They just want a way to numb the pain for a bit.

I remember back in my Incel Tears days (cringe) I got angry DM's from a few Incels. They would usually go on this long rant calling me a bitch or psychopath or something. From there immediately I would respond with something like

"Hi, nice to meet you! How's your day going? :-)"

I expected them to get angry at me for not taking their bait but...they didn't. It was weird how quickly they mellowed out, and we just talked for a while. One left Reddit altogether, I talked to another on Discord for a while after he promised to stop harassing the other IT women. One of the most surprising things to me was that none of them asked me to meet up with them to have sex or anything like that. They just wanted someone (a girl I guess) to talk to?

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

huh. best comment in the thread. i guess i was missing something.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London9 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Sounds like they were desperately lonely and miserable. Framing it as a lack of friends/romance when really they craved just the basic level companionship and confused that for romance.

Too many times I hear of incels saying “I don’t have any friends”

Like what!? Hol up work on that first

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I did the same thing back in my "femcel" days lol. Mommy/daddy issues, check. Issues with making friends, check. Third time has got to be right, the only box left is romance. I've since made more of an effort making same sex friends and getting used to basic levels of emotional intimacy/friendship so I don't get myself involved in an emotionally unhealthy romantic relationship.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

So there is hope. You’re doing it right. Romantic relationships is like all that basic stuff on steroids. We all gotta learn to crawl before sprinting.

[–]sublimemongrelBecky, Esq.4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Man I had the exact opposite experience when I tried talking to a few incels. They were seemingly nice in the subreddit then freaked out at me in pm.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Damn, IncelTears is like a cesspool. What made you stop posting there?

[–]Sad_Virgin_Beta_Male0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

tsk Noice

[–]KikiYuyuPurple Pill Woman20 points21 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

So basically human empathy and sympathy means nothing if you aren't also putting out?

[–]Zippo-Cat7 points8 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

So basically human empathy and sympathy means nothing

Are you five? Of course they mean nothing. They ALWAYS meant nothing.

You think starving African children give half a fuck that you sympathize with them? No, they want a dollar so they can live for another fucking month.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

African children would feel better if you think "Oh, poor kids" than if you think "Die out of starvation, little bastards, or grow the food yourself!"

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

To African kids, these are basically the same thing.

[–]KikiYuyuPurple Pill Woman5 points6 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

If you actually are going to compare starvation death to lack of sex, you're a certified scum bag.

[–]TRX550 1 points [recovered]  (7 children) | Copy Link

I mean, i wouldnt neccesarily compare the two either, but right after basic water, food and shelter needs, humans absolutely need companionship and validation. Going through life receiving neither of those is hardly a life worth living

[–]KikiYuyuPurple Pill Woman4 points5 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Sex isn't the only source of either of those things.

[–]TRX550 1 points [recovered]  (5 children) | Copy Link

sure but the amount of validation and happiness from being in an intimate relationship is absolutely astronomical compared to everything else

One guy getting regular sex and adoration from his loving wife and another lonely sexless guy getting told good job on your tps report by his boss are not getting anywhere near the same levels of validation

[–]KikiYuyuPurple Pill Woman3 points4 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

You keep seemingly equating sex to love and fulfillment. Not having a girlfriend doesn't mean you have no friends, no fulfilling job, no hobbies, no fun, no life. It doesn't mean no one loves or appreciates you or is glad to be in your company. A life without romance does not = a life devoid of warmth or companionship or real human contact.

If a guy can only feel validated through sex, that's not the world's problem to fix. That's his. He needs to fix his unhealthy view of his own worth.

[–]AgentMullWork4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I think there's a HUGE difference between a guy who gets sex occasionally and never feels fulfilled but keeps chasing that 'high', and a guy who doesn't even know how to begin to get sexual attention from women. I listened too much to the anti harrassment/gender talks growing up, where I felt I was always hearing that men are constantly imposing sex and the male idea of sex on women, that women felt a lot of pressure to play along or feel excluded when men talk about sexual stuff or make innuendos. How women aren't 'just holes to use for your pleasure' (so just how much pleasure can I feel ok about having or wanting?), or I'd hear about how porn is fake and women eager to have sex is just a male fantasy (for instance, the explicitness of the song Closer by NiN always made me feel real weird, Ive just had a hard time accepting that a normal girl would be like "yeah, I do want you to feel me from the inside and fuck me like an animal"). I remember hearing that 'women are just as capable of making first moves as guys, so don't feel pressured to make a move because you're a guy'.

I've also had sleep apnea for most of my life. I got diagnosed 5 years after college, but thinking back, I had the symptoms since at least high school, including brain fog, constant tiredness, etc. but I thought it was just who I was. A funny thing happened when I started to get treated: I started having far less anxiety about sex. I used to have this weird feeling waking up, where sex felt like an alien concept that no one would be interested in, like my brain was saying "you barely survived the night, you shouldn't be thinking about that" combined with "oh that's just me wanting to use women, no one could possibly be interested in that with me." It would kind of fade most days if I got enough oxygen in my system, but then I'd go to sleep and come right back in the morning.

Once I started Prozac for anxiety last year at age 29, combined with a chance 2 years ago to actually get to have an intimate experience with a girl who kinda took the lead on the 3rd date (after she was first like "aren't you going to do anything?", but understood when I told her I had no experience) things continued to get better in my head. The validation I got from that experience was huge. Hearing a girl who agreed to go on a date with me tell me how much she likes morning sex, or where to touch her was unbelievable. It didn't go much further than fingering/bj, but after maybe a dozen dates in my life, where I've never known what to do, or how fast to go, or what's expected of me, and tried to just take it slow and give the girl some control, and ultimately get mostly told that I'm 'a great guy, but not that great that I want anything to do with you, bye', that was a relatively large boost in self esteem. I've also realized I'm a pretty high sex drive guy, but my only output has ever been to hole up at home or in my room when living at college and jerk off because I'd never had what felt like a safe way to express my desires to women, and until her no girl had indicated any outright sexual interest in me.

Do I need to/can I improve myself, and maybe not focus so much on dating? Sure, absolutely. But its hard for me to forget my loneliness and still practically zero experience, especially since most of my life I've already tried just doing my own thing, while still making occasional dates online. It feels like I'm not even in the same world, or interacting on the same level. It doesn't feel like "oh I've had fun with some girls, and it ultimately didn't mutually work out, that's the way it goes, but I've learned a lot and feel more prepared to make a move when I find a girl I like." I feel like I'm a 30yr old still in hs with a lot of the same hangups and insecurities about initiating/indicating interest because I just treated women like friends (and I've had many female friends) and what I was told didn't work at all.

My feelings are more about the dissonance between how adults, and even friends to an extent viewed me growing up, and telling me "oh, there plenty of women out there who would love to be with someone like you", "I wish I could find a guy like you", etc and my results. I've been told more than once by older women, some of them drunk, one of them my middle School librarian, "oh, if I was 15-30 years younger..." When I express some of these thoughts I get back something between "women owe you nothing, ugh" and "you were supposed to use the girls in highschool and college as practice to build your skills been more forward and assertive, and not cared much about offending, or stepping over a line. It's up to you to get what you want." Hmm, I wonder where a lot of guys get these weird ideas about sex and how to get it.

I know I have value. I know I have things to offer. But I have no idea how women interpret it, or how to better show it off, or even how valuable it is.

[–]ModernMedia1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Without really being in the same boat as you, I feel like you have told a relatable story. Without much lingering malice or anything, why would anybody struggle to empathize with this?

[–]disabledtrpRed Pill Man1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Your comment should be a post itself somewhere (PPD, TRP, whatever). Thanks for sharing.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

What does another person caring enough about you to listen and talk with you matter if muh dick.

[–]SerpentCypher23 points24 points  (83 children) | Copy Link

I don't think it will help them get laid. I think people are just getting sick of the just world bullshit (lonely people are lonely because they deserve to be) used as a way to dismiss uncomfortable truths and problems that they don't want to think about.

When people aren't mocking lonely men they pretend they don't exist. I wouldn't be surprised if they just want someone that isn't another lonely guy to say "Damn that sucks, hope things get better for you." Just to hear a woman acknowledge they exist without mocking, being dismissive or insulting them would probably make a lot of them feel better. Unfortunately this seems to be almost as unlikely as these men finding a relationship.

I always see women talking about how misogynistic and woman hating lonely guys are, but I don't think they see how the way they they talk to/about them embitters them and makes them resentful. Nobody has any empathy anymore and it seems like everyone is in a race to the bottom.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave18 points19 points  (27 children) | Copy Link

Do we really believe that lonely frustrated men are satisfied as long as a hot chick just says “damn son that sucks about the dry spell.” ?

And more importantly, do we really think that any moderately attractive women can show even a moment’s sympathy to a desperate man and just move along without him getting relentlessly attached or thinking it means she’s open to more?

A woman saying aw sorry you didn’t get laid will not help the guy, but it will put her at risk bc desperate guys are crazy and latch on. There’s no reason for her to bother.

The only time it works is if the man is deeply in love with some other woman he can’t be with for whatever reason, and his hot chick friend says “wow I’m sorry that sucks.” It’s safe bc they’re already friends and she’s not the object of longing.

[–]Zippo-Cat4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Do we really believe that lonely frustrated men are satisfied as long as a hot chick just says “damn son that sucks about the dry spell.” ?

Judging by Patreons of said hot chicks... I guess many of them are

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

A woman saying aw sorry you didn’t get laid will not help the guy, but it will put her at risk bc desperate guys are crazy and latch on. There’s no reason for her to bother.

I admit that it's a legitimate risk. However, there's a lot of wiggle room between making yourself the lightning rod for a lonely guy's untapped potential for affection and pulling a Laury Penny and saying stuff like

yea this sucks BUT FEMALE PROBLEMS ARE INFINTELY WORSE AND IF YOU DARE TO SAY OTHERWISE YOU'RE A SHITLORD WHO DESERVES TO DIE ALONE

As manospherians have repeatedly said: the thing that produces the bile and anger first and most is the experience of having been lied to. Piling up on that permanent gaslighting isn't going to make things better.

[–]throwyourboat34 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy Link

Well no one is lying to them now so men need to get over it

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Well no one is lying to them now

giggity

[–]rus9384Misanthrope-1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

And more importantly, do we really think that any moderately attractive women can show even a moment’s sympathy to a desperate man and just move along without him getting relentlessly attached or thinking it means she’s open to more?

Yes, we do. Actually, often that "let's be friends" thing is an attempt to do that (sometimes it is exploitation of a guy, but far not always).

A woman saying aw sorry you didn’t get laid will not help the guy, but it will put her at risk

Not sure, because there were girls who actually wanted to date me, but I dismissed them as I did not see them attractive. But I empathized to them, I did not tell them to GTFO.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

If you’re saying let’s be friend and mean it you’re not the desperate man who whom I refer.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I gave an example with genders reversed, those are girls who were somewhat desperate to me.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Ok am just confused how this relates to the topic.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

And more importantly, do we really think that any moderately attractive women can show even a moment’s sympathy to a desperate man and just move along without him getting relentlessly attached or thinking it means she’s open to more?

Attractive women are not talking to guys like that anyways, so I'm not sure why this is coming up

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave0 points1 point  (17 children) | Copy Link

They do sometimes and end up like the Waitress with Charlie Kelly.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (16 children) | Copy Link

I don't know the reference

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave1 point2 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

Stalker who thinks he loves and is helping her no matter how much she asks him to stop.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (14 children) | Copy Link

But he does not really think she loves him. It's just because people who love (or very attracted to) someone want to be close to them very hard.

Of course, she does not owe to have sex with him. I think girls can tell guys if these guys make them dry.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy Link

There are absolutely delusional stalkers who believe deep down she loves him she is just a confused little bunny who needs him to make her realize. I blame rom coms. In fact I’d say more often than not this is how desperate men think.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (12 children) | Copy Link

Then she should tell him that she's not attracted to him the way he's not attracted to some other girl.

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave1 point2 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

Yeah lol it’s funny you assume she hadn’t already.

I’ve known women who told a man HUNDREDS of times she wasn’t attracted or interested and he was still pestering her.

[–]GridReXXit be like that17 points18 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Hmmm. I’ve been the woman who feels bad. Men get attached the moment you smile and express human decency. I can’t take that on for every sad man.

[–]poppy_blublack midget wine mom 🍷1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yes, but let’s separate “men” from “incels.”

[–]GridReXXit be like that2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

And incels do that times 1000.

[–]LillthOfBabylon10 points11 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

I don't think they see how the way they they talk to/about them embitters them

Yeah. Wishing death and rape on women isn't the problem. Women thinking that's creepy is the problem.

[–]CamoWoobie1002 points3 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

No, women being unnecessarily rude and cruel to guys is the problem.

[–]LillthOfBabylon6 points7 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

So women shouldnt think wishing death and rape upon her is creepy?

[–]CamoWoobie100-1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

They should, but those are two seperate issues.

[–]LillthOfBabylon5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

They're not. If we're talking about IRL situtations, perhaps Elliot Rodgers should have been throwing coffee on women!

[–]CamoWoobie1004 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

They are behaviors that men do. But you're taking a small minority of behaviors from a minority of men and treating it like it's the norm and women have no fault. You're completely removing bad behavior from women from the equation.

OP: lonely guys feel bitter because of being mistreated by women

You: So women shouldnt think guys who wish death and rape on them are creepy?

You're taking a myopic view and looking at 10% of the picture and being disingenuous to remove fault from women and blame it completely on teh menz. Men who wish rape and death on women are a small minority, even just looking at lonely men as a group.

[–]LillthOfBabylon3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

But you're taking a small minority of behaviors from a minority of men and treating it like it's the norm and women have no fault.

Only 25% of young men are virgins, so that's technically a minority. Now, I'm certain most guys of that 25% aren't crazy.....BUT it's insane to fed their delusions that it's always other people's fault for their situation.

blame it completely on teh menz.

When he starts wishing harm on people, yes. The blame is completely on the guy.

[–]ohheyhi99Conflicted Feminist Man, No Pill-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

When he starts wishing harm on people, yes. The blame is completely on the guy.

Elliot Rogers was true scum, but you’re still using extremists like him to justify your treatment of the group as a whole. In my observation, many incel-haters don’t limit themselves to men who wish harm on people.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

People being rude is bad? “visible surprise”

[–]CamoWoobie1002 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Well, apparently a lot of bitches dont understand that

[–]decoy88Black Male in London1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Rude bitches don’t care. Damn y’all need to get out more.

[–]throwyourboat34 1 points [recovered]  (4 children) | Copy Link

Screw them. We all have our parts to play. It isn't our job to withstand abusive, broken men. You hate women? Heal yourselves.

[–]CamoWoobie1004 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

It's not men's job to take shitty treatment from women either. Yeah, women can be unecissarily cruel to men, women shouldnt be surprised when a man has the upper hand and does the same thing back.

Theres a difference between not wanting to be with an abusive guy, and being a bitch to an innocent guy because you're mad a Chad did you wrong or a completely different guy didnt take no for an answer.

[–]throwyourboat34 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy Link

The average women is not being a bitch to lonely men. You're bitter and using incel language so it is easy to see you feel personally attacked when women aren't attracted to you.

Either way, calling us bitches have proven to worsen your situation because now society has identified you as bitter and unwanted. That's it.

You could improve relations with women but you choose to make them worse while stomping your feet and expecting women to play mommy.

We pass.

[–]CamoWoobie1004 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The average lonely guy isnt bring abusive to women. Chad isn't solely an incel term. I'm not personally attacked when women arent attracted to me, I'm offended when they are unnecessarily rude or manipulative.

Some women are bitches.

I have sex, so no I'm not unwanted. A bit bitter specifically about women who act like bitches tho.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Chad is not necessarily incel language because it existed before inceldom (originated in TRP?).

I think both sides should improve themselves. Because there absolutely are women whose behavior is disguisting.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Not all incels are like that? And also incels were incels in prior they were wishing death and rape on women.

[–]LillthOfBabylon2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Not all incels are like that

But are we gonna pretend that's not a huge issue?

And also incels were incels in prior they were wishing death and rape on women.

Yeah, mental illnesses and mental disorders. That's not women's fault. That's the family's fault for not properly treating him.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Not all incels are crazy. Those are outliers.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

Nobody has any empathy anymore

No one ever has empathy for total strangers. Humans are wired to only feel empathy for people we know.

[–]slackingwriter4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

I disagree. I would posit that what happens instead is that societies condition people to replace empathy with judgement.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

This. Million times this. We should get rid of Kantian philosophy ASAP.

[–]ModernMedia0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

How the hell do you backtrack that to Kant? I wouldn't even agree that people have less empathy anymore. It's more like people narrow down on relatable struggle and get disconnected (even more so) from plights of different walks of life. Might be people being too ready to feel attacked, when it's just indirected sorrow going around

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

How the hell do you backtrack that to Kant?

Because he's a very prominent figure related to the concept of justice.

Well, TBH, people never were empathetic in general. Justice replaced "holy laws".

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It's more like people narrow down on relatable struggle and get disconnected (even more so) from plights of different walks of life.

I agree with this but disagree it's something created by philosophy. I think it's just human nature. We relate to people who are like us.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

I feel empathy for total strangers. I guess there are others like me as well.

Ah, yeah, almost everyone is like me, remember what people feel when they watch a thriller.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

How do you experience empathy for a total stranger? What exactly does that feel like? I am genuinely curious because this is alien to me.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

Well, e.g. feeling bad when a stranger is beaten? Feels bad, like "what if I were at his place?"

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

I would process that as an objectively bad thing, but I wouldn't actually feel any type of way if he was a total stranger.

To quote Necro:

If you see a stranger stabbing a stranger
Don't get involved, that shit'll get stranger
When you're in danger of your life being taken
Over something that wasn't a major concern of yours

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Maybe it's a bad thing. I am not rushing to help anyone I feel bad for, because I still have the instinct of self-preservation.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

I don't really tend to assign moral value to things like this myself, for me it just "is." Anyone who is not in my "group" doesn't elicit emotional responses. I do think this is common human behaviour even if it's not an absolute. We are after all a tribal species.

Interesting to hear your experience though.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

To me it's not about morality as well, it's just in me, as a feeling.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!2 points3 points  (19 children) | Copy Link

I got a different answer. I know lonely men exist. I know they suffer. I don't care

Lonely man I have some very short advice for you. TRY

[–]The3liGator7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

More just world fallacy.

Also, if you're just an asshole who doesn't care about anybody's issues or even want to help, why come to a debate sub?

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I've done more to help you squatamalen weirdo then you could ever hope for.

You should be on your knees thanking me for what I've m done to help you. 3/5

[–]Sad_Virgin_Beta_Male1 point2 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

I tried for more than 10 years, still lonely and virgin. Any other short advice?

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!3 points4 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

Adjust your standards and bang away at all the easy girls, sad girls, mad girls, lass girls.

Oh and develop a drinking problem, or a coke problem, or my God at least develop a weed problem.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

”but that’s illegal!

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

+++

[–]Sad_Virgin_Beta_Male1 point2 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

I tried all that already. For example: I smoke a joint every day before going to sleep. Any other advice?

[–]GridReXXit be like that2 points3 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

These are social activity suggestions.

Drinking or doing substances alone doesn’t do anything but make you a depressed alcoholic or addict.

[–]Sad_Virgin_Beta_Male1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

I know where to buy the weed. Where do I buy females to smoke with?

[–]GridReXXit be like that2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

With friends. Do you have a crew ? Do you go to kickbacks and even TV show watch parties? BBQs? Do you host your own? Who do you go to grab beers with ?

[–]Sad_Virgin_Beta_Male0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

No, I've always been alone.

[–]GridReXXit be like that0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

That’s going to be hard then.

[–]jax006Wants to bang ~20% of PPD chicks0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Just take a shower and go outside dude

[–]Sad_Virgin_Beta_Male0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Already tried. For litteraly years. Still a lonely virgin. Any other suggestions?

[–]FranceWhiteFlagg0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Thailand

[–]Sad_Virgin_Beta_Male0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Lol

[–]crumblesnatch 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy Link

Do it while you're awake?

[–]Sad_Virgin_Beta_Male0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Already tried, didn't work. Any other advice?

[–][deleted] 24 points25 points  (17 children) | Copy Link

There is a quality of life difference between being poor and having rich people guffaw at you, throw cabbages at your head, and speed by you in their horse drawn buggy spraying mud everywhere while shouting “you shouldve thought about that before choosing to be poor and indolent you plebian FILTH”...

And having people say “you know what, it sucks being poor, here are resources that might help”

Does it make you less poor? No, but guess what, wealth does automatically not equal happiness. Same with pussy. Sometimes the manner in which the elites treat the commons matters - it’s the difference between spurring an armed revolt and merely having a perpetually sad underclass that uses religion and drugs to cope.

When society mocks and ridicules you it isnt long before you hate “them” back, and want to do something about “them” rather than looking inward

[–]Zippo-Cat8 points9 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

This post is so terrible it's hard to even address it.

There is a quality of life difference between...

What is the "quality of life difference" of seeing rich people supposedly care about your issues and sympathize - only to spew out some platitudes and then fuck off to play golf?

Does it make you less poor? No, but guess what, wealth does automatically not equal happiness. Same with pussy.

"Wealth does automatically not equal happiness" is something that ALREADY WEALTHY PEOPLE tell themselves and others when they somehow end up unhappy because of the hedonist treadmill.

For poor people money absolutely DOES equal happiness because it's the lack of money that's making them unhappy. Holy fuck.

When society mocks and ridicules you it isnt long before you hate “them” back, and want to do something about “them” rather than looking inward

And here's the punchline. We should "sympathize" because otherwise the poor will snap and some Robespierre guy will start doing rounds.

It's fine to be self-serving but at least be honest about it eh.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

This post is so terrible it's hard to even address it.

But you did anyway. Methinks the lady doth protest too much.

[–]Zippo-Cat1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

What can I say? I'm the PPD MVP

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Can i be in your entourage

Maybe one of those ppd middle aged female groupies will deign to sleep with me

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

For poor people money absolutely DOES equal happiness because it's the lack of money that's making them unhappy. Holy fuck.

You misunderstand what that expression means.

It doesn't mean "it doesn't matter if you are too broke to buy food."

It means "having more money than is required to live comfortably does not increase your happiness."

And that's pretty much true for most people. Once you have enough income to live comfortably, extra money can buy you nicer toys but it won't make you happy.

It's like that quote "money doesn't buy you happiness but it does buy you a more pleasant form of misery."

If you had enough to live comfortably but were depressed, then tomorrow you won the lottery, you'd still be depressed you'd just be crying in a Ferrari.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-1 points0 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

Have you had the crazy thought that maybe you should like actually try?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Addressed this already

you shouldve thought about that before choosing to be poor and indolent you plebian FILTH”

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Well why did we all write it all down?

DO TELL ME

[–]The3liGator-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

If anything ever bad happens to you, it's because you never tried hard enough.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

True that

[–]OneJealousGod-2 points-1 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Thank you for doing the work and applying everyday uses of words like guffaw, indolent, & plebian.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I need to tryhard even harder on reddit and come across high iq so i can attract a nerdy pseudo-intellectual female

[–]ThereCanBeOnlyOne_34 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Have sex, sweaty

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-2 points-1 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Hmm 🤔 no I don't feel like sexing up the Mrs tonight. Maybe in the morning.

[–]Jackpot807Purple Pill Man0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Said no man ever

[–]RoninCDN0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Her boyfriends got her tonight, he has to wait tull morning.

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yep. These were my thoughts too as soon as I read the OP. Couldn't have said it better.

[–]LifterofThingsDelicate Feminine Flower4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It doesn't, but it might make them less inclined to go Eliott Rodger, while they're figuring shit out. It feels nice to be empathized with, for other people to acknowledge and validate your pain and suffering.

[–]ohheyhi99Conflicted Feminist Man, No Pill5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I think women’s empathy would help a lot.

A lot of incels—or even men who struggle with dating—retreat back into their dark place because they feel despised by women for their desire for intimacy. And if incel-bashing on Reddit is any indication, they’re not entirely wrong. I mean c’mon, there’s a whole damn subreddit called r/IncelTears. It’s not just the misogynist incels who get shit on. A lot of incel-bashers are just socially or genetically privileged bullies punching down, but they justify their behavior by conflating all incels with Elliot Rogers. Some of these incels actually have it really hard. I empathize with many of them like I empathize with many of the women on r/TrueFemcels, even some of the ones who hate men.

If a guy who feels like a failure and resents himself is introduced to more women and men who ignore his real challenges, tag him as an entitled misogynist failure, and openly hate him, it’s likely that unhealthy thinking will follow. Again, this pile-on doesn’t just happen to entitled misogynists.

Feeling listened to—and no, “here’s why you’re wrong!” is not listening—would likely give some incels more encouragement to step outside of their dark place and believe that they can get somewhere better.

[–]SeemedGood7 points8 points  (46 children) | Copy Link

In the same way that when men mature and lose their insecurities they find a different set of women attractive because they pay more attention to different characteristics.

When I was fifteen through roughly twenty, the only women I found attractive were those with blond hair, an athletic build between 5’3” and 5’7” tall, size C cups or better, round Nordic facial features, perky behind, and that were from the “right” families.

As I matured, became more self confident, and as a result became better able to empathize and sympathize with others a magical thing happened. I started paying attention to other aspects of women’s characters which made them attractive to me. A woman’s kindness, curiosity, and thoughtfulness became more important in determining how sexually attractive she was to me than her hair color, cup size, body shape, or educational level.

I began to be able to appreciate women for their beings as opposed to solely for their utility to me, in my case represented by fulfilling a role model for the type of women I was “supposed” to be with.

[–]s86ahmed1 point2 points  (30 children) | Copy Link

I thought in most cases guys are more flexible in what they find attractive as opposed to just aiming for a very specific type of girl (who can be hard to get).

[–]SeemedGood0 points1 point  (29 children) | Copy Link

  1. I have found that if any woman is “hard to get,” for a man, most women will be because women’s attraction cues have a lot more overlap than men’s. And if one is attractive to women generally there are so many women available that nominally “hot” looking women (whatever that is for one) are neither rare nor particularly difficult to come by.

  2. Note I was discussing shifts in what we find sexually attractive as opposed to what we will tolerate. In my particular case, it was easy enough to date the superficially “perfect” woman, but I found doing so deeply unsatisfying because ultimately I was dating those particular women based on my insecurities and the utility those women had for me in ameliorating those insecurities rather than because I appreciated their beings.

  3. Yes, because men are the selected sex and are chosen for access to sexual reproduction, men are more frequently forced to outgrow their inherent childhood solipsism, a process which creates the ability to see others for their beings as opposed to just their utility to the self. When that happens, a broader array of people become beautiful to one. Back when I was still in my “objective 8+s only phase” I used to see men with wives that I found unattractive and wonder how they could possibly love them enough to want to marry them. It was incomprehensible to me because I was still solipsistic and viewing women only as objects to be used to satisfy my desire for particular utility. It didn’t occur to me that women could be beautiful in their beings, without reference to how well they might sate my need to be with someone who “everybody else” thought was beautiful (one of my particular needs for utility in a woman). I was unable to appreciate women for their beings as opposed to their utility to me, and this kept me from being able to see beauty in women who did not fit the needs of my ego. Lose the solipsism, begin to master the ego, and many more people become attractive because you are appreciating them for who they are.

[–]s86ahmed2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The last point hits home. Thanks man.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (27 children) | Copy Link

  1. Completely wrong. Women are less agreeable in what they find attractive in the opposite sex.

  2. Are you saying that when you were 15-20 you could not have a boner by looking at a brunette, for example? Or at a woman who was not out of the "right" family?

  3. Appreciation is not the same as sexual arousal and it's terrible you don't see this.

P.S. Now I am sure you are an asexual (or maybe a troll).

[–]SeemedGood-1 points0 points  (26 children) | Copy Link

  1. When you say less agreeable, what do you mean? If you mean that they are highly selective, I agree. If you mean that collectively women have a diverse set of attraction cues, I disagree strongly. It has been my experience that if you are attractive to a few women, you will be attractive to many women because what they find attractive tends tends to have a lot of overlap across individual women, much more so than men.

  2. Yes, I’m saying that I was only sexually attracted to a certain type of woman and that women who were not of that type did very little for me. In my social milieu though, there were a fair number of women who were that type. Imagine living in Sweden, but it’s actually a subset of the US population that lives on the East Coast in the Boston and NYC metro ares and all go to the same small set of private high schools and colleges.

  3. Appreciation for the being of another is what leads to the desire to merge with another both spiritually (metaphysically) and physically (sexually) with others for those that are conscious of themselves at that level. For those whose attractions are subconsciously determined, that may not be the case. That was certainly not the case for me when I was younger and only started becoming the case when I was inspired to bring my attraction cues into my conscious control by dissatisfaction with the relationships that I was having with the women my subconscious attraction cues were choosing.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (25 children) | Copy Link

It has been my experience that if you are attractive to a few women, you will be attractive to many women

Not doubting it, but I am wondering how did you compare men and women here.

Yes, I’m saying that I was only sexually attracted to a certain type of woman and that women who were not of that type did very little for me.

This is a very strange type of sexual attraction and ~98% of men are not like that.

bring my attraction cues into my conscious control

This is impossible for the vast majority of humans. It has nothing to do with "solipsism".

[–]SeemedGood-1 points0 points  (24 children) | Copy Link

  1. There have been numerous studies demonstrating that women tend to be much more selective about what they find sexually attractive than men. This mathematically implies that they have more overlap.

  2. I had that luxury, most men don’t. Part of my point is that if you don’t have the luxury of choice you adapt and that that adaptation can actually be an evolutionary process as well, not necessarily, but it can be.

  3. It’s possible for every human. Almost all do to a very limited degree, most do not. And it is related to solipsism in the sense that the ability to appreciate others for their beings as opposed to their utility is the elimination of the solipsistic state. That does not necessarily derive from becoming conscious of oneself, but they do tend to go hand in had as becoming fully conscious of oneself relies on on the awareness of the existence of others.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (23 children) | Copy Link

I had that luxury

It now looks like what you described was exactly one particular girl for whom you had oneitis, whom you dated and who broke your heart. Because girls you describing do not exist in abundance, a blonde girl with C tits, with good butt, etc. is rare. It's like at nost 0.1% of girls.

So, you changed your sexual attraction because you had to adapt. Women don't have to adapt, and that's the point.

But there actually are incels with pickiness of Chad, so I doubt your second point.

I doubt anyone really appreciates others because they are human beings. You now appreciate those humans who are nice to you because they are nice to you.

Ah, well, trolling confirmed. What you wrote there is completely against what you are saying here.

[–]SeemedGood0 points1 point  (22 children) | Copy Link

But there actually are incels with pickiness of Chad, so I doubt your second point.

I have never asserted that individual variance doesn’t exist and the existence of counter-example doesn’t necessarily refute the asserted principle. For example: males in sexually reproducing species prefer to have sexual interactions with females of the same species. The fact that male homosexuality exists doesn’t countermand the assertion.

Ah, well, trolling confirmed. What you wrote there is completely against what you are saying here.

If you read it with specific bias, you might draw that conclusion. It would be hard to do so objectively, however. But to each his own.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (21 children) | Copy Link

No, what you said there is that you care about looks. And what you said here is that it is unimportant.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (14 children) | Copy Link

When I was fifteen through roughly twenty, the only women I found attractive were those with blond hair, an athletic build between 5’3” and 5’7” tall, size C cups or better, round Nordic facial features, perky behind, and that were from the “right” families.

Lol, sounds like a joke, especially

from the “right” families.

part, like you are buying a highbred cat or dog.

That said, when it comes to friendship, only woman's personality matters, when it comes to sex, only her looks matter, but I want both and it always was like that to me.

[–]SeemedGood0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy Link

like you are buying a highbred cat or dog

It was in part like that, but the family background was an indicator of having the “right” socioeconomic background (went to the “right” schools, played the “right” sports, had the “right” hobbies, belonged to the “right” social groups, etc).

when it comes to friendship, only woman's personality matters, when it comes to sex, only her looks matter, but I want both

This is also a utilitarian based approach to viewing others. My point is that when you stop viewing others from the perspective of how useful they are to you (for friendship, or sex, or both) and begin to appreciate them for their beings you will begin to find many more people attractive as potential friends and sex partners.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (12 children) | Copy Link

went to the “right” schools, played the “right” sports, had the “right” hobbies, belonged to the “right” social groups

These are strange criteria for sexual attraction.

Also, I bet you did not have sex at all back then, as you were insecure apparently you were not Chad, but your type girls were Stacies.

This is also a utilitarian based approach to viewing others.

Well, I am utilitarian, I am a cynicist and I am machiavellian, these three often come together.

My point is that when you stop viewing others from the perspective of how useful they are to you (for friendship, or sex, or both) and begin to appreciate them for their beings you will begin to find many more people attractive for friendship and sex.

Not sure, because I am picky in other things too, be that music, fruits at the store or video games.

[–]SeemedGood0 points1 point  (11 children) | Copy Link

Also, I bet you did not have sex at all back then, as you were insecure apparently you were not Chad, but your type girls were Stacies.

I’ll take your bet. How much would you like to wager?

Not sure, because I am picky in other things too, be that music, fruits at the store or video games.

And this is also my point. People are not objects for use and consumption, like music, fruits at the store, and video games. Once you lose that solipsistic view, the nature of your sexual attraction changes.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

I’ll take your bet. How much would you like to wager?

Then you are saying you were insecure Chad?

People are not objects for use and consumption

They definitely aren't, but as I am not sexually attracted to men, I am not sexually attracted to many women.

[–]SeemedGood0 points1 point  (9 children) | Copy Link

I am asserting that if you’re willing to make that bet I’d be glad to take your money. I want either an Arch KRGT-1 or a Bimota Impeto motorcycle and I can’t really justify the cost of it at the moment. Perhaps you’d be willing to help me fund it via your bet?

But I do agree that women are masculinizing themselves as they are emasculating men in our current society and thereby making themselves less attractive. It’s hard to appreciate the beings of others when they do not appreciate their own beings.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy Link

But I do agree that women are masculinizing themselves as they are emasculating men in our current society and thereby making themselves less attractive. It’s hard to appreciate the beings of others when they do not appreciate their own beings.

No, it is not about women masculinizing themselves. I am attracted to women with conventionally not very attractive personalities, which in many aspects are masculine.

It's just as I am not getting a boner by looking at a dude, I am not getting a boner by looking at an unattractive girl.

[–]SeemedGood0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy Link

It's just as I am not getting a boner by looking at a dude, I am not getting a boner by looking at an unattractive girl.

No one does. My point is that what you find attractive changes as you take a less solipsistic and utilitarian view.

[–]rus9384Misanthrope0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

Then I can also say you can make yourself attracted to men.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Knock off your incel whining.

The complaint about how hard dating is for men isn't about "even though I'm fat and neckbeardy, how am I going to get the pussy I'm entitled to". Nobody is entitled to anything from anyone else.

The problem with the way dating works is:

Men are told never ever ever to approach a woman, because stopping her on the street is catcalling which is rapey, approaching a woman where you work is sexual harassment, approaching a woman where she works is stalking, approaching a woman at a hobby gathering or a conference is why women feel unsafe every waking moment, etc.

What men are expected to do is never approach women, but always be putting themselves out there approaching women. Because even though relationships are good! Faint heart never won fair lady! Just do it! Just ask her! None of them would ever DEMEAN themselves to talk to men they're interested in, I mean, GOSH, what if I was rejected? As a woman, I have feelings you know. Men don't but women do, whine wah whine.

The fact that they're only interested in the top 20% of men, and expect male sexuality to be a female consumer good that's only "on" when they want it (but be instantly ready, imbue the man with psychic knowledge about how to get her off that even she doesn't really possess, etc.) is orthogonal to all this.

The biggest problem is this confusing ball of weird expectations. "Of course you're single, you're not out there asking people out and mingling!" "Uh, okay, we're going to need you to leave, a girl says you made her feel slightly uncomfortable by buying her a drink when she's just here to attend the lecture." "Okay, male sexual attention is rape culture, the male gaze, and everything wrong and horrible and rapey" "As someone with a reactive sex drive, I want you to make the first move, I want to feel desired, I want to be swept off my feet".

But of course women have the glib answer for the fact that this is a pointless wad of shit, and that's "JUST BE PSYCHIC. APPROACH THE GIRL WHO WANTS TO BE APPROACHED HOW DO YOU NOT KNOW THIS". And then "be right back, going to AskMen to ask them all if this guy likes me, because I can't tell. Gosh why are men so confusing." Also amusingly they tend to post things to the Internet like "the top 25 times men didn't get the hint". Right next to the article on "affirmative consent" and "how approaching a girl outside of explicitly getting it in writing in triplicate she wants you to fuck her should be criminialized."

But then again, this is a gender that has magazines that put "Easy weight loss! How to lose 30lb in 24 hours without even trying by using grapefruit rind tea" right next to the "10 recipes for scrummy ooey gooey fudge sludger brownies".

So how the hell else does it stand to anything other than reason that they constantly post that men are shit and how much they goddamn hate them all, and then in the next breath "of course we're sex-positive and love you all, where the hell did you possibly get that idea? The problem must be you, you no-game short cocked short mom-basement dwelling beckbeard incel should-be-on-a-watchlist loser."

Sigh. Where are all the good men?

[–]throwyourboat344 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Sigh. Where are all the good men?

Having hot sex with the women that want them while annoying mgtow continue to whine

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Why is there no fucking downvote button on this subreddit if you're male.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

can't believe i read all of this

[–]webernicke7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Empathy in the form of "wow must suck to be you, bro" won't help. What does help is empathy that comes in the form of honesty.

Because let's be real. Most of that empathy gap is coming in the functional form of outright denial that a problem exists, or if it does exist how it's really men's fault and patriarchy backfiring or some shit.

It's like when dudes are talking about how sub 6ft men have an uphill battle and then you always have females and blue Pillers coming out the woodwork like "no here's my single outlier chadly dwarf to disprove your therory." It's all about the just world bullshit and always remembering to uphold that women are wonderful effect

Ain't nobody care about "empathy" just for feels. People just want to hear it raw about what they're really up against instead of being told that they're imagining shit all the time. Rather have a girl tell me straight up yeah you need to either be gifted, rich, or put in a shit ton of effort because dick is cheap, than to just give me a pat on the shoulder and say she hears my pain lol.

And before anyone says it, yeah, females on this board will be more upfront about what dudes are facing in the market. And yeah dudes get angry when they hear it. But they should be getting angry. Nobody likes hearing about how they're at a disadvantage. Doesn't mean they don't need to know about it. At least then they can make a decision based on real shit.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

In a world were women could empathize with the plight of men ...instead of getting a "ewww. no way in hell loser" when he asks her out ...he will now get "you're so brave for putting your heart on the line but unfortunately you're not my type"etc....

In the end it's the same result. No hugs, no kisses, no love , no intimacy and ...most important of all(no matter how much you guys try to pretend it's not what you want) ......no pussy.

Not sure this is what is even meant by sympathy when others are talking about it, but the latter kind of reaction would make it far easier for many men to not be freaked out and demoralized at trying again with someone else.

But on the other hand, many women assert that polite rejections are often met with hostility and anger. I'm not sure how starting off with escalation helps those situations, but apparently they think it seems to.

[–]oneprettycoolcat1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It won't.

But it might make you feel a bit more human to have someone empathize with you.

[–]trail222 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

They may not wanna fuck them, but the wont think they are losers. Thats how empathy works to my understanding.

And yeah. You can dress better, lift weights and try to flirt and still fail at dating.

[–]passepar2t3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Empathy isn't going to help but maybe demonize them a bit less?

[–]decoy88Black Male in London3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

In my life. The only people that have ever really given a fuck are close friends and immediate family.

Noone else gives a shit.

[–]confusedapplepie6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Guess these posts will never stop...

Your problem is that you don't value empathy- all you want is sex. But guess what, we live in a society, we gotta live together. This works perfectly fine without sex (gosh so many people on this world I haven't slept with and yet I get along with them) but without decent social skills? Not so much.

But most important: it's not my goddamn responsibility as a woman to make sure every guy gets pussy!!

Just no, this is not how it works. Do I blame a squirrel for not letting me pet it? No, it's a squirrel busy with squirrel stuff, end of the story.

[–]ifelsedowhilelocal cop - cherry top6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

if the beta masses who make up the backbone of society can't have their minimum share of pussy, society will be negatively affected.

[–]Salty-Bastard8 points9 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

With the rapid rise of narcissism empathy has taken a back seat. With the polarization of society the "we're in this together" attitude is hard to find nowadays. When's the last time we performed a selfless act of kindness? Volunteer without an agenda? Donate anonymously? Made another humans life brighter even for a second, without any expectation of acknowledgement?

That shit takes practice and we're so worried about blaming and hating that we have pushed compassion to the curb.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

I honestly and for real spent five years every weekend at South Davis community hospital. With a young boy who at 2 years old was in a car crash and paralyzed. I gave him a huge chunk of my life. His name was Danny. He was a man still and still had the dreams of a man.

In the hell clown world the real world? This that half a decade gains me no points. I would never tell a girl I gave a poor sad baby half murdered at birth that much of my life and my love.

I'll never tell any girl. Little squatamalen do tell me about your dreams of a girls vagena, tits, and vag.

No one else will ever care. I'll care about the cats they meow. The rabbits? Eat away, cry away, do cry to me about being a quad at three. Worse.

Cry please guys. But make sure you all tell me how much you really care.

[–]Salty-Bastard0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

I've never discounted your personal experiences and have given you the benefit of doubt more than once. But we'll never be on the same page.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I'll never be on your page boomer bro what happened to you? A slow float on the river replaced the people you never had anyway.

I'm your people. I wish I could make your people be your people. Enjoy your slow death. Let me know I can hustle you a raft and at a discount.

[–]Salty-Bastard0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Stay in your lane wino, I don't like people like you.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh I love normiecons personally. So original. That's why they can't stop winning.

[–]87AudreyHorne0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

I honestly and for real spent five years every weekend at South Davis community hospital. With a young boy who at 2 years old was in a car crash and paralyzed. I gave him a huge chunk of my life. His name was Danny. He was a man still and still had the dreams of a man.

What happened to him?

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

He died at 19. Those hospitals don't give very good care and he was ventilated.

[–]poppy_blublack midget wine mom 🍷3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

When's the last time we performed a selfless act of kindness? Volunteer without an agenda? Donate anonymously? Made another humans life brighter even for a second, without any expectation of acknowledgement?

Lots of people do all this and more. You like most men on this thread are ignoring the fact that incels heap a lot of hate on others but then sit and scratch their heads as to why no one is playing the violins for them.

I don’t show empathy for people who don’t have it for anyone else.

They’re 100% responsible for how they’re viewed.

[–]Plopolok0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

If you've never seen a lonely man that wasn't hateful, you haven't looked very carefully.

[–]poppy_blublack midget wine mom 🍷1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

I've never seen an incel that wasn't. They are the ones who spend all their time trying to convince the rest of us that they represent the norm (not that we're buying it cause we're not).

[–]Plopolok0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

Even in this post, you have comments by men saying that they don't have sex and saying it without hate.

[–]poppy_blublack midget wine mom 🍷1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Being celibate doesn't make you an "incel" anymore than being white makes you a neo nazi.

That said, there's A LOT of incels on this sub. A LOT.

[–]Plopolok0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

If you define incel as "celibate with hate" then of course all incels are hateful.

[–]poppy_blublack midget wine mom 🍷0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

They define themselves that way with what they say and do.

[–]mydikishomofobik2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Sympathy is useless. But kicking someone when they're down can bring a negative response.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

concise

[–]Orange_PaisleyOrange pill is best pill2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I would argue that many women really do empathize/sympathize with lonely men. I know I usually feel more awkwardness and embarrassed when a man that I am not attracted to hits on me, than I do contempt (unless said guy is a real jerk about it). When I was single I might even had occasionally conceded to a coffee date or a drink with a guy who just didn’t do it for me, to be kind or to see if he was perhaps hiding a sparkling wit or secret charisma. But you are right, I didn’t generally find myself wanting to sleep with these men.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Some men equate mommy love with womanly love (this is not the right way to put it, here's my usual pre-vyvanse and nicotine disclaimer). I really feel like the issue can be simplified down into these men are struggling to believe that women won't love them like their mothers did, they can't just show up, they have to bring something to the table to make her want him.

[–]wotsittoyou2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

"sympathy/empathy" is code for "will keep talking to me even though I'm a sad sack" which rightly or wrongly they probably see as likely to increase the chances they'll get laid. I mean thinking about it... the point at which their hopes are usually dashed is probably the point at which she turns and actually walks the fuck away rather than keeps interacting, it must seem that if they can just keep her talking, just keep her interacting.

[–]crackrocksteady7buying gf7 points8 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

They want pity fucks and pity blowies and pity parade you around the friend circle

[–]ThisIsJustATr1buteHas what plants crave5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yes empathy here is a euphemism for freely distributing sex. Add a dash of territorist tactics (“it’s to prevent men from getting violent”) and that’s incels.

[–]The3liGator2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, not to mention all the straw we have to clean up after them.

[–]jkonrad-Pill3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It’s not just from women, they want everyone to pity them, because then it excuses them.

People who got dealt a shitty hand but are doing the best they can with it don’t make self-pity posts on anonymous Internet forums.

It’s people the people who have given up, or at lest aren’t trying as hard as they should, who make these posts.

[–]angels_fan_rp7 points8 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

If guys weren't terrified of being creep shamed and #metoo'd, there'd be a LOT more approaches.

Some of those approaches might turn into something.

But as of right now, they risk of approaching comes at such a high anxiety cost that most men won't do it.

So yes, it would have a massive positive effect for men.

[–]whichbladeNA Paler Shade of Purple0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Men have struggled to approach women before 2017.

[–]angels_fan_rp4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Women have creep shamed men for decades.

[–]The3liGator-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It is becomibg worse though

[–]FlavFal31F4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

The woman could take a more assertive and egalitarian approach in dating because she knows the guy is inexperienced and won't live up to more traditional gender roles where he's expected to lead.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

So a loser?

[–]FlavFal31F-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Depends on who you ask. For me? No.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Aren't you dating a 22 year old?

[–]FlavFal31F0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's correct.

[–]bonusfruit5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Its true that empathy or being nicer about rejection won't help. My position is that brutal honesty will help. Make it very clear to all unnattractive but useful guys that they will never have a chance. To the point where the hopeful, ernest friend hoping attraction will blossom becomes extinct. Women will lose their beta bucks, but it's the ethical thing to do. Women don't deserve friends that they have obvious sexual power over. Men are super friends for women in ways they are not for their guy friends. It's a social paradigm we are all so accustomed to it doesn't even register as an abuse of power. It is. Men must be forcefully purged of their idealistic views about womens nature early, instead of growing up with a rosy view that women are not shallow, love men for deep qualities, etc, only to get redpilled later and be bitter and depressed about it. Complaints about the friendzone will cease if women take action.

[–]Willow-girlProud 2 B an American farmer1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Have you ever heard the term "mercy fuck"?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

no

[–]LeJacquelopeHaving a son is child abuse1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Sympathy/Empathy? Nah. What we need is an annual Hunger Games for men. If we go by blooper/feminist and even TRP theory, the harsher the meat grinder, the stronger we make the surviving men, and before long humanity will exceed House Jurai and the Timelords in its splendor.

(Sarcasm, of course.)

[–]LillthOfBabylon2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Before someone claims this isn't a thing and nobody is asking for sympathy/empathy.

That's a lie they tell themselves to whine for the sake of whining.

Women will still look at him and see a loser.

Also, understanding someone doesnt always mean you sympathize with them. People WANT to help them, but these guys wont help themselves.

[–]meeselbon5733 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Recognizing the truth of women’s dehumanization of men helps men stop caring so much about women and get on with their lives.

[–]throwyourboat341 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Lol

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

It could help to keep women from contributing to these lonely men and their decline into misogyny and hatred and perhaps help with the whole feminists-hating-men thing and blaming them for everything.

Perhaps it could lead to more viable solutions as to how we can really, truly help these men.

I also think men are the ones that could use a bit more empathy and compassion when it comes to women, but that's a whole other discussion I'm not so sure I feel like having atm.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!3 points4 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

You think girls going mommy mode will help you? We've been trying to help you for decades. Mommy moo cow isn't your answer and I'm sorry about your mom dude. Girls are pretty great, lovely sweety pies, so nice, but never ever ever is your girl, your fwb, your GF, your wife, ever, at any point, ever going to be your mom. Might as well just set yourself on for if you think a woman will stand for you to be another child.

Fifty years of women stating this over and over and over and over and over. And guys still can't figure this out

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

I'm a chick though

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-2 points-1 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

Oh I don't really offer any advice to girls. I wish you the best of luck but I'm not a girl and while I can observe I can never be. Girls need to start giving other girls advice.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

What are you talking about? Women have been giving each other advice forever.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-2 points-1 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Women lie to each other and burn each other down to a degree you can only imagine. Guys are gold in how we treat each other. Girls? Girls care nothing nothing about each other.

Guys win again

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

If only I was a woman I could possibly imagine how women interact with each other.

If only.

Women in competition will tear each other down, as will men. I'm talking about matriarchs teaching their own.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Girls teach each other nothing because no girl can raise in the fsm by telling other girls what she learned from failure.

Guys can though

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

My mum was not in the same FSM as me. She and her sisters and my grandmother taught me plenty. Same as I give my pre-teen niece genuine, useful advice when she asks me. Advice that comes from failures AND successes. I have a much younger friend who often comes to me and asks my advice, because she sees that I'm in a happy marriage and she wants the same. I'm not in competition with her, so I'll gladly share everything I know.

You're completely clueless when it comes to female dynamics I'm afraid.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Scary I'm afraid as well.

But do tell me more about how I'm not real. No dokey I love church. I mean it's just no windy wonder. So weird. Weirdness. Just lie to my face some more

[–]LillthOfBabylon-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

perhaps help with the whole feminists-hating-men

So that's fine to believe all women are feminists, but as soon as I saw all men are rapists, I'm the guy?

Perhaps it could lead to more viable solutions as to how we can really, truly help these men.

Not coddle them, give them medication, and stop feeding them a victim narrative. Could funny how we're criticizing feminists and yet we're perfectly fine when men like feminists!

I also think men are the ones that could use a bit more empathy and compassion when it comes to women

And are these the same men who think rape victims were asking for it?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

And are these the same men who think rape victims were asking for it?

I think my phrasing was wrong, but I meant to imply that men are the ones that have less empathy/compassion for woman than the reverse.

[–]Plopolok3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

My opinion is that for now society in general should just be more "conscious of the situation". How things suck for lonely men, but also for women, the general problems of the dating environment. It's not about fixing things right now by handing pity fucks, it's about gradually improving the whole environment. If it's too late for today's incels, so be it, I just want things to evolve in a better direction. And I think that if women looked more closely and with more empathy at lonely men, if they understood how/why they are in this situation, in many cases they'd realize that they could have been better partners than many men who do have success with women. Which means that even keeping the same incelness rate, there's a big potential for improvement.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Can you imagine a worse fate than your wife/GF feeling pity towards you? The last thing any guy should ever want is for the girl of his (wet) dreams to have mommy feelings towards him. The goal is for the sweet lass to look up at you, her lord and her master, the man who cares for her and makes sure she is free to act in safety inside his parameters.

You're not missing anything bro. Sad sack guys? I mean I do feel for them. But it is a failure to launch. They don't know how to play amongst the stars. They sit on the ground and watch. They haven't even started. And when they do? Why? They then think they know it all, because they've been watching for so long. Watching what caught their eye.

I've known women who have tried, out of immature desperation, to lock down and lead a guy who has failed to launch. They don't want to fuck him. They don't want him to think of them as a sexual being because that's not why he's there. Maybe he tries to take a racy (oh so racy lol) picture of her in her panties. She will freak out. That's not what this guy is here for.

Hey she can just call the cops like the train wreck who called into the latest free domain radio call in show. She wants to be a mom. She wants to be a wife. Finds a guy with a good job. He wants to take pictures of her in her panties! Not a hardcore video, nor pictures of her in the skimpiest of the wonderful things you can find at discount stripper dot com. Not, "you look so good girl, so good, with my dick in your mouth let's get a picture", not anything! Poor sucker just wants to take a picture of the girl in whatever plain panties she's wearing and she literally calls the police on her live in boyfriend.

The fate of the poor sap who only watches and fails to launch. The fate of the man who a girl gets with not out of pity but out of her own selfish desire to be a wife and mother but not put in the work to do so.

Hey at least he got laid. The guys who just want to be the guy a girl "understands", 'oh my little wee one life sure is hard' will not even get to fuck. They get nothing. Whine away. Sure life is hell and it sucks pretty bad. I do have to laugh at all the failures to launch though. They think they had it hard. They think it's not their fault cause deep inside they don't think they actually want to be a failure. Whatever. They matter so little I'm feeling bad I've written this much about them.

[–]X-BIRTThe Green Pill0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Not disagreeing with you or anything, but you'd be way easier to read if you used hyphens.

[–]korkyshadow1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Blue pill people think women can be reasoned with. You can't logic yourself into pussy.

[–]ggkkggk1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'll say this before I start reading the comments myself.

I recently learnt that too many times do men make these fantasies we have for women, find a way into reality , we put women on Mountain like pedestals.

Most can never truly reach and when we're disappointed our own hopes break us

No disrespect to women but a lot of women don't deserve a lot of men , similar to there's a lot of men out there that are with women who they don't deserve

Sympathy feels nice but only when you truly don't want only want sympathy, A lot of guys really just want attention like everyone else or pussy

My advice is to stop chasing that image, wait till until that image finds you and it feels natural , maybe it might not work out or maybe it will , hope your luck is better than mine , i completely accept that I'm going be single for a long time and I'm okay with it

And if I get some sympathy along the way he'll make being friends and staying friends easier

[–]quercusp1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

But maybe i'm missing something

Yes you are. There's more than just pussy:

  • Feelings, emotions, being comforted, being supported maybe. So being rejected with sympathy is less painful.
  • However, being rejected the crude way although more painful in the end might effect less damage to your soul, because it makes it possible to develop resent against this woman and getting over her sooner.

So the effect of being nice and sympathetic to the one you reject is two sided. But for sure we can't just say it doesn't matter. In any case me personally I'd really like women had more empathy for the emotional struggle of men.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm just fine with the acknowledgement and recognition of the difficulty.

Most women don't even seem to have that, because it's so easy for them that they can't comprehend it. It's like how a rich kid can't comprehend being poor unless they actually get exposed to it. Most women won't get personally exposed to it until old age, and that's assuming their husbands die first.

[–]Bntt891 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

So female sympathy isn't worth anything realistically these men need to be taught to have something in their life. You should learn that you dont need anyone else to feel worth anything, but society keeps putting forth this notion that if you want to be a real man you need a women. Rather we should enforce giving all ppl(boys in this case) that they need a purpose. At least they will have something.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

How exactly is womens sympathy/empathy going to help these lonely men find love/intimacy/sex?

The same way "recognizing climate change" is a thing. You have to recognize something before addressing it.

So let's pretend women finally understood how hard dating is for the 'average' man.Women still won't want to fuck him. Empathy won't make her find him attractive. Sympathy won't make her proud to show him off to her friends.

In your thought experiment, a woman who understands the dating market would stop giving bad advice to their male family and friends and give correct ones. Also, they would recognize there is a problem and could give psychological help, not making them feel like they are alone against the world.

In a world were women could empathize with the plight of men ...instead of getting a "ewww. no way in hell loser" when he asks her out ...he will now get "you're so brave for putting your heart on the line but unfortunately you're not my type"etc....

Yes. But at least they would know other people understand and would also know what exactly what is that they are doing wrong.

In the end it's the same result. No hugs, no kisses, no love , no intimacy and ...most important of all(no matter how much you guys try to pretend it's not what you want) ......no pussy.

Yes. But a mission in front. A quest. Get enough value to earn it. I was lucky, I discovered the red pill knowledge on how to get a woman's intimate behavior while I was still a teen.

Many were not so lucky, and failed to recognize the truth for years. Some still cannot see it. Virgins to this day.

The fact is ...no matter how much empathy/sympathy they get. They are still going to have to learn how to dress better. They are still going to have to lift weights 5 days a week for a least a year and a half. They are still going to have to get over their social anxiety and learn to flirt.

Tell them so. Don't sprout bull crap that women have any other way of love. And you will find the average male value skyrocket.

How exactly is womens sympathy/empathy going to help these lonely men find love/intimacy/sex?

  • Correct knowledge on how to obtain value.
  • Not feel like being alone against the world.
  • Feel like you are understood.
  • Correct feedback on what to be/do.
  • Basis so the problem can be addressed.

[–]czerdec1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Who said it would? Not being irrationally hated by half the world is a civil rights struggle, not a quest for pussy.

You can argue that if the irrational hatred of men was removed, men would be happier in themselves and would perhaps be more attractive as an indirect result.

[–]Xemnas811 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

As women are the consumer class and also the (narrow) majority voting bloc, gaining their sympathy is necessary to fund state-corporate-sponsored campaigns into men's health and wellbeing.

Peak hypergamy is just a symptom of gynocentrism

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

this is the most ....interesting ...comment

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[–]geyges🐇4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

I just can't get over the amount of put-downs in some of these posts. "fat" "poorly dressed" "lifting weights"... like what the fuck? These presuppositions are just odd.

I see so many fat poorly dressed douchebag dudes with absolutely decent looking women that this just kind of doesn't mesh with reality. Like there's more to relationships than just looks, isn't there?

Sure there's a collection of females that are cruel, materialistic, sluts. But there's also normal girls out there that are ok with jeans and t-shirt, $30 sneakers, and don't need you to look like a supermodel. Some might even care more about you're being a good human being than having a 6-pack.

I'm not crazy. You're crazy.

[–]OfSpock0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

These presuppositions are just odd.

If you assume that they're fit and attractive, then the fact that they're incels (but they don't seem to know why) is even weirder.

[–]Zippo-Cat-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You're not crazy, you're just crazily ignorant.

[–]the_calibre_cat0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It isn't

[–]rapplepop0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Just look at it the other way. Imagine some 250 pound woman with facial hair insisting you had no empathy for her because you didn't want her to be your girlfriend or give her the D.

You'd probably think she was being unreasonable and annoying and you wouldn't want to be around her if she was acting like that. If you're unattractive, whether it's physically or socially, you should really just accept that a smaller pool of women will be drawn to you and you can choose to either fish in that pool or just learn to lead a happy single life.

There's a lot of good things about being single. You get a bed all to yourself, you don't have to share all your time and money, you don't have to answer to anyone.

[–]robertfrostt0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Relationships are by nature, natural. Any attempt to force some sort of attraction is fruitless.

[–]CainPrice-1 points0 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

I'm with you. Loser men don't deserve empathy.

If people treated them well and were understanding instead of pissing on them, they'd feel better about sucking at life.

I don't want loser men to feel okay about sucking at life. I want them to stop sucking and do better.

[–]The3liGator3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

That's not how people work though. They will just get depressed and/or angry.

[–]atlantic68Purple Shill1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

And? Why do we care

[–]The3liGator0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

You don't have to.

Why are you here if you don't care?

[–]atlantic68Purple Shill1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Wait what? This isnt braincels lol. Its ppd. It isnt lonely loser anonymous..

[–]Plopolok0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

I don't want loser men to feel okay about sucking at life. I want them to stop sucking and do better.

"Sucking at life" is a very imprecise way to describe them. It implies that a toxic thug in and out of jail with 3 kids from 3 different women doesn't suck at life while an honest incel nerd with a productive job sucks at life. That's not how they feel, for them doing better means becoming more honest and having a more productive job. And this won't help them with women, so you can't just tell them "stop sucking at life" if you don't first enlighten them on the nature of their inefficiency with women.

[–]RoninCDN0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

To play devil's advocate, how is a toxic thug a sucker if hes banging two girls and is passing along more offspring then the beta?

[–]Plopolok1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

I can imagine that this would be the devil's point of view indeed. But there's quite a lot of "loser men" who don't share it, so just telling them "you suck" without explanation isn't enough to make them do better.

[–]RoninCDN0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

Right but to play devils advocate, how is being an asshole bad if it means you bang 24/7???

[–]Plopolok1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I'm not saying it's bad. Basically someone said that empathy would decrease the losers' motivation to change, and I said that the priority should be to give them instructions on how/why to change.

If you really want an answer: a society composed of toxic thugs is less efficient than a society composed of honest productive persons. And good/bad in the context of character personality are often defined as good/bad for society, not for the person themself.

[–]RoninCDN0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Again I fully agree with you and your answers are spot on. I just want to explore the TRP side of things.

Devil: There are thousands of betabux that pay for society and are cucks no matter what. Therefore thugs should flourish and bang the top 80% of women and let the betas of society raise and care for them. Its only 20% of men being alpha thugs anyway.

[–]Plopolok1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Sure devilbro, enjoy the decline! No one cares about the betacux, whether empathy would help them or not doesn't matter, it's not gonna happen, society will keep cucking them as much as they let themselves be cucked.

[–]LeJacquelopeHaving a son is child abuse0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

And at what point, after how many men get radicalized, do you realize this strategy is a total and irrecoverably failure?

[–]Shadow_Of_Chad-Lite-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Just because you have alot of empathy doesn't mean you'll use it or make the right choice with it

[–]blackedoutfastRed Pill Man-2 points-1 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

well if they were sympathetic/empathetic enough and actually believed that there was no other way to help these guys, then yes, women would take one for the team and fuck them. it's just not a very realistic solution because most women aren't nearly that empathic/sympathetic in general, and especially toward typical weirdo incel types.

but people are always doing dumb shit out of sympathy, like inviting crazy crackheads to come move in with them. it's not completely unimaginable that a woman might consider fucking some a relatively unattractive dude to help him get past losing his virginity.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

women would take one for the team and fuck them

i said i wouldn't argue. but no they wouldn't

but people are always doing dumb shit out of sympathy, like inviting crazy crackheads to come move in with them. it's not completely unimaginable that a woman might consider fucking some a relatively unattractive dude to help him get past losing his virginity.

i see what you're saying. but nah

[–]blackedoutfastRed Pill Man0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

yeah realistically it wouldn't happen for a typical weirdo incel, but it's theoretically possible if the guy was relatively normal and just having trouble losing his v-card.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

maybe if she was adventurous enough

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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