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Some men complain that with time their wives/women don't want to have sex. That sex fades over time and if a women got married "she should fulfil her duties as a wife, and sex is apart of that deal"

To the men who believe the statement above is true. Have you ever looked inward to see what you have been doing - Have you kept up the emotional satisfaction that is needed in a relationship?

If you don't think a "happy wife is a happy life" (in terms of the basics as in keeping romance, surprises, making her feel special is important and no that's not beta) since you are now married you no longer have to "win" her over - why do you think the women you are with owes you the same amount sex she gave you in the beginning ?

Women love sex. Don't expect a women to cater soley to your sexual needs if you are ignoring the emotional upkeep that is also needed for a relationship to continue.

Just like how you think she should "give you duty sex" I also hope you're giving "duty emotions" / actions.


[–][deleted] 40 points41 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Sex and/or emo maintenance done without expectations support the continued effort of the other. To me the very term "relationship" describes an easy and happy flow of both between people; and how willing the couple is to make sure it stays that way. If you're going full quid pro quo and doing a tally you've got bigger problems than "equal effort" and something is either missing or fundamentally broken in the relationship. The most insidious in a happy couple being taking each other for granted over time.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Yes. Once someone feels they are being taken for granted and makes this known and nothing changes ... The relationship is fundamentally over.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I think it can change, as long as it's from a simple lack of awareness. If it's fueled by bitterness that can't be let go of then yeah. It's a slow but sure death.

[–]Theseus_The_KingI’m a lady king dang nammit!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is the cause of my last breakup.

[–][deleted] 29 points30 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

To the men who believe the statement above is true. Have you ever looked inward to see what you have been doing - Have you kept up the emotional satisfaction that is needed in a relationship?

I do not have a relationship right now, but I had an EX for 5 years. I kept maintaining or increasing her emotional satisfaction each passing year. Always putting my best, giving gifts, going on dates to places I hate, helping out in her studies.

She paid me back by decreasing sex, each year, less and less. All ended when she tried to cheat on me with my brother. And told him she cheated on me with a colleague. You tell me, you expect we, the ones which ask for a bit of our happiness, really did not try to maintain everything else stable first? Heh. Funny right? I even tried to make her even more happy. It is like I am a moral human being.

since you are now married you no longer have to "win" her over - why do you think the women you are with owes you the same amount sex she gave you in the beginning ?

She didn't. But I persisted, and here we are. I imagine if my brother was not that much of a moral guy. I could have married this terrible person. A woman who cheats because "I'm too good, but not attractive enough". Heh. You tell me, what do you think we are? Some kind of egotistical person? Women?

[–]TheBookOfSeilAn ounce of Snu Snu is worth a pound of cure8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I even tried to make her even more happy

That’s where you probably messed up. There was likely something else happening that you weren’t aware of (like maybe she simply lost interest in you. It happens. People change), and you failed to recognize it so your wife proceeded to walk all over you for not reading her mind.

It’s sad to see relationships end up this way but I don’t think human relationships are supposed to last longer than necessary anyway.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

She wasn't a wife. And I doubt anything happened. Her entire family and friends(except for the mother) were with me in that I trust them to tell me if this was the cass, if anything, at least her brother would help me. She was just a she. That is it. She may have never expressed it but I think it is only plain old hypergamy . It was the 3rd time already. I had to learn at some point.

In the end it is all good. Because of it I discovered what would be the TRP assumptions. And later the sub. I do not regret it, it is because of my experience with women that now I have a way better sex life without the need for a relationship. You only learn by trying right?

[–]FairlyNaiveRed Pill Man4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Feel your pain. Suppose the username is relevant?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You mean Workaholico? It is an really old joke from my friends with my real name.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

time to swallow that red pill.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I already did my friend.... long ago.

[–]reppid1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

"going on dates to places I hate"

Fundamental problem here. It's the classic example of I went to the opera with my wife, what else does she want, why isn't she happy.

You want to find shared experiences with your partner that you both enjoy. If those don't exist, then why are you together?

Also, the lack of understanding why that didn't make her happy is the problem. You went through the motions but didnt understand what they meant.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I think I may not have expressed myself correctly. I meant to say I hate places full of people. All of them. I already am in a classroom with 140ish students daily, plus coworkers. I hate going anywhere near people when I dont need to. Thus any place a normal woman would like is hell for me. Like the mall or cinema.

My idea of a good time is staying at home doing nothing in particular. And a relationship based only on that will never work. Even the shyiest of women cannot understand the lures of doing nothing. And I do not accept being alone. So I accepted doing what I must for a relationship. And it did not work. Plus. The op is about self sacrifice.

You think I am the only one who passes by it? Look at the likes. Only high valued man and women have the privilege of only doing what you like. And in case of men, just barely. If you do not understand that sacrifices may have to be done. Okay, but do not try to so this to your partners, they deserve better treatment.

I understand very well what happened now, I just didn't at the time, sorry, bad english. Unfortunately I was a victim of hypergamy. I was close to my peak, but my chad brother was even higher. Same for the guy which she cheated on me. My resources were secured. Now she needed a better man's DNA.

It took some years but I understand now what means to be "too good". I will not make the same mistake again. But hey, at least I learned my lesson. It is because of her and the women previous to her that I got to the red side. Now I am way happier. Plus, my back does not have to sustain another person's weight.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I mean sometimes you just run into assholes. Shit happens.

[–]wtffellification14 points15 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

> since you are now married you no longer have to "win" her over

from what I'm able to grasp about marriage overall.. this is the mistake that probably causes most divorces. This mindset is what causes you to take your partner for granted. Yes, I am right. When you marry a person, that's not the end of the 'play between the sexes'. It's really a beginning

> why do you think the women you are with owes you the same amount sex she gave you in the beginning

It's more that she owes it to herself. because she used to enjoy it and if she doesn't now, there are issues to be adressed. I want my partner to be happy because I want to be happy. and if 'duty' is the first thing that comes up to describe a marriage, than, well, I find that sad

[–]decoy88Black Male in London1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

from what I'm able to grasp about marriage overall.. this is the mistake that probably causes most divorces. This mindset is what causes you to take your partner for granted.

I agree. It really does feel like a lot of the complaints and cynicism for “marriage” stem from this point.

[–]YetAnotherCommenterPurple Pill Man, Sexual Economics Theory12 points13 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Don't expect a women to cater soley to your sexual needs if you are ignoring the emotional upkeep that is also needed for a relationship to continue.

You're forgetting that sex isn't the only part of emotional upkeep. Women need to make their men feel loved, cherished, wanted, etc. and sex is part of this. But starfishing him doesn't give him that feeling.

Of course relationships need to be a fair bargain with both parties taking care of each other's desire to be desired! I don't think any sane person would disagree with that. But the reality is that these days, some women (not all, obviously) believe that after they're married its basically got to be a one-way flow of resources and emotional labor from him to her in exchange for her just starfishing on Valentine's and perhaps his birthday.

Not to mention, contemporary marriages are burdened with unrealistic expectations. She has to treat her like a fucking princess and live up to her ideal of Prince Charming otherwise She's Not Happy and he gets slapped with a huge divorce bill.

The fact is that everyone needs to start recalibrating marriage expectations. If they are realistic, they'll realize there should probably be much less marriage.

[–]cxj75% Redpill Core Ideas8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

No I do not want duty sex, I want enthusiastic sex.

The problem here is that there aren’t enough hours in the day to work to support a family and seduce women to the extent they desire/require for sex. Tons of couples wind up working opposite schedules and kids require absurd investment of time and energy these days because average is over, the internet is the default parent and heroine is just around the corner.

I don’t think people have the time anymore. I think what happens is people don’t really get quite the timesuck that kids are, and the men give the women what they want assuming women will still continue sex as before the marriage/kids. Then they get pissed when on top of ten hour work days plus childcare they are supposed to find time to romance women, when a lot of times those women lack the energy to even be romanced assuming the guy puts the effort in.

Lots of marriages are just doomed to DB imo, people are overworked and their backs hurt. Marriages are like the baby turtles hatching and trying to make it down the beach while the seagulls have a field day

[–]Barely-moralMostly red though15 points16 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I do my part. I expect her to do her's. That is it. If I need something that she is not providing, I speak to her in a clear way. If she needs something that I am not providing, I expect her to speak to me in a clear way.

Sure I have my duties and it is on me to fullfill every single one of them. I can't demmand anything if I am not willing to be judged by the same standards.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Good to know! U seem fair.

[–]MGTOWtoday16 points17 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Typical hamster. If a man is unhappy it’s his fault. If a woman is unhappy it’s a man’s fault. This is just another reason why men should avoid marriage. Hookers always put out, and can’t divorce rape you.

[–]RandomxTandem 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy Link

My husband used to be very sweet before we got married. After we got married he had us combine finances, quit his job to go to school full time and have me support him, so while I work full time he became controlling about money (I dont have health insurance because he doesnt want me to pay for it). He yells at me for things all the time. He threatens to clean out our savings or go after alimony if I tell him I'm not happy anymore and I dont know if I can keep doing this. Its just not the same sexy relationship when you get married and it turns out the person you married isn't that same sweet and caring person they were when you were dating. So yeah it's hard to have sex with the entire dynamic changes after marriage. If you ask me, I was the one better off not getting married here.

[–]2thinktwoHigh 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy Link

Not to belittle your situation, but if we were to take your example and just substitute out "husband" and "he/him" with "wife" and "she/her", you'd pretty much have a typical shitty marriage/alimony trap unhappily married men face all the time.

[–]goatismycopilotJohnI'monlydancing0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

So get divorced. He has given you the blueprint for the rest of your marriage. Do not do something stupid and get pregnant. Skip out he can threaten anything he wants see a lawyer and get actual informed advice instead of listening to bullshit.

[–]CainPrice4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

The idea is that a marriage isn't supposed to be a transactional exchange. A wife is supposed to have sex with her husband because she wants to. Not because he's earned it through positive emotional behavior. And a husband is supposed to treat his wife well and care about her happiness because he wants to. Not to earn sex from her.

These are two -independent- obligations. It's silly to proclaim that if a woman stops having sex with her husband, it's clearly because he's failing to satisfy her emotional needs.

That's actually part of the lie that has made red pill men so angry. The notion that a woman must feel emotionally satisfied before she has sex with you.

A woman will go home with a man from a bar or from tinder that she met an hour ago, just for sex. She's not emotionally close to him. She doesn't want to date him. She just wants to enjoy a hook up.

Girls will let strangers finger them on the beach and in bar bathrooms, give guys blowjobs in their cars on their lunch breaks from work, maintain casual relations with hot ex boyfriends who merely need to text "I'm in (city) this weekend, what are you doing tonight" and she'll show up at his hotel room that night, and so on.

Women have and enjoy sex just fine, without emotional closeness. The gall to hold her husband to some kind of special standard by withholding sex that she'll have with strangers from him, when he's the one guy she should be the most eager and enthusiastic to have sex with - the guy she actually married - is anger-inducing.

Women have and enjoy sex without emotional closeness all the time. If a wife isn't fucking her husband, it's because she doesn't want to. And there's no behavior he can do to buy sex or earn it from her or manipulate her into it. The very notion that if he does emotional stuff for her, now he's earned it is creepy and pisses his wife off.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

These are two -independent- obligations. It's silly to proclaim that if a woman stops having sex with her husband, it's clearly because he's failing to satisfy her emotional needs.

That's actually part of the lie that has made red pill men so angry. The notion that a woman must feel emotionally satisfied before she has sex with you.

You’re so close here but....

Girls will let strangers finger them on the beach and in bar bathrooms, give guys blowjobs in their cars on their lunch breaks from work, maintain casual relations with hot ex boyfriends who merely need to text "I'm in (city) this weekend, what are you doing tonight" and she'll show up at his hotel room that night, and so on.

Women will do this. Sure complete emotional satisfaction/closeness isn’t needed but what’s also absent is those strangers aren’t causing emotional dissatisfaction either.

In a marriage where a woman is emotionally dissatisfied with their husband, it puts them off the thought of sex.

Similar to ‘like, dislike and indifference.’

[–]CainPrice0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's a good point. Essentially, women hold different guys to different standards.

If you're a fun guy she's meeting for a hook-up, the standard is being cute, fun, confident, and not too clingy or needy or creepy. If you fuck that up, she'll stop feeling it and won't have sex with you. You failed to meet the standard for a casual sexual encounter.

If you're her boyfriend, however, she has different expectations of you. Even if you're fun, attractive, and under other circumstances, she might have hooked up with you, you're not a fun hook-up guy. You're her boyfriend. So if you fail to meet her boyfriend standards and don't measure up as a boyfriend, then even though you're a guy she'd otherwise have hooked up with, you failed to meet the standards she set for you, so she's disappointed and won't have sex with you.

If you're her husband, her standards for your behavior are even greater, and if you fail to measure up by making her feel happy and complete and appreciated and lucky and in love, and so on, then even though she may still be attracted to you, she'll be disappointed when you don't measure up to the husband standards and won't have sex with you. If you were just a fun casual sex guy, it would be on, but you're her husband, so you have to do more for her to get the same sex she had with other guys just for being cute and fun.

If the main reason a guy seeks out women is sex, then he should avoid relationships and stick to casual sex. Because women compartmentalize guys, and once you're no longer a casual sex guy, she'll cut you off if you don't meet whatever other standards she's holding you to.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Women enjoy sex without emotional closeness to men who she doesn't care about emotionally nor are interested in that. If you're in a relationship - emotional closeness, along with other things is what defines that. Otherwise you're just strangers having sex.

Emotional fulfillment is a big part of it. But that's why it's a powerplay on both sides. Obviously a man can't be a door mat and be with someone who doesn't respect him - and people who show disrespect are very clear. It's people who don't see the signs and continue digging a hole when they don't realize their only giving not receiving. (Men and women)

Keeping a woman happy and her wanting to fucking you all the time is something that not alot of men have figured out. A woman you're in a relationship should want to fuck you, obviously, but in order for a want to come into place a desire needs to be felt and that comes from the other person being desirable. Whether its a man or woman. For a women that is not a man being her slave and doormat only, for men it's not women being bitchy, over weight and overbearing.

Just like if a woman gained 50lbs while being together - some men no longer want to have sex because her body is no longer desirable. She no longer has what he wants. If a man becomes distant, cold and uninterested in keeping up with emotional closeness she will no longer want to have sex.

A relationship is work, effort on both sides for the needs of the other.

[–]CainPrice2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

A "relationship" isn't "work". You have this weird idea that once a man agrees to a relationship, he's agreed to a different standard of behavior before he's earned sex. You'll fuck a guy from tinder you don't like that much just because it's fun and feels good, but won't fuck your husband just because it's fun and feels good.

He's held to a different and more burdensome standard in your world when you should want to have sex -more- readily and -more- easily with somebody you actually like.

When you'll go home with a guy you just met for casual sex, but require your husband to behave in a different, more difficult way before you'll have sex with him, that's loving your husband less than you love a stranger.

[–]A-New-Fawn3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Sex plays a vital role in a relationship/marriage, as does emotional support. Dont marry someone if you dont want to fulfill both of those needs, even if that comes at an expense to you sometimes.

If a man (or woman) completely disengages with the marriage and his wife, and expects sex, then he's in the wrong.

That said, most issues with men wanting sex in a marriage doesn't come from that. At least, not in my experience.

I feel like this post is just OP saying "well you should be all fair". And sure, you should. But in most dead bedroom situations, that's not what's happening. It's not a failing on both parts, it's a failing on one person's part because they view their partner (or their needs) as not important enough.

[–]toronto87 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy Link

If I fulfill my part of the deal she should fulfill her part of the deal. If she doesn't I don't have to and vice versa. Though obviously the LTR/marriage will end or be an unhappy roommate situation in the latter case.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Exactly. Both people should be looking at it like this - though hopefully the realize and needs / wants can be met with communication

[–]SimulatedEnvironment 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy Link

Booty sex. We said booty sex. Not duty sex.

[–]metaltriteMagenta Pill3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If you’re not careful it’ll be doodie sex

[–]Whiteliesmatter12 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You might have this the wrong way around. It could just as easily be “don’t expect a man to pay attention to your emotional upkeep if you aren’t catering to his sexual needs”. The two have an intwined relationship, they feed off one another. You can’t say which one causes the other.

However, you are right about one thing: too many people (both men and women) let themselves go in relationships and wonder where the sex went (women and men complain equally about their partner not catering to their sexual needs, if not slightly more women. Go over to r/deadbedrooms if you don’t believe it. In spite of most redditors being men, it seems like there are more women than men). What is the first thing people do after a breakup? Hit the gym. Well if a stranger isn’t willing to fuck your gross fat self the way you are, why did you expect your partner to?

Also, sex IS a necessity IF you want to control your partner’s sexuality and forbid them from having sex with others. You don’t get to have your cake and eat it too. But if for whatever reason you lose interest, whether that reason is medical, loss of attraction, whatever, then you of course aren’t obligated but you forfeit your right to be telling them who they can and can’t fuck.

[–]NalkaNalkayou call it virtue, I call it cowardice14 points15 points  (50 children) | Copy Link

A lot of the sexual and romantic problems that couples have in marriage is that men and women view marriage differently.

Men view marriage as retiring from the dating game and not having to deal with that bullshit.

Woman view marriage as the highest level of the dating game. Hard mode.

The clash of those views results in lots of dashed expectations and unhappy people.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.13 points14 points  (44 children) | Copy Link

Don't women also view it as retiring from the dating game? When you get down to it, what's with their offence at the idea of "forever girlfriend" when discussing marriage? I mean really what's so offensive about the concept of a forever girlfriend. It's not longevity of the relationship--forever covers that. It seems to me that they also want to slack off from being a girlfriend.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Because marriage is a lot more symbolic of a deep commitment than bf/gf. Women like that. Being a perma-GF is not a enough and to a lot of women, almost downright insulting.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (22 children) | Copy Link

Don't women also view it as retiring from the dating game?

To me? In a way but where they can finally center their attention on one man and feel free to do so without the fear of being nexted after a few months.

It seems to me that they also want to slack off from being a girlfriend.

Interesting enough, the women who are in my circle took on more responsibility as being a wife. She was now a reflection of her partner and vise versa what they did represented them as a unit. What has been taught to women is to not act like a wife if you are not one. Probably why men end up saying "why buy the cow if I can just have a glass of milk"

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.2 points3 points  (21 children) | Copy Link

finally center their attention on one man and feel free to do so without the fear of being nexted after a few months

What about marriage specifically makes you feel less insecure about being nexted?

The other part of your answer is so vague that I have no clue what it means nor whether guys would even desire this switch from girlfriend to wife.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (20 children) | Copy Link

It is a much larger committment therefore I would hope more conscious decision making comes into play. Marriage isn't just an " i love you, you love me, let's get married" that's a recipe for short disaster. It should be a serious consideration knowing it won't always be a walk in the park and binding people to their words. Therefore if I'm going to "nexted" I know it's something deeply rooted in unhappiness not because he is simply saw some good ass.

This can go for men too, not only women.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.3 points4 points  (19 children) | Copy Link

Maybe you don't have no-fault divorce in your locality, but "binding people to words" is all but lipservice at this point. All marriage really adds is economic entanglements, perverse incentives and dilemmas that instill fear.

[–]Barneysparky8 points9 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

That is simply not true. Divorce is one of the top reasons for stress in adults, for both men and women. Men are more likely to remarry in the first year.

Those are facts. Indisputable. People don't divorce willy nilly like a girlfriend you see a couple of times a week vs someone who you are with or communicating with 24/7. I think some of you young people either haven't had parents who love and work as a unit.

It's like you are each other's "parent" in that you have breakfast together, discuss your day and schedule, someone else knows where you are at all times.

That's why people mate, so someone will worry if you come home at night or plan your funeral. When that breaks, it's friggen horrible.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

Most marriages end up in divorce and most of those divorces are initiated by women. Women are also much more likely to divorce a husband if he makes less money than her and marriage rates are known to fall if women make more money.

The idea is nice, but at the end of the day it's nothing more than power and money. When women get neither out of it, they reject it.

[–]DemonConsulting4" Dragon5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Most marriages end up in divorce

This is statistically false. Even if you count second and third marriages the divorce rate has at no point exceeded 50% in the US and the peak was in the 80s-90s with the boomers who where pressured into marrying young. It also includes serial divorcees who keep getting married and divorced multiple times.

The divorce rate for first marriages today is closer to 30%, meaning around 70% of first marriages do in fact stay together which, by definition, is “most“.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

What do you base this on? The divorce rate for marriages in the first 15 years is about 50%, meaning that in the average lifetime, most marriages do end up in divorce.

[–]Barneysparky0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

Most marriages in my demographic suceed. Might even be 85% in my demographic. What's your demographics that you include yourself in the everyone gets divorced thing?

There are groups like: teenagers who marry young with no idea that their partners want any dream but making them happy who end up divorced almost always.

Somewhat intelligent people know that marrying before you are emotionally mature is foolish, so they don't .

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

It's pretty convenient to make claims like "most marriages in my demographic succeed" when you give neither the statistic nor mention what your demographic even is.

The divorce rate when taking into account the entire lifetime is quite a bit over 50%.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Divorce being a "stress" is the point. It's a barrier erected disincentivise separation. That can be a good thing for hiccups and temporary struggles. But it also raises the bar on the amount of suffering that is tolerated in the in relationship. A failure mode is it's an excuse to relax and not be on your best behavior.

So the real question is what is the better incentive structure? One with a high barrier for exit where your partner is traped or one with a low barrier of exit where you must work to preserve the union? Studies show that partners who never married are both happier than partners who married. And studies also show it's women who are happier in the forever girlfriend context. Combined with your points about women initiating divorce and men remarrying, it just suggests that women hate marriage.

Also a "forever girlfriend" isn't someone you see a few times a week.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Every part of our society instills fears. That's what happens when governments take over. Are you not going to work in your life because of the fear working installs: being broke/homeless if you don't take part in society? Only a few people can be financially stable while not relying on a employer to pay them so they can live.

A successful life long marriage is incredibly rare. We were sold that everyone deserves a happy relationship/life no matter what income level , career you come from simply because we are human. If people take that red pill and realize they don't deserve love because they breathe but because it's something they have to continuously work on and when they find another like minded person - government laws won't effect them because they are doing it for something deeper than that. They know there's an out but are confident in each other that they wont take it.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

They know there's an out but are confident in each other that they wont take it.

It seems to me that you have walked a circle back to square one on the forever girlfriend vs marriage question. If the security of the relationship both trivializes the government's threats and is independent of the government's existence, then there remains absolutely no logical reason to demand protection from the government in case the guy should happen to see some good ass.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Do you think a part time worker and a full time worker are the same? Do they have the same benefits? Are their paychecks equal? Is their segnority the same? No. You can also equate it to working as a contractor for company and seeing the clear difference between security, work performed and perks full timers get though the job is the same.

I'm not going to argue with you about why marriage is important to a women or why it's deemed as beneficial. Im not here to change your mind. It's unfortunate that governments are now so deeply involved but if you're with someone who you deemed worthy of marrying government involvement is simply a factor not a deferral. You can say the logics boil down to social status, religion, stupidity, love, whatever you want.

But if you want to continue the job position you have, excel in it, have managers recongize it, add more work, duties and responsibilities to it and still keep you at low pay and at the same position with no promotion. I'm sure you will start to reconsider your efforts.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

It's interesting that you make the analogy to employment. Lifetime employment with the same employeer is gone and branch swinging between employers is how to get raises and promotions nowadays.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (19 children) | Copy Link

No. Women view marriage as retiring from the freaky deaky sex on demand game. “I’m a WIFE. I don’t have to do THAT anymore. Blow jobs and anal eww gross. STFU and get your ass back to work, asshole!”

[–]CainPrice2 points3 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

The worst part of that is that it's unconscious for most women. They don't realize they're doing it. If you tell your wife that your sexual frequency has dropped, she'll insist that's not the case. She hasn't even noticed the lack of sex. Sex just hasn't been crossing her mind, so neither has its absence.

The very second you marry, something inside of her is repulsed by the changed power dynamic and she stops having sex with her husband without even realizing it. In her subconscious mind, he transformed from the kind of guy who can get sex from women without a relationship to the kind of guy who needs to hand over the bank account for a mere chance that a woman may, in her sole discretion, choose to have sex. Marriage literally makes a man subconsciously repulsive to his wife.

[–]PennnyLameMY VAGINA IS A SOVEREIGN NATION!! ✊🏼3 points4 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

This is an insane claim. What are you basing this off of? I have not experienced this and neither has any wife I have any regular discussions with.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

He’s basing it off the thousands of hours he’s spent circlejerking with men in MRP and dwelling in confirmation biases.

Conveniently, the fact that the last time such men took their wives on a date was a month after their 3yr old kid was born, the “I did (blank) for you just because I love you” which used to be an at least once weekly event is now a bi-annual one. And the last time he lifted her up in front of his friends or even said one good thing about her, was on their wedding day. Coupled with the fact that he just ignores everything she says unless it has something to do with sex. ...are all forgotten or left out.

What woman wouldn’t want to have sex with such a gem! It truly boggles the mind.

[–]PennnyLameMY VAGINA IS A SOVEREIGN NATION!! ✊🏼2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

You’re likely not wrong.

I can only speak for myself but I think of the little (non-monetary because these men always think it’s about money) things my husband does for me and I wonder how many similar things these men are doing? Specific, meaningful compliments in and out of sexual situations, sending me articles he thinks I’d like, making me coffee or sometimes brunch when I am working from home and he has the day off, asking me to go for a walk with him, doing laundry and hanging my bras all over the house as a display that he has remembered they don’t go in the dryer. When men say flirting with or being considerate to their wife is soooo much work because getting married was supposed to be ”retiring” my eyes nearly cross from rolling so hard.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Prime example you have no idea what life with newborns is like. Any of those things is met with insta-trigger bitching about only caring about sex and recitation of the laundry list of other things you should be doing.

[–]PennnyLameMY VAGINA IS A SOVEREIGN NATION!! ✊🏼2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah, I’m gonna go out on a limb and say even a woman with a newborn isn’t going to start insta bitching about her husband wanting sex if he brings her a fucking cup of coffee.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Valid

[–]CainPrice0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy Link

Two questions:

  1. Are you married?

  2. Do you have children?

Talk to a 31-37 year old woman with 2 or more kids that are 5 or older. Not about this, specifically, just about sex. Remember that this isn't a conscious thing she's doing. She's not aware that she's having less sex with her husband, and if she is, she thinks it's just natural when you're married and have kids for the sex life to die off for the most part.

Most 31-37 year old women with 2 or more kids that have been around for at least 5 years are not having sex 3+ times a week with their husbands. It's more like once, maybe twice a month, and they're not the ones initiating. If their husbands didn't push the issue, sex would vanish entirely and the women wouldn't even notice. Not all, sure, but most married with children women in that position do not feel strong sexual desire for their husbands.

[–]PennnyLameMY VAGINA IS A SOVEREIGN NATION!! ✊🏼2 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

I am married. No children. I do have very close friends with children and while they have lamented libido issues since giving birth and feeling non-sexual about their breasts while nursing, it’s nothing like what you’re describing. They are very aware of their lack of desire, are upset about it and consulting with doctors and friends on what to do.

Given my oldest sister’s ever expanding litter, I know they were fucking after baby #2 (enough to have 2 whoops babies after they said they were done with kids) and my middle sister has had their children walk in on them multiple times which her and my BIL think is hysterical every time. They are all still boning.

I fully understand that sex ebbs and flows due to life and babies and hormones and bodies but what you’re describing isn’t what I see from women I know well enough to have knowledge of their sex life.

[–]CainPrice1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Maybe we run in different circles. I'm in my late 30s, and most of my friends are upper middle class US suburbanites married to former college sluts. Most got married and started having kids in the 25-28 range, and like clockwork, by the time the first kid turned 7 or so, most of them are getting handed divorce papers and telling me that they haven't had sex in over a year.

These aren't bad guys who stopped dating their wives. They're upper middle class dudes who work hard, make 6 figures, coach their kids' soccer teams, get a babysitter once a month to take their wives to a fancy dinner, take ski and beach vacations every summer and winter, and from the outside looking in look like happy marriages. On the inside, their wives disrespect and nag the shit out of them, nothing they do is ever good enough, they never have sex, and as soon as the kids are all old enough to walk, their wives seem to divorce them, take the kids, and move back closer to their parents.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

I think Pennny is correct that women are very aware of lost libido. I used to think my wife didn't realize it, but I was very, very wrong. Women have expectations about when things should return to normal and panic if things don't work out that way. They will try to hide it because they know how "I love you but I'm not in love with you" is going to go down. I don't want to dwell on dark times but my wife was terrified I would find out things were different. For the guy, it's extremely discouraging and soul-crushing and very easy to just throw in the towel and give up trying to restart the pilot light.

I will tell you though that there are rhing in what you describe that don't add up. Particularly the kid's ages and walking etc. The milestones to recovery are more when mother starts to sleep through the night for a few weeks. That's when some normalcy starts to return. For us this was when each kid was about 1.5yo. It depends on a number of factors and parenting decisions. If someone had just told both of us to expect it would take that long we would have avoided a lot of suffering. As you may imagine our communication wasn't so hot.

Anyway when you say they are divorcing with 7yo kids and haven't had sex in a year, I guarantee the husband was going through the motions and stopped authentically dating the wife and let the fire die. Additionally, they probably needed some spine.

[–]CainPrice0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

It doesn't matter how it's worded. You're expressing the same idea: that women don't just stop having sex with their husbands and treating them worse unless the husband is bad and starts sucking - it's always the husband's fault and always the husband that changed and the wife sucking is just in response to the husband starting to suck. While sure, that's the case sometimes, completely dismissing the idea that a significant number of women just plain get disinterested over time, especially after marriage and especially especially after kids even when the husband is great and hasn't changed much if at all is a bit of a just world fallacy. A non-insignificant number of women become shitty even when their men don't suck and do everything right. Not every wife, sure, but enough that we can't just shrug and say, "The husband probably just stopped doing date nights and never helped around the house" every single time we hear the same old story from countless men.

Kids make marriage hard. There aren't enough hours in the day for most families. Dad has to work long hours (and sometimes Mom, too) to make enough money to afford the mortgage in the suburbs and the SUV payment, somebody has to get the kids to all of their kid activities, stay home when a kid is sick, do all the baby crap if any of the kids are still babies, plus the house has to stay clean, clothes have to get washed and put away, dinners have to get cooked, groceries bought, bills paid, and a thousand other home maintenance tasks. There aren't enough hours in the day and enough money in the bank for a husband to keep dating his wife like they're still in college. Getting a babysitter on Saturday night and going out to dinner becomes a tedious proposition - date night depends on babysitter availability, and that 15 dollar glass of wine becomes a 50 dollar glass when you factor in that you have to pay the sitter. It becomes easier for the husband to just watch the kids while the wife goes out with the women for girls' night. Groups of housewives dominate just about every concert venue in my city, and every trendy bar not filled with kids.

The fun trips to resort hotels and beach destinations they used to take before kids are replaced with family vacations to grungy waterparks and theme parks, where they have to lug children and luggage around and the vacations become more work than their actual jobs and they can't wait to get home.

Marriage turns out to not be a fairy tale. Her husband is always at work, there's never enough time or money, dates become once or twice a month dinners depending on when they can get a sitter, and vacations become work. Meanwhile, she looks across the street and sees the neighbor's husband out in the yard at 4:30 playing catch with his son, while his wife drives a newer and nicer SUV than she does and wonders what her husband is doing wrong. Why is he working longer hours for less money and never around to play catch with the kids? Her neighbor's marriage looks great from the outside looking in, especially on Facebook. Meanwhile, her neighbor is looking across the street at her and wondering why her husband can't work a few extra hours like her neighbor's husband does so she can wear fancy dresses and go on more date nights like the neighbors across the street.

[–]TheLongerCon0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

and most of my friends are upper middle class US suburbanites married to former college sluts. Most got married and started having kids in the 25-28 range, and like clockwork, by the time the first kid turned 7 or so, most of them are getting handed divorce papers and telling me that they haven't had sex in over a year.

You must have an odd friend circle because statistically(assuming you're American)only around 25 percent of marriages between two people with a bachelor's degree end in divorce, and I'm guessing that number is much lower in the education/income range that's considered upper middle class.

Not saying those remaining 75 percent are high quality, but if virtually all your friends marriages are ending in divorce than your friend group must be an extreme outlier sample of the American middle upper class, or you have some sort of confirmation bias which makes me question the rest of your commentary on marriage.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes to all of it. That’s why a man has to make clear that he can giveth and he can taketh away. If she starts taking him for granted or if the sex falls off, it is over, done, finito, immediately, and he will get someone else to fuck him. And all his time, labor, money and resources will be gone immediately too.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Seriously. Why are women doing things as "girlfriends" they don't want to actually do as "wife" and then getting pissed off that guys see it as a bait-and-switch? It like watching a bunch of used car salesmen complain about lemon laws.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The only men that have a right to claim “bait and switch” are ones that are still doing all the lovey dovey things that they used to do before they were married an had kids. Including the frequency of dates, text messages, surprise flowers and gifts, spontaneous trips, breakfast in bed and all the others. Otherwise, he’s being a hypocrite.

Show me a guy who’s wife has stopped having sex with him or doesn’t have as much sex as before, and I’ll show you a guy that hasn’t taken his wife out on a date in 6months or does nothing around the house and plops down in front of the tv for the entire night after work.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Men view marriage as retiring from the dating game and not having to deal with that bullshit.

Translation: Men view marriage as not having to try anymore and put in as much effort, as they believe that they’ve got her and her commitment is already in the bag.

And these are the same men that’ll come to complain that she did a “bait and switch” on them. Lol!

[–]NalkaNalkayou call it virtue, I call it cowardice0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

That's what I said.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Oh so you admit that men do slack off when married because they feel like they don’t have to try anymore?

Lol. Alright then. Certainly agree with that.

[–]NalkaNalkayou call it virtue, I call it cowardice0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's the whole point of my initial post. Men and women have different ideas of what marriage is about. Neither of them is wrong or bad, it's just that those two visions are incompatible so compromises have to be made.

It's particularly bad for the solipsistic that don't even view the other sexes preferences as valid.

[–]abaxeron✴️Indian Programmer4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If you don't think a "happy wife is a happy life" (in terms of the basics as in keeping romance, surprises, making her feel special is important and no that's not beta) since you are now married you no longer have to "win" her over - why do you think the women you are with owes you the same amount sex she gave you in the beginning ?

Cuz I pay the bills just like in the beginning, duuuuuuuuh ?!!!!!

[–]stats1354 points5 points  (23 children) | Copy Link

Sex is a necessity. Either I get it from the wife or I get it somewhere else. So either sex is a duty of the wife, or its ok for me to have sex outside the relationship.

The difference is that for anything that I am unwilling or unable to provide, I have not issues with her getting it elsewhere, whereas woman tend to have issues with men getting sex elsewhere even when they aren't providing it themselves. If she thinks its a necessity to have some (blank) and I don't give it to her, then she is free to find someone else who will. If I minded that she do it with someone else I wouldn't have denied it to her.

[–]TheSuperStink 1 points [recovered]  (12 children) | Copy Link

It’s a strong want, it is not a necessity.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

Sex is necessity. By marrying a man forsakes his right to look for sex elsewhere. Now he's stuck with wife and she should provide it to him no matter she is in a mood or not.

[–]TheSuperStink 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy Link

Again, it’s a strong want, not a necessity. Water, food and shelter are necessities.

You don’t die from lack of sex.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

It is a necessity. You have no idea and low T.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑2 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

The attitude of providing sex whether or not she’s in the mood, is why men get starfish sex.

I guess lying there with a repulsed expression on her face or staring at the clock as she thinks about all the other things hat she would rather be doing while she waits for you to finish, is #winning to some men.

Go figure.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

Same for men

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

Lol no they don’t. Most men are pathetically desperate for sex. It’s why they harp on and on about sex being a duty. Cuz they know they aren’t getting it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

They can get it elsewhere

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

And so will she. And she’ll have a much easier time doing so.

Win-win.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yes so what's your point again?

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

That was it. Glad you agree.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

So if for whatever reason you were no longer having sex with her or you could no longer have sex with her (due to medical issues), you would be fine with her getting side dick?

Lol. Okay.

[–]stats1350 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Just as I expect my wife to view sex as a duty, I also view sex as a duty. Since I do care that if my wife gets side dick, I won't say no to sex with her. If I can't get it up, then I'll take Viagra.

If its an extreme case where my dick literally falls off, then of course she can have side dick. I'm not going to expect her to abstain from sex the rest of her life just because I can't provided. Of course, I also don't really see the point of keeping a wife at that point. A wife doesn't really have that much use to me if I don't have a cock (or can no longer use it).

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is the same attitude that wives have whenever their husbands no longer have a job. Yet for whatever reason, they’re criticized for leaving him for that reason. A lot of husbands don’t really have much utility to their wives beyond bringing home a stable paycheck, so I have no idea why they expect her to stay if he’s unemployed. Makes sense that she leave him tbh.

[–]mwait0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

Sex is a necessity. Either I get it from the wife or I get it somewhere else.

This. I have said this countless times but it still bears repeating.

If you are not having sex with your husband.... Expect that someone else is. It's really that simple.

If you are a man in a marriage with a dead bedroom, don't feel guilty about getting your dick wet elsewhere. Sex is part of marriage. If your wife isn't giving it to you, go somewhere else.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

The wife is probably just going to cheat back.

Cheating as payback is one of the common reasons for female infidelity.

You can get a side chick, but I bet dollars to donuts that your wife is going to get side dick. Win-win, I guess.

[–]mwait0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Some will, some won't.

But you'll be getting laid.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

And so will she. Most likely with new, exciting dick.

Again, win-win.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Emotional fulfillment is apart of marriage. Hence why there is physical cheating and emotional cheating.

If you don't want to bother with it, don't get mad when she starts getting close to a co worker or male friend that shows her more attention. They text and talk all the time, hang out together, and have playful banter back and forth.

[–]mwait0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

I didn't say anything about not supporting your wife. All I said was, don't sit around with your thumb up your ass if your wife isn't having sex with you.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Just like someone shouldn't sit around and wait for their partner to have a romantic relationship with them. If her man's not giving it to her, based on your logic - she should go get it somewhere else.

[–]Jackpot807Purple Pill Man1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Imo if a state of stagnation (IE, wife doesn’t give sex, or the husband doesn’t pull his weight around the house, or both) exists in the house, the surest way to eliminate it, is to start giving the husband sex or for the husband to actually be the man of the house and be responsible.

It’s an olive branch, an unspoken request to have things return to the way things were, back in the good old days. One could provide the other with what they need for, say, a year. And if the other does not reciprocate, then either confront them about it, or leave the relationship knowing that you at least tried to make it work.

[–]classicrando1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

you are now married you no longer have to "win" her over - why do you think the women you are with owes you the same amount sex she gave you in the beginning ?

why do you think the men you are with owe[s] you the same amount emotional and financial support he gave you in the beginning ?

[–]welcometothejlRed Pill Man1 point2 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

I think part of the disconnect here is that men don't feel appreciated unless they are having sex. If a guy works, pays the bills on time, provides a comfortable home and a reliable car to his spouse, he should get some appreciation sex. Instead you want to hold out because he doesn't do anything to emotionally support you? I get that men can be the emotional equivalent of a plain bowl of oatmeal. But try not to take him completely for granted. The above advice is good though, and definitely worth considering if you've hit a rut. Just remember the other side of the story.

[–]CatchPhrazeRed is For Rudolph2 points3 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

Yeah but like 80% of married women work as much as their husbands do. This provider stereotype is kinda old hat. These days a guy isn't footing the bill by himself so if he wants sex he needs to bring something else to the table.

[–]welcometothejlRed Pill Man0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy Link

If that's true, why do >80% of women get child support or alimoney after a divorce? That number should be closer to 20%.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

I guess it’s the same reason why women tend to have primary custody

[–]welcometothejlRed Pill Man0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy Link

I think I get what you're saying, women get child support because they are the ones that want to be with the kids while the dad's just want to go out and act like they're still in college. Let me tell you that is false. Family courts are tilted towards women, period. Many men don't fight because it's insanely expensive and your chances aren't good.

I'm a good example. My ex and I settled out of court. We have 50/50 custody. I still pay the same in child support as someone who skipped town and never sees their kids. And she has a master's degree and makes $70,000. The law is written so that no matter what, the parents aren't seen as equals, and the vast majority of the time guys get the raw end of that deal.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy Link

Family courts are tilted towards women, period. Many men don't fight because it's insanely expensive and your chances aren't good.

Well we can say that but it’s hard to no for sure. It’s like the chicken and egg. Are men not fighting for custody because they don’t want it or because they’re being told they’ll lose and be worse off? That kind of thing is hard to quantify.

I'm a good example. My ex and I settled out of court. We have 50/50 custody. I still pay the same in child support as someone who skipped town and never sees their kids. And she has a master's degree and makes $70,000. The law is written so that no matter what, the parents aren't seen as equals, and the vast majority of the time guys get the raw end of that deal.

Fair enough but if you as the man had primary custody, how would the courts have decided the split?

[–]welcometothejlRed Pill Man0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

It might be hard to quantify, but it would be an easy fix. Have laws that treat both parents as equals by default. (Unless of course domestic abuse, drug addiction, child abuse, or violent crime etc.) As a dad I should have the right to my kids half the time and my ex half the time. If I stick to that obligation I should keep half of the total amount of child support that the state decides my kids need. For the guys that want to flake out, treat them the same as now. Easy.

The way that would work is, let's say my kids get $20,000 in support now. Because I make 60% of our combined income, I should be responsible for $12,000 of that amount, and she is responsible for $8,000. The way it works now is I pay her $12,000 a year. So essentially she keeps all $20,000 despite only having 50% of the responsibility and costs.

The way it should work is because I make 60% of the income I still put up $12,000 and she puts up $8,000. Then because we split the responsibility 50/50, I get $10,000 of that $20,000 and she gets the same. That should be the default. Then a judge could tweak it from there based on the needs of each parent/kids.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Have laws that treat both parents as equals by default.

I’m pretty sure they do? What fucks it up is a judge’s personal bias + however good/bad your divorce lawyer is.

50/50 default custody split is fair to everyone but the child. As they need some sort of stability in their life. And 3.5 days at mum’s, then 3.5 days at dad’s just isn’t practical. So a primary carer has to be selected.

The way it should work is because I make 60% of the income I still put up $12,000 and she puts up $8,000. Then because we split the responsibility 50/50, I get $10,000 of that $20,000 and she gets the same. That should be the default. Then a judge could tweak it from there based on the needs of each parent/kids.

Sounds reasonable. How’du split custody 50/50? I also thought everything is calculated based on the child’s needs, or at least what they can convince the judge the child needs.

[–]welcometothejlRed Pill Man0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

You said mum, so I'm guessing you don't live in the US. My kids have plenty of stability with 50/50 custody. With two loving parents both houses feel like home. They do well in school and aren't troublemakers or anything. It's fallacies like that that marginalize men. And it also kind of negates your point that women want the kids and men don't. How do you know they aren't being pushed out as caregivers because of bias?

In the US child support is calculated based on a study by the USDA every 3 years or so. It's not a needs based system. What they do is add mine and my ex's incomes together, compare it to a married family with the same number of kids and what they would spend, and decide that is the amount of money the children need. Then the ex gets to keep all of that money. I explain it a bit better in another comment if you want to check my history like 5 comments down or so.

The way we split custody is I work half of the days of the week and she works the opposite half. We're lucky our schedules have that flexibility. So I work 4 days one week, have 3 days with the kids, she works 3 days that week, and has 4 days with the kids and vice versa.

[–]decoy88Black Male in London0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

UK native here.

And it also kind of negates your point that women want the kids and men don't.

That wasn’t my point at all.

How do you know they aren't being pushed out as caregivers because of bias?

We can’t know that, just like we can’t know it isn’t that. We only have the stats on who gets the custody.

In the US child support is calculated based on a study by the USDA every 3 years or so. It's not a needs based system. What they do is add mine and my ex's incomes together, compare it to a married family with the same number of kids and what they would spend, and decide that is the amount of money the children need. Then the ex gets to keep all of that money.

So this happens regardless of how the custody is split? For example if the child spends weekends with the other parent, that figure wouldn’t change if they didn’t see them at all?

The way we split custody is I work half of the days of the week and she works the opposite half. We're lucky our schedules have that flexibility. So I work 4 days one week, have 3 days with the kids, she works 3 days that week, and has 4 days with the kids and vice versa.

Works for you but I imagine other couples aren’t so flexible.

[–]CatchPhrazeRed is For Rudolph0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

I don't know, maybe because it isn't fair to make a woman pay 100% of the cost of a child they had together? Most child support payment are under $500 dollars a month.

The average cost in total to raise a kid for a middle class lifestyle is over 200k. Woman get hit harder economicly when a couple has a kid and divorces. Not the man.

[–]mwait0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Lol

[–]welcometothejlRed Pill Man0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It doesn't cost $200,000 to raise a child. Those estimates, which come from the USDA, are flawed. I'll give you some reasons.

1 pre baby if you have a car and it costs $400 a month, suddenly when you have a kid half of that car cost, $200 a month, is considered a baby expense. But your costs are the same minus a car seat and possibly more miles driven. So this cost is overestimated.

2 pre baby if you have an apartment with a spare bedroom and it costs $900 a month, suddenly when you have a kid a portion of that living expense relative to the ratio of the spare bedroom to the size of the home, is attributed to the cost of the baby.

3 these costs are not based on needs, but what a married couple with the same income as you and your ex would spend on a child. So again two incomes under one roof are probably going to have more disposable income to spoil a kid than 2 incomes under 2 roofs. The estimates don't take into consideration any belt tightening.

Most child support is based on an income shares (worst name ever) formula. What they do is they add up both parents income, come up with a number, say $20,000. So let's say mom makes 30% of the total and Dad makes 60%. Dad would pay $12,000 to mom and mom would keep the $8,000 that she is responsible for. What if Dad has the kids half the time, does he get half of the $20,000 needed to raise the kids? I can tell you in my case, no.

Since Mom gets all the support, is she responsible for all of the payments? Absolutely not. Kids do sports? Both parents have to pay.

So let's take another look. I pay $12,000 a year for two kids that I have half the time. I have to provide a home, a car, clothing, and monetary support for medical and extra curricular activities on my own, plus pay ($12,000 x 18 =) $216,000 over 18 years. Over half of the cost of raising the kids. Plus I actually raise the kids half the time, meaning by our own overinflated USDA estimates, I'm doing $200,000 worth of the work. So let's see, raising 2 kids for 18 years should cost $400,000, my efforts have me at $416,000 over 18 years. My ex literally has 0 financial skin in the game. What were you saying?

Edit: I wrote this on mobile and don't know why some is in bold.

[–]passepar2t 1 points [recovered]  (4 children) | Copy Link

Have you considered that women respond only to negative reinforcement? And that keeping them insecure and afraid that you'll leave is the only sure way to keep them invested in loving you both physically and emotionally? And that keeping your woman "emotionally happy" just makes her lose more respect for you and lose what little sexual desire still dangled from her single remaining erogenous neuron?

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

I think it's unfortunate that you think that - because women who end up feeling emotionally unfulfilled are the ones also leaving.

Maybe some women respond to negative reinforcement but not all.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Just like men who feel sexually unfulfilled.. so who's to blame exactly? If a wife requires tingles everytime then she choose bad husband who is bad fit for her.

You are rationalizing bad behaviour here. Nothing more

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Do you think I'm going to say that men don't feel sexually unfilled is their fault?

No. A woman should be keeping up her side as well. I'm saying that she won't if she feels she has to nag her husband to do something, or to pay attention to her or to make her feel special. A woman doesn't want to fuck her man-child partner. A women doesn't want to fuck her man that makes her feel like she is his mother.

I'm not talking about reward sex or reward emotional fulfillment. I'm also not talking about an act of kindness to receive sex on that day. I'm speaking in the grand scheme of a relationship, build up resentment and feelings a women ends up feeling when the relationship as a whole is no longer emotionally fulfilling that causes a gradual decline in sex with her partner.

And no this doesn't always happen in ever single case that a woman no longer wants sex. But if you speak to women you'll hear it is a common trend that acts of love from her partner has also declined, (life isn't perfect we all know that) effort from her partner has also declined once he "has her" therefore causing her to lose attraction in turn making her not want to have sex.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The point is, two married people, living under the same hood for many years become TOO comfortable with each other. Married men drop their SMV significantly in their wifes' eyes. Women know their husbands have already committed to them, they have the upper hand.

[–]shonenhikada1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

This sounds like sex is a treat that must be earn by a man for doing his wife's deed. Essentially, how is this any different from an escort telling you that you got to pay 2k for her to drop her panties for you, fake moan and pretend she likes being with you?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Exactly.. OP is pure solipsism.. she's unable to see ot this way

[–]big_boi_big_mac3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

women's duty in marriage is to love, while the man's duty is to provide. However only the man's is required by law to uphold his end of the bargain. Not supporting your wife is considered a form of abuse, and is considered a crime. I don't think a man has ever gone to the police and said 'my wife is not upholding her duties in marriage by not providing me with sex'. If he has he is laughed at and is told to go fix his issues himself.

Im all about shared responsibility, women and men should have equal responsibility. If a man is the sole breadwinner, you bet his wife should be cooking and cleaning that house of theirs. If they both make the same amount of money then they should split housework and cooking evenly.

Still i wouldn't support anyone ever getting marriage because of how entitled women have become, wanting their man to emotionally support them and do all this other shit, while they themselves, cant cook well, cant fuck well, and are an drain on the common man, with their bickering.

If you want companionship, get a dog or cat.

Look i get it, guys want someone to grow old with and truly love and cherish till they die. To have someone by your side while you age into dust, i get it.

When your 60, traveled the world, done some crazy shit and established yourself go find a matured women, your age and share the rest of your life together, having little worries about being poor or not experiencing enough in life.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

women's duty in marriage is to love, while the man's duty is to provide.

I think that's a bad way of looking at it and what causes alot of problems. A man thinks his sole job is to provide he will be neglecting core needs of a relationship to grow. That's where these men will get in situations and feel so hurt and betrayed because their women up and left or cheated while he was out of the home providing. I'm not in no way saying what these women did were right because cheating is wrong in anyway but if you're neglecting core nurturing parts it's going to break one day. That's why the men who provided everything and make it their sole duty to do so, tell women they should be happy because you have a house and money and all that - only to be so confused as to why they didn't stay together.

I know many, many people that relationships were like that. The man worked crazy hours, barley home, basically no relationship - she stayed home took care of the kids but there was no "them" so she left. She didnt see a reason to be in a big house, alone most times and feeling neglected. A big house meant nothing to her if she couldn't even enjoy her husband anymore.

Wanting their man to emotionally support them and do all this other shit, while they themselves, cant cook well, cant fuck well, and are an drain on the common man, with their bickering.

Well if you find a woman who does all of that and all she wants from you is some excitement? Some date nights? Some interest - is that a problem to you?

[–]welcometothejlRed Pill Man1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

But the point is, because of child support and alimoney laws, men are legally obligated in 80% of cases to still provide for a woman if they divorce. It undermines the contributions of a man to a relationship if women still get to benefit from him even after leaving him.

[–]big_boi_big_mac0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I know many, many people that relationships were like that. The man worked crazy hours, barley home, basically no relationship - she stayed home took care of the kids but there was no "them" so she left. She didnt see a reason to be in a big house, alone most times and feeling neglected.

See this is the problem with modern day women , they simply believe that they should always be the center of attention. Men arent always 24/7 at their jobs, they come home, tired after a hard days work of being the sole breadwinner. Now this is where the woman performs her role as the wife. Cooking and just giving love to her husband, unless she married some sloth, you can expect warm smiles and gratitude.

Men usually are very grateful when seeing a wife put in effort to comfort them within a relationship, and while maybe not being as bombastic as women can, during times of thanks, if you pay attention you can see how much a man appreciates these simple actions.

Well if you find a woman who does all of that and all she wants from you is some excitement? Some date nights? Some interest - is that a problem to you?

This is a big no no for me. I want a someone who i can share everyday with me and be happy with the simple things in life, and not someone who wants 'excitement'. The honeymoon effect wares off eventually and when you no longer feel 'excitement' anymore, the marriage ends. I want someone that is happy just spending simple days together even if nothing exciting is going on around us. I know it sounds boring, but all old couples operate in the same way, more of a friendship then a pair of lovers. So yes it is a problem, i plan for the long term stability then having small doses of 'excitement' with a wife that is a total bore on me when we aren't doing such extravagant things.

[–]Zippo-Cat2 points3 points  (34 children) | Copy Link

Whether or not your wife wants to have sex with you has fuck-all to do with her "emotional satisfaction in the relationship".

What even is this fucking thread? Reads like a page from Bluepilled Relationship Platitudes Handbook.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑6 points7 points  (33 children) | Copy Link

Actually, it has everything to do with her emotional satisfaction. And the fact that men don’t realize is probably why a lot of them aren’t getting sex. Redpill advice is trash.

If she’s unhappy in the relationship, she’s not going to fuck. Or maybe if she’s feeling particularly selfless, she might throw you a pity fuck once in a while while she stares at the clock thinking about the other million things that she would rather be doing.

[–]NalkaNalkayou call it virtue, I call it cowardice2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes, and which is why it’s even more important to maintain emotional satisfaction. Even the researchers speculate that:

“They may also not have experienced some of the benefits of longer-term relationships that may increase desire, such as going on romantic vacations, getting engaged, learning more about their sexual likes — and feeling comfortable sharing those likes with their partner.”

That’s a quote from the first study you posted.

From the second study, again this is showing data that women lose interest in sex over time, but no concrete data on why. The researchers then go on to speculate about these reasons. And stress, being busy, feelings that you’re not with the right person, and medical problems are the common reasons given. Yet another reason why it’s important to ensure that these things are addressed and dealt with to maintain both the emotional and physical bind of the couple.

The final study you posted states:

“The study also revealed tenderness was important for women in a relationship.”

And tenderness sounds more like an emotional connection and satisfaction to me.

What do you think are the factors that cause women to lose sexual interest in a relationship? You’re RP, so I can probably already guess what your reasons are going to be, but a few RPers have managed to surprise me recently, so let’s see.

[–]Zippo-Cat4 points5 points  (26 children) | Copy Link

Redpill advice is trash.

And yet everything, from scientific studies to female erotica to actual porn, proves "redpill advice" largely correct.

lmao bloops

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

You do know that according to porn studies, one of men’s biggest fantasies and desires, is to be cuckholds and have what they call a “hot wife”.

Now, unless RP is now admitting that all or most men want to be literal cucks while their wives and girlfriends get dicked down by other men, then either RP doesn’t know what it’s talking about or the source of its “evidence” is simply not credible. Can’t have it both ways.

There are no actual objective “scientific studies” that RP has in its arsenal. RP claims to have them, but we’ve never actually seen any of these studies. Not even in their sidebar. The ones that they produced have been debunked so heavily that RP is now too ashamed to even bring them up anymore. Redpill relies on pseudoscience and the supposed experiences of bitter old men that seek to indoctrinate younger men so that they can profit off of them by selling them books, videos and T-shirts.

Ergo, trash.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

(x) doubt

[–]Zippo-Cat1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

You do know that according to porn studies, one of men’s biggest fantasies and desires, is to be cuckholds and have what they call a “hot wife”.

No, I do not. Care to link said "porn study"?

There are no actual objective “scientific studies” that RP has in its arsenal. RP claims to have them, but we’ve never actually seen any of these studies.

/r/blackpillscience

Enjoy.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Sure. Here and Here

[–]Zippo-Cat-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

/shrug

Even if we ignore all the other ifs and buts then sure - if data says most men fantasize about cuckoldry, then I guess most men want to be cucked. What it DOESN'T prove is that they DON'T want to be cucked.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

...wut?

I don’t think you read through what you just typed there. You’re not making sense.

[–]poppy_blublack midget wine mom 🍷2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

female erotica to actual porn

The purpose of which is fantasy entertainment. I mean seriously, you think that shit represents real life? LMAO

[–]Zippo-Cat2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

You're now literally arguing that people regularly fantasize about things they DON'T want to happen to them.

Nonsensical worldview + blind denial + complete lack of self awareness = you.

[–]poppy_blublack midget wine mom 🍷0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

No I’m saying only an idiot thinks porn and erotica are proof of anything other than people love escapism.

“proof that RP is true” LOL.

You probably think porn is accurate representation of what women like too, right. And that those college girl gangbangs really are “real footage.” LMAO

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Actually, what you see in porn is evidence that men want to dehumanize women through sex. As well as lots of latent homosexuality. Porn is not real sex, and if your sex resembles porn, you're a monster.

[–]Zippo-Cat2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Actually, what you see in porn is evidence that men want to dehumanize women through sex.

How ironic that my comment was referring to the well known statistic that the main audience for violent porn are women themselves.

And here you go, trying to tell me that "evil men dehumanize women through sex"... LMAO

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I googled it but did not find your well known statistic. What I did find is that the researchers define violent behavior very narrowly. Porn producers need only direct the women to make pleasurable noises to avoid being accused of violence. Paying the actress to pretend that she likes it allows them to continue increasing the dehumanization. Both the producers and researchers have no way to measure the actual violence since the actors are acting like it is pleasurable.

Perhaps you do not know what REAL female pleasure looks like. FYI, the clitoris will become engorged and the vagina produces natural lubrication. Bet you've never seen that in porn.

[–]allweknowisD0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy Link

And yet everything, from scientific studies to female erotica to actual porn, proves “redpill advice” is largely incorrect.

It’s funny how there’s evidence from both sides, it’s almost like it works for some and doesn’t for others. The population isn’t some hivemind that all work on the same wavelength

[–]Zippo-Cat0 points1 point  (12 children) | Copy Link

And yet everything, from scientific studies to female erotica to actual porn, proves “redpill advice” is largely incorrect.

Show me said scientific studies, said female erotica and said porn.

It’s funny how there’s evidence from both sides

Well, where is it?

[–]allweknowisD5 points6 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

Yeah because I just have erotica and porn at hand that goes against RP.

Even fucking 50 Shades has emotional support, the guy literally changes and softens up in order to provide her what she needs. She refuses to go back to him when there was no emotion and only degradation. So even your biggest evidence of female erotica doesn’t translate to RP truths.

Also don’t have scientific studies at hand and I’m currently at work; but off the top of my head one of the big ones is:

Gottman’s “four horsemen of the apocalypse” showing the 4 biggest predictors of divorce are all items that RP advocate that women like. Especially what they advocate in relationships.

I’ll make sure to get back to you with more when I’m able to search. But, please do provide your evidence considering you made the initial claim. And I’d attempt to show science that isn’t evolutionary psychology because I’d rather not read bullshit

[–]Zippo-Cat1 point2 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

Even fucking 50 Shades has emotional support, the guy literally changes and softens up in order to provide her what she needs.

That is... not true. This is not what happens in the book. Plus I feel like you have some serious misunderstandings about what "RP truths" are.

Gottman’s “four horsemen of the apocalypse” showing the 4 biggest predictors of divorce are all items that RP advocate that women like.

Because most marriages - most relationships - are fake nonsense not based on sexual attraction, but on convenience, familiarity and fear of being alone. In those relationships women pick their partner the way you would pick a roommate. OF COURSE that if said roommate suddenly started trying to be an "asshole" you would kick him out of the house.

You're arguing that women don't divorce complacent simps who are essentially live-in slaves. No shit they don't? Why would they?

[–]allweknowisD1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

Go on, do enlighten me how it isn’t true then. I’d love to hear it.

Cop out argument. I’m not interested in debating with someone that doesn’t even have anything to add other than “uh marriage and relationships aren’t real”.

Have a nice day

[–]Zippo-Cat2 points3 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

Who cares about providing evidence to back up your claims? Just wish him a nice day, that will show how much bigger and better person you are, and therefore you automatically win because you hold the moral high ground!

I'm meeeeeelting

[–]allweknowisD2 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

Gave you evidence, mate. Not my fault you can’t debate scientific evidence and instead rely on false claims.

And again, you made the initial claim. Yet to see you provide any evidence. Or are you just used to throwing out random statements and people believing you cause you’re that much of an alpha?

[–]mwait0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

It definitely does not have everything to do with her emotional satisfaction. It has to do with how attracted she is to the man.

I had plenty of relationships when I was younger, where I completely neglected the feelings of my gf... Still had plenty of sex though.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Argument by unprovable personal anecdote.

Sorry, no dice.

[–]mwait0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

And here I thought my personal anecdote went well with your outlandish claim supported by no actual evidence.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh so you do admit that you made an outlandish claim? If you’re calling mine outlandish and say that your claim goes well with mine, then you’ve just shot your own claim in the foot as well. Lol.

Thanks for proving my point, I guess.

[–]Salty-Bastard1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Happy Life, Happy Wife works out better.

[–]FairlyNaiveRed Pill Man1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Dread for life, happy wife;)

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Well making her happy should be apart of that live, and her making you happy should be apart of her life as well.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

And sex is a big part of making man happy.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

And emotional fulfillment is also a big part of making any relationship work.

[–]jenovajunkieNot Your Average MRA1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

Hold up, what are you saying?

That women don't need to do any of the emotional upkeep as well? That men are always the one to initiate, and take action; like, what's happening. Women are not robots, neither are men. Just because they love sex, as you say, they should also put in some effort, why is this gender biased?

Are you a feminist mole?

This seems more like a feminist deceptive tactic.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

Why I wrote "Some men complain that with time their wives/women don't want to have sex. That sex fades over time and if a women got married "she should fulfil her duties as a wife, and sex is apart of that deal" To the men who believe the statement above is true.

Right now I am talking about MEN who complain about their wives not having SEX and looking inward to see if THEY THEMSELVES are keeping up with their relationship upkeep instead of Soley looking at a decline of their women having sex with them.

Women should have emotional upkeep. That's obvious and not my point.

I'm not a feminist so you can try again.

[–]jenovajunkieNot Your Average MRA1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Okay, what if those men do maintain their wives emotions, or are always bending backwards to please their wife; yet, the wife still doesn't want sex.

You didn't acknowledge the fact that some women, no matter how hard you try, just aren't going to give it up. It's true that after marriage sex does dwindle (after kids, I don't even want to know), this post places responsibility solely on the man.

One could argue that this whole post is obvious. You basically treating females as some horny sex machine that runs on emotions, which is not the case. What's obvious to one is not always obvious to the other, this post implicitly creates pressure on men that aren't having sex to blame themselves even when the woman isn't interested.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

I'm not going to write a book on a post explaining each end of every single argument. I didn't talk about every single man. I again said "to men who believe the statement is true" if you don't - then you are not the audience that agrees with the statement therefore this is obvious to you. Others... Not so much.

Okay, what if those men do maintain their wives emotions, or are always bending backwards to please their wife; yet, the wife still doesn't want sex.

That happens. And that will be a post targetting women who do that. My post is not about those women, though they do exist. Never denied it.

Yes. Responsibility on the man that believes a wife should have duty sex while he fails to provide upkeep on his end as well.

this post implicitly creates pressure on men that aren't having sex to blame themselves even when the woman isn't interested.

It's unfortunate that you think that. Men should blame themselves if they think a women is going to want to have sex with them when he barley recongizes the emotional needs in relationships. As women should be guilted if a man is doing so and she is still witholding sex for no reason.

[–]jenovajunkieNot Your Average MRA1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Men should blame themselves if they think a women is going to want to have sex with them when he barley recongizes the emotional needs in relationships.

Wow, you are manipulatively coercive. When did I write that, never. You didn't address my points, so now you're entirely blaming men even when the woman doesn't do her part.

Your post is about sex and relationships, I think you should fully disclose what you are saying instead of leaving it vague. Essentially you are pushing some type of blue pill/feminist ideology.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Do you have reading comprehension problems?

So now you're entirely blaming men even when the woman doesn't do her part.

I said :

That happens. And that will be a post targetting women who do that. My post is not about those women, though they do exist. Never denied it.

As women should be guilted if a man is doing so and she is still witholding sex for no reason.

Wow, you are manipulatively coercive. When did I write that, never.

What r u even taking about? I am saying that men should blame themselves if they think a women is going to want to have sex with them when he barley recongizes the emotional needs in relationships. That is what my post is about.

At this point I think you're a troll. So if you're going to reply again with nonsense this conversation is done.

[–]jenovajunkie 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy Link

I don't care what you do, and no I do not have reading comprehension difficulty. You are a feminist, by not including it (like the bad things feminists do, or the good things males have done; for example) you're not giving it importance, or acknowledging that it happens.

I am talking about that sentence that you took from what I wrote, and then added to it, as if I did that.

This conversation is over, as you commit slander; attacking my reputation, as if your are trying to ruin my creditability. So as you can see I am not the troll, but you are. Take you manipulative tactics else where and shame men some other way. Join Incel Tears or something.

[–]LeaneGenovaBreaker of (comment) Chains[M] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Knock it off.

[–]jenovajunkieNot Your Average MRA0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I see my error, although someone else could have mentioned that the PPD should be a place for neutral debates.

That is what PPD is for correct, not to pull members one way or not?

[–]p3n3lop3Black Pill& Waiting on the Singularity1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I also hope you're giving "duty emotions" / actions.

This needs to be framed.

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[–]Uncommon_Sensed_1234 1 points [recovered]  (4 children) | Copy Link

Happy wife, happy life should just die already. Why do men have to keep in winning their wives? I would hate to think my husband had such a level of insecurity that he must always win me to keep me.

God, if I were a man I probably wouldn't marry. Always dating and romancing her like you were young to keep her and never maturing into your marriage. Tragic.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

This was for people who don't think emotional upkeep in a relationship is important yet still expect a wife to cater to him fulfilling her duties because she is a wife.

Happy wife happy life, happy husband happy life. All the same thing. If I was speaking to women I would use the second. If you are going to be someone for the long run would their happiness not bring you a source of your own?

If they are miserable I'm sure as hell you wouldn't be care free and happy while maintaining that relationship.

[–]Uncommon_Sensed_1234 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy Link

I've never read a serious reply from anyone on here, male or female, that says emotional upkeep is not needed for a successful relationship. I think you arguing against something no one on here claimed to begin with.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I've read plenty but I'm not going to go and dig them all up. But in real life you also hear this from women where they withhold sex or are not longer attracted to their partner because the husband starts to feel more like a man child then a partner. Emotions are ignored. Arguments are shut down, etc. Men having dead bedrooms etc etc.

So another reason why my post stated "if you believe the above statement is true" I don't assume everyone here thinks it is.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (14 children) | Copy Link

My wife can't deny me sex. I can't even imagine this. I mean she wants more sex then I do and if I go more than a few days she'll start getting pissy and I go a week she'll start accusing me of cheating and eyeballing my phone.

But I mean how can a wife or even a girlfriend deny a man sex? We're way bigger than you.

Oh wait that's right you all were raised with insane beliefs created in only the last thirty years and you think they are real true Science!(tm) based morality.

[–]rainisthelifeFacepalm 😑4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Don’t really see what the mans strength has to do with the woman’s ability to deny him sex.

He can be as big as Terry Crews, but if wifey doesn’t want to fuck, then they ain’t fucking.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Women do love to fight

[–]AlexCoventry3 points4 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

I mean how can a wife or even a girlfriend deny a man sex? We're way bigger than you.

That's rape, and is a crime even in states where prohibitions against rape give consideration to marital status.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Amazing how what the thangs meant some thangs now in only one generation that I've watched now mean some incredible bizarre nonsense things. And now you're all so incredibly unhappy and desperate and honestly pathetic, and I tell you that you believe nonsensical lies that have never existed before, and you tell me, 'but but but what about my nonsense nobody ever has or ever will believe again?'

Rape? I suppose if you just redefine any words than any words can mean any thing. And then the people who do what the words now mean? Bad people!

I mean I'm sorry you never had anyone to tell you otherwise but do you think there's a reason you all over here on ppderpalbate are all so much smarter than I, yet my life is so incredible, and women say to me, "I can't believe you understand"

Though I understand. You are just so much better than me.

[–]AlexCoventry1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I'm just stating the black-and-white consequences of such behavior. If you physically force someone to have sex with you, that's definitionally rape, and a criminal act.

As far as I can tell, though I am no lawyer, it ought also to be a federal offense.

I have no conceit about who is better, but I do know I would be ashamed and mortified to even consider doing that.

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Keep on going on with what you are forced to repeat and tell me that it is the U-turn truth, the truth, tell me the truth.

Please do tell me I'm so apt to hear it.

As are the women. Desperate to hear the truth. How are you going to tell them the truth, when you don't know it

[–]beachredwhineCongratulations!0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

The law isn't a way to socially engineer society. It's a recognition of natural law.

[–]AlexCoventry1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The law is imposed by the sovereign institutions of the nation, which naturally care more about the legitimacy, security and productivity of themselves, the nation, and its citizens, in that order, than they do about preserving historical iniquities. It's very naive to imagine that the law has anything more than an accidental relationship to how humans would relate in a brute state of nature.

[–]FunCicada0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

Marital rape in United States law, also known as spousal rape, is non-consensual sex in which the perpetrator is the victim's spouse. It is a form of partner rape, of domestic violence, and of sexual abuse. Today, marital rape is illegal in all 50 US states.

[–]AlexCoventry2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Bad bot

[–]WhyNotCollegeBoard1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Are you sure about that? Because I am 99.18463% sure that FunCicada is not a bot.


I am a neural network being trained to detect spammers | Summon me with !isbot <username> | /r/spambotdetector | Optout | Original Github

[–]AlexCoventry2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Bad bot

[–]B0tRank0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Thank you, AlexCoventry, for voting on FunCicada.

This bot wants to find the best and worst bots on Reddit. You can view results here.


Even if I don't reply to your comment, I'm still listening for votes. Check the webpage to see if your vote registered!

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Thank you for the reality check.

[–]wekacuckLife is settling.-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

sex is apart of the deal

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

As people get over they usually need to make sure that they schedule time to retain emotional and physical intimacy.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

No sex - no attention and money. It is only fair. Men perform their duties all thr time even if they do not like it or not in mood. Same is with sex.

[–]LUClENSociology of Sex &Courtship0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Ha, mismatched affection styles

[–]Taladar0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Judging by /r/deadbedrooms stories lack of sex in marriage is often more a matter of one person enjoying sex more than the other, not of one expecting sex without putting in any effort.

In situations like that I believe that providing sex is a mandatory part of the sexual exclusivity expectation of a relationship. You can't expect to both provide no sex to your partner and for them to not have sex with anyone else just because you like sex less (or not at all).

That said, that should happen in an open way that is communicated up front, not in the form of going behind a partner's back.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

If you’re only having sex or only fulfilling somebody’s emotional needs because you feel like it’s your “duty”, you’re in the wrong relationship.

[–]TriadFamilyTimesEverything I know I learned from group sex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Straight people all need to go to six months of relationship counseling before they're allowed to marry for the first time. Five for LGBT people, we're slightly better at it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Is this Purple Pill or Blue Pill? I am confused

[–]a1b1no0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Dynamite, right here!

[–]chillinbliss38-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Only a guy who is selfish in bed and generally do sucks in bed thinks this way.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Typical shaming. Ppd never change

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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