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TRP hates safe spaces. I think we can all agree on this one. To them it is an overreach of the feminist agenda that does nothing but put men down. A complaint I have often seen is that safe spaces limit free speech. To them, free speech is being able to say what ever you want, where ever you want.

So, if this is true, why are so many people banned from TRP? Its a surprise to no one that posting on TRP against one of their ideas or "endorsed members" will get you banned. Is this not creating a safe space for its members? If not, how / why is this different?

In my opinion, a safe space is a place where people can free express their problems and concerns on a common problem without the fear of outside arguments. IE LGBT safe spaces talk about discrimination they face without anti-gay groups telling them they are wrong and immoral.

edit: Just for the record, I have no problem with safe spaces and honestly think that TRP being one is not a bad thing. They want to talk without constantly feeling attacked and thats fine with me.


[–]prodigy2throw#Transracial15 points16 points  (24 children) | Copy Link

A safe space is somewhere where you don't say something to offend another person who is also in said safe space.

Go to asktrp. Guys talk sooo much shit and give tough advice and hard truth. That is not a safe space.

A safe space would be if everyone on trp was consoling each other and saying "don't worry it's not your fault"

[–]theheartofgold3 points4 points  (23 children) | Copy Link

A safe space would be if everyone on trp was consoling each other and saying "don't worry it's not your fault"

Again - you guys seem to think you know so much about safe spaces. I'm willing to bet you've never been involved in one of those communities, mostly because it's clear you have no idea what goes on in there except for whatever nonsense TRP has fed you.

[–]prodigy2throw#Transracial8 points9 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

I think the issue trp takes with safe spaces is people who want to make the whole world a safe space.

[–]theheartofgold0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy Link

If by that you mean they want to rid the world of bigotry - try to limit the amount of racism, sexism, homophobia, anti-semitism, transphobia, etc. that those people have to face on a daily basis - I'm not sure why anyone would have a problem with that.

What you think feminists want: "nobody can ever say anything bad against women or gays or black people ever again, choose your words carefully or else you're gonna get thrown in jail"

What feminists actually want: "We need to educate people so that they realize the extent to which people in out-groups experience discrimination on a daily basis, and the various ways in which discrimination shows itself, so that they can gain a little empathy and understanding that might make them take a step back and look at their own actions and ideas."

How is a world where there are fewer bigots a bad thing?

[–]prodigy2throw#Transracial5 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

This is the stupid logic you have. Hiding bigotry won't get rid of it. It takes more to change a culture than "don't say those things that are mean". There needs to be systemic change to the world and people around us and the way people act and think. Thought policing won't get us anywhere.

[–]theheartofgold4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, no, see - that's not my logic, that's the logic you just put in my mouth instead of understanding what I was saying.

I don't want to hide bigotry, I don't want to thought police anyone. No one is saying 'don't say those things that are mean' - even in the safe spaces you're mocking, they're saying 'we don't accept bigots or bigoted statements here,' which isn't even remotely the same as saying 'we don't accept mean comments'.

Feminists want to help educate people and make them aware of the kinds of discrimination that these out-groups face. It's not about "saying mean things", it's about "maybe if you understood how what you're saying affects these people, you would be less eager to say that kind of thing", or "maybe if you understood what it's like to be a person in this out-group, you would have a little more empathy for them." It's trying to affect a systemic change, it's not 'thought policing' - that's a motive that you and your ilk have made up because you don't understand a bunch of fundamental shit about the way the world works, and the motives of most feminists in particular. People often need real life experience with a gay family member or friend, or a black romantic partner, or a trans colleague, before they can muster up any empathy for them - what feminists want to do is try and drum up that empathy without that intimate kind of connection and experience, and that's a tough row to hoe, but creating safe spaces for those people at least provides a small amount of relief for them, while we try to work with all of our allies to create the change that we want to see. TERPers say that TRP provides a space for men to vent, say anything they want, for men who feel like outsiders because there aren't as many safety nets for men in society as for women. Imagine how you feel, and then translate those feelings to people of color, gay people, women, etc. I don't understand how you can't have the empathy for those people to understand that they need their places to vent as well. You ridicule that idea but don't see the connection? People who feel like outsiders should be more understanding and concerned with the feelings of other outsiders. They shouldn't mock them, unless they are unbelievably selfish and self-involved to the point where they can't see the hypocrisy in that stance.

The problem I have with TRP isn't that I begrudge men a safe space to vent their feelings - I think that's fucking great. I think there should be more of them. The problem is that they're using that safe space to shit all over other people, using inane generalizations based on bad, easily disprovable theories. I think you would be surprised at what people talk about in women-only and LGBT groups. Hint: it's not about how AMALT and how straight white men are evil oppressors because biotruths. Though I'm sure there must be a female version of TRP (not RPW, but the exact opposite of TRP), and I'm sure if I ran across it I'd be just as disgusted.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

What part of

We need to educate people so that they realize the extent to which people in out-groups experience discrimination on a daily basis, and the various ways in which discrimination shows itself, so that they can gain a little empathy and understanding that might make them take a step back and look at their own actions and ideas."

didn't you understand?

It's like you didn't even read the post to which you're replying. It has nothing to do with thought policing.

[–]prodigy2throw#Transracial1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

If by safe space you mean a shelter for discriminated groups then I have no problem with that. My problem arises when people try making public spaces safe spaces. Like when Lena Dunham said she wants Twitter to be a safe space for her. Or when people try to make Reddit a safe space. It's counter intuitive to free and open discussion and it become hard to draw a line on what's offensive and what isn't.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Have you ever actually been to a safe space or participated in one in any way?

Do you have any idea what you're talking about?

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

If by that you mean they want to rid the world of bigotry - try to limit the amount of racism, sexism, homophobia, anti-semitism, transphobia, etc. that those people have to face on a daily basis - I'm not sure why anyone would have a problem with that.

Bailey/motte-fallacy.

The SJW goals are far more extensive than merely "limiting" the amount of all that stuff, and you know that perfectly well. The SJW activists who were collectively throwing a tantrum last years about "cultural appropriation" and all that crap didn't remind me of people who were trying to limit the amount of hate-speech, but more of Mao's sheep during the Cultural Revolution. Quite honestly, I sincerely wonder what shit they would have pulled had they had a general permission to deal with doubleplusungoodthinkful people (ty to George Orwell) as they saw fit.

[–]theheartofgold1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

No, it's not. The fact that you think that the 'SJWs' who are trying to get people to understand about cultural appropriation are 'sheep' is irrelevant, because your ideas about feminism are not universal truths. I don't need to bait and switch in this argument, because the feminist movement isn't actually the straw-movement that you TERPs rail against. Putting up ads and signs about people wearing other people's cultural artifacts as halloween costumes is information, it's not thought-policing, it's trying to get people to understand why doing something is hurtful, so that maybe they'll take a step back and think twice before doing it. That's exactly what I said - limiting the amount of micro or macro-aggressions that out-groups face on a daily basis. The fact that you're all huffy about people telling you that wearing a native-american headdress as a costume is offensive to some Native Americans is more telling about your values than it is about feminists.

Bottom line is, we're never going to agree on this. I think TRPs are a hate group, you think feminists are evil Orwellian brainwashed sheep who want to stop you from doing what you want. I don't think we can resolve that kind of major ideological rift in a discussion over reddit, although I appreciate you keeping it civil.

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Putting up ads and signs about people wearing other people's cultural artifacts as halloween costumes is information, it's not thought-policing, it's trying to get people to understand why doing something is hurtful, so that maybe they'll take a step back and think twice before doing it.

What a fine example of a mature and moderate audience who is doing a great job at bringing its point across! Of course what these people do is totally not about thought-policing and power grabbing by getting interpretational authority over what is okay and what isn't!

(and the student activists who labor on behalf of feminism aren't any better)

That's exactly what I said - limiting the amount of micro or macro-aggressions that out-groups face on a daily basis.

:facepalms:

[–]ZorbaTHut1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't need to bait and switch in this argument, because the feminist movement isn't actually the straw-movement that you TERPs rail against.

"The feminist movement" is not a homogenous monolith. It consists of many parts with their own differing philosophies. There is maybe an argument to be had about which of those philosophies has the most political influence, but there isn't an argument to be had about whether the philosophies exist.

That's why people are talking about the bailey/motte fallacy. Because you're pretending that all of feminism is made up of perfectly reasonable people who just want to stop racism and sexism, and meanwhile, there are really awful toxic people who are overjoyed at this idea, because they can hide their own horrifying behavior behind the same wall.

The fact that you're all huffy about people telling you that wearing a native-american headdress as a costume is offensive to some Native Americans is more telling about your values than it is about feminists.

It's kind of weird that you're complaining about strawman behaviors right before criticizing /u/exit_sandman for a statement that they never made.

[–]Eulabeia0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

How is a world where there are fewer bigots a bad thing?

Because you don't get to decide what counts as bigotry, and the proper way to get rid of it all by yourself.

[–]theheartofgold2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Um, bigotry has a set definition - "Bigotry is an unjustified prejudice against a group of people, commonly races, genders, sexual orientations, religions, or politics."

What makes bigotry different from prejudice is that bigotry is defined by actions, while prejudice is defined by thoughts. So no one is trying to police people's thoughts - just prevent them from acting in ways that harm others.

I never said I get to decide what counts as bigotry, except in my own mind. Bigotry is mostly defined socially - which is why the 'unjustified' part of 'unjustified prejudice' is so important. And why I would never try to get rid of it 'all by myself'. You have to have allies in order to create a major societal shift, which is why intersectional feminism exists. If you get the members of all the out-groups together for a cause, they will have a powerful voice in society. Even unifying one community of minorities can be a powerful movement (see also: civil rights).

[–]Eulabeia-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

When I said "all by yourself", I didn't mean that literally as you the individual, but you and other feminists. A lot of feminists seem to have a different definition of bigotry and what should be considered "unjustifiable prejudice" than others do. Like for example the crap about it being prejudice plus power, so you can't be sexist against men or whatever. These are certainly not the people I want to trust with being in charge of ridding the world of bigotry, if I even thought that was a worthwhile goal in the first place.

no one is trying to police people's thoughts

LOL. Sure.

[–]prodigy2throw#Transracial4 points5 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

A Safe Space is a place where anyone can relax and be able to fully express, without fear of being made to feel uncomfortable, unwelcome, or unsafe on account of biological sex, race/ethnicity, sexual orientation, gender identity or expression, cultural background, religious affiliation, age, or physical or mental ...

[–]theheartofgold2 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

So you think 'don't be a racist/sexist/homophobe' is the same as 'consoling each other and saying 'don't worry it's not your fault' do you? All they're saying there is that bigots aren't welcome to harass people for being black/gay/female/trans/jewish/whatever, they're not saying 'you can't give tough advice or hard truth' and they're not saying 'don't worry it's not your fault' anywhere....

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Except that you get hounded for being a beta/orbiter/doormat/etc.

The message of safe spaces is "it's not your fault for being different, it's the others' fault for not accepting you being different" - and yeah, that's exactly what it is, though I am curious how you'll try to spin it around.

The message of TRP is that when you're a beta/orbiter/doormat/etc. it's ultimately your own responsibility because you're (a) the only person who gives a shit and (b) the only person who can change that.

You want to know what a safe space for romantically unsuccessful guys looks like? Check an incel or FA forum.

[–]theheartofgold5 points6 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Except that you get hounded for being a beta/orbiter/doormat/etc.

I don't know what you mean by that. Where?

The message of safe spaces is "it's not your fault for being different, it's the others' fault for not accepting you being different" - and yeah, that's exactly what it is, though I am curious how you'll try to spin it around.

I'm not going to try to spin it around. You're right - that's the message of safe spaces, and it's a message I 100% agree with. Because gay people, black people, women, trans people - it isn't their 'fault' for being different. It's something they have no control over, and if people don't accept that, it's on them, not the person they're discriminating against.

But that's different from not taking ownership of one's behavior. A person can't control their gender, what they can control is their behavior, and no safe space I know of tells people that when they behave like a shitbag, that's not their fault. Because it is they're fault. So here's the thing:

The message of TRP is that when you're a beta/orbiter/doormat/etc. it's ultimately your own responsibility because you're (a) the only person who gives a shit and (b) the only person who can change that.

That's because being a 'beta' or a 'doormat' is a behavior, it's not a genetic trait. If you're suffering because of your behavior, it's true - you're the only person who can change that. But that's not the same as being gay or being black. Those are things you can't change. So you're arguing that TRP isn't a safe space because safe spaces tell you it's not your fault for being different, and TRP holds you accountable, but that's a false comparison, because TRP isn't dealing with the same issues as most safe spaces. TRP deals with changing one's behavior, it doesn't deal with how to live a life where you're constantly discriminated for something you can't change.

Safe spaces absolutely hold you accountable for your behavior. What they don't do is hold you accountable for your genes. I don't think TRP would do that either (unless you're a woman).

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

I don't know what you mean by that. Where?

At TRP. If what you (general you) said was true, TRP would be - as a rallying spot of the romantic have-nots, losers in the SMP, romantically unsuccessful guys or however you may call them - extremely sensitive about not triggering these guys, and tiptoeing around all issues that may affect them. It's not.

I'm not going to try to spin it around. You're right - that's the message of safe spaces, and it's a message I 100% agree with. Because gay people, black people, women, trans people - it isn't their 'fault' for being different. It's something they have no control over, and if people don't accept that, it's on them, not the person they're discriminating against.

Yeah, and the guys who end up at TRP do not get such a message. It's conceded that they got told a shitty narrative while growing up, but that it's their responsibility and theirs alone to turn their lives around.

That's because being a 'beta' or a 'doormat' is a behavior, it's not a genetic trait. If you're suffering because of your behavior, it's true - you're the only person who can change that. But that's not the same as being gay or being black.

And this refutes my argument how? Because totally disregarding the value of actual safe spaces, all it does is supporting the position that the comparison between TRP and safe spaces is full of holes.

[–]SmurfESmurferson1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

At TRP. If what you (general you) said was true, TRP would be - as a rallying spot of the romantic have-nots, losers in the SMP, romantically unsuccessful guys or however you may call them - extremely sensitive about not triggering these guys, and tiptoeing around all issues that may affect them. It's not.

Outside of everything else you're saying, I'm curious how in the world you're trying to claim that TRP isn't tiptoeing around loser male egos?

Because that's all I see.

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Then you can't have read a lot. The way "betas" and "beta behaviors" are presented certainly doesn't qualify as what you said.

[–]SmurfESmurferson1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm not the person you responded to, and said nothing about "betas" or "beta behaviors."

I'm still curious how TRP doesn't tiptoe around loser male egos, though? I thought it was accepted that "winner" males wouldn't find themselves at TRP...

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel21 points22 points  (57 children) | Copy Link

So, if this is true, why are so many people banned from TRP?

Concern trolling can ruin the sub, trolls are banned too.

Actual members are often treated mercilessly for their fuck ups.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 12 points13 points  (56 children) | Copy Link

I'm not talking about trolls. I'm talking about people with legitimately different opinions coming to discuss them.

Actual members are often treated mercilessly for their fuck ups.

Not talking about TRP members fucking up.

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel16 points17 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

I'm not talking about trolls. I'm talking about people with legitimately different opinions coming to discuss them.

Unless you are debating sexual strategy then purplepilldebate is the place for you, otherwise there is no reason for you to be there, nobody cares about some outsiders half-baked opinions.

Not talking about TRP members fucking up.

If you are talking about trp being a safe space that is relevant, if it was as you say then fuck ups would be coddled - which they are not.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 9 points10 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

otherwise there is no reason for you to be there, nobody cares about some outsiders half-baked opinions.

EXACTLY! thats why LGBT communities ask for safe space's. They dont give a shit about your straight half-baked opinions.

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel14 points15 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

I feel bad for LGBTers, from what i've heard/seen they are just getting co opted by feminist groups, same thing happened at both the 'occupy' protests.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 11 points12 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

so the only problem you have with safe spaces are those directly for women?

[–]feminazi_oppresorRed Pill5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

While I think they are retarded if people want a 'safe space' they should be able to have it. I just want to be able to say what I think and not have to worry about some little bitch crying

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I just want to be able to say what I think and not have to worry about some little bitch crying

So... a Safe Space then?

You Terps are pulling some ludicrous mental gymnastics to not admit that your No Gurlz Allowed circlejerk club is not a safe space. It is identical in every way to a safe space. Just admit it. No harm done.

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel0 points1 point  (9 children) | Copy Link

No (I would have though women are included on lgbt)there is a difference between a safe space and a place with specific criteria, men and women can have single gender clubs all they want, but the whole safe space/I fear any kind of push back is bullshit regardless of the gender.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 9 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

So why does TRP ban people for disagreeing with them? Are they not afraid of the push back of the other members of reddit?

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

So why does TRP ban people for disagreeing with them?

If you had a club would you bother with some stranger coming in saying we need to change things or show them the door?

Are they not afraid of the push back of the other members of reddit?

It's more concern trolls trying to water the sub down/change its direction, the rest of reddit already has a pretty caricatured second hand view of trp (which new visitors often also have).

Debating efficacy is fine, debating whether or not things would be 'better' if we toned things down takes away the space for men to vent.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

There's no debate to be had: Reddit's image and the image of men in general would be better if TRP didn't exist.

Edit: A word

[–]theheartofgold4 points5 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

but the whole safe space/I fear any kind of push back is bullshit regardless of the gender.

So your characterization of the difference between TRP and 'safe spaces' for women is that on TRP you guys just don't want to bother with any kind of pushback because it dilutes the message, but you've decided that women's safe spaces exist because they fear any kind of pushback? Have you not considered that maybe those spaces exist the way they do for exactly the same reason as TRP? Because they don't want to have to wade through some outsider's half-baked opinions?

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Alphas don't bake.

[–]TriggeredByIdiotsRP Environmentalist - Nut in a slut1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

But...apple cobbler is both easy and delicious.

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

but you've decided that women's safe spaces exist because they fear any kind of pushback?

I haven't decided anything, for me it's my experience that female safe spacers are - sit down, shut up no disagreeing.

Because they don't want to have to wade through some outsider's half-baked opinions?

I respect that but no criticism at all even from those on the in is too much, as I've said elsewhere in this thread the current liberal safe spaces i've seen are cuddleboxes and increasingly people are demanding safe spaces in new places for example tabletop games, they now want safe bubbles in others communities.

[–]theheartofgold2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I respect that but no criticism at all even from those on the in is too much, as I've said elsewhere in this thread the current liberal safe spaces i've seen are cuddleboxes

I'm just having so much trouble believing anyone in this thread has spent any amount of time in 'liberal safe spaces'...or 'feminist safe spaces'...or any safe spaces. A) Why would you, except to stir shit up? None of you are liberals, or feminists, or approve of safe spaces. B) If you go there with the express intent of stirring shit up, that makes you a troll. C) TRP bans trolls, too.

From my actual experience with 'liberal' safe spaces, as an actual liberal and an actual feminist, so someone who has good reasons to be there, I have yet to see any of the behavior you're describing. Other than banning trolls and personal attacks, most of them welcome discussions and have no problem with dissenting opinions.

Also if people want a safe space tabletop community, how in the world does that effect you? Don't join one, if you don't approve of them. It's not like they're saying all tabletop game forums and discussions are now safe spaces. Besides - all 'safe space' means is 'no personal attacks'. It doesn't mean any of the shit people are claiming in here. So if you want to personally attack tabletop gamers, maybe find a community that isn't a safe space? I'm also a tabletop gamer also and I don't particularly feel the need for a 'safe space' in that community....so I don't plan on joining one. Problem solved.

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪7 points8 points  (36 children) | Copy Link

Not every place is a place to offer alternative views. For example on redpillwives discussion of feminism is banned. Period. Thus is not because it's a "safe space" from feminism but because we have a singular worldview to discuss and we are a community for like minded people, not a place to hash things out. This is no different than r/communism not being a space to argue in favor of capitalism or r/Christianity not being a place to laud Baphomet.

There are no redpill women ideas that are up in the air and need to be discussed and debated. There are red pill ideas and not redpill ideas. The whole world discusses not redpill ideas. The red pill subs are places for people to discuss redpill ideas

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs3 points4 points  (33 children) | Copy Link

Is this really how you see the world?

None of your ideas can be debated and discussed?

Because that's absolutely insane and not at all true.

[–]chasingstatueszion was part of the matrix2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

None of your ideas can be debated and discussed?

That's what this sub is for.

Do you think TRPers should be allowed to start posting debates in /r/thebluepill?

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Yes. If they want to try to defend their ideas in TBP, they are welcome to.

Just admit that TRP is a safe space so we can be done here. Please. You've all but said it already.

[–]chasingstatueszion was part of the matrix0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Where did I say it already? Are you confusing me with someone else?

Also, are you a mod over at /r/thebluepill? Because during all the time that I once spent there, I never saw a single post by any TRPers and the vast majority of the comments they attempted to make in any threads were deleted. Which I saw no problem with. But if you have a problem with it, take issue with your own mods. Because they're the ones who keep it safe from RP bombardment.

And I'm pretty sure you're not thinking practically about what would happen if you gave TRP an open-door invitation into your subreddit. Hell, there have been a ton of posts made by bloops in that sub which said that PPD is a pointless waste of time. You think they want their sub to turn into PPD 2.0? Because that's what would happen.

But if I'm wrong, prove it. Go talk to your mods and your sub about creating an open-door policy for TRPers to come on in and make their case. Make a post in TBP right now about it and don't respond to me unless it's with a link to that post.

[–]wazzup987Blue pill, you can beat me black & blue for it later0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Ok your a mod explain some thign to me http://pastebin.com/A9ahGyip

why did this post which BP but essentially says their is a larger cultural and environmental context that is causing rp to grow and by not addressing is to our folly.

I'm not some twerp but i got banned from BP not 5 minute after posting that. I was always respect given i have some significant political disagreements with the feminist part of the population because we all agree that rp is bad.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm not a mod

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪1 point2 points  (24 children) | Copy Link

Is this really how you see the world?

what did i write about how i see "the world"?

None of your ideas can be debated and discussed?

well you tell me, what alternate relationship dynamic besides a male led one could flow from redpill first premises? how do you envision a debate about that? youll find you cant come up with a logical other position becaus eno other position follows from the 1st premises we assert. you didnt understand what i meant. of course redpill ideas can be discusssed and debated, with people who hold other worldviews and express other first premises, they just arent to be debated on the redpillwives sub, thats not the PLACE to debate them. there's nothing to debate about rpw from a redpill perspective because there arent multiple conclusions that flow from redpill first premises. not every forum is a forum for DEBATE, some forums are forums for community, RPW is a forum for community of like minded people

obvious we "discuss" them, that was an error to write that.

Because that's absolutely insane and not at all true.

its perfectly logical and sane if you understood what i meant and its 100% true

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs5 points6 points  (23 children) | Copy Link

Red Pill "premises" are bullshit based on nothing. They should be rejected out-of-hand.

So whatever "flows" from that is bullshit, too.

not every forum is a forum for DEBATE, some forums are forums for community, RPW is a forum for community of like minded people

So Safe Space. Got it.

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪1 point2 points  (22 children) | Copy Link

Red Pill "premises" are bullshit based on nothing. They should be rejected out-of-hand.

you are entitled to feel that way, but its not logical or philosophically correct nor does it address anything i wrote or said. you are just hell bent on emoting all over the place and broadcasted your unrequested disapproval at me. disapproval noted, not cared about, dismissed.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs2 points3 points  (21 children) | Copy Link

Ok Logic-Bot.

Prove to me that Red Pill premises have a factual basis in real life.

Do something besides assume how I think and feel.

broadcasted your unrequested disapproval at me.

I don't give a fuck about you behind the vile bullshit you're spreading. You have an awfully high opinion of yourself.

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪1 point2 points  (20 children) | Copy Link

Prove to me that Red Pill premises have a factual basis in real life.

this isnt how philosophy works. philosophical 1st premises arent scientific facts, they are axioms from which a set of ideas logically flow. i am not arguing over whether Red Pill thought is true with you, i am arguing over whether or not there is possible "debate" over established redpill ideas on redpill subs. im not surprised you dont even understand what im saying or dont appear to have any background in the analysis of ideas and worldviews.

you are the one exhibiting a high opinion of yourself by broadcasting your sneering disapproval to a stranger without even attempting to demonstrate higher value. why are you telling your disapproval at me, nobody? you talk about debating ideas and youre fundamentally incapable of even doing that on a forum devoted to doing so.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs3 points4 points  (19 children) | Copy Link

I know how Philosophy works. I have my degree.

I understand how logic and axioms work, but simply using these words to fit your narrative is not the same as being logical.

Axioms must be indisputable, self-evident facts. "Two objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time." - That sort of thing. They can't be whatever ridiculous, woman-bashing bullshit TRP wants them to be.

So nothing "logically" flows from nothing.

Edit: I should mention that, "Philosophically" speaking, even axioms can be debated. It may never bear fruit, but it can and should be done. There is no subject that cannot be discussed, no matter how "iron-clad" you goofballs believe it to be. By removing discussion, you're doing a disservice to Philosophy.

[–]Heathcliff-- 0 points0 points [recovered] | Copy Link

This is literally what the sub you're on right now is for.

Trp is where we post all our ideas, we don't want to debate them there. We can debate them with you here. It's cleaner that way.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

So would you say that TRP is a Space in which you are Safe to discuss these ideas with like-minded individuals? A Space in which you are Safe from dissenting opinions?

A kind of Safe Space, if you will?

And I know you won't.

[–]Heathcliff--All Women Are Cathy0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

[deleted]

What is this?

[–]Lonny_zone0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

BAPHOMET I PRAISE THEE

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Lol I thought of you when I wrote it

[–]autoNFAPurple Pill4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm talking about people with legitimately different opinions coming to discuss them.

I think subreddits should be able to enforce a set of clearly-labeled ground principles that are not up for debate to prevent endless back-and-forth with outsiders over basics. For instance, I wouldn't call it "censorship" if a console gaming subreddit banned PC gamers from coming in and posting arguments about why PCs are superior to consoles. Similarly, I have no problem with subs for religious denominations having rules preventing atheists from demanding debate over whether their god exists or not. It's not "safe space", it's enforcing topicality.

However, I'd say "banning a user for disagreeing with an endorsed contributor, but not the ground principles" does fall under "safe space".

[–]ManRAh0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Places where people gather to share common interests aren't "safe spaces" just because they don't like when people come in to tell them their interests are dumb.

If you walk into a Magic the Gathering convention and start going "MtG is for nerds! Ha!" and they react by throwing you out, that doesn't mean it's a safe space for MtG nerds.

"Safe space" has never been pushed to mean anything like that. It's used to describe people trying to make public spaces "politically correct" and unoffensive. It's used when people try to kick "offensive ideologies" off of Twitter or Reddit. It's used when a University sets up a "no whites" time slot at the public coffee house.

[–]daveofmarsFor Martian Independence17 points18 points  (23 children) | Copy Link

The day TRP auto-bans people who post on feminist and blue pill subs, the way feminist and blue pill subs currently auto-ban people who subscribe to TRP, is the day I accept your equivalence.

[–]GridReXXit be like that6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Wait... I was banned from RPW for being subscribed to TBP and I have never even posted on RPW nor wrote a comment about them.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs5 points6 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

Except we Bloopers don't do that and you guys did it to me immediately for disagreeing with one of your crackpot theories, sooooo....

[–]daveofmarsFor Martian Independence6 points7 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

1: Yes, subs like feminism, ask feminism, ask women etc with autoban people for subscribing to subreddits like TRP, cringeanarchy, tumblurinaction. Pot meet kettle.

2: Calling it a crackpot theory shows me you didn't have the right attitude to comment on TRP in the first place. You weren't doing it in good faith and likely broke the rules immediately. Of course, no concern troll ever wants to admit they broke the rules. It's always those mean old mods who are in the wrong, and are afraid of "real" discussion. Sure.

You want to convince me otherwise? Show me your chat logs so I can see for myself whether your banning was justified or not.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs2 points3 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

  1. They absolutely should. You are a member of a hatesub. The entire thing should be shut down.

  2. It is a crackpot theory, since it's based on absolutely nothing. The parts that are useful can be found in the same self-help books my grandmother read in the 60s. The rest is empty misogyny, Field Report Fanfiction, and tips on how to push through a woman's "resistance" (AKA "rape").

  3. I don't have to justify a fucking thing to you.

[–]daveofmarsFor Martian Independence4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Like I said, judging from your attitude you didn't belong there.

And you likely don't belong here either.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

I'd never want to belong there.

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points | Copy Link

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[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Same reason you're commenting on month-old threads: Not much else to do.

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points | Copy Link

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[–]YabuSama2k0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

You are a member of a hatesub.

Which subs are hatesubs in your opinion?

[–]GridReXXit be like that0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

It's true... AskWomen banned me for using an OP there as an example in PPD.

Ironically I was entirely pro woman. They stiill banned me for even being on PPD.

[–]wonderingwhether54Non-Red Pill0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

So how is that different from trp or rpw?

[–]GridReXXit be like that2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Ask Women doesn't make fun of "safe spaces." TRP does and then does the same thing as them.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I was specifically referring to The Blue Pill.

[–]wonderingwhether54Non-Red Pill1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I was banned for rpw for dissenting. So yeah, that day has come.

[–]theheartofgold0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

feminist and blue pill subs currently auto-ban people

Which feminist subs do this? Because I know TBP doesn't do it.

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I think few people are actually really aware of how banning works (myself included). I for example got banned only from one sub so far (that I know of), and this isn't any female sub, but /r/askmenover30 of all places (I didn't even comment there apart from maybe 5? posts, with the last post having been months before the banning message).

The thing is: As I said, I don't know how banning on reddit actually works. Obviously there is the possibility that you get messaged after a ban, but if there's also the option that you get banned without notification, I don't know of it. If, however, banning always comes with a notification, obviously the feminist and female subs don't have an "autoban by default for manosphere-subscribers"-policy in place since I would have noticed it if it was otherwise. However, if some sort of auto-shadow-permaban is possible that takes place without notification, I may very well be banned from a load of subs I don't even know about.

What I think is meant by "auto-banning" is actually "unsolicited banning" - i.e. you getting banned without actually having posted anything offensive (or anything at all) in the subs in question. And that certainly happens in these subs, whether one agrees with it or not (personally I am not too hung-up about it since I don't intend to post on them anyway).

[–]kick6Red Pill Man34 points35 points  (33 children) | Copy Link

Safe spaces, at least in TRP parlance, are hugboxes "because words do hurt" with no hard talk, and extra stuffed animals and coloring books. TRP isn't so much a safe space as an echo chamber. Attempting not to protect it's users from badfeelz, but to keep a consistent message.

[–]sublimemongrelBecky, Esq.4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

At least on PPD some of them get very triggered. Don't even try and use the word toxic

[–][deleted] 2 points2 points | Copy Link

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[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Just as well you were only mentioning it rather than using it. I felt some palpitations coming on there for a second.

[–]kick6Red Pill Man0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

because it, like misogynist, has been slung around so much as a thoughtless response that it has lost all of it's shaming power?

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 16 points17 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

I understand you gave it a different name but how is the idea different? Other safespaces want to "keep a consistent message" as well. LGBT spaces dont want to talk about the morality of the homosexuality, they want to focus on their struggles. There is "hard talk" in these communities as well.

[–]kick6Red Pill Man18 points19 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

We're not talking about the same thing. A safe space is a hidey-hole from all the world's badfeelz. They specifically avoid messages because messages potentially offend.

What you're talking about is merely a private forum (in the general sense, not in the specific internet bulletin board sense), and as a firm believer in the right of free association...I won't deny that to anyone.

[–]rappingwhiteguys12 points13 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Damn look at this hamstering

[–]GawernatorI race motorcycles6 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

fail response

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Using "fail" in 2016 is a "fail response."

[–]GawernatorI race motorcycles0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

In love with the 80's - Relient K

[–]hakosuaEscape the Pillory1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

I get what you're saying about a shift such that people are increasingly held accountable for the emotions they trigger in others. And I do think "safe space" is intended to imply emotional safety. However, I think the TRP exists, in a large part, because men feel emotionally invalidated by popular discourse.

There's a self-improvement component too, but I suspect emotions play a larger role than anyone is willing to admit. Any why shouldn't they? Emotions can be behavioral motivators, warning signals, or useful markers of what people value.

Tl;dr: Feels aren't just for the ladies.

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist14 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I agree, but I still think there is definitely a difference between a forum that tells you, "Tell us about your problems. No one is judging you here. Don't worry. None of it is your fault." and one that says, "All of it is your fault. Stop being such a pussy. Now go lift, faggot!"

The second qualifies as an "echo chamber" certainly, but I'm not sure it meets all necessary conditions for "safe space".

[–]kick6Red Pill Man0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

I think the TRP exists, in a large part, because men feel emotionally invalidated by popular discourse.

I wouldn't use the term "emotionally invalidated." I'd go with "gaslighted (gaslit)?" It's conceptually different.

[–]hakosuaEscape the Pillory0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, that's interesting. I think I like bringing emotions up on the PPD sub because it often seems like the elephant in the room when RP guys discuss feminists or vise versa. You mentioned a distinction between gas-lighting and emotional invalidation. I agree. However, I think I have an easier time coming up with scenarios in which these phenomena intersect.

For example, a guy might say, "it makes me angry that a girl was really friendly to me, then ghosted when I asked her out." And a girl might respond, "No. That's just your entitlement. You're assuming she's under obligation to sleep with you." In saying that, she implies that it's the guy's perceptions that are fucked up; also, his emotions are baseless.

Conversely, a girl might say, "I feel guilty; this really sweet guy asked me out and I don't know how to tell him he's not my type." Meanwhile, a guy might respond, "Nah, you're just virtue signaling, deluding yourself that you feel guilty. If you really gave two fucks about him, you'd fuck him or tell him the truth straight-up. It's not difficult." I'd argue this is also gas lighting because he's dismissing her external concern (how to say no) while shifting focus to the idea that she's deluding herself.

So, in both scenarios, feelings get dismissed and problems get turned back around on the speakers. I think men might also be less likely to express emotions straight-up. So it's maybe a little harder to judge if there's an emotional component when they're gaslighted. In any case, sometimes it's most respectful to deal with the content of an argument without making the other person tip their hand emotionally. We all know that we all have feels but there's no rule that we've gotta share them on Reddit.

[–]kick6Red Pill Man0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

For example, a guy might say, "it makes me angry that a girl was really friendly to me, then ghosted when I asked her out." And a girl might respond, "No. That's just your entitlement. You're assuming she's under obligation to sleep with you." In saying that, she implies that it's the guy's perceptions that are fucked up; also, his emotions are baseless.

that is invalidation, not gaslighting. However, that's not what guys get upset about. What guys get upset about is this.

"That girl told me she wanted a sweet sensitive guy that treats her like a princess, but last night she fucked some dude that couldn't even buy his own drinks, let alone hers." And a girl might respond "no, she really does want sensitive guys she's just 'finding herself' right now. One day she'll realize how great you are."

Gaslighting as all about telling someone that what they're seeing isn't actually what they're seeing. THAT's what guys are mad about: this conspiracy to make sure guys don't believe their own senses.

[–]hakosuaEscape the Pillory0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Right. I guess I think of gaslighting as telling someone their sensory interpretation of reality is flawed and then following that up with some trait-based attribution of why their reality can't be trusted moving forward. So it's both saying "that's not true" and "you crazy" (although that second clause is oftentimes implied rather than spoken.) if someone just disagrees with my interpretation of reality, that's fine. Gaslighting is insidious because it's more than just disagreeing.

Does the RP have an opinion on why girls advise guys to be nice? I agree that your example seems core to the anger phase - after reading it, I recognized it as a very specifically RP thing. I would argue your example contains some subtle emotional invalidation. The guy sounds pissed off and the girl seems to be encouraging him to suppress his irritation be rewriting his reality into something more palatable.

[–]kick6Red Pill Man0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I make the distinction between "you're not allowed to feel x about y" and "you're seeing it wrong, x isn't actually happening, y is"

While the two might be part and parcel in this context, part of becoming a man is learning to control your emotionality so it's not something we distinctly think of in regards to this. Ergo, our emotions are always invalid in the sense that the larger public isn't supposed to recognize that we have them (vis a vis, masculine stoicism).

Does the RP have an opinion on why girls advise guys to be nice?

That's a rabbit whole with no bottom, but yes RP does.

[–]sir_wankalot_here-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Struggles like

One female pushups equals two males

If only misogynists would see that means equal opportunity

[–]dissentforall0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Safe spaces attempt to fully insulate the people in them and prevent them from having to come to terms with the fact that others will vehemently disagree with them. TRP is more of a ignore the BS they teach you out there and take this game plan to run your life how you see fit. They actively force the members to stare reality in the face and say "this is how it is, deal with it...but take this to help you navigate" but don't tolerate nonsense in midst of teaching.

[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Possessive "its" takes no apostrophe. Don't make me say that again. /glare

If it was auto complete that did it I may forgive you. /grumpyface

[–]kick6Red Pill Man0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

....really?

[–]Ultrablue1973-4 points-3 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

TRP isn't so much a safe space as an echo chamber. Attempting not to protect it's users from badfeelz, but to keep a consistent message.

TRP doesn't have a consistent message. There is no real Bible that guys believe in, and a lot of things they spout off is really reprehensible: Women shouldn't be allowed to vote, women can't be logical, AWALT.

If a woman says all men are assholes I will point blank say, "You've just insulted my father, brother, and husband." If she answers something like, "Well all the men I've dated are assholes" I'll ask her why she is drawn to assholes. (Though to be honest I don't hang around women like that, and when I do it's usually in some sort of social situation I've been forced into.)

TRP doesn't seem to ask the same thing ... why are you only finding stupid, shallow, neurotic women? Do they make you feel better about yourself? Smarter? More manly?

[–]UulmsharBetter Red Than Dead12 points13 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

Women shouldn't be allowed to vote, women can't be logical

Citation needed.

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist5 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

People do say that on TRP, but like the above poster said, TRP doesn't have a Bible...

[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

WTF did I just read?

TRP says women shouldn't be allowed to vote? TRP doesn't give a flying shit whether women get to vote or not.

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

You should read more TRP.

Though I don't necessarily agree, there are actually some really well thought out arguments for why women shouldn't be allowed to vote. I find some of them hard to argue against and almost convincing.

[–]Entropy-7Old Goat0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

I think it is a minority opinion, but TRP isn't about political activism anyways so there is no sort of movement to repeal the 19th Amendment.

The thing is, there are lots of minority opinions on TRP that would otherwise get squelched out in a "safe space".

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

I guess it still qualifies as a minority, but it has become a pretty popular idea on TRP. Like you said though, TRP isn't a political movement, and I think even those who hold this opinion recognize that it would be impossible to repeal it anyway.

[–]Entropy-7Old Goat0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I did a bit of poking about and you would have to spend a good hour or so to find more posts and comments than you can count on both hands. I found 3 posts that directly criticized giving women the vote (claiming that it lead to a bloated government and the destruction of marriage) and a few comments in other threads along those lines. There were some posts that stated flat out the political impossibility of repealing the 19th amendment and several commenters and posters who said that granting women the vote was the proper thing to do. Other commenters pointed out the bad timing in that women were granted the vote during WWI and yet were not subject to the draft.

Overall, with almost 150,000 members and lord knows how many posts over the last 10 years there is a paucity of guys on TRP coming out against women's suffrage.

[–]blehedd2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

It's not quite "women can't be logical", but it is however from the sidebar (redpill antibiotic nuke) and as close to redpill bible as you get:

Women are irrational and inconsistent, they have a capacity for logic but it is not their modus operandi, that is to say that they must exert effort to be logical as it is not their factory setting. A logical woman is easily baited into becoming emotional; women are easy to compromise. Their decisions are based on their current emotional state rather than the abstraction of logic.

[–]pitaenigmaBeta Male Seeks Cock Carouseler5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Shit, replace women with people and I'll agree

[–]kick6Red Pill Man0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I like how you tried to make this look like it was replying to my post, but was actually just a run-of-the-mill anti-TRP propaganda piece. Nice try.

[–]EquilibriunRed Pill Man20 points21 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

I've actually said this before. Ironically TRP is the safe place where men can be angry and not be labeled by SJW terms. But in TRPs version, it's "safe" from people trying to make noise to the message. Not from other people in TRP giving you cold hard truths. Safe spaces are for morons who can't handle disagreement in public places IN REAL LIFE that don't want to face facts. This is a forum, and I've been banned from certain ones without posting there ever. They can be ran at moderators whims.

The message of TRP is actually ironically feminist. The amazing notion that women should be held just as responsible for the shit they do. But we know better they don't want to. So we do what all men do. We mentally "deal"/ accept it and move on with our lives.

[–][deleted] -2 points-2 points | Copy Link

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[–]EquilibriunRed Pill Man18 points19 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

Bro you don't talk shit about alcoholics who are trying to handle that shit. This, is kind of like that. Admitting that life isn't how you think it is, accepting it and moving on.

These guys don't come here because life is good. No one god damn finds TRP cause everything is gravy. These people( I think others forget this) are in pain. Lots of pain. And they are pissed because the world lied to them. I was lied to about literally all the fucking things for 25 years. How pissed do you think I was? It's easy for you to dismiss, but that sub makes men's lives better. And in turn everyone else around them. While this sub examines the validity of theory, practice and result, TRP is focused on making a man's life better. This place is the armchair quarter back of TRP.

The sad part is, they weren't taught right in the first place. I wasn't. My dad was and is a beta. I love him but it's true. He's always been there and is very clutch when needed. But I don't listen to his woman advice ever.

Men on that sub, need to learn things and TRP provides the curriculum. What they do with it is up to them. don't shit on it

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

I feel for you man. I understand not being good with girls is rough, and it's harder when you don't have good role models. But trp is the answer. You say it makes everyone around the mans life better, that's not true. I grew up with a trp dad. He made me and my mothers lives miserable growing up. Dread game, idgaf attitudes, and what ever other manipulation affect people in a negative way. Yes, trp will give you good tips with flirting and taking care of yourself, but that's all the good the have to offer. The rest is misoginistic crap writen by the mods to keep you mad and going to their websites so they get ad revenue. Do you think gaylubeoil gives a shit about anyone else on trp, or does he's just want you to go buy his alpha shirt? Trp is a cult.

If you want some honest help go to a therapist, not random men on the Internet.

[–]EquilibriunRed Pill Man4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I did both. And yes, glo cares. Who else do you know that skypes with people to help them get more fit? If I asked him for help, I bet money he would help. It's not about not being good with girls. It's about not being good to yourself.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

GLO does care. He cares about selling t-shirts.

[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

It's not about not being good with girls. It's about not being bad with girls.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

By treating them badly.

[–]abacuz4Blue Pill Man-3 points-2 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

These guys don't come here because life is good. No one god damn finds TRP cause everything is gravy. These people( I think others forget this) are in pain.

I mean, tough? Plenty of people in pain don't join hate groups to convince them that their failings aren't their fault.

[–]Paranoidexboyfriend13 points14 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Some hate groups are very socially acceptable and allow their members to vent all they want. If you want to hate on white men, the whole world is your oyster to vent those feelings and get backed up on it.

[–]EquilibriunRed Pill Man4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

From what I see it's always your fault. Gf left you? Your fault. Can't get a date? Your fault. Difference is, is that there's also reasons why, and how to fix it. Instead of just "be yourself" " you're fine" blah blah blah

[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

You forgot my favorite. "You're a very nice person. Any woman would be glad to have you. Just not this one because there's a fish on her bicycle".

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't know. Have you ever noticed some of the active posters eventually stop actively posting? Maybe they moved on. Others choose to stay.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

You can't talk about TRP anywhere except TRP. You can talk about the glories of feminism pretty much everywhere else on reddit

This sub isn't a safe space, and it's filled with TRPers

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 7 points8 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

So trp is a safe space to talk about your problems....

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

Are you a parrot bro?

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 6 points7 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

You literally described trp as a place you can go to talk about you problems without judgement or persecution from others....

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

trp as a place you can go to talk about you problems without judgement or persecution from others

OK, that's a genuine LOL right there. We've got judgement aplenty, as even a quick scan of that blooper sub's front page would tell you. You're just making stuff up at this point.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

Yes, but wouldn't you agree that The Blue Pill is a space separate from TRP, and Blue Pillers who try to post there are almost universally banned by your mods (One of whom is a known, self-admitted rapist) for attempting to refute your philosophy (which is easy to do, since it's based on nothing)?

That's a Safe Space, bro.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

almost universally banned ... for attempting to refute your philosophy ...

People who violate TRP Rule Zero are banned. You just said as much.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

So: Safe Space. Got it.

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points | Copy Link

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[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Whining about imaginary internet points?

You're not maintaining frame, bro.

[–]feminazi_oppresorRed Pill6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

TRP is a place where you can say whatever the fuck you want A safe space is the opposite

[–]theheartofgold2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

TRP is a place where you can say whatever the fuck you want

Unless you're saying "you guys are misogynists" or "I met a woman who wasn't AWALT because AWALT is nonsense". So. Not 'whatever the fuck you want'. It's 'whatever the fuck you want that's on-message'

A safe space is the opposite

Have you ever been involved in a safe space community other than TRP? You guys seem to think you know a lot about them.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Nah, it's just not a place for debating TRP ideas. Or white knight poopooing. Debating TRP ideas goes here. Judge and persecute away.

[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Judge away.

OK. You are an oppressor. You are the problem rather than the solution. You are a misogynist. You are literally bad to women. Women are weak and vulnerable. You abuse your superiority in physical strength to dominate others. You have no heart or compassion for the suffering of others. You act out of hatred to bully the weak. You join with others to actively preserve your group privilege by condemning those you have othered. You call them names. You openly despise them. You cast the out from the community of the good. And you regard them as less than human.

How am I doing?

Not like me at all. /s

[–][deleted] 6 points6 points | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

So no one at trp would like the feminism subreddit shut down? Absolutely no one? Lol

[–][deleted] 5 points5 points | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Nailed!

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS8 points9 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

Advocates for Youth states on their website that a safe-space is: "A place where anyone can relax and be fully self-expressed, without fear of being made to feel uncomfortable, unwelcome or challenged on account of biological sex, race/ethnicity, sexual orientation, gender identity or expression, cultural background, age, or physical or mental ability; a place where the rules guard each person's self-respect, dignity and feelings and strongly encourage everyone to respect others.

Nope, sorry. You fail.

Even if we change the benchmarks and remove all the SJW pet causes (biological sex, race/ethnicity, sexual orientation, gender identity or expression, cultural background, age, or physical or mental ability), the fact that the whole "thou shalt not trigger or belittle thy fellow safe space inmates"-directive is thoroughly disregarded should be a hint that you're talking nonsense.

Its a surprise to no one that posting on TRP against one of their ideas or "endorsed members" will get you banned.

Bullshit, disagreeing with endorsed poster doesn't get you banned. Being a troll does, though.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 4 points5 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

Nah I'm pretty sure that there is infighting even within safe spaces. They just don't insult you based on your identity. Also here's a list of people getting banned for bs reasons.

http://www.reddit.com/r/TheBluePill/comments/21kfan/heres_your_last_chance_tell_us_all_how_you_were/

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel5 points6 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

bs reasons.

The top comments are all bp mods, it makes sense to ban someone that is a mod for a sub that mocks you, would you allow a homophobe into a private gay club?

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 5 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

No, but I would consider the gay club a safe space for gay people.

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

No

There you go.

Also there is a difference between safe space as in haven and safe space as in coddled hub box, unless your gay club has a no bad feels rule it's not a safe space just a space that is in some ways safe.

[–]theheartofgold2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

You seem to have conflated "respect one another" with "no bad feels".

The idea of being in a safe space where you don't get discriminated against by bigots (which is what it states - sex, race, sexual orientation, age, disability) is not the same as a 'coddled hug box'. People in these places can still have disagreements and talk about big bad real world realities, they can just do it without anyone calling them a faggot or a nigger when they disagree. You seem to think that "thou shalt not trigger or belittle thy fellow safe space inmates" is the same as "don't be a sexist, a racist, or a homophobe", do you see how reductive and silly that is? The rules are there to prevent morons from coming in and harassing people - kinda like the rules you TRPers have for exactly the same reasons: because they want a space where a bunch of trolls can't come in and waste everybody's time.

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

You seem to think that "thou shalt not trigger or belittle thy fellow safe space inmates" is the same as "don't be a sexist, a racist, or a homophobe", do you see how reductive and silly that is?

Its how things are I have yet to see a safe space that is as you describe.

The rules are there to prevent morons from coming in and harassing people

That may be, but that's not how it plays out.

[–]theheartofgold2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I have yet to see a safe space that is as you describe.

Because you spend so much time hanging around safe spaces, right?

That may be, but that's not how it plays out.

See my previous post: "The rules are there to prevent morons from coming in and harassing people"

I'm actually in a safe space community. We've never had to ban anyone, and there's been plenty of dissent and arguments. If a TRP joined up and never attacked anyone or harassed anyone, they would never get banned.

But I doubt it would play out that way.

[–]MagicGainbowKeepin' it real, havin' a feel0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Because you spend so much time hanging around safe spaces, right?

No but every once in a while interaction with them is necessary.

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Ah, and TRPs sudo science means more. Gotcha

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Not at all. Who said that? Not me. Why do you need to make a strawman to make your argument?

[–]TheRedLadle2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I imagine you're thinking of the word pseudoscience? Unless you actually mean some *nix command 'science' that requires root privileges?

[–]hyperrrealLoves fun[M] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

You fail as usual.

This is uncivil, and needs to be removed from your comment.

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Fixed, don't want to die on that hill :P

[–]hyperrrealLoves fun0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Thanks

[–]alreadyredschoolRational egoism < Toxic idealism8 points9 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

I can slender in there call 90% of them beta doormats, question the character of some guys, call him a pussy and not get banned but upvoted, especially if he acts like a pussy. No really, RP is much harsher on guys than it's on women but somehow this is forgotten.

If it's a safe space then it's a horrible one at that.

Say faggot on TBP and get banned. Call a pussy on TRP a faggot and you get upvoted.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 8 points9 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

But tell someone feminism is a-okay and get banned from trp. So how is that not infringing on my free speech?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

But tell someone feminism is a-okay and get banned from trp.

Because it isn't OK.

So how is that not infringing on my free speech?

Just because you don't allow idiots to come in and shit on the carpet with ideas like "feminism", doesn't mean that it's a safe space.

To think otherwise you'd have to take the position that any sub on reddit that removes a comment for any reason besides breaking reddit rules is a "safe space".

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I would. Is a subreddit for PS4 not a safe space free of other gaming consoles posts?

[–]that_all_you_got1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's it mate, you officially got the tardation.

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I'm not sure if places which don't allow 100% free speech and safe spaces are necessarily equivalent. I think safe space has more to do with not being judged and criticized. TRP definitely doesn't meet that definition.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I think safe space has more to do with not being judged and criticized. TRP definitely doesn't meet that definition.

Unless you judge or criticize literally any facet of your bullshit philosophy based on nothing.

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Depends on whether you are talking about TRP members criticizing each other or TRP members being criticized from outside observers. TRP allows the former, but not the latter. I don't believe a place that allows the former could properly be considered a safe space.

[–]alreadyredschoolRational egoism < Toxic idealism3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

TRP is not the government. They can't infringe your free speech. Private clubs are free to throw out anyone for any reason, except for some discrimination law things.

[–]hakosuaEscape the Pillory0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm wondering if this has more to do with how guys demonstrate that they give a shit about one another. Like, if you're all calling people "pussy" because you've been there too, and because you needed a kick in the ass to improve your lives, then that's still a caring environment. You see this oftentimes with older males in 12-step meetings: they call bullshit on one another all the time but it's usually intended as constructive feedback. Also, by policing the ranks for weakness, you reenforce group cohesiveness, which keeps things safe from outside interference.

[–]MakeEmSayAyyGirlNoInventAnything3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

you're more than welcome to go in there with facts.

but the fact is and ive argued this in every sub, women have every gender based stat in their favor in the west.

if you come in there and make good logical points they'll let it go. we can back up every point.

[–]GaiusScaevolusMod TRP/AskTRP/BaM4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I think there's a difference between creating your own "clubhouse" for which you control the criteria for entry, and co-opting public spaces and spaces primarily funded by the people you attempt to exclude.

The notion that any college, public or private, excludes the exercise of free speech or other rights by taxpayers and/or tuition payers respectively is absurd. The notion of creating your own private supported space and not opening it up to people who hate you is a different proposition entirely.

TRP folks don't object to having your own space, but create your own, don't steal from others.

[–]InBaggingArea6 points7 points  (19 children) | Copy Link

It's not so much a safe space as a straif space. It's a place where people who are left out from everywhere else can go to say what they really think.

There's also a separate soon for asking questions of TRP. TRP itself is about showcasing TRP ideas and asking questions is not allowed, as I understand it. No expert here.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 11 points12 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

How is that different than Black and LGBT communities requesting safe spaces then? They're "people who are left out from everywhere else can go to say what they really think."

[–]TheRealMewtNatty4 points5 points  (17 children) | Copy Link

Because they're not left out from everywhere else... other than the places that explicitly do not tolerate those groups.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 9 points10 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

And TRP members are left out of more places than Black and LGBT groups?

[–]TheRealMewtNatty6 points7 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

Probably. We might never know since TRP preaches that its followers behave like those around them.

Let's play a thought experiment, though. You're running a bar and I walk in. I'm different in three different scenarios.

Scenario A) I'm black. Scenario B) I'm gay. I make this known. Scenario C) I practice TRP. I practice all of it and I make it known.

Which scenario do you summon a bouncer to come up to me and say "You need to leave"?

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 6 points7 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

Honestly, if you aren't bothering anyone. None of them.

[–]disposable_pants9 points10 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

Tell that to the people who are all too happy to dox anyone associated with the manosphere.

More to the point, imagine someone going up to a bouncer and saying three things:

  1. "You need to throw that guy out because he's black!"
  2. "You need to throw that guy out because he's gay!"
  3. "You need to throw that guy out because he's being mean to women!"

The first two would probably get you thrown out of most places. The third -- the public perception of the manosphere -- has a good chance of getting the TRP guy thrown out.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 9 points10 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

Yes, because you are going out of your way to bother other people. No one will kick a guy out of the bar for being Christian. But if he's going around telling people they're going to hell for drinking he'll be removed

[–]disposable_pants7 points8 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

Who said the TRP guy is bothering anyone, though? The guy who wants to get him kicked out just for what he thinks? What does "bothering" mean here? What specifically is he doing?

The point -- which you just illustrated -- is that even an insinuation of wrongdoing toward women is enough to get white knights for miles around to turn against someone. We live in a society where it's no longer possible to publicly turn against someone for no other reason than their race or ethnicity, but their thoughts? That's fair game.

[–]theheartofgold3 points4 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

You're moving the goalposts. In your scenario, it would have to go like this:

"You need to throw that guy out because he's black!"

"You need to throw that guy out because he's gay!"

"You need to throw that guy out because he thinks women are illogical and child-like"

You're not gonna get thrown out of a bar for that, bro. You're just not. If you start shit with other people, maybe, but just for expressing the thought? No. So now what? You guys seem to hate the idea of 'the oppression olympics', but you sure do love participating in them. If you think TERPers are actually more of an out-group in today's society than people of color and gays you're officially out of your mind. Have TERPers ever had their basic rights stepped on? Are TERPers jailed at hugely disproportionate rates? Are they profiled by the police? Are they more likely to be below the poverty line? Are they more likely to be murdered? Are they banned or stoned to death in third-world countries?

Yeah, no.

[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

The circles I move in being black or gay are plus points. Being TRP is excommunication material. It's worse than being a convicted murderer on early release.

[–]kitsandkatsBlue Pill Woman0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Imagine that.

[–][deleted] 5 points5 points | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Im pretty sure most people don't post cmv to actually have their views changed. I said challenge me.

[–]Eulabeia2 points3 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

What do you think a safe space is? By your definition it seems that every forum with moderators that bans users for straying from the discussion topic is a safe space.

If I'm not mistaken, a feminist safe space is a place where nobody says anything offensive, there's no arguing, and everyone must agree with the basics of feminism.

In contrast, posters on TRP try to be offensive as possible, and there's a decent amount of arguing. As far as I know you'll only be banned if you don't agree with the goals of subreddit.

[–]tallwheelManosphere Unificationist1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yep. This. OP's definition is incorrect.

TRP is not a free speech forum, but that doesn't make it a safe space.

[–]theheartofgold1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

If I'm not mistaken, a feminist safe space is a place where nobody says anything offensive, there's no arguing, and everyone must agree with the basics of feminism.

You're mistaken. Everyone in here is mistaken, because none of you have actually ever been in a feminist safe space, and all you know about them comes from other TRP members who have also never been in one, but who hate feminists and want to make them seem as ridiculous and weak and evil as possible.

[–]Eulabeia0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy Link

Care to define what exactly a feminist safe space is then? I thought I was being quite charitable with my description of one. I even forgot to mention the worst part about them, which is how they like to sometimes completely ban men.

By the way, what I know about them actually comes from my experience of trying to talk about gender issues in some of them.

[–]theheartofgold1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

I'm involved in two of these. One is women-only, one isn't. Much of what we talk about is just goofy stuff, but a bunch of it deals with mental-health issues, body positivity, dating, substance abuse, whatever our members are dealing with currently. On the women-only one, women post naked pictures sometimes, and talk about their sex lives in a much more open way than they do on the other one, but that's about the only difference. We don't ban people for dissenting opinions, we don't ban people for saying offensive things, because everyone's definition of offensive is different. What we do, is we discuss these things. Our only rule is that members aren't allowed to delete posts - that way there's a personal accountability that we have to take on, so if someone gets offended, we can't wiggle out of it, we just discuss things. Like adults.

What we DON'T do, is talk about how awful straight white men are, force people to agree to the basic tenets of feminism, ban arguments, ban offensive statements, ban users for saying things we disagree with.

By the way, what I know about them actually comes from my experience of trying to talk about gender issues in some of them.

Apparently you chose the wrong ones to do that in, I guess. And my other guess is that by 'talking about gender issues' you mean 'trying to tell feminists that they're wrong about everything' just like the way you feel about the people who get banned on TRP - I just read through some of your comment history, and even just on the first page more than half of it is you trying to tell feminists they're wrong about everything, lmao.

If you actually had an open mind, I bet you would have been allowed to stay. But you don't, because you're on TRP, which means you think AWALT, and you're surprised a feminist group didn't want you around? These groups, like TRP, exist so that certain out-groups can have a place to vent without annoying trolls. They don't exist to constantly have to defend their ideology and goals, just like TRP. Where exactly is the difference?

[–]Eulabeia0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

we DON'T...force people to agree to the basic tenets of feminism, ban arguments

They don't exist to constantly have to defend their ideology and goals

So which is it?

[–]theheartofgold0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

I'm talking about my group, which isn't about feminism, it's about women. So, unsurprisingly, we don't sit around arguing about gender politics constantly. If someone wants to have an argument about feminism, that's fine. If we were being constantly invaded by TRP trolls trying to tell us why, as women, we are actually all illogical children who are genetically predisposed to slutting around, that would be a different story. And that isn't about forcing people to agree to the basic tenets of feminism, it's about having a space that's not full of sexist morons.

When feminists come into TRP, telling you all you're sexist idiots who hate women, don't you ban them? Do you count that as 'forcing people to agree with the basic tenets of TRP? And if so, aren't you being a hypocrite for bashing feminist safe spaces for doing the same?

There's a difference between in-fighting arguments, and trolling. Banning trolls isn't making something 'a place where nobody says anything offensive, there's no arguing, and everyone must agree with the basics of feminism.' It's just...banning trolls. TRP does that as well.

Btw I notice you ignored the rest of my point. So I made it again, in different words, in this post.

[–]Eulabeia0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

I am not actually a member or active participant of the red pill community, and I am not exactly clear on what they ban people for. I'd guess that's mostly up to the mods to determine on a case by case basis, and their own personal biases often come into play.

aren't you being a hypocrite for bashing feminist safe spaces for doing the same?

Can you point to me where exactly you think I have been "bashing feminist safe spaces"? Is that really how you interpreted my brief description of them?

I notice you ignored the rest of my point

Are you expecting me to come up with a point by point rebuttal to everything because you think I just want to argue with everything you say? I asked a question, and you answered it. What do you want me to say?

So, your point is that a "safe space" is a place where...trolls are banned? Is that what you consider a safe space?

[–]theheartofgold0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

Here's what I consider a safe space - a space that encourages discussion and debate without personal attacks.

Ok on a safe space: "Are you kidding? I totally disagree - here's why:"

Not ok on a safe space: "You're a feminazi and should be raped."

It's pretty much as simple as that. Sometimes people just want to duck out of the rest of the internet sometimes, where people think arguing means "You ugly cunt I hope you die in a car crash". It's not about discouraging dissent, it's about encouraging respect. And IMO you can have much more productive, exploratory arguments in a place like that than on a board where people have already made their minds up and are just there to clumsily club each other with ad hominem attacks.

I've seen some other TERPers claim that safe spaces are about 'fearing' or 'avoiding' the harsh realities. I just don't think that's true. There are plenty of places to go to get called a nigger bitch or a faggot pussy for having a different opinion. People in out-communities live every day in those harsh realities. Enjoying a space away from that is pretty sane, and has nothing to do with fear or avoidance (or freedom of speech).

Can you point to me where exactly you think I have been "bashing feminist safe spaces"? Is that really how you interpreted my brief description of them?

You're describing them in a deeply unflattering light. You want to argue semantics, here? You're in here describing them as Orwellian nightmare censorship communities. What do you call that? (Other than 'a brief description'.) It's certainly not an unbiased brief description.

Are you expecting me to come up with a point by point rebuttal to everything because you think I just want to argue with everything you say?

Not really, I'm pretty much done with this conversation. It's been interesting.

[–]Eulabeia0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

a space that encourages discussion and debate without personal attacks.

So then TRP is not a safe space by your own definition, because it allows personal attacks.

Glad we managed to sort this out.

[–]theheartofgold0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

I don't think there's enough of a difference to warrant the ways in which TRP's hatefully describe 'feminist safe spaces' as if they would never be involved in such degrading things. You started out by describing them as places which don't tolerate 'dissent' or 'differing opinions' and 'force people to agree with feminism' and yet the only difference I can see, is members on TRP can call each other names. I'm pretty sure that if I went there and posted personal attacks, that wouldn't be tolerated, and I'd be banned. So the difference is that you guys can call each other pussies, and in feminist safe spaces you can't?

Wow, yeah, feminists sure are the weak, evil creatures TRPs describe and safe spaces are definitely a sign of the gynocracy taking over...

[–]Entropy-7Old Goat1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

TRP is a pretty rough and tumble place and there is a wide variety of opinions on particular points, disagreements and even heated discussion. Sometimes the mods and such get heavy handed about the purity of the message and - as with any moderated forum - ban people who give them heartache.

The biggest problems with "safe spaces" are 1) today's society is active in creating and maintaining leftist/feminist safe spaces while preventing or dismantling conservative/masculine safe spaces and 2) point 1 is extending into public forums such as university and politics that should not be safe for anyone but rather a crucible of frank talk to seek truth and solve problems.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

So how is trp different from a conservative/masculine safe space?

Also can you give examples of a conservative safe space?

[–]Entropy-7Old Goat0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

The concept of and term "safe space" is a leftist/feminist construct so in a way there is no such thing as a "conservative/masculine safe space" because there are people on the other side trying to square the circle to label something like TRP using their own conceptions rather than looking to what is really going on.

In the liberal sense of the term, a safe space is for people who cannot endure the rigours of public discussion and debate on social, intellectual or political matters. They want an environment where they are not "triggered" or "offended" by opposing ideas or a lack of politeness on the part of someone who disagrees.

If you want to use the same term - "safe space" - then you have to understand what conservatives and men want to be safe from, and it is completely different: 1) disruption and 2) SJW backlash.

It is wildly common for conservatives or men to organize an event only to have it stormed by the left and shut down. Venues are overpacked to keep legitimate attendees out, protesting picket lines block access, the stage is rushed, the speakers are shouted down, fire alarms are pulled and even bomb threats are made to clear the building. Universities and other organizations use trespass laws and ridiculous "security deposits" to punt or prevent events while private venues will back out of a booking out of fears of vandalism and violence, and otherwise messing with their business (at say, a hotel where there are multiple events and guests who have nothing to do with the function being protested).

You don't really see that at leftist/feminist events and if you did the police would crack down hard (which you rarely see with conservative/masculine events despite the existence of laws such as section 176 of the Criminal Code of Canada). If anything, a PC function will sue a venue if the conservative operators try to back out of the booking, and they will win under various "human rights" laws.

So conservatives and men want a space they have enough control over that a discussion can actually happen rather than getting derailed by people who oppose their very existence and do not want the discussion to take place at all.

Secondly - and this especially applies to men even moreso than conservatives - is to be left alone outside of the discussion space rather than being stalked, doxxed, harassed, defamed, or having their family, friends, employers or customers similarly treated.

Some schlub from Hydro One in Ontario (the government run electricity monopoly) laughs when a different guy makes an obscene comment (FHRITP) in microphone range of a female television reporter; the reporter calls him over and has a quick interview (if you want to call it that) and he confirms that he thought it was funny. Then SJWs track him down to publicly shame him and his employer, who cave to the pressure end up firing him. (With the joke on the SJWs being that he probably got a sweet severance package out of it.)

In the face of that, guys want a place with some anonymity so they are safe from such tactics.

Otherwise, conservative and masculine spaces are not at all "safe" in the leftist/feminist conception because there is vigorous debate, cutting remarks, with verbal smack downs going every which way along with off colour humour and genuinely offensive comments which don't get censored for fear of throwing out the baby with the bath water, and also because everyone is assumed to be an adult.

[–]statsfoddernot blue, not red.1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The same reason SRS, TBP and other "satire" femmpire subs ban people... follow the narrative or gfto. It isn't special to TRP and while it is hypocritical to create a "safe space" at the same time as decrying them as killing freedom of speech, the others do the same in proclaiming free speech meanwhile sanitizing that speech to create a safe space.

[–]takeshyperbolelitera1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I think we need a working definition of 'safe spaces'. I have a vague idea, but I suspect others, including the OP, have a different definition.

There seems to be people on Tumblr that want to claim the entirety of public university campuses as a safe space, which I suspect many people are against, including TRP.

Calling a subreddit a 'safe space' doesn't seem to match what people are typically talking about when they say safe space.

I have no problems with people forming some kind semi-private group (subreddit) on a privately owned (ie not government funded) web site and excluding people based on whatever arbitrary rules they chose.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I utterly despise safespaces and from what I can see, TRP is a safespace/hugbox for men to talk about how hard it is out there, and how the rest of the world just doesn't understand, and it really hurts their fee-fees and buy a t-shirt

pls

[–]GregariousWolf1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

This depends on your definition of safe space.

If you define safe space to mean a moderated message forum where the discussion is limited to certain topics and trolls are banned, then sure. By this definition, TRP is a safe space.

However, I don't think that is what people usually mean when they use the term safe space. The term as it is generally used on Reddit and college campuses is closely associated with identity politics. It is not just that the topic of discussion is moderated and that off-topic or abusive posts are removed.

In a safe space, feelings matter more than arguments of logic, and who you are matters more than what you stand for. Your membership in the preferred class entitles you to permission to speak and gives you more license in the things you may say. Self-censorship is encouraged to prevent politically incorrect ideas from being expressed and steps are taken to prevent undesirables from participating.

As I define it, TRP is a moderated forum, but it is not a safe space. There are subs that meet this definition. I'm banned from subs like r-offmychest, r-rape, r-blackladies, r-againsthatesubreddits (and probably more that I don't know about) even though I never participated in any of those subs. I am an undesirable person only for having posted in TRP on occasion. The content of my posts was unimportant. On TRP people disagree, sometimes vehemently, on politics or religion. Arguments on politics or religion get moderated for being off-topic, but you can call people out on bullshit. You do have to stay on-topic, but you don't have to spare people's feelings.

The OP is making an appeal to hypocrisy, also known as a tu quoque fallacy. OP's definition of safe space is overly broad. When TRP preemptively bans people who post in TBP or bans people for having the wrong politics or genitalia then it will be a safe space. Until then, I don't think it meets a strict definition of one.

[–]Christian_Kong80% Natural Red0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I agree the subreddit in itself is a safe space but not the RP/alpha/whatever lifestyle.

It's unlike many other safe spaces in that it is a safe space that (often)helps people deal with the real world as opposed to many others that are used to protect people from the real world.

[–]disposable_pants3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Its a surprise to no one that posting on TRP against one of their ideas or "endorsed members" will get you banned.

You can absolutely disagree with an endorsed contributor on TRP. You can even challenge the ideas -- just as much as you can challenge the central ideas of any sub. For example, I can't go on /r/baseball and tell everyone that baseball is stupid and they're all losers for liking such a boring fucking sport. That's trolling, and that will (and should) be banned anywhere.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

To them it is an overreach of the feminist agenda that does nothing but put men down.

The difference is this. Feminism, attempts to change the real world, into a safe space. It attempts to derail all negative criticisms of it's movement, and women in general. They seek to use legal and governmental powers to enforce their safe space unto everyone. Anyone who critiques a woman for her appearance, sexuality, or basically anything is instantly labeled a misogynist. Anyone who "isn't a feminist" is automatically declared vouching for spousal rape and think of women as sub human.

TRP, is a space within the world. It has central ideas for its spaces, but does not advocate it's members trying to spread those ideas to other people. One rule of TRP is you don't bring it up to real life friends.

[–]c_in_macn1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

TRP is nothing like a safe space. Members are actively censored all over reddit so they have to have a place to talk about ideas. It's not about protecting people from feelings.

[–]hakosuaEscape the Pillory-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Ideas can cause feelings. The ideas that TRP censors are the ideas that hurt or anger them. The ideas that they express have an emotional component which outsiders tend to invalidate (and also usually censor). For example, rarely do we express sympathy for a man's difficulties obtaining sexual satisfaction, especially if he's single and is looking to fuck around. The TRP respects that not getting laid can be upsetting. Their advice might still be "get your shit together"; however, they're a safe space in that they don't dismiss the negative emotions of incels.

[–]YaBoiTibzzenjoying the blueper reels0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Safe spaces are only problematic when you start imposing them on others so that you never have to leave yours, as opposed to recognizing that it is a place that you can retreat to but must then eventually venture out from. SJWs do the former while wanting to deny TRP, MRA, etc., to even have the latter. TRP meanwhile advocates that you be very careful about even talking about any of the ideas offline much less try and impose them on anyone else through shaming tactics and the like.

[–]winndixie0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

How safe do you feel in /r/trp?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is the very definition of a safe space

[–]WrensPensPro-Redpill, anti-Redpill sub0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, it's a fucking safe space for their sperg ECs who need to make sure no one hurts their fee-fees after they posted their jack off fantasies.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I dunno where all this "TRP bans people easily" stuff comes from. I've expressed some controversial views there and bern downvoted, even got some shitty PMs, but not banned. I think it's quite an open-minded forum, actually, wouldn't call it a "safe space". People there will certainly call you on your bullshit.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Damn right it's my safe space. I can go there and say whatever I want without a bunch of whiny bitches and manginas attacking me because I hurt their fee fees.

The only real difference is that it's a non-politically correct safe space instead of a politically correct safe space

[–]caesarfecitPurple Pill Man0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Somebody else said it best - TRP is an echo chamber rather than a safe space. People are free to argue and flame each other, but there isn't really a diversity of viewpoints and the mods can be pretty cancerous, they just think they're better than other cancermods because they're not SJWs.

I understand TRP not being a free for all, it draws in a lot of left-wing and some loony right-wing trolls too. A lot of times conversations devolve into juvenile attempts to out-edgy each other, equal and opposite to lefty virtue signaling.

But a lot of the blame for that sub being a shit hole rests on the core users being more about validating their set of beliefs than they are about encouraging thought, growth, and development.

[–]InBaggingArea0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

I think the problem here is that feminists are trying to make the public sphere "safe" for feminists, where the expression of disagreement is defined as unsafe.

But if you say that the expression of disagreement is risky, then anyone who tries to create a safe space for themselves is creating an unsafe space for others.

I see no attempt by TRP to make the public sphere unsafe for feminists.

[–]kitsandkatsBlue Pill Woman0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

where the expression of disagreement is defined as unsafe.

You are not allowed to disagree on TRP. Because that's "distracting" from the discussion, "not relevant" etc. - responses to this thread from RP members state this over and over, to justify why people get banned for posting dissenting opinions.

TRP is a safe space where people can discuss their ideology, free from being challenged on it or insulted for it. It's definitely a 'safe space', and just because members are uncomfortable with it being called that for some reason doesn't make it less true.

[–]redmachines-1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

TRP is not a safe space. Those men are never going to run away from their problems with women by entering a seduction forum. A safe space for men has to be one where women are not discussed in any shape way or form. Otherwise the sexual failure will follow you like a shadow.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

safe space for Black people will probably include discussions on racism.

safe space for LGBT communities will probably talk about the struggles and discrimination they face.

safe spaces for men who are not successful with women will talk about women.....

[–]redmachines0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Those are not safe spaces. Once you complain, the oppressors will hear it, invade your space, shove blue pill ideologies down your throat, and start shaming you for throwing a tantrum.

[–]BluePiller1776[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Which space are you talking about in this post? Who are the oppressors in your opinion?

[–]redmachines-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Anyone that they complain about. And then some guy working for the other team will read/listen and and spread ideas that directly contradict everything that you have learned in that space.

Example: Forever Alone Women is a subreddit for women who feel lonely. They complain that men do not want them ignore them etc. Men read this and invade their reddit telling them that they aren't really alone if men want to fuck them, men have it worse, they are entitled and want billionaire chads etc. Basically shaming them for throwing a tantrum.

Second example: Seduction forums. Women read and listen to the things they say and now it is no longer a safe space. They have invaded the space, spreading blue pilled dating "advice" to men that doesn't work and filtering out the information that they needed to hear the most.

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[–]xthecharacterdoes this dress make me look pretty?!5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

TIL the only thing RPers don't like about safe spaces is the term itself and the application of it to people who aren't them.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Along with /r/thedonald , where they have at least 20 shitposts a day mocking SJW's and their echochambers, while they are the biggest echochamber of all.

[–]GoldPilot(⌐■_■)1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I've never understood the contempt for "Safe Spaces." I don't particularly need one, but I understand the need for it.

When your life is made difficult by something you can't change, even if you keep a stiff upper lip about it, it's nice to have a social group or location where you can retreat, share your problems, and regain the morale and stamina it takes to get out of bed in the morning. I don't see that as any different from hitting up a pub when the world is getting you down.

With no breaks from the difficulties of being yourself, why is it frowned upon to go to a place where there's a temporary ceasefire? I frankly think the people who condemn Safe Spaces are solipsistic, and since they've felt safe all their lives, they can't reconcile the idea that someone needs a break from their incessant "discussions" in which they prod the ways of life of people who don't feel safe. That there's a place where they can't bring in their privileges, and that someone has it harder than them because they're part of the problems that the people who seek Safe Spaces find refuge from.

Safe Spaces are meant to be easy. A place where you don't face "tough love" or lopsided discussions that you get tired of. A place where you're among friends, and everyone knows and sympathizes with your struggle.

To those people who question the need for or validity of Safe Spaces, I posit a simple question. Don't you wanna go where everybody knows your name?

[–]wazzup987Blue pill, you can beat me black & blue for it later3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The problem with safe spaces is that they can be used to shut down debate when it needs to happen. like on college campuses, people with non-normative opinions have been de-platformed simply for not being what ever enough. If you disagree then answer or debunk them don't de-platform them.

You want safe space? It called your home. To be frank a lot people that pine for safe spaces just don't want to hear opposing opinions or let others hear them. While I don't care if some people don't want to hear the other side and hone their arguments, you do not have the right to deprive people of hearing the what people you disagree with say.

We see this happening too much on college campuses. Hell rape got dropped from a criminal law courses because it might trigger some people. You mean to tell me these people can't discuss rape in clinical terms. No sorry toughen up.

Yet another reason why I don't like the third wave intersectional feminists. They are all so fucking weak. I'm fine with people being vulnerable including men, but these people are vulnerable to the point where they cant function in the real world.

I recently read the feminine mystique and was shocked to see many of what I would consider to be MRM talking points about feminism reflected (in albeit) feminist terminology. I think the core problem of feminism is: A) The navel gazing. For a group of people that accuse Cis Het White Men of not being able to see beyond their perspective they're sure as shit are no shining city on the hill. ugh.... The eternal problem with identity politics. B) This victim mentality / hypoagency modern feminism seems to be indoctrinating every one but cis het white men. Which I find hilarious because if you wanted to destroy a group or make them weak as shit and unable to do any thing for them selves I would tell them they were hypo agents too... which brings me to my next point. C) Feminism is gas lighting women and minorities. I mean women and minorities are constantly being told things are too hard for them to do and that the system is rigged. How is that gonna do any thing but keep women and minorities down? It like an abuser telling their abusee they are nothing with out them.

Its disgusting and degenerate. man jim crow ain't got nothing on this; at least then the victims knew where they stood and knew they were being fucked. This shit pretends to be you friend then cuts you down at every step along the way.... almost like a mean girl... the irony.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

phew. look at them scramble to prove the OP wrong... while doing the exact opposite.

[–]BaadKittehMiss me, bitches?0 points1 point  (17 children) | Copy Link

If you're looking for twerps to admit their hypocrisy, don't hold your breath. They either aren't bright enough to understand that they are hypocrites, or they deny it anyway.

[–]drok007Not white enough to be blue pill2 points3 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

If you're looking for twerps bloops and "not-RP" to admit their hypocrisy, don't hold your breath. They either aren't bright enough to understand that they are hypocrites, or they deny it anyway.

FTFY

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs-2 points-1 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

Please point out what is hypocritical about Bloopers.

Really. Please do. Because I don't see how it's possible for a forum dedicated to pointing out that Terps are full of shit to be hypocritical.

Go ahead. I'll wait.

[–]drok007Not white enough to be blue pill-1 points0 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

Their cryptochristian collectivist morality doesn't make sense once you use the slightest bit of thought. It is mostly divorced from reality. I suspect most BPers are sheltered or younger and naive.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy Link

You are assuming that we have an agenda or ideology beyond "Hey look at these morons."

We don't.

I am neither sheltered or younger or naïve. I just like to poke fun at woman-hating losers on the internet. "I suspect most BPers" are the same.

[–]drok007Not white enough to be blue pill0 points1 point  (12 children) | Copy Link

BP ideology is more narrow, and smaller than RP. Most normal people are not like BPers.

Edit: I'll clarify, this is due to the nature of collectivism. It exists objectively, just because you are ignorant doesn't mean you can wish it away with your feels.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (11 children) | Copy Link

I'm far from ignorant.

I spent my time looking in to your philosophy, was smart enough to realize it was based on nothing, and moved on to a community that openly mocks your nonsense.

I'll repeat: We do not have an ideology. We exist because the things RPers say are so ridiculous they need to be exposed and ridiculed.

[–]drok007Not white enough to be blue pill0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

You seem ignorant to both what RP and BP are. If you weren't, you'd realize the statements you are making are asinine.

I'll repeat: You have an ideology. Just because you are ignorant doesn't mean everyone else is. This isn't even like a hard thing to spot, so it's surprising to see that some of you are so inept. Normal people are aware of your cult.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs0 points1 point  (9 children) | Copy Link

OUR cult!?

Oh man, that's so rich I got diabetes.

[–]SlimLovinHigh Value to Own the Libs-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

They want to talk without constantly feeling attacked and thats fine with me.

I disagree with this.

I agree that TRP is identical to a Safe Space, and I would be totally fine with that if they'd just admit that they are being inconsistent (which has never before happened in the history of TRP)

But they do want to feel attacked. They feel attacked by women. They feel attacked by feminists. They feel attacked by other users on reddit.

They need to feel attacked, because they are demographically members of the majority who need to feel like an oppressed minority. That's the reason they exist, as a reaction to some misconstrued and baseless idea of Evil Womyn. That's the reason they don't allow outside opinions. It would poke holes in the DAE MEN THO!? circlejerk.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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