How class affects male preferences

pearlsandstilettos · 2018-04-24T21:11:42+00:00

Men, the OP begins by stating the criteria that are related to attraction and consistent across the board. There is a lot of argument about attraction when the topic at hand is commitment and class.

I am cleaning up this post for all the comments that veer too far into the "men need you to be pretty" territory. It's off topic. It's also stated in the OP and this is RPW we already know this.

WhatIsThisAccountFor · 2018-04-23T01:39:34+00:00

I disagree on this one. Class doesn't affect male preference, it affects male options.

A low income male can't date an Instagram model looking girl because she would never commit to a man like him. He has to settle for that type of woman, so he is fine with being with that type of woman.

Men's preferences don't change as their class changes, the only thing that changes is the women they can attract and keep.

lespetiteschoses · 2018-04-23T01:44:30+00:00

This is an excellent post, and definitely something that should be discussed more openly.

The only point I would add is to be careful not to conflate pure net worth with social class too strictly. A working class man who suddenly comes into a large amount of money may be a 1%er, but culturally will still like a lot of the same things that working class men like. This is why you see sports stars or DJs pairing off with porn stars, when a man from old money would not.

In other direction, my husband's brother is a perfect example. My husband's family comes from old money and are firmly in the upper class. They have been for many generations. His brother chose to follow a different path and rejected money, but his culture, mannerisms and choice in women is still very upper class.

zymbosa · 2018-04-25T00:42:08+00:00

Hm. I'd just keep in mind that your career goals and aspirations are personal and unique to you, and shouldn't be shorted or overextended by the prospect of getting a certain type of guy. Find something you are passionate about and stick to it and advance yourself in it.

additionally, as somebody surrounded by "creative class" types, these type of men are sometimes brutally stringent with their requirements for a woman. They need somebody that can carry on an intelligent conversation and more importantly, not be supremely offended by sarcasm or hot button jokes or even worse, have sarcasm/jokes totally lost on them. Can't tell you how many of my male friends have dumped a girl immediately upon recognizing they weren't going to make that cut. Intelligence in this way isn't compartmentalized but super general. You have to be a person that enjoys learning about a great many things to really be a good fit for this type of guy. He wants to learn from you and also teach you a thing or two, or have you two learn new things together. That social intelligence doesn't come from a college degree, it comes from a diverse background that's pretty independently driven. (well traveled, well spoken, open to admitting not knowing something/mistakes but eager to learn why, not easily offended, cultured, etc.) In that group beauty is also pretty vague. Take care of yourself and make it obvious and you're pretty much good. That's the general jist. Take care of yourself. That goes for weight management, appearance, etc. I've seen some of my friends go out with women I thought were very unattractive but their outgoing personalities and the clean way they were dressed/carried their appearance changed my mind. Pretty simple stuff.

vanBeethovenLudwig · 2018-04-23T00:12:15+00:00

Interesting post! Good for discussion and musing.

Depends on the kind of top 1% men...NFL players or actors typically date/marry models (party lifestyle) but say, royalty will marry a woman with an education (looks AND brains). I work directly with a royal family member in the Middle East and many of the royal wives have postgraduate degrees. Mark Zuckerberg married a doctor, and Reddit co-founder married Serena Williams (both career women). A lot of elite political families will also choose women who have the same social class or even a woman with political connections (so think a woman who went to private school, not the hot model). So I would say unless a rich man just wants a hedonistic life, he will still take into consideration the education of a woman.

I agree with your observation regarding UMC couples but I would argue it might not solely be because of socioeconomic advancement. It's simply that these men (tech, medicine, consultant) have most likely been surrounded by educated women in high school/university. He simply CANNOT relate to a woman who doesn't have brains or interests (and sometimes those interesting women come in the form of a lower-earning artistic type).

Something to think about is the MINDSET in terms of social class, not just income brackets. A tech analyst making 60-90k creating apps or software for his business partner wouldn't have a job unless the partner had the creative idea and a business model. In that case the tech analyst would be in a white collar LABOR position that puts his income high but his brain is in a lower class "mindset" (strong at problem solving, or designing systems, weak at creating new ideas). Someone who has a managerial job that takes planning, strategy, vision, flexibility, initiative, would typically exhibit more alpha behaviors or upper class behaviors of being proactive. (And that managerial job may pay less than a tech job, depending on the company)

I just say this because I know plenty of men AND women who have high incomes but have absolutely no social skills at all (again, white collar labor positions). And when I say social skills, it's not just having fun with each other as a couple but the ability to converse with a variety of people and have social grace (basically - how's your general knowledge?)

Lastly, while I agree that it's important to make him look good via your social standing, but I disagree that a woman's income is crucial to increasing his quality of life. Personality, quality time together and interests are more important (if one had to choose). Extra income can certainly help because he won't have to worry about being the sole provider and can relax a bit on finances, for sure!

But yeah, if a girl isn't super interesting ("basic") definitely a man could take her earning potential (and looks) into consideration.

KittenLoves_ · 2018-04-23T07:43:59+00:00

Physical attraction is definitely a key factor but it isn't everything, and neither is femininity. Personality traits (often tied to the kind of job a woman holds) are incredibly important as well. And while no man is going to be turned on by a woman's career choice, to assume that it's absolutely meaningless in 100% of cases is more than a little myopic.

I would posit that the majority of men want a woman who is, all things considered, approximately equal to him. This doesn't mean they need to be making the same amount of money, of course. But it does mean that most men don't want to be with someone vastly better or vastly worse than they are, in terms of both SMV and RMV. And part of a woman's RMV is, whether you like it or not, her career. A woman with an intense, high-earning, long-hour career has low RMV, no matter how hot she is, for a man who wants a stable family life with children who spend a lot of time with their mother. Conversely, that same hot, high-income, long-hour woman has much higher RMV for a man who wants to live a rich, childfree life.

To bring things out of the theoretical -- my cousin works in finance and is quite solidly in the top 1% income bracket. When he got married, it was to a woman who is as highly educated and as high-earning as he is. She's quite beautiful and feminine, but I highly doubt that they would be together if she were in a lower-income field, because being beautiful and feminine simply isn't enough when you have (pretty much) all the choice in the world. There are hundreds of thousands of beautiful and feminine women, and as you say, a man with a lot of choice isn't going to be judging the minute details of which woman is more beautiful and feminine than the others -- he will pick the one whose education, career, personality, values, and/or interests align most closely with his own.

Similarly, highly intelligent people like to have partners they can talk to without needing to explain things. I've said this a few times, but within academic circles, it's very rare to find long-term couples who aren't at approximately equal levels of education/intellect. Generally speaking, academics marry other academics. When you make the majority of your life focus the pursuit of education, it's hard to be intellectually satisfied by someone without a similar drive towards knowledge. And while, yes, an academic might want the hot but less intellectually driven girl for one or two nights, in the majority of cases, he's not going to pick her as a life partner.

This is the key point about a woman's career -- a woman bringing up her master's degree, or her partnership at a law firm, or her surgical experience, as if it were the most important reason a man should date her, is fundamentally misunderstanding the way attraction works. A man can't fuck your law degree, and your 400K a year income can't provide feminine comfort, and these are the things that initially attract a man -- physical attractiveness and femininity. But that doesn't mean the law degree or 400K a year income are completely meaningless, either. They're just the kind of secondary qualities that heighten a woman's RMV (not SMV, which accounts for inital attraction), similar to personality, values, and hobbies, that make a woman "wife material" instead of just "fuck material".

carrotriver · 2018-04-23T20:47:12+00:00

My understanding is that marriage and LTR are becoming less and less common for folks with low SES. Check out the book, "Life at the Bottom: The Worldview that makes the Underclass" by Dr. Theodore Dalrymple if you are interested.

bob13bob · 2018-04-26T20:10:47+00:00

can't agree more about socio-economic class being under-considered in these subs. I'm a man who frequents the red pill subs. It's easy to see in trp how young the posting base is. IMO doing 10 hrs of gym / week when you don't own your house is a bad strategy for men.

I live in the bay area and have lived in SF for many years. Earning power for women definitely changes the kind of men she will typically marry. a 4b/2.5bath house renting is 5k/month within 20min of the high paying jobs here. I'm regularly around power couples. Men AND Women are selected on "respectability". If you want to buy a house with a decent school district here, 1.5m for 3bed/2bath easy. Thats around 300k household income just to qualify for the loan. Those who bought earlier grew much richer on their homes than even their high paying jobs.

Also, pro nfl players are vast majority bankrupt within 10 years; i wouldn't use them as a representative sample of high earners.

VeeGeeTea · 2018-04-24T08:21:32+00:00

Class ranking is relative to the city you live in. Afterall, the standard of living differs from city to city. With that, this is not the number one priority when male seeks companionship from a female. Generally, men look for women with more subtle feminine features (ie. values family, caretaker, and are conservative pth spending). Men don't mind you making more money or having a higher education than he does. All he cares most for is that you'll be there for him as he will for you.

WeCaredALot · 2018-04-26T06:26:06+00:00

Just want to say that this is an excellent post, and I've greatly enjoyed reading the comments. It's frustrating to read so many Red Pill opinion pieces (not just here but online in general) that discount the importance of career, family background, and class when men decide who to partner with.

EliteBodSquad · 2018-05-04T12:28:09+00:00

I think you've defined the reasoning behind the issue I'm having right now. I'm currently building my career, and in a couple of years should be able to earn more than triple my current income.

However, currently I work a job the requires very little qualifications (despite having an MSc) just to get experience. I attract very physically attractive men who are within the middle-income bracket knowing that in the future I'd be more suited to a upper middle income man. I come from household that is well qualified (very upper middle income parents and a prestigious family line in our home country, not in the UK). My friends are going to become very high qualified well connected individuals not sure if that's what you mean by a good social circle. I'm mid 20's, in the best shape of my life and know how to take care of myself, but the financial side of me is lagging behind. Don't know how to wait this out quietly while thinking about my age and being slightly frustrated about the fact I don't meet men I can consider seriously in the long term. By that, I mean our life spans are always incompatible and I dream much bigger.

[deleted] · 2018-04-23T04:28:39+00:00

Thank you for calling my career interesting and high social value! 😊 In other news, awesome post, I agree completely! I remember we’ve talked about this a bit in another thread a few months ago. Take all my upvotes

justtenofusinhere · 2018-04-23T17:49:35+00:00

"If her daddy's rich take her out for a meal, if her daddy's poor just do what you feel." --Mungo Jerry.

tempintheeastbay · 2018-04-23T05:32:33+00:00

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