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Red Pill TheoryHow to build your career: Just like there is an untalked about rules in relationships, there are also untalked about rules to a career. (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by TRP VanguardtrpSenator

So you are here, and I will just assume you notice how there is a double talk game going on in life. There is the facade of saying one thing which is politically correct when it comes to gender relations and how to play it, then there is another set of "real" rules which are subtle and not talked about. Well, the same is also true with your career. In fact, I think MORE people fall for shitty PC career advice than they do with the shitty PC relationship advice we hear all the time. I can't even begin to tell you how often I see people fall in their careers, completely flaberghasted as to why they have failed: They work hard, follow the rules, and show up on time... Yet for some reason, they keep getting passed up.

You've been lied to

I'm sure you've heard it all before: If you want to get ahead, you have to just bust your ass, and become the best in the role within your company if you want to get ahead.

Yet, for some reason that mediocre guy who never really was super popular, gets the promotion. You, and even your friends, will objectively admit that it doesn't make any sense. That someone else is clearly more qualified for the job.

You may ask yourself, "Why the hell did the company promote the other guy over the clearly more qualified employee?"

The answer is, because the other guy knows how to play the game.

Rule 1: HR is working for the company, not for you

I put this first, because it's the biggest smoke screen to ever exist within a corporate environment. HR exists today as a manifestation of companies trying to create a positive image in front of the law. They need a department that says "Look at us. We care about the employees. We don't discriminate, nor do we allow any wrongdoings. We exist to HELP THE EMPLOYEE!"

It's a great department to have when a company is actively trying to discriminate against shitty non-team-players, but need to make it look like they are pro-workingclass. In reality, HR is actively working against you. They are the ones who draw you in under the guise of help, only to take notes on how much of a mess you are, how much you complain, and how much of a thorn in the companies side you really are.

At the end of the day, HR is working in the best interests of the company, not you. When you decide to go in there to complain about your boss or some bullying going on, they may encourage you to open up and make an official report. But what you are really telling them is "Joe Blow isn't a team player. He complains when it gets tough, and can't handle tough situations. That if something bad happens on the floor, Joe may actually become a liability. He's going to be the first one to sue and destroy our slim profits for the year." If you ever complain to HR, you are now on a list of people they don't want within the corporate inner circle. You're dangerous. You leave a paper trail. You don't handle things off the record. You're a liability.

Corporations have spent decades and countless dollars trying to figure out how to remain as effecient as possible while navigating the legal frameworks. You may not like it, but that's how it is. The company cares about itself, and your bitching is just bringing in liability. It's just like how bitches like to create plausable deniability.

Rule 2: You're a soldier, not an scientist

This is the second biggest mistake I see happen within a corporate environment. Too many people, working the ground, see all the faults within the company. They'll be quick to critique how inneficient the workflow is, the poor management decisions, or how unnecessary some actions are. They'll bitch and complain about how much the bad decisions are hurting their ability to do a good job.

And you know what? They are probably right. Without doubt, every organization is riddled with inefficient rules and processes. However, they don't give a shit.

You have to understand that your leaders are just doing their best. What they need is people to execute their orders as best as possible. What they don't need are people creating friction with every decision they make. What they need are soldiers. They need people who just do the job as they ask. They don't want a debate or experiment with other ways of doing things. Rather, they just need people to do it the way they ask for. Even if your great idea would objectively help the company, who gives a fuck? Don't try and outshine the master.

They need team players, not innovators. You can start innovating when you're role is about innovating. Until then, just follow orders and show you're a team player. Later, when you have your own team and your boss is looking to increase sales, that's when you can show off by implementing a more effective workflow which increases productivity.

Rule 3: Your boss is your gate keeper

It doesn't matter how much you rightfully hate your boss. It doesn't matter how deserving they are to be slandered. At the end of the day, your boss is trying to run a good team and look good to their boss. And what they don't need on their team is someone making their job difficult. They don't need someone making them look bad, or talking ill about them to others. What matters to your boss is how they look.

I've seen it a number of times where the boss will fuckup, and the boss above them will call a guy over, and he'll start getting the heat for his fuckup that was the result of his boss's fuckup -- only to tell the upper boss that he was just following orders and that his boss messed up. That he shouldn't be blamed for screwup since it's really not his responsibility. And ironically, in his eyes, now thinks he looks good in front of the upper boss by deferring blame.

But all this guy has done is gotten his gatekeeper in trouble. Now he's made his boss look incompetent. Now he's shown to his boss that "he's not a team player." That he can't be trusted. I've literally seen careers thrown on eternal hold because an employee refused to just take the hit for their boss. Because from that point forward, when promotions were being discussed, and the upper bosses came to your boss seeking insight on who should be promoted, that boss would NEVER say they were ready to join the team. No matter how hard and productive of a worker he was, the gate keeper would never let him through to the next level.

In fact, what you should be doing is whatever it takes to make your boss look good. Take their hits, and shut up when it's needed. Show to them you are looking out for them, and want to make their life easier. And in return, your boss is going to fight for you.

Make yourself valuable, not intolerable. Don't give into the idea that management tries to push of reporting when things aren't to policy or correct. It's only going to hurt you.

Rule 4: Avoid being too friendly with your peers

Believe it or not, being the most popular guy is working against you. I know how much you want to become friends with everyone around you in which you spend a majority of your day. But you must create some degree of distance if you want to become successful.

The problem with becoming too social is multilevel: On one hand, you open yourself up for gossip and landmines. You know that one time you were out with a few friends from work and at one point were offered MDMA from some girl? Well, everyone saw it, and one of them is also friends with other people, and they'll casually tell someone. And that someone is going to tell someone else. And by the end of that game of telephone, your all of a sudden a druggy... and it will get back to management. It always does. And they will think less of you because of it.

On the other hand, if you are good friends with coworkers, it puts you in a hard spot being a leader of your former peers. Management is going to think twice about promoting someone who is such good friends with so many people they'd be in charge of. They need to be confident that you are going to be making decisions in the best interest of the company, not your friends.

Rule 5: Don't gossip

It's poison, and should go without saying. If you want to go up tiers, the people above you have to trust you within the pack. They don't want tattle tales, nor do they want people who are going to casually talk about inner workings. They want people who they can trust.


All-in-all, the point is, you've been lied to. The corporate game is actually pretty easy. It's not about being the best, most intelligent, cleverly innovative, nor most passionate. What a company looks for is a team player. You can be average across the board, but if the people above you like you, and can trust you, they'll want you with them. Earn their trust. Don't rock the boat. Show that you are there to help further the cause of making the company money, and you'll be fine.


[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 188 points189 points  (38 children)

Rule 6: You move up fastest by going diagonally

5% pay raise? Hell no, you can get 20% by moving company. Do this often and keeping racking up those increments.

Sure there is an advantage in having 2-3 years working for the same company, but if you get the chance* to move, take it. That move will be worth more than staying in the same place for an extra year.

I've done this a lot. Too hungover to describe in detail.

*Make it happen. Don't be passive, claiming pay discrimination due to your own fear, laziness and passivity only works for women.

[–]bonerfleximus 44 points45 points  (8 children)

Excellent, probably the most important rule.

Another one for those wanting to move up faster is: eagerly tackle the most difficult tasks. This sort of goes along with all the team player stuff above, but in a more proactive sense. All the things OP described above will be default behavior for a good percentage of your coworkers. If you want to stand out at all, do so in a positive way by making yourself indespensible.

To go along with this, learn to teach. Sometimes making yourself indespensible is a double edged sword because you end up in a position where your manager would be fucked without you so they can't promote you. Teaching others is a great exit strategy so you can move on to the next impossible task. It's also the best way to leverage having a deep knowledge if any corporate processes. Don't be stingy with your knowledge, it's not your skills that got you where you are...it's the underlying principles we've described in this thread.

[–]AsylumHarbour 25 points26 points  (4 children)

Teaching others is a great exit strategy so you can move on to the next impossible task. It's also the best way to leverage having a deep knowledge if any corporate processes.

Every deep fryer at McDonald's comes with a operation manual. Edit: Regardless of where you work -- whether in fast food or on Wall Street -- you too can use the principle of manuals. Create operation manuals for each task you do at work. I call them "process sheets." Have anyone who reports to you create a process sheet for what they work on, complete with the contacts of internal subject-matter experts. It makes great training material for anyone coming onboard. It saves your time and their time. Also, if you fire someone or they quit, you're not losing the process knowledge.

When someone has a question about how to do something, tell them to look at the process sheet. If it's not in the process sheet, add it to the process sheet.

It will keep you from getting mired in the small things and open you up for planning.

[–]bonerfleximus 1 point2 points  (2 children)

I agree with you when it comes to working at McDonalds. I'm talking more about corporate jobs where you have opportunities to rise.

Even at McDonalds though you improve your reputation by helping people. If it doesn't hurt your duties elsewhere it's better to build that intangible asset than show them the manual.

[–]AsylumHarbour 2 points3 points  (1 child)

To clarify, I was using the deep fryer example as an illustration. I have never worked at McDonalds. I work in a corporate setting.

Accountants, lawyers and financial analysts can use the same tactic of process sheets.

[–]bonerfleximus 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hah I wasn't implying you were but good to know.

[–]--Trap 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is a great idea, starting today I'll implement this into my own work environment.

[–]FatHat 17 points18 points  (2 children)

eagerly tackle the most difficult tasks

This can backfire if you're not careful, in most companies job roles are somewhat fluid, and volunteering for work nobody else wants can cause you to become "the guy" for that work, if the work is potentially ongoing. In engineering I see this happen all the time.

Now you can't be promoted because you're seen as a specialist that's impossible to replace. If you want the work this can be a good thing, but if you're just doing the difficult task to be a team player, you may have dug yourself into a hole. Ideally if your goal is an upward trajectory, you want to be seen as competent and reliable, but replaceable.

[–]UrRealDad 7 points8 points  (0 children)

You also need to be careful in creating a written set of instructions for your position that are easily followed. I have seen skilled employees let go and replaced by unskilled employees who can simply follow along to the formerly skilled employees instructions. If a company is looking to cut costs, and they feel they can pay someone else less to do the same job, you become a target for termination.

As Rule #2 above says, don't increase efficiency or create improved processes until your position dictates that you do so (IE: you are promoted to a process creation position). Otherwise you are just making yourself more easily replaced.

[–]bonerfleximus 7 points8 points  (0 children)

There's a difference between work nobody wants and work nobody can do. I'm talking about stuff that people are afraid to touch because the risk of fucking up is high. Not shitwork that nobody wants.

I don't agree with being replaceable. This is why you learn to teach. After adopting and mastering a difficult task, people will see the recognition you receive and want that. There will often be someone eager to take on the same task if you mentor them. This leads to having a wake of effective individuals planted like seeds in the forest, one of them could get promoted later on and help you out. Either way your personal brand improves (reputation) and your network grows. Over the course of a 5+ year career these seeds add massive value.

Source: Started at JPMorgan in 2007 at the lowest level due to mass hiring from the mortgage crisis. Less than 2 years of college before dropping out, never even touched a spreadsheet prior, was actually cooking in restaurants. Within 2 years I was a VP in their Analytics department, had gone through 4 titles leading up to that. Last year I left and now work for a google-esque startup as a project manager creating custom front-end software for hedge funds. In 2 weeks I'll be at our office in time square for a client scoping.

*Edit: cleared up college experience, said "no college before"

[–]rheinhart 9 points10 points  (2 children)

I've been doing the same thing for awhile as well. You climb the rungs by jumping to a new ladder. I've had $20k in raises in the last two years jumping up two jobs.

[–]Wrobbler 1 point2 points  (1 child)

what industry? Im in sales and thinking about taking a 20k base ease but possibly lower commission total comp should be about the same though.

[–]RedPillScare 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Commissioned jobs are an entirely different beast. The spiffs, perks, base, customer, commission, product value, sales cycle, region, and recurring purchases are all factors affecting your total compensation.

For you to effect a $20k increase requires different efforts than a wage slave.

[–]BRENDORVEGAS 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I made this mistake in my last line of work. Worked for a company for a 8 years and should of left at year 4 when I hit my plateau.

[–]RedPillScare 6 points7 points  (2 children)

There is a concern in the comments that job hopping will hurt you.

Remember that it is not the hopping, it is how you characterize the hopping. Have a reason for your moves that sounds credible and pleases the interviewer. "Better pay" can work once, if you couch it right. A 5% increase makes you look mercenary. A 20% increase with greater responsibility is an offer you couldn't refuse.

Vary the reasons. "They were reorganizing." "Different city to be closer to [bullshit]" etc

Remember to think as you will, but present an appearance of conformity.

[–]manplancanal 2 points3 points  (1 child)

My boss is a pretty laid back guy and doesn't hesitate to say whatever crosses his mind. Something I've picked up on is when I want a raise I apply for a job wayyyy beyond my skills. I lie on the app about everything from experience to college degree just to get them to call my references, 5 times in 6 years my boss has asked me if I'm looking for a new job and I'll say I love it here but I just took something I can't afford by working here and have gotten a raise everytime. I do love it here and I have a strange pride about never asking for a raise so this is win win.

[–]spicedncoke 16 points16 points [recovered]

A lot of people are sold on these promises from their managers that they'll get large raises, their skills will develop, we will promote, etc. The reality of it is these promises are not followed through on a lot of the time and next thing you know, you are stagnant in your workplace while people are passing you by in the career ladder.

A female colleague of mine started as an Accounts Payable Clerk role for a company that owned companies in diverse industries. The owner was 75, republican. Made her bring him coffee, newspaper, and greet guests. He told her that one day she could manage payroll if she tried hard enough. Instead she nope'd the fuck out of there a little after a year and is now a Senior Accountant where I am.

And the irony? The company she left tried to recruit her for a Director of Accounting position. LOL.

[–]vicious_armbar 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I agree with this! This is a general rule in life as well. Managers make promises for higher pay later, women make promises of pussy "Once they get to know you better" chicktalk for spending your resources on them, a man will promise a women the moon if he thinks there's a good chance it will get him laid.

Legally unenforceable promises about future benefits from people who are counter-parties to you during a negotiation are worthless. If someone claims to be serious about something, then demand that they put their money where their mouth is now or walk.

[–]Trpidation 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think one reason for this is that people aren't proactive enough about it. My job (though I was relatively new at the time) was going slow and I wanted a raise because I just graduated college. My uncle is a big business manager and strongly recommended I request a raise due to that fact alone. I of course got the raise (I'm also highly overqualified for my job), but I think it's only because I requested it. Had I not, I would have gone unnoticed despite being praised for entirely slaying at my job.

If you make yourself fucking indispensable, so that even the thought of losing you as an employee is a source of distress for them, you can climb that ladder fast as fuck.

At my job I'm constantly trying to improve my abilities, doing tutorials and studying current trends, etc., and it's paying off. I've improved a shit ton and it's being noticed. HOWEVER, there has been no mention of a raise or anything like that. I may be putting out significantly higher quality stuff than their company has ever had from a designer, and they're noticing/appreciating that, but they haven't offered me any kind of monetary increase. Which is why I'll be bringing it up with them in two weeks, and I'm fairly certain they'll give it to me.

[–]life036 3 points4 points  (5 children)

Agreed. I recently DOUBLED my salary by moving to another company from the one I'd been at for the last 10 years.

There's no way I would have seen this kind of money had I stayed with the old company even for another 30 years.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Which country were you from, which country did you head to and which industry are you in

[–][deleted] 3 points3 points

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]life036 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Got an associate's in Network Administration, BA in Programming. However, I suck balls at programming, and basically just do sysadmin / network admin work.

[–]DarkExecutor 3 points4 points  (9 children)

A lot of places will think you're job hopping if you spend less than two years in a position. 2 years is generally the time it takes to learn a new job so they think you're a quitter and they won't expect to you to stay long either.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 12 points13 points  (7 children)

A lot of places will think you're job hopping if you spend less than two years in a position.

True... but if you get the opportunity to move, this doesn't apply. Too many people think "I can't move, I've only been here a year" when in reality they could.

My point is that you should try to move as fast as possible, recognising that job hopping is a minor mark against you. Rinse away your tears with those extra $50's you get each month.

[–]DarkExecutor 1 point2 points  (5 children)

I guess it also depends on the field. I know my first job won't be that penalized for being cut short. Maybe I can pull it off on my 2nd, but if it becomes a habit on my third, it'll start to look bad.

[–]1Dis_mah_mobile_one 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That sounds like classic Law of Diminishing Returns. The real lesson is that there's no longer such thing as a perennially successful job where you stay for thirty years and get your gold watch.

[–]Endorsed ContributorRedBigMan 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Cutting it short after a year isn't so bad... cutting it short at the 3 or 6 month mark might look bad.

Remember you can job hop if you can afford to... That is if you are actively being recruited by head hunters and the like then if you get a better offer don't be afraid to branch swing to the next company because companies are not loyal to their employees. You shouldn't give a company any more loyalty than they are giving you.

Currently working a minimum wage job with shitty hours and you get an offer for a $20/hr job and the hours are much better? You sure as shit should be bailing because as a man the only one looking out for your best interests is you.

[–]DarkExecutor 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Like I said. It matters what field you're in. I know for a fact in engineering that it looks bad if you don't stay for two years minimum. I'm not talking about minimum wage jobs

[–]rpscrote 2 points3 points  (0 children)

unless they want you bad enough that they dont give a shit. That's what he's saying. Moving jobs a lot looks bad if you're NOT in the position of power.

If you're in a position of power it makes them sweeten the deal because you clearly have no issue finding employment.

The "people who move around a lot dont get hired" mantra is pure BP brainwashing to keep you in your place

[–]RP-on-AF1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My last company (engineering) was long-term focused and would have been a little concerned with a pattern of brief periods of employment. But a couple of brief stints were certainly no problem. Everyone understands some jobs don't work out well.

[–]mikeliker 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There is a point of diminishing return. Be aware of comps for your position and salary. If you are in the 90th percentile for your position or greater, good luck on getting a big bump unless you take on more responsibility.

[–]JewishEasterBunny -1 points0 points  (1 child)

It works really well in IT however I would point out that "job jumpers" are usually approached with caution if you do this too much. I was contracting for six month intervals and its much better to put down "contracting for XYZ LLC to..." for five years than put down individual companies.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 1 point2 points  (0 children)

My background is in IT, and yes it does work really well. It applies in plenty of other industries.

[–]laere 53 points54 points  (15 children)

Great thread, really would like more of this content, been here for a while, and every single day it's AWALT after AWALT after Cuckold post, it gets fucking tiring.

Couple questions:

  1. Would you say this applies to all jobs, even if you work at McDonald's?

  2. There is a guy at my work who literally tries to be popular with every co-worker there, I've even had people tell me they talk his ear off. Whether he does this to only me, or to others as well, sometimes he tells me that: "Oh man XYZ say you never do anything around here blah blah blah," as if he is trying to plant a seed of doubt or something in my mind about how people see me at my workplace. I always laugh it off, because I really care less about what anyone thinks of me. I usually don't talk much to co-workers unless it's work-related. Is this the best way to handle it?

  3. I have been reading millionaire fastlane, and finished think and grow rich prior. A lot of these books deal with how people are sold the faux vision of wealth. A lot of people see wealth as big houses, expensive cars, hot models, etc. Furthermore, they go on to explain how changing your belief system/mindset from a faux vision of wealth to having a true map to where you want to be will actually lead you to wealth. Wealth being defined in terms of health, happiness, and maybe living on a farm, or a minimalist life. My question being; Has anyone here had experience, where changing their mindset financially, has brought them some success?

EDIT: These questions are open to anyone, not just the OP.

[–]AsylumHarbour 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Has anyone here had experience, where changing their mindset financially, has brought them some success?

Wealth is freedom; freedom is a state of mind. The man pushing a shopping cart down the street collecting bottles three hours a day could be the happiest man in the world. The overweight guy in the Maserati popping Viagra to bang his model girlfriend might not be.

Personally, I've been driving the same old car for almost 10 years now when everyone around me is getting in on the two year BMW SUV lease. I make food at home rather than eating it in restaurants. I have zero debt. I take all this extra money I'm not spending and put it into an index fund tracking the S&P 500.

Am I wealthy in the money sense? No. Am I confident and feel that I have freedom to not care as much? Getting there.

The less I need and want, the more freedom I have.

That's wealth: having everything you could ever need or want.

[–]RP-on-AF1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Debt is slavery, without a doubt. It ties you down and makes you timid.

[–]projectself 21 points22 points  (6 children)

Would you say this applies to all jobs, even if you work at McDonald's?

Yes, it doesn't matter if you work at little ceasars pizza or for exxon mobile - your job description, always can be summarized as make your boss look good.

I usually don't talk much to co-workers unless it's work-related. Is this the best way to handle it?

you need to protect your reputation at work. No one will do it for you. This really is not something you should laugh off.

My question being; Has anyone here had experience, where changing their mindset financially, has brought them some success?

I am reading a book now on stoicism, and one of the concepts is something called hedonic adaptation. It basically means that we all have a consumer mindset to some degree, but that the things we want do not bring the happiness we think they will. That new tv, new car, new job, new partner, whatever, we work for it, get it, and then lose interest in it. A stoic approach says happiness is not getting what you want, but wanting what you have. Seems reasonable right? How to achieve that? The stoic philosophy says negative visualization works, simply mentally imagine something is gone. You lose you car - it wont kill you, you'll live, but you will lose some convenience or functionality. Meditate on this a bit and the next time you get behind the wheel, you will gain gratitude.

[–]laere 2 points3 points  (4 children)

How do i protect my reputation?

[–]AsylumHarbour 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Be polite and boring, never impulsive. Much of the talk about holding frame on TRP applies to reputation management.

My objective is to neutralize reputation: Make it a non-issue so that what you are known for isn’t your funny jokes or unique way of dressing but your actual work.

In order to make reputation a non-issue, just do how you were raised: say please and thank you. This takes zero brain power.

Try phone calls instead of emails. Ask how people’s weekends were. Make small talk, even if it is meaningless. The real truthful conversations should take place with mentors and guides: those who have a vested interest in seeing you succeed. Save the substance for them, behind closed doors. Even then, those conversations should be well thought out and should involve solutions, rather than problems.

Do not give people an excuse to judge you in a way that is beyond your control. Posting to social media allows people to do this, and they will. Even if you are posting boring, uncontroversial content, someone can come back at you and say that you are spending time on social media rather than doing the work they are waiting on you for. So, unless you engage with a specific objective in furthering your career, avoid doing this. It is superfluous to who you are and provides no real benefit other than maybe a personal catharsis. Keep a paper journal on your own if you need this.

Don't get dragged into gossip. Just smile politely and try to change the subject. If someone wants to open up a bitch-fest, just commiserate politely on a superficial level and move on. You will gain a reputation as someone to not bring drama to.

Don’t joke over email. Don’t accuse anyone of anything over email. Keep emails task oriented. If in doubt, don’t send one.

By neutralizing reputation, you blend in and your reputation becomes not about you but about the work that you do.

[–]laere 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks. Ive never lost my temper at work even when ive wanted too. Dealing with tons of people daily can get exhausting I just try to be as polite and calm as possible and breathe slowly.

[–]fewforwarding 2 points3 points  (1 child)

By flipping out at people who try to make you doubt yourself. No I'm joking you should actually laugh it off. Addressing it makes it legitimate.

[–]rpscrote 0 points1 point  (0 children)

agree and amplify works here too within different boundaries

[–]Ibex3D 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The stoic philosophy says negative visualization works, simply mentally imagine something is gone. You lose you car - it wont kill you, you'll live, but you will lose some convenience or functionality. Meditate on this a bit and the next time you get behind the wheel, you will gain gratitude.

Seriously. I did mushrooms once(first time doing something like that) and had a horrible trip that literally felt like it took an eternity. I was lost in this crazy world of fear and confusion for what felt like years. You know what happened when it wore off? I appreciated being sober. I was just happy that I was home. The world is incredible. Just looking at trees in fascinating now. Happiness come from your perspective.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Surprisingly there is a decent amount of upward mobility within McDonalds. I went to high school with a kid who had absolutely nothing. Black, poor, gay male of below average stature. Nice guy, but he had absolutely nothing going for him.

He worked at McDonalds from the time he was 14 because he needed the food/money. Manager at 18, went to the McUniversity and got put in charge of the store at 24.

A couple years ago I ran into him. He is part owner of his own McDonalds now and looking to open another.

Apparently if you want to open a McDonalds franchise, you MUST have worked at a MCDonlads for several years. Its a way to maintain orthodoxy and homogeny in all McDonalds everywhere.

As such its fairly common for rich guys to make McDonalds "all stars" part owners of a McDonalds to satisfy that requirement and run the day to day.

I mean dude isn't rich, but I wouldn't be surprised if he cracks 6 figures sooner or later here.

[–]waylandertheslayer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you're reading about wealth and how to achieve, it, I'd recommend 'The Richest Man in Babylon'. It's quite simple, and boils down to a few principles (most importantly, save and invest and least 10% of your income), but it's very motivational and I think it's somewhere on the sidebar/on some other TRP recommended reading list.

[–]Squeezymypenisy 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My dad did. He changed from wanting that stuff to cutting out unecessary luxury. Have a goal for your money. I think a lot of people lack goals with it so they just spend it. Most millionaires are smart with their money and cheap. It took them some time to build their wealth up. He had kids and limited his own personal spending on himself to 300 a month, but he didn't spend the rest on kids. He saved most of it.

[–]spicedncoke 26 points26 points [recovered]

Rule 7: Aim High

I wish I was given this advice when I started out my career. I knew two guys who worked in a Big5 bank in Canada. One started out as a Financial Sales Rep (FSR) and the other was a teller. Same branch, same degree. FSR started at $38k/year + bonus while the teller made $13/hr.

You know how large companies sell you on this "move up the ladder" scheme to make CEO? Well it never happens...and if it did, it was a 1 in 1,000,000 deal back in the 1980's.

Well fast forward 5 years later and the FSR moved to the regional office, got a few promotions, and now is a Corporate Banking Manager who broke $100k + bonus. Not just that, he got an Accounting designation...which the company paid for. And the teller? Stayed as a teller for 3 years, moved up to a glorified teller type role and ended up going back to university after 4 years. Now of course there are some different factors in play, but these days, successful people get into the great teams and work their way from there.

Moral of the story? Aim high. Aim as high as you can. The higher you start, the more money you'll make, the faster you gain skills, the faster you expand your network...and not linearly.

[–]laere 5 points6 points  (19 children)

What does Aim High really mean though? When you tell an average joe to aim high, does that mean to apply to every job that requires 5 years of experience, if he has 0?

[–]SMEGMA_CHEESE 5 points6 points  (0 children)

It's more of a mental framework/perspective thing. Where is your arrow pointing? If you look at 30k/yr as something to aim for, that's where your arrow is pointing and anything above it feels "unworthy" for you. Now, if you're comparing yourself to people making 30k/day and make that normal in your mind, then that 30k suddenly looks like a hell of a lot less and you sure as hell aren't going to stick there.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

"Aim high" can be explained better by this.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 5 points6 points  (12 children)

Aim high. Don't undervalue yourself. I've literally created false resumes and got a ton of calls with companies trying to hire me.

The reality is, everyone is a person, and are just as stupid as you are, and the difference between job A and job B is really all about who's willing to grab it.

[–]spicedncoke 6 points6 points [recovered]

People are just as stupid as you are but eventually we all catch on to everything.

Don't ever lie on a resume. It will come back to bite you in the ass...you can kiss your career goodbye depending on where you are located.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] -1 points0 points  (8 children)

Who told you not to lie on your resume? How will it bite you in the ass? Seriously wondering what perspective you're coming from.

I have a good buddy who lives in PH right now who lied from end to end on his resume. He went as far as creating fake websites for non-existent companies, and prepaid phones for those fake companies.

Right now he's running a company which just got a 10m round.

Obviously that's anecdotal, but I'm genuinly curious on your perspective. Once you're hired, you're hired.

[–]breakingmad1 5 points6 points  (2 children)

Wow this is seriously horrible advice at least for British people. Get caught lying on a CV here and depending on the job its not uncommon to do bird

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I have only lived in the UK for 7 months, so I don't have a full picture of what goes on down there.

But if you ask me, wouldn't they want you to think that?

[–]breakingmad1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No there have been lots of cases. Sure loads of people probably get away with it, but its not something I'd casually tell someone to do

[–]curiousthis 1 point2 points  (3 children)

That can only work for companies that don't need to peer closely at their employees.

Right now he's running a company which just got a 10m round.

Get your good buddy to be careful or start cleaning up his history. If that company ever goes public, the board of directors, underwriters and investment banks will insist on background checks for their senior employees. Background checks include tax, criminal and employment verification and he can be fired or even prosecuted for lying to get the job.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] -1 points0 points  (2 children)

It's easier to ask for forgiveness than it is to ask for permission.

[–]curiousthis 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Yeah - as long as you are ok with the consequences -- a good friend of mine lost his VP level position because he lied about his arrest record (was arrested for a bar fight, but never prosecuted).

It also leads back to my interpretation of TRP - If I made mistakes in the past, I will own up to them.

But it looks like your friend may get away with it - any employment search will come back with the result company no longer in business and he should be good.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Within my experience, your "friend" didn't lose his job because of that record. It's more likely that they were looking for a way out and found it.

[–]TomHicks 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I've literally created false resumes and got a ton of calls with companies trying to hire me.

Did you take any of those up?

[–]breakingmad1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No shit if you make a false cv and you got companies trying to hire you, whether you would have kept the job for more than 3 months is another story

[–]razorwan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I have a much more useful, albeit more rough, explanation, but it's the hard truth--

Your average joe isn't smart. They either work some sort of blue collar job or low-end white collar job. They aim low in that they get jobs that are easy to attain, don't challenge the mind, and lack the drive to get a high-end job. Instead your average joe is more willing to complain about their job, complain about the price of fucking gas or some shit, complain about a lack of handouts or use platitudes like the wage gap to make themselves feel better.

Aiming high means making that low end job you're currently working at nothing more than a stepping stone. It means busting your ass studying for the LSAT, MCAT, GMAT, etc. while working just so you can be something more tomorrow. It means taking a smart risk to start your own business which you'll grow.

[–]beginner_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The job I have now said 5 Years experience. I had 0 straight from University. So yeah, does requirements can mostly be ignored as in most cases maybe 100 people in the whole world can fulfill them and if not, you really must think about your career.

EDIT:

And I will now apply for one that demands (10+) not int the exact field I am but very close..But for that Job I don't see they could find anyone matching all the requirements for less than 300k.

[–]Endorsed ContributorRedBigMan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

^ This.

The only way to be the CEO is to start your own damn company.

[–][deleted] 17 points18 points  (4 children)

Required reading for getting ahead in an office environment - Office Politics by Oliver James.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Have you got a summary or any good points from the book to share?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Basically, the less a work system is based on meritocracy and tangible results (aka most office environments), the more that dark triad traits are required to negotiate and manage your relationships. The book gives a solid outline on spotting triadic traits in others, and outlines strategies on how to use them yourself.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (4 children)

I believe in results. Getting things done and being sacrifical is what makes everybody's paychecks and businesses going. From IT sector, banking, to carpentry, results matter.

In the same way thay people are loyal to the whoever is responsible for their paycheck, paycheck givers are loyal to people who bring them results and money.

Yes, there will be games and things won't be fair all the time. One tactic that never failed me is the truth and honesty. If I bring more to the table then other guy who is a player but actually does jackshit, I need to be above him or I'm leaving. I believe in my principles and that's the last frontier.

Everybody is replacable, but so is every company. Results oriented worker will find a job anywhere anytime. Once they are threatened to be left without people who bring shit to the table they change.

[–][deleted] 7 points7 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]SgtDowns 3 points4 points  (0 children)

No - not necessarily because a lot of times companies want you to share your sucess with others (aka you will manage others) or if you are successfully managing a small team why not give him the ability to manage more. Good companies also recognize if they aren't rewarding you then you could leave ( you 100 percent should if that is the case).

If anything in corporate America the weakness is the other way. People often misattribute amazing performers to translate to amazing managers.

Get good at your job, don't become too worried about being too good at it. The problem comes from when you are amazing at your current job but you are lacking in skills that make you good at the next level. Ask and focus on what the job requirements are for the next role and demonstrate it and you will be rewarded (unless your company is shit).

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes.

If you are perfect waiter, nobody will want you to leave that position. Instead, shift manager will become someone competitive with less waitering skills.

If you work in the factory and you produce 20% more then others, who would want you to move and become a supervisor?

The game is usually tight here and you have to know how to play it. I think one way is to demand more money. Other would be clearly state that you are not going to be tossed around by someone who is less worth then you are. You can also let someone else go up but keep the power. What I would do is to require promotion, and then with my superior skills and job knowledge create and lead a great team.

Possibilities are many. If I can't choose any then I will simply reduce my productivity. Because nothing is free and I'm not a fool.

Money is what everybody wants and don't be fooled by big talkers about how it's not. Know your principles and demands.

I left ex company because I was way most productive worker while others received benefits. I didn't find a way to change it so I left. They called me back numerous times, I refused everytime.

[–]AsylumHarbour 1 point2 points  (0 children)

everybody is replaceable, but so is every company.

More people need this perspective, and I believe it reflects an abundance mentality to believe that your company needs you as much as you need it.

I am very happy with my job. I still apply for other positions and have conducted four job interviews for other companies to see if they will value me the same as my current employer.

[–]wattwatty 11 points12 points  (3 children)

Great post. All are reasonable points, but take heed of the one about HR in particular. If an HR person told me the sky is blue, I would go outside to check. They lie by default. Always. (sometimes, to both workers and management. In the same day. About the same thing!).

Not for nothing, but given these observations, I ask a couple of questions of us all: How many HR folks at your job are women? Is the department all women?

[–]Amadameus 4 points5 points  (1 child)

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[–]RedPillScare 1 point2 points  (0 children)

There are a few in my industry, and they are typically lesser betas, sucking down blue pills like they're Skittles.

[–]cyphers_steak 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've been in IT for about 12 years and have seen a male HR rep only once.

[–]RedPillProphet 15 points16 points  (5 children)

I know we don't like disagreeing with popular content on here but this is absolutely horrible advice. This is the pure blue pill equivalent of the corporate world. Being a team player, working hard, never gossiping, being loyal to the superiors, remaining professionally distant, never criticizing the management's decision and never complaining are all HALLMARK of a good corporate slave destined for staying in an entry level position.

It is also not at all controversial advise. This is the shit we have been told to do our entire fucking lives. It gets you nowhere.

What is a lot more important than hard work and loyalty is visibility and selfishness. To be unafraid of failure and ambitiously take on challenges and bullshit thorough them. What you have to realize is that everyone at the top is bullshitting.

[–]bigcitytruth[🍰] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

You hit the nail on the head my friend. Bullshitting works.

In real life, our bosses lied on their resumes about their past experience, lied about their previous salaries in order to get even higher salaries, and lie to their underlings about the real reason why Bob got the promotion and you didn't. These guys lie because it works. If you start lying, you will get ahead. Seriously, nobody in HR checks this stuff. And past salaries can't even be legally verified either, what ... is bubble-gum-chewing Kathy in HR really going to call your bank asking for your records? They aren't allowed to give her that info! This means you can totally lie about previous salary.

My salary grown steadily in proportion to how much I lie than by actually working harder.

Sometimes you can actually pull a Costanza and work less by simply lying to everyone that you have too many projects going on, as long as you dress the part, act important, and seem "busy," people will believe you. And almost like Office Space, the less you fear getting fired, the more people will respect you.

As far as your boss is concerned, if he's an honest-to-goodness hack that's keeping you down, he's likely doing it to many others as well ... eventually he'll hoard up enough secret enemies that they'll take him down for you, without you ever needing to lift a finger. That's when you can move up to take over his office. I've seen this happen at large international companies before, many times.

[–]alwaysthrowmeaway 4 points4 points [recovered]

I have been reading 48 laws of power. He seems to quote this book, but really I think we should all just read it. It talks about when to break the rules and when not to. I think if you want to move up, you need leadership qualities. Charisma myth is good too. Honestly, I am working my way through a big list of books that were recommended on an old RP thread. Frame, controlling you emotions, is also good.

[–]TheBloodIsRed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, charisma myth is worth the read.

[–]tarzanmakewar 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I can't agree; while it will not give you a raise in pay or position, the attributes Can keep you from getting fired, which is Priority #1. The bosses don't want loner's, loafs, gossipers, hail-fellow-well-met types, they want people who will make them look good.

Visibility cannot stand on it's own-you need something with which to back it. A company man, who is visible, is better than the rebel employee who will give the boss a glimpse of reality.

No

[–]RedPillProphet 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If getting fired is even a possibility for you then yeah, the advice is this thread may help. You need a base level of competence but after that all of this is irrelevant to further success.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

No matter how hard and productive of a worker he was, the gate keeper would never let him through to the next level.

Some managers will never let anyone through, regardless of how good the employee has been to them or the company. It's important to recognize these people and develop an exit strategy. That being said: these people are close to always far onto the DT field and offer a great example of tactics that will help you in interpersonal war.

[–]evileddy 14 points15 points  (3 children)

HR is most definitely for the company.. not the employee.

Before I retired... at 40.. from my gobermint job they had some layoffs going around and my buddy received the dreaded email that he was on the list of potential layoffs. You were then required to fill-out a lengthy form stating all your qualifications, merits and anything that you worked on during your career.

So he spends a few nights at home filling it all out and submits the document to upper management as requested.

About a month later he gets an invite to a meeting with an upper level manager and an HR rep.

Now I will point out that the manager at the meeting.. is a woman.. and the HR rep is a 20 year old woman.

My buddy tells me that the manager asked him a few questions regarding the layoffs and informs him that she has gone over his document very thoroughly but unfortunately he will be let go.

He takes it well and says "Well I suppose after being here for so long I could use a change of scenery!"

She replies "Oh..how long have you been working here?"

".... did you not read my submitted document?"

"...oh.. right.. yes... I found it very light and kind of half-assed.. to be honest"

Then he looks at the HR girl "She just admitted she didn't know how long I have been here ( 30 years BTW ) .. how can you assure me she even read the document?"

HR girl: "... uh... I'm just here to shadow and .. uh... learn.. about uhh... how these things.. uh.. go... not to take sides"

Poor guy. Why didn't they lay that HR chick off and keep him? I looked it up and HER salary was more than his and he was a very friendly, confident, intelligent hardworking dude.

I decided to retire early after they let him go... I could not work another day for such a fucked up female centered environment.

Every other day we had to read or attend some kind of "stop being men" seminars or emails and constant "GO GIRL!" posters plastered everywhere.

Fuck that shit.

[–]SilkTouchm -1 points0 points  (1 child)

What about his indemnization?

[–]evileddy 2 points3 points  (0 children)

indemnization

He cashed out his pension and started a business.

[–]RPredditor 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I'm really digging these posts lately concerning financial and work-related success. Thanks fellas, I've seen a lot of useful theory that I can immediately apply to my career. Also, it's a real breath of fresh air here and a nice change of pace from "Lift. Read the sidebar. Lift moar" (not that this is bad advice...)

[–]TheHappyGiant 4 points4 points [recovered]

Rule 7: Get a set of skills that isn't easily replaceable

My last job I got 20% bumps in my pay every 4-6 months. Why? It would have taken 3 people to do what I did, across all the different areas of the company. When the company does well, you can demand a percentage of the growth. I was the highest paid person, in a fairly large company, by at least 30%.

How do you get there? Never back down from a problem or get scared to learn something new. You'll fail and that's fine. Learn to fail fast and most importantly be humble and never be afraid to ask questions. Read, read, and then read more.

At this point in my career I might be the only person on the planet that can do what I do. I never worry about money or losing my job because I know another one is just right around the corner. It's a nice position to be in and gives you freedoms you wouldn't have thought possible.

[–]watersign 0 points1 point  (0 children)

yes..having a "combination" of common skills and subject matter expertise is a good thing to have.

[–]TRP Vanguard: "Dark Triad Expert"IllimitableMan 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Been awhile senator, great comeback thread.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Once you take the red pill, you can never leave.

[–]malditoduende 10 points10 points [recovered]

How are you doing professionaly if you don't mind me asking? Personally I always moved up by kissing the man who signs my checks ass. Well that's what faggots said, in reality I simply talked to the guy like he was any other man, I think this was a breath of fresh air for him. Fuck the supervisors. I destroyed them, stepped on their heads, and now they kiss MY ass. I was innovative and Machiavellian. Whenever the company owner was around I showed myself off. I have good ideas, so my superiors would steal them and make it their own. I caught up with this and did the following: Come up with one good idea and a great one. I'd share the good idea with my supervisor and made sure to be near him when he communicated it to the real boss. Then I'd simply say "That's a good idea, supervisor, but I think X would be better" Boom. Headshot. Now the real boss knows who he should be trusting with his projects and Mr.Supervisor knows to not try to fuck me over by stealing my thoughts. Just my 2 cents. I do entertainment construction, obviously not an office environment. At this line of work, hard labor and not being a PC fag actually pays off.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Right now, I'm not where I'd like to be because the startup I worked for fell under and I had to take the first job which was willing to help pay my rent. Trust me, I'm jumping ship as soon as get things under control.

However, over all? I've had a great career. I've worked with international VC firms, as well as a head for different political organizations.

I'd be lying if I said no ass kissing was done during my climb up the ranks. In reality, all it really takes is just befreinding your boss, while upholding the rules I discusses above.

[–]Lord_NShYH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Exactly. Those with corporate power don't empower the competition.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children)

[deleted]

What is this?

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Absolutely. You want to become an asset, that's for sure, but not a weak asset. I've seen it a ton of times, where there will be an engineer who is aspy as fuck and just rocks the code. Yet gets nowhere, because they want him coding, not managing.

[–]epistemic_humility 4 points5 points  (0 children)

In the same vein I work in a support environment for software company x. I utterly KILLED it week after week month after month. Top ticket closer every damn day and not by two or three a week. Average weekly closes is around 60 I was pulling 130s.

I thought this would net me more dollars. WRONG! This net me the exact same shit for two years while slower less intelligent folks who kissed ass better than me got all the love.

I tried to point it out to three different managers (tumultuous times) BAD! I was straight cast out of the corporate circles.

Guess who just snagged a new job with a 24k raise doing better more interesting things and working from home. This guy.

No more commute no more fluorescent hell. ALWAYS look for other jobs, know your worth and keep your opportunities open.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And then they get mad when someone half as good gets moved up.

[–]blacwidonsfw 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is happening to me. My technical skills are so strong it's changing the way we work and they are dependant on me.

[–]foldpak111 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Employment is disgusting. Glad I made it out of there.

[–]DarkExecutor 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Also, don't shit where you work.

[–]Sigma353 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I have heard it phrased as "Don't dip your pen in the company ink".

[–]NidStyles 8 points9 points  (4 children)

Rule 4 and 5 are the only ones I agree with 100% of the time.

The rest depends on circumstances. If you are getting raises and promotions, then going to bat for your boss can be okay, if it's not something career ending.

Rule 2 is understandable as your direct supervisor will likely take credit for your work anyways.

Rule 1 is a no brainer, they get paid by the company, not you. People are loyal to who signs off their paychecks. The exception would be if it's a person you have known long before you started working there on a personal level.

[–]geppetto123 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Rule 2 is understandable as your direct supervisor will likely take credit for your work anyways.

Thats what i was wondering too. If the good work is your work he would take credit of it, meanwhile if there is bad work NOT even done by yourself he will give you the credit. For the boss a win-win for yourself a loose-loose.

Practical advise how to handle?

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 8 points9 points  (1 child)

I feel like not enough people realize management are people. People aren't fucking stupid.

Yes, your boss IS often going to take credit for your work, because frankly, they see it as their personal success. For all intents and purposes it is their victory, because it was someone on their team which they lead through their leadership, to produce those results.

However, don't think the upper managers are stupid. They focus greatly on their labor force and have a stellar radar for what's happening. While they may give credit to your boss for your work, they also know it was YOU who actually created the opportunity.

Your best bet isn't trying to take all credit for it, by neglecting your boss's leadership. Instead, you should let them have it while making it clear that you were the one responsible.

If played right, when promotions are on the table, and all you've been doing is make your boss look good, your gatekeeper is going to have nothing but good things to say about you.

[–]SgtDowns 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agreed the ideal situation is have it appear to be a joint effort. Upper management will recognize it they aren't retarded.

[–]NidStyles 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I can't give direct advice from a vacuum.

If it's an office environment, you need to make yourself visible as a leader within your section. Make it so the boss over your supervisor sees you work directly somehow. Your supervisor will hate you, but he doesn't matter, he's just a bitch in the way to the top.

This is why I don't work in offices myself. That environment is just not good for a man's health.

[–]RPDBF 4 points5 points  (4 children)

On rule #3 is there any point in which you shouldn't fall on your sword for your immediate boss instead of admitting it was his fuck-up? There must be a situation in which you accept blame for your boss that may hurt you in the future. Now I guess if you do fall at least you can find other employment with a good recommendation

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Obviously it's situational. If you're boss is a dumbfuck who isn't liked by management, then do your best to distance yourself from them and not allow yourself to get branded as a supporter of said fuckery.

However that is a rare, albeit frequent, case. If you really are in that situation, still don't try and rock the boat by coming off as distruptive and dramatic. Keep your head low, get credit when it's due, and play it political.

[–]SMEGMA_CHEESE 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The easy solution is that when you take the fall you make sure to lie badly for your boss. The boss's boss will pick up on what's going on and talk to the boss, but mention how you took the fall for him.

[–]the99percent1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

When you want to replace your boss or you know your boss is leaving.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Key to succeeding comes down to three factors: Performance, Image, and Exposure

[–]draketton 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Rules 2 and 3 are too risky to follow. Should do the opposite of what the OP says with regards to those, bearing in mind that a lot of companies will react exactly as OP says they will, but also bearing in mind that fishing for the exceptions is the only reasonable path forward.

[–]OsoFeo 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Bear in mind that playing as if you understand the rules is more important than following them to the letter. Knowing when they can be broken to your advantage does not negate their existence.

One other small thing:

You can start innovating when you're role is about innovating.

That's still not even true. Many roles that seem on paper to be about innovation are more about making predetermined decisions look as if they were innovation. Again, know the real rules, know the real role.

[–]Glenbert 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Logged in to bookmark this. Good to see this topic getting the red pill real talk treatment.

[–]F_Dingo 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Great advice, had a teacher of mine tell me to just do an average job at shit and only excel when you need to or will get noticed.

[–]FatHat 1 point2 points  (0 children)

There's solid advice here, but I think the phenomenon of mediocre performers being promoted has a much simpler explanation: if they promote someone, they have to also replace him in his current role.

If your skill-set is seemingly indispensable, then management might see that by promoting you, they will create a very hard to fill void.

Let's say you're a world class mathematician, and a good-but-not-great people person/leader. Replacing a world class mathematician is very hard, but finding a person with OK social skills to fumble around managing? Pretty easy. If you're the mathematician in this situation, often the only way up is out. Another organization that isn't worried about losing your skill sets is going to be much more amenable to giving you a different role.

I'm not suggesting that you should be intentionally mediocre at your job or avoid specializing (there's nothing wrong with a career track that doesn't involve being a manager), but if you're trying to figure out how to apply your efforts, being too good at your job can act against your interests.

[–]somethingofvalue 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Does anyone have any books they recommend for getting ahead in the corporate world? I've heard:

Winning by Jack Welsh

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you are looking for books SPECIFICALLY for the corporate environment, I'd recommend:

What color is my parachute (The 2016 version comes out in 2 weeks. I know this because they wont stop fucking spamming my inbox)

Corporate Confidential - 58 secrets your company doesn't want you to know

Also, there is some TRP reading sub for books. But I forgot what it's called.

[–]Reflexiver 3 points3 points [recovered]

Rule 0: Create your own corporate empire and make other people beneath you follow these stupid rules.

As rules are only to make the weak weaker and the strong stronger.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 12 points13 points  (8 children)

I've worked with startups my entire life, as well as owned my own companies. Trust me kid, I know the game. There is nothing wrong with being an employee. Not everyone is going to be Trump. And having a steady paycheck without all the worry about cashflow, is a fucking stellar situation.

[–]fuckin_retard 11 points11 points [recovered]

I agree. "Create your own corporate empire" is an absurd morsel of advice for the vast majority of people. Unless you have a killer idea that you know has potential, it is much wiser to make stacks climbing the ladder.

I upvoted you, but saying "trust me kid" on the internet is going to get you downvoted by some. You don't know if you're talking to a kid. Even if you were, it would still be condescending as hell, and you'd immediately destroy any receptiveness in the person you're talking to.

[–]gg_s 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Unless you have a killer idea that you know has potential

If one's understanding of business comes from watching episodes of Shark Tank, then yeah, creating your own empire is absurd advice and one should stick to their 9-to-5.

[–]RedPillProphet 1 point2 points  (1 child)

What you say here makes sense however your original post is choke full of advice meant to create the perfect slave. Do you honestly not see??

[–]gg_s 0 points1 point  (0 children)

For some men, it's good enough. They don't care about business, they just want to work. If you're a businessman, hire these guys.

[–]Reflexiver 1 points1 points [recovered]

There is nothing wrong with being an employee. Not everyone is going to be Trump. And having a steady paycheck without all the worry about cashflow, is a fucking stellar situation.

Indeed, I agree. Our ways of thinking are not the way for everyone. It only depends on what a person wants. If someone wants peace of mind and secure paychecks every month, then he definitely should consider to follow your suggestions.

The thrill of risk is not for everybody.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's what annoyed me with this thread. Too many people trying to jump in and tell me that basically entrepreneurship is the only way to go, and being an employee is a blue pill.

Which is BS.

[–]StarDestinyGuy[🍰] 0 points1 point  (10 children)

What's with the dramatic you've been lied to theme here?

All of these are incredibly obvious. I don't think anyone would be shocked or feel lied to with these rules.

[–]648262 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I see a lot of my friends and colleagues who bitch about being good at their jobs, but not getting promoted. They don't see the game. Why would a manager take away some of their best producers? They er clueless, with reference to the Gervais principle.

[–]TomDemian 20 points20 points [recovered]

Back when I was a beta fucking up with women, I was also a beta fucking up at work - this stuff wasn't obvious to me then. Everything is obvious in hindsight. People forget how ignorant they were.

[–]StarDestinyGuy[🍰] 0 points1 point  (6 children)

Which of those rules weren't obvious to you?

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (5 children)

The majority of us were told work as hard as you can, do as you're told, and it will all work out. We were taught to essentially be honest, to trust people, and that people who sucked up were to be treated with disgust and not emulated.

We were not given the heads up that our bosses would not be on our side, and that you had to step on some ankles to get places. We were not told that 'it's who you know', and most of us didn't have the necessary social skills anyway.

And a lot of us were labouring under the idea that you sort of got what you were given, and that being rich and successful and powerful was for 'other people' - that we had a certain lot. But working hard and being honest would help you carve out a better slot.

Which, is obviously all bullshit. I've spent the last half-decade of my life basically unlearning the majority of what my family, friends, teachers etc. had instilled in me. Some I keep, but for the most part I was re-raised by myself, books, and the internet. Seems obvious looking back in.

[–]RedPillProphet 0 points1 point  (4 children)

What you say is true, but the original post addresses none of that. It is the traditional blue pill advice but for careers.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children)

I was just illustrating that what may seem obvious to people raised in upper middle and above families is completely alien to others, even if I didn't cover the exact specifics. What I mean is that the dynamics of, say rules 2 and 4 don't even cross the radar of most people.

[–]RedPillProphet 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Sure.

What he is saying overall is shitty advice though. Your post has a lot more actual useful info in it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ahhhhh I just read through a few of your comments, I see where you're coming from now.

I COMPLETELY agree with your other comments, there was definitely something that stunk about the advice to me. There are a lot of seemingly RP people on here who are way too happy to become the corporate slave. It's never really made sense to me.

I say start a business, or do something 'creative', and work a 'good enough' job until you can work that stuff out. Otherwise, I don't believe you can be free, and therefore 'alpha'.

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Obvious to you. Not to everyone.

I mean, you're here right? Things that some people take as obvious matter of fact, are not always as clear for others.

[–]tautologicoxymoron 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Great insight and great post! I'd love to see more work & finance related discussions and contributions in this community.

[–]wanderer779 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I like some of this but I would add a caveat that a lot of this depends on your boss being a decent guy. A lot of people are just selfish pricks. You can bust your ass for them and take the blame and they are still not doing shit for you.

I think that it is hard to come up with rules that always work and each situation calls for its own approach. Still this is a good set of basic principles to add to the "bust your ass and do as you are told" old school advice

[–]TRP VanguardtrpSenator[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'll be honest, I wrote this a bit tipsy after coming home, so I may not have been entirely crystal clear.

However, the rules still apply. Going against your boss is rarely going to help. Learning to roll with the punches is in your favor. Keeping your head low, is the best way to go.

[–]tarzanmakewar 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I like some of this but I would add a caveat that a lot of this depends on your boss being a decent guy. A lot of people are just selfish pricks. You can bust your ass for them and take the blame and they are still not doing shit for you.

This, in particular, sticks out, and it is, IIRC, the first time that I have ever seen it in print, and I'm 58 years old.

[–]okycap 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My first thought after reading this thread - why would anyone willingly subject themselves to all of the politics and bullshit?

Then I remembered it's my life on a daily basis.

Seems like working for yourself or freelancing of some sort would be ideal. Something not in a corporate environment.

[–]tech_0912 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There's only one flaw in this logic. You take too many hits for your boss, and their boss will be the one to fire you no matter what your boss says. The person that's actually responsible will get away with fucking up many times and cost a lot of good people their jobs in the end.

[–]Fthebluepill 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is a great thread I'm glad to see more attention on important aspects of truly developing yourself instead of the usual this girl did this etc.

I hope you will give more of these in the future

[–]Spiral-knight 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's about being a chump and leaving everything in the power of a person, or people who in all likelihood don't want to see you rewarded for the shit you do for then. That is what confuses me, everything hinges on your boss. A person who stands to possibly be replaced when it comes time for promotions, there is far, far to much power elsewhere that you are forced to rely on the good graces of

[–]TheMGhandi 0 points1 point  (1 child)

http://imgur.com/gallery/aQpOEzM

I disagree with rule #2. If you remember The Gervais Principles, being a soldier, or as Rao would say 'over-performing loser', would net you in the clueless Loser category. I was expecting to see you bring light to the 'under-performing loser' or basically, how a sociopath would maneuver his way up the ladder.

That said, I'm guilty of rule #4 if I do say so myself. Your post really hit home for a lot of us. To top it off, it's rather a refreshing break from the 'horrors' of society.

[–]sundaybrunch11 1 point2 points  (0 children)

TRP on the workplace = Venkatesh Rao's domain. I wish more people would have read his shit

[–]Ambarsariya 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Rule #4 is very important. I experienced the challenge first hand when I had to manage my friendly peers as my new subordinates. It becomes difficult to draw the line.

Will disagree to a level about Rule #2. Sooner than later you are no longer a soldier. You are a commander in a war who can either follow the known path or create a new path for himself. Create your own path and value for the company and you would get a massive boost in your career.

[–]watersign 0 points1 point  (0 children)

ITS DEF major important to be liked and respected by the people who decide whether or not you should still be there

[–]AsylumHarbour -1 points0 points  (0 children)

They'll be quick to critique how inneficient the workflow is, the poor management decisions, or how unnecessary some actions are. They'll bitch and complain about how much the bad decisions are hurting their ability to do a good job.

So much insight here. I see it and manage at least one person with this attitude. I am finding myself trying to make it smoother for them, but then I spend my time as the middle man trying to negotiate smooth workflow rather than having the team to do the actual work.

Edit: With this insight, I'll be paying the complaints less heed and ensure the team is moving forward with their objectives, despite inefficiencies or the fact that one person feels the process makes their job more difficult.