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Red Pill TheoryRelationships are restaurants, not banks. (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by TRP VanguardArchwinger

One of the greatest sources of aggravation and failure for many men, when it comes to marriage and long-term relationships, is our tendency to believe in relationship equity. Most men believe that if they invest their time, energy, and resources into a relationship, then in the future, when they are in need, the other party will be there for them with time, energy, and resources. Essentially, they see relationships like a bank. They invest their money, deposit it in an account, and they later count on being able to withdraw that money.

However, relationships are not banks. They are banquets. You are not investing money for a future return. You are spending money on dinner. That money is gone, and you receive a meal. If you want to eat tomorrow, you spend more money. If the meal sucks or if you’re running out of money, you find other places to eat that offer you more food or better food for less money. If you show up tomorrow with no money, you don’t eat. Even if you’ve been a loyal customer for years.

Women understand this. Most men do not. Men will lament when a woman behaves badly. They will question how she can do this to them. They have been so loyal and invested so much over such a long period of time. How can everything they’ve done over all this time mean so little to her?

All of the time, energy, and resources you invest into women are not money in the bank. They are food you bought for her. Food she has already eaten. Food she has already shit out. Shit she has already flushed down the toilet.

When deciding how to treat you, whether to fuck you tonight, whether to leave you, whether to cheat with a potentially better man, women are not thinking to themselves, “What has he done for me in the past?” They’re not even thinking, “What has he done for me lately?” They’re thinking, “What is he doing for me right now”, or possibly “What is he going to do for me in the future?” She’s already eaten the food you bought yesterday. The only value that meal or any previous meal has to her today is what it indicates about the food you will give her today, and in the future.

To be successful when we interact with women, it is important to speak their language, rather than becoming mired in our own. When you speak to a woman – banter, hint, flirt, and engage – she is looking for what she stands to gain in the future. Not what you’ve done for her already. She doesn’t want to feel like she’s indebted to you for past favors and that she needs to stick with you to pay you back. She wants to feel like she’s getting a great deal by staying with you and that more great things are to come. You need to appear like you’re going places, and like bringing her along would be nearly effortless. Like all she needs to do is convince you to take her hand and pull her.

If you are a valuable man, and you hint to a woman that she has a chance with you, she will be the one spending time, attention, and resources on you, hoping eagerly to convince you to take her where you’re going and share your value with her.

Since a Red Pill post wouldn’t be complete without comparing women to dogs, let's think about what dogs learn from us as we invest in our relationship with them. Every day, at 6:00, you pour food into the dog’s bowl. The dog shows up and wolfs down the food, then looks at you. You do the same thing, every day, at 6:00. You have invested the time, effort, and the cost of the dog food into this relationship with the dog. And what have you gotten? The dog doesn’t bring you the newspaper out of gratitude. It hasn’t even stopped shitting on the carpet. Instead, all the dog does is walk over to the dog dish at 6:00, look at you, and wait to be fed. This is what the dog has learned from your investment into the relationship.

However, if you train the dog by giving it food and treats and petting it when it brings you the newspaper, and swatting its ass with that newspaper when it shits on your carpet, the dog begins to bring you the newspaper spontaneously, hoping for treats. And it stops shitting on the floor.

If you only give the dog treats some of the times it brings you the newspaper, the dog begins to wonder exactly what aspects of the newspaper fetching work to produce the treats. It tries to bring you the newspaper faster and more frequently. It works hard to prove that it’s good enough to get treats from you.

You want your woman to know you have treats. You want her to know that she can earn them – your value is totally within her reach. But you want her to work for your value. And if she starts getting uppity and reminds you about the blowjob she gave you yesterday, speak her language. That’s old news. What’s on the menu tonight?


[–][deleted] 137 points138 points  (47 children)

That's why you never marry. You gave her a nice house? That's old news. You gave her kids? Yeah more old news.. You sacrifice your life for a shit job to pay bills? Yawnnn..she's bored. Heck I have a new female roommate and she's already "bored" hanging out with me because she's a lazy whale looking to be entertained all the time. She pays me rent. That's the only "relationship" I have with females.

[–]1seenoeval 187 points188 points  (37 children)

I met a girl just as I was starting my business and got into an LTR with her.

We moved into a small apartment together about 6 months in, she worked part time at a clothing store for minimum wage.

Shortly after living together I really hit a stride and went from doing ok to thousands a week in profits almost overnight, on track for 600k that year. Spent the next year giving her all the greatest things in life she never could have dreamed of, she quit her job, I bought us awesome cars, rented a huge million dollar house, vacations, shopping sprees etc etc.

Then I hit a brief crash of about 8 months where everything went to hell, big lawsuit draining thousands in legal fees a week, profits frozen, had to sell the cars to cover overhead, bank balances went down like the Hindenburg.

The way she turned on me almost overnight (by the way I was taking it in stride knowing I would get back on top regardless of outcome, not like I was a miserable fuck) It was unreal, the vitriol, the resentment, that she couldn't live the lifestyle she could have never touched without me during a short period of downturn.

The attacks against my masculinity, the cold shoulder. That was my only needed lesson in life about "what have you done for me today"

I was a King one day to her and a peasant the next. She lived to serve me because she knew it resulted in her being the Queen and she knew how many other girls even her own closest friends wanted to take her place.

Got out of that horror show, within a year was back on top, never forgot that incredible education.

Years later she is miserable, married to some fat chump in a tiny house, she "likes" every single photo of mine on facebook to this day, has conveniently shown up many times at bars and restaurants I was tagged at hoping desperately I'll want to fuck her and take her out of her nightmare life.

I'm always nice to her, but only because I know it tortures her and will keep making her dress up as hot as possible within ten minutes of someone tagging me at some local spot and running out the door on her poor bastard husband. I asked her what he has to say when she just decides she's going out all night when he works 65 hours a week supporting her lazy ass, her response "I do whatever I want, and honestly I don't give a fuck what he thinks, he's lucky he has a hot wife like me"

I respectfully disagree, he's about the unluckiest guy I know.

[–]ImHereAtLast 70 points70 points [recovered]

You know what they say, "Someone, somewhere, is sick of her shit."

[–]Bwood56 67 points68 points  (1 child)

You show me a hot girl and I'll show you someone who got tired of fucking her

[–]2awalt_cupcake 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I needed to read this haha!

[–][deleted] 25 points26 points  (7 children)

Damn! that was good to read. Congrats on getting her out of your life. Enjoy your freedom and the pussy buffet that comes with it. I think women need to pay in order to respect men. That's why you see females listening attentively and respecting all the men she pays (doctors, trainers, cops, bosses). Any man who a woman pays (time, money, sex) she will respect. A husband paid for his woman so she doesn't respect him. That's why rich men only marry rich women but that ship has sailed. Men should never marry. Rich men should be institutionalized if they want to marry.

[–]1seenoeval 25 points26 points  (4 children)

Nicest thing anyone has ever done for me, I would have stayed loyal to her for years and years and missed out on some of the greatest experiences of my life had I not gotten to see her true colors.

I agree no man should ever marry, the only reason for an LTR is if you really enjoy someones company for an extended period of time or you want children, but in that case you are better off adopting or if you must have your bloodline involved, hire a surrogate.

[–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (3 children)

As I get older I enjoy my friend's company a lot more than females I'm banging. They all have ulterior motives.

[–]1seenoeval 54 points55 points  (2 children)

A wise much older friend once told me: "Everything a man needs in an amazing relationship, he can get from another man, besides sex....unless he's a fag, in which case he's got it made, otherwise, learn to use women for sex and men for emotional, spiritual and meaningful connection"

[–]MEpicLevelCheater[M] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

An excellent series of thoughtful comments. I have awarded both of you with points.

[–]Boovs4life 1 point2 points  (1 child)

So should let's say when going out some place, should the woman want to pay or do i tell her to pay? Or split the bill? What if she says "why do i have to pay?" Or "the man is supposed to pay!"

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

You pay for your portion, she pays for hers. Splitting the bill is a good rule of thumb but not ideal if her share is greater than yours.

For example the bill is $80, but her share is 60 and yours is 20. Say you just had something to eat and she had a lot to drink. Why, in such a scenario, must you pay 40? It makes you BBish.

Ironically, she'll be more attracted to you if she pays for the whole thing because she'll learn to associate you with something of value (money).

"The man should pay" is a classic shit test - just flip it on her. Or reply with a non sequitur (it shows you're not taking her seriously, which is alpha behavior) as you lay your portion on the table and wait patiently.

I would appreciate feedback from experienced RPers here.

[–]MoneyStatusLooks 13 points13 points [recovered]

Why did you inflate your lifestyle so quickly when you hit it big?

I'm basically on the same track, and other than an expensive car, im funnelling all the money in to investments, paying off mortgage and other things like that. Seems like the smart move, especially if your business is inherently risky like mine.

[–]1seenoeval 26 points27 points  (8 children)

Because I was 24 and an idiot, it was all very exciting. I'm still an idiot in a lot of areas but very smart with money now.

Quite honestly it was worth it, I didn't really need the collapse to straighten me out, I had always planned to get in line but wanted to go to my grave knowing I lived in an insane house once, had a 6 figure car once, flew private once etc.

I live well below my means now while still having a very luxurious life by most standards and honestly wouldn't want the maintenance, costs or stress involved in maintaining a crazy lifestyle like that long term.

[–]tomeitsmoar 2 points3 points  (6 children)

Damn, at 24? Would it be rude to ask what type of business it was?

[–]1seenoeval 20 points21 points  (5 children)

It wouldn't be rude but it doesn't matter, you can make that kind of money a lot of ways.

I know landscapers that make that and software developers. It's really a matter of scaling if big money is what you after.

You start with one beat up used lawnmower and save until you can buy another. You make roughly $35 an hour, then hire someone at $10 an hour to work with you.

You make $25 an hour but add a new client you can put in that spot while your new employee services that customer so now you are making $60 an hour.

I'm of course oversimplifying things but honestly making really good money is not difficult at all. There's a million ways to make a million dollars from the computer geek to the blue collar guy.

It's not work hard, it's not work smart, it's work hard and smart.

[–]laere 0 points1 point  (2 children)

where can i learn this stuff?

[–]2CHAD_J_THUNDERCOCK 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Books:

  • The millionaire fastlane

  • How to Get Rich by Felix Dennis

blogs:

  • wallstreetplayboys.com

  • search this subreddit for 'career'

Beware most personal finance stuff. Most of it talks about living within your means and saving pennies. Not much talks about building scalable businesses.

To get rich you need to do one of two major things, typically:

  • Be in a revenue generation role. e.g. front office finance (investment banking, sales, hedge fund trading), or high ticket high value sales (enterprise software sales, B2B SaaS sales). Most jobs are not revenue generating.

  • Own and control a scalable business. e.g. one where you build assets that bring in 'passive income'. Set up a whole business end-to-end and either automate all processes with workers or software. Now its running on autopilot and you only need to give it 5hours a week of attention. Now either start growing this business by entering new markets, or start another business using your skills.

For that second option I think the best way of doing it when starting out is just to be selling stuff that a business already wants. If you are a software engineer then write shit python mock-up in a few weeks that isn't scalable, and sell that. You need to network with people in businesses and find out their pain points. Maybe get a job as a sales engineer first, so that you can be paid while learning these skills.

Alternatively for that second option at the moment you can have in consumer markets by reverse engineering google/amazon searches. There are PPC and SEO tools that can tell you how often people are searching for products in google or amazon. Find the products that have high margins, that people are looking for at a decent volume, and where current competition exists but is missing something. Then get a manufacturer on Aliexpress to produce that item and start selling it. If demand increases a lot then use alibaba. Then grow into similar products in the same niche, and start branding your products. Automate and outsource as much labour as you can to increase scalability of your operations. Then after a few years sell the business for 7 figures.

99% of businesses you see people talking about arent even worth starting tbh.

[–]2CHAD_J_THUNDERCOCK 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do you have any good tips on how your successful software engineer friends have managed to pull it off?

Which process did they use to formulate the business?:

  1. did they take up freelance work then learn to outsource it, and become project managers / salesmen

  2. or perhaps they were sales engineers, learnt a pain point that several companies had, then transitioned to making and selling that software

  3. or did they take the high risk route and make some amazing research orientated software, and go through the whole VC series A, series B...

  4. or did they take another high risk and go into very scalable B2C software, like mobile apps.

Hope its OK to ask, Im trying to gather as much data as possible atm to make a big decision.

[–]mrmeyhemn 1 point2 points  (0 children)

this should be taught to boys at an early age.

Edit: as well as how to protect it from divorce rape.

[–]PlanB_pedofile 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Riches to Rags. Shit like that makes men stronger.

When it happens to women, it does nothing to them.

Women have the attention span of a goldfish. Only living in the now and present.

[–]Hang10Dude 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Great story, Dawg.

Not sarcasm... I'm not good at the internet.

[–]TheReplierBRO 1 point2 points  (6 children)

That sounds so crazy man. I don't know. Like that whole thing just sounds so fucked up.

You really wanted to have a large house and be a part of the "dream" life?

People are people, fuck it, so yeah you married some trashy hoe and she went off and divorced you when you couldn't provide in the exact manner I just stated. Seriously man, doesn't it just sound messed up to you that what you just described is what people want out of life?

You literally were somebodies bitch in some way (you worked for a company, therefore below somebody else). Doesn't THAT bother you at all?

And yeah I got you on that whole being chased down thing. People in general will come around again once you see you're doing better without them. You can't trust the people you met at the top, and just as much don't trust the people at the bottom unless they fell with you. From there you build together.

[–]1seenoeval 9 points10 points  (5 children)

I wanted to have the experience of living in a mansion, so I did. It showed me that I like having a really nice home but don't need something insane, still it was my choice to see for myself which is how I prefer to approach everything.

It was also super fun, having really nice things and fast exotic cars is fun. Not everyone will get to have that experience but it certainly isn't soul crushing. Nothing wrong with people who live exotic lifestyles, the only people who are miserable being rich are the ones that sold their souls or morals or dreams down the river for it.

I never got married, I've always been too smart for that, but I do like an occasional LTR if I really like someone.

I created my own company, I haven't worked for someone else since I was 24, I made all that money for me, not anyone else, well besides the IRS.

Doesn't seem like you really read what I wrote with all those inaccuracies in your summation but it sounds to me like you have a real anti-establishment thing going on which is fine.

There is nothing wrong if you never want to make a lot of money or have a nice house, etc, if none of those things appeal to you. There is also nothing wrong with being happy with those things, it's certainly not like every guy with a big fancy house is trapped in a gilded cage wishing he stayed in his shitty studio apartment scratching his balls and playing video games all day. People want different things out of life.

[–]TheReplierBRO 1 point2 points  (4 children)

For sure man. I just believe is all about what you can create, avoiding being exploited, and avoiding exploiting. You create, explore, and your smile from that should be your reward.

Ask my probation officer; I have a problem with authority haha if only because I explained in detail why I don't like police and how they're ran here in America.

I believe I did jump to conclusions about marriage and such but you can see why. I wouldn't have some leech in my home with me. In fact, my relationships have been almost opposite of everyone's experiences here, but I'm also young and stand out in many ways including intelligence, passions, wants/needs, looks.

I'd just wish this sub was less of "Be Chad" or have angst against other 'ypus' and more, "be your fucking self" because nobody does that anymore.

It's probably just my bias, which o need to kill, but I feel nobody here is colored or from shitty situations. Never seen somebody shot, never been popped for felony charges. Some things I can't change, but I realized that following other people is the fastest way to sacrifice yourself.

Hopefully somebody gleans some truth from this.

[–]1seenoeval 7 points8 points  (3 children)

Absolutely be yourself. Like I said, nothing wrong with laying on the couch in a tiny apartment playing video games all day if that's what makes a person truly happy. Nothing wrong with chasing expensive things either.

If you watch the movie "The Town" that's where I grew up, nothing but low lifes, psychopaths and criminals, where being stabbed, shot or beaten to death any day of the week was a fairly reasonable expectation for what might happen when you left the house that morning.

Luckily we moved a state over and things were completely different after that. Maybe you yourself just need that change of scenery. Environment is a major factor in how your life is going.

Who you were yesterday, is not who you are today. The who you are today is the person that has been through all that shit and learned valuable lessons that shaped a new and better person.

A record is nothing to worry about, you can build a great life with felonies in the past, I may or may not have a couple from back in the day, fortunately being your own man doesn't require someone else to give you a job.

Even if you start your own one man office cleaning company, you can grow that from a couple hundred bucks a week to 30 people working for you in no time.

Just saying man, there's plenty of opportunity out there for you and it doesn't require you being anything but yourself.

[–]rockumsockumrobots 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm taking your posts to heart. Thanks for taking the time to type them out.

[–]TheReplierBRO 0 points1 point  (1 child)

If that's what you assume I'm up to then so be it. I spend my days graduating college and creating art. To some people I'm physically a beta, if they so choose to place labels like that. When I see those people I just laugh. Caught up in everyone else. Mentally I'm a Sigma, adept in the mind. Mostly I'm rejective however, but not for reasons usually discussed. I stand out and girls love that shit.

Don't really watch many movies unless they have a spiritual/philosophical/religious/psychological side to them. That one seems to hit it though and was just something I missed back in high school days. I'll check it out if it's on Hulu or Amazon Prime but otherwise, nah.

I've moved plenty of states in my day and I'm actually very young. I've lived in 4 states between highschool graduation until now. I've never been in or myself being the root cause of, as much trouble as I am now. You ever see a grandma hit some G while holding their granddaughter? Changes your whole worldview.

Of course man, and like I said, my interests in the arts has only grown with certain usage of substances. Specifically into hip-hop/rap and drawings. Though I've always enjoyed this entire realm, it wasn't until recently that I began actually chasing it. After a DUI caused me to almost die (I hit nobody else and it was actually from texting and driving...)

I'd have to say though, that being a hypocrite goes against my desires. I sure can go around and start cleaning up yards/houses/people's psyches, but I can't. And the true reason is it's not my dream. Psychology and Sociology have been great stepping stones, vehicles into my next life. But I have almost no desire to be a counselor as of late. I have always felt the point of life is to impact as many people positively as you can before death.

The way things are going I might have just fucked that up, if I died within the next month or so. But if I follow my heart, my soul, the way it has always spoken to me and I make that my career, then even living out of my car at 25 will be better to have tried than being unhappy with the money that hasn't released that part of me.

Things are hard man, I know. I have this pressure to graduate soon which I will. My GPA however, is nowhere near the best. Though I've seen better that are worse.

Give it time. This is still the come-up. I compare myself to people like Kid Cudi, Dizzy Wright, and old Kanye West. By that I mean, egoless and "here for a message". I'm basically unhireable right now and will be until 2017, when I graduate, when I get my car back. Isn't that sort of a strange outcome to have been given? A year of solidarity to get my head straight and work on myself?

"I don't believe in miracles. I do believe in fate. I do believe in destiny" Where we are now, that seems to hold a lot of weight. Suicidal/Depressive until a car crash that hurt nobody but myself. I tell everyone it was the LAST night, and it was true. I haven't so much as been out of the house except for legal stuff and school for over 2 weeks.

Things change quick. But some lessons on appreciating life right in your face like that? They're no 'accident' and that DUI, though it was a shitty day, was meant to happen.

[–]BramRhodesDouglas 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I love this story man, I'd love to see a proper post on it including lessons you learned. Sounds like it grew you a lot.

[–]lazypengu1n 0 points1 point  (0 children)

congratulations on your hard worked for successes in life! end up finding a more suitable woman after your learning experience?

[–]1KyfhoMyoba 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Ahhhh, schadenfreude! German chocolate cake for the soul.

I asked her what he has to say when she just decides she's going out all night when he works 65 hours a week supporting her lazy ass, her response "I do whatever I want, and honestly I don't give a fuck what he thinks, he's lucky he has a hot wife like me"

Time for some black-knighting/bro-knighting. Let her hubby know her track record and what he's in for.

[–]1seenoeval 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I have no doubt he knows but chooses to be in denial. He knows her looks/body are well above his pay grade (for now) and she is right, he believes he is lucky to have her at all and that means he'll put up with anything.

If she told him she wanted him to film me fucking her ragged on their marital bed, he'd just be happy he was included in her thought.

I feel for him, but I don't, this is a lesson he will need to learn the hard way and hopefully he changes his life.

[–]1KyfhoMyoba 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Convert him to the Church of the Iron God.

[–]DancingC0w 5 points6 points  (3 children)

At least you don't have a problem with the rent for now lol

[–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (2 children)

Yep. If she pulls any moves on paying rent she's outta here.

[–]Meglomaniac 12 points13 points  (1 child)

Make sure you look up your rights as a roommate and how you can have her removed. Its a big deal at least in my country dealing with tenant rights etc.

[–]razorwan 5 points6 points  (3 children)

Marital institutions differ from culture to culture. While AWALT, you'd be harder pressed to find a woman who acts on her ennui with what she's given in a more "oppressive" culture as compared to a western "progressive" culture. That's why older RP customs and societal restrictions are so important if there's any hope of making marriage successful over a large population.

[–]sir_wankalot_here 5 points6 points  (0 children)

BS. You need to swallow the pill. There have been several posts by Indian guys here who I am guessing are probably over 35+. They are describing rural life in India before television etc when they where kids. So events that happened 40+ years ago (factor in when they are kids the story is already 20+ years old). AWALT.

As usually their posts get voted down. Yes in unicorn land or back a long time ago. Or some crap like that.

[–]MightyTaint 2 points3 points  (0 children)

if there's any hope of making marriage successful over a large population

Should we be striving to make marriage successful? Even if we remove all the negative aspects, I don't really see the benefit of registering your relationship status with the state.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

True. However as 3rd world women are "waking up" to their sisters in the West (thru media), their entitlement complex is growing. I would be very cautious to marry a 3rd world woman. She knows the deal and won't feel bad for taking her gringo to the cleaners. Better deal is to live with her in her country and limit the money she gets from you. Like giving a dog treats for good behavior but never marrying them. That keeps them on their toes.

[–][deleted] 68 points69 points  (9 children)

How dare you compare women to dogs!!!

Did you forget that dogs like beer, they cant talk, and they do all their snooping outside as opposed to in your wallet, desk, and laptop.

Canine lovers everywhere are deeply insulted

[–]Allanlemos 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Not to mention that a dog truly loves YOU,not your money or car or status,as long as you treat them right.

[–]Senior Contributordr_warlock 9 points10 points  (0 children)

He wouldn't care if I was poor, incel, ugly, accomplished nothing in life, or going through a rough patch. Everyday when I open the door, he comes rushing down stairs happy to see me wagging his tail. When I'm in my room, he'll come in, lay down next to me and lay silent. All he cares about is that you give him some food and show him attention once in awhile. He doesnt care if you feed or pet other dogs, he actually welcomes all new canines. How can you not love him?

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 28 points29 points  (6 children)

Hey, NAWALT.

My wife finally found a beer she likes. It's this crazy root-beer-flavored beer that has a bazillion grams of sugar and costs like 15 bucks for a six pack.

Because if a woman's going to drink beer, she wants to make sure it's as expensive as possible, and has as much shit added to it as possible, because women like to get stuff.

[–]CobraBanshee 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Its very common for women to drink beer where I come from.... what... (netherlands)

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Same in Bavaria. If she does not drink beer, you should laugh in her face and ask why is she crazy.

[–]Fedora_Tipper_ 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Was it "not your father's root beer"? I just had that the first time yesterday. Nearly tastes like a soda.

[–]redpillstate 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Wow, I just recently tried this beer as well - and guess what? It was recommended to my mother by her hair dresser. She offered me one on my last visit. Interesting to see it brought up here. These little things are fascinating to me.

[–]1AmlanceJockey 55 points56 points  (10 children)

She doesn't just forget about anything you did for her in the past, her hamster tells her that you are an asshole because you could have given her more. The house could have been bigger. The diamond more expensive. The restaurant fancier. You are are an even bigger asshole if you stop giving those treats. Your sacrifice is not forgotten. No, that would be fucked up, but too simple. Your generosity is forgotten AND you are cast as a villain.

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 30 points31 points  (2 children)

It's more that what you did in the past is supposed to signify what you're going to do for her in the future. If you appear like you're moving up and she stands to benefit from being with you, then that doesn't pan out, then, as you've noted, all of that past stuff actually becomes evil. Like you used it to trick her or something.

[–]1AmlanceJockey 9 points10 points  (0 children)

That makes sense. From her perspective she really feels as if she lost something when you stop providing. And in a way she did lose something. She thought she was going to get resources from a certain provider for a certain time when she was 20. When the provider initially gives her those resources she figures her value is deserving of at least that because why else would she be receiving it. So she stays with him and when she is 25 she finds out he is not going to provide those resources to her anymore. She is five years older, five years fatter, and five years more wrinkled. She still has the same needs, perhaps more, but now she has five years less buying power. That's a real loss for her if you ask me.

[–]1KyfhoMyoba 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Remember Dave Foley's divorce rape? 4 years on a hit show, and the judge says that he has to support his ex as if he was still on a hit show. If he goes back to Canada, he goes to jail. Hasn't seen his kids in, like, 5 years.

[–]Endorsed ContributorAFPJ 13 points14 points  (4 children)

While comical, this isn't exactly helpful. A better way to look at it is that women, like all human beings, are purely relative creatures. The key is in setting the standard and expectations early on - don't give her XYZ a year into a relationship; people think moving in a year after dating is acceptable: fuck no - those discussions don't get to start until after 3+ years. Diamond? Forget about it altogether - don't explicitly tell her that, but always make sure she ends up not enjoying any conversation that she tries to have about it - that way, the idiocy stops itself eventually.

Being relative is why giving extremely little and extremely slowly is always the best way to go; not because you're a "cheap fuck" (shaming tactic) but because giving slowly leaves more of you for you & makes her happier in the long run. A man putting himself as number 1 is always a win-win because women don't want to win, they want a winner.

[–]1AmlanceJockey 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I feel you.

You might enjoy the classic Heartiste post Be a Skittles Man

[–]MightyTaint 2 points3 points  (2 children)

For the diamond thing I like to preemptively talk about how they aren't really rare, their price is just inflated by DeBeers by restriction of supply. This in turn creates the conditions for blood diamonds, and even if the diamond you bought is guaranteed not to be one, simply increasing the demand for diamonds increases the demand for blood diamonds. On top of that, they're a boring looking gem, and I think they're tacky.

As long as you can give them an out for not keeping up with the Jones's, any woman with keeping around will see that diamonds aren't worth buying or wearing.

[–]Burn_The_Thunder 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes! Good source for those interested in the full read: https://faculty.cit.cornell.edu/jl2545/4550/materials/atlantic.pdf

[–]Endorsed ContributorAFPJ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Or, instead of explaining yourself, you could just tell her she's not getting a diamond.

An old fashioned plain golden wedding band is affordable and should be your go-to anyways.

As long as you can give them an out for not keeping up with the Jones's

...if you're insane enough to do that to begin with. This should be a filter for who to not put a ring on.

[–]MightyTaint 4 points5 points  (0 children)

That's the story of my father and his relationships. Such a giving man, but unfortunately attracted to the most unappreciative entitled bitches. It's a god damn shame he never swallowed the pill. A good man's life wasted on harpies, and cast as a villain after the fact. Never let your life story wind up being just an accessory to some unremarkable female.

[–]1London-Bananas 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Relationships where you don't watch what you invest are like quicksand. The more you move the worse it gets.

[–]tits_out_forTheBoys 17 points18 points  (2 children)

But you want her to work for your value. And if she starts getting uppity and reminds you about the blowjob she gave you yesterday, speak her language.

This is the tl;dr right here. The concept of "relationship equity" doesn't apply to women just as it doesn't apply to men. She will treat you as she sees fit in that very moment. Instead of trying to change her behavior, counteract it with the appropriate measures.

Her love for you is highly conditional, and if you cannot say the same thing about your love for her, then your relationship is doomed to fail. She wants a man with a spine, not a doormat who takes orders. Punish swiftly but reward slowly, and she'll learn to view what little affection you offer her as manna in the desert.

Any other approach is unacceptable doormat behavior that she'll grow to despise you for. Women want a man who's better than them.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

The concept of "relationship equity" doesn't apply to women just as it doesn't apply to men.

Exactly. It works both ways. If your wife gets fat and nagging and withhold sex at some point, you're not going to stay with her based on loyalty for the relationship up to that point... err wait, that's exactly what men do. OK nevermind

[–]Hang10Dude 6 points7 points  (0 children)

They do... I don't think they should, though.

Well, I shouldn't say that, I'm glad my parents stayed together, even though their relationship was less than good. That's me speaking from a purely selfish perspective, though.

[–]makethemflaunt 13 points14 points  (6 children)

Since a Red Pill post wouldn’t be complete without comparing women to dogs

It's amazing how much basic behaviorism can be applied successfully to interacting with women. The treats are the positive feelz and the swats on the butt are the negative feelz.

It's said that the best workout is the one you keep doing. And one of the best ways to stay committed to something is to enjoy doing it. In that vein, the more fun and joy we can take in pushing women's feelings around up, down and sideways - just for fun, not even necessarily for any gain in that moment - the better honed our skills will be so that we'll be able to employ them effectively when we need them. That's why flirting generally -even when you're not looking to lay her- is a good habit. It's how you sharpen the blade.

[–]EnragedParrot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the swats on the butt are the negative feelz

and the swats on the butt are the negative feelz.

Wait, not necessarily true! :D

Swats on the butt can be a combined negative/positive or even provide a feeling of security for her ("he cares enough to spank me for doing wrong"). It's a real thing. Google "Taken In Hand".

Withdrawing attention is the most apt comparison to swatting a dog on the nose, though within an LTR a good spanking can accomplish both.

[–]Endorsed ContributorBluepillProfessor -2 points-1 points  (3 children)

The treats are the positive feelz and the swats on the butt are the negative feelz.

I don't think you know what is positive and what is negative to the feelz.

[–]makethemflaunt 4 points5 points  (2 children)

What the crap are you talking about? You make her laugh - she feels good. You withdraw attention or pretend to get mad at her - she feels bad. You throw ice at her - she gets worked up and feisty. Here's a great example of fucking with people's emotions, from the immortal classic, Goodfellas. Video Link

[–]Endorsed ContributorBluepillProfessor -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

Swats on the butt are positive feelz. We are mixing metaphors.

Swats on the nose = aversive for bitches (dogs).

Swats on the ass = positive for bitches (women).

[–]makethemflaunt 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The treats are the positive feelz and the swats on the butt are the negative feelz.

is correct because swats on the butt were a reference to the original post:

swatting its ass with that newspaper when it shits on your carpet

...

[–]Endorsed ContributorUrsusG 11 points12 points  (4 children)

Women understand this.

They understand this and they hate when it's applied back to them, i.e. when you make it clear that you will not marry her and that the relationship will be over the moment she stops satisfying you sexually.

Source: current personal experience

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 17 points18 points  (3 children)

Hate is a strong word. I mean, they will verbally express displeasure. But then they keep fucking you. Go figure.

[–]Endorsed ContributorUrsusG 5 points6 points  (2 children)

But then they keep fucking you.

while being verbal about how she 'doesn't owe you anything'

Like I'm supposed to feel lucky I'm tapping that ass when I'm giving her a roof over her head and putting meals on her table.

But it's just talk. Don't listen to the talk. If she's putting out the way you like it, you're more or less doing it right.

[–]MightyTaint 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Like I'm supposed to feel lucky I'm tapping that ass when I'm giving her a roof over her head and putting meals on her table.

Not only that, but when you fuck her you usually fuck her real good. Most guys, especially betas, are shit in the sack. Anytime a female tries to act like she's doing me a favor, I encourage her to not put herself out, and go find better. They usually backtrack real fast.

[–]TheRationalMale.comRollo-Tomassi 9 points10 points  (3 children)

This is a good analogy for the Fallacy of Relational Equity:

http://therationalmale.com/2012/05/21/relational-equity/

I’ve repeatedly read men relate to me when they say how unbelievable their breakups were. As if all of the investment, emotional, physical, financial, familial, etc. would be rationally appreciated as a buffer against hypergamy. The reason for their shock and disbelief is that their mental state originates in the assumption that women are perfectly rational agents and should take all of their efforts, all of their personal strengths, all of the involvement in their women’s lives into account before trading up to a better prospective male. There is a prevailing belief that all of their merits, if sufficient, should be proof against her hypergamous considerations.

For men, this is a logically sound idea. All of that investment adds up to their concept of relationship equity. So it’s particularly jarring for men to consider that all of that equity becomes effectively worthless to a woman presented with a sufficiently better prospect as per the dictates of her hypergamy.

That isn’t to say that women don’t take that equity into account when determining whether to trade up or in their choice of men if they’re single, but their operative point of origin is ALWAYS hypergamy. Women obviously can control their hypergamic impulses in favor of fidelity, just as men can and do keep their sexual appetites in check, but always know that it isn’t relationship equity she’s rationally considering in that moment of decision

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Right-o. All that past investment gets considered a little bit. Namely, to the extent that a woman thinks your past acts signal future investment. But if your life doesn't pan out favorably and she doesn't gain from the relationship the way she envisioned, she will be especially irate. As though the entirety of your past investment was an evil ploy to manipulate her. Women love minimizing your past contributions, or even rewriting history to take credit for them.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

It's almost as though she has memory capacity for one day at a time. When the next morning comes the man has to start from scratch all over again. Doesn't matter what he's done for her in the past, she is operating from what can you do for me now?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's like 50 First Dates, except without the feel good ending

[–]99_Problem 7 points8 points  (0 children)

A dog will return your affection way more consistently than any human being.

[–]Endorsed ContributorUrsusG 5 points6 points  (4 children)

“What is he going to do for me in the future?”

That is why you dole out your commitment and resources in the smallest chunks possible - just enough to keep her around.

Don't ever make the mistake of giving a lot (of time, money, commitment) early on in the relationship to show how awesome you are and how much you 'love' her.

She will take that as baseline and ask for more very soon.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Very true. This should be one of the core tenets of LTR game.

How do you respond to a shit test along the lines of "you don't care about me"? Clearly, if you go "no honey, I do care about you", you've basically failed the shit test. Right?

[–]Eloni 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I care about dat ass. Now shake it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Standard badboy jerk-type ahole behavior. No wonder they do so well with women.

[–]Endorsed ContributorBluepillProfessor 7 points8 points  (0 children)

This is the best analogy of Briffault's Law I have seen. It doesn't matter how loyal you have been to a restaurant. If you don't have money RIGHT NOW then you are not eating.

[–]beardedgntlmn 14 points14 points [recovered]

B. F. Skinner, the man was a genius. No need to waste his valuable research on just dogs.

[–]Asoka11111 1 points1 points [recovered]

Replying this to look him up later when not on mobile.

[–]beardedgntlmn 4 points4 points [recovered]

Operant Conditioning, or positive/negative reinforcement.

[–]Code_Bordeauxx 0 points1 point  (5 children)

Operant Conditioning, aka positive reinforcement

Huh? No you got that wrong. Operant conditioning is learning through trial and error. That can be through positive reinforcement (rewarding), in which case the 'error' is not getting a reward. However it can also be through punishment, in which case the 'error' is an unpleasant experience.

Inmagine a cage of mice with in the centre a red button. Positive reinforcement would be that the mice get food if they press the button. Punishment would be that they all get shocked if one presses it. Both are forms of operant conditioning.

[–]beardedgntlmn 1 points1 points [recovered]

So how exactly am I wrong? Is it because I did not reference negative reinforcement? You just stated that positive and negative reinforcement are forms of operant conditioning, which they are. Relax man, that reply was intended to put u/Asoka11111 on the right path, he'll learn all about it once he looks up the research.

[–]Code_Bordeauxx 0 points1 point  (3 children)

You were wrong, because operant conditioning is as much 'also known as positive reinforcement as drinks are 'also known as tea'. I know what your reply was intended to do, but you should just have stuck with the first part. The second part was unnecessary and false. I'm only pointing out what is factually incorrect.

[–]beardedgntlmn 1 points1 points [recovered]

Would you prefer I go back in and edit my reply to include "negative reinforcement" as well? What you are pointing out is that I am wrong by omission. I've already graduated college twice but if it means that much to you I will edit my reply and we can go on with our days.

[–]Code_Bordeauxx 0 points1 point  (1 child)

No, not really. If your intent is to educate the guy, just stick to 'look up operant conditioning'. That is all, and you could have picked that up already since I said the second part was unnecessary. If you insist on mentioning another synonym, use the accurate one: instrumental conditioning. If you really feel the need to mention positive reinforcement, for reasons that are unclear to me, I think the best way to say it would be 'look up operant conditioning by positive reinforcement'. And yes, then we can go on with our days.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Good post.

This post essentially is an elaboration of Briffault's law

BRIFFAULT’S LAW:

The female, not the male, determines all the conditions of the animal family. Where the female can derive no benefit from association with the male, no such association takes place.

Now,

You are spending money on dinner. That money is gone, and you receive a meal. If you want to eat tomorrow, you spend more money.

and

If you show up tomorrow with no money, you don’t eat. Even if you’ve been loyal customer for years.

and

women are not thinking to themselves, “What has he done for me in the past?” They’re not even thinking, “What has he done for me lately?” They’re thinking, “What is he doing for me right now”, or possibly “What is he going to do for me in the future?”

essentially illustrate the first two corollaries of the law, which are:

  • Past benefit provided by the male does not provide for continued or future association.

  • Any agreement where the male provides a current benefit in return for a promise of future association is null and void as soon as the male has provided the benefit (see corollary 1)

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

This works for everything. You don't expect to earn people's loyalty by doing them a favor once or twice.

Same applies to parenthood.

Blue pill parents expects their kids to do what they (the parents) want. Usually doesn't work very well. If the kid does become obedient, he/she will be resentful.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

You had me until you compared women to dogs. At least dogs are loyal once you train them correctly. I never had a dog try to branch swing to another owner because he was looking for a supply of bigger, meatier bones.

[–][deleted] 7 points7 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

It's a little more complex than that.

Your dog doesn't want to be smacked with a newspaper just because you're not doing it right now. But your dog does want the treats you're not giving it right now.

Women know the difference between a valuable, attractive man and a value-less, unattractive man. They don't care if the low-value, unattractive guy is present, absent, interested, uninterested, or even if he hates them. He's invisible. They wouldn't want his treats, even if he were giving away an enormous pile of them for nothing.

But they will do anything for treats from the high-value, attractive man, and anything to avoid a swat from his newspaper. For him, they'll be the ones constantly devoting time, energy, and resources, hoping he favors them with future benefit.

[–]HockeyBeast44 2 points3 points  (1 child)

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Back in the day, you could tell that story, and nobody would bat an eye and insist that women aren't like that. They'd be like, "Yeah, that's why you don't give women golden fish, dumbass."

[–]2popthatpill 1 point2 points  (1 child)

All of the time, energy, and resources you invest into women are not money in the bank. They are food you bought for her.

That is to say, resources spent on women should be thought of as operating expenditure, not capital expenditure.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yup. Good analogy. It's a cash outflow, not an asset.

Where do you draw the line though? If you're in a LTR and your OpEx is low, she'll know you don't care enough and leave. If you turn into a uxorious BB, she'll get disgusted and leave. How do you balance it? Is there a sweet spot somewhere in the middle? Push and pull?

[–]BOSpecial 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is great stuff. Most men don't understand that women live in the moment and on emotion.

[–]danrmt 1 point2 points  (1 child)

So women are opex, not capex

[–]palaceposy6706 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hmm, but they do depreciate...

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

However, relationships are not banks. They are banquets. You are not investing money for a future return. You are spending money on dinner. That money is gone, and you receive a meal. If you want to eat tomorrow, you spend more money. If the meal sucks or if you’re running out of money, you find other places to eat that offer you more food or better food for less money. If you show up tomorrow with no money, you don’t eat. Even if you’ve been a loyal customer for years.

Yeah, pretty much.

One of the reasons so many men show up here so pissed off is that for a decade or so, they've been whipping out their credit cards paying for steak dinners. And their women were telling them they were giving them steak. Wife says "here's your steak!"

Then they come here to TRP to find out wife was lying to them; or that they don't recognize McDonald's Happy Meals when they see them. Because wife was accepting his payment for steak dinners; and he thought he was getting New York strips and a 5 year old California merlot. He wasn't, because wife was serving up Happy Meals with dried up encrusted McCrapBurgers and small cokes.

[–]Endorsed ContributorUrsusG 0 points1 point  (1 child)

And if she starts getting uppity and reminds you about the blowjob she gave you yesterday, speak her language. That’s old news. What’s on the menu tonight?

I'm genuinely curious what the result of that would be.

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

She calls you an asshole and leaves/stops texting you. Two days later, she fucks you, asks you afterward if you're going to stop being an asshole, and you act like you have no clue what she's talking about. Like the original conversation where she called you an asshole didn't even register as a blip on your radar because it was completely insignificant in your life.

[–]princenotsocharming 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You are right the only thing is the meals cost an awful lot and I prefer the tastier street food stall which is offering me food for free.

[–]recon_johnny 0 points1 point  (0 children)

UPvote this motherfucker.

Solid. Many, many truths (and mostly the primary ones) for relationships.

Learn this, if you haven't.

[–]dart200 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This wasn't quite as true when marriage was for life and divorce was non-existent. Weird how more freedoms have destroyed the ideal.

I wonder why women naturally understand the change, whereas many men are still stuck thinking a woman's commitment is meaningful.

[–]MoonLair 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Brilliant red pill. It's good to see something besides angsty men angsting with foam coming out of their mouth.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Great allegory.

What's on the menu lol

[–]bourbanog 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit, because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure"

-Tacitus

[–]AcriDice 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I cannot express how much I love this post

[–]nicememeboss 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Care to explain your last part without an comparison?

Whats a treat to her etc. ? Thanks bro

[–]ShitlerParty 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A lot of this could be used to describe a parasite.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"Since a Red Pill post wouldn’t be complete without comparing women to dogs (...)" - nearly spilled tea on my workplace keyboard, You sick man.

[–]dmagne -2 points-1 points  (11 children)

Wow, it's like you know that a woman has never ever repaid a man's loyalty in kind. Oh wait that is a lie because it's been repaid to me 100 times over. Yeah turns out relationships can be banks. Maybe you should stop trying to get in to relationships with horrible women? I think you just make bad choices. I finished college because of a woman's loyalty to me. She repaid me with literally thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours of her time. You lie sir.

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Sorry. Can't edit titles. I wanted to say "Relationships except for dmagne's mom aren't banks."

[–]Endorsed ContributorUrsusG 0 points1 point  (4 children)

finished college because of a woman's loyalty to me.

Your mom/grandma don't count, dude.

[–]dmagne -1 points0 points  (3 children)

Not talking about my mom. Talking about a woman I dated in a romantic relationship and was not married to.

[–]EnragedParrot 0 points1 point  (2 children)

You're anecdote doesn't disprove AWALT - it's just an anecdote for THAT particular situation.

So, OK, you found ONE woman who wasn't AWALT...for you, for that time. I've found one too...but I can still guarantee that if either yours or mine stopped getting the "feelz", that loyalty would risk disappearing.

[–]dmagne 0 points1 point  (1 child)

You're describing humanity, not just female humanity. Males of this species display the same selfishness. If AWALT then AMALT too buddy.

[–]EnragedParrot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And how does that refute, in any way, what I said?

[–]1KyfhoMyoba 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. NAWALT!!

Fuckng pussy.

[–]dmagne -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I'm a pussy because I know for a fact that what OP said isn't true? Or because a woman helped me? I'm not really sure what your accusation is about.

[–]fingerthemoon 1 points1 points [recovered]

I had numerous women help me financially when I was a young starving artist. So your right that some women will invest in you if they see potential in you or they value your entertainment/sexual experience. But this is a different scenario than the OP where the man is providing and demonstrating kindness, generosity and loyalty over time only to be unappreciated later for all he's given.

I've also had the experience of supporting a woman, putting her through school, buying her a car and many other gifts, sacrificing what I wanted many times, always looking out for her best interest, only to be fucked over by her 6+ years into our relationship. She shocked me because I thought I knew her. She completely disregarded everything I did for her and acted like a selfish cold-hearted-bitch. I never saw it coming.

I came across hard times and always thought she'd be there to support me but she did the most painful thing ever and made it all a thousand times worse. She cheated and then branch-swung, rubbed my face in it, and then played out her fantasy of having two guys fighting for her (like all her favorite shows). She kept me on a string for over a year making me think we would get back together after she explored herself (had only been with a couple guys before me). Meanwhile I was going insane thinking about my precious little snowflake getting plowed by another dude. I almost committed a felony a few times but thankfully in my rage I was able to control myself... I thought I had chosen a "good one" but I was wrong. Now I wonder if there actually are any good ones.

Sounds like she was investing in you and helping you finish collage. I wonder how things might turn out if you were investing in her and helping her finish collage.

[–]dmagne -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

Well for one she would know how to spell college. Second I did help her through law school. We helped each other, aren't together and are still friends. So basically exactly what you speculate with negative implication occurred in positive reality. But go on hating. If it helps you then who am I to question.

This sub has some very useful things to say to men. I just think it's sad that it has to come wrapped in a misogyny burrito. I find the taste bitter.

[–]reigorius 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That bitter tastes is what all newbies taste here. It will go away eventually.

[–]kalse2 -2 points-2 points [recovered]

Most people (men and women) treat relationships like this. If you're putting her on a pedestal expecting something different, you're going to get burned. Most "friendships" I've had with men have the same quality, it's all about the moment, and whatever contractual agreements (sharing a house, cleaning schedules, etc.) that you've agreed to. Sometimes there's a bit of investment here and there but not much.

[–]enkae7317 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Not really. Say, for example, you helped a friend out of a hefty situation. That bro got your back no matter what.

I've had friends where I went through hell and back with and vice versa. We still continue to help each other out and back each other when we see fit.

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Maybe? I don't fuck men, so that's not really a concern of mine.

[–]kalse2 1 points1 points [recovered]

What I'm getting at is this (the restaurant model) is how most people treat each other. I guess some guys treat the girls who they want a relationship with differently, and overinvest for some elusive future reward.

[–]TRP VanguardArchwinger[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I don't understand how "Men, too" is helpful for anybody's sexual strategy. How is your addition to this thread going to get guys laid? How will it give them power in their relationships with their women? If anything, being exactly like this toward women would give men more power. So "Men, too" is a good thing, right?

[–]EnragedParrot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Men who are like this are what women call "bad boys", because they (women) can't control them, so are attracted to them.

Sounds like a winner to me!