Red Pill TheoryDon't expect people to be on your side when you improve yourself (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by [deleted]

INTRODUCTION: When you begin to take charge of your life and do what it takes, whatever it may be for your situation, to improve yourself, don't expect anybody to support and or encourage you while you are in the process. This is especially true with those whom have known you for a while (close friends and family to name a couple).

BODY: As a man, your value is forged and chiseled away through the passages of time. That is the only way. Sure you can get a good haircut and dress better all in one day, but that's just a part of the puzzle. You can be good-looking, but if you have no life direction, no goals, no passions, no friends, no fulfilling life, no accomplishments, etc., (in other words, nothing that took time to create) then you're still low value and everybody, not just women, can sense this. You may get a Siren to approach you, but Mark Manson said it correctly: "The truth is always shining through."

When you start doing something, chances are, you're going to suck donkey balls at it. This is just part of the process and is something that you must go through if you wish to shine. Not only do you suck, but everybody else who knows you're starting will laugh because they see you going through the initial failure stage. I'll give you an example from my own life.

I have known one of my friends since high school (we're both 21). He grew up with a masculine father and harmonious family; therefore, he is what many would call a natural alpha. Unsurprisingly, he has never had a problem with women or friends in his life. I, on the other hand, am a recovering porn addict, former geek, bully victim and barely had my first kiss at 17. After swallowing The Pill, I decided I am done with being stepped on. It has been over two years and things are beginning to take shape for me: I have a 3.89 GPA in a STEM degree, am a leader in my public speaking group, am saving up money, began to look after my appearance (Malefashionadvice and skincareaddiction FTW), am beginning to feel true desire (fuck porn), and discovered that I have the God-given gift of a masculine voice (have received multiple business cards from former radio/sports announcers and have even given some girls tingles just by speaking) I'm looking into starting my own home voiceover business for extra cash. Needless to say, I am at the happiest point I have ever been in my life.

My friend has been used to me being the WoW/porn addict I was in the past and treated me as such. After reading TRP for a while, you can read between the lines of what everybody is saying to you. The other day, he told me, " Why does it matter what you look like? Everybody's face breaks out and everybody dresses badly. You need to stop listening to society...Why did you quit porn and World of Warcraft? You were so happy when you did them...Why do you want a white collar job as a data scientist? You already make good money at (my fast-food job)...You need to stop talking like that to girls and talk normal." Lemme tell you despite all of these words, his father is going to give him a blue-collar business upon graduation, is planning on opening a tattoo shop afterwords, already owns multiple motorcycles at 21 and has maxed out his physical appearance.

TL;DR: When you improve, don't expect anybody to be on your side. People do not want the process, they want the result. You may find some people that understand the struggle you must go through to be great, but these people are rare.

UPDATE: Holy Hell. This exploded. Thanks for the gold. I'll answer questions as soon as possible.

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorVasiliyZaitzev 237 points238 points  (17 children)

Crabs in a bucket mentality; the other crabs don't want you to escape.

The best way to handle is to say "ok" and then go about your business of exercising, learning game, improving yourself. Don't waste a second arguing with losers who just want to bring you down.

[–]drummmmergeorge 25 points26 points  (0 children)

can a mod give this alpha a point? this is what we're all about.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

AKA "Win through actions, not argument". Works every time

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (2 children)

i don't think it's people don't want you to improve specifically, it's that people don't want you to change, for better or for worse.

when you form relationships with people, it's based on who you are at the time. if you change, the relationship is now based on who you were, and may no longer be valid. which sucks for the person who didn't change, and valued the initial relationship.

if you want to get into heroin, you're non junky friends aren't going to like it. if you want to get off of heroin, you're junky friends aren't going to like it.

people don't like change. change sucks. but eventually we all shrivel up and die.

[–]thatblondeguy_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Indeed. It's not that people somehow want you to have a bad life. They just don't want you to change because it's uncomfortable, new and unknown, possibly dangerous for them. That's also why each time there is a youtube update the comments are filled with people complaining about it and demanding that they revert it back to the previous version (which they initially complained about too).

Human brain makes us feel that change = bad

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

While people are uncomfortable with change, most are far more uncomfortable with a someone close to them improving them-self, as opposed to someone changing for the worse. Because most people see other people's faults, and feel better about themselves. The other aspect is that most people are animals, and someone who is trying to increase his rank in the pecking order will be challenged and slapped down if possible. Just like in a wolf pack and "natural order" of wolves. Now if someone slides downhill, maybe starts using drugs, other people close to them will actually try and help sometimes. But god forbid they help someone who is on the road to self improvement and trying to be better than they are. Who do they think they are, rising above their station like that?

[–]foldpak111 7 points8 points  (5 children)

It helps to laugh others off immensely when you have a Freedomain Radio or Tai Lopez podcast playing on your iPod. Have fun with your life 'bro', I got business to take care of.

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorVasiliyZaitzev 7 points8 points  (1 child)

You can do that, too. If it's someone you have to deal with, such as a parent, it's easier just to say "ok" and acknowledge them, but not give them an angle to criticize you/argue further. This is especially effective with mothers.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Is this the same Tai Lopez as the YouTube ads showing off his house?

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

The crap mentality comment he got that from rollo tomassi from the rational male. People give compliments when your down in order for them to feel better about themselves. Hardly anyone gives you praise when you're improving yourself!

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorVasiliyZaitzev 13 points14 points  (0 children)

No disrespect to the Grand Master, but the "crabs in a bucket" expression has been around since before the internet.

[–]garlicextract[🍰] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Great post - but in this case, OP's friend isn't a crab in a bucket. Dude seems to have it made.

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorVasiliyZaitzev 0 points1 point  (1 child)

but in this case, OP's friend isn't a crab in a bucket. Dude seems to have it made.

Yet his mentality is as "crab in bucket" as they come.

[–]garlicextract[🍰] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I certainly agree. Just wondering why the guy is such an asshole that he is a crab out of the bucket, pushing this guy back down.

[–]freeupboats4every1 64 points64 points [recovered]

When you're making a genuine change, other people only see a status quo. Your friends and family don't notice as you get stronger. It's so gradual and they're so focused on their own lives that, in their heads, you've always been this way. That's great because it makes their perception of you malleable and they do forget the bitch you once were, but it's bad because one day they'll feel like they don't know you and all they'll see is what they want to change in the present moment. Your mother will only see how you offend her by having disdain for women. Your friend will only see how butthurt he is that you don't fit in with his reality anymore. People don't see that you're becoming stronger and happier every single day. They just see what makes them uncomfortable now, and when that switch in their heads is flipped they'll scramble to figure out what the fuck happened.

And so the fact that your friend is uncomfortable means you genuinely have changed to him. He doesn't see the old porn addict in you. If he thought it was all an act, he wouldn't be bothered in the slightest. But he knows it's real and feels he's lost a friend. Not your responsibility to help, but if you want to stay friends with him, just keep being you. Avoid big arguments -- they're just shit tests. Talk about stuff you like to talk about. Invite him to lift with you. Worst case he stays the same and you make new friends, best case he improves with you.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 15 points16 points  (0 children)

in their heads, you've always been this way.

This pisses me off from time to time

[–]2awalt_cupcake 46 points47 points  (17 children)

"awalt_cupcake, let me ask you something?"


"Do you love yourself?"


And that's when I realized loving yourself in today's society is being satisfied with who you are, making yourself feel happy, and not pushing yourself through the shit life has to offer on the way to greatness.

I do love myself. That's why I studied the essentials of nutrition to change my diet, that's why I study the muscles to understand what the hell I'm doing at the gym, that's why I lost weight, that's why I approach women, treat them like they deserve to be treated, and put myself first. Because I love myself and have always known my value. I made the crucial mistake of ever thinking anyone would see my value if I didn't set boundaries and cut people off entirely.

[–]sir_wankalot_here 13 points14 points  (12 children)

Good point, being happy with yourself basically means being contented that you are a pathetic loser and finding excuses why you a pathetic loser.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 14 points15 points  (9 children)

I saw a lady with a shirt today that said, "Exercise? I thought you said Extra Fries." She was fat and proud.

That's what loving yourself means. Letting yourself go and wearing it for everyone to see. Doing what the fuck you want and not caring about the results is a great mindset in the opposite direction of application. Instead of pushing yourself with that mindset, you live in laziness with that mindset. And as you said, that state of mind in that frame of execution boils down into excuses.

[–]sir_wankalot_here 12 points13 points  (8 children)

execution boils down into excuses.

Using the fat woman as an example, simplified there are two scenarios.

  • the fat woman with the TShirt example, can't figure out why she can't get a date, makes excuses why she is fat, this case she is a loser.

  • the fat woman woman who has maybe hit 35+, she will tell you straight out she is fat because she shoves too many donuts in her face. But she finds donuts more fulfilling then men. These type of people are actually really great to talk to.

Basically it boils down to, do you make excuses.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 4 points5 points  (6 children)

This chick had a dude with him. They looked to be both in their 30s. Even that land whales these days get laid.

[–]billythebeta 5 points6 points  (5 children)

It has been said before on this subreddit, but men slipping up is why our society is so feminized. When thirsty fat betas have no standards they're fine with even giving land whales attention.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 5 points6 points  (2 children)

At the same time they're played. "A true man would x". Or be poisoned with the ideologies of self-sacrificing love. It's a chicken vs the egg scenario. Which came first? Male ignorance or female manipulation? I argue both occurred just at the right time. Domino effect.

[–]billythebeta 4 points5 points  (1 child)

It's not a chicken vs egg scenario at all-- male ignorance certainly came first. Men held the chips across the world for a very, very long time, but slipped up in the last century or so when they gave credence to spinsters hamstering away feminist philosophy.

Women have always been manipulative-- RP men have seen through this and controlled it for a long time, until now.

[–]2awalt_cupcake 1 point2 points  (0 children)

There once once a man who didn't know. And once he learned before it was too late. The end.

[–]nrjk 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Yeah, I really don't understand men that bang morbidly obese chicks. Even when I was 240, the thought never crossed my mind to go get easy sex from a Ham McBurgerstein.

I understand the fat beta guy situation, but I've seen plenty of thin men with Shamoos, too. That shit has to be a different wiring in the brain to be able to get hard when you're looking at essentially a woman who looks like a half deflated hot air balloon stuffed with cottage cheese.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Or worse, marry one.

and just like that, I've turned gay

[–]SlinkyOne 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm going to start saying and believing that. Donuts ARE really fulfilling.

[–]nrjk 2 points3 points  (0 children)

And ultimately falling in love with the reasons you're a pathetic loser being on the extreme end.

[–]dirtydog413 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Depends if you are a 'loser' or not - who's to say or to judge? Someone else? Yes, be honest with yourself and don't delude yourself into thinking you are happy if you really aren't. But if you ARE, then don't let someone else decide what makes you a 'loser' or not, and then feel you have to change to satisfy their idea of what you should be doing with your life. Is that red pill? Not to me.

"A man is a success if he gets up in the morning and goes to bed at night, and in between he does what he wants to do" - Bob Dylan.

[–]SlappaDaBayssMon 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Somehow "loving yourself" became different from loving anything else. That guy around the block who's always waxing and improving his hot rod loves his hot rod. The guy who wipes down his guitar and gingerly places it back in its case loves his guitar. The man who goes out of his way to keep his family safe and fed loves his family, but in order to love yourself you can only engage in hedonism and self destructive activities. Just more fee-fee doublethink cooked up by an ad agency to sell women more stupid shit they don't need or even truly want.

[–]Donuteater780 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think engaging in hedonism is more of a "Lust yourself sort of thing.

[–]dirtydog413 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It works both ways doesn't it? I mean, if you genuinely ARE happy with who you are, then you shouldn't feel pressured to change yourself because of what OTHER PEOPLE think you 'should' do. For example, you might be in a 'dead end, low paid' job for example, but it might pay plenty enough for you to do what you want to do with your life, have enough leisure time that you are happy with, or whatever. Maybe it's not a great example but just to illustrate the principle. Or maybe others think you should dress more smartly, or have a girlfriend rather than be single, or whatever it may be. Just make sure you are changing for yourself and not because of society and other people's expectations and demands, and there's no problem.

Some of us may genuinely feel as I do, that society is a deeply fucked up place nowadays, and therefore to opt out of it as much as practically possible is the right thing to do. Others may judge me as being 'unsuccessful' because I do not possess enough of the modern symbols of success - big house, new car etc. - well fuck them, I am living for myself, not to impress some strangers. Or for that matter, women.

[–]Endorsed Contributorredpillbanana 36 points37 points  (2 children)

Check out my old submission: Sometimes, when people get upset at you, it means you're on the right track


Many men on the self-improvement path get discouraged because they see the upset it is causing among their friends/family/coworkers.


  • Others are suffering from your increased competitiveness in business or in romance.
  • Girlfriends/wives are worried that your SMV is increasing so they start mate-guarding.
  • Friends or family see you becoming more ripped/successful and they get jealous want to drag you back down to their level.
  • Fat coworkers make fun of you when you turn down the office cookies or donuts.
  • Women complain about you to their beta orbiters and the betas try to stand up to you and/or try to steal her away.
  • Women are afraid that you'll be a bad influence on their boyfriends/husbands so they tell them to stop hanging out with you. From a recent fascinating article I read: “She [Playboy Playmate Sandy Bently] cut me off from Mark,” Eddy Louis would say later, “because the more I talked to him, the more she had to fuck him.”
  • People miss the old you who would bend over backwards to please them, and they react negatively to the new you who sets boundaries and doesn't need to appease them. This can be especially prevalent among family.

[–]putinbusch 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Have you got a link to that article?

[–]Endorsed Contributorredpillbanana 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's in the archived submission.

[–]billythebeta 21 points22 points  (12 children)

I remember this message clearly demonstrated when I lost weight years ago-- everyone from my own family to friends were ready to shit on my efforts even though the journey of weight loss was hard enough on its own. Then a year later those same people are giving me compliments and shit when they were previously undermining the efforts.

Hell, I still see it now when I'm in med school-- all these party tards saying that I'm wasting away in school, but they'll be the same ones to envy and (try) to marry me once I'm an established physician. Just waiting to crush these attempts when the time comes, along with making bank.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (11 children)

God. All of my family is fat. None of them exercise or eat healthy. I started making the right choices this year, and I lost about 30 pounds. I get home for Christmas and everyone is telling me I'm too skinny and need to eat more. I have a BMI of like 23 or 24. I could stand to lose 10 more pounds.

I've been biting my tongue to keep from telling them that I'm not skinny, and they are all just fat gluttons.

[–]billythebeta 5 points6 points  (9 children)

When losing weight you're going to be surrounded by people trying to tempt you with unhealthy foods (see: enablers). Remember that your goal is the only thing that matters-- no matter how jolly or encouraging they're trying to be-- stick to your diet. The reward far outweighs the temptation of food they're trying to stick in your mouth.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (8 children)

It's fucking Christmas. I can feast for a few days and be okay. When I leave next week, I will go back to my new normal eating habits, which is around 1800 to 2200 calories a day of mostly vegetables, fruits, nuts, and lean meats. I'll probably aim for around 1500 calories a day for a couple weeks though to lose any extra weight I put on over the holidays though. I have learned to control my body now.

[–]billythebeta 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Whatever, it's your weight loss-- I'm just giving you the down and dirty about what is bound to constantly happen with your friends and family when they see you improving yourself for the better.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

No, you're right. It's just that I'm not around my family often. I work in a different state. I'm only visiting for 2 weeks. It doesn't really matter if I eat extra ham or desert for 2 weeks and gain a couple pounds, because ultimately, calories in - calories out, and the weight will come off as easily as it went on. I weighed 194 a year ago and now I'm at 166. I don't really have a goal weight. I just want to be healthier and better looking.

[–]billythebeta 1 point2 points  (1 child)

As long as you don't consistently go over maintenance you should be OK. Sounds like you know what you're doing, but I felt compelled to let you know of the common pitfall anyways.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

TBH as somebody who's lost weight and gotten in shape over the past few years, I'm now annoyed by my fit friends telling me to stay strong and resist... heh. Goes to illustrate the point, people fucking hate change no matter the direction.

[–]nrjk 0 points1 point  (3 children)

May I ask your previous/current weight and goal? It sounds as if I'm the same range as you. I've maintained the last two or three weeks at 30 pounds eating 1500-2000 a day. These extra 15 I want to lose need to hurry the fuck up.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

At my fattest, I weighed about 194. Now I'm at 166. I'm 5'10". I'd like to thank fatpeoplehate for drastically improving the quality of my life.

My goal is to be healthier and better looking. I never set a goal weight.

Keep at it. Maybe cut out 500 calories a day if you're maintaining and want to lose weight.

Edit: last post removed for referring to fatpeoplehate as a subreddit. I didn't realize that wasn't allowed.

[–]foldpak111 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Now go back to 194# pure muscle within 2.5 years. You can thank the gods later.

[–]5t3fan0 0 points1 point  (0 children)

congrats on your gains man ;-)

maybe give yourself some food rewards since its also holidays BECAUSE they're rewards for a well done job on losing 30, they're not a cure for being skinny

extra motivation: when you reach your goal (and you will) your family might stop trying to drag you down and actually get inspired to change as well... its not guaranteed but it happens

[–]thisornothing 15 points16 points  (1 child)

So true. Home for Christmas and my father is already trying to convince me I don't need to put any more muscle mass on.

Crab bucket mentality. People will hold you back. Do not let them.

[–]SinisterSwindler 5 points6 points  (0 children)

My father is the same, throughout the whole of the last 6 months all he kept saying " why do you want to get bigger? You won't get any bigger! What? you want to be slow and weak like those body builders?" all the while he comes home gets drunk and eats shit while watching tv after work. Fuck him.

[–]prodigy2throw 11 points12 points  (1 child)

They don't want you to win - DJ Khaled

[–]red_pill_account1 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Luckily I have a friend who is the opposite. He has seen my success and wants my help getting buff. He knows it's gonna be hard work that he'll ultimately have to overcome, but he is more confident in having my expertise in the process. It's good to have friend(s) that are actually wiling to grow with you.

[–]ChinmayT2 6 points7 points  (0 children)

They are god's angels. Have one like that myself. Helped me in my weight loss.

[–]foldpak111 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Men like this are out there, gents. I know plenty and they encourage me to surpase them. They do everything in their power to ensure that doesn't happen though haha. They love a good competition.

[–]Momo_dollar 5 points6 points  (3 children)

Question about your friend. In the past and now, what are his other friends like? Does he go out with other guys with similar or even higher smv to himself or does he have a habbit or only hanging out with people with lower smv?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

The friend that he hangs out with the most is somebody that failed out of college, had a child at 19 and literally flew over 1000 miles just to drive with a girl he's been orbiting since he was 16 (leaving his kid back at home). All of his other friends in the past were much lower SMV than him. Today, most of his friends are above average SMV but nowhere near his level. He also resents guys in fraternities more than anything, saying they are "douchebags."

[–]5t3fan0 0 points1 point  (1 child)

flew over 1000 miles just to drive with a girl

i would also do it... if the car was a saturn V rocket

[–]tedted8888 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I think you just found out who your real friends are, and are not in this situation.

When you improve yourself, and others realize it, they think about the time they wasted and why they didn't get over their bad habits. Its natural for them to put you down, because it exposes their ego for the empty shell it is.

[–]nrjk 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Jesus, I've read similar posts to this and actually have had to experience it to fully grasp it. I've lost ~30 pounds in the last 3.5 months-basically by counting calories, walking a little bit, and playing/practicing drums (my profession). I'm down 3 pant sizes so naturally I've had to buy newer clothes so I don't look like a saggy internet feminist.

So far:

-comments from a friend to tell me to "Stop losing weight, you're making me look bad" from a guy I hang with. His GF is an old drinking buddy of mine (I knew her first), but I've noticed she's been asking/commenting/joking about my sex life more, making more eye contact, and general flirting (we all know this girls game: she flirts with me and I wetten her up just enough for her BF, hahaha. Or a branch swinger).

-One of my mom's friends saying I shouldn't lose too much more even though a BMI chart put my "ideal" weight between 180-190.

-The two older guys in one of my bands of course razz me about it, but they've been complimentary actually.

-One of my old high school friends kept giving me shit when I put on a nice shirt, pants and shoes to hang out.

I'm 33. This isn't confined to ANY age range-this is life in general. When I was a teenager, I spent a lot of time playing drums, and naturally had less time for friends. Of course came the shaming tactics, passive aggressive behaviors, etc. My true friends were the ones that never minded, and allowed me to get better and not be resentful about it. For the ones that try and talk you out of it, and it's been said here already, just say "ok" and continue on.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)


What is this?

[–]leftenant_t 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Because your improvement reminds them their stagnation and force them to re-consider their life choices.

[–]Gelu_sf 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Exactly man.. people want the result. This is the single most difficult thing to overcome. Because you automatically assume that your friends want what's best for you.

Wrong! People want comfort. Be it the comfort of keeping you in the box where they already placed you, or the comfort of not dealing with anything else that they feel it's threatening. Like /u/redpillbanana said in his reply.

I have LOTS of examples for this, but I'll stick to only two, involving the same person. This is a woman I've been seeing on and off for some time. She behaves like a woman totally in love and I believe she is (for the moment).

Example 1: Cooking When I've moved to my own house one of my main objectives were not to die of starvation, so I had to learn how to cook. I've studied very "mathematically" everything and occasionally I've been talking to the lady in question about it. The stages were as follows:

Stage 1: That's cute she kept subtly downplaying everything I was doing. But was showing some appreciation that I as trying to feed myself and not eat instant microwaved pizza.

Stage 2: The shaming once I've become more proficient, she started to do a push pull thing where the push was "Men do not belong in the kitchen. It's too womanly" . Of course this stemmed from the fact that she felt threatened by the hypothetical situation where we would live together and she would not rule the kitchen completely. I was intruding in her non-existent domain.

Stage 3: Admiration this comes after you show consistency and get some social proof. She drops lines of admiration out of the blue, zero downplaying, zero shit tests. Even asks for advice on recipes or techniques. The cooking difference between us is 20 years in her favor.

Example 2: Lifting & Dropping fat: The reasons for this are obvious for any TRP member. I decided to see how far I can go on this side, since I'm in mid 30s. And if I don't do it now, I'll never be able to. Ended up going to the gym , taking up combat sports.

Stage 1: That's cute regarding to the gym, it dawned on her that I'm doing something for myself.. she encouraged me to do it, but only half-halfheartedly as she believed it's only a fad.

Stage 2: Shaming / The brakes after getting some results and being consistent she started throwing in the brakes and shaming. Phrases such as "You'll get fat after you stop", "I like puffy men" (mind you I was never puffy) , "Are you going to become a gymbro?" and the likes became commonplace. This coming from a woman that watches UFC on occasion and things like that.

Stage 3: Admiration / Freudian Slip after 4 months of training, eating properly , getting below 17% BF I'm standing with her in front of the mirror and she drops this: "You changed so much you're making me feel bad. Now I have to lose weight!". Please note: we never go out in public together, we would never be in a situation where people would look at us side by side, and she really is thin.

TL:DR: Mind your own business,ignore the haters. They will eventually turn into followers , or dump you like a bad habit. Either way, you win.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don't understand why you want to change, you're fine just the way you are

My own mother has spent the past three years trying to sabotage my progress with this line. I shouldn't lose more weight, I shouldn't put on more muscle, I shouldn't try to become lean, I should just be a fat lazy slob.

I ended up telling her to go fuck herself, I wouldn't take her sabotaging me anymore. She still tries, I just shut her down immediately and move on.

[–]Merica911 6 points7 points  (4 children)

This is why SMV exist. It's the value of a thing that either worth more or less. There is no "everyone is the same", every little thing on this planet has value.. To the water you drink to the house you live in..

Business 101; when the demand goes up so does the price. When I mean by this and an responses to your post? Is that people's only way to increase their SMV is to shame the ones on the higher ladder. They are to lazy to work hard for themselves so the easiest thing to do is shame more and more.

[–]Bearhardy 4 points5 points  (0 children)

That and most probably he is shit testing OP to sww if he can break it, it's normal for those closest to us to test us in this fashion I have noticed, more so alpha guys like OPs friend, I bet you OPs friend hears the same all the time, why you want another bike? Why you work out so much? Etc. And he just brushes off and DGAF

[–][deleted] 3 points3 points

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[–]foldpak111 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I'm only 5'6" but once I bulked up from 130# to 190# while maintaining 8%bf (took about 5 years of consistent effort), the shit tests came as well. It really messes with most men when they see a guy much shorter than them who could absolutely dominate them. I caved to the shame-baiting as well, but then I found TRP and like you said, everything clicked. Now I get a massive testosterone boost and I'm just thinking to myself, "You better stay in line beta male, or I'll dominate you and fornicate with your girlfriend right in front of you. You are an extremely lucky individual for we live in civilization, and no longer the animal kingdom." Btw, I don't think I'm hot shit and these Gym Jones workouts keep me humble, but I'm definitely hot shit around the 80% who think it's cool to white knight/SJW.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (9 children)

A bit off topic but how did you kick your porn addiction? I've tried nofap and pot free but I get nowhere, it is seriously debilitating to me but I don't know what to do.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (3 children)

I haven't exactly cut it out completely, but I'm rather in the process of changing the habit. Since you're asking me this and have tried NoFap, you probably have an addictive personality just like me. This is actually a blessing in disguise because you change where you get your dopamine burst from (such as something productive to you).

Unfortunately, according to The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg, "you can't eradicate a habit; you can only change the routine." Like most addictions, it isn't the 'high' that you're after, but rather something else. You have to ask yourself what it actually is that you're craving. Is it human connection? Some general fun? Are you jacking off as a means to escape something? Are you hungry (I have actually fapped because of this)?

Once you have found the "reward" that is driving your habit, you then have to find a way to meet that reward. For me, the thing that was driving my habit is just being bored as Hell. Now, whenever I get an urge, I open up Python and begin coding (I still feel the urge, but it evaporates at an elevated pace).

The next part, which is what I'm currently working on, is to associate sexual pleasure with women and not with your previous "reward." Believe me, you will know when you feel genuine desire because your penis will alert you when a good mate is nearby (remember, you can't negotiate desire). I don't really follow the whole NoFap thing either, but rather follow Mark Manson's advice: masturbate only once a week while thinking about women that you genuinely desire and have interacted with. I "relapsed" today, but I was thinking about a girl who sent me Snapchats of her half-naked and this slightly older girl at my work who called me "babe." The trick is to rewire your desire.

Only be sexual with yourself and anybody when it is actually genuinely flowing. Don't be sexual just because you're bored or lonely.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I really appreciate this man. I think it's boredom for me, it happens if I stay up late or have nothing to do at home.

Working on cutting out downtime and getting an actual routine.

Thankfully I'm not as bad off as these guys with Ed or jerking off everywhere, but I'm still probably more addicted than not, still get the desire feeling you speak of and everything.

That being said, is it healthy to masturbate to people you know? Feel like it's not, could be wrong.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

As long as its genuine desire and you're not causing anybody harm, then, in my theory, it will help you brain rewire to real human beings and not pixels on the screen (because this is what you're trying to avert). Make sure the fantasies are realistic too and you are imagining yourself doing things to her (pulling her hair, pinning her down, slapping her ass, etc.).

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Alright, thanks again.

Nofap I don't visit anymore, it's gotten too cult like so I take anything I can get outside of that atmosphere, appreciate it.

[–]ItsNotShane 2 points2 points [recovered]

How often do you jerk it? Are you spending hours, calling out of work, skipping out on classes, friends, etc.. just to pmo all day?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A few years ago, yeah.

Now I still do it every 1-5 days, lucky if I don't binge, and the next day or two afterwards I am way less social, find myself second guessing everything, can hardly speak without sounding nervous, etc.

So I suppose I have improved but it's still pretty bad

[–]coolwords 1 points1 points [recovered]

Are you lifting? Have you gained decent lean mass and dropped your body fat below 15%? Have you begun seeing how differently other men and women treat you?

Don't expect your brain chemistry to change on its own until you've fixed the body that creates it in the first place.

You do know what to do. It's written all around here. Get off your ass. Lift.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Ah shit, does that say pot free? Meant porn.

Also, I do lift a lot, very proud of it and I've been cutting myself down as well. Despite all that I still can't, maybe I just haven't progressed enough.

[–]1PantsonFire1234 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Keep in mind that people are more than willing to accept your decline. Watching someone fall is what people love, especially your competition (ie: your closest and dearest).

Personally I don't agree with that mindset, I believe that friends and family should help each other ascend, not hack at each others feet. But this is the default mindset allot of these bitches hold.

Fewer people enjoy watching you rise up in the world leaving them behind. Some are rigid in there mindsets yes, but I would heavily question the true nature of a 'friend' or family member that's trying to hold you back.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Don't expect anyone to be on your side when you do fucking anything interesting at all whatsoever. You know why it's funny when Donald Trump says "anchor babies" ? Because everyone hates him for it. You know why nobody gives a shit when Bernie Sanders let's Hillary off the hook for Benghazi? Because he's afraid of conflict. If you want to be great and get people's attention then you have to be bold and if you want to be bold then you've gotta face the restrictions that prevent others from being bold----especially opposition.

[–]foldpak111 9 points10 points  (1 child)

I'm noticing that mass hatred leads to wealth. The austistic fuck who created that revenge porn site was making on average 10k per month with ads. Owen Cook drove millions in revenue when Neil Strauss talked shit about him in The Game. I personally know a couple of clickbait kings who prey on the unconsciousness of the masses and easily pull in 70-80k per year. But if you're a harmless little guy you'll be lucky to pull 45k a year.

Be bold. Be controversial. We live in a capitalist society, not a moral one. But most people didn't get the memo.

[–]2Overkillengine 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We live in a capitalist society, not a moral one. But most people didn't get the memo.

They are too busy giving in to emotional catharsis to listen.

[–]scruffist 1 point2 points  (0 children)

People do not want the process, they want the result.

Whatever it is you're improving about yourself, this will be true for some of the people around you, but not all. Some people won't want the new you at all. So prepare yourself mentally that that might happen, but don't let it stop you.

I've had this happen several times where I've just lost one or more close friends or lovers. Becoming self-confident and more assertive, changing career aspirations, becoming a freelancer. Notice only one of those things really has anything to do with the people around me. It didn't matter. It made them bitter that I was trying, even though I obviously was starting from scratch and had nothing really to brag about in the beginning. But you find people who are a better match to where you are along the journey. Sometimes you outgrow people, in other words.

[–]Rougepellet 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The fuck kind of friend is that? Here you are making clear improvements to your life and he's trying to hold you back. "You already made enough money working at fast food job" really? Cmon.

[–]colmatterson 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Improving yourself is all well and good, but if you're a nerd and you enjoy nerdy things like video games (WoW), then you should continue doing the things you enjoy doing! I don't know your reason(s) completely for taking the pill, and like I said, self-improvement is a grand thing! I also understand that games like WoW can be addictive. I don't know if you quit because you decided it was dominating your life too much (and if so, props to you for recognizing that and changing yourself for it!), but the impression I get from your post is that you're trying to shed your "nerd"-identity.

Do what you love. Being a nerd doesn't mean you can't work out, eat right, focus on school and so on, and even take girls out on dates. Again, I don't know your story, so I don't know how much this applies to you, but it would be a tragic shame for someone to give up the hobbies they truly enjoy just because they were made to feel ashamed of them. I think we can all agree here there isn't anything alpha about that at all.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I completely agree with you: if you're into nerdy things because you're genuinely passionate about them, then you shouldn't give them up because they are your driving life force. They are the thing that makes you wake up in the morning and have a purpose as a man (otherwise, you are valueless).

But for me, I played World of Warcraft so much that I nearly didn't graduate high school on time because I never studied. I'm still into nerdy things (I'm studying computational mathematics, enjoy public speaking and like reading textbooks), but I have found much more joy in actually creating things rather than taking from them. (in this case, programming instead of computer games)

[–]Dbrown15 1 point2 points  (0 children)

People like that fail even their own logic. He says you were happy how you "were", so you should stay that way even if the "new" you make you even happier. People want those around them to remain how they want them to be - It's just that simple.

[–]masnera 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"After reading TRP for a while, you can read between the lines of what everybody is saying to you" this...i am very grateful to TRP because of this.

[–]awe_some_x 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I can personally attest to this. Couple years ago I lost 40 pounds and quit smoking, only to be ridiculed by my best friend and girl I was seeing at the time. They started by mocking my new habits, and eventually attacking my character. They both bowed out of my life, and a couple months later the girl came back around to congratulate me on finishing my first Ironman. I told her to kick rocks. Just remember, when you start taking flak from both sides, it means you are over the target. Good post OP, and keep up the solid work.

[–]ChinmayT2 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Have experienced this myself. I have been on both sides of this. So understand how your friend feels. He doesn't have bad intentions it is just human behavior.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He might be acting out of fear of losing you as a friend. As you get cooler and cooler he might not be able to keep up to you in coolness and feels you are drifting away. He is longing for the security he once had.

I would stop thinking about your self as something negative. Nothing wrong with WoW and porn if thats what you're into. No need to feel bad about it. Changing your interests and getting the results you want is rewarding.

Its probably time to upgrade to a new friend if I were you. I want people who support me not try to hold me back personally.

[–]bleed_red_white_blue 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Very true. Many times they project their own insecurity onto you; when they see you enacting positive change, they are reminded about all the shit they're not taking action on in their own lives.

One important thing that works for me is not to try and convince them or fight them or whatever but try to co opt them into your goal.

When a dude says: don't worry about society or whatever, if it's a good friend be open about why you're changing and that it's tough but you want to do it for yourself not because of others. If the dude is a good friend he will be empathetic and might be able to share some insight to help you.

Overall, I'm just talking mindset here; you don't need to write off your friends/family because they're initially negative. Look for the good in them if they're important to you.

[–]irun247 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Motorcycles aren't expensive. I don't think owning several means anything. I'm pretty sure you could get several for 10k which would be a pretty shitty car.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

How did hou quit the porn addiction?

[–]Dopamine37 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I got porn addiction . First 3 weeks for me I just masturbated without porn every time I had the urge. After that for a week I masturbated once every day. After that I masturbated once every 2 days... For some of us it is a slow process

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

(I gave this exact same response to another comment, but I wanted to make sure you actually got it)

I haven't exactly cut it out completely, but I'm rather in the process of changing the habit. Since you're asking me this and have tried NoFap, you probably have an addictive personality just like me. This is actually a blessing in disguise because you change where you get your dopamine burst from (such as something productive to you).

Unfortunately, according to The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg, "you can't eradicate a habit; you can only change the routine." Like most addictions, it isn't the 'high' that you're after, but rather something else. You have to ask yourself what it actually is that you're craving. Is it human connection? Some general fun? Are you jacking off as a means to escape something? Are you hungry (I have actually fapped because of this)?

Once you have found the "reward" that is driving your habit, you then have to find a way to meet that reward. For me, the thing that was driving my habit is just being bored as Hell. Now, whenever I get an urge, I open up Python and begin coding (I still feel the urge, but it evaporates at an elevated pace).

The next part, which is what I'm currently working on, is to associate sexual pleasure with women and not with your previous "reward." Believe me, you will know when you feel genuine desire because your penis will alert you when a good mate is nearby (remember, you can't negotiate desire). I don't really follow the whole NoFap thing either, but rather follow Mark Manson's advice: masturbate only once a week while thinking about women that you genuinely desire and have interacted with. I "relapsed" today, but I was thinking about a girl who sent me Snapchats of her half-naked and this slightly older girl at my work who called me "babe." The trick is to rewire your desire.

Only be sexual with yourself and anybody when it is actually genuinely flowing. Don't be sexual just because you're bored or lonely.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Beautiful post. Thanks for sharing

[–]Boovs4life 0 points1 point  (0 children)

How did you quit porn? I've improved in many aspects of my life but i can't get myself to quit porn.

[–]sam4837 0 points1 point  (0 children)

[edited] Relatedly, if you have good ideas, don't share them or be very careful with who you do share them.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

This same concept has been posted and explained several times now.

[–]Sean4123 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

"maxed out his physical appearance?"

What the fuck.. .Haha. Life it like an RPG to you guys.

[–][deleted] -5 points-5 points

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[–]Brucebruce90 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Thanks for providing a real life example of the crabs in our life