Red Pill TheoryRule #6a (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by TRP VanguardWhisper

Most of you are familiar with early proto-red pill material from the pre-TRP manosphere. If you aren't, you should be. Go read. Without Rollo Tomassi, the Book of Pook, and so on, we would not be here today. Don't just skim the sidebar. Read it, follow the links, read, lather rinse repeat.

Today, we will be revisiting one of the basics: Iron Rule of Tomassi #6.

Women are incapable of loving men in a way that a man idealizes is possible, in a way he thinks she should be capable of.

Read it, because the devil is in the details:

She’s not incapable of love in the way she defines it, she’s incapable of love as you would have it. She doesn’t lack the capacity for connection and emotional investment, she lacks the capacity for the connection you think would ideally suit you.

Now it's time to refine it from the benefit of our additional five years of understanding:

Iron Rule #6a: If women cannot love you the way you want to be loved, then you want the wrong kind of love.

That's right, it's your fault, not theirs. Women are creatures of emotion and instinct, and what they do precedes from who they are. If you expect women to love you in a way they cannot, you are trying to teach a canary to talk, or a parrot to sing.

How do women love?

There are two kinds of love: Respectful Love, and Protective Love.

Protective love is the love of a superior for an inferior. It is not repelled by weakness or vulnerability. It does not serve, submit, or give up power. It controls, dominates, and protects. It will sacrifice safety and comfort for the benefit of its object, but never dignity. It concerns itself with the welfare of its object, but not with the object's whims or commands.

The Flow of Protective Love is:

Man -> Woman -> Child

Respectful love is the love of an inferior for a superior. It is inspired by strength and self-assurance, and destroyed by weakness or vulnerability. It serves, submits, and gives up power, but does not control, dominate, or protect. It will sacrifice dignity for its object. It concerns itself with the whims or demands, but never the welfare, of its object.

The Flow of Respectful Love is:

Child -> Woman -> Man

Men who want Protective Love from women are broken men. They are idealizing their mothers' love towards them, noticing that it is identical to the love they feel for women, and deciding that's what love is. But such men will never be loved at all until they learn of the existence of Respectful Love, and figure out how to inspire it.

Your woman will never count up the sacrifices you make for her, tally them, mark them, and respond with gratitude, for the same reason that a child will never spontaneously notice the sacrifices of a parent. Monitoring your state, and putting herself in your shoes, would be a Protective act. Parents who have grateful children are not the ones who have made great sacrifices for their children, but the ones who have taught their children to honor and respect them, and show that gratitude.

This is why you must learn to rule your woman, or she will rule you. Because if you love her, she must love you also, else you are her slave. And if you do not rule over her, if you are not superior to her, she will see you as a child in the body of a man, and any affection she ever holds for you will also be blended with contempt.

Women are capable of love. They are capable of self-sacrifice. They are capable of devotion. But to receive it, you must abandon ideals from your mother. You must put away childish things. You must stop expecting women to sympathize with you or be concerned for your safety or welfare. Instead, you must decide for yourself what your needs are, and demand them as a condition of your protection and care.

[–][deleted] 129 points130 points  (83 children)

Part of growing into man hood for me is the switch of love I have for my mother. It was a child looking up to a wonderful woman who raised me alone. Now in years past I can see myself caring for her in ways because I can see how much she sacrificed to keep me happy. This is something I have yet to see many women my age do, they seem to still bicker and fight with their parents, mothers specifically.

I was told always in school that girls mature faster then boys, yet here I am, in my 20's and I have no problem blowing off any date or friend to take my mom to dinner somewhere nice. God knows she has done more for me then any women ever will. All the while some of my close female friends haven't been home to see their family in months, some cases years, and its always self-serving; Laundry, money, car service.

[–][deleted] 89 points90 points  (21 children)

yet here I am, in my 20's and I have no problem blowing off any date or friend to take my mom to dinner somewhere nice.

This. Patrice O'Neal talked once about his priorities, which he arranged like this:

  1. Me
  2. My career
  3. My mom
  4. Girls

Also, always put bros before hoes. Girls come and go, but true friends stay friends for decades, even for life.

[–][deleted] 32 points33 points  (8 children)

My priorities: 1.Me 2.My Money/FutureCareer/Passions 3.School 4.My Mom/Family (although I don't know most of my family) 5.My Bros. ..... 35. Girls.

[–]vagbutters 12 points13 points  (2 children)

I put family and friends as my number one, as cliche as it sounds. While I invest in myself and do everything I can to better myself, I cannot deny the love I have for them. I'd give up everything I have to protect my family. My body can eventually wither away, my money can get seized, or I can die-- none of that shit matters as much as the people I count on who I know will be there for me, always.

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (1 child)

You sound like a very empathetic person. Its great to feel that family and brotherhood bond with others, but very few people have your back 100%. It might be against your personality to be selfish, but you need to be cautious.

[–]vagbutters 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I completely agree; I don't put all my eggs in one basket, so to speak, as I've known that even family can royally piss you off, and I've been betrayed by some friends before. I can understand that some people can see empathy as a weakness but in your day to day life, and retrospectively when you look at your entire life, the people who are close to you indubitably bring you the most happiness. People who care about you are one of the major pillars of everyone's life. I happen to believe that I'd take torture instead of seeing them hurt

[–]ComteDeSaintGermain 1 point2 points  (4 children)

If you can't learn to put someone else before yourself in your priorities, then you haven't gotten the hang of what 'protective love' in the above post is.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Ill never get the hang of that, I don't love bitches. I can put my mom or my bros first sometimes but its rare. My narcissism makes me think of what I get out of it at all times. Kinda hard to put others first when you're so self absorbed.

[–]ComteDeSaintGermain 0 points1 point  (2 children)

well, as long as you don't have any delusions about who, what, and how you are.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

Nah, I'm young but I'm pretty self aware.

[–]ComteDeSaintGermain 2 points3 points  (0 children)

How can you know you're self-aware? ;)

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (5 children)

He put himself first ... really? ... must have been joking

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Nobody will love you more than yourself.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

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[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

He put himself first but died of self-neglect?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

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[–]Endorsed ContributorTheeRyanGrey 38 points39 points  (23 children)

Single mother America has destroyed men as a whole for too long.

Men have no clue how to be men or how to love a woman. It's so destructive

[–][deleted] 24 points25 points  (16 children)

This is pretty much my go to argument for TRP as a whole to non-believers. Men raise adults. Women raise children. Kids need a childhood, fun, memories, bonds, and common sense. But at some point those kids need to grow up, and its a fathers job to ready that child ready for the cruel, unforgiving world. You can't take away any of that equation, which is always best as a team effort.

[–]Endorsed ContributorTheeRyanGrey 20 points21 points  (15 children)

Women are incapable of raising men

There's a reason 90% of black men in jail come from Single mother households aND single father households produce significantly less

[–]ImBloodyAnnoyed 3 points3 points [recovered]

That's definitely a big reason but let's not ignore the completely screwy justice and court system, the prison business, arrest quotas, etc.

[–]yaysmr 8 points9 points  (3 children)

Effect, meet cause.

The black family unit was doing extremely well until the '60s. Which shows some great irony.

[–]ComteDeSaintGermain -1 points0 points  (2 children)

unfortunately, the counter argument "well they wouldn't be in jail if they hadn't committed a crime' still holds a lot of water with a lot of (powerful) people, and likely always will.

[–]GermanDude 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Well, so how is that not true? I don't know ANYone of my friends or acquaintances (including Africans) who even spent so much as a night in a cell, so I am pretty sure being in jail has to do with them having been criminal.

[–]ComteDeSaintGermain 0 points1 point  (0 children)

  1. It is true that most of the time, you cannot go to jail if you don't commit a crime.
  2. MOST of the time.
  3. Where education and support systems are lacking, crime can be both lucrative and perceived as the 'only viable option' for some. They are incorrect, but it is still what they think.
  4. The root problem is something that legislation cannot address, unfortunately (parenting).
  5. Everyone does stuff that's of questionable ethical quality or illegal. It's rather unjust that one group gets targeted for 'gotcha!'s disproportionately. Getting busted for crime isn't unjust. Being targeted/watched all the time to catch you when you slip up, is unjust.

[–]GermanDude 2 points3 points  (5 children)

What are arrest quotas? The US prison system is fucked up, but they can't just put anyone in prison! If someone in the hood won't even learn from all the bad examples around him (that set precedent before him/her), but chose to ignore the consequences and became criminal anyway, whose fault is that?

[–]ImBloodyAnnoyed -1 points0 points  (4 children)


Dude I'm with you on personal responsibility.

But let's be realistic. The biggest statical determinant of whether you'll do some crime is your environment. That does not excuse personal behavior but it shows that the issue is more complex.

If you're an ADA, your career progression depends on how many convictions you can get. So you won't prosecute white people with money for lawyers as vigorously as black ones without. They cut deals even when they may be innocent or only guilty of a lesser crime because they cannot afford to pay for bail and be in jail for long. Which in turn lowers their faith in the justice system. And so on it goes. That's just a small wheel in a larger machine.

As said I agree with personal responsibility but I don't think the discussion should be limited to that.

[–]GermanDude 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Regarding bail I agree it's ridiculous. I guess the system in the US is indeed quite corrupt. In the end though, I'm sure that quotas alone don't fill all those prisons. Quotas and other abuses (eminent domain) serve to generate revenue for cash-strapped police forces.

[–]juliusstreicher 1 point2 points  (1 child)

If you're an ADA, your career progression depends on how many convictions you can get. So you won't prosecute white people with money for lawyers as vigorously as black ones without

Why the love for black convicts? White people without money get just as bad a fucking as black ones do. All whites aren't wealthy industrialists who get pats on the back from cigar chomping power brokers.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (3 children)

If you were a judge and you started noticing a single class of people were committing a disproportionate amount of crime you'd start throwing the book at them too

[–]ImBloodyAnnoyed 1 points1 points [recovered]

Except that if you're a judge, only people already arrested come before you. If one group gets arrested more, it's either because they commit more crimes or it's because the police arrest them more than other groups (maybe because that group has less money to spend on lawyers) or both.

For instance, white and black people consume about the same amount of drugs, but black people get arrested far more frequently.

Source: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2013/06/04/the-blackwhite-marijuana-arrest-gap-in-nine-charts/

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Cop I know says it's easier to pop blacks. They often roll with their squad so you have 3-4 guys in a car. You see s traffic violation pull them over run their ID's. He says with out fail one will pop for a bench warrant or some stupid shit (unpaid tickets, failure to appear, etc). Arrest them. Rest of the black guys start wildin out. More arrests. He looks better.

Pull over a single white guy. Run ID. Give him ticket. He pays the fine. Doesn't get arrested two-three years later when he's pulled over for another violations. Just pays and goes.

[–]ImBloodyAnnoyed -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It's a self-sustaining issue on both sides. Agree.

[–]getRedPill 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Don't blame ONLY women. It is Cultural Marxism as a whole, and feminists as their main branch, who fucked up malehoodness. That combined with white guilt, demoralizing welfare states, people thirsty of power trying to control all aspects of our private lives having any excuse serves them in the moment. As a curious fact, Note there male feminists as much as female feminists, so you know.

[–]Endorsed ContributorTheeRyanGrey 1 point2 points  (2 children)

You're looking at it from a macro perspective, and if you know anything about me, you know i agree with you 100%. The Liberal Elite are running the Brave New World playbook step by step.

[–]getRedPill 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Brave New World AND 1984 playbook. Also, in my first languague, which isn't english, we don't use the "liberal" word to refer to commies, lefties, SJW's, White Knights, Mangina and progr.. regresionists. It's such a good and beutiful concept to waste it like that. The less they care about is liberty. Think about it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

In what what do you mean love a woman?

[–]Endorsed ContributorTheeRyanGrey 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Men are stuck loving women the way they love their moms

That's wrong

[–]koolaid_zombie 34 points35 points  (2 children)

Oh they do mature faster. Meaning they reach maturity quickly then cease to mature any further beyond that point.

Men mature more slowly and tend to continue maturing for the duration of their lives (if they're smart that is).

Thats why you should never get stuck in the rut of thinking you've topped out in any area of your life. There's always room to grow and improve yourself.

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (1 child)

This is why I push people so much to pick up hobbies and find yourself creatively. Since taking on this quest of bettering myself I've found countless hours in my day for guitar, art, reading, and the gym[from cutting porn, videogames, and shit people from my life]. The serious struggle I face every day is making sure I'm doing it for me, because that is such an easy trap to fall into. "What songs would really get a girls attention?" - voice 1 "No! Wrong, learn songs you wanna jam to, make yourself happy, bitches will never care what is played, just that it is played with passion." - voice 2. Men need role models, and daily hobbies, it just sucks that so many men before us have laid siege to generations of pussy from bi-factor of their talent.

[–]bhaknu 4 points5 points  (0 children)

True. Else you'll be the fat acned neckbeard wearing a fedora in a hotel bar in Reno signing karaoke "Some say love, it is a hunger...." as you convulse between leaning back and bending down to make strange hand gestures to horrified ladies as they scurry off the dance floor. I'm sorry if that was someone here. ... trigger warning in post.

[–]WardlyHasted 19 points19 points [recovered]

girls mature faster then boys

Girls go through puberty earlier than boys. So in this sense, girls indeed mature faster than boys.

I think what happened is somewhere down the line, people began to mistake this "physical maturity" for "emotional maturity".

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (17 children)

I will never forget the times maturity was lorded over me like I was the problem, girls pretended that they grew up faster because of their period, make up, and being able to date up in social status, but then it seems like guys just enjoyed more of their childhood then flew past in actual maturity come high school years. Come college years and they might as well be the same 15 y/o girl, just with tits and a drinking habit. Then men are so socially pussy whipped we are borderline lost causes if we aren't innately "hot." I wish I had found TRP at 14. I wish we all had.

[–]juliusstreicher 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No-oh shit. I'd be better off to the Nth power.

[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points  (15 children)

I found it at 15, ill be 17 in September. Then again, I already got girls though. It just affirmed my views on women even more. Boys my age are so lost.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (14 children)

Help those you can, you could have some really interesting field reports at your age dude. The more you can help take TRP the more men there are to be on your side.

[–]TWYW 6 points7 points  (9 children)

Too bad he spends all his days on TRP (mostly shitposting) instead of actually doing stuff.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

He's young, Wisdom comes from mistake of arrogance. Leave the mocking of children to other children.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (7 children)

Not all my days, just before bed. I go to school, come home, do homework, run 2 miles, swim 20 laps, do pushups with dumbbells, do whatever chores I got, and then read.

[–]ChadThundercockII 2 points3 points  (6 children)

Gotta work on that back and glutes, son. They are the basis of every strong and efficient body.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (4 children)

What exercises can I do for glutes/back while i only have dumbbells and a sit up bench? Dips?

I'm just trying to slim down with what I have right now. I'll be going all out once my mom gets our gym membership stuff settled and I'm back at the gym. I do situps too.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Get a pull up bar. Sit-ups are wasted effort until your body fat is low. If the dumbells are heavy there are many good back exercises with them look them up. Also do not neglect shoulder deltoid For glutes there is lots of body weight exercises. One more thing, instead of Sit-ups get an ab wheel. And do it from a standing position not on your knees, that's for bitches

[–]ChadThundercockII 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I second the Ab wheel suggestion bruh. I personally have an Ab wheel, a door pull up( will build one at home), and a heavy bag. For glutes, do hip thrust and squats. For the back, I can't recommend anything beyond the pull up.

Also, try to avoid crunching your abs too much. And avoind sitting too much too.

Keep trucking, young Chad.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (3 children)

I've already tried once or twice, dudes my age are too soft. So Im like fuck it, fuck em. More pussy for me.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

You were once a soft little pussy beta shit too. We have been. What is the point of enjoying the fruits of your labor if your table sits empty. If all men thought like you, then TRP wouldn't exist. Surround yourself with strong men, all the better if you can teach and train them, you'll appear as a king.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Nah, I've never been especially beta. Wasn't alpha either though. Always been on the middle. Never had the empathy neediness or insecurity to be beta, never had the masculinity or power to be alpha. And I agree. IVe redpilled my best friend. I would be interested in forming a squad of redpill alpha bros. However since its risky I wouldn't go around trying to wake up random men. Only close friends.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Just remember if you couldn't explain it to a 6 year old, you don't know it well enough.

[–]juliusstreicher 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is EXACTLY how it was incorporated, in my youth. I never heard anybody talking about male physical maturity, and their mental maturity (boys will be boys!) was always the focus of the phrase "girls mature faster than boys".

[–]Lord_NShYH 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Part of growing into man hood for me is the switch of love I have for my mother.

Yes, this is an important marker. You know the tide is turning when her discipline goes from scary to cute and laughable. Then, once you become a man, you must protect your mother.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thank you for describing it better, I honestly was having the hardest time putting into words how adorable and harmless that wonderful lady is. The only woman I would destroy galaxies for.

[–]NakedAndBehindYou 19 points19 points [recovered]

"Girls mature faster than boys" is just a meme that women like to perpetuate to make themselves feel good.

[–]j4c0p 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Yes , they have to mature faster. In time when they can get pregrant , they have to be prepared to care for child at least on basic level.
In that case it's true, 14-18 years girls are more mature than 14-18yo boys.
The real question is , who stops where.
Its quite common to see women late in her 30 acting like 18.
Even 30 old man is not acting as naive as 18 year old himself.

Maturing is not some achievement to unlock , its an ongoing process.
It's like bringing sprinter to ultramarathon. First 100m doesn't matter.

[–]knowthyself6 4 points4 points [recovered]

Totally agree. Some of the girls in my college are straight mean and awful to their parents...who are paying for their college, sorority, and Camero in the case of one of the girls. And of course this girl in particular is a MASSIVE crazy feminist. Its honestly pretty saddening. If I have kids in this day and age I dread having a daughter with all these influences on her

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The most deadly thing to a feminist, is a successful, smart, woman raised in a red pill home. Honestly, your daughter[s] could be the one that shifts the balance back in place by making her the worthy one of the true alphas. I can yell "fuck feminism" all day and not make a scratch, but if a woman does, the crowd listens. Pack animal mentality.

[–]ImBloodyAnnoyed 4 points4 points [recovered]

True though the mother has to have the wisdom to let that happen.

From some interactions between friends and their families, some mothers of 30+ year olds just won't stop "mothering" them. Which makes it difficult and frustrating.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Part of that is no woman wants to raise a "player" "misogynist" or "fuck boy" which is easily confused with an alpha. A mother teaches you how to respect women, on a very basic primal level (Don't rape, don't hit, etc.) The problem comes in with there being no father to tell that boy why he needs to respect humans on a basic level, then use his own power to get exactly what he wants out of life. These single moms think they are raising the perfect man and will slay. But women don't know what they really want until a man shows them. Thus the beta is born on to ye.

[–]hb8only 1 point2 points  (0 children)

thank god that you didnt have your mother who is a teacher - those mothers are devils

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I was told always in school that girls mature faster then boys

They do, right up until they're 14.

Men continue to mature into our 30's. But no-one mentions this, because Women Are Wonderful.

[–]vagbutters 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Yep; girls in general seem to have much less respect for their parents than men do.

Actually scratch that-- hypergamous sluts have less respect for their parents. I've seen RP women in my life who have given an arm and a leg for their parents' comfort, as it should be in a society that isn't ass-backwards due to feminism

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Children are used to getting things for little or no work. Some men and women grow out of that/get taught otherwise. It grotesquely flamboyant when they don't. cough Feminists cough Millennials cough Beta "nice-guys"

[–]getRedPill 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was told always in school that girls mature faster then boys.

They start fucking, with older men, sooner. Maturing? Uhhm uhhm, no.

[–]NeoreactionSafe 31 points32 points  (0 children)

This is why you must learn to rule your woman, or she will rule you.

Masculine polarity actually means to "love from above" and to rule through rewards and punishments.

As a rule:

If you cannot love from above as a man then do not love... spin Plates to pass the time.

[–]NietzscheExplosion 30 points31 points  (5 children)

This needs a big bump. Some guys on here are missing out on respect.

I have never understood men who want to "own" their women. You never own women, and certainly not now. Ownership is actually what brought on feminism which knows no bounds.

Persuasion is better than force.

Could it be Protective love nowadays = BB? Respect = AF?

Then everything in between?

[–]Endorsed ContributorInvalidity 19 points20 points  (0 children)

There never really was a time where men owned women, but it was almost always the case that women had an absolute that men would be able to fill. They needed a provider and without one, it would almost always guarantee destitution. That was as balanced of a relationship as there ever will be.

Now that women have been relinquished from a need for a provider, men can only satisfy one need: lover. If you are not a lover, you are simply a matter of convenience. Your time with any woman will be short and tumultuous.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (2 children)

Depends on what exactly you mean by 'own', but the relationships that were the smoothest and where the woman seemed happiest were those where there was no question about how was leading the relationship (me). I dominated (not in a brutal way, I took care of them, but they did what I told them), they followed, and no ifs or buts. When it was more 'equal' (read, I went beta), there was more drama, neither of us was happy. 'Persuasion' I am not keen on. Verbal gymnastics are women's sphere of influence, not men. Acta non verba.

[–]NietzscheExplosion 3 points4 points  (1 child)

True. I mean own like property....like no woman except modern real slaves are. Basically the mentality is framed by modern men when his woman cheats on him and he gets mad at the guy for fuking his woman... she was not your woman and never was.

What you are describing is respect. Yes you dominated - via respect.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I see, ok I agree with that.

[–]circlhat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Correct, but who is saying otherwise, she is my women, if a women is attracted to you , she will love the ideal.

If she is not attracted to you she will value her independence more

You have to understand women want to submit to a dominate man, this man is not necessarily you and it never goes away, therefore she needs to submit to your frame

[–]zer165 45 points46 points  (1 child)

Step 1: Change title of post to "Why she doesn't love you" STEP 2: Mods sticky for 3 months (entire summer)

If you're serious about helping blue pill guys, mods will follow above steps. This is written exactly the way a laymen needs to hear the truth. Anything else by mods is screwing around, imo. No more married TRP BS, this post is that good. Clear, concise, and correct.

[–]ElCthuluIncognito 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wholeheartedly agree. I'll add that while this doesn't cover much at all, it covers the absolute core cause of BP. That is, this dynamic is at the origin of almost all BP behavior and mentality in my opinion.

This realization involving 'love' set the gears in motion/was my stepping off point into TRP. Though nearly everything in the sidebar does explore this concept- a solid, direct expose on this deceptively simple concept would serve BP better than anything else I can think of.

[–]RedPillJohnny 16 points17 points  (0 children)

"...she will see you as a child in the body of a man, and any affection she ever holds for you will also be blended with contempt."

...even if you change and became Chad Thundercock to every other woman on the planet, this woman will still see you as lower than her and a chump and will never give you the love and respect you want in the way you want it.

Great post Whisper.

[–]prostaddict 5 points6 points  (1 child)

This opens my eyes wide to my past relationships. 2 of them the women 'wore the pants', and both had lackluster sex and ended with them dumping or cheating on me. The other 2 were times I took full control, and the respect and sex was out of this world - they'd initiate many times and would never say no. Thank you

[–]SwallowRP 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Same here. The moment my relationships showed my "beta" traits (ex. 'opening up' about things) they set their sights on another branch.

All of the sudden the respect stops, and the women feel that you've been lying to them the entire time by them thinking you're alpha.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child)

I may be wrong, but I get the feeling a recent comment of mine triggered this, in which case I am very glad it did. Women are most definitely capable of love, but it has a different basis from a man's love, and the big mistake we make is thinking it is the same. This is why the feminist-inspired 'equal partnership' is such a disaster. Women truly believe they want this, but as in so many things, they have no idea what they really want. If she can't respect you, if she can't admire you, if she can't look up to you, she will stop loving you, it is as simple as that. I have heard women talk about their husbands/boyfriends as 'having another child in the house'. Clearly, the men in those relationships were hooked on the idea of having another mother, but the girl is not the mother. We hear, eg in the theatre shooting in the USA a year or two ago, about men throwing themselves in front of their girlfriends and taking a bullet for them. There are no accounts of women doing this for their boyfriends. But women will do this for their children.

[–]DoesNotMatterAnymore 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If she can't respect you, if she can't admire you, if she can't look up to you, she will stop loving you.

She will eventually fall out of love, but before that (some women!) she will go from Respectful to Protective Love. And that will frustrate the shit out of her. Because she still feels that she loves you, but something is off, something is different. This is when her man stop working on his value, showing weakness (vulnerability is ok, in a small amount, even necessary).

[–]nygeHuston 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Definitely nice to get a refresher of old concepts once in a while. Your title is a little bland though and titles of posts are crucial in much attention they receive. How's "Revisiting the Iron Rules of Tomassi: Rule Number 6"?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Learning to draw hard boundaries is a solid key here with plenty of material around to cultivate this skill. Most people hate themselves so they are incapable of drawing hard boundaries. They hate themselves so much that it doesn't even bother them when someone treats them poorly. They think they deserve it anyway.

If you just learn to draw boundaries with a girl, and enforce them, you are already above everyone else. You know what you expect to allow someone into your life. And you build that frame around yourself. You decide what you allow into your boundaries and you just bail if someone doesn't respect that.

Know yourself. Love yourself. Become your own best friend. Your spend your entire life with only one person. You. You must meet yourself and find your boundaries. Draw a hard line in the sand. Only those who pass over that line are worthy of the time of your best friend. Yourself.

[–]Caucasian-African 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is concise, insightful, and a true evolution of "proto-red pill" knowledge (to borrow Whisper's term).

When I first accepted that a woman is incapable of loving me as I've always wanted and expected to be loved, I was pissed. But I also knew that my anger would eventually subside to be replaced by a calm acceptance and understanding.

This post embodies this acceptance and understanding, and in fact brings me relief.

There is no reason to hate grass for being green, wolves for eating sheep, or women for being women.

[–]Modredpillschool 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I should add that this should come naturally to you as you read the side bar and really take in the red pill. At this point, I don't think I could ever accidentally have "respectful love" for a women. Women are weak. They need protection from everybody including themselves. You can't accidentally respect that if you understand it.

[–]tallwheel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Very good rewording which makes an already solid concept easier to understand. The concept of two different types of love really ties a lot of other RP theories together well too.

[–]TheReformist94 2 points3 points  (0 children)

What this sub fails to realise is that a lot of us aren't asking for maternal love,nor the same love we give,but just some ounce of loyalty and not fucking a man after 14years of marriage and 2/kids with complete lack of remorse.stop trying to spin this utterly shit situation on some positive way.

[–]Cant_Tell_Me_Nothin 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Men who want Protective Love from women are broken men. They are idealizing their mothers' love towards them, noticing that it is identical to the love they feel for women, and deciding that's what love is.

The opposite is also very true. Men who grew up with cold, distant, maybe narcissistic mothers, end up growing up and yearning for the love that mother never gave them. They think other women will fill that void. It doesn't work when that woman is also the woman you want to have sex with.

I grew up this way. I was lucky to end up somewhat good looking which gave me a lot of opportunities with women. But I quickly fucked it up. I wanted women to pat me on my head for my accomplishments. I wanted them to have compassion for me. Sometimes I even wanted them to have pity on me.

I remember a specific moment which was very telling. I was laying in bed with an ex playing around on top of her. For some reason I felt the need to rest my head on her chest and asked her to play with my hair. She physically looked disgusted by it and asked me what I was doing. She pushed me away. This is when I realized that wanting women to love you like a mother is disgusting to them. Literally and Metaphorically speaking, women should be the ones resting their heads on your chest, not the other way around.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I am fucking erect right now, this is fabulous.

[–]Docbear64 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fantastic post it can be very revealing to deconstruct the reality of women from the fantasy but we have to focus on the fact our blue pill conditioning was an infection in our own minds. I appreciate any post that let's me look on young blue pill me and say " You fucked up guy" and this helps me not to steer back to that position not just from a position of frustration and defensiveness but because I and the women I will have in the future deserve better.

[–]endogenic 1 point2 points  (2 children)

What is love? We need a very concrete and accurate definition. Otherwise, there will be no one who can learn, from what you teach, to distinguish love (which makes things change the better) from affection, which originates from attachment (which invariably makes things change for the worse).

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Love is a simply an emotion men feel that feels good because of the dopamine rushes they get from it. It makes them feel obsessed and attached and happy inside so they'll pair bond, mate, and further the species. Love simply works to make us breed, beyond that It has no purpose.

[–]Nicolay77 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ohh do you want accuracy? Then read this first. And understand that love is a very, very overloaded word. No matter how hard you try, you will not find one satisfying definition.

In fact, overloading that word is probably the work of females working on that for centuries, because an overloaded word can be retracted with ease: 'Ohh I didn't mean it that way', 'I love you but only as a friend', etc.

Think about the words the Greek had for love:

  • Storges: from parent to child.
  • Eros: between man and woman.
  • Philias: Between equal peers.
  • Agapes: To elders or superiors such as grandparents and governors.

It seems Sanskrit had even more words (I found about six, but without a suitable source, they are hard to understand in context).

So, you need probably five or more words to replace the overloaded 'love'.

Good luck.

[–]Towerish 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's exactly the kind of stuff I want to see on TRP. A short and concise pack of knowledge in an easily digestible form with great effects on the reader.

It's because of the logical reasoning in this post. As we are creatures of logic we are able to draw the full circle through this post. I'm sure that's what Whisper intended.

I'd totally put this on the sidebar.

[–]ComteDeSaintGermain 1 point2 points  (0 children)

ITT: lots of people not understanding the content of the post

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Betas will always have that never fulfilling fantasy of a girl loving them not matter what and forever which is why they would get married. Little do they know that as soon as the bitch gets bored, they're going to get cheated on and years of "love" the woman had for the man disappear the second Chad sticks his cock in her.

[–]imbweeeeding 2 points3 points  (1 child)

So true, I had this happen to me. It was with a woman that I thought was special and unique, that talked all the time about how cheating is wrong, and prided herself on being different than other women. Well this woman drove me into financial difficulty then BAM! faster than you could believe was out.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well it's good you learned from your experience and are now educating yourself here.

[–]IGoYouStayTwoAutumns 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This was the big breakthrough for me: realizing that the (protective) love I never received from my mother was the very same type of love I spent my life seeking in all my female partners. Mom never loved me / cared for me / nurtured me / supported me but goddamnit, I was gonna find a woman who would! (And we all know how well that strategy works out in the real world...)

I suspect a lot of Recovering Nice Guys can relate.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

A woman can love you completely and she can get very close to the sort of love you want and desire. The problem is the use by date. All love from women has a use by date. Eventually she will want something more and she will forget all of your past and move on.

If you want that sort of love from a woman (or something very close to it) you need to be the boss. She is in your frame - ALWAYS. You are on a journey and she is blessed to be your passenger and assistant. Any other dynamic will fail. She should love you more than you love her. Even with all of the above criteria satisfied, she is a woman, she will get bored or cheat. Female love has a use by date. The best you can hope for is that you fall out of love before she does.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (9 children)

Honestly, I don't believe women are capable of love like you said. I'm not sure what you'd call whatever it is they do, but considering how fickle they are, their weird twisted brand of love doesn't really benefit a man. Pretty worthless. RedPill men should let go of love.

[–]TRP VanguardWhisper[S] 10 points11 points  (5 children)

their weird twisted brand of love doesn't really benefit a man

A woman who feels this kind of love will do whatever you tell her to.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (4 children)

And then fuck you over when she meets a chadlier alpha then you. Or just gets bored. Or meets a dude and you're not around. Sometimes he doesn't have to be more alpha, he just has to not be you. Sure its useful to get sex out of her and other things, but can you not just achieve that with tingles? Or does this love of theirs = Super Oxytocin Tingles?

[–]whitepois0n 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Their love is not something that sustains itself when left unkept, but it is still love they are feeling in the moment. A women will love and worship you in that moment but they are also capable of worshipping another man 2 hours later.

[–]DoesNotMatterAnymore 0 points1 point  (2 children)

And then fuck you over when she meets a chadlier alpha then you. Or just gets bored. Or meets a dude and you're not around.

... and you know what? That's OK! That's a feature not a bug, it's part of the package, same as the tits, vagina and soft skin. Don't be bitter about these things, accept them.

It's like you are an employer and you hire a new guy. You train him, guide him, discipline him. And eventually this guy became a great employee, awesome at what he does. But soon an other company - which is seemingly much better, pay better - found him, offers him a job.

What can you do as an employer in this situation? Nothing. You can demand loyalty, but it's a contract. If they found a better job then your company, you can't do shit about it. If he wants to leave, let him go.

In this situation you can understand Briffault's Law pretty easily. On the workplace we are not better then women. For them we are just a 'job', and we can offer < insert some value here >.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Why invest in something fickle like that tho? I'd say get in, bust a nut, get out. Lose her number.

[–]circlhat 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Everything you say is true and spot on, but we still must understand the concept of best self interests, hypergamy is important to the overall survival of the species but it could be at your expense.

Just because something is natural and intended by nature doesn't mean its in our best interests, it means we should adjust our lives and realize women love differently than what is taught.

We shouldn't put much effort into a women, but rather live our lives and see them as accessories

[–]Senior Contributoradam-l 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I'm not sure what you'd call whatever it is they do

I'm inclined to agree. When people, men and women alike, hear the word "love", they have a certain notion of it. It includes self-sacrifice - and women themselves do think that they are making "sacrifices" for the men they "love". Women might "fall in Respect", as Warren Farrell succinctly puts it, but, if you analyze it, that wouldn't qualify as "love", even for women.

Also, I'm quite skeptical about the idea that there is love from mothers towards their children. Women "love" even their children based on their expectations to receive care and protection from them. The situation with mothers and sons is I think illuminating: the 80% or more of men that are hopelessly locked into beta behavior are overwhelmingly a product of their mothers, owning to their (mothers) fidelity to the female sexual imperative, to which they are more loyal than to their own sons. If you really love your boy, you at fucking least protect him from becoming a beta, you don't raise him to be one - not even unconsciously.


[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I've heard of your book, never read it though. I'll check it out eventually. And yeah, I just don't believe women love. It'd be a useless aspect of their hypergamy. Women don't truly fall in love because love would keep them from utilizing their dual mating hypergamy strategy the best. It would force loyalty on them, which is not something they have. Women fall in lust for alpha genes and tingles, but they don't fall in love.

And yup. Most women raise betas. Single mothers betafy their boys. Another reason men are superior to women, as much as I care for my mom.

[–]Venenarium 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Excellent post! I see a lot of men growing bitter on women here or in the MGTOW section, which is why I think that the iron rule of #6 is not pointed out enough.

If you try to dictate what others should feel like, it's because you are narcissistic and lack empathy.

[–]DoesNotMatterAnymore 0 points1 point  (0 children)

which is why I think that the iron rule of #6 is not pointed out enough.

Imo it's not all about the rules. If you set a rule, there is a 'why' after it.

Galileo Galilei: "The earth is not the center of the universe!"

Is this statement true? Well it is, but if people has a different believe system then yours, and you are unable to EXPLAIN your point of view, no one will give a shit about you.

OP explained the 'why' with Respectful Love, and Protective Love.

[–]nevercomment 0 points1 point  (0 children)

/u/Whisper are there any books or articles you recommend (that aren't sidebarred or mentioned regularly) about respect?

This post reminds me of one you wrote three months ago about parents, I'd like to learn more.

And are these types of love an either/or situation (e.g. if she feels respectful love for you, you must feel protective love for her), or can two people both experience respectful love for each other?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is a really good, insightful post. Seeking protective love could be rephrased as 'being needy' and 'showing weakness'.

[–]1ThumpNuts 0 points1 point  (0 children)

" ...you must decide for yourself what your needs are, and demand them as a condition of your protection and care."


That's what it's all about!

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not agree with flow of respectful love. Respectful love from my point of view doesn't exists. There are two issues: mommy issues for boys and daddy issues for girls. And that's the real flow of respectful love.

[–]Endorsed ContributorDoxasticPoo 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They are idealizing their mothers' love towards them

Well, I think this is part of the issue. Women CAN provide that love. Because mothers do. It just doesn't make sense once you're grown up.

This is why boys rebel and separate from their mothers during their teens. They must learn to love themselves, to give themselves protective love. And their mothers must begin the process of switching from protective to respective love.