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LTRBe careful of being too Alpha, Comfort Tests are far more lethal than Shit-Tests (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by Hakametal

Gonna be a short one brothers. This is gonna be for the guys that are going into LTRs after swallowing the Pill, and a general reminder.
Background
9 months ago, I destroyed a relationship with a woman who was into me big time. At the time, I thought that being confident, indifferent and aloof was what she really wanted, and to a degree that is very much true. But the reality is, that I was scared of Hypergamy and it stopped me from showing my softer side who I was as a person. I thought that if I was always Alpha, she would love me for it, but the reality is that women need to pair bond with you at a point. You need to understand that the more a woman falls for you, the more she wants of you. There is a point where you need to feed her the Beta side of you. Over Dreading your girl will cause her to close up emotionally... and it is far, far harder to open her back up again compared to standing up to a Shit-Test.
You must find a middle-ground. The more your SO is into you, the more you can be emotional to her. However, you over do it and she'll feel like you don't care about her and she'll protect her emotions first over her attraction to you.
This is primarily for LTRs, but the same applies to a Plate that you want to keep around. Women are not inherently sluts, they will want love from Chad. If you don't give it to her, she'll find someone that can.
Have self-respect, but don't be a cold fish to her. While her attraction will grow, you're lack of emotional availability will cause her to resent you. Balance is key for an LTR.
Another note: The difference between a Shit-Test and a Comfort-Test can be incredibly subtle. If she's insecure, it's a Comfort-Test. This is why crazy insecure and BPD women are a yo-yo between Alpha and Beta and are not stable relationships.

[–]NeoreactionSafe 385 points386 points  (76 children)

 

  • Shit Test - Too little masculine polarity.

  • Comfort Test - Too much masculine polarity.

 

This is 100% correct.

A woman wants to quiet her Hamster Wheel.

You achieve optimum attraction and minimum anxiety when she is perfectly set within the extremes.

This idea of "just be an asshole 100% of the time" is great for Chad Thundercock who cannot (or will not) do a LTR but you need Alpha in moderation for the perfection of LTR management.

If this stuff were easy everyone would be getting it.

 

[–]Smigg_e 79 points80 points  (23 children)

Most decent girls will only put up with the "just be an asshole 100% of the time" types of dudes for only so long. Girls with any ounce of self respect will drop you if you're constantly and asshole. Being an ass all the time not only shows you're a shitty person but it also shows you're very insecure about yourself. Not being able to let your guard down shows youre not secure in yourself enough to be vurnerable. Find that middle ground for sure. Know when to be soft and know when to be an ass. There's a time and a place for each.

[–]Buchloe 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Yes. Just killed a relationship this way. Gotta open up and be authentic at some point.

[–]supnat 15 points16 points  (6 children)

I learned this the hard way. Got into a relationship with my high school dream girl by being an asshole (just following TRP really) and i remained a giant dick to her the entire relationship, till she eventually got tired of it and broke up with me. She ended up fucking another douchebag or two like me afterwards, as did I end up fucking other girls.

I apologized for being such an asshole to her and got her to talk to me again. We are hooking up currently, and I wish I could get back with her but I'll take what I can get.

I never ever showed her my nice side or really did anything for her, and I'm paying the consequences!

[–]good_guy_submitter 12 points13 points  (5 children)

Sounds like oneitis. I know that feel bro about the high school dream girl though, hard to let that one to.

[–]supnat 9 points10 points  (4 children)

I completely acknowledge it's oneitis, but she's the first female that I think is legitimately funny (not Amy Schumer funny, actually funny). She also easily has the nicest pair of boobs ive seen in real life or internet, though the rest of her body and face is pretty good as well. It's working for now, but if it doesn't then i will be forced to get over her.

[–]good_guy_submitter 10 points11 points  (2 children)

she's the first female that I think is legitimately funny (not Amy Schumer funny, actually funny). She also easily has the nicest pair of boobs ive seen in real life or internet,

Yeah, definitely oneitis. You're probably the only guy that feels this way about her. I mean most would be willing to bang her it sounds like, but those are some tall words the way you describe her.

[–]Kingspot 6 points7 points  (0 children)

"I think shes funny and has a great body"

yup. classic oneitis.

[–]supnat 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Thank you for confirming what I just said about me having oneitis!

[–]NeoreactionSafe 20 points21 points  (6 children)

The only proof is success.

If you do it wrong then the relationship fails.

Let Truth be the guide.

 

[–]Smigg_e 29 points30 points  (5 children)

The hell are you talking about?

[–]NeoreactionSafe 23 points24 points  (0 children)

Finding the balance is where things are a success.

Example:

If you flaunt the fact you had sex with your girlfriends sister and promise her you will do it again any time you like it might make you believe you are being Alpha, but the odds are she will crack due to lack of comfort and find some other path in life.

 

[–]TheReformist94 7 points8 points  (1 child)

He's a nut these days.tell me about it. The neorxnsafe of 2014 is long gone

[–]IIlllIllIIIllIl 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Man, NXS is speaking truth without much of an ego filter. It is highly refreshing.

[–]JackGetsIt 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Don't mind Neo. He's just the resident Redpill Cabalist.

[–]oh_no_aliens 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I just come here for the popcorn.

[–]circlhat 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Not being able to let your guard down shows youre not secure in yourself enough to be vurnerable.

That is not really what she is asking for, even if she does, being a asshole isn't needed at all.

Remember asshole by definition is something women have redefine to fit their purpose.

Being vulnerable isn't the opposite of being a asshole

[–]Smigg_e 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's not directly the opposite but the two definitely come hand in hand.

[–]TheReformist94 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Again,jumping through hoops

[–]deforms 1 point2 points  (1 child)

This is a huge relief. I'm about 3/4 done with sidebar material and reading here and I was getting the impression that you had to be alpha 100% of the time with no slip ups to make it work with girls. It seemed near impossible.

[–]Smigg_e 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You need to learn when to alpha and when to be softer. It's very important when you do these.

[–]Bendz57 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So true. My LTR and I have a running joke that I'm anywhere from 50-75% of the time an asshole.

[–]spiltnuc 33 points34 points  (30 children)

Can you explain comfort tests? I've never heard of this concept since being introduced to TRP

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorCopperFox3c 37 points38 points  (3 children)

I think the best primer to shit tests vs. comfort tests is the one /u/NightwingTRP wrote on TRP a couple years ago:

The TRP Field Toolkit - Part 3: Shit tests and Comfort tests

[–]spiltnuc 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Thank you. Damn, that just changed my mindset completely. I've been too much of an asshole to girls I actually like and end up losing them because I refuse to act beta since in the past it caused me to lose my girlfriend

[–]JackGetsIt 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I find it interesting how some of the best and most useful posts on redpill that keep getting shared and discussed in perpetuity didn't get that many upvotes upon release.

[–]Tiborik 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Less readers a couple years ago

[–]Omnibrad 104 points105 points  (6 children)

A shit test is when a woman views herself as having higher value than you, and puts you on the spot to prove otherwise.

A comfort test is when a woman views herself as having lower value than you, and puts you on the spot to abandon pursuing women of higher value than her.

I could be wrong but that's my 2 cents.

[–]PissedPajamas 33 points34 points  (2 children)

On the contrary, when she shit tests you she's proding for weaknesses, she's looking for a chink in the armor. If she shit tests you, she sees potential in you. You must prove you're above her with amused mastery, aloofness, and bringing her into your frame

[–]JackGetsIt 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Well said. Both tests come from a place of insecurity. Women operate from a constant state of insecurity. Shit tests are an insecurity that you're not a strong enough man for her requirements. Comfort tests are a projection of insecurity that you are so strong she needs reassurance of commitment. A good LTR is basically a series of occasional comfort tests and zero shit tests. Because it is always better to error on the side of strength.

[–]cashmoney_x 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Or, never have to worry about this shit again. #mgtow

[–]uniquevoid 3 points4 points  (2 children)

That is NOT true, shit tests happen even if she knows you're higher value

I get shit tested every week by low value women

[–]AttackOnKvothe 7 points8 points  (1 child)

That might mean you are not of high SMV to them...

Just my two cent's, tho...

[–]uniquevoid 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm white, muscular, tall, dress well, get good grades, have a car, AMOG and even a muslim 5/10 girl shit tested me in spite of showing clear attraction.

All women shit test

[–]drty_pr 34 points35 points  (1 child)

Shit tests = "you"

Confort tests = "I"

[–]el_Technico 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Underrated comment of the whole thread.

[–]thebrandedman 89 points90 points  (4 children)

Shit Test: Can I break him.

Comfort Test: Is he a rock I can build on, or a rock that will break me.

There's a difference between being resolute and immovable, and being the male version of an ice queen. Don't be the ice queen.

[–]wanderingfun 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Comfort Test: Is he a rock I can build on, or a rock that will break me.

I think of it more as:

Is he a rock that the world will break upon, or a rock that will break me?

A rock she builds on turns a man into a Beta Bucks foundation. A man that the world crashes upon and breaks is the resolute and immovable force she has a choice to follow, but by definition cannot move herself. Benefit of thinking it this way: both Shit and Comfort Tests are subsumed into a single thought. Shit Test is her being part of that world: when she is part of that world crashing in upon him, will it break the man?

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

it's simply testing for alpha or beta behaviours.

[–]NeoreactionSafe 6 points7 points  (3 children)

You must be new.

Check out Rational Male he has good material about it. You should ideally read all of year one and two there. (as a minimum)

Basically you need to hold Frame (which she sees as you being an "asshole") but there is a point where she does need some basic comfort from you.

Never "over reward" with comfort... reward only "sparingly".

The beta tries to comfort a woman too much and that's disgusting to her.

 

[–]spiltnuc 2 points3 points  (2 children)

I read the book, I just never recalled comfort tests

[–]NeoreactionSafe 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Actually this is funny...

If you do a google search on "Comfort Test" and various Red Pill terms you get a variety of sources.

I'm not exactly sure who originated the terms "Shit Test" and "Comfort Test".

Just by searching I know they existed back in 2014.

So how we got here I'm uncertain... for nearly three years it's been a discussion topic.

As with everything Red Pill there is no unified set of "perfect answers".

My advice is to just decide for yourself what you think.

Free will, free thought, free speech.

 

Men love women, women love children, children love puppies

 

Seems to stem from:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_Thomas_Ellis

 

All her work was livened by a dry, dark sense of humour. One of her most famous witticisms is: "There is no reciprocity. Men love women. Women love children. Children love hamsters. Hamsters don't love anyone".

 

...but she could be deriving her quote from another source.

I recall reading a web page about two and a half years ago with this idea.

 

[–]lqtys -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Neither me. I think he talks about the blog.

[–]TheReformist94 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Who gives a fuck? Its dancing to her frame

[–]bigtuna45 4 points5 points  (0 children)

When we arrive at TRP, we mostly learn to fake the alpha. As I progress, I find myself needing to fake beta traits more often.

[–]RedPharaohRising 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Women want to not be in control of their hamster wheel at all. They want to know that whatever sets it spinning, or stopping, they can come to you for either.
You're the rock, you're the person who will throw her up AND catch her. The fun of the adrenalin plus knowing she's got a safety catch.

[–]NeoreactionSafe 5 points6 points  (0 children)

 

Women want to not be in control of their hamster wheel at all.

 

They are blind to it.

So yeah... she wants to be kept in this place between the extremes.

You are her rock... you are the Captain.

 

[–]flyinglime 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Can confirm. Broke many plates this way

[–]yummyluckycharms 2 points3 points  (4 children)

I do agree although I think society makes it very hard for most relationships to survive because of the need for balance is pretty one sided.

Her acceptable boundaries are always in a state of flux - whether its because of her own personal experiences (ie. age/career), her friends influences on her (ie. divorce contagion), and society's influence on her (ie. feminism). The male is constantly trying to calm the hamster because failure to do so means divorce rape (especially troublesome with common law now). Moreover, the female has a win/win situation given to her in a LTR, and so the incentive to please her male partner diminishes greatly over the long term.

Ultimately, its a losing game as seen by the betaization curve and high divorce stats. Many western countries aren't even bothering to record marriage stats anymore (Canada comes to mind)

[–]NeoreactionSafe 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Well and the fact that the politics of globalism is teaching the Blue Pill with the specific goal of destroying the family and giving more power to a central government.

The system is designed so you fail.

But a huge chunk is within your control because you can gain Red Pill awakening and counter some of it.

However... never assume it's easy... it's darn near impossible if you aren't extremely aware of how this works.

 

[–]thescaper1997 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Yeah realistically i could care less if a girl leaves me cause im too alpha or w/e bullshit. Another mans trash is another mans treasure tho. This shit has became pretty cringe worthy with all these tactics etc. Guys think if they just get this rite balance she'll stay loyal for ever. All the cards are stacked against your relationship/marriage lasting forever and you actually being happy even if it does last.

[–]NeoreactionSafe 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The LTR is not for everyone.

Chad Thundercock simplifies his life and just "doesn't give a fuck" and we like that about him.

When you get into the LTR you are going from Checkers to Chess... the level of Game is much higher.

Checkers is just life made easier.

 

[–]RedPill115 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Moreover, the female has a win/win situation given to her in a LTR, and so the incentive to please her male partner diminishes greatly over the long term.

It's not really true, but it's pushed because women are more profitable if they're not staying at home. This discusses in Japan, though behind a curtain of caring, feelings, and the old female culture standy of "we're trying to help":
https://vimeo.com/80542212#t=46:29

Are we using the existing population to it's fullest potential? So for instance, half the population is women. Are japanese women being fully utilized and maximized in terms of contributing to the economy? And I think the answer is right now "no". It's roughly 65%-70% according to government statistics of japanese mothers drop out of the workforce after having their first child. That's alarmingly high. The good news with this new government that Japan has under prime minister Abe is that he's elevated this issue of female participation in the workforce to the national level.

In reality as women get older they get less attractive. Then they get baggage with kids and an ex-husband, their attractiveness drops as well. Her best strategy would be to choose a guy who's going to remain interested and invested as she gets older, and keep him happy.

As a society it's pushed that this is "offensive" to talk about and constantly have the opposite idea jammed down our throats - that her age doesn't matter, that there's always more worthwhile guys out there for her, etc. It's nut pushed because of altruism, it's pushed because divorced or unmarried women are more profitable. They have to return to the workforce to pay for their own place, where they pay taxes and consume more consumables, etc.

[–]circlhat 2 points3 points  (1 child)

False, as your goal is to be yourself and not achieve some ultimate polarity.

Shit Test = That's on her Comfort Test = That's on her

your goal is to act as you wish

[–]NeoreactionSafe 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Again... Chad Thundercock isn't a leader type.

Can a Captain indulge his random urges?

Well, sometimes.... but often he has to be the leader and command over others requires certain things that the Chad Thundercock type doesn't have.

Chad Thundercock fucks then runs away to find new sluts to bang.

This is his worldview.

Chad never sticks around for a LTR. (so he never encounters these tests)

 

[–]newguy57 points points [recovered]

Fuck this shit man all this time Ive been shitting women because of this stupid fucking sub and now you want me to be a pussy. Fuck this shit. Ill just be a normal person from now on.

[–]NeoreactionSafe 6 points7 points  (0 children)

No, you can be Chad Thundercock and not do LTRs.

Just realize who you want to be... Chad or not Chad.

Chad doesn't do relationships... period !!!

 

[–]The_Best_01 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, there are a lot of contradictory posts on this sub. I don't know what to fucking do anymore.

[–]tardisgroaning 0 points1 point  (1 child)

You should maybe write a post about this.

It sounds like a lot of the sub have never heard of "comfort tests". The only time I've heard it mentioned is on MRP.

In fact, having lurked for three years, even I assumed that comfort tests weren't part of TRP.

I may be someone who doesn't always agree with you, but perhaps you've stumbled across an opportunity to enlighten a few folk here with a new OP.

Food for thought, at least.

[–]NeoreactionSafe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Let me say that for 99% of guys these days the Comfort Test won't happen.

I'll give you an example...

At one time I had a virgin girlfriend. Yep, I literally popped her cherry and I kind of surprised her in the way I did it. Anyway, that turned into a three year relationship that wasn't half bad.

But I had lost my passion for her. Actually it was more like I finally got over the previous girlfriend which was high drama and painful.

So my eyes were wandering and she knew it.

She wanted marriage. I wanted to fuck around but felt trapped. So she had no Comfort in our future and frankly I didn't either. It was like the relationship had died spiritually, but the funny thing is the sex was good right up to the end. I was enjoying her sexually but was greedy for more and better and more exciting sex.

Women need to feel the man is both strong and also pointed towards her.

Chad Thundercock is strong but will never marry.

So in effect I was Chad Thundercock in that one.

 

[–]TheReformist94 0 points1 point  (1 child)

At the end of the day,as I said before balancing the AFBB,you're all just jumping through hoops to satisfy your LTRs whims til she has satisfied her hypergamy/serial monogamy.I.e. her frame. At the end of the day,whilst you're dancing like a little monkey, aside from the fact that you've accepted she's not yours but your turn,like the linear serial cuck you are,what are you getting out of the relationship,seeing as true love and a shred of loyalty are out of the eqn?

[–]NeoreactionSafe 3 points4 points  (0 children)

 

You must be new.

 

...aside from the fact that you've accepted she's not yours but your turn

 

That's the mantra for Chad Thundercock.

You see Chad Thundercock is the kind of guy that does not do LTRs.

If you are describing the LTR you need a different (Family Alpha type) skillset.

Chad Thundercock will never, never, never do a LTR. (that's his definition)

 

[–]Senior ContributorNightwingTRP 49 points50 points  (8 children)

Plate management isn't a topic we deal with very often. However I do think it should be discussed more as a precursor to whether or not you're ready for an LTR. If your plates are smashing every month and you're fine with that... great. If your plates are smashing every month and you're looking for an LTR, you've got a whole bunch of work to do.

A simple way to look at this problem is just see whether her problem is reasonable or not. If it's reasonable then it's probably a comfort test, after all, shit tests are not reasonable or realistic. They're just nonsense that breaks the rapport to see how you respond. They should be treated as the nonsense they are. Comfort tests tend to be looking for something from you. This is a very clear difference that you'll likely be able to pick up on instinctively.

Remember, taking on an LTR is similar to adopting a child. You've just made yourself responsible for all the feelings and behaviours of the chick you're dating. She expects you to lead her and make her happy. This workload is the downside to an LTR. But if you get good enough at it, then it's less of a workload and she will consistently put in effort too that will reward you. For shit/comfort tests in general: dismiss/mock her nonsense and solve her problems. That's what you've signed up for long-term.

[–][deleted] 34 points35 points  (0 children)

Also, shit tests tend to be 'you' and comfort tests tend to be 'I' is a solid ROT.

You're an asshole = shit test

I don't know if I can handle you going out all the time = comfort

[–]AlphaTransition 4 points5 points  (0 children)

A simple way to look at this problem is just see whether her problem is reasonable or not. If it's reasonable then it's probably a comfort test, after all, shit tests are not reasonable or realistic.

Thanks. This is a takeaway I missed in prior reading.

[–]Buchloe 5 points6 points  (0 children)

"Practical female psychology" Is a good book, available in free PDF online. It's entirely for rp minded men who actually do care about their women and want to successfully manage relationships with relative ease without sacrificing their person mission.

[–]melb22 11 points12 points  (4 children)

But don't try to solve her problems intellectually. The feedback I've gotten from women is that they are looking for a man who can make them feel better simply by putting a hand on their shoulder and saying something reassuring in a gravelly masculine voice, or maybe enfolding them physically and saying something reassuring.

[–]Senior ContributorNightwingTRP 24 points25 points  (3 children)

You're still asking women for their opinions on how to deal with women? I'm not remotely surprised that she's told you "be a good little emotional tampon."

When I say solve her problems, I mean if she comes whinging that she's failing to do something then go do it for her. Don't try to get her to solve her own problems. If she comes to you with a problem that you can't directly solve quickly then that's a case where she simply wants attention. All of these sorts of things are leadership tests. i.e she wants you to demonstrate you're leading everything in a direction that makes her feel good/safe/secure/attracted.

Be irritated by stupid whining over nothing otherwise you're setting yourself up for a lot of it. If she wants your attention then she'd better be doing something good. If she brings you a small problem like lifting/moving something heavy, then she owes you reward for your efforts and you command her to do whatever you feel like as reward. Drinks, food, or sex. Doesn't matter. Just so long as you're showing leadership and dominance. You're the prized rock. Show that and she should already know you'll expect her to behave like you are that craved prize.

[–]melb22 5 points6 points  (2 children)

she wants you to demonstrate you're leading everything in a direction that makes her feel good/safe/secure/attracted.

I saw a video of a man who dealt with his wife wanting emotional comforting by lifting her onto a bench and enfolding her - it seemed to work well - that to me isn't being an emotional tampon - isn't this a way of making her feel safe/secure without buying into whatever she is verbalising?

I have to confess I'm not sure about some of this, so I do take seriously what you suggest in your last paragraph.

[–]Senior ContributorNightwingTRP 8 points9 points  (1 child)

That can work. The key is avoiding the sort of beta talking about everything to make her feel better. Trying to be reassuring for the sake of being reassuring does work... but I don't recommend it. Though something like "you're stressing over nothing." being combined with some physical comfort provides stability that she can just indulge her emotions safely.

It's really annoying when chicks do that though so I wouldn't recommend encouraging it. Ensure she knows that this behaviour is fucking stupid and you'd be happier if she got her emotions under control and did not regularly go on a feels rollercoaster that you then have to manage. (Yet still demonstrating you can take it in stride.)

Mock and deride the intellectual aspect to the behaviour... i.e it's all feels nonsense that is silly/childish and she should be better than that. While providing physical comfort/attention. Remember that the medium is the message. So the subtext going on it provision of comfort "this is easy, I can do this... and it's irritating. I deserve a better class of woman."

I saw a video of a man who dealt with his wife wanting emotional comforting by lifting her onto a bench and enfolding her - it seemed to work well - that to me isn't being an emotional tampon

It is to me if he's having to do it regularly to quiet down her emotional neediness. There is a fine line between responding to her needs and her needs becoming the driver of your behaviour. You're there to be the rock she can rest on IF she needs to. If she needs to do this very regularly then it's turned from you responding to her needs, to her needs driving you around.

Just like if a chick shit tests you too much you should become more and more mocking and less attentive... the subtext has to be that you're not going to tolerate her nonsense indefinitely. Same goes for comfort tests. While you can identify and deal with it... you're not some emotional tampon at her beck and call for every little weepy feel.

[–]melb22 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks for expanding on this.

[–]lqtys 107 points108 points  (5 children)

Yeah but remember:

ALWAYS SHOW YOUR BETA SIDE AS A PRICE FOR HER GOOD BEHAVIOR. Not indiscriminately.

[–][deleted] 49 points50 points  (3 children)

This is why I thoroughly believe in aftercare. You want to get inside a chick's head? Hold her after sex but few times else. Women will eat a mountain of shit for a spoonful of sugar.

[–]DeterBenchPress 51 points52 points  (2 children)

Sex with you is a mountain of shit? Damn man, super sorry ;)

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

If you can get a woman to agree to you shitting on her chest, you basically own her.

[–]Arcturus_ 35 points36 points  (2 children)

This is my view on TRP and LTR's.

Make her a part of your world, invite her in - but don't make her your entire reason for living.

Be independent, have hobbies, but don't rely on her for anything. The idea should be if she leaves you tomorrow it'll suck for a couple days but you'll have the tools to move on quick and not let it drag you down. Talk to her about your day but don't bitch and complain about your problems. Be alpha in the sense that you're still applying TRP principles and being the best version of yourself that you can be, but realize that you're human too and we all crave human connection. Simply put, don't be a robot. Find the balance, and it may be difficult for you to do, it may take a while and that's fine.

You need to know women base what they say, think, and do on emotions. How they feel right now is how they're going to act towards you. Keep her wet by being an alpha, but keep her close by being human.

[–]nutnics 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Spot on and inviolable words of wisdom here. Being human might make her panties wet too, women are not robots either after all.

[–]AttackOnKvothe 2 points3 points  (0 children)

don't be a robot

damn, /r9k/ are gonna miss me then. Don't know if I can pull this through.

[–]tailz69 17 points18 points  (0 children)

Ya i lost one similar to this. Beginning of relationship was more alpha tendencies never showed a soft side ..

Got into relationship still never showed her much but started to open up more but it was a little too late. Also maybe went too far on the other end and it maybe shocked her too much as she didn't know who the hell I was. The alpha or the beta. The balance was hard to find because I haven't liked someone for awhile so I couldn't calibrate it properly. A ton of shit tests which were failed mostly because they were pretty big ones as she was likely unsure what was going on.

I also noticed I haven't been in a relationship for awhile because I never show the soft side. The reason tho is because I genuinely dislike most girls personalities and it takes a chick who's hot 9-10 and a good personality to lock me in. So apparently I need to up my SMV to get more of these types of girls as apparently it's rare given the amount of time I've been single/ not giving a fuck

[–]trpraducu 13 points14 points  (0 children)

True, but remember that after the "Comfort Test" comes the "Beta Cuck Test".
Give a woman comfort, but after 2-3 tests in a row say NO, because you're no longer in comfort test territory but in relationship status/dynamics/limit testing territory.

[–][deleted] 24 points25 points  (0 children)

Comfort tests ARE NOT about showing sensitivity, or your sensitive side.

Comfort tests are about providing comfort and security in your commitment to a relationship.

Not acting distant to someone you're in a relationship with should be a no brainer. The best defense against hypergamy is options and abundance. That, and I guarantee 99% of the guys in here are not in a place of offering too many alpha behaviours, this advice isn't advice, it's you coming to terms with plowing through your life without any calibration.

[–][deleted] 24 points25 points  (0 children)

This is what changed my view of TRP... and I think for the better.

I took everything here so literally and I was impressionable after dating a BPD. Well, along comes a beautiful, shy girl that would make a great LTR.

The relationship eventually fell apart from too much dread and my lack of emotional intimacy. Yes, I was scared of getting taken advantage of and it cost me a possibly good relationship.

For those new here, a little advice: Take what you read with a grain of salt. Pick and chose what applies to you and fits into your way of existing. Try not to get wrapped up in some of the nonsense that gets thrown around here.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMeat-on-the-table 26 points27 points  (4 children)

A lot of people are too invested in the dichotomy of Alpha and Beta--so much so that they believe that if a Beta does something, then the Alpha's action is whatever is diametrically opposed to that. This often results in some guys becoming insufferable hard-asses who think any show of emotion or humanity is Beta and will send her attraction plummeting.

The truth is, an Alpha isn't afraid of his emotions. He just doesn't let them inform the way he interacts with the world in general, and women in particular. He acknowledges that he has a softer side, and realises that this makes him more of a human and a man, not less so.

The more your SO is into you, the more you can be emotional to her.

Plainly, no. She can know that you have emotions, but you don't have to show her your emotions. That's how you activate her hypergamy, because an excessive show of emotions indicates that your emotions are in control of you, rather than the other way around. This is also known as being Beta. Note then, that the difference between the Alpha and the Beta isn't if they have emotions;it's how they deal with and deploy their emotions.

[–]1empatheticapathetic 6 points7 points  (1 child)

If a woman is being a cunt and I want to next her, isn't that based on how I feel about her actions? Surely I'm making decisions based on my emotions here.

[–]RP15 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Not if it's based on a reasonable criteria.

Even if she's otherwise perfect but cheats, publicly disrespects you, flakes all the time, never has sex with you, stops having sex with you, or generally acts in a way you've deemed unacceptable, it is not an emotional decision to next her.

If you next her because of a fleeting emotion she made you feel, you probably failed a shit test or took her nonsense too seriously. That's making an emotional decision and would be beta.

This is actually why she shit tests - to weed out betas. If she can make you feel angry over something inconsequential to the point where you'd leave her, you are not a strong enough leader. Additionally, if you allow for behaviors that warrant a nexting, you are too beta.

All of this is about balance.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'd like to add that there are plenty of actions that are only alpha or beta based on the context. You can do something that is very alpha, but if you change the context and do the exact same thing, it would be considered very beta.

[–]Omnibrad 17 points18 points  (2 children)

Children are best raised by both biological parents in a low conflict marriage. Any deviation from this is a deviation from what is best for the child. Women instinctively know this, which is why for a LTR they will be selective about the low conflict part.

Women are perfectly cool with raising the level of conflict to test you, but if she tests you too much then you will next her. This street goes both ways.

[–]jt3611 11 points12 points  (1 child)

This is so true. My LTR was raised by both parents in a happy marriage. Her dad left once she was grown but when her younger sister was just becoming a teen. Guess which one has reasonable expectations and which one is a fucking nightmare.

[–]melb22 7 points8 points  (0 children)

The single biggest predictor of divorce is if a woman experienced parental divorce whilst still a child.

[–]MrBowlfish 29 points30 points  (7 children)

Some RP men seem to forget that sexual competition for attractive women is INTENSE. If you are not a grown up about all this and learn to balance, she will next your ass. You can be Chad level 9 but if you are a brutal dictator with no emotions she will eventually wear out her heart, listen to her friends, and replace you with Chad level 8 who will treat her with a little more dignity. There's always another guy with good looks and good game knocking at her door.

[–]Htowngetdown 16 points17 points  (6 children)

If you're Chad level 9, who cares if this girl nexts you?

[–]user_none 8 points9 points  (4 children)

I'd think that Chad level 9 whom gets the next, next, next treatment gets old after a while.

[–]Htowngetdown 6 points7 points  (3 children)

This makes sense. I'm only 24, so I guess I don't have the full perspective yet.

[–]SetConsumes 11 points12 points  (2 children)

Definitely met Chads that just want a meaningful relationship and kids and are tired of spinning plates. Most of them were at least 28.

[–]antariusz 11 points12 points  (1 child)

I'm 34. The problem is not that I'm tired of spinning plates, the problem is that you begin to recognize that there is no point to having a LTR. 90% of women aren't even worthy of more than a few months of your time. Just dropped a 21 year old I'd dated for a year and a half because of lies, manipulations, and other factors. Not even a month later have a 18 year old telling me that she loves me, and I've fucked, I think, 5 other women in the same time frame. I'll probably try to make things work with this 18 year old. She seems like a decent girl... But they all seem like decent girls in the beginning, when they want you to like them.

I want to find a unicorn, there are no unicorns. The more women you are with, the more you will begin to identify their flaws quickly and easily. It's kinda like the more sex you have with more women, the easier you can find the clit, the quicker you'll be able to stimulate her to orgams via finger, tongue, or penis... and that's just experience. The more women you've plated, the quicker you'll be able to identify each girl's problems.

LTRs are simply for girls that you are able to live with their problems for a while. Eventually other problems emerge... That's when you drop them and move on, creating more alpha widows.

[–]SetConsumes 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I get it. I really do. I don't believe in unicorns, but some women are more unicorn like than others.

Which is as good as it gets. I managed to get lucky and find a virgin catholic girl that comes from a family with old school masculine men that's exactly my type physically and 90% my type mentally. It's easy being in this LTR.

But she's still AWALT and if I don't maintain attraction I know she'll just find some other dude cause she won't be able to help herself, no amount of education and brains matter. I fully realize too, part of why she's so eager to please me is because it helps her keep me immensely, it's manipulative and she is a seduction machine, but my cock and belly enjoy it nonetheless. Mutually beneficial relationship, what else can I ask for?

Honestly, the hardest part for me is not the LTR rather it's not cheating on her. I love women, especially really feminine and alive ones.

[–]Endorsed ContributorAuvergnat 13 points14 points  (0 children)

By coincidence, I just happen to be discussing this subject on an asktrp thread (asktrp/comments/5p3xru/girlfriend_kept_causing_drama_i_set_a_boundary/)

I'm trying to figure out if the story related by OP was a comfort test. What do people think?

Here's an excerpt of on of my comments there:

How do you define shit test and comfort test in the first place? I see them both as "challenging" (that's what "test" stands for) a man's "boundaries/mindset/opinion/frame/whatever". The difference being in their origin and purpose: the shit test originates from a position of assumed strength and has the purpose of imposing her Frame on him (eg "I know you don't like me going clubbing, but I'll go anyway. And I'll manipulate you into accepting it. Watcha gonna do about it??"), while a comfort test originates from a position of insecurity/weakness and has the purpose of requesting changing his Frame to assuage her anxiety (eg "I know you don't like me crying for no reason, but I really need to talk about my feelings right now. Please..."). I see shit tests characterized by defiance and comfort tests by fear.

Given that women desire dropping their Frame to submit to the stronger Frame of a strong man, if a man reacts to a test by re-establishing his Frame, TRP theory predicts she will gladly accept this re-establishment and feel more attracted to him. After all, when TRP teaches men to "pass shit tests", the expected reaction is not tears, tantrum & drama, but compliance and attraction. What I am coming at is that here OP clearly responded by re-establishing and enforcing his Frame. If she had been shit testing him, this would have constituted "passing" and she would have shut up and gotten horny. Instead, she kept on pushing and pushing and then crying and throwing a tantrum and later cried rivers supplicating him not to leave her. To me, that fits all my definition of comfort testing..

EDIT BONUS: link to a relevant post and a comment of mine, to further explain my views on the topic: http://archive.is/KtdnY

[–]spiltnuc 6 points7 points  (0 children)

At some point it's necessary to show some beta if you actually are interested in the female for more than sex. This whole concept just changed my perspective

[–]twofones 3 points4 points  (0 children)

This is where Captain-First Mate becomes important.

It is an analog of Dread.

It keeps the woman balanced at second place but while keeping things interesting yet sustainable.

Good for moderate to long term relationships when both parties have a certain amount of investment.

Can't link within the subreddit here but there are a few good posts a while back

comments/33vkaj/captain_vs_firstmate/

comments/4771ti/day_one_of_your_captain_first_mate_dynamic/

(edit: grammar)

[–]ghee99 4 points5 points  (2 children)

the 2 to 1 rule applies in a lot of these sitations

in other words, just make sure that she displays affection, says something romantic at least 2 times, for every 1 similar thing that you do for her.

if she seems like she's taking your romantic gestures for granted, you can adjust the ratio to 3 to 1 or even 4 to 1.

ideally, Yes...you can be nice to her, just do not ever be the one who's being the nicest, or the MOST romantic. And always know that she has to work for it, and earn your affection/romantic side by her being 2 to 3 times are romantic and affectionate to you!

and if you are ever in doubt, just think of her as a fat chick that you only bang when you're super horny. And then think, what would i do if it was in regard to a fat chick?

if the answer is nothing, or i'd just ignore her, do that. if the answer is that i would reply to her text (but not talk too long to her) then do that. Also, if a fat chick was trying to make me jealous, would i care? or start telling her not to do what she was doing? Nope, I'd just ignore it totally, and not really even care at all.

So, when you are feeling like you might be being too nice to your SO, just use the "what would i do if she was a fat chick?" test, and thats usually the best way to proceed.

[–]itsthegreek 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Wow the fat girl tip is extremely smart. I can't think of anytime I behave more alpha than I am once I've finished banging a low smv hoe and want to get on with my day.

[–]ghee99 4 points5 points  (0 children)

yes,

thinking of a hot chick as if she were a fattie, and treating her the same way, is the best shortcut to acting Alpha.

I think with a lot of guys, they think they need to neg and insult a good looking chick, but that's not quite right.

For example, with a fat chick that you fuck, you never say anything insulting to her directly. For example, you never say "you're gross" (even if you are thinking it). You always act polite, its just that your mind is usually somewhere else, and she never has your full attention, and even when you do reply, its usually not right away, and even then its usually half-heartedly. Plus, with a fat chick, you tend to be more relaxed, as you don't really care that much whether you get laid with her (I mean, with a fat chick that you fuck, you do wanna get laid, but you are not that into it, so you don't care that much and act accordingly).

Hot chicks are so used to getting immediate replies, and full attention from guys, so treating a hot chick politely, but somewhat disinterested and delayed (but never outright rude) tends to be the best approach.

There are times when i have been with a hot chick, and I actually momentarily visualize being with a fat chick, just so that i can re-frame things, and know what to do.

Anyway... thats whats worked for me, at least. Thanks for your kind words!

[–]brinkleybuzz 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Women love to compete for high value men but are miserable when they lose. One of the keys to a successful LTR is to subtly remind her that she always has to compete for your commitment (dread game) while assuring her that she's leading in the competition. Notice that I said "leading", because if she thinks she won she'll start looking for someone else to compete for.

[–]StinkyDogFarts 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Playing games is a great way to bed dullards. That's why this stuff works. If you are sticking around, you are breaking the rules you should have plates spinning. That said, if you stick around by choice and so does she, no more games. You are entering a partnership, not playing a game, so choose wisely.

[–]__ROOSTER__ 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It comes from a basic redpill misunderstanding of what Alpha means. PUA thought alpha means: gets pussy; when thats a overly simplistic paradigm

Leaders get pussy, and people that have learned to hack chicks get pussy, being a hacker isn't Alpha, its acting.

[–]ikigaiaru 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'm gonna piss a lot of people off by saying this.

Many people (prob over 50%) use TRP as a psychological defense mechanism to stop them from being emotionally vulnerable. They cling to the ideology to protect them from having deep relationships.

The most alpha thing you can do is be HUMAN, and be honest. That means sometimes showing "beta" qualities. BUT, it must be done from a place of strength, understanding, masculinity, and abundance of life. Being alpha is being unapologetic for oneself and their viewpoints. Don't be afraid of your viewpoint including comfort qualities, just do it from a strong frame.

[–]bigredchewinggum 5 points6 points  (0 children)

IMO, the best solution to this type of stuff.. Shit tests and comfort tests is to simply be yourself.

There's nothing wrong with catching feels and wanting an LTR with a woman. However, there's something wrong with being desperate about it too. There's nothing wrong with "being alpha", acting aloof, and spinning multiple plates, however there's something wrong with it if you're doing it out of fear of catching feels, getting cheated on, or getting "cuck'd". A lot of people here, including myself seem to have a very sensitive ego about the idea of breaking up with a girl or her dumping you when you shouldn't. Everyone gets dumped/rejected at some point. As you get older though, this becomes a lot easier to accept and less dramatic.

Why not enter an LTR with a chick if you like hanging out with her and having sex? If it doesn't work you can both just break up. Sure there might be drama and headaches, but those are going to exist everywhere else in your life anyway so you might as well get used to dealing with them and learn to treat/solve them effectively.

Recently, I've been seeing a girl. At first, I figured it was just a hook up and she'd probably lose interest after a few weeks like what usually happens. I'm at a point in my life where I legit do not give a fuck if I lose a girl or not. I'm a pretty good looking guy, lift, slaying at university, living in a major city and generally just enjoying my 20s. Genuinely happy for the first time in my life in a long ass time.

Hungout with my plate one night and she didn't want to fuck.. Or even kiss. Literally did not phase me at all. We just kept hanging out having a good time. She's fun to be around so I'm like "why the fuck not be just friends? we like the same tv shows and music, smoke weed together.. She'd make a good friend".

Turns out she was "testing me" (her words not mine.. I didn't even know it was a test) to see how we were together just hanging out. I guess I passed cause she's been pining to be my girlfriend all week. However I need to give it some more time before I can give a confident yes or no.. Only known her for a month.

Shit tests and comfort tests are silly and require way too much thought. Simply just focus on being a high value guy (lift, get educated, slay at your career, lead a fun interesting life) and everything else works itself out. Be zen about it and just ride the wave. If you think about falling off your surfboard you probably will.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If she's on her period or about to be it's a comfort test. If she isn't then it's a shit test. It isn't rocket science. Even passing comfort tests doesn't mean "showing your soft side". You did the right thing. Sometimes things just don't work out or maybe she had you pegged as a provider and part of you is sad because you were willing to be that provider, because you liked her that much.

The point of too much dread is just when it exceeds your SMV. It would be useful to know more details.

[–]doctorcoolpop 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This shows why manipulative strategies don't work in the long run .. you have to be yourself

[–]xXSoroxXx 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Can confirm. Went 95% dread with 5% beta. Was a roller coaster of highs and lows with the girl ending up never wanting to see me again haha.

[–]Romyyy99 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Good post. This is something I've always felt it was wrong with this community. Women with an ounce of self-respect won't put up with your Alpha shit if you already establishes you're an alpha in beginning. The balance is key in everything.

[–]radioactivities9 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That happened to me with a guy I genuinely loved. He never accepted that a woman would still love (and desire) him if he showed weakness. They were weaknesses in his mind and not mine. Sometimes you have to let your guard down and believe, trust the other person. Otherwise RedPill ideas become solipsism too. This is what causes both men and women to treat each other poorly, even if only from emotional neglect.

It's better to focus on how the other person wants to be loved and satisfying that how you can. If you think doing that for someone will degrade you, they shouldn't be your main squeeze.

[–]LymanRP 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I couldn't agree more, and this is something I've struggled with since becoming RP-aware in my marriage.

It can be tough distinguishing between the two. Too much alpha and too much dread can have the effect of pushing your girl away, especially if you're making a rapid transition from Beta to Alpha at home.

[–]melb22 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is why crazy insecure and BPD women are a yo-yo between Alpha and Beta and are not stable relationships.

Was true for me - BPD ex-wife wanted both absolute beta and absolute alpha at the same time - no way anyone could meet these psychological needs.

[–]TheSupr3m3Justic3 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Balance. As with all things in life.

[–]The_M0rning_Star 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I like how afraid of being a beta people are. What the fuck do you think happens when an alpha steps down? The best beta becomes the new alpha. Being beta isn't bad; it doesn't mean you're weak.

[–]RP15 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There is s difference between being beta to more powerful men and being beta to a woman.

Any man worth a sexual relationship sees himself as higher than all women in most ways and children in all ways. That is a major part of masculinity and it's why TRP is not merely a self improvement group. This is a group that makes men, and the key to that realization is recognition that you are more capable, rational, and stronger than women and children.

That power comes with the responsibility to be strong and never allow emotions to drive decisions. It also means you must lead women and children and take no shit from them while providing strength and comfort in their lives.

Being a helpful, supplicant beta to a woman is bad because it means you e given a woman/child decision making power over your life. You've surrendered your strength and power for the promise of pussy. Being beta (deferential, assisting, loyal) to a powerful man is just make hierarchy and success in those beta roles is how you inherit the alphas kingdom as you describe.

[–]Goodava 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I said it a long time ago and got downvoted into oblivion.

[–]DruidFlyAwayToday 1 point2 points  (0 children)

What if you`re Gengis Khan? Too Alpha?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I intentionally fail comfort tests. I am however, in a stage of my life where I don't want girls to get emotionally attached to me, or me to them.

[–]hahayeahthatscool 1 point2 points  (1 child)

If the advice for LTRs always ends up as "be more of a bitch" I'm inclined to think LTRs are inherently beta

[–]Nottonystark69 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We have literally gone full circle with this shit. This might as well be a relationship subreddit. Taking the red pill means no LTR she's not yours. It's just your turn. Mods can you back me up.

[–]Hsnbrg501 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you OP. This is what I needed, as I entered into an LTR a few months ago with someone who's quite taken with me as well, and wonder about the Alpha to Beta ratio. I feel I will suffer the same fate as OP if I don't throw a little more beta into the mix.

[–]JvSOUL 0 points1 point  (2 children)

What about a Girl you literally have no capacity to be emotional with her (She's a 6.5-7) but the sex is enjoyable?

[–]altra_hex 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I would guess offer her as much emotional comfort as you think is needed to keep her around until you get bored... or don't and be ok with having her jet at certain point.

OP is right though. Did the same thing with a girl over the last few months and eventually she was a crying wreck that couldn't handle even talking to me anymore.

[–]spiltnuc 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'd argue that a beta then won't get comfort tests because the female already knows she has the beta by the balls, unless I am mistaken

[–]theONE843663 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fuck LTRs I don't even keep plates for more than 6 months.

[–]sedivy94 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm basically ruining my own relationship this way right now. Did constant dread game, resulted in her closing up and our trust in each other disolved (simply trust that the other will be kind, patient, etc... hypergamy was not a concern). Broke up with her yesterday, actually.

[–]Pelikahn 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What if her comfort test is that she wants to marry you?

[–]flatox 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is indeed a crucial knowledge for those who wish to have an LTR.

[–]circlhat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Women are not inherently sluts,

Nothing wrong with being a slut, but they are inherently sluts

If you don't give it to her, she'll find someone that can.

At a certain point she will always choose a beta, around the time she hits the wall, are we really going to alter ourselves to please women?

As long as you did what you wanted , it was correct

[–]IIHotelYorba 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's VALUE test and comfort test. They are BOTH shit tests. Get the terms right if you're going to keep "borrowing" from PUAs.

[–]flatbushwick 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This post is so important... a lot of the dudes on here speak like they are alpha assholes 25/8. It's important that us newcomers learn that TRP is more about a balance. Knowing when you need to be Alpha and when you can be yourself.

[–]FuckGivingUp 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is really a great post. And one that saddens me as it's two years too late. Good advice anyhow!

[–]theredpill22 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is so true.

I am / was the same as you. Completely cold, my friends joke that I'm like a rock with no feelings. I don't show anyone my feelings about anything. I had a very rough upbringing and it made me very distrustful and paranoid of others. I had a hyper masculine father (trade union official, ex army) who pushed me to excel in everything I did. He was relentless.

I'm reaping the benefits now in a lot of ways, I would consider myself elite in terms of SMV at my age group.

However, most women find me intimidating and they go quiet around me, it's very hard to get them to open up around me at all. They either act bitchy or don't say anything around me, despite staring at me and showing other obvious indicators of interest.

I'm realising now that a girl I was trying to game was very insecure, and being constantly confident, aloof and cold meant that she closed off emotionally completely. She needed me to show her that I liked her as a person, not just a sex object, and I failed hard. I was getting ridiculously mixed signals, I'm talking rubbing her legs against mine in public, then when in private she would seize up like crazy and shut it down. I'm not a empathetic guy and I'm probably a bit autistic so I didn't know how to make her more comfortable around me.

So she acted like a bitch towards me, while I would laugh it off and pay her no attention. She was insanely attracted to me, this went on for a few months and I'm pretty sure I made her cry a few times.

Eventually I got sick of her shyness/bitchiness, and gave up. Treated her the same as I would a guy, actually being a nice, chill person. Now she's really nice to me, doing things for me, smiling at me more, keeping eye contact. I'm realising that she was shit scared of me, and I was too autistic to realise.

She was already very attracted to me, ironically "jus b urself" would have been a much better tactic.

[–]i_have_a_semicolon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nicely articulated and accurate post!

[–]20Nation 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's a really good observation. I wrote an entire article on this a couple years ago (with graphs etc.) http://swooptheworld.com/the-alpha-beta-illusion/

Basically you have to judge this type of stuff on the girl and her relative value to yours.

[–]mile-high 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Old Chateau trick: Get a period tracker app. (I use one called Life) When she's in the fertility phase you can expect more shit tests, and you should amp up your alpha game. This week you also get good overall grading on how alpha you really are: in this week, she should show signs of attraction towards you. If not, she subconsciously perceives you as overall beta, and you're in trouble. The rest of the month you can dial it back, and even run some beta game if you like. The science is there to back it up. Find the original blog post for more info.

[–]Trooper_1868 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wouldnt different girls have different cycles? Im not a biologist :(

[–]1ozaku7 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Always give a woman slightly less attention than she gives to you. If you keep close enough, but her just wanting a little bit more, she won't close off emotionally, she will see that desire to have a little bit more of you as attraction.

[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points  (10 children)

Lets be real. She didn't dump you because you were too alpha for her. She dumped you because deep down she knew you were a beta, and you refused to behave like one, negating her entire purpose for dating you in the first place. Girls LTR betas because of the emotional support and comfort the beta provides her, but if you are beta and don't provide those things, she has no use for you.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (4 children)

Dude, that sounds like complete bullshit. Look at men like for example Gordon Ramsay, or Elliott Hulse, or Marco Pierre White. They are married, have families, are inspiring and charismatic leaders, and they are alpha as fuck. Being alpha is about empowering yourself and being the best you can be. That road is different for each and everyone of us, which means some of us will thrive and grow in an LTR, others will not.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Differing opinions are fine man. I just think we might have a different definition of alpha.

[–]palaceposy6706 1 point2 points  (3 children)

You're applying the alpha/beta dichotomy fallacy, that it's black and white - not true. She just wasn't getting enough beta.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

The way the OP tells the story it SOUNDS reasonable, but do you really think girls are out there dumping alpha males because they aren't sensitive enough?

[–]palaceposy6706 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Absolutely. Women want it all, they want AF/BB in the same person.

They'll pick fights with their betas to make them angry so they can get rough make-up sex.

Similarly, they will rope in alphas with their best efforts in sex, but then start introducing him to their friends, family, etc. and start the whole nesting routine.

AF/BB is not a black-and-white dichotomy, it's a spectrum, and women have a certain place on that spectrum that they want their partner. The problems start when the partner is in a different place on it... this is that wisdom of the ages that says "men go into an LTR wanting their partners to stay the same, women go into an LTR wanting to change their partners". When they can't get something in the relationship, then they look outside of it (making emotional tampons of orbiters, fucking Chad the pool boy, etc)

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I understand your line of thinking, but IME that usually isn't how it works. Women shame betas when they act like alphas, and alphas when they act like betas. They don't want one individual to fill all roles, even if that's what they say. They want different individuals for different roles, which is where the hypergamy comes from. The idea of "alpha fucks, beta bucks" is very real, but you dont really get to choose which you are, you can only increase your understanding of female behavior to protect yourself from being taken advantage of.

You can act alpha, but eventually you will fall in love with the girl, and she will know what you really are. I agree there isn't a perfect cut off for alpha/beta, but IN GENERAL you fall into one category or another. A beta can proactively work against the weaker parts of their nature, just like an alpha can, but usually you are one or the other on the inside, and the girl usually knows which you are. When you pretend alpha to get the girl, but then LTR her and fall in love, you are contradicting urself. Like, if you act alpha, but then LTR the girl and fall in love, but then still put on this act of being alpha when all ur behaviors and decisions contradict it, thats when she will leave, which is what I think happened to OP.

It confuses the shit of the girl because she's like, "I know he isn't some badass alpha because he isn't plowing other girls all the time and blowing me off. All he does is hang out with me and go on dates with me like a beta, but he continues to put up this frauded personality and refuses to reciprocate in the actual relationship. I'm not getting the emotional comfort of the beta, or the experience of dating an alpha, I'm out. "

The problem is, forums like this brainwash people into thinking they shouldn't show their true emotional beta side, when in reality it is the only reason a girl would want to be with them in the first place. So they become this grey sort of not beta, but not really alpha.

TLDR: if he was truly an alpha, she wouldn't have expected emotional comfort out of him, because thats not what girls want from alphas.

[–]1empatheticapathetic 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Interesting point. Something I've wondered a lot recently.

Are you a beta as soon as you decide to do an LTR?

[–]PurpleBanner -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

9 months ago, I destroyed a relationship with a woman who was into me big time. At the time, I thought that being confident, indifferent and aloof was what she really wanted, and to a degree that is very much true. But the reality is, that I was scared of Hypergamy and it stopped me from showing my softer side who I was as a person. I thought that if I was always Alpha, she would love me for it, but the reality is that women need to pair bond with you at a point. You need to understand that the more a woman falls for you, the more she wants of you. There is a point where you need to feed her the Beta side of you. Over Dreading your girl will cause her to close up emotionally... and it is far, far harder to open her back up again compared to standing up to a Shit-Test.

This needed to be pointed out?