Stop Seeking Validation from EVERYONE (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by fluidmechanics22

One of the biggest mistakes I have made in my life and I have seen in other men's behaviour is seeking validation. This is not limited to looking for it from girls but also from other men. It is proof that you have no confidence in your paradigm of the world.

Asking others' to confirm your opinions or views about the world is essentially saying, "Hey I have no confidence in anything I have learnt or seen in life, please tell me how you see the world and I will copy that". Lot's of young fall into this trap. And considering how fucking nonsensical the world is, it's understandable. But you are going to get nowhere in life if you keep looking for others to confirm your views on the world.

There is a distinction between accepting what you don't know about the world and looking to learn, and not believing in yourself. The first is a display that you don't know everything and that you are looking to expand your view on the world. The second shows that you can't even trust yourself. It is unattractive to men and women.

If you think someone has fucked you over, believe it. If you think a girl is messing with your head, believe it. If you don't trust your old friend, believe it. The more you believe in yourself, the more confident you will get in your own choices because you will start making the right decisions and gain a confidence you never had before.

[–]Senior Contributordr_warlock 163 points164 points  (7 children)

This is what I call "Inner Frame" ==> preventing emotional induction (external and internal induction, internal in this case). Despite our attempts here in this sub to teach each other to break from the herd mind, be independent individuals, and never interact with women in anything that doesn't benefit you, our mind is not designed that way.

(most people) You are programmed to do what it takes to 'fit in'. You are programmed to rely emotionally on each other and their opinions. You are built to be superior to women, but programmed to use that superiority to further serve women. When your subconscious mind believes you've followed these 'rules', you feel validated, but when it perceives that you're not fitting in, losing social allies, or risk losing a woman's approval and presence, it breaks it's own 'inner frame' by invoking a spike of anxiety. It's the emotional equivalent of someone in a position of authority scolding you for not conforming to their ideal vision for you. Stay in line, boy. Survival, reproduction, and going with the flow are all your subconscious cares about. It does not give a shit about your emotional well being and happiness.

If you do what everyone else does, you'll get what everyone else has. If you want to be anything better than the average man, if you never want to fall victim to a female, you have to ignore this spike of anxiety and cause 'trouble'. Transcend your programming. The hardest part is knowing when you're encountering clear injustice ie beta shaming, AMOGing, and herd mind shaming, and when you're over reacting. The best place is to start with women, that's the biggest enemy for male independence and advancement. Your biology mentally cripples you to serve them to some extent at your expense.

Assuming you're like most new comers here, "Just be yourself" will get you the same beta results you've been getting. Given that, the best methodology is to go out of your way not to help females. Don't open any doors. Don't move too much out of the way for them to walk. Never stop to help women with car trouble. Never do favors. Don't help a woman pick up things she dropped. Never react to any bad news you hear come out of a woman's mouth. Ignore any woman's tears no matter what the cause (including your girlfriend). Never give up your seat for one. Never interfere if a female is involved in a fight, let her get hit. Don't even call the police for one. If a woman is not doing her part, make sure to bring attention to it, even in front of others. Demand gas, cash, grass, or ass from any woman (even a 'friend') if she wants a ride. Never buy a woman anything, no gifts, no drinks, no flowers, no cards, nothing.

No hate. No yelling. No insults. No rudeness. NO EXPLANATION OR JUSTIFICATION. Stay calm. For the most part I'm literally saying do nothing.

If you think some of this is overreacting, that's because some of it is. That's the point. You can't yet differentiate between 'overreacting' and justified. So you practice ignoring your provider/protective and other beta-like instincts and saying no to a woman by going full-out. This is to form new habits, literally reprogramming your mind. Then as you get experience in this, you slowly learn not only to differentiate between overreacting and justified, but also how to engage. You can be kind or do slight 'favors' without being weak (i.e. propping the door open).

The first problem you will encounter other than that initial spike of anxiety for offending a woman is shaming by women and witnesses, which spikes more anxiety. Don't react or justify yourself in any way. Nothing bad happens. 'Asshole' and 'misogynist' to most people just means not going out of your way to help women or give her special privileges (Look up the 'benevolent sexism' study for proof).

The second 'issue' you will encounter is you'll notice some women will stop talking to you or stranger girls will ignore you. This is a good thing, they did you a favor. Women that only thought of you as something for money, validation, and favors -- an orbiter, drop themselves out. Their whole intention was to get something out of you 'cuz vagina and they sense that you're not a guy whose gonna give it to them. Bye bye sweetheart.

Again, No hate. No yelling. No insults. No rudeness. NO EXPLANATION OR JUSTIFICATION. Stay calm. This doesn't mean ignore women completely. You can say "hi" or smile. Don't walk around with an angry face and try to be 'alpha'.

This will be uncomfortable, that's because it's meant to be (biologically speaking). If you wanna reach the heights, you must not let your programming jerk you around. Reprogram your mind one act at a time.

Inner frame: preventing (internal) emotional induction.

The philosophical 'inner frame bible': http://www.redpilldoctor.com/why-you-should-read-meditations-by-marcus-aurelius-74-quotes/

[–]whuttupfoo 16 points17 points  (0 children)

“Don’t call the police” is overkill.

[–]WillTyr 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Dr_warlock - I feel like you need to make a specific post on this topic of reprogramming the beta mindsets. I have applied the exact methods and found successes in the long run. It is always true for everything, the first 2 weeks are always the hardest.

[–]plascra 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Frame is essentially talking about locus of control.

[–]Endorsed Contributorsadomasochrist 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's only part of it. It's also about maintaining congruity to pragmatic reality. E.g. Ignore what she says.

So when she says something that has a different subtext to overt speech, instead of adopting an internal locus of control and acting within her frame, you act according to your own frame.

An internal locus of control is only about decision autonomy within the framework of "things I can control and things I can't." And within that framework, you seek only to make decisions that involve controlling yourself.

That means ridding yourself of people who are not benefiting you, as opposed to trying to make them conform to a role you want.

Now if you're reductionist enough, I see what you're saying. But there's a lot of examples where this would not be true. In your example, paramount frame is a man who doesn't need to entertain a woman's delusional state because he has plenty of options.

But if say you had a superior who was imposing some will on you at work you didn't agree with, you have to sacrifice your frame while maintaining an internal locus of control.

You could "hold frame" and go with an external locus of control, but unless you have the political capital at the office to triumph and the upsides outweigh the downsides, you're pissing in the wind.

That's why a lot of guys on here seem to struggle. They look at frame as a binary construct. That they either hold it or lose it. So you have guys making posts about becoming social outcasts at their place of employment because they "held frame" at a work function.

Now one could argue that staying true to yourself is holding frame, to yourself, but if it means the loss of social standing, you've lost frame with the group at large. Which is why the laws of power dictates this so well that you think as you like but behave like others.

Is that advocating the loss of frame? Sure, your frame. But to try enforce your frame on others is an external locus of control.

So we agree and disagree. It's a complex topic and I felt compelled to add to it. But regardless, great point that few I think have really contemplated.

[–]NickA97 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Do you have a link to the benevolent sexism study?

[–]DeathToTheZog 55 points56 points  (2 children)

It is so liberating when you finally just get so sick of the worrying. I finally just flipped my perceived weaknesses into my strength. I own up to my faults.

I used to be so sick. I mean physically sick from worrying 24/7 what someone else may think. Or about trying to fit into someone elses mold.

Fuck that shit. Never again.

[–]Subbs 24 points25 points  (1 child)

The truly ridiculous part is that next to everyone does this. No one even thinks about you, everyone thinks of how they're being perceived by others. These days people avoid looking at each other because both parties are simultaneously scared of what the other may think.

[–]Scroph 14 points15 points  (0 children)

In my experience, it is the other way around. I routinely witnessed people talk behind other people's backs to feel good about themselves. Some of them bond (in a twisted, corrupt manner) over this. Hours wasted in this meaningless activity. Note that I live in a Muslim region and this still happens all the time even though the religion forbids it heavily.

[–]NeoreactionSafe 19 points20 points  (0 children)


  • Monkey See, Monkey Do


There was a guy named Rene Girard who devoted an entire lifetime of work studying the effects of imitation:




Girard’s fundamental concept is ‘mimetic desire’. Ever since Plato, students of human nature have highlighted the great mimetic capacity of human beings; that is, we are the species most apt at imitation. Indeed, imitation is the basic mechanism of learning (we learn inasmuch as we imitate what our teachers do), and neuroscientists are increasingly reporting that our neural structure promotes imitation very proficiently (for example, ‘mirror neurons’).


However, according to Girard, most thinking devoted to imitation pays little attention to the fact that we also imitate other people’s desires, and depending on how this happens, it may lead to conflicts and rivalries. If people imitate each other’s desires, they may wind up desiring the very same things; and if they desire the same things, they may easily become rivals, as they reach for the same objects. Girard usually distinguishes ‘imitation’ from ‘mimesis’. The former is usually understood as the positive aspect of reproducing someone else’s behavior, whereas the latter usually implies the negative aspect of rivalry. It should also be mentioned that because the former usually is understood to refer to mimicry, Girard proposes the latter term to refer to the deeper, instinctive response that humans have to each other.


Ultimately the SJW is a "competitive virtue signaler" who is both imitating as well as a rival with others in trying to "Virtue Signal" the Blue Pill mythology.

That's why it becomes a downward spiral into "Political Correctness" because the competition is based in a rivalry of Nice Guys™ trying to "out nice" each other.


The Red Pill is to be real, the Blue Pill is to be fake.


[–]SquirtGunKelly_5 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Confidence is key and self reflection is the best approach to attaining it. Like the body of this post!

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (3 children)

Fucking truth!

And when you're in this state of validation seeking, it's almost like the world seeks out your weakness. People sense it without consciously knowing and will shit all over you. After deploying to Iraq and Afghan I came home more apathetic. The mindset was mixed. It was good because you don't give a fuck about much. Nothing can really get your blood going. Nothing really scares you. But then I got a 'normal' job and became a broken person for many years almost.

Finally starting to get back to a real headspace where I'm not seeking validation and don't feel so afraid of the world. It was like it all backfired. The mindset of IDGAF backfired and it became I give too many fucks.

Lifting helped some but for me what's really helped was getting back into MMA. It's far deeper than the physical. You start to realize people don't know what the fuck they're doing for the most part in life. They're all scared. They aren't looking at you or what you're doing, they're worried you're looking at them, judging them and what they're doing instead.

[–]1empatheticapathetic 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Why were you a broken person?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Long story short: I let it happen. I broke it off with my ex back then. She stole my dog when we split along with all my stuff. It really messed with me coming home to everything being gone. It was a combo of that and working at a big company where being a soldier, doing the things I did wasn't important to anyone. If anything it seemed like it was a black mark. All my job was, was to save lives not take lives overseas.

But lesson learned. It's all about framing in your mind. The perceptive reality of those around me, I let take over my own perception of reality.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Social media has played a huge part in this. At any moment, a man can go on Facebook and write a status about whatever decision he made or opinion he has and get near-instant feedback via comments.

What this man doesn't realize is that by doing this he will do things based solely on what other people think, making him appear pathetic and unable to live his own life without the validation of others.

I believe social media to be one of the biggest reasons for men's downfall in confidence today, especially when it comes to your ideas about validation. It makes them weak.

[–]V1SoR 12 points13 points  (3 children)

Only women and immature guys seek validation from other people. An adult man doesn't need it. If you think everyone feels the same, you're not mature yet. I stopped needing anyone's validation in my mid 20s, not because I wasn't getting it (I was, even too much), but because a self-sufficient man doesn't need it to feel complete.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (2 children)

There you have it. You already got validation, and THIS is why you didn't crave it anymore. That's why you were able to feel complete.

[–]V1SoR 6 points7 points  (1 child)

You forgot to add 'eureka!'. On a serious note though, you're wrong.

Validation isn't something that you get once and don't ever need again. Those who crave it can never have enough of it. Just like food or sex. You need a constant resupply. If you think that's not true, then imagine a world where women didn't need constant validation. That would be a utopia, since it would get rid of so much attention whoring and so much bullshit. I dare say, taking away the constant need for validation from women would alone in itself solve so many problems at once that it would essentially be a blue dream come true.

[–]1empatheticapathetic 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I disagree. Once you've had it once, you at least know you were capable of it at one point, and if necessary, gives you the confidence to achieve it again in the future if you wanted. You hit a mark in your life and were rewarded for it. Even attaining it once is important for your self esteem, depending on what it is and how common place it is and how important it is to you.

Women on the other hand are not men, so it's not a relevant comparison IMO. They live in a world where they naturally receive a stream of constant validation. They exist to achieve validation for existing and fucking, opposed to men who receive women as a form of validation for their achievements/SMV. If a woman had her legs chopped off and was unable to get the validation she used to get, she would still be light years happier she had those initial years of validation before she had her accident, opposed to never experiencing it.

[–]Ericgzg 8 points9 points  (1 child)

Was watching American gods and a character said something to the effect of "we cannot choose the path our senses show us but it is a path we must follow, all the way to the end". So accept the path you are shown and follow it in confidence, that is all anyone can do.

[–]RmX93 2 points3 points  (3 children)

So you are saying that even if your theory is not right you shouldn't believe what others try to explain you, you just keep your word? I met so many dumb people saying same bullshit over and over again and they dont want to listen the facts because they will feel beta if somone change their minds.

[–]BasketCase559 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don't think that's what he's saying at all, he even makes the distinction between being sure of yourself and your beliefs and being willing to learn new things.

Anyone who's afraid of having their mind changed for fear of looking beta obviously lacks a strong frame and is exactly who this post is aimed at.

[–]1empatheticapathetic 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes you're exactly right here. The person you describe has strong frame. They believe what they believe very strongly and are unable to be swayed. Now whether they have the correct beliefs in the first place is a different question. 'Correct' and 'right and wrong' are subjective measures.

I meet people I believe are politically brainwashed and I bet they feel the same about me. Two people with strong frames and opposing view points.

[–]sickofallofyou 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Validation comes from within.

[–]antihostile 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Stop seeking validation from anyone.

[–]Baltais 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If we remain dependent on external factors to feel approved of, then we will always be emotionally vulnerable.

[–]2comment 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Validation is a currency that ceases to have value in and of itself; like many desires it sinks to monopoly money for those who've seen past it. It becomes a valuable tool to manipulate situations and people or to prevent being manipulated.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

[–]brotherhood-of-man 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Especially from men.

I have a healthy relationship with every woman around me. I don't care about their existence and opinions. And they respect me.

But men are always trying to fuck with me. Constant shit tests, AMOGing attempts, etc.

I believe it's because I see men as natural friends, and value their opinions.

[–]22Luika 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Holy shit im in the same page dawg. I's like they need to dominate you. What you think?

[–]brotherhood-of-man 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, I started to believe most of the power plays between two men are no different than man-woman relationships.

End goal might be different. But the value game is still going on among men too.

[–]kealh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I have had experienced this during my years in college. Seeking validation from my peers. All I find is rejection. It took me a while to stop caring what others think of me and boy, does it feels so good to be free. I literally feel ascended and when I look at other people in their on cliche circle jerking each other. I get myself a good laugh and move forward.

[–]aanarchist 0 points1 point  (0 children)

inner work comes first though, cuz i know way too many people that believe in every deluded little feeling they have and basically false flag themselves into the grave. truth is objective, so to be able to have true lasting confidence in yourself, your intuition, instincts and experiences, you have to first align yourself with reality and destroy any blue pill programming you have so that you can see life through an objective lens. the red pill isn't about becoming a narcissist or a sociopath, it's about setting yourself free.