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tl;dr: girl finds "man of her dreams." Everything is wonderful, until foreign tingles arrive.

I work for a national chain restaurant. Working alongside lots of young, female employees has offered me so many instances of redpill truths. I'm in a LTR myself, so I don't need to worry about trying to game women, but I do enjoy their company, friendship, and conversation while working my shift.

One server, who I have worked with for nearly 4 years (lets call her Joanne - 23 years old), used to have pretty bad luck in finding a man who would date her long-term. The running joke was that a UFO kept visiting all of her dates, kidnapping them away. Until, that is, she met "Billy."

From the day they met, she was head over heels. Billy had a good job, owned his own freaking house, and loved Joanne very much. She was very vocal about how thrilled beyond belief she was that she found a good man, and one that committed to her. 6 months or so into the relationship (perhaps a bit longer), he took the next, obvious step that men are supposed to do with a woman they love - he proposed.

Her social media was then plastered with pictures of her joyfully displaying her diamond ring (which cost God knows how much money), along with captions of how in love she is, and how great of a man she has.

Every time I saw her at work, which was then about once weekly due to her limited scheduling because of schooling, I'd ask about Billy. Her face would light up, she'd smile wide, and tell me about how perfect he is and how wonderful everything is going. They were in love, they were going to be married, start and raise a family, and they would live happily ever after, just the way we're taught it's supposed to be.

That was, until, last night.

Per usual, I ask about her dream man and expect the response I'd always gotten. Only this time her brow wrinkled, she glanced downwards, and had a serious look on her face. Joanne then tells me about how she's having "second thoughts" about marriage.

Uh oh.

Due to redpill education, I obviously immediately knew what was the issue. She herself couldn't pinpoint what was wrong, but I, using PC language, spelt out redpill truths to her in a non in-your-face way. She was thrilled that she found someone to talk to who understood her plight, and could help her identify exactly what was going on.

Simply, Joanne felt as if she "were living with a friend or a son, rather than a lover." She said there wasn't much, or any, "passion, for as long as they'd been together." (What?!) The same man she used to gush over and tell me - every time I asked - how amazing he is - was now being described as someone who she had always "settled for," while asking him to change, but he "simply wouldn't."

Of course, we all know here at TRP that this extreme and rapid change of heart didn't come out of thin air. The next obvious question from me was, "are you interested in someone else?"

She smiled. Her eyes lit up. Her body posture changed. Her mind drifted off to some distant dreamland with rainbows and puppies as she sighed, "yes." Joanne then goes on to tell me how one man from class, who she met a mere three weeks ago, is "all the things that Billy is not." Mind you, this new guy is a mere 18 years old - five years younger than her.

But, tingles.

My stomach turned, and I felt disgusted at yet another blatant demonstration of AWALT. However, I consider her a friend, so I counseled on:

Billy is taking Joanne on a trip out to Arizona within a few days, to hang with family. There is no doubt that Joanne will behave as if everything is fine, possibly even having sex with Billy, of course fueled by fantasies of the new, 18 year-old southerner who, in three weeks, has unwittingly destroyed an engagement and a 2-year relationship all because he talked to her a few times.

The entire trip, Joanne will be plotting the right time after they return to call off the engagement, return the ring, and branchswing up to her new, higher branch. And, why not? She's known him a whole 3 weeks - this is true love! Time to upgrade to the new, shinier model that I've never even test-driven! Fuck the guy who owns a home, has a good, stable job, and is offering a lifetime of commitment.

The worst part is that Billy hasn't the slightest clue this is even coming. Joanne stated that she's sad that she'll be losing a good friend, and would love to stay friends with him if possible (friends, of course, who will never fuck ever again), but it's too late now for poor Billy to change her mind. She's set on getting some strange dick, the tingles have spoken, the vagina has moistened, and just like that her "dream man" and "life partner" is a thing of the past.

Billy will be left devastated, scratching his head, wondering what in the hell he did wrong. He offered her a home, financial security, a lifetime of commitment via marriage, the promise of children. ALL things that Joanne "always wanted." Billy was taught, all of his life, that he was making all the right moves. I mean hell, he even manned-up and proposed for crying out loud!

Not to worry, however. I'm sure Billy is surrounded by plenty of alpha males who know how women really operate, and they will educate him on exactly what changes need to be made so he doesn't get horribly burned, again.

And again.

And again.

But, 18 year-old alpha dick.

  • She wasn't Billy's. It was just his turn.

  • Once women get tingles, they will bail on a good man who's given her everything (like in the case of my mom who ran out on my father after 20 years).

  • Don't be like Billy.

[–][deleted] 322 points323 points  (38 children)

She wants the stable, successful provider, and the passionate, edgy, lover. Sometimes you just can't have both, and I wouldn't be surprised in a year from now, maybe less, she'll want Billy back once her short affair dries up and the 18 year old loses what made him so different. Tis the world we live in, lost in our own silly instinct that doesn't work the same in the modern world.

[–]Origami84 264 points265 points  (29 children)

A year from now? The new guy will fuck her, brag with her friends about the older chick he banged 2-3 times, and then will dump her telling it is "too weird". I give her 1 month.

[–]LandoChronus 28 points29 points  (24 children)

Billy is the fiancee in the story not the chad.

[–]Origami84 44 points45 points  (23 children)

Good point, my bad. I meant that the chad will enjoy her and dump her, of course.

[–][deleted] 53 points54 points  (22 children)

And later she will go back to Billy. He will "man up" and take her back, and everyone lived happily thereafter.

[–]H42 1 points1 points [recovered]

With Chad's baby in her belly. Shhhh, don't tell Billy, puulleeeeeaase...

If that is how it goes down, I hope OP will step up and rat her out to Billy.

[–]newls 1 point2 points  (0 children)

And thus by putting her down hard, he will have passed the shit test.

I hope and pray he will learn this in his post-breakup grief stage, but we all know that's unlikely.

[–]Endorsed Contributormallardcove 10 points11 points  (0 children)

This is exactly how it will go.

Either Chad will become a tamed beta and she will lose interest, or Chad will cheat on her or dump her for someone else. Then she will come running back to Billy. And Billy will accept since he will probably still have oneitis and has been brainwashed to believe women deserve a 2nd chance because reasons even when they have proven they can't be trusted and if he doesn't give her a 2nd chance he is a woman hating bigot shitlord.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (14 children)

If this actually happens, Billy is a rare, unfortunate breed of sucker.

[–][deleted] 28 points29 points  (6 children)

Rare? They are the commonest kind. It's full of them. That's what's allowing the vaj-algorithms using and using and using males (with the lightest conscience, and society's endorsement!)

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (3 children)

This Billy guy sounds like a real winner though.

Of course there are plenty of suckers out there, but Billy's rare because of his success.

He's a successful young man with his entire life figured out who's willing to marry down so hard he was/is engaged to a 23 year old restaurant server.

Are there a lot of beta suckers? Yes. On Billy's level? No, absolutely not.

[–]newls 2 points3 points  (2 children)

His main need now is to swallow the Red Pill. Being dumped is the most reliable route for that.

Then I hope and pray he stays single and uncommitted well into his thirties. Or at least more committed to his goals than to any one girl.

[–]RandyBumgardner85 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Most men have been used and abused by at least one woman at some stage in their lives. Critical thinkers will sooner or later see a glitch in the matrix, start to seek answers and hopefully one day end up here. This process could take years but the eventual outcome will usually be positive.

Most men are not critical thinkers. The vast majority will shrug their shoulders, think "oh well I probably wasn't worthy of her" or "she just wasn't the one" and blindly keep repeating the process over and over. This is evidenced by the fact that so many divorced men re-marry as soon as possible. Often with the same outcome.

Being a critical thinker is one of the greatest abilities a man can have in life.

[–]Wellbidlo 2 points3 points  (0 children)

cmon, you could make vaginal-goritms pun

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Billy ends up being a cuck.

Or for all you know she’ll break up with Billy and Billy will stumble upon TRP and become the alpha he should be. Things like this are what drive people do this sub.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (4 children)

Unfortunate yes, rare no. I know a couple of Billys that are raising Chad's sons right now.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (3 children)

Every dude should pick up a paternity test.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (2 children)

I preferred getting a vasectomy on the NHS for free.

[–]dgillz 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I cannot believe you are getting downvoted.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

certainly #happy on her Fakebook wall, at the least.

[–]UncleChido -2 points-1 points  (2 children)

Can't a man have a happily ever after

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Back in the day, yes. In modern times? It's getting rare.

[–]Deep_freeze202 7 points8 points  (0 children)

A man makes his own happily ever after, he simply has to accept that it doesn't include a wife, mortgage picket fence and 2.5 kids.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Her rationale 1 month from now is going to be:

"After this experience, now yes that I understand how I love Billy!"

[–]FuckRightOfff 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Yes, the billy beta-in-waiting, guess he won't be single for very long, he screams provider. I'm guessing if you followed billy, he'll find a single mom. SWIM dated a 27 y.o. single "mom-child" She lived with her parents, worked retail and her parents basically paid/raised the child as her sister. What happened next -- She found a billy beta (33 year old, home owner, making 100k+ year, drives a bmw) , someone who she thought could provide for her and her child. They dated and fucked for a couple months, all of a sudden she finds a younger, "edgy" local drug dealer, and quickly branch swings to him. She thought it was genius, the drug dealer was the new dick. After a couple weeks she realizes this drug dealer is a complete fucking loser working for $6/hr and selling nugs out of his $500/mo apartment. He didn't provider her anything other then sex, and drugs. She decided the drug dealer wasn't a good LTR, and quickly went running back to billy beta. Except billy beta was over her, and told her to fuck off.

[–]Bolt_Ironstag 1 points1 points [recovered]

What? All she want's is a dangerous safe guy who's nice (but not too nice) who makes a shit ton of money, has enough time to dote on her constantly while giving her plenty of space to hang out with her friends and fine some dick on the side. Oh and exotic vacatiobs in between all that. Is that so much to ask?

[–]1empatheticapathetic 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Where have all the good men gone

[–]fromthecrypt8 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Good summary of how fucked up humans are.

[–]1ozaku7 -1 points0 points  (1 child)

My goodness, just imagine that being a provider these days isn't good enough anymore... How horrible! Where are the times where having a house, a car, a fulltime job attracted all the pussy towards your dick by default?!

[–]3LiveAFTSOV 378 points379 points  (46 children)

Great example of hypergamy.

At least this chick has the decency to call off the wedding rather than stringing Billy along in a 10-year ATM dead bedroom relationship while she shags other Chads.

I wonder how long it'll take before she starts saying "where'd all the good men go" again.

Psh, women.

[–]Saberinbed 62 points63 points  (5 children)

This. Most women i know or have fucked, still stayed with their boyfriends because the guy basically guranteed them a good future.

[–]newls 7 points8 points  (3 children)

One of my ex-plates had an orbiter who acted really weird around me the whole time I was fucking her. After I broke up with her, this guy wore her down over the course of five years and they eventually married. I know this guy is a desperate simp with no other options, so I want to see hypergamy bear out in this situation. It's always the same pattern.

The distillation of hypergamy in this is that, she wanted to fuck me, and now she feels she has to fuck him. She was just smart enough to see the longer term benefits in guaranteed lifetime commitment.

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (1 child)

" She was just smart enough to see the longer term benefits in guaranteed lifetime commitment"

Beta behavior IS a sexual strategy. Its just not a very good one

[–]n-esimacuenta 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Beta behavior IS a sexual strategy. Its just not a very good one

It was the best one for them but sexual liberation outdated it.

[–]Saberinbed 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Dude, i asked this one girl who i fucked to break up with her boyfriend because i liked our chemistry. This was before i read about TRP so it was kind of a dumb thing to do.. but anyways, she basically told the guy she cheated on him with me, asked to take a break from the relationship, and the guy said NO. He was afraid he couldnt get her back if she broke up with him. They are now still together. No shit, the dude is in med school.

[–]420KUSHBUSH 57 points58 points  (12 children)

As my good friend once said:

"Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em"

[–]GainzdalfTheWhey 89 points90 points  (3 children)

I prefer the can't live with em, can't have heterosexual intercourse without em

[–]jiveraffe 1 points1 points [recovered]

"Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em"

I dunno. It's getting easier on that second part.

The juice seems to be progressively worth less and less the squeeze.

[–]BonelessSkinless 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The juice is worth nothing and the squeeze is your life, time, energy, money, happiness... nah man. It's not worth it actually. But many guys have to find this out the really hard way

[–]oldslut 3 points4 points  (2 children)

my favorite is: "can't live with them, can't live with them"

[–]420KUSHBUSH 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Very insightful. You are wise as alwasy, oldslut. Wise as always

[–]abramN 0 points1 point  (0 children)

my fave is Norm from Cheers: "women: can't live with 'em. pass the beernuts"

[–]BobbyPeru 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Along with Rollo’s theory, she probably thought she was coming close to “the wall,” and then she realized she may have another 5-10 years of riding the Chad carousel


At least this chick has the decency to call off the wedding rather than stringing Billy along in a 10-year ATM

I wouldn’t necessarily chalk it up to decency.... maybe she just miscalculated her “wall,” and then came to her senses and dumped him

[–]Rabbit-Punch 12 points13 points  (5 children)

I mean, Billy isn’t a ‘good’ man. He is a compassionate man probably, but a good man would know better about turning into an unattractive mate

[–]theubernoob 1 points1 points [recovered]

How would he know better? That's one thing I used to do a lot and would like other people to think about as well; assuming just because you know something, that everyone else should know it too. You should understand that we all come from different backgrounds affording us a wide variety of knowledge. A large amount of people aren't raised with the knowledge pushed by this community which is really why the community is here in the first place. I would say Billy is naive and/or ignorant depending on how you want to define those terms, but this whole thing is independent of him being a good man.

[–]Rabbit-Punch 5 points6 points  (2 children)

How would he know better?

The same way anyone else would know. Usually by experience. Life is unforgiving, I am not placing fault on anyone but thats just the way it is and the way it has to be.

What constitutes a good man is a deeper question. A good man is not naive. A good man knows the evil that himself and other people are capable of, and chooses not to be evil and to keeps his eyes open.

[–]1empatheticapathetic -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Lol why are you on TRP if you supposedly know what you need to know and expect other people to know.

[–][deleted] 22 points23 points  (0 children)

The key point here is that the fembot won't leave the "unattractive mate" until it hasn't found itself an "attractive mate".

Had vajbots dignity and self-respect, they'd plod on as single in the absence of "attractive" mates. They don't. They select the most-usable.

Disgusting algorithms if you ask me.

[–]1319Skew 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'd go with what she does not what she says. Personally,I think she'll find out how Billy never truly loved her because of that one time he's left the toilet seat up and them blame him for why she fell out of love with him, or just cheat and scratch that itch and kiss Billy with Chad's semen still on her lips.

[–]tranquil_af 2 points3 points  (1 child)

What does the "1" mean next to your username?

[–]newls 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've often imagined it's like GLO in a fairy costume bestowing bro-points with his magic wand. Or is that just me? Guys? Guys?

[–]Fedor_Gavnyukov 124 points125 points  (10 children)

if you're a dude with education, career, and home, you shouldn't be trying to tie down a fucking Chili's waitress in the first place

[–]hdosnxbjdjeb 22 points23 points  (3 children)

LOL true af

At least find a girl and fucking vet her so you don't find any red flags that come up like this

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (2 children)

Yeah vet but don’t propose. Awalt. Matter of time.

[–]hdosnxbjdjeb 0 points1 point  (1 child)

"Matter of time"?

What's that supposed to mean

[–]Psilotheos 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's all a matter of time before she finds another man to satisfy those tingles. It's just your turn.

[–]Endorsed Contributormallardcove 15 points16 points  (5 children)

I am educated with a 6 figure job and I also work part time as a bartender on weekends so I see both worlds from my end.

The AWALT behavior exists both places. In my professional job the women still do these things, stringing betas along, cheating on them, etc.

The women in my bartending job at the restaurant are just a bit more open and unashamed about it. They don't try to rationalize it, or cover it up.

At my restaurant we have a girl who has a smoking hot body and ass but not so great of a face. Naturally she gets all the attention from both male co-workers and male customers. But she is 27 and past the wall(hit the wall early). She also has her inner bitch come out all the time because she thinks she is hot shit and has a huge ego from the attention she gets. I give her none and it frustraters her because I dont shit where I eat and I dont find her attractive due to her being post wall and her face and nose being too fugly for me. Yet she gets all the attention from other men who are trying to get her commitment. Some poor chump is going to date and marry her(or try to marry her some day) and I feel bad for whoever that is. Restaurant servers/bartenders who are women that have redeeming qualities are like instagram whores because they get a ton of attention, more than an average woman and will be a lot more bitchy.

The thing is, the women in my professional job are the same way. They would act the same way if they were in a similar environment. AWALT.

[–]BurnDownTheMission68 17 points18 points  (2 children)

27 is past “The Wall?”

Is everyone on this sub 20 years old?

And Lindsey Vonn has hit the wall as well?

She’s nuts but gorgeous

This idea that hot chicks at 20 become ugly at 30 or 35 or even 45 is absurd

[–]relaxit 8 points9 points  (0 children)

A woman at 27 is closing in on her wall. It's not only about looks but also future child bearing potential. Desperation and complete loss of innocence doesn't help the average 27 yr old woman become more attractive.

45 yr olds as hot as 20 yr olds? Who are you trying to kid? When shown pictures of women, males across all ages prefer the looks of 19-21 yr old girls over older women.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Every woman hits their wall at a different time

[–]CapsaicinKing 0 points1 point  (1 child)

with a 6 figure job and I also work part time as a bartender on weekends

I have a feeling this is not the whole truth. Or you live somewhere that a 6 figure job is just barely making the bills, like the bay area. So 6 fig is moot.

But if you're working 2 jobs, the 6 figure is moot.

[–]SikeShay 0 points1 point  (0 children)

First thing that struck out to me, only because I've been considering a bar job for the social gains.

But then this dude also has time to drive Uber, and shitpost about politics all day kek

[–][deleted] 55 points56 points  (1 child)

There is another lesson in this too. I have never, not once, met a woman who won't get arrogant if she believes the game is won, regardless of how hard up she was before she met you or the consequences of failure. That bitch could be a 1 to your 10, and know it, but if you telegraph enough that you are hers she will get arrogant about it.

[–]Writs_For_Your_Tits 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's mystifying, but I've seen the opposite too. Good looking women trying to qualify themselves to partners who's faces look like a train wreck.

[–]Endorsed Contributorex_addict_bro 138 points139 points  (20 children)

Not exactly the topic of the post and the most of discussion in the comments, possibly, but:

I, using PC language, spelt out redpill truths to her in a non in-your-face way


This is how you do that.

You do things in a proper way, you verbalise stuff properly when even the most leftist feminist coworker starts agreeing with you.

THIS IS HOW WE DO IT gentlemen.

Sincerely yours,

don't talk about the fight club,

[–][deleted] 82 points83 points  (6 children)

One of my favorites is to routinely let women in relationship problems know that they're stuck between picking between the guy who's good in bed but won't commit, or the guy who will totally commit but isn't great in bed.

Nearly every woman will gleefully relate to that statement.

[–]Endorsed Contributorex_addict_bro 41 points42 points  (2 children)

This exactly. You're doing it right.

Side effect, you're "the guy that just gets it".

Readers, please note, that OP is NOT an emotional tampoon. Actually helping someone verbalise their own thoughts or validating someone's thoughts and opinions are powerful techniques. I think people do tend to like you when you do that.

[–]DatingCoach111 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Could very well be the answer for eliminating feminism and white nights, as well. Subtle education.

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (0 children)

Yes sir. Women will gladly eat small, little red pills if they're wrapped in chocolate and gently delivered by us with a concerned look of sympathy and understanding.

[–]econquest 1 point2 points  (2 children)

between picking between the guy who's good in bed but won't commit, or the guy who will totally commit but isn't great in bed.

Is it possible to be the first guy in every way except, unlike the former, to commit? (Basically, is married red pill possible?)

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Sure. Your best bet is to find a woman who wasn't raised in Western culture.

[–]SovereignSoul76 36 points37 points  (0 children)

Tries to be diplomatic: "Oh, I see. You are a, um...roastie, who is addicted to the um.....cock carousel."

Her: "THE WHAT?!"

[–]UshankaDalek 23 points24 points  (1 child)

I'm having an interesting time doing this with a friend from college. A mutual friend is the living embodiment of hypergamy (so bad she barely even hamsters). I've gently made a few RP observations about her, and they've been met with ready agreement.

Some people need to take the red pill as a suppository. Others, maybe it helps to give them a few flecks at a time.

[–]greatamericancities 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Well said. Some people can swallow it. Others will gag and cough it up, but can take it as a suppository. In the OP's tale it was ground up and lightly sprinkled over something delicious, so Joanne ate it up.

[–]3LiveAFTSOV 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Good catch.

So many guys make the mistake of DEERing, and being blunt or brutally honest with red pill truths.

If youre trying to teach, it's good to be slow and gradual when introducing the concepts.

If you're trying to make somebody cry though... then you can just throw the whole shebang and go Rambo on it.

[–]newls 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's more about showing that you 'get it' and this is very rare among men, and thus women open to you more out of appreciation and sheer surprise.

If you spout this stuff angrily and literally, you look like an autistic 17-year-old who's discovered pickup for the first time.

[–]1empatheticapathetic -1 points0 points  (0 children)

That's simple social awareness honestly.

[–]bearmanpig4 3 points4 points  (3 children)

Any examples you can point to of how to word RP knowledge specifically? Having a hard time speaking truth to a BP friend who divorced his cheating wife, and is now dating her again.

[–]VanSeslas 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Example: let’s say your friend slowly stopped taking care of his fitness. Slowly turning into a “chubby” looking guy for god knows whatever reason. Blue Pill mindset: “She loves me for who I am as a person. My physical apparence doesn’t matter that much to her after all we’ve been through “ You with the Red Pill mindset : “My man you’re playing with fire” Wrong way of presenting the RP truth to him: “All women are hoes, and your wife ain’t no different. She’ll leave you the second you stop being what she needs and find it elsewhere.” He will NEVER agree with you if you put it this way. That’s just too harsh. Correct way of presenting the RP truth: “my man, your wife fell in love with an attractive, fit guy, who takes good care of his body. If over the years, you slowly turn into something she’s not attracted to, and is constantly surrounded by a man that provides her the desire she wants, it’s in her biological instinct to slowly drift away from you and get closer to that new man. And yes, that is regardless of EVERYTHING you’ve been through. Sure, some women are different, but let’s not use exceptions to define a rule. Take care of your body sir. And if while you take care of your body and is everything she SHOULD want but it’s still not enough for her to stop cheating on you, respect yourself and withdraw yourself from this relationship. Out in these streets is a woman who is dreaming to stay the most loyal partner to you. You’re disgracing that woman and yourself for remaining with this undeserving woman you call your wife”. See what I did there was I made him swallow the pill but with enough water so that he doesn’t realize how fucking bitter and disgusting the truth the pill holds is. Going the first way with AWALT is like making him swallow the pill with no water. He’ll reject it.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

The idea of offering blue-coated redpills for easier digestion is worthy of its own thread. Perhaps myself or another will write one up and create a discussion.

[–]Endorsed Contributorex_addict_bro 4 points5 points  (0 children)

From my own experience, don’t save this man. Watch him die slowly.

[–]RedEyeDude 0 points1 point  (1 child)

What do you mean by PC. Is it political correctness?

Couldn't find it in the glossary, or through search.

[–]Endorsed Contributorex_addict_bro 0 points1 point  (0 children)

[–]Solitary_Solidarity 50 points51 points  (18 children)

I'm new around here guys, still trying to understand all of the philosophy of trp. This is just insanity, 18 years old. He has his shit together, this makes zero sense.

This demonstrates that it is infact all 100% emotional with women. I hope Billy doesn't take her back she'll just do it again and Ive learned through my lurking on trp, that this behaviour is actually really common.

Its like they have a higher sex drive and are compelled to sleep around a lot, this makes sense from an evolutionary standpoint but not in the society as a whole.

[–]grewapair 60 points61 points  (4 children)

Makes perfect sense. She's 23 and doesn't need to settle.

What she needed was a guy to commit to her so she could believe she was worthy of it, so she lowered her standards until she found it. That itch having been scratched, there's no more need for a beta.

Women over 26 need to settle. She does not.

[–]smirk_addict 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Your statement is a harsher truth than the original post.

[–]Andgelyo 14 points15 points  (0 children)

This. I don't know why everyone here is acting surprised about this. A 23 year old doesn't need to settle down at all. From what I gathered he asked her to marry him. She's got a few years more of slutting it up. When she reaches late 20s she'll be nearing the wall and then accordingly will find a Billy clone.

[–]Solitary_Solidarity 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Yeah i guess you're right, its just a smaller window for her now if she decides to ride the carousel. Oh well.

[–]SovereignSoul76 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Yep. And every Chad that bangs her serves in a ratcheting capacity with regards to her ability to settle. That is to say: if she fucks Channing Tatum, that is now her minimum requirement for a LT mate. Otherwise she just becomes an Alpha widow who resents her Beta-Bux for being a pussy.

[–][deleted] 26 points27 points  (8 children)

Men and women both have high sex drives - it's just expressed differently.

Men generally want large numbers of partners simultaneously. Women generally want sex from one man at a time, leaving her current partner in the dust to chase after the new one.

[–]Solitary_Solidarity 6 points7 points  (7 children)

Yeah i would say thats accurate, just from reading here. I don't have much experience in this tbh but the anecdotes speak for themselves. Im confused about one thing here though, Billy was clearly the better partner in terms of sustaining offspring. Unless she doesnt want kids at all until shes in her mid 30s and used up..

It just makes zero sense, how do you begin to understand this shit?

[–]HotWaffler 12 points13 points  (3 children)

She's in her early 20s and wants to ride the CC for a while. Once she gets close to the wall, then the panic of offspring sets in. Then She'll go back to the Beta Billys but will still sploosh over the Chads.

[–]Solitary_Solidarity 0 points1 point  (2 children)

So is the goal to become a Chad? Or just maximize smv, because right now mine is really low. And i havent been really that interested in getting laid for a long time. I just do as i please, i long trp core message of self improvement.

Thats why im here.

[–]HotWaffler 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It all depends on what your personal opinion of a "Chad" is. Always increase your SMV. Not only for plates but for yourself. Lift heavy shit. Get involved in more activities and always educate yourself. Become the most competent male you can while always maintaining frame.

Edit: And read and follow the side bar consistently.

[–]rathyAro 0 points1 point  (2 children)

You think it's a good idea for her to settle down with a guy she doesn't even like?

[–]Solitary_Solidarity 0 points1 point  (1 child)

She liked him at first though didn't she? The only that changed was this other guy. As far as u can tell anyway.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

She loved him - or so she always said. New guy appears, and all of a sudden "something's always been missing with Billy."

[–]Mr-Ed209 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Its the messed up dichotomy of her beta not being a 'challenge' to her. Women are like dogs chasing cars when it comes to commitment. They run after it but they have no idea what to do once they have it. and generally, once its obvious their target is willing latch to them, they will chase the next shiny new thing - despite how unsuitable it may be.

This dynamic is evident in all aspects of dating. It would suck to get as far as this guy in OP's story and be subject to this. But it happens in all aspects of dating. It's why as a guy the best 'strategy' is to be the guy she is fucking and let her try and earn commitment through good behaviour. Because thats attractive to women. Thats the main tennant of AWALT, they all share that nature.

The solution is to lead. Women are no longer your savior, they are merely something pretty that share your awesome life - maybe indefinitely or maybe for a few weeks, months or years. Marriage is a weak move and any man with true self respect would never agree to it.

[–]Solitary_Solidarity 0 points1 point  (2 children)

So in order for an LTR to work, you have to consistently be out of reach? Or just have a dgaf attitude, does not make sure she will be loyal then? Its not like the old days when failed marriages were frowned upon. So maybe women have always been this way.

Yes i plan on reading more sidebar and hitting the gym hard again for the first time in a while, full monk wont be that hard to do lol nobody really talks to me.

Hopefully itll work out, ideally id like a few fwb. Relationships aren't really for me.

[–]abramN 1 point2 points  (1 child)

great line from the Phillip Black Show (start listening around 13:15): "a woman is like a little kitten, and you are that little piece of yarn dancing around in front of her"


[–]Solitary_Solidarity 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the recommendation ill give it a listen.

[–][deleted] 80 points81 points  (16 children)

My analysis: this girl is a restaurant server at 23, not sure if she's getting a degree to get a better job (you mentioned her going to class).

She finds find beta nice guy Billy, who's responsible, has a good job, a house, a good salary, etc who falls head over heels for her. She literally hit the lottery with this dude, she could probably quit her job and raise her kids as a stay at home in 2 years maximum.

But, she's instead going to continue to work and get with this 18 year old kid until she gets bored of him.

A sucker on Billy's level is a rarity nowadays, this delusional girl probably thinks there's a Billy on every corner waiting for her, after she hops off this 18 year old's dick.

She's in for a nasty shock.

[–][deleted] 49 points50 points  (5 children)

You have some wishful thinking there.

Happy male footstools, mats, and bondsmen are extremely common — it's what exactly has produced and "fed" this behaviour on the fembots' part.

[–][deleted] 42 points43 points  (2 children)

Ofc there are plenty of beta males.

But, Billy's got his own house, a good career, a good future (probably), a good salary, probably a good family, and a good personality.

Everything about him is husband material. A server with no future should feel lucky for landing this guy.

Billy is rare not because he's a beta male, it's because he's a successful beta male footstool who's willing to marry a 23 year old restaurant server.

[–]newls 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Indeed that is all true, but Billy is in the vast majority of guys rather than the minority. This is why the other guy is so notable. If she's smart she won't burn the Billy bridge entirely (i.e. fuck the other guy in secret).

But if it does go south then server girl can hop on Plenty of Landwhales or OkSinglemom or Matchacatlady.com tomorrow and get five more solid prospects just like Billy in the first 24 hours.

All she has to do is reciprocate. Guys on these sites are so deprived of female attention in general that they'll jump on anything, especially if she's good looking.

Try doing a fake signup as a girl on one of these sites. Instant message abundance. There's a lot of garbage but if you click through to some guys' profiles there are doctors, engineers, and devs in there on good salaries like Billy. All she has to do is reciprocate.

Dating sites for girls nowadays are beta catalogues. Pick out a nice looking beta, pay with some duty sex.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There really aren't a lot of men with the same level of wealth as Billy, especially that young.

She could downgrade and find another beta she's good looking, probably not one like Billy though.

[–]econquest -3 points-2 points  (1 child)

What do you get by using dehumanizing language like "fembots"?

Instead, TRP is about identifying correct traits and instincts in all women (what all women are attracted to.)

So in the long term, TRP is sure to win and convert the definition of "woman" to match reality.

Let's use an analogy. Suppose there were men, women, and androids made of silicon. But only men and women had emotions.

Suppose some kind of stupid false ideology taught that men and women are the same as androids, and can run any algorithm.

You say no, there are certain innate desires and behaviors. As part of this you call men and women meatsacks. What does using the term meatsack get you?

Nothing, I say. (But it is a term of derision.) There's a bit of difference because in my example men and women are both meatsacks whereas in TRP it is about the differences between them.

But we don't get anything by dehumanizing.

Instead we need to work to have the proper definition of "human" accepted by everyone.

[–]dingle__dogs 21 points22 points  (1 child)

yeah, right? She's dumb as fuck throwing that all away. To be fair though, if she's unhappy with that then she'll never be happy.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Who throws away a 2 year relationship to get with an 18 year old from class? Lmao.

Best case scenario she's a med student and is on her way to becoming a doctor, which is why she's still in school at 23.

[–]truedemocracy3 18 points19 points  (6 children)

Exactly. This woman has NO idea how fucked she is. She is 23 so in the prime of her looks and probably has a heightened sense of self worth from her teenage years and early 20s. In college she could be a dime, but the fact that she is 23 with no career prospects is a major red flag on her intelligence, decision making abilities, etc.

She still has time to cash out on her youth. But women in their late 20s to late 30s who are still servers/bartenders and cant have a stable relationship are a dime a dozen. She literally has a 2-3 year window unless she can somehow get an actual career before either being a permanent plate or only LTR material to low value men

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Her looks are literally gonna begin to fade 3 years down the line. She needed to cash in her chips NOW. Not later NOW.

I absolutely agree with you, why is this restaurant server with no prospects for the future sleeping around?

Does this woman think she's a doctor and can support herself? Unless this lady is still in school because she's a med student, she's in for a bad time 5 years down the line.

[–]truedemocracy3 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Oh agree that she should move now because a 23 year old waitress still has more potential than a 26 year old one who is simply older.

'The Wall' is very real for women but CAN be delayed by healthy lifestyle, having a good job, dieting, etc. Don't get me wrong - women who go all in on career run a risk of being miserable. But a 23 year old nurse or accountant can still attract good mates when they are 27 or 28.

A 23 year old waitress or bartender says "I'm young and uncertain what to do with my life", which is fine - you are still in your early 20s. A 28 year old waitress or bartender says "I have no prospects, no career goals, no ambition, no longterm planning skills" and will automatically be plated by ANY man with a decent value.

It's the classic case of women conflating SMV with RMV. Top 10% men will sleep with you. But a top 10% man will absolutely laugh at the prospect of a relationship with you.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Absolutely RMV =/= SMV.

The top 10% of men will only be willing to marry good looking women with careers.

The funny part is Billy is probably part of the top 10% of men (other than his beta personality), and this delusional woman is trying to friendzone him.

Fucking hilarious.

What this server needs to understand is, why would a man in his late 20's marry her when there are so many women with an sizable income who desperately want to get married once they hit their late 20's?

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (2 children)

But women in their late 20s to late 30s who are still servers/bartenders and cant have a stable relationship are a dime a dozen.

I honestly think this may be due to the prevalence of ADHD types in the server/bartender industry. Being ADHD myself, we strive in an environment where stimulation is high, and attention must continuously be diverted every 10 to 20 seconds to a different task.

ADHD brains are notoriously bad at relationships, on average.

[–]Pestilence1911 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Kek. Used to be a bouncet and get sexually assaulted every nighy.

Handsome privilege is real.

[–]1ozaku7 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You mean bipolar impulsiveness?

[–]1ozaku7 2 points3 points  (0 children)

hit lottery with this dude, she could probably quit her job and raise her kids as a stay at home in 2 years maximum.

That's such bullcrap. Every man in his life will eventually has his own place, rented or bought, a well paying job, a car and all that standard. Look around you, everyone owns it, only true losers don't.

What Billy owned was in abundance, it's common, it's normal. This is not enough to hold a girl down.

Billy Beta was just a guy who grabbed the first and only thing he could ever grasp his hands on. For him, she was rare, because she was the only one that wanted him. But she is wanted by many other guys.

Billy had no choice between girls, this girl has a choice between men. Billy is the weak link because of his oneitis who doesn't look for THAT special girl, but A girl. He didn't get to sleep around and pick the woman that suits his preferences the most. He just wanted to have a vagina next to him in bed that can cook for him and all that, while he can be himself, the little son that thinks that having a home, car, cock and wedding ring will satisfy her enough to keep her until death parts them.

Women are not loyal like dogs. And even dogs are willing to cheat on you, but the thing is, they have no opportunity to do so. That's why some religious women make such good wives because they are fucking isolated from opportunities and don't know any better.

[–]acekilo 58 points59 points  (6 children)

Women are something else man. I'm glad I never trusted them from the age of 12. Pump and dump them like a bad habit!!! I learned from my mother how women cheat every chance they get.

[–]NoMenLikeMe 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The hilarious part is you’re joking, but nobody else realized it, so you got 20 karma.

Good form.

[–]1ozaku7 22 points23 points  (3 children)

Great read, thank you.

Let me emphasize how your thoughts are very right by identifying what Beta Billy did wrong, which is just being a provider and not a lover (in a nutshell).

The majority of the guys who get the so-called starfish sex is because the man holds the passion. The man should let his instincts take over, fuck her brains out, show her she has a strong man and not some pussy that asks if she would like to have that sweet loving lovemaking like last time.

You could even hear Jeremy Clarkson that the Lamborghini Aventador was amazing, yet... it wasn't a Lambo. It felt too safe, too easy to drive, it didn't give the feeling of danger, the thrill that other Lambo's like the Gallardo gave. And this is exactly the same thing. The guy had it all, but he simply lacked his instincts, his manliness, his masculinity.

Imagine being stuck to a woman who isn't feminine. Who doesn't wear dresses, heels, skirts, fancy makeup, does her hair in all the great ways, is caring, girly, feminine. Imagine a friend who is beta, and another who is alpha. Then consider their female alter-ego. The beta would pretty much be a tomboy, the alpha would be a very feminine girl, right?

Understand that hypergamy isn't always about going from good to better, but maybe they believe that there is a side to a guy that she doesn't know, that he needs time to get used to her, and once that time comes, he will fuck her brains out. But she was just disappointed because she got exactly what she saw, a unmasculine man. Then alpha showed up, who likes to bang chicks and lets his instincts go when he's busy. Some men think (too much) during sex, others, just turn their minds off and their instinct on.

  1. Imagine that even the most innocent girls in public are capable and willing to be the biggest whores in bed for you. It is you who allows and enables them.
  2. Get your testosterone checked and work out. Humans operate on feelings, feelings are produced from chemicals that the brain and body create and release. If something is fucked up there, you will be fucked up aswell. For those who have been depressed, you know how it feels to be off that "drug" that your brain releases. You lose your drive, lose any feelings, you are indifferent to anything and life doesn't make fucking sense. Also, work out, better body, better confidence, BETTER CHEMICALS and BETTER FEELINGS.
  3. Women just want to feel. It's no point to keep a relationship peaceful. Eventually women will intentionally fuck shit up so atleast something is happening. They are addicted to feels and noone can help it. Even if you argue, stand by your norms and values, make her pissed, make her cry, it doesn't matter. There is no appreciation of sunshine without rain, there is no good if there is no bad.

[–]dustman83 0 points1 point  (1 child)

This is pretty good and something I have been struggling with in my marriage. Been together 16 years, married for 7. Two kids, house, vacations, six figure job, attractive and ripped, yet my wife is going through a mid life crisis. She's loaded on anti depressants, ultra caffeinated in morning and stoned as fuck in evening. Addicted to attention and was txting dudes behind my back. Wants to be single and even leave the kids, yet, I fuck the shit out of her, making her scream and cum everywhere. Something telling is she said she doesn't feel anything. I can upgrade on her if I wanted, but mother of my kids and I love her. Also, what's the point if AWALT? Women are just fucked up.

[–]1ozaku7 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The life force of women is fueled by feelings, and feelings come from the body and brain. So maybe get her blood checked. On top of that, leaving you and her kids is her last resort of getting those feels again that make her feel alive.

Women are fucked up, women are drugged up. They are teenagers on permanent drugs. They are exactly like children. Yet, you can love some, you can fuck some till they cum all over the place and fucking love you for it.

You will die at the age of 80. Enjoy life. Don't preoccupy yourself too much with a wife that wants to leave your ass and her own children. Try to save it, but have a plan B ready when plan A kicks the bucket and things go down the shitter.

[–][deleted] 19 points20 points  (1 child)

This was probably the hardest thing for me to come to grips with when I first swallowed TRP.

The fact that “everything you’ve been told about growing up, finding a woman you love, and starting a family was a lie”

We were all told that if you were a nice guy with a nice job then you’d find the love of your life. How false that sentiment truly is.

That’s why I don’t make fun of guys like this who haven’t seen the truth yet.

It’s like Billy here was trying to fix a car but the manual was in mandarin. Him fucking up was inevitable.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Him fucking up was inevitable.

Yes. And there is currently no system in place to prevent men today from being scalded alive.

This poor sucker is going to be shocked at her decision, and will suddenly be all alone, crying and sobbing. All the while, he will desperately try to fight the image out of his mind of his former fiancee having her face forced into a pillow while she's plowed, balls deep, by a different guy who's gorilla fucking her every night.

[–]420KUSHBUSH 16 points17 points  (11 children)

Every time I saw her at work, which was then about once weekly due to her limited scheduling because of schooling, I'd ask about Billy. Her face would light up, she'd smile wide, and tell me about how perfect he is and how wonderful everything is going. They were in love, they were going to be married, start and raise a family, and they would live happily ever after, just the way we're taught it's supposed to be.

You don't understand how much it pains me to say this, but the rule of "It's only your turn" has been proven yet again

[–]1ozaku7 8 points9 points  (4 children)

This is nature. Nothing is yours, NOTHING. Your car? It will be owned by the landfill in 20 years, or another owner in 3. Your house? Your children will inherit it. Your body matter? You drink water in, piss water out. Eat food, crap it out. New cells are made, cells die and are released to the cycle of nature.

You don't exist from the same matter as you did 8 years ago. You can look at a baby picture and you would see a body that has none of the matter anymore that you have in your body right now.

Enjoy the moment.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Your life is all that is really ever yours. Even that will eventually be taken away.

[–]Shredderick420 -1 points0 points  (1 child)

This right here sheds light on life's paradoxes. Why do we cling to the known so much?

[–]1ozaku7 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It's safe. It's comfort. It consumes less energy. Nature always takes the path of least energy. Look at men, we like stability and a comfortable life. Women on the other hand cannot resist the urge to act up on their feelings. Acting on their feelings takes less energy than acting on rationale.

Everything in the universe takes the path of least resistance. That what consumes the energy most efficiently wins.

[–]robowalkers3 -1 points0 points  (5 children)

What if you cheat on her?

What about Jay z cheating on Beyonce, Shaycarl (famous youtuber) cheating on his wife, Cardi B getting cheated on?

Did any of this men think it was only their turn?

Very easy to say that it has been proven again and again when theredpill ONLY posts things that support its preconceived bias.

Confirmation bias at its finest.

[–]420KUSHBUSH 0 points1 point  (4 children)

You neglect the fact that I don't just critique women but men too. Everyone is stupid

Did all three of those actually happen?

[–]robowalkers3 0 points1 point  (3 children)

No man, they didn't happen. I made it all up. You got me.

[–]420KUSHBUSH 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Didn't know they all actually happened, just fact checking

[–]robowalkers3 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Wake up man. The subreddit is looking at relationships through a straw. You asking if all three of those events actually happened without questioning a post on here from an anonymous user that supports the bias of this subreddit is no different from somebody coming out of a cult and realizing the world doesn't operate how they thought it did.

Then you have bitter people roaming the subreddit thinking they are alpha because they read /theredpill for 10 hours a day. Want to know irony? Hating women but then spending the majority of their time figuring out the science on how to interact with them to get sex.

Cracks me up.

This subreddit is based solely on confirmation bias. Yet, most people are too ignorant to see that. I can name thousand of stories of guys who cheat and destroy woman's lives yet those would be ignored. Somebody posts a story about AWALT and everyone starts clapping like seals. Where's the fact checking there?

This isn't reality. It's manufactured by narcissists with superiority complexes.

Show me one objective study done by a reputable source of how much more likely women are to cheat than men? It has been proven again and again you say correct? Shouldn't to be hard for you to provide the information then.

Wake up man. Just don't drink any kool aid if anybody on here offers.

[–]420KUSHBUSH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I question everything. If someone doesn't question every tidbit of information they read then they are a drone, of course I considered it. I'm just saying I wasn't aware about those three despite me assuming I would hear about something that big

thinking they are alpha because they read /theredpill for 10 hours a day.

Anyone like this is a naive child

Want to know irony? Hating women but then spending the majority of their time figuring out the science on how to interact with them to get sex.

This one always makes me giggle, fun to point it out to someone who does that

I am well aware majority of it is confirmation bias, started realizing that more recently. And I do get rattled up about any kind of cheating stories

I am a narcissist with a superiority complex (to myself, don't care about others in that regard. I want success) so you got me there

I never said a woman is much more likely to cheat on a man. I'm just saying any stories with cheating where the cheater is smug and arrogant drives me up the wall

A whole major issue any teacher that's worth their reputation will tell you to always question everything and make assessments for yourself rather than listen to others. Obviously this is important, to always be aware of your surroundings sort of thing

Some of it is confirmation bias, though a lot of the things on here work. Granted I hope you know very very few people would believe a story of someone's field report that sounds like it was an exert from Fifty Shades of Grey or a story with many holes in it

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (3 children)

And then Billy will go into a deep depression and wonder what he did wrong. Meanwhile everyone reading this knows exactly what he did wrong but he has no clue and never will unless he learns TRP basics one way or the other.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Chances of him ever coming across TRP basics: slim.

Chances of him becoming a bitter shell of his former self who's paranoid about women leaving him for the rest of his life: good.

[–]warsie -3 points-2 points  (1 child)

The problem being he wanted to marry her? Yeah makes sense

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Wanting to marry a woman isn't a problem. Many men here on TRP desperately wanted to fall in love, treasure their woman deeply, place her on a pedestal, and sing her praises as they walk the aisle, lose their virginity together, start a family, share their deepest thoughts and emotions, and grow old together, all with total mutual trust and respect.

It is a beautiful thought, and something most men truly want.

Unfortunately, reality hands us bitter, ugly, and awful truths that must be confronted and digested. When people get horny for someone other than their LTR, that primal urge to fuck often overrides all higher-thinking and leads to relationships being flushed down the shitter time and time again.

[–]qwertyuiop111222 11 points12 points  (1 child)

She has 10 requirements. Billy meets 8 of them. But she is missing the other 2 requirements.

New bloke meets those 2 requirements, and she is fascinated that someone who likes her possesses those 2 requirements. Who's gonna bet that when she breaks with Billy and runs into the arms of the new kid....3 months later, she will be all regrets and drama, trying to get Billy back into her life (because now she is missing 8 of those 10 requirements).

Some people deserve to be alone. OP, this co-worker of yours is one of them.

[–]dodgyasfuck 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Perfect. The grass is always greener.

[–]PM_ME_YOUR_RC51 8 points9 points  (2 children)

I see this happen all around me, time and time again. I always wonder why guys my junior don't clue into this shit. A friend even went full vegetarian lately because his gf (a single mom @23) convinced him to.

Now I've realized, they're programmed and man shamed by society into submissive roles. "Happy wife, happy life" right? Everything to make a woman happy! (Obvious /s)

I've learned so many lessons watching divorce rape and child support/alimony bullshit. Not going to happen to me. Ever. AWALT.

It took me some years, but I finally took the red pill. Never going back.

[–]1ozaku7 3 points4 points  (1 child)

I heard that "Happy wife, happy life" before.

I prefer to say "Easy wife, easy life", or "Satisfying wife, satisfying life".

[–]dodgyasfuck 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"Happy wife" is bullshit, though. It's like living with the Borg. Whatever you do is instantly taken for granted, and any future repeat is treated like the second time you hear a good joke.

I don't buy my wife perfume or massage her any more, because I used to do those things a lot and she took it for granted. So she can get fucked. And she knows it, too. She knows her fucking attitude is the reason I turned that shit off.

Don't ever try to be an active part of their happiness. They either have it or they don't. Anything you do is temporary. Don't waste your time and don't invite their contempt by familiarity.

[–]zeuD13 15 points16 points  (8 children)

I mean it doesn't necessarily mean that Billy was beta rather than the chick like all women are sluts.

[–]a_strategos 24 points25 points  (4 children)

It definitely means he wasn't super alpha. I don't mean to degrade anyone but if he has a house and financial security, he is definitely significantly higher value than a girl working as presumably a server or bartender. Yet, he had managed to act like a "son" as opposed to a man in control.

[–]le_dod0 1 points1 points [recovered]

This. Also, who the fuck proposes after 6 months? Fucking hell...

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It may have been longer. I don't really keep track of their timelines.

[–]dynospectrum7 11 points12 points  (0 children)

At least a little beta. OP stated that Billy proposed after only six or so months. You have to wonder how long they lived together prior to the engagement. Either way, its not nearly enough time to fully vet someone for such a commitment.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes it does. She is in no way abnormal in her behavior. He blew it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lol. A non-beta detects tingle-absence, and/or has an ego hardened enough to not self-deceive about what he has detected.

[–]truedemocracy3 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Women who are post-college and still work in the service industry are very low value and very rarely demonstrate any reasonable LTR traits. This behavior really isnt surprising.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Man. This hits you right in the feels. Billy doesn't know, but I feel for him. As black & white as this sounds, that's just how the game goes sometimes. These kinds of situations make you realize, never put your gaurd down. Ever! Any updates would be awesome. This is like a sad movie lol. Not laughing at Billy but damn this shit is crazy and way too common. Even worse situations are happening like people above mentioned.

[–]PMmeYOURrareCONTENT 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Her calling off the engagement is the best case scenario lol

Hope she doesn't marry him to milk his wallet

[–]pretty-legit 4 points5 points  (11 children)

"Of course, we all know here at TRP that this extreme and rapid change of heart didn't come out of thin air. ..."

New to the community, can someone elaborate on this?

[–][deleted] 26 points27 points  (10 children)

i.e., women never ditch a man unless there's another man lined up and ready to go.

[–]Solitary_Solidarity 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Monkey branching is the term right? Attractive women have multiple branches to choose from. Monkeys love to swing, they have too. Lol.

[–]pretty-legit 1 point2 points  (8 children)

Yeah I got that part, but what are the red flags that the dude could of missed

[–]2CasaDeFranco 2 points3 points  (0 children)

She's 23 and works as a waitress. She clearly isn't making good long term choices.

[–]Deep_freeze202 1 point2 points  (5 children)

Fewer or lack of indications of interest (ioi) Being distant/less available Being less sexual/avoiding intercourse Stops or reduces doing things like cooking, cleaning ECT the sorts of things women do for men Acting disrespectful, flirting with other people ECT

There are a lot of things that are tells and really arent hard to notice unless you're blinded by "love".

[–]dodgyasfuck -1 points0 points  (4 children)

Please stop using ECT. It is "etc".

[–]Deep_freeze202 -1 points0 points  (3 children)

Yeah I really don't give a fuck soooo....

[–]dodgyasfuck -1 points0 points  (2 children)

The entire point of trp is self improvement, bro. ECT is a huge red flag calling you a dummy. Up to you if you'd like to put it away.

[–]Deep_freeze202 0 points1 point  (1 child)

My spelling and grammar are more than sufficient, making an insignificant error on occasion doesn't really matter especially when the only time writing is going to come into play involving women is in text where proper spelling and grammar are all but irrelevant. I think youre simply looking for an opportunity to play the smart guy. I'll keep my attention focused where it matters thanks.

[–]dodgyasfuck 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Foolish, but your choice. It is every bit as clear a flag as a butcher's apostrophe or wrong use of your/you're. So if you simply start using "etc" then your writing will be better and more authoritive.

I think you're just being proud, and it's a shame.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Somebody once said "if her nipples don't swell during the sexual act, she is cheating".

That's the kind of red flags. But of course emotionally affectionate men — and I was a paragon of their class — start self-lying to not face a break-up (which will came at her decision, later, and will be yet more hurtful).

[–]CursingWhileNursing 2 points3 points  (0 children)

She said there wasn't much, or any, "passion, for as long as they'd been together."

I always find it amazing how easily women can retcon whole years in their mind. "I feel no passion for him now and since my feelz are reality and reality can't change, I think I never felt any passion for him!"

It's actually fascinating, it is like self-hypnosis. They can convince themselfes that they have never loved someone. I guess this is the reason why women are over a relationship so fast. A bit of public drama, a bit of basking in the fake compassion of their female friends, a new haircut... and for the days between thursday and sunday she already can make plans on finding a new toy.

[–]2Dmva100 16 points17 points  (9 children)

It is well known that the majority of engaged/married women are easy to pull and put on your plate roster.  She has the ultimate security of provisioning of her sexual strategy satisfied and insured, so her AF is in full swing.

I'm not going to delve to deep into AF/BB and pulling married women, I am here to tell you why whenever you hookup with a married woman you must ALWAYS fuck her in the ass.

The primary reason a married woman is fucking you on the side NSA is because you are attractive and she wants your sperm so she can have hot Alpha babies that BB will pay for.   The primary reason you are fucking a married woman is because you are a sexual beast who doesn't give a fuck and wants to own her as your sexual slave, knowing full well that her hubby can never have such a privilege because he gets all the other 'sides' of her that you don't want nor have to deal with.

With the above stated, you cannot give that married woman the satisfaction of feeling you in her pussy.  You must fuck her in the ass because it is the worst possible tease in the world for her.  She feels your dominant cock pounding her and pumping her anus full of hot cum, but she doesn't achieve her grand objective of getting your babies.  She will become the most submissive, dirty super-slore for you if you carrot-dangle penetrative sex with her.  Plate her with anal and blowjobs, but never the PIV.   This also gives her the ultimate plausible deniability if ever questioned or confronted.  'We never had sex!' Or to herself 'well that was anal so it didn't count.'

The only time it is appropriate to do PIV is after she has begged, session after session, to feel you inside her, that you bust a massive load in her and create a cuckspawn.  She will have become so sexually degraded by you at this point that even if her current BB leaves her, she won't come to you for support. She will find a new BB.  The risk here is yours to take.

Why bother if you aren't fucking her pussy you ask?   Well the answer is easy.  You have other plates for that, and you just don't give a fuck because you are the shit.

[–]calibeachgod420 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Would you let the guy watch? Lol

[–]greatamericancities 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Brutal. Love it.

Have taken this road by accident and it played out as you describe. Next time I'll take a more purposeful approach, just to see how much I can get away with.

[–]Endorsed Contributormonsieurhire2 2 points3 points  (0 children)

+1 for cuckspawn.

[–]dodgyasfuck -1 points0 points  (2 children)

Retarded to bust a live nut raw in a married woman. Totally retarded. She is a clinger. What kind of moron invites child support financial rape? The kid comes out looking like you, she likely gets a divorce and you have a child and the payments. The child is the more important factor there, too. A real person in a fucked up situation because you're a dick who wants to feel like an alpha.

And not all cuckolded men are betas. Some women are just cheating cunts. So don't go thinking the sidebar will save you from a bat to the head, and choose your cucks wisely.

[–]2Dmva100 0 points1 point  (1 child)

If a cuck ever threatened me I'd just go after the children, even if it was mine.

Dude would fold when my boot is on their tiny throat.

'Okay okay omg okay you can keep fucking her and I'll pay the bills just don't hurt them, puuhleeaazzee.'


[–]dodgyasfuck 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Bullshit fantasies aside, choose your plates wisely

[–]Extremely_Photogenic 5 points6 points  (4 children)

I bet if he broke off the engagement now, Joanne would be completely head over heels for him again and he'd be Mr. Perfect again. If he got some hot, younger girl it'd be 10x worse.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Good god do I hope he lands an uber-hottie after she leaves.

[–]Extremely_Photogenic 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Same. Please provide updates

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Update: Joanne and the new guy are "facebook official" and she posts pics of them regularly. He rides bmx, knows how to publicly speak, and is quite handsome.

Poor Billy never had a chance. I am not friends with Billy on social media, so I have no idea how he's doing, but my guess is that he was and is a wreck, and probably single as hell.

[–]fflando 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The only reason why she wants to stay friends with Billy is to make herself feel less guilty about what she’s done.

[–]re4d3 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Do not be so harsh on her. If you got a girl which is ready to cook, clean and take care, but, alas, she is not womanly, or just fat and no spark whatsoever, you would call it off as well. The problem is, we are taught "what girls want" and it is just half truth at best.

[–]PanaReddit 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Keep us updated, please. I bet my ass she won't be calling off the wedding.

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Let's unravel the ancient RP scroll, shall we:

"And the woman shall breaketh off her courtship to Billy Beta, and she shall receiveth the breadth and width of Chad's loins into her bosom. Whence she hath drunken the intoxicating wine of Chad's goblet, dopamine and endorphins will have runneth their course, and she shall return to her homeland to a tearful and broken Billy Beta, where he shall welcometh her once again with tears of joy.

He shall cling to her, and her to him, and the two shall be one flesh - and one wallet.

Lest another Chad maketh his way unto her path.

Thus saith the Red Pill. Amen."

[–]jrr6415sun 2 points3 points  (2 children)

what makes billy a beta? It seems like you don't know anything about him besides that he used to make her happy.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

what makes billy a beta?

From the horse's mouth: "He behaves like a child. I have to basically hold him by the hand and lead him around at times. He throws tantrums. He's a social chameleon, becoming whoever it is he hangs out with at the time."

[–]n8dawwg 1 point2 points  (2 children)

OP, please give a update in a few weeks. This is gold.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Update: Joanne and the new guy are "facebook official" and she posts pics of them regularly. He rides bmx, knows how to publicly speak, and is quite handsome.

Poor Billy never had a chance. I am not friends with Billy on social media, so I have no idea how he's doing, but my guess is that he was and is a wreck, and probably single as hell.

[–]SickOfIt518 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Billy will take her back once 18 year old sows his oats and moves on to the next easy lay and then Billy will be right here on dead bedrooms.

[–]zyqkvx 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Billy got off easy. Could have got married / divorced.

[–]ridesano 0 points1 point  (0 children)

not a red piller but is doesnt take a genius to know girls are attracted to money. billy was the safety net. he still is, if something was to make her realise that her new love cant provide what billy can bet you she'll be "in love with him again". when something better comes along she will dip.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lucky Billy! If she gives back the ring and bails out before getting married instead of going through with it, riding a bunch of dicks while married to Billy, having some kids who may or may not be his, but for whom he will definitely be paying child support, then kicking him out of his own house and taking a substantial portion of his other assets, all with the force of the government behind her, then Billy is a lucky man indeed!

[–]yummyluckycharms 0 points1 point  (0 children)

her dumping billy would be the best thing for him, but thats not whats going to happen.

She's going to marry him, fuck chad on the side, and then divorce billy after the appropriate period of time. This way she gets her cake and can eat it after having a wild party on billy's dime. Hell - its what I'd do given the current legal situation in the west

Hypergamy is awesome for the evolution of the species, not so good for society

[–]halfback910 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank God for him she's doing it before tying the knot.

[–]Redpillandrew 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I loved this field report. Some bluepill examples are better than others: i can really relate to this one, it really points out how women conceal their true feeels to lock down their safe BB. That's why I add, as a reminder: look at her actions, not her words.

[–]Birdog770 0 points1 point  (0 children)

After the wall, she'll still be waiting tables. Except, instead of the high end restaurant that hires young hot chicks she'll be at waffle house.

[–]sloanpal144 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Billy is actually the winner in this story, once you really think about it. He dodged a bullet, and possibly will become open to reconsidering everything he once thought he knew about women leading him ever closer towards TRP. The only loser here is Joanne.

[–]willso86 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You can say this and that to explain why a woman would dump a good man with a good job, house and a real provider but there is no accounting for just plain stupid

Recently happened to a friend of mine. She has it all set up for her, a nice house, he has a great job and they have a son together. Due to get married this year but she called it off for no apparent reason

[–]antariusz 0 points1 point  (0 children)

She isn’t even going to tell him.

She’ll just cheat.

The alpha fucks won’t commit. Then she’ll go back to billy. He’ll never know.

[–]ramjaz 0 points1 point  (6 children)

Couldn’t help but notice your comment towards the end of your post about your mom leaving your dad.

How do you feel about her after she did that? Just curious because I always thought Red Pillers love their moms unconditionally.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (3 children)

It's the weirdest thing you can imagine. You do always love your mother. After you own mom burns you like that and runs off, you want to beat the tar out of her and rip her head off, while simultaneously never wanting to do anything to hurt her.

So, you hold all of that anger inside, never venting it to the place you should have. It leaks out all over, in the form of hatred towards all women, substance abuse, malice, etc.

[–]ramjaz 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wow. Now that you say that, my story makes a lot of sense.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

That makes sense, but is very, very unhealthy.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Absolutely. It took me a long time to realize that this was even happening. I'm a much better person, now.

[–]TRPcez 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Mom > Man > Woman > Children (reset)

Red Pillers love their moms unconditionally

Unconditional love does not exist backwards. You will never love your mother the way she loved you. Same with man and woman. Read more post about this. GL

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Unconditional love does not exist backwards. You will never love your mother the way she loved you.

Well, the natural state of things is as you say, no doubt. However, maybe some of us will love our mom as she loves us after experience with how all other women "love" us.

[–]Luis_McLovin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He was the best thing until the next-best came along. Her priorities for what she wanted in a partner were different. What happened was to be expected and the man was foolish to commit in a span of six months.

[–]reddzeppelin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

you cant worry about someone leaving you. thats hamstering. I dont think a LTR is inconsistent the TRP, however in this case it doesnt read to be of someone with an abundance mentality.

[–]NibblyPig 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Call off the engagement? Guess again!

Free meal ticket baby

[–]murt98 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That’s what you get for falling in love with a waitress, someone whose job is to flirt with strangers for tips. Any woman who works in a restaurant, bar, club, or even goes to the latter 2, stay the hell away from.

[–]jewishsupremacist88 0 points1 point  (0 children)

its happened many times before but suckers will be suckers. just the natural order of thangs..

[–]11-Eleven-11 0 points1 point  (0 children)

6 months though. I can't even feel bad for the guy. Thats just stupid.

[–]enkae7317 0 points1 point  (0 children)

6 months then propose? Wtf people move fucking quick nowadays. How you going to commit to a girl for fucking LIFE (or presumably so) after knowing her for only 6 months?

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The entire trip, Joanne will be plotting the right time after they return to call off the engagement, return the ring, and branchswing up to her new, higher branch. And, why not? She's known him a whole 3 weeks - this is true love! Time to upgrade to the new, shinier model that I've never even test-driven! Fuck the guy who owns a home, has a good, stable job, and is offering a lifetime of commitment.

Most likely she'll just not get round to telling him. Make sure New Chad will stick around before branchswinging, and that means overlapping long enough to be certain. Which she never will be... so she'll have an affair until either the new guy turns beta or remains aloof and dumps her.

Billy will never know.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"the vagina has moistened" haha great writing 10/10

[–]drqxx -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Be the Alpha or at least the Omega.

[–]smokecheck1976 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Dude, she's 23. I can make a few guesses about her. She is either still living in her hometown going to college or she is nearby. She is driving a car that Daddy paid for, or is still paying for. She has her own apartment, (At that age. if that isn't hanging out a "fresh meat" sign, I don't know what is.) so she "could be away from her parents", who still pay most of her bills.

I see it every year in the town where I live, it happens to have a large university. Every year, I think this is it, this is the year I turn into the guy old enough to be their dad and I age out after only having a few years of fun with women that age, I work out even harder. Year after year, so far, I'm still the "fun older guy" that they (usually grad students) don't tell their parents about.

In our modern culture, it's usually a mistake to think most people that age, man or woman, are ready to make a lifetime affecting decision. They aren't, not usually. In the past, maybe, but life is easy in the west, and to tell the truth, most days are not a life and death struggle.

Billy is the right choice. She might not be the right choice for him.

[–]_-_steve_-_ -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Hopefully Billy will dodge this bullet before getting divorce-raped and learn a life changing lesson.

[–]cooler_booler -1 points0 points  (1 child)

TRP is about the real stories like Salma Hayak marrying a 60 year old French billionaire for his money. I think this is made up story, "the guy is 18 years old, has a a good salary and owns a home". What is he, a magician. TRP moderators should validate some of these anecdotes as real or imagination.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Guess again. Her new interest is 18. Her fiancee is right around her age. Probably 23-25.

[–]excaliboor -1 points0 points  (1 child)

Personal question out of curiosity, if you don't mind.

  • Once women get tingles, they will bail on a good man who's given her everything (like in the case of my mom who ran out on my father after 20 years).

This was for another guy, too?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes. She first cheated on my father with his coworker. After my Pops forgave her and took her back, she left for a second man - a total opposite of my Pops. He doesn't work, is lazy af, but displays some alpha characteristics. She's still with him today, 15 years later.


[–]NorthEasternNomad -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Women in our society are conditioned, almost from birth, to believe two things are absolute truth:

  1. Men should feel honored and/or privileged that they have "shown up" or choose to remain in our lives. At all. Hence, the friend zone exists at all. Thus, women believe, deep down, that just showing up, or being there, is enough.

Enough to call it contribution. Enough to turn us on. Enough to keep us interested. It does not, in their mind, matter - at all - whether they DO or OFFER anything after the courting phase. Being there is privilege enough for us men.

  1. Acquisition is the key to happiness. If you're unhappy - or even confused, maudlin or just bored - the ONLY path back to happiness, is through the acquisition of something, or someone, NEW.

According to the life long conditioning to which women are subjected, nothing you currently have in your life can possibly restore happiness or excitement. Obtaining something new, is the only way to achieve that.

Does this excuse AWALT behavior? No. Because grown women SHOULD know better. They should be able to sit down and reason things about. Apply SOME measure of logic to even the most emotionally driven circumstances in order to assert some measure of intellectual reasoning into the matter.

But refer again to "most responsible teenager in the house" here. Because now I have read that "theory" I see proof if it all over the place. Even now and then from my own otherwise pretty great LTR Partner herself.

The more you give them, and the higher the pedestal on which you place them, the less they want you. Because in that giving the perceive blind, submissive acquiesence to their will, and that, is not manly. And manly, strong, firm hands on the tiller - and the headboard - are what really matter most to them. If it were otherwise, Leave it to Beaver would still be more popular than 50 Shades of I-wish-i-could-admit-it.

[–]clme -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Can you comment on the physical attractiveness of Billy vs. the 18 year old? Is Billy just average looking?

[–]An_All-Beef_Engineer -1 points0 points  (0 children)

/u/StinkyDiaper Maybe you're wrong. Who says she won't marry Blly while getting sweet 18 yr old dick on the side???

[–]emantos -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I say Billy got a blessing in disguise.

[–]bringer_of_glory -1 points0 points  (0 children)

"He behaves like a child. I have to basically hold him by the hand and lead him around at times. He throws tantrums. He's a social chameleon, becoming whoever it is he hangs out with at the time."

Billy sounds weak. Why should she be willing to marry him? Just because he has a job and a house? You really think this is what you need, to make a woman happy? In the beginning, she got what she thought she wants (commitment, nice partner, engagement). After a while she realized, that Billy actually sucks. Spending her life with a pussy like him doesn't sound nice anymore. So what?

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