FitnessMy #1 tip for muscle growth (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by TheDialecticParadox

Since my previous text submission 5 days ago: '10 ways to boost your appearance', I have recieved 20+ private messages asking for my routine in the gym. To me, this is an indicator there is a gap in knowledge for readers of TRP.

A newbie who comes across TRP is told to lift. He reads the sidebar and picks a beginner program like stronglifts or starting strength to build a strong frame and foundation. After around a year, his lifts start to stagnate and while he has put on a decent amount of muscle he wonders: 'what now?'.

Instead of just pasting my routine in here for newbies to blindly follow, I thought I would go a bit more in depth and offer advice for what has given me the best results with a lot of experimentation in the gym, professional advice from coaches, and a lot of reading.

To show I am not talking out of my arse, here is a pic I just took with my mobile. To those wondering I weigh 174lb @ 5'11". I've been gymming on and off (due to injury) for a couple of years now.

Disclaimer: I believe 90% of the people who read TRP are interested in maximising their muscle growth and getting as 'big' as possible, as fast as possible. The other 10% are simply interested in getting stronger. This advice is catered towards the 90%

So, let's get straight to the point: What's my #1 tip for maximising muscle growth?



Too often I see countless gym bros and skinny newbies cheating their way through their routine. It is a crime a very large majority of the gym population are guilty of. But, if you think about it; how many of the people that go to the gym actually achieve the results they want? (Answer: less than 10%).

Now, there are multiple ways to think of this 'rule' of mine:

  1. Resistance
  2. Form
  3. Breathing

  4. Is very simple. Fight gravity.

How often do you see people curling absurd amounts of weight and simply let the weight fall down to their hips after the peak contraction? Are you guilty of this?

This doesn't just apply to curling, every movement should have a controlled tempo.

  • The contraction phase (the muscle shortening) should be fast and explosive. Aim for 1 second.

  • The peak phase is the end of the contraction. Really squeeze the muscle and force blood into it to pump it up. Mind muscle connection is very important for safe and effective lifting.

  • The eccentric phase is the one that is neglected by the majority of lifters. This is the extension of the muscle. For example: Lowering the weight to your hips after a curl, dropping down into a squat, or lowering the bar to your chest during bench.

Aim for a minimum of 3 seconds to complete this phase. If this phase is something you have neglected, you will have to lower the weight you are using without a doubt.

Why is this?

Well, if you think about it, contraction and peak is only 50% of the actual movement you are doing. If you neglected the eccentric phase and simply dropped the weight and relaxed the muscle you are only performing 50% of a proper rep.

Therefore, if you introduce the eccentric portion of the lift and use a 5 second rep tempo (1,1,3), you will jump from 50% resistance to 100%!!

If you didn't use the peak phase either, you will jumping from 40% to 100%!

So essentially you are doubling the amount of work your muscle is doing simply by fighting gravity!

You will notice you will get strong as hell and your muscles will get a ridiculous pump if you focus on getting 100% out of every rep.

Conclusion: Leave your ego at the door and use weight you can fully control!

☆EDIT☆ i assumed this was common sense, but as swift_rage pointed out, there are some small exceptions to this rule. If you are maxing out on the deadlift or bent over row, it is perfectly fine to ignore the eccentric phase and drop the weight. This is to prevent injury. Trying to resist 150kg falling from hip height is asking for trouble!

2. Form

This is pretty simple. Maintain correct form at all times. If your gym has them, check a mirror for reference. If they don't, film yourself. If you can't get the form right, look at ways to engage mind muscle connection to muscles that aren't working how they should.

The most common exercises I see with the worst form are squats, bent over rows, and pullups/chinups.

My advice:


Everyone should be able to do low bar squats unless you have restricted mobility due to injury. If you can't, hire a powerlifting coach to show you the ropes. Actually, even if you can low bar squat, I recommend seeing a coach anyway to grasp basic programming for strength. I will talk about this later on.

If you want to do high bar squats, this is what helped me get ATG with good weight (I currentlt do 200lb for 5x10).

  • Stretch your hip flexors, quads and calves every day.

  • If you see a pole, practice body weight 3rd world squats whilst holding onto it. Lean forward, backwards and to the sides until you feel a stretch in your calves/shins. Hold. These should take around 2-3 minutes.

note: It's okay to let your back round, the goal is to stretch your shins out.

  • Once you have acheived your desired level of mobility then you can reduce the frequency of stretching and third world squats. I simply do them as a cool down after my lower body routine 2x a week now.

  • Do RDL'S and hamstring curls at least once a week.

  • If you can front squat, front squat at least once a week. If you can't, do goblet squats.

The idea of all this is to increase mobility, and strengthen the core and hammies. It's very easy to build strong quads and to neglect your hammies/glutes, especially since most of us sit down all day.

☆Bent over row☆:

Your back should be parallel to the floor. That is proper form. I don't care what your local gym bro says, if you really want huge lats, then you will do it.

Before you start the movement, suck air into your gut and brace like you're about to take a punch. Let your knees bend slightly and your hips slide back, like you're about to get fucked doggystyle, and row the weight off the floor. Control the bar on the way down, exhale. Take another breath, brace and repeat 5-6x. This will work your core and posterior chain as well as your lats. Do not do these and heavy deadlifts on the same day.


If you don't use an ab wheel as part of your core workout I suggest you start. It has immense carrover to the pullup and chin up.

The pullup is pretty simple. Start hanging from the bar with your legs crossed, look at the ceiling, and try and pull your sternum to the bar, whilst squeezing your scapula together and elbows down and back.

The chin up is essentially the same, except you can get away with looking ahead, focus on pinning your elbows to your sides, and try and pull yourself 'through' the bar during the peak to get a good pump.

Do not swing your legs. Do not bob your head. Do not let yourself drop down during the eccentric phase. This will ruin your shoulders and elbows.

If you can't even do one pullup or chinup, don't use the assisted pullup machine. Grab a stool and a resistance band, wrap one end around the pull up bar and the other on one of your bent knees. Jump up to the bar and fighting gravity; lower yourself as slowly as you can. Repeat 5-6 times for as many sets as you can manage.

Yes you will look dumb, but once you can do 3 unnassisted pullups, you can start the russian fighter pullup program. When you can do 12 unnassisted pullups/chinups in a row, add weight.

3. Breathing

Look up the valsalva maneuver. This is essentially creating a ball of pressurized air in your diaphragm to stabilize your spine and therefore your lower back.

Focus on breathing into your gut instead of into your lungs. Your shoulders shouldn't rise and fall with your breathing. The only thing that should move is your gut. When it is full of air, you simply 'squeeze' your core like you are going to take a punch.

You do not have to do the valsalva maneuver for every exercise, but when you are doing a movement that uses the posterior chain or lower back it is essential to prevent injury and increase strength.

Now that we've covered some simple ways to increase the effectiveness of the way you lift weights, I'll quickly glaze over some other important topics:


No matter how hard you work in the gym, you aren't going to see much progress if your body is covered in a blanket of fat. If you are >15%bf, you need to focus your attention on what you are putting into your body, and not what you do in the gym. Here is a quick chart you can use for reference if you don't know your bf%.

There are plenty of articles, research and even TRP submissions with info on cutting bodyfat down. If enough people are interested I will consider putting together a post on this in more detail, otherwise:

  • Eat a good portion of vegetables, and have complex carbohydrates every day before and after you work out for energy and recovery.
  • Minimize packaged foods, soft drinks and generally refined sugar and breads.
  • Consume plenty of fish, chicken and red meat. If you can't cook: learn.
  • Remember to eat a small serve of healthy fats like nut butters, olive oil and avacado every day.

Here's an example.

That's my lunch and dinner everyday (with meat variations of course) it looks boring, but when you marinate the meat for 48 hours in low-sugar honey bbq sauce it tastes amazing.

That's all I have for now, for those that are interested, I'll also include my routine below so I stop getting pm's about it

This is a modified powerlifting routine, with increased accessory volume for more muscular hypertrophy instead of density. Track your weights lifted, emphasize a 5 second tempo and ensure adequate rest (2-3 mins for compound movements and 60 secs for asseccory movements).

All exercises in brackets are a week 2 variation, to give some variety and optimize muscle growth.

Exercises with +'s are compound movements and should be no more than 5x6 imo. Accessory exercises should be around 5x10-15



+Incline bench (+flat bench)

Decline db press (incline db press)

Incline dumbbell flys (cable flyes)

Db pullover

Finish off with 5x sets of decline push ups to failure.


+Deadlifts (+Bent over row)

+Weighted Wide grip pull-ups (+Weighted chin ups)

Db row (wide grip cable pulldown)

One hand cable row (straight arm pulldown)


+Weighted dips

Db kickback (skullcrushers)

Rope pulldown (overhead db arm extension)

+BB curl

Reverse grip BB curl (Hammer curls)

Concentration curls (preacher curls)


+Squats (rotate between high bar, low bar and front squats to hit your legs from all angles and ensure even development.)

Db lunges (BB lunge)

Leg extension (+leg press)

Lying or seated hamstring curl (+RDL's)

☆Seated and standing calf raises☆

Calfs are a problem area for most, until very recently I was the same. Do the following and they will grow:

50 rep sets with light weight. Rest for 60 secs. Super set with standing calf raises and repeat 5x. Focus on squeezing the calf at the top of the movement and don't 'bounce'. Control your descent and explode up.

note it's important to do both seated and standing variations of calf raises as they work different calf muscles. Standing hits the gastrocnemius and seated works the soleus.


+Overhead BB press (+seated DB OHP)

Upright rows (face pulls)

Lateral db raise (cable lateral raise)

Front db raise (cable front raise)

Bent over db lateral raise (bent over cable lateral raise)

Ab wheel

hanging leg raises

Weighted plank.

[–]musclehacking 53 points54 points  (22 children)

From your food pic, either you eat your veggies frozen or really like your salt.

[–]Jack4ss92 8 points9 points  (3 children)

seriously, what is that? msg ?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

msg is a type of salt still. that much would be fucking gross, same as normal salt.

[–]Swift_Rage 39 points40 points  (31 children)

Eccentric phase not always recommended. Example: Heavy deadlifts.

edit: Nice forearms btw

[–]TheDialecticParadox[S] 6 points7 points  (4 children)

I agree. Maxing out deadlifts is an exception. I'll edit my post.

[–]Wilreadit 1 point2 points  (3 children)

No you are right and swift_rage is not. In competition you are not trying to tire yourself and it may be ok to drop weights. When you are trying to build strength or muscle, the eccentric phase is crucial. You need to use a sub max weight and really do a controlled lowering, taking up to 5 seconds and infact stopping mid way for another 5 secs. This will lend both isometric contraction in an isotonic contraction.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMetalgear222 1 point2 points  (12 children)

Why not? Why skip half the motion, if your form caves at the eccentric portion of a heavy deadlift you weren't ready to go up to that weight. Sure powerlifters and crossfitters will disagree.. But controlling deadlifts on the way down adds immeasurable strength.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMarsupian 2 points3 points  (1 child)

You dont slowly lower heavy deads, you do a controlled drop. With warmup sets sure but there is a reason you can deadlift more than you can RDL.

If you want to slowly lower heavy deads you are either choosing to never deadlift heavy or risking fucking up your back.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMetalgear222 1 point2 points  (0 children)

controlled drop is what im talking about. just dropping it is what i disagree with.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (6 children)

You don't want to spend a shitload of time lowering the bar.

brb getting a lifetime back injury

[–]AntiWhite 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Just stop. The eccentric is just as important as the concentric on all lifts. You don't drop the weights just because you can't finish the lift. Only on 1-3 rep max lifts is there a reason to drop the weights and there better be no less than 3 plates on each side even then. There is a little guy in our "quite" gym dropping 275 on the floor for reps... Don't be that guy. Be these guys

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

You're not quite sure who you're talking to. You control the weight down, but on lifts like deadlifts you don't spent an eternity lowering the weight like you would with a chest pressing movement.

If you could see me or my lifts you would pipe down in an instant.

[–]AntiWhite 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Sorry I thought by your comment you were concentric only. There are plenty out there. Hope you enjoy the video at least.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No worries. Those people do exist. They're called morons lol

Eccentric is arguably more important for strength than concentric. You get beast strength by actually minding the eccentric phase which most people ignore. When I powerlifted and actually gave half a care about proper form and control my lifts exploded almost overnight.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Checking in; had poor but not awful form, wore running shoes, lowered the bar slowly, injured my lower bqck for about 2 years. Still cant do heavt deadlifts any more.

[–]Wilreadit 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Should have chosen a smaller weight first and then did eccentric with those. Then your back would have been steel.

[–]akshay7394 -3 points-2 points  (11 children)

I'm pretty sure his point is that if you can't do it at that weight, you should lower the weight and practice until you can. Which would apply to deadlifts, too. Nobody should be going straight into heavy deadlifts.

[–]Swift_Rage 20 points21 points  (3 children)

Its not about that. Even if you set an appropriate weight where you are able to lower it(but still heavy ie 1-5rm range), slow eccentric can be extremely taxing and potentially damaging even when keeping proper form. Most of the varsity athletes at my gym drop it when going below the knee.

quick google:



[–]akshay7394 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, fair enough :) I'm not pretending to know everything about deadlifting, haha! I just meant, logically, since the way you'd do it with any other weight-based exercise is to lower the weight until you're comfortable, it stood to reason that you can with deadlifts too. Which is the point OP was trying to make -- I'm sure they wouldn't be damaging if you maintain form with a weight you can handle.

But, like I said, I definitely don't know a lot about deadlifting in general, so you could definitely be right.

[–]PawnToKing 6 points7 points  (1 child)

The slow deadlift eccentric is retarded. Don't do it. Ever.

[–]akshay7394 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh I'm not planning to, I meant that going by OP's logic, he's specifically saying not to start with heavier weights, that's all. I generally stick to bodyweight fitness programs with 2 days of additional free weights mixed in, so I don't deadlift often anyway.

[–]tuxedoburrito 2 points3 points  (2 children)

You're being downvoted but this is exactly what every professional coach and trainer says. Do not go heavy until your form is perfect and your muscles can handle this. Also you have joints that need to be strengthened, neuro pathways that need to be taught to do lifts. Start at medium weight, get your form down, then build up.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMetalgear222 6 points7 points  (0 children)

yep connective tissue takes on average 4-6 weeks to strengthen at a given weight, thats why its important to increment up slowly to achieve positive results without getting injured.

[–]akshay7394 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You're being downvoted but this is exactly what every professional coach and trainer says.

Yeah it's literally Weightlifting 101, haha. Idk about deadlift specifically, but it's definitely what you're supposed to do with any other weighted exercise, so I don't see why it wouldn't apply to deadlifts as well.

[–]PeeHurt -1 points0 points  (1 child)

Post a physique pic and what's your 1rm. I'll post mine and tell you my DL afterwards

[–]stickfiguresk 11 points12 points  (1 child)

10‰ of gym goers get the results they want

More like 1‰ are happy with their results and 9‰ are yolked and horribly insecure.

woo! Lmao4plate!!!1 ... Wait... Ah fuck, there's a 5plate....

Errybody thats established that intermediate base should read Practical Programming to learn rep schemes and pacing, and why pre-made routines are built the way they're built and who they're for.

[–]PawnToKing 2 points3 points  (0 children)

mentions practical programming. I smile. Good on you for bringing some timeless literature into this discussion of opinions.

[–]5kevin 25 points26 points  (11 children)

The #1 tip to gaining muscle is proper amount of sleep.

[–][deleted] 17 points18 points  (4 children)

The #1 tip to gaining muscle is gear, followed by diet, then followed by sleep. Let's be real here.

[–]Marcus1138 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Gear's magical and all, but you still need to be eating at a surplus, sleeping, and working out to see the benefits. If you aren't resting at all, aren't eating enough, or aren't working out, gear won't do squat.

[–]Mckallidon 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Actually bad sleep minimizes the effects of gear, which ratchets up the process that occurs during sleep that builds muscle. You only grow in your sleep and during certain hours if you're sleeping. Gear or not, proper sleep is number 1. Calories is number 2.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

This is actually false, supplementing testosterone actually reduces the amount of sleep a human needs to work at peak efficiency. :) This has been pretty well studied and documented back when there were still a lot of studies being done on steroids.

I wouldn't even number them in a list, and that's a mistake I made in my original post. It's more like you can't make optimal gains or any gains at all without all 3, so they should just be included together.

You're partially correct, just not entirely.

[–]Mckallidon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's a drop in the bucket. That doesn't make up for other factors that sleep quantity and quality impact. HGH is not T. HGH does a lot that is important and supplementing T does not make up for poor sleep, or not being asleep whe your body will release it under the right conditions. Unnaturally upping the bodies T also reduces the mechanism by which the body rewards your body with it. Plus upping your T with supplements will up the estrogen in your body because the endocrine system always balances itself. Without the biofeedback upping your T you're actually forcing your body to up the E to get back to sure which means diminishing returns. That also doesn't offset impacts to learning and memory and training the nervous system which requires itself in your sleep regardless of T, but not entirely regardless. It's not a quod pro quo deal. It also doesn't offset the imbalances to your hormones caused by supplementation and upping the cortisol by having less sleep. Which also kills T. All you're doing is offsetting the loss of T from increased cortisol, which kills T vYou're not gaining anything long term. Just a hack with minimal short term cost but also minimal gain. The endocrine system is not this simple. You may be able to offset one metric through supplementation, but not all of them, and even then you're still creating an imbalance that has costs further down the road.

[–]tuxedoburrito 0 points1 point  (5 children)

This one is interesting. I know coaches that recommend 9 hours of sleep while Arnold Schwarzenegger slept 6 hours a night. I'd like to see a study on this.

[–]tbpd 13 points14 points  (0 children)

If you shoot up with steroids and insulin, you can likely get away with 6 hours a night, too. But for the majority, sleep is extremely important.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (2 children)

[–]tuxedoburrito 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks! I'm going to check his out for sure.

(That isn't sarcastic, I really am interested in this).

[–]Collector797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's one of the most politically incorrect blogs I've ever had the pleasure of reading. I love it. Good supplements too.

[–]nomorelulu 7 points8 points  (0 children)

He was also on roids. As a natural you can ignore anything someone on roids says about lifting/gaining muscle. They play by a different set of rules.

[–]Temperfuelmma 60 points61 points  (5 children)

Conclusion: Leave your ego at the door and use weight you can fully control!


Noobies have a tendency to be overeager and overwork, which can in reality hinder muscle growth.

[–]WinstonMcFail 6 points7 points  (4 children)

And cause wear and tear on your shoulder joints that you won't even notice until you're older

[–]recon_johnny 1 point2 points  (3 children)

This. Being older, that shit hurts more now than ever. The muscles can grow faster than the tendons can keep up.

[–]Project_Thor 2 points3 points  (2 children)

You are what you eat, Nice chicken breast. When was the last time you ate tendon? Your Welcome.

[–]WinstonMcFail 2 points3 points  (0 children)

No amount of tendons that you eat will repair years of ego bench pressing, but I agree.. people should eat more tendons, livers, hearts, etc

[–][deleted] 116 points117 points  (21 children)

Are you really gonna post that pic and then give chest growing advice? smh

[–]Sophisticated_Sloth 8 points9 points  (6 children)

Is his advice wrong though?

[–]JackGetsIt 18 points19 points  (4 children)

No. He has great advice in his post he's just underdeveloped in his chest and needs to supplement his routine with more chest work/hypertrophy type work. OP is also looking natural and when you're not on any steroids depending on genetics chest can be a tough area to add size to. Example: look at the chest of Eugene Sandow

[–]use_a_choosername1 8 points8 points [recovered]

Eugene never trained chest because it used to be considered feminine to have a big chest

[–]JackGetsIt 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I had not heard this. My understanding was that chest training methods and programming were not as advanced as they are today as well as the lack of access to steroids. Natural bodybuilding competitors today also have comparatively smaller chests despite access to modern equipment and the social pressure to have a big chest.

[–]Marcus1138 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Maybe it's genetic, but I find chest very easy to train. Even just a year of consistent push-ups will build up a decent amount of muscle. But that's the key to chest - consistency over time. Seeing progress is slow. On the other hand, I'm very jealous of OP's forearms. I can't put any mass on there it seems.

[–]1RXRob 18 points19 points  (8 children)

Are you really gonna post that comment and not post a pecs pic? Smh

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children)

To be fair, at his bf% a lot of chest bulk disappears, happening to me right now on a cut. Op is in great shape.

[–]TheThingsIThink 2 points2 points [recovered]

From what I've seen on a lot of progress pics the pecs loose a lot of size, often the ab gains don't seem to offset the amount of chest lost

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I enjoy bulk and cut. I get to experience both in the same year.

[–]TheDialecticParadox[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fair enough. I know my pecs are underdeveloped but atm I have my hands full trying to get my legs to catch up to my upper body, as I had a lower back injury and couldn't do any lower body work for 6 months.

[–]moresmarterthanyou 23 points24 points  (3 children)

nice post - you forgot sleep!

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (2 children)

This. Trained, dieted and juiced for years but struggled with sleep.

If I really understood and appreciated proper sleeping habits I could have massively catapulted my results. No matter who you are, you cannot afford to get shitty sleep. It is universally and infinitely beneficial.

[–]moresmarterthanyou 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Have you tried magnesium spray? I rub it on my inner elbows and under my knees and it helps me knock out and supposedly REM. It might be placebo but I seem to dream more.

[–]Eloni 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I know ZMA makes me have weird as fuck dreams.

[–]Momo_dollar 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Everyone knocking the OP's physique. Look at every magazine targeted at women, the men in them all have physiques more similar to him then big ass bodybuilders. Look at Fast and Furious, on the whole , who was the one girls droled over more Vin Diesel/ Dwayne or Paul Walker?

Only thing that stands out about the OP'S chest is that the lower part is disproportionately underdeveloped. So maybe focuse on some decline benches.

Chest is the most overrated muscle amongst guys. How many fighters have big pecs? The most visually appealing muscles to women and men ( for judging ability) shoulders and butt. Only thing a bitch wants is that your chest is solid when she puts her hands on it.

[–]TheDialecticParadox[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Thanks for the critique. I only recently started including decline work. I never did it before which is why my chest looks the way it does.

[–]Wilreadit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Try some crutches for your ab. They will chisel your lower abs and make you adonis belt more visible.

[–]FilthMonger85 35 points36 points  (14 children)

Not a hater but your are in the late beginner stage, maybe intermediate.

Still better than 98% of schlubs though.

[–]greatslyfer 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Lighting can have an effect.

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points  (12 children)

What are you talking about dude is in beast shape. Getting in shape doesn't mean becoming a bodybuilder.

[–]SW9876 0 points1 point  (7 children)

"Beast" lol. You could take a super scrawny kid and make him look better than OP in 4 months or less

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (6 children)

It's all about perspective. If you compare him to the average male he absolutely is a beast of a man. If you compare him to professional bodybuilder not so much, but that comparison doesn't make any sense. If you want to be a negative cunt then you can always say there is someone better.

Someone is a BJJ blackbelt, well fuck that hes not one of the greatest, he could do better.

Someone crushes 99.9% of the population on 100 sprints, what a puss he's not olympic level.

Next your probably gonna say well this guys not on comparable levels to these examples, but you know what he's pretty close. You take a sample of 100 males and this guys gonna be in the few top percent.

And no you won't go from zero to that in 4 months get real.

It's good to have ownership of your fuck ups which this sub promotes but also what a toxic mentality not being able to give credit. It's always this negative hissing about petty shit that serves no purpose but to put someone down.

[–]TheDialecticParadox[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

That's my goal, to be in the top 10%, not the top 0.01%. That's just unrealistic for my age and without gear.

[–]Poppenhoffer 4 points5 points  (4 children)

Bro you can't include sets for shoulders and NOT include much emphasis on traps. Everyone's all about the upper body, but they forget that a man without big traps can't show off their build all that well when they're covered up by clothes.

Here's some basic trap exercises I do:

5 x 8-12 Shrugs (ESSENTIAL)

3 x 10 Cable Face Pulls

3 x 12-20 Lateral Raises

2 x Failure Pull-ups

Incorporate these with your shoulder or back workouts and you'll be well on your way to looking like a stud. Also, do deadlifts at some point on one of your leg days to see gainz for days.

[–]PeeHurt 5 points6 points  (0 children)

150 reps of trap work is completely unnecessary. Do heavy deadlifts and they grow. In fact shrugs aren't necessary. Let's see the traps brah.

[–]TheDialecticParadox[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Look at my traps, do they look underveloped? Heavy deadlifts, pullups and farmers walks are enough for me

[–]Project_Thor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Overhead Shrugs and Loaded Carries. Much Better.

[–]Collector797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Upright row is a good one for traps too.

[–]Ma1nStreaM 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Another thing to take into account is REST.

Make sure to get adequate sleep, you grow when you sleep.

I had stalled in my progress a few months back and someone pointed out to me that I wasn't getting enough sleep for my body to rebuild.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Also on that note, cut back on booze and caffeine. They'll effect your ability to get REM sleep which you need for recovery

[–][deleted] 7 points7 points

[permanently deleted]

[–]-contrarian- 2 points3 points  (1 child)

High volume has done wonders for me.

[–]Hakametal 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's pretty much the foundation of hypertrophy training. High volume, high intensity, decent weight.

[–]Endorsed ContributorMetalgear222 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fucking love this. Stealing it

[–]ShamanontheMoon 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Kudos to what you have accomplished so far, but could you send a pic where you're not obviously sucking your abs in?

[–]plsporo 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That bodyfat picture isnt accurate at all, those guys have reasonable muscle mass. 15% will look way different on someone without some muscle mass than on that guy.

[–]Rognin 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Consume plenty of fish, chicken and red meat. If you can't cook: learn.

Uhh as someone who works in the food industry, you might need to heed your own advice. That looks repugnant.

Veggies: Those look like low quality IQF, they lose so much in both taste, and quality that I'd suggest you skimp a little budget on the proteins and pay full price for fresh. They even add salts to those in the water baths they're in before the freezing process. Just all around bad food.

Rice: again, that looks like Uncle Ben's. Spend some money on balsmati and whole rice. Or even mix it up with Barley, Amaranth, Rye or spelt. The bonus is you'll need less savoring (salts and fats) for a great taste and you'll get added nutrition you'd not get in Uncle Ben's. You can even replace these with seeds or pods, and again get better taste than rice or potatoes without adding as much flavoring for the same results (or better).

Meats: I've never respected anyone that marinates meats in commercial BBQ sauces. There's gut loads of sugar, salts and other useless ingredients. Cut the sauces for fucks sake, be a man and learn to appreciate meat and eat the meat without masking its taste. It has it's own taste and if you can (country permitting) have them as close to raw as is safe (porc in Canada can be served rare). Wild meats are even better. Some spices may be good, as long as they aren't loaded with salts. If you really want to marinate the meat, make your own marinades (takes a few minutes!). Use Dijon, olive oil, whole peppers, mayonnaise, high quality salts and anything that is marinated in vinegar in your fridge (in small doses) can be used to add a special taste to a marinade (like bell pepper vinegar, olive vinegar, capers, caperons etc. etc. etc.) or even special vinegars (apple cider vinegar, wine vinegar, etc. etc. etc).

Edit: Spelling

[–]Project_Thor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What a relief, finally someone talks real nutrition. Not this I don't eat meat because they have feelings or Consuming Fat is going to make me fat bullshit.

[–]Crevez 2 points3 points  (30 children)

LOL. You are clearly a beginner or a 'bro'. A lot of what you say is scientifically just wrong and far from ideal and anyone with basic understanding of lifting should know that.

Slow eccentrics are bullshit. Everyone knows this. Concentrics are way more important and if you do slow eccentrics you will be able to do less concentrics, therefore you'll have less gains.

Deadlifts as a back exercise? Come on man...

Do I understand this correctly that you go to the gym 6 times a week and have your own day for arms? Ok then.

Your back needs to be parallel to the floor on bent over rows? Well no, not really

[–]looking4fun43 15 points16 points  (15 children)

You don't know what you're talking about. Deadlift is a huge back exercise (along with legs and rest of core). Also slow eccentrics are shown to be better than concentrics for certain muscles. (An example is hamstring curls have shown to be much more effective when focusing on a slow eccentric phase)

[–]PawnToKing -2 points-1 points  (14 children)

Actually, anyone worth his salt in deadlifting knows to train it with legs. It does build a strong back because of the tension, but so does a properly braced bench press.

[–]looking4fun43 7 points8 points  (12 children)

The benchpress does not work the back nearly as effectively as a deadlift. And many people train their deadlift on a back day away from their leg day because of squats.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (7 children)

Why it's slow eccentric bullshit?

[–]tuxedoburrito 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Deadlifts are a back exercises, lol. They definitely utilize the legs, its just a compound lift. Most people I know at the olympic weight lifting gym I go to do deadlifts on back day.

[–]JackGetsIt 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Your back needs to be parallel to the floor on bent over rows? Well no, not really

This point you're absolutely right on. Unless it's a Pendlay row, bent over rows can have a less than parallel back position depending on the focus/goals etc.

However, just because deadlifts don't 'isolate' the back doesn't make the movement any less of a back builder. It's a posterior chain compound exercise with the back muscles as an integral part of that chain. Isn't the huge push in bodybuilding the last 15 years compound, compound, compound?

It sounds like you know your shit but aren't you just being contrarian on this point?

[–]Project_Thor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Deadlifts are a Posterior Chain Exercise, They do hit back, doing them on 'back day' or whatever stupid split you bros are doing will work. Slow Eccentrics vary on every exercise. Don't try to tell me that there's no reason for slow eccentrics on curls for example. Those are called Pendlay rows, it varies person to person, Have you tried them?

[–]Lawojin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What is your source of info on lifting and diet?

Do you know about Menno henselmen's work?

[–]MercenaryOfPie 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Everyone knows this

Sauce?? I didn't know this.

[–]Wilreadit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Dude shut up if you do not know what you are talking ok.

[–]sfengi 1 point2 points  (11 children)

You really need to skip some of your arm days and work on your chest and back.

[–]TheDialecticParadox[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've gotten thay criticism a lot and you're definitely not wrong. Will go up to 2x chest days a week.

[–]logicalthinker1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

yeah your arms and shoulders look pretty good but that chest could use a couple months of focus.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (7 children)


You understand there is no set bar how you should look. Your bicep doesn't need to be proportionally the correct size compared to your tricep, that's bodybuilder shit which is a hobby in itself. If the aim is to be fit then you don't need a certain size of breast muscle, you just need to achieve your own goals for strength.

[–]PawnToKing 0 points1 point  (6 children)

Wait, why are you talking about strength goals? I thought you were into physique stuff? Your routine certainly isn't ideal for strength gains.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (4 children)

First of all I'm not OP, it's not my post.

Second the reason I mention this because it's ridicolous to critique things like these in the context of TRP. The aim is to be fit for your well being and be muscular for sexual attraction. The minutia of working more on the chest and back is for the sweaty dudes thinking about small stuff like this, not for the purpose of attraction.

The reason strength might be important is maybe for your hobby or for the reason of having the ability to do certain activities if they present themselves. And if you do reach your goals for strength, deadlifts, certain number of pull ups and so on, then you are gonna look just fine and don't need to worry about if you should work a little more on the jerk muscle. If the goal is not performance but just purely looks then yeah it's a moot point.

[–]PawnToKing 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Gotcha. My mistake. I mean sure, in the end bodybuilding or powerlifting, or even powerbuilding, they're all just hobbies.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Not necessarily, or depending of your definition of hobby. I lift for health and performance for my hobbies. So lifting isn't a hobby for me as much as it is a necessity to get what I want much like hygiene.

[–]PawnToKing 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I see. Now we've moved into semantics. Well, this has been nice.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The difference is I'm not trying to enforce my view on anyone. I just explained my view of a hobby and how I don't consider strength work a hobby of mine, I didn't say "Dude you need to work on definition of a hobby" or "it's not a hobby and your wrong if you say otherwise".

And in the context of health it's not just semantics, you need to lift or in some way activate your muscles in a strenuous enough of a way that they do not deteriorate as rapidly as they would with no strength exercise going into old age.

I knew someone would say that in regards to my explanation.

[–]tuxedoburrito 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Seriously. There is an ideal for masculine body beauty. Go for that. Don't try to let the world pander itself for you. Theres a standard, and go for it. That's a nice-guy mentality to have the world change for you because your feelings.

[–]Tarmyniatur -3 points-2 points  (5 children)

You don't look like someone who should offer advice.

[–]IceDagger316 9 points10 points  (3 children)

Definitely not on muscle growth...

[–]DonaldBaelish 5 points6 points  (0 children)

He just needs that creatine steroid everyone is talking about 😉.

[–][deleted] 8 points8 points

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[–]PawnToKing 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think most of this is on the right track. There definitely seems to be lot soft research backing the benefit of the eccentric, but it sure isn't vital. Also, your routine is not great, but rather between average and good. Solid exercise selection, but your frequency is not ideal.

[–]jovijovi99 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My grade 11 teacher taught us at least 1 second going up and 2 seconds releasing. Control and form is important; even if it means lowering the weights by a couple of pounds.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

1 tip for me: Find a simple program like strongholds or 531 and stick with it for at least a year. Track your gains, either with a log book or app.

[–]tuxedoburrito 0 points1 point  (6 children)

Body builder here. Kinesiology major. My current bb coach used to train Ronnie Coleman.

Best thing I can recommend for anyone to do, and you touched on this, is to hire a coach. Not a personal trainer, some stick figure with an online certification, but an actual coach. A lot of men here go for power lifting and I did that for a year, but since I started training with a body building coach my gains have increased drastically.

In three months I went from 165 lb to 180 lbs by changing my diet and lifting heavy 5x a week, with two complimentary workouts also to a total of lifting 7x a week. I went from squatting 225 to this morning I did 365 for 3 reps on my last set. My bench went from 185 to 265 on my last set for three reps.

Getting a workout partner to help spot you is crucial. This allows you to go heavier as well. The diet isn't the same for everyone. Everyones diet is different based on your body type and metabolism. I would definitely ask a professional about this, see a coach.

I'm still a year out from my first competition and have another 30 lbs of mass to gain but getting a coach is absolutely crucial to proper development, form, diet, all of it. Highly recommend it.

I would also recommend never to lift near your max by yourself. If you're lifting HEAVY always have a spot and partner there.

Lifts I would recommend not doing because they are prone to injury, I know from personal experience or seen many others injured are Over Head BarBell Press (I know this one is going to hurt all the strong lifters out there, but its really dangerous. My coach has a friend who died doing this lift.) Just do military press on smith machine instead. It's really dangerous to overhead press with barbell. Compresses your spine. I've pulled both trapezius muscles right under my scapula, couldn't work for a few days. It's brutal. Just go to military press. Also, decline barbell bench is extremely dangerous. Like wise with decline dumbbell bench. Decline push ups are okay. I pulled my rotator cuff about a month ago doing decline barbell. My coach forbids using those and overhead press. Just food for thought, but you can do whatever you want to.

As for squat, I'd also throw in leg press for sure. Different variations. You can do the same lift multiple times in a row using different variations. For example I'll give you a run down of what we did for leg day this morning,

Barbell Squat






(I attempted 3x405 but failed, I got a little too ambitious. We had three spotters for this lift, if you're lifting really heavy you need multiple spotters, a belt and knee wraps for your own safety).

Squat Superset-

Sissy Squat + Duck Squat

Sissy Squat 10x135

Duck Squat 10x135

Sissy Squat 8x225

Duck Squat 8x225

Sissy Squat 8x225

Duck Squat 8x225

Sissy Squat Drop Set, 8x250 immediately followed by 8x225, 4x185, 4x155, 8x135

Duck Squat 6x225

Drop sets are tricky, basically you do the squat until you hit failure, then drop the weight a little bit, continue until failure, etc.

Leg Press Close-feet x Wide-feet Superset

240 x 20 (close stance) 240x20 (wide stance)

420 x 15 (CS) 420x15 (WS)

510 x 12 (CS) 510x12 (WS)

510 x 10 (CS) 510x10 (WS)

And that was all we did for today. Took an hour an a half. Kicked my ass. But just an example of different ways to do leg days. I'd always recommend squatting and leg press. Arnold said, "if you aren't squatting, you aren't working out."

You should never do the same workout twice. Every workout should be different. Confuse the muscles and you will limit your plateaus.

Best of luck, gentleman.

[–]NikkyMontana 3 points4 points  (2 children)

your advice goes against everything I've learned over 2 years of lifting lots of broscience like confuse the muscle when the only thing you have to do is increase the weight or the reps to see results and having another 30 lbs to gain assuming you have been lifting for a bit before going to a competition is also hilarious regarding having a coach who coached ronnie coleman who was on tons of steroids i doubt his advice goes well with a natty if you even are one although your lifts are quiet weak

[–]tuxedoburrito 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Well. If it works, it works, my friend. I'm not going to argue with my coach. Who trains natural athletes and untested.

As for quite weak? Seems relative. I'm extremely proud of my lift weights and the progress I've made. And they're a decent amount of weight for anyone that lifts natural. Squatting over 315 and benching over 225 is not weak at all. Those are usually the bench marks for starting to lift actual heavy weight.

But what do I know, right? I'd rather be the one out there busting my ass with the professionals than the guy who points fingers.

[–]walnut_of_doom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That 30 lbs doesn't necessarily need to be all muscle. Being fatter gives you better leverages for lifts, mainly the squat.

[–]PeeHurt 3 points4 points  (1 child)

If you're competitive in any sense in the NPC or aspiring IFBB than you're not natural and your advice isn't going to be applicable to the natty twinks on this board.

If you're coached by Ronnies coach he would tell you muscle confusion is absolute bullshit.

If you die doing OHP you're a retard and that's just Darwinism.

[–]SigmundRoidd 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm pretty sure Chad Nichols (Ronnies coach during the late nineties to mid 2000s) isn't taking newbies who weigh 180 lbs. Chad was known for his extreme drug protocols; one of the major reasons why Ronnie went from competing in the 240s to almost 300 lbs on stage. Chads only taking like 1-2 IFBB pros this year I think.

Progressive overload is the only principle most beginners need to focus on to grow. Too many guys supersetting 20 sets to make their arms grow when they weigh 160 lbs. People over complicate this shit way too much. Some of the biggest dudes I know (and this includes national level/IFBB pros) are strong hard working guys who stick to basics (training, diet and drug wise), and never obsess over this shit. The ones who bench 185 are the ones trying to reinvent the wheels.

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points

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[–]fnoobreported 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Gotta get that insane mind muscle control going

[–]Hakametal 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Has there been much posts done on tracking your macros? That's something that a lot of noobs leave out.

[–]attractiveOF 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nice post , thanks for sharing ! a small question , how many grams of meat is that on the plate you posted ? does it excead 150 grams ?

[–]VodkaTankerSpill 0 points1 point  (0 children)

High bar is just a good for overall muscle development for general bodybuilding training.

[–]L3gendaryBanana 0 points1 point  (1 child)

This is good general advice for noobs, but not 100% correct.

That whole percentages section is bullshit. You do want to control the weight, but if you do 3sec eccentrics you're not going to have as much time under tension and metabolic fatigue in fast glycolytic muscle fibers- you big fibers wont be working as hard. Just control the weight and dont rush your reps. No need to count.

Pull ups- dont cross your legs, it reduces hip/low back stability by reducing glute activation. Point your toes and squeeze your glutes.

Diet- don't eat carbs beforw your workout, you dont need them unless you are running a marathon. You store ~3500 calories worth of carbs, you're good. If youre doing cardio carbs after are good because your body will store more glycogen after your workout than if you ate later, not that important though. Also carbs before you workout, especially cardio will make most people gassy and encourage diarrhea.

Just get the myfitnesspal app, track your macros. 1g/lb of bodyweight of protein, at least 25% calories from fat, and the rest of your calories from mostly carbs and then however you want to distribute it. Track your weight every morning after peeing and before eating and adjust your calories depending on which way you want to go. If you're lifting hard with enough volume you will get guaranteed results. It just takes work.

100% agree on stretching calves and hip extension.

Overall good post op, good for noobs, but if you want it to take it to the next level it needs some tweaking. I have more info if anyone is interested. Im an exercise science major and almost done.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Good post OP. Just curious, what's your bf?

[–]aznredpill 0 points1 point  (0 children)


Controlled lifting PREVENTS INJURIES because you're lifting what you're capable of lifting and not being too rash about egotistical LIFT MOAR BRO behavior. Also, allows you to strengthen the muscle mind connection (CNS activation) that is necessary for progress.

[–]GOATmar 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Become naturally big & ripped in less than 90 days:

SLEEP WELL. 7hrs to 8hrs minimum.

EAT WELL. at least 1 to 1.5g per weight in protein every single day you eat. consume 1 gallon of water at least daily. eat spinach, kale and all types of berries. dont forget nuts. and of course, the staple olive oil & fish oil. Your main meat should be sirloin beef, it's like steroids when consumed in bulk.

INTERMITTENT FASTING. That's right you son of a bitch. Fasting destroys fat at a retarded rate when you do it, and releases growth hormones when you finally eat. Exploit this shit weekly by doing 1 or 2 days of 24hr+ ZERO CALORIE fasts. I usually take 1 day off of all physical activity (workouts & career) to go from 11PM Tuesday (last meal) to 11AM Thursday consuming nothing but clean water.

When I'm not doing a savage 24hr fast, I'm doing the good ol' 16/8. First meal of the day is around 11AM Last meal at 7PM every day.

I dropped my body fat from some grotesque 19% to a respectable 12.5% in about 4 months - i could have seen much better results had I learned about the 24hr fasts. Ive been doing the 24hr fasts for maybe a month now and my BF% is still dropping. goal is to have 10% at most.

Lift heavy. duh. Cut the stupid split routine bs that only "benefits" HGH & roid heads. Theyre gonna grow regardless of what routine they do, so they stick with the easy shit of low weight high reps. When I say lift heavy, I mean StrongLifts 5x5. Not many people make it 6 months of natural lifting in it. Shit gets BRUTAL when you start doing 2 to 3 times your bodyweight - but the benefits are tremendous. In just 6 short months I was able to hit my thigh measurement goals because of squat & deadlifts.

For those fo you who don't know what SSL5x5 is, check out stronglifts.com

And finally, probably the most important tip of all tbh... FOAM ROLL & DO MOBILITY STRETCHING. These not only help your recovery tremendously, but these things actually gear your muscles up to do work. The better geared you are to lifting, the heavier you can lift. The heavier you can lift, the bigger your muscles get.

i should mention No Carb diet on non-lifting days is supposed to stimulate fasting but meh. you can combine no carb + IT for even faster melting of BF%. do whatever you please concerning nocarb, i know i cant lift without solid carbs beforehand.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Just going to hi jack to expand on concentric and eccentric as its mentioned a lot and most people just seem to kind of pick up on it without knowing what it means.

There's 3 types of muscle in your body, the 1 type you care about is skeletal muscle, and at it's most basic it works by shortening and pulling one part of your body to another part of your body.

It does this by having 2 long strings, which are similar to velcro, in that 1 section "hooks" onto the other "Loop" These sets of strings are repeated thousands of times in your muscles.

If you look at a roller door or any mechanical wheel that relies on a cog, you can see how it raises an object against gravity by each tooth of the cog fitting into the object being raised repeatedly. This is a muscle contracting, and is the concentric part of a lift. This is done against gravity.

The eccentric phase is simply the reverse, and goes with gravity. All you are doing is moderating the effect of gravity instead of letting the weight fall naturally.

If you dangle a weight on a rope, and instead of letting it run through your hands, you control it's descent by gripping the rope with your hands and letting it play out, but maintain control.

This is what is happening with the "hook" and "loop" parts of your muscles in the eccentric portion.

[–]yummyluckycharms 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Irony - makes a post regarding muscle gain - makes no mention of age, body shape, and having a benchmark of testosterone levels established. These criteria are far more important than some guy cheating on form or reps

[–]TheDialecticParadox[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Everything besides testosterone are factors that cannot be controlled, and steroids are not an option for most people.

[–]yummyluckycharms 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The point is that before talking about muscle growth, its important to know what your genetic potential entails in terms of how much muscle you will gain and how easy it will occur

[–]ChadThundercockII 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Third world squats

you mean how humans are programmed to sit, rest and poop?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I was blessed with a Dad who has a masters in Microbiology and also loves using science to get big.

He taught me everything about getting big. For those who don't have such a role model, check out Ben Pakulski. He's a professional bodybuilder who also has a degree in Kinesiology and is extremely well read in Biomechanics. His Youtube channel will teach you how to properly work out.

[–]stawek 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Do I remember well that Ben had some shared videos with Mike Chang from Sixpack Shortcuts? This pretty much disqualifies him.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah he obviously went on there for publicity because a lot of people follow Mike Chang's retard ass.

If you watch those videos, it's Ben teaching Mike real science, not Ben promoting Mike's advice.

[–]apleasantpeasant 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Hey bossman, can you give me a quick guide on your low-sugar marination process?

Sounds delicious, and I'm working on my cooking skills. Would appreciate a few headers. Thanks in advance!

[–]TheDialecticParadox[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Personally dude I just buy low-sugar bbq sauce and marinate my chicken in that. Even the reduced stuff has quite a bit of sugar in it, but if you drain off the excess, there is barely any actual sugar in the portion of chicken you'll be eating in your meal. I use to marinate in olive oil, salt, lemon juice, garlic, mustard, some honey, and herbs but found it still lacked flavour.

[–]chances_are_ur_a_fag 0 points1 point  (1 child)

weak ass noob. number one tip is eat clen, tren hard, anavar give up. that will grow your muscles like nothing else. ever.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Exercise physiologist here...most of what OP says is accurate and good advice in lay terms.

My only contribution, or suggestion, is to specialize in either high bar or low bar on squat. Switching won't really provide adied benefit, however, altering feet position will (ie. Close stance will hit outer sweep vs. Sumo will hit more medial).

[–]RP_Student 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Kind of strange having a beginner with average results who does a bro split (i.e suboptimal training) give advice and get 300 upvotes.

[–]ben0wn4g3 -4 points-3 points  (15 children)

174 lbs is the weight of a baby

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (12 children)

Umm. I am 5'9" and around that weight and can bench around 300 lbs.

[–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Exactly. Men's weight starts at 0,1 tons.

[–]MercenaryOfPie 0 points1 point  (0 children)

d you to be bigger than them. So at your height it's even more important to be a big

Short ton, long ton, or metric tonne?

[–]kj5576 0 points0 points [recovered]

Could you make a post on lowering bf%?

[–]frys180 4 points5 points  (12 children)

Eat less than your total TDEE (between 70 and 80%) and consume at least 0.8 to 1 gram of protein per pound of bodyweight. That's literally it.

[–]kj5576 1 points1 points [recovered]

I've been doing that for a bit. I guess I should change the question to lose bf and build muscle at the same time. Around 17% rn. Ive plateaued in all my lifts, so should I focus more on building muscle rn? I'm 18 if that means anything.

[–]frys180 0 points1 point  (2 children)

You cannot lose fat and gain muscle at the same time. Only in the beginning with noob gains. You need to eat more than your TDEE to get gains. It's the exact same diet as cutting but you need to eat 15 to 20% over your TDEE. If you can get away with eating less than 15% then more power to ya. Less fat to cut later.

[–]kj5576 1 points1 points [recovered]

So bulking and then cutting is the only option... Cheers!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Leangains fasted training might be an option. Works for me.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (6 children)

Lift heavy (1-5 reps) on compound exercises (bench, squat, deadlift, rows, etc.). The heavy lifting will get you stronger and burn more calories as well. Take 5g of creatine everyday and at least a protein shake after your workout.


For creatine, look for creatine that uses Creapure. Allmax nutrition, universal nutrition, optimum nutrition, vitacost has one. If it says creapure on it, then you are good. Highest quality creatine. Also consider glutamine. Creatine is a supplement I will always take.

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