Rant/VentingThe great are alone but not lonely (self.TheRedPill)

submitted by [deleted]

As you venture on the path of self improvement, there will come a point when you look from one side to the other and notice that there is nobody there alongside you. Internally motivated, real, self improvement will lead you to a point of having less things in common with those around you.

Becoming mentally and physically strong will make you uninterested in the common. Where most flock to you'll want to avoid. What most enjoy you'll find no satisfaction in. Where the willpower of the common crumbles, yours will remain standing like a wall erect.

Become used to being alone in your actions and thoughts. The more things you have in common with average men the more average you will be. The average will try their best to pull you back in at the first sign of you breaking off into an improved lifestyle. Their ability to pull you back in will bring them comfort.

Internal motivation is the key to weeding out the bullshit behaviour of the common, soft, comfortable man. You will recognize the bullshit behaviour and conversations, I don't need to specify what they are. Tune them out, ignore the desire for comfort, and always remember why you do what you do. You'll become good at it.

You will be alone, and it will seem like every woman is a loud-mouthed, phlegm-coughing, basic, fat bodied, reality TV watching bitch. You are right, most of them are.

If you understand and accept that you'll be alone on your path to become great, you'll never be lonely.

[–]HAMMURABl 205 points206 points  (4 children)

The top of the mountain is lonely. You'll get used to it.

[–]-ATLAS-_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The climb is all that matters when we push, the enjoyment when we rest.

[–]mcbenzene 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Even if it is lonely, the path is difficult and everybody dreams of climbing to the top. Those who conform will not reach the top. It maybe lonely, but you'll be respected for doing what others couldn't or struggled and conformed.

[–][deleted] 109 points110 points  (29 children)

Yea this is definitely true. Most of my friends are in their mid to late 20s, and I've watched them become more and more feminized and soft over the last few years. I think what happens is, they end up in LTRs and spend 99.99% of their free time around a girl. They get comfortable jobs, go out drinking several nights a week, smoke weed, and shitpost political rants on facebook. Talking to them on the phone or in person literally feels like I'm talking to a girl. They've lost what little edge they once had.

It's definitely an odd thing when you come to understand that your path will be much different than theirs in the long run. I always felt different from my friends, even in highschool, but now what once felt like a small gap has become a chasm. It seems like 99% of guys are following the same path. Like, not a single one of my friends has avoided falling into the trap.

OTOH, I'm sure I seem equally weird and shitty to them. Every time I'm around them now in a social context, I feel like me just being there makes them uncomfortable, because I'm so out of touch with the weird, feminized vibing that goes on. Everything they say and do seems superficial and pedantic. I think its instinctive to want to bring close friends into the fold in any endeavor, so I guess thats why it bugs me. I want them to avoid the traps of comfort and stay at their edge, so I don't have to go it completely alone, but in reality it truly is a lonely path.

[–]jackandjill22 27 points28 points  (7 children)

Seems like to me someone from a upper socioeconomic bracket. That some guys take the "path of least resistance" follow their families direction, perhaps even in relation to women & never venture beyond their doorstep into anything risky or dangerous. Since they never learn life-skills as they get older it becomes more difficult for them to try new things because it seems scary & unfamiliar to them. They end up having more to loose than to gain. So, eventually they become slaves to the white-collar never leaving their bubble except for occasional structured traveling/trips.

[–][deleted] 32 points33 points  (5 children)

I think that's definitely part of it, following the path laid out for them and being fairly comfortable just by virtue of their fortunate circumstance. I also think it comes down to individual biology. The disconnect for me is that, for a long time these guys portrayed themselves as edgy and fully embraced the masculine subculture, i.e. sports, fraternities, etc, and their identities were basically centered around those activities.

But now that they don't have those clubs and activities woven into their lives by default, you get a true sense of who they were the whole time, and it isn't at all how they portrayed themselves. 100% of the time, once they are out of college, they settle into a comfortable relationship with a girl who has them on a leash, and start cultivating a social identity in the same fashion that women do, using social media as the primary medium for advertising. It's literally like a 180, and for me its annoying because it exposes them for frauds who were just pretending to be alpha because it was part of their current identity and what the culture they found themselves in currently supported. Their entire sense of self-worth, confidence, etc. was just an offshoot of being in a frat, or being on a team. It was all a charade. They were just betas masquerading, using the status their clubs and activities gave them to bolster their confidence.

The point I'm trying to make I guess is that to me, when you allow your environment and the people around you to dictate your principles and your identity, you're a fraud. Now, their identity is their relationships, so they are basically identical in demeanor to the women they are dating. There was never any real substance to them, never any real depth. They've always been slates for other people to write on, and IMO, their biology never really gave them a choice anyways. The disillusionment I've had with my friends I guess is similar to the disillusionment that most people have with women when they find this forum or have a bad relationship or whatever. It's just another reality-altering "Redpill" so to speak. The people who you think are your friends aren't who you think they are, and the alphas who are authentic to the core usually don't make good friends.

[–]RPFlame 12 points13 points  (0 children)

The point I'm trying to make I guess is that to me, when you allow your environment and the people around you to dictate your principles and your identity, you're a fraud

It's why I believe that before coming in the Red Pill you should already have a few skeptical bones in your body, alongside critical thinking skills.

I see red pill as a locker room where we can exchange ideas and experiences, but it's easy for a newcomer to just pick something randomly, attempt to apply it, then blame it on the thing he did instead of blaming himself for not thinking "is that what would make sense for me right now?".

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Guys that go against the grain by instinct and deep self believe are rare. In my case it's probably because I'm fairly high on the autistic scale, was always most comfortable around myself + my above average reasoning abilities always managed to expose average joe and jane as sheeple.

Relationships change you though and women definitely tend to manage to take off most guy's edge. It happened to me as well in an LTR.

[–]Jaxx_Teller 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Don't disqualify men that are in LTRs altogether, they're not all completely beta. But most of them are.

[–]Olga_Schmutzer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The disillusionment I've had with my friends I guess is similar to the disillusionment that most people have with women when they find this forum or have a bad relationship or whatever.

To me, this Red Pill-thing had almost as much to do with male friends and our dynamic as it had to do with women.

[–]RPFlame 8 points9 points  (0 children)

That some guys take the "path of least resistance"

If red pill taught me something first, it was to own my outcomes.

The moment you own it is the moment you decide to work on bettering it.

I went through a book called "your own worst enemy" and it basically talks about "Low effort people" who did "just enough to X" where X can be things like "get a job" or "have a girlfriend".

How many people even have a feel of self-improvement that isn't attached to monetary gains?

Software developers, for example, constantly update their knowledge and learn new things so they can climb the ladder of income or sometimes out of fear of becoming stale and irrelevant. Yet you'll rarely see a fit developer who's into self-improvement.

[–]Mckallidon 24 points25 points  (17 children)

Having an intact soul is offensive to nihilists. The older I get the more I understand the books American Psycho and Fight Club, among many others. The more I hear most other people talk, the more I want to live in a cabin in the woods lol.

[–]ElOweTea 7 points8 points  (0 children)

"The more I hear most other people talk, the more I want to live in a cabin in the woods lol." I feel you on this one.

[–]jazerac 2 points3 points  (3 children)

The more I hear most other people talk, the more I want to live in a cabin in the woods lol.

The older I get and the more I am around the general public, the more I feel this way. I am developing contempt towards most people.

[–]rodrigolrsilva 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Both this thread and your comment remind me a lot of the book I'm currently reading, Walden, by Thoreau. He literally goes to a cabin in the woods to learn about self reliance and self improvement in general. Hell, he builds his cabin on his own with his bare hands, from scratch. He makes a lot of observations about society, among that realizing that striving to be great leads to isolating oneself. Folks talk a lot about Atlas Shrugged, which I'm yet to read, but I think a book like Walden, perhaps a lighter read, should be more appreciated. It discusses not only self reliance(a common topic among the writer's of Thoreau's literary movement, transcendentalism), but a lot of other things about what is worth our attention, what is wrong and right with how the average person thinks, etc.

[–]Docbear64 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the recommendation, I may check this out.

[–]Mckallidon -5 points-4 points  (0 children)



[–]1StoicCrane 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Literally just thought of Fight Club hours ago. Completely agree on this one.

[–]conquerlifegroup 0 points1 point  (10 children)

You should read Atlas shrugged man. Could take you a few years if you pace your self, but I think you'd really like it.

[–]Mckallidon 1 point2 points  (3 children)

It was a chore of a read lol. I'm very mixed on her writing. I actually liked Anthem and the romantic manifesto the best.

[–]conquerlifegroup 0 points1 point  (2 children)

What are those? Also by her?

[–]Mckallidon 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Anthem is an allegorical dystopian novella about collectivism.

Romantic Manifesto is a philosophic work about the nature of art.

Her lesser known but IMO better works.

[–]conquerlifegroup 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Despite not knowing 3/4ths of the words you just used, I may check those out one day. :D thanks

[–]SetConsumes 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Really, Rand. No one serious takes her seriously for a reason. It's more or less an attempt at codifying AWALT as good and virtuous. Which is remarkable in its own way, but terrible as far as a contiguous philosophy.

Nietzsche > Rands bastardization of him all day long.

[–]conquerlifegroup 0 points1 point  (2 children)


1) lots of people take her seriously, but perhaps not publicly, I believe.

2) The book is over a 1000 pages and cannot be summarized as "more or less" of anything as it covers a vast amount of topics, often with incredibly in depth analysis.

Something tells me you never read the book but read people's critique of the book.

Am I wrong?

[–]SetConsumes 2 points3 points  (1 child)


1) lots of people take her seriously, but perhaps not publicly, I believe.

Meaning no one important. And pretty much no professional philosophers as she doesn't make sense.

Read section 1.1

2) The book is over a 1000 pages and cannot be summarized as "more or less" of anything as it covers a vast amount of topics, often with incredibly in depth analysis.

Something tells me you never read the book but read people's critique of the book.

Am I wrong?

I've studied her philosophy directly, not just stuff about one of her books.

She appealed to me greatly combining Nietzsche and Aristotle. Seeing her fail was quite a disappointment.

[–]conquerlifegroup 0 points1 point  (0 children)

1) In her book she critiques people who quote the "important" a.k.a popular philosophers of our time as a warrant for an argument.

That's group think, which isn't always bad, but i prefer to argue on the merits and specific examples of someone's philosophy over "a lot of other people say she's bad."

If I lived my life doing what a lot of other people said were right, I would still be living in the hell of my childhood.

I believe one can find great wisdom in unpopular works and people.

2) Not sure how she's failed as she still effects a great many people today.

Again, if you'd like to bring up any specific tenant of her philosophy, I'd be happy to have a discussion.

I don't care either way, but I'm game. Up to you.

[–]RPwhitefrost 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Awesome book. Rand's writing style sounds almost robotic at times and overly pretentious but the philosophy behind it is great and the story's pretty solid.

[–]conquerlifegroup 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Defiantly over pretentious at times for me... I don't agree with a lot of what she says (I.e. That all native Americans were savages that deserved to be slaughtered... fucking yikes). But she makes amazing arguments for the benefits and rewards of living a highly motivated life style, in my opinion. Just a good perspective to have mixed in with the many others.

[–]BigFaction 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Are you me? This is the exact same thing I'm dealing with/thinking about a lot. I'm the only single guy in a group of 11-12 close friends and it feels so weird being around them sometimes, like I see a different world then them that they choose to ignore.

[–]SetConsumes 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do they have a choice to ignore the different world? For most, no.

[–]M1ster_MeeSeeks 19 points20 points  (3 children)

Very good timing on this post. It's become extremely apparent to me with my mental self-development. I don't have any peers who are at/near my age, and those who I considered peers a few years ago are a lot further behind me on the mountain now. I'm not at the peak, but I'm at least past base camp (where so many seem to get stuck).

A few days ago I found myself asking a 50-something woman, who has worked on self-development her whole life and is similar to me in many ways, if she felt a mismatch with the values of America. She's traveled the world and said she had a mismatch with the values of humanity. I tend to share that sentiment.

It's not lonely for me. I enjoy every second of my day. That's not something people in college can claim, nor almost anyone else that I know.

The physical piece is what's next. I'm getting closer every day, but I'm not near the same level of success as I've achieved mentally. Thankfully, the physical piece is far easier.

[–]jazerac 1 point2 points  (2 children)

What do you consider mental success?

[–]M1ster_MeeSeeks 8 points9 points  (1 child)

As I type this I feel like I'm qualifying myself to you (or trying to sound cool, I promise that isn't the case), but regardless:

I mastered a skill that incorporates a few major disciplines: long-term investing (I'm loathe to mention it since so many like to compare as soon as it is discussed). Within investing I have very few apparent peers outside of extremely successful people.

Separately, I started a business with a friend (addiction treatment center) and employ doctors, therapists, and am self employed.

I write regularly and am often told I'm one of the best writers my friends have been exposed to. I've read 200+ books to self-educate, as well as hundreds of thousands of pages of regulatory, corporate, and clinical information.

On average since 2008 I've spent between 7-9 hours on self-education daily. In 2016 I've averaged 15 hour workdays, with much of that going towards self-discovery, learning, and building our business.

I'm 25 and nearly all of my time has gone towards mental success for as long as I've been an adult.

[–]Brutecanute 4 points5 points  (0 children)

People like you inspire me, kudos.

[–]Ma1nStreaM 18 points19 points  (6 children)

The more in shape I get, the more I'm offered fatty/sweet snacks by 'friends.'

[–]1StoicCrane 6 points7 points  (3 children)

Be aware of this if you get a girl who knows how to cook. Girls bake and offer cookies and brownies to their boyfriends for a reason and it isn't dessert..

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Damn. That shit is crazy. I would make my girl cook me up some nice steaks, or some pasta/rice dishes.

[–]Olga_Schmutzer 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I get shit-tested by soft drinks, brownies and chips all the time. :')

[–]1StoicCrane 0 points1 point  (0 children)

For the sake of your SMV avoid "testing" them in your stomach.

[–]vonbehren 1 point2 points  (1 child)

The part I hate the most is that I don't want to eat it because of my diet but because I know it'll just make me feel like shit. Yet everyone is quick to take offense when I decline.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I have noticed that as well. There are some snacks I like that are a bit unhealthy, but they don't make me feel like shit, like fast food does.

[–][deleted] 31 points32 points  (14 children)

I was often teased as a kid and struggled to make friends due to my reputation of being hard-headed, stubborn, and bleeding with narcissism. Easy to say, I spent a lot of time alone as a child and I developed thick skin quickly.

Now that I'm older, I see that my personality has actually accelerated my progress in reaching the peak of the mountain and now I am thankful that I am an "asshole".

....All because I didn't conform

[–]M1ster_MeeSeeks 48 points49 points  (1 child)

You may enjoy this quote even more than I do:

“Man is by nature a social animal; an individual who is unsocial naturally and not accidentally is either beneath our notice or more than human. Society is something that precedes the individual. Anyone who either cannot lead the common life or is so self-sufficient as not to need to, and therefore does not partake of society, is either a beast or a god.” –Aristotle, Politics

[–]mcbenzene -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

Maybe people like us are some kind of evolutionary exception.

[–]1DaBaulz 4 points5 points  (0 children)

While the OP has a point in that a strong man should never fear being alone, comments like this are less about being RedPill and more about MenGoingTheirOwnWay.

If you don't have strong alpha friends then that is an aspect of being RP that you have not mastered yet. (Still the OPs post is true, you should be able to be alone without fear. But if you are an alpha, people will be drawn to you so it won't be as lonely as you think)

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (5 children)

You are choosing a dvd for tonight

[–]1StoicCrane 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The herd of mindwashed mediocrity is hardly one worth integrating with. OP is noting how the path of fulfillment is by virtue alienating because so few tend to tread it. Completely different than being a Chettoh, Dorito, Xbox playing, Ps4 masturbating hermit with nothing of value to impart.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child)

I am not a social recluse. Now that I am an adult, I can actually find like-minded individuals while avoiding ones that I do not like. And I have. Yet friends come and go. It's good to meet people along the way, though eventually we'll all walk different paths. Meaning that you truly are alone in your journey.

School is different. You're forced to only socialize with people who simply have one thing in common with you: they live in the same area as you. School puts the group over the individual. Kids form social circles and then conform to whatever place in the hierarchy that they were labeled into. Acting like that hierarchy doesn't exist, nobody is going to like you.

[–]skylive2 -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

You avoided the question. What mountain are you on top of? What have you done that is worth giving up long term social interaction?

[–]soyDonEladio 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't get why you got downvotes. I thoroughly dislike people like that who pat themselves on the back as an excuse for sucking shit and giving up.

I consider it a form of masturbation.

[–]aDrunkenWhaler 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Now that I'm older, I see that my personality has actually accelerated my progress in reaching the peak of the mountain

What does 'peak of the mountain' mean for you?

[–]AnjaJutta -5 points-4 points  (2 children)

Waking up to a gigantic boner every single morning and when you go to pee it refuses to go down and then you realise that you are still dreaming and your penis turns into a huge sword and you swordfight Trump and kill him and become world president.

[–]1StoicCrane 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Downvoted to oblivion. Comments like this is the reason why the above post was made.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Part of mastering your environment is understanding how to interact with people. When you make a value judgement, for example, my thoughts and opinions are better than conformists, you have failed yourself. Everyone you meet has the potential for utility.

[–]40_SixandTwo 10 points11 points  (4 children)

I'm glad I read this because a lot of the times I do feel disconnected from people around me. For one, I grew up a very lonely and isolated kid. I'm 21 and I find it hard to relate to people my age, and awhile back an older friend of mine explained it to me. From the time I was 14 I worked in various jobs with men much older than I was, I think I've matured a lot faster than my peers because of being forced to adapt in a work environment with adults.

Lately I've been feeling more disconnected than ever. I'm not sure why. I've been making it a point to try and approach and talk to more people.

[–]1DaBaulz 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Lift. Be a good friend. Treat your friends better then women. Have a bro code. Go to school, get a career. Keep approaching and don't do it for the ends, do it for the journey.

Things will get much better. Men hit their prime after 27.

[–]40_SixandTwo 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes. It takes time, but I know it's and pieces everyday will amount to massive improvement.

[–]soyDonEladio 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I use to feel the same. You've got to see them for what they are, unimportant. I started a project with a close friend and I feel much better now that I have a purpose. Get busy man!

[–][deleted] 59 points60 points  (13 children)

Or you could simply just surround yourself with like-minded people instead of isolating and thinking you're better than everyone.

Just because you don't hangout with your "average" friends or see eye to eye with them on particular life philosophies doesn't mean you're any better than them. This kind of circle jerk thinking will lead you to being a loner, and thus having no connections to step up the ladder to greater plateaus.

Even if your friends are "average" it doesn't mean you have to write them off and 86 them from your life. I have plenty of "average" friends back home who work average jobs and have literally taken like 0 risks in life. I still enjoy their company and catching up when I'm home visiting family on the holidays or whenever I come back for a weekend.

Instead, seek out people who are on similar paths as you. If you want to be a professional musician, move to LA.. If you want to be the next rockstar computer guy, go to silicon valley.. If you want to be the next theatre star, go to New York.. That is, if you really have the brains and guts to compete with the best.

You have to learn how to meet the right people and network to get anywhere.. not just hangout on a fucking internet forum and stroke your ego saying "I am soooo much better than my average friends who work at taco bell and some random cubicle job.. They don't even know this red pill stuff!" It's like Squidward on Spongebob Squarepants thinking he's so fucking above everyone that works at the Krusty Crab for simply being a shitty clarinet player.

When you're actually on a level where it's appropriate to consider yourself "above the rest" you will actually be above the rest because you'll be hanging out with other people who are above the rest. You'll be at the party with champagne and caviar instead of Bob and Nancy's backyard barbecue.

[–][deleted] 22 points23 points  (6 children)

I think that an outsider identity automatically gets established, and it isn't necessarily a choice you make to circlejerk or feel superior to others. I literally feel more alone the older I get, and it isn't because I feel like I'm better than other people, but rather that my life and goals are diverging more and more from everyone I've ever been friends with, and I think its a universal thing.

I'm not implying that I'm perfect or that the road I'm taking is superior, just that me and my friends are on very different paths, and its a jolting realization to come to, because you spend so much of your adolescence growing with your friends, and having a lot in common with them. Then suddenly, in your mid to late twenties, people start falling into categories that they will mostly stay in for life, and those categories are widely divergent from what you had always known them as growing up.

The ultimate realization you come to is that things with them will never be the same as they were, and you are basically on your own from now on. Sure, you can make friends who are more like you, following the path that you are on, but those friendships won't really be the same, because the path that you are on demands autonomy, rather than co-dependence.

The more autonomous you become, the less you can be a part of the tribe, because the tribe demands sameness. People can't co-exist peacefully in the tribe if everyone isn't on a level plane, and so you being autonomous in itself makes other people uncomfortable. Just by virtue of trying to be something better or different, you are inadvertently fucking with others who are trying to keep everything equalized and socially placid. The more you try to accomplish and the more you prioritize your goals and desires above everything else, the more isolated you become. Thats just how it works.

[–]conquerlifegroup 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Dam, I feel a calling to this path, but i guess it's sad in a way too.

[–]1StoicCrane 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Very well put. Divergent values between one and an in-group spurs a personal reassessment to question whether that social group's influence is beneficial or even desirable at that point.

People outgrow one another. It's an aspect of life. The sooner "old skin" is shed the sooner newer more beneficial layers can form in it's place.

[–]skylive2 1 point2 points  (3 children)

What are you doing that makes you better than the AFC?

What have you achieved that puts you so much higher than those you consider 'mediocre'?

(I asked someone else this further down but I'm interested in your response too.)

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

I said in another post that I definitely don't feel like I'm better than the AFC. I don't even know what the AFC really represents. I just know that all the people I grew up with are on a different path than me, and it seems like they are all on the same path. I feel like a lot of people, especially those interested in TRP, might have this experience, just like we would have a different experience with women than the average person, by virtue of what we've learned. I'm more talking about the feeling of isolation you get when you don't follow the path your friends are taking. Not so much talking about being better or superior. Neither path is superior or inferior, they are just different.

[–]skylive2 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I think the danger with that line of thinking is it can end up becoming a goal in and of itself. If you're Isaac Newton and want to shut yourself away from the world so you can invent calculus then it has some value. If you're an average guy but with lofty goals then you probably don't need to spend every waking hour avoiding people.

Social relationships and networks are important, and not just for happiness. Success in most fields in one way or another is built on successful cooperation and political maneuvering. Not to mention motivation, support, inspiration. We are a social species. Our lives are inextricably linked with the lives of others and to willingly separate yourself from that seems damaging.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't mean that you should intentionally avoid other people. I mean that when you are around old friends who aren't on the same path, you feel an esoteric distance between you and them that you didn't feel before. I definitely think socialization and being around others is very important, but when you live a certain lifestyle, socialization feels categorically different than it did before. You aren't connected to other people in the same way that you once were, back when you were vibing with them and being fulfilled by being around them, and making your friends the center of your life. Even when you are socializing, you feel kind of alone. To me its a good feeling, because formerly I would get caught up in drama or take people's opinions seriously, whereas now all of that stuff seems empty and meaningless, and it doesn't impact me on a visceral level. Even friends who I used to have deep conversations with, who are now in serious LTR's and spend most of their time around girls, I can't identify with them anymore. There is too much excess and too many frills in their character now, and less real depth. That sounds like egoic bullshit, but it is a very, very real difference that I notice in those people. By depth in their character, I just mean that their thinking is more superficial now, their goals are superficial, etc. Everything is about emotional vibing when I talk to them, rather than how two guys would usually talk. I bring it up with them from time to time, and there is a wall of rationalization I can't get around. Their relationships make them happy, and make them feel fulfilled, but its a double-edged sword to be in that state, and I don't think most people realize that. They don't have that masculine edge anymore, and it isn't coming back IMO. Once you've lost it, and fall into that emotional relationship mode, that edge is gone for good.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

You might be taking it a little bit too literally.

[–]RPmatrix 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Or you could simply just surround yourself with like-minded people instead of isolating and thinking you're better than everyone.

and stay living a mediocre Life like they do? Are you suggesting 'mediocrity' is a worthy goal just so you can have a group of "friends"?

You can keep your mediocre opinions to yourself

Have you ever considered that some of us here are Waaay better than the AFC?

What level of mediocrity do you find acceptable?

[–]skylive2 1 point2 points  (2 children)

What are you doing that makes you better than the AFC?

What have you achieved that puts you so much higher than those you consider 'mediocre'?

[–]RPmatrix 0 points1 point  (1 child)

What are you doing that makes you better than the AFC?

That depends on what you consider an AFC to be. I've never been 'average', I most certainly have been frustrated, but in no way am I a 'chump'. Although TBH sometimes I wish I was too stupid to question the 'status quo', alas I'm smarter than the average bear.

Have you heard the saying "one man's bread is another man's poison"?

I do not generally compare myself with others. I don't subscibe to most of 'society's norms' nor their 'measures of success'. I am "my own man" and I establish My criteria for 'success'.

Maybe the fact both my parents were dead by the time I was 17yo has something to do with it, for I had no one else BUT me to "help me" at that time, so I "helped myself".

"Failure" was not an option, and as a result I have succeeded in most of the things I've wanted to do and "tried to attain". This includes bedding numerous women and making copious amounts of money, to name but a few of my successes. I've always had a muscular physique since I was a kid, and I still do at 50yo! BUT, that too comes through Effort. I exercise regularly and have a thoughtful and healthy diet and have all my life.

Sure I've had fuck ups and failures but they didn't stop me Trying. And I'll never stop trying to achieve the things I desire.

One thing I've learned in this time is "success is relative". e.g. would you consider hooking up with a HB10 and plating her until she accuses you of some heinous event where the police are involved and she takes out a restraining order on you, a 'success'? Or (god forbid) marrying some women and breeding only to later have her divorce rape you and take the kids ... where's the 'success' in that?

Yet many people Do it! IMO such people are either fools Or they're thoughtless 'people pleasers' trying to get approval from others by "being normal" LOL!

I put in the effort and TRY to achieve the things I want ... and have been for nearly 40yrs! I have succeeded in doing things most people never will. That includes with women.

Nobody is born 'successful' ... and money doesn't buy happiness. It's almost funny the amount of people who don't believe the things I've done, but that's becoz such things are 'impossible' in their average lives

Sure I too know 'average' people but they're not really my 'good friends', I call them 'acquaintences' for that's all they are. TBH sometimes I've wished I could be 'happy being average' but I am unable to

My true friends go out of their way to help me IF I needed, or if asked them for help. And vice versa. My true friends also put in the effort required to achieve their goals.

Maybe my criteria for what makes a 'good friend' are different to yours. Nonetheless I have good friends across the world, how about you?

What level of mediocrity do you find acceptable?

NONE! If it's due to lack of effort. As I say here often, "the Only failure is the failure to Try".

Too many people expect that when a problem occurs, "someone should DO something about it" ... just not them! I have NO time for such people. Nor do I care for their 'approval'.

This world is as it is because, the majority of people are mindless slack cunts who have No interest in improving either themselves Or the world we live in. It's such peole who are (happy to be?) 'average' and follow their boss's (and wive's) bidding, aka "following orders".

As you can see, such people make this a wonderful world, full of jobs for cops and soldiers that work for politicians who "promise much and deliver SFA" while terrorizing and killing the people they're supposed to protect!.

Such people are thoughtless drones who follow the current 'social conventions' becoz they're "easy".

Nothing truly worthwhile 'comes easily' and much of the 'pleasure' comes from the many small achievements needed to obtain them. But ALL of them require Effort.

But, there are a LOT of lazy, thoughtless, slack cunts in the first world! aka AFC's becoz that's what being a lazy, thoughtless, slack cunt will make you, an "average frustrated chump!"

What level of mediocrity do you find 'acceptable'?

[–]1StoicCrane 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Not a matter of being better but feeling alienated due to changing perspectives and personal ambitions in contrast to friends whose letting life pass them by perpetuating or maintaining self-afflictive habits or behaviors.

Say you left town for four years and returned to find all of your friends both with and without college degrees entrenched in weed, cigarette habits, and alcoholism when you're focused on getting a higher paying job, or hitting the weights hard consistently. In the frame of the situation how'd you feel? OP's post isn't about condescension as it is about the re-evaluation of personal influences in relation to his long term prospects and renewed perspective.

[–]RPFlame 8 points9 points  (0 children)

The more things you have in common with average men the more average you will be.

It's simple law of cause and effect.

Thinking and acting like everyone else will make you... like everyone else.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

There never was and never will be anyone walking this path with you. Masculine men walk their path alone and there is beauty in that.

When you realize that you are both the problem and solution to everything in your life, it just gets easier.

[–]Aaren_Augustine 32 points33 points  (11 children)


Full Human Experience. This is my litmus test when loving someone. This is the bullshit meter to rationalizations of getting back with oneitis chick. Or when you think you might be going MGTOW for all the "right" reasons.

I get up at 4:50 a.m., before the vast majority of the surrounding population and lift heavy. I'm fucking hanging off my power rack while other motherfuckers are hitting the snooze button.

[–]drew967 12 points13 points  (6 children)

Recovering is also part of gains. I mean are you sleeping at like 9 or 10 to get at least 8 hrs?

[–]Aaren_Augustine 11 points12 points  (5 children)

8 hours. I'm 36. I get the Heal Train in the morning when I wake up. All my joints and tendons ache from my SL 5x5 routine. IF until about 11 a.m.

[–]drew967 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Coming from someone younger; overtime did it feel better to wake up early? Early as in like 5-5 30?

I imagine its pretty hard to get used to

[–]Aaren_Augustine 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Your body adjusts. People assume it's that way forever. It's not.

[–]purplecabbage 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Right on bro. IF FTW. 8-12 for me. Morning workout too (but not so god-awful early lol).

[–]kruxofthemimed 0 points1 point  (1 child)

should i be doing 8-12 reps or lower? i started the all pro beginner routine which increases reps from 8-12 over 5 weeks and then increase weight by 10% if you pass the 5th week, is this program less efficient?

[–]purplecabbage 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm not a PT. Research it if you're looking for answers.

[–]marplaneit 1 point2 points  (3 children)

My strength is really low during early morning, hace u tried lifting at 6pm?

[–]Aaren_Augustine 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Have you squat low first thing? Cocaine.

[–]xinihil 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Try downing a significant amount of water right before sleeping and immediately after waking. Do something to get your blood flowing before lifting and then some dynamic stretching. Cellular hydration generally takes around 6 hours after initial ingestion of water to hit its peak, and has enormous effects on strength.

[–]marplaneit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay thanks I will try that !!

[–]miser1 4 points5 points  (0 children)

This idea that it's "lonely at the top" is nonsense. There are plenty of people at the top and at every step of the way up. If you're hitting the gym, you'll be meeting the other guys also hitting it. I moved to Japan to study martial arts - guess who I met? Lots of like-minded people, serious about their training who had done the same thing.

Being on a trajectory for success will naturally intersect your path with people who're also aiming high. There are plenty of like-minded people out there - this subreddit is itself proof of that.

The loneliness is felt at the beginning. It's when you're mourning the loss of your original friends, habits and comforts, still discovering and creating your new identity. But there's nothing lonely about achieving your ambitions - on the contrary, it's the very thing that'll lead you to forming genuine bonds with like-minded people.

[–]stoicismexpress 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Don't let improving yourself become an excuse to look down judgementally on everyone around you out of some inflated sense of self-worth. Emotionally isolating yourself because of your ego is an all around stupid thing to do.. Sure many people around you might be far more shallow than you, but ask yourself: would you want people more developed than yourself that would describe you as shallow cutting you out of their own life?

Other people are all we have, enjoy their company and try to help them in the same way you helped yourself.

[–]1ShallITinder 8 points9 points  (8 children)

See this is the same MGTOW bullshit that /u/GayLubeOil was talking about in his post, it is ruining this sub. I am not saying you turn into a woman and make every day where you chat at a cafe but the other end of the coin is just as bad. You will turn into that isolated socially disconnected guy that can't move up in life.

What gets you that promotion at a job? Social skills!

How are you going to market yourself when you start your own business? Social skills!

How are you going to get the best looking women? Social skills!

If you don't have any of that, your skinny-fat socially conscious counterparts will beat you almost every single time. So you lifted some fucking weights and counted your meal down to the last calorie, good shit dude, you're still a fucking weirdo that can't make friends or get ahead in life. This whole mindset is single-handedly bringing down this entire sub.

[–]1DaBaulz 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Well, I wouldn't say that about the OPs post, but I would definitely agree on some of the replies to the post. There is truth that a man should be OK with being alone, that is very true. But to be doomed to loneliness is not a product of an RP lifestyle.

[–]1StoicCrane 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Isolation isn't condemnation. It's no sentence. It's necessary in order to draw deep insight and undisturbed reflections. The "silent desperation" new users project onto solitude denotes the BP mindset. Not the acknowledgement of alienation with their newfound perspective.

[–]1ShallITinder -1 points0 points  (0 children)

A man should NOT aspire to be alone and it should not be glamorized on here, this post belongs in FA, not red pill.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Some of the isolationist ideas MGTOW guys preach should be fucking banned. That shit can be really dangerous for newly unplugged guys.

I'm not saying OPs post is like that, but in general. Anything that discourages socialization is not good.

[–]_the_shape_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Anything that discourages socialization is not good.

We can at least agree though that the amount of competition for you does decline

[–]1ShallITinder -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I think it is like that and this thread should be deleted.

[–]lawwwl 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's up to interpretation. I'm looking at friends the same way op does. During your path on self improvement you will likeley come to the realization that you have outgrown your friends. You now have three options: be an isolated Idiot, stay with your friends and don't get anywhere in life or look for friends who are a better fit for you. It's up to you.

Also you don't have to be an asshole and 'break up' with your friends, just aknowledge the difference and move on.

[–]stoicismexpress 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Listen to this man everyone, please

[–]TheInkerman 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I think of it this way;

There is a difference between solitude and loneliness.

[–]MrMelbourne 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I have successfully cut ties with two first cousins that I grew up with.

Each one was for different reasons and my only regret was that I had not done it earlier.

Gentlemen ... life is too short to spend it with people that make it feel like it is too long. In other words, negative influences, people that take far more than they give, people that don't understand what reciprocity is, people that are selfish, people that are very stingy with money and so on.

The main thing is that you do it by whatever means necessary. The goal is to cut them out like the cancer that they are.

I can assure you that being alone is FAR better than being in or tolerating bad company and over time it will free you up to meet other, better people that you choose to be with.

Tolerating shit behavior with friends or relatives also sets you up for tolerating shit behavior from women.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I like the sentiment, but remember that a social network is important. Self-improvement is not anti-social. It's anti friends that hold you back and anti succumbing to the Herd mind.

However, we need balance in our lives. Grabbing drinks with high-value guys is a good thing to do on Friday nights.

[–]Akela_hk 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Second to last sentence could not be more true.

[–]xXSoroxXx 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I cannot stress this point enough. The faster you accept this the more easy life comes. I lost A LOT of "friends" as I got fitter and made more money. As i watched my relationships go down one by one it really depressed me. For about 2-3 weeks I went to see a therapist to deal with this. I'm all good now and but looking back I was in a dark place. If anyone wants to chat feel free to PM me.

[–]1StoicCrane 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Can completely relate. Most of my old friends have turned into androgenous drug addicts. Aside from an occasional high and bye I'm hardly interested in bothering with people who aren't like-minded in someway.

Seems snobby and in a way it is but if the people you're associated with aren't raising you up they're tearing you down. Be aware of your influences.

[–]kankouillotte 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Unfortunately, the older you are the truer it is, because being active and seeking out new things to do is definitely not common among your friends when you're in college, but when you're 30+ and all your friends and coworkers are providing $ in shitty sexless marriages with kids then it's even rarer.

Most are overweight and only watch TV, when they are not busy obeying wifey's orders, and the rare ones having leisure activities are not giving it much effort at all, they just use the aikido or motorcycling sunday to escape their family.

There, you're really alone in your self-improvement lifestyle, as well as in your night activities.

When you're in college, you might be going out with oblivious wingmen and think you're alone, but wait till there are no wingman at all to come with you.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

School of life has an very good video on being lonely. I don't have much to add except that i have discovered the same truths in my life.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Great post; indeed, mindset is key. Tackle adversity head on and independence becomes your natural state. Self reliance is the true blessing of masculinity. Women cannot achieve it, no matter how hard they try. They will always need us; we only need ourselves.

[–]AdventurousJacK -1 points0 points  (0 children)

This is exactly what I needed. Thanks.

[–]StinkyDogFarts -4 points-3 points  (2 children)

This is all correct. But... Every rule has exception. Are you? Probably not. Can you be? Yeah. If you wanna bang hot trim, follow the rules and move forward. If you want a real girl, Midwest. Move there. There are shitty girls everywhere, but you actually have a shot at a smart girl who wants a career and will be a great partner and you'll have a great life. They won't be a ten, but they also won't be a pain in the ass that you have to manage like a child. A real partner. Happiness is better than contentment .

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

If there's one thing I've come to find out in my 25 years on this planet, it's that well educated career girls are some of the least suited to be a "life partner".

I'm not talking from personal experience, just observation.

[–]Tylerjjs 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Is from the mid west.

They are just as bad.